How my last family visit set the stage for estrangement
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- Опубліковано 1 січ 2025
- This video is a reflection on the last visit I made to see my family- 8 years before estranging. I reflect on some of the dynamics and how they led up to the final events and cut off.
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Thank you for watching. My name is Chess. I'm a psychotherapist, coach, counsellor and survivor of a toxic, abusive family dynamic.
I have experienced both estranging from and being estranged (alienated) from family members. My journey through understanding the sad truth behind my family's facade and standing up for myself against lies, blackmail, and illegal activity, was the hardest thing I have ever done. It took an immense toll on my health, finances, relationships and sometimes my sanity. But I survived, and now better than I ever was.
I created this channel to be a support for others who are navigating the difficulties of challenging families. I am neither pro- nor anti-estrangement. I am 100% for healthy relationships. I believe estrangement is an essential tool for those who have exhausted all other options and their wellbeing is at risk by staying close to people who can't support them.
Thank you for watching. If you are dealing with a toxic relationship, please look after yourself and get professional help if you are able.
If you feel you would benefit from extra support around this topic, or any of my other videos, I offer individual coaching. Drop me a line through www.thescapegoatclub.com/coaching to find out more!
Please drop me a line below to tell me what you think, what your experiences are and if there is anything you’d like me to cover. I can’t do this without your support. I hope you like the video and subscribe to the channel if you enjoy the content. Please comment or email me through my website if you have a suggestion for a video.
Much love, Chess xxx
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This is a personal account of my experiences. I am not diagnosing anybody in my family as narcissistic. If you are in danger of physical abuse & harm, from others or yourself, please contact your local emergency services immediately.
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DISCLAIMER: The information contained within the UA-cam channel 'The Scapegoat Club' is not a substitute for professional advice such as a doctor, psychologist, psychiatrist, or other therapist. The information provided by the UA-cam channel 'The Scapegoat Club' does not constitute legal or professional advice nor is it intended to be. Only a trained medical professional can diagnose psychological or medical conditions.
If they don't miss you in your absence, they don't value your presence. The hard part is letting go of the need to know why.
This is very painful , I know it too well🩷
That is a great expression and so very true.
« Letting go of the need to know why » thank you for this insight ❤
Brilliant! Thanks for this comment ❤️
And even if they could give you an explanation, it would either be an excuse or a lie. They can't or won't take responsibility for their behaviors which is the heart of the problem. We have to give ourselves closure by realizing that we don't need to know why, only that we deserve better and we are better without them.
"You have to learn to leave the table when love's no longer being served." I have no idea who said this, but it's true.
The great Nina Simone ‘You’ve Got to Learn’
@@rebeccac2291love her music. She suffered a lot emotionally, too.
Thank you for this INSIGHTFUL words! I'm sorry for what you went through. I believe that the toxic behaviors we see in others are because we are in a MAJOR SPIRITUAL BATTLE between good & evil. John 10:10 says, "The enemy comes to steal, to kill, and to destroy. I have come that they may have life and have it more abundantly."
When it comes to toxic people: it is good to PRAY, SET HEALTHY BOUNDARIES, love ourselves first, & know that we're worthy of surrounding ourselves with people who are sincere & love us. Sometimes this means having little to NO CONTACT with toxic people, esp. when it is evident that they do not want to change.
It is important that we realize that the dysfunctions that toxic family (and people) do are usually because they DON'T want to change. So, they PROJECT their insecurities, their self-hate, their shame, their misery, etc., unto the person(s) they see who is STRIVING to be better. And they attack the person who is sincere, kind, caring, ambitious, successful & has the "good" qualities that they know they don't have. This is because they know they're NOT doing anything to improve themselves, be a better person, achieve certain dreams/goals (it could be financial, emotional, & physical) that they see the party that they envy doing.
To make themselves feel better, toxic people try to bring misery into other people's lives, esp. when it's someone that they've close contact with, such as a child, relative, friend, colleague, etc. And sadly, it is even more common with relatives & church leaders/members (or religious groups). I think they are some of the most evil, as they use family & faith as a crutch to cover up their heinous ways! STAY FAR Away from such people.
An INSIGHTFUL UA-cam video that helped me to understand better the reasons why toxic behaviors in others is by a wonderful Christian author called "Boundaries When To Say When To Say No" by Dr. Henry Cloud. He also has a UA-cam channel. There're also some wonderful UA-camrs who are therapist worth listening to. They are Tamara Hill and Dr. Ramani (she is called the "narcissists" expert!). And Kris Reece, who shares a lot of great wisdom based on her experiences.
People who do good & want to make a difference, be positive, build others up, etc.are often ridiculed. And the people who're controlled by evil spirits do not want good/light to come in, as they know it will expose their darkness (John 3:19-21). Christ alone is our TRUE REFUGE. So, when we put our trust in Him, He will heal us from the hurts caused by toxic people. And He will put the "right" loving & nurturing relationships in our lives.
In Christ, the U.S
How much are you the problem
@@joavkof in Nina Simone’s problems? Not all that much, I imagine. Though I could be in denial.
Estrangement enhanced my life. Two and a half blissful years with no abuse, disrespect, ultimatums or temper tantrums from my mother and sister. Twenty seven years of freedom from my father’s abuse and disrespect until he passed away.
Estrangement has proven to be wonderful in that I live authentically.
@@Keepingitreallyreal yes 🙌
Thank you. You have a great point of an enhanced life.
Me too! My daily life is blissful, with their weight lifted off me. Years have flown by. 💗
I estranged for personal safety. I didn’t even know you COULD estrange from the family until I found this amazing counselor. My life did not really start until I estranged, in my late thirties. I became free to thrive
It goes both ways sometimes, some oarents try theiir very best and yet their children go to the brightest light, the most exciting things and then after years go by wonder why the parents are not overjoyed by them. Some parents are there everytime they are asked and yet it isnt returned. People are human and bothsides can be mean.
Just because you love them, doesn't mean they love you.
Family included.
It took me YEARS ago GET that.
They don’t love themselves- and that is the truth. You have empathy and they…. Dont… Narcissistic parents. 😢
@@blessed7927 1,000% ON.
Harsh Truth.
@@blessed7927 and sibs.
@@blessed7927 and narcissistic grown children.
I'll add another comment: Once a narcissist (or family of narcissists) feel they no longer "control" you, they will discard you. So by you being a smart, articulate, kind person -- they discarded you. I say you escaped with your beautiful life. Well done.
OH---OH--- stated to perfection!
I see it that she is discarding them and that is part of the problem between them.
The picture in the draw means they care, and are still hurting. And they might be crying everytime they take it out and look at it.
This was me! I'm called the one black sheep and that's ok for it means I'm nothing like them! Be strong love yourself for peace is everything!!
@janesmith9968 if she was discarding them she wouldn't have visited, she is trying, she tried. You can't fix a narcissist, they'll never change, l can assure you they aren't shedding tears over her, she has a life outside of theirs and they take that as an insult to their ego. They are absolute classic narcissistic parehts with an empath child. She's hurting, l promise they are not and they'll live longer than she will because narcs don't get stressed out, they infact get a thrill out of hurting people.
@@irishcountrygirl78 100%!
You aren’t alone. I can completely relate to your situation. My daughter (as a young child) used to ask, “What’s wrong with your family?” She still asks in her adulthood. My family isn’t a good source for support or love. I have to accept it and find those needs elsewhere.
💗💗💝
exactly that’s what I’m saying send a birthday card or gift at Christmas and leave it at that find your support elsewhere that’s what I was trying to say you don’t have to these people are grumbling there’s a little sense of self righteousness these are obviously sick sick people that are abusive that’s because they’re hurting
I have attempted to become closer to my family, and I came to the conclusion that if anything happened, it would probably be on a superficial level.
And I've tried to put myself in their shoes, and I concluded that it's would have to become a career to try to understand them,
and for them to understand me.
And the second part would be most difficult, because they don't have much desire to understand me
But it would also entail my learning to play golf and my dad to learn to ride motorcycles.
Maybe on another dimension. ?
Well this is more common than you think don’t waste your time with selfish people like those well done to the lady for pointing it outl look to the people around you that make you laugh and are happy to be in your company xxx😅
The old saying is so true. "When people show you who they are, believe them."
Yeah I did not want to believe it! Now I don’t feel comfortable around them or stay with them!
so true...so true!!!!
Great Maya Angelou quote! Live by this and one will have so much less heartache as you needlessly try to ‘correct’ or ‘fix’ someone who you interact with. This quote has really saved me a lot of very sad feelings.
Your dad chose not to use any kind of a filter to HIS brain’s understanding of his relationship to you….and to do it so cruelly in front of others is just so mind-bendingly wrong. No empathy whatsoever….such a narcissistic attitude! Would like to know what her dad would say/do if he saw a video of this horrific pub scene. What she is relating has happened in my own family …. I have accepted that a safe mental distance between me and my toxic family is much better for all concerned. My best to you for sharing….your sharing has helped me and many others!
@@keepcalmcarryon8178 That's the kicker too when your parents are insulting you, making sideways comments YOU KNOW that it's being done audience during a holiday while they're pretending not to. After enough instances of me overlooking it, I get closer and closer to the no contact of not already have NO CONTACT already.
Being disrespected in front of someone else is a universal deal breaker for me.
Anyway, anyway, this is like the second or third presentation I've seen from this ladies channel here and I really like how she goes about and has a unique approached by discussing this and very specific part of narcissism
The gaslighting is the worst.
Yes and maybe she gets it because she is kind, intelligent, successful… which intimidates the parents/ makes them feel inadequate so they bully her away.
It's devastating.
Yes. When people are too insecure to have an honest conversation, don't waste your time. It only makes things worse.
Omg! It is!
Yeah, but there's nothing that pisses a manipulator off more than when you publicly call out their gaslighting.
2008 was my im done moment.. i was in hospital having surgery for advanced breast cancer and mother phoned to see if there was any thing to collect. The nurse said mrs o your daughters not dead she is in surgery. Mother replied maybe next time and hung up.. that was it for me.. i felt bad for the nurse who told me the story when i got back to my room. As another comment says when your done your done x
I have been the family scapegoat since day 0. Took me ages to understand, no matter, what I do, I say... I will always be the "problem". Went worse, when I cut them off. But I chose me and grieved properly. It was the BEST decision of my life.
I feel like the scapegoat - treated like a garbage can 🗑️ they can all throw neg judgements & neg comments into.. ugh 😣
I’m just done 😓
@janiemiller825 don't think it is the easiest step, but it will be the healthiest step you will take: go. Don't waste your precious lifetime any longer with toxic ppl. Whether they are family or not. And trust me: they will fight like hell broke lose! Bc giving YOU their garage is easier for them, than facing their shit on their own.
So go. You will be be at peace - in the long run.
Most of the children who die of abuse and neglect are the chosen scapegoats of the family. No matter how many children, the others are treated less harshly. Survival is success.
@@oldladyfromnm7590 Correct. We are survivors.
Sometimes I forget that. Thank you😊
I like that you said you chose yourself. That is hard to do when your afraid of being like them.. right . But it is actually normal to have a self and be brave and just give yourself permission to breathe.
My grandmother used to say, “Go where you’re invited, stay where you’re comfortable.” I invited myself to visit my mother on her birthday and it wasn’t going well so I quickly departed. Grandma was right.
Wow! What a wise lady.
I guess the other side of the coin is if you invite someone to your home and they mess you around by continuosly not turning up or being late, or they turn up and you don't feel comfortable, you don't invite them again.
My husband had friends who I invited to dinner twice. After two cancellations, I didn't bother to invite them again.
My brother cut me off 7 years ago..for something he said I did, which I hadn't. He wouldn't discuss it. I had a mini breakdown but worked my way through it. I came to realize that he suffered from the same narcissism that my mother had. You can't fight city hall and I'm much better off without constantly having to have a relationship on his terms. You have to look out for your own mental health..no one else will.
@@andreawebster-blanco579thats a very helpful takeaway " you cant fight city hall " going to pop that in my pocket and carry it with me thank you
I'm getting this tattoed
@@andreawebster-blanco579 Same, unnecessary drain. Better off out of my life and only nice people in my world.
Avoiding toxic people, including your family, is an act of self-love and improves your mental health, and gives you energy to put more effort into your good relationships. It took me years to realize my parents did not enjoy my visits, I assumed they were glad to see me.... they weren't!
@@priscillaa.8548 100% i can understand that. If i went to visit parents she would answer the door with her coat on and say oh im just going out.. took me a while to figure she just didnt want to deal with me. I hear ya x
Every one has a tendency to be toxic. So you better lower the self righteous thermometer😂😂
@@carolynbohannon4602 You should know.
You can't choose the family you are born into, but you can choose to make your own family. That's what we did.
I agree friends are the family we choose!
Choosing to make your own family can and often does end up just as bad, if not worse. Especially in the West and particularly if you're a man. #MGTOW
@@BrickMudge So, now you know where the problem lies....
@@dabeage I've known this for years. Just look around. It's just more obvious now than ever before.
Agree ❤ my husband and I have no blood family left alive ( the handful left are toxic) but we have a circle of friends who we’ve all raised our kids together and these grown kids now have kids, our grand nieces ❤ and it’s the best! Family does not equal blood!
Just because you are related to someone, doesn't mean you have to put up with their abuse of you. Choose to be around those who appreciate you, related or not. This is what I've learned after too many years, but better late than never. Happy Thanksgiving! ❤
Your words hit home for me. I just never learn my lesson and I keep going back for more verbal and emotional abuse from my mother. She is not well and I am trying my best to go take her to all her appts. so that my sister who lives with mother can have some help and because it is my mother. When we are together, or she will even call me on the phone and tell me she cannot believe I am not doing more to help her and my sister. She does not appreciate anything I have ever done for her and while I don't live with her, I have taken her to every appt she ever had. I just took her for 5 weeks of radiation treatments and 5 chemo treatments. And that was 5 days a week for 5 weeks. Wasn't enough. When I make mention that I have health problems too( I have psoriatic arthritis along with other diagnosis) she will look at me and say "well, what's wrong with you". Just shocked that I am complaining because I don't look like anything is wrong with me and I dare not to complain in front of her. I saw her Tuesday for an appt, and she talked so rude, was yelling and cursing at the tech at the doctor's office. I told her she will have to find someone else to take her for any appts, because I would not be doing it again after the ways she treated them and me. Am I wrong for not helping out when she is sick? I just don't feel like I have the energy to be in her presence ever again. And especially not in public when she acts like that. And she does not have dementia. She has always been mean. I would not be surprised at all if the doctor's office asked her not to come back
I stopped putting up with a verbally abuse brother and was told "It's just how he is"...then I was told, "You are a Christian, you need to have grace", insinuating that I am the problem if I have a problem with his behavior. 🤦🏻♀
@@debrap947 such a hypocritical attitude!
So true
Thank you for this INSIGHTFUL words!! I'm sorry for what you went through. I believe that the toxic behaviors we see in others are because we are in a MAJOR SPIRITUAL BATTLE between good & evil. John 10:10 says, "The enemy comes to steal, to kill, and to destroy. I have come that they may have life and have it more abundantly."
When it comes to toxic people: it is good to PRAY, SET HEALTHY BOUNDARIES, love ourselves first, & know that we're worthy of surrounding ourselves with people who are sincere & love us. Sometimes this means having little to NO CONTACT with toxic people, esp. when it is evident that they do not want to change.
It is important that we realize that the dysfunctions that toxic family (and people) do are usually because they DON'T want to change. So, they PROJECT their insecurities, their self-hate, their shame, their misery, etc., unto the person(s) they see who is STRIVING to be better. And they attack the person who is sincere, kind, caring, ambitious, successful & has the "good" qualities that they know they don't have. This is because they know they're NOT doing anything to improve themselves, be a better person, achieve certain dreams/goals (it could be financial, emotional, & physical) that they see the party that they envy doing.
To make themselves feel better, toxic people try to bring misery into other people's lives, esp. when it's someone that they've close contact with, such as a child, relative, friend, colleague, etc. And sadly, it is even more common with relatives & church leaders/members (or religious groups). I think they are some of the most evil, as they use family & faith as a crutch to cover up their heinous ways! STAY FAR Away from such people.
An INSIGHTFUL UA-cam video that helped me to understand better the reasons why toxic behaviors in others is by a wonderful Christian author called "Boundaries When To Say When To Say No" by Dr. Henry Cloud. He also has a UA-cam channel. There're also some wonderful UA-camrs who are therapist worth listening to. They are Tamara Hill and Dr. Ramani (she is called the "narcissists" expert!). And Kris Reece, who shares a lot of great wisdom based on her experiences.
People who do good & want to make a difference, be positive, build others up, etc.are often ridiculed. And the people who're controlled by evil spirits do not want good/light to come in, as they know it will expose their darkness (John 3:19-21). Christ alone is our TRUE REFUGE. So, when we put our trust in Him, He will heal us from the hurts caused by toxic people. And He will put the "right" loving & nurturing relationships in our lives.
In Christ, the U.S
My doctor said to me, " Go where you are appreciated.". I've done my best to follow her prescription ever since.
Painful video because it’s too close to home. It helps to know there are others faced with this nightmare. God bless us all.
Same. I have too many family problems to list here, but I still remember my parents' 50th Wedding Anniversary when my dad mentioned my "acid tongue" in a speech to both sides of the family. The truth? I had finally found my voice after years of keeping a smile on my face no matter what. Turning the other cheek. I can't do that anymore.
Yes. So very true. It is an unexpected comfort to know others can relate to your own experiences of parental alienation/rejection.
I can feel your pain as I have experienced the same. I was living in Hong Kong and wanted my mom in NY to see my daughter for the first time. So when my daughter turned 2, I flew over to NY and my mom refused to see us. This hurt me so much.
❤❤❤
@@twistoffate4791My whole childhood my father would say “you’d cut your nose off to spite your face”. Then he’d swipe at my face. Out of the three children he had I was the only one to ever speak up for myself.
Now I just avoid and it makes me so sad.
It is profoundly perplexing how some parents never bond or feel any deep love for their children. I think I was my mother’s shame. It took me years to realize what a disappointment I was to her.....but then again the reality is, she never wanted me. From my earliest memories she rarely played with me, read to me or spent time with me. She was too busy cleaning, exercising and fixing her hair and makeup to really spend much time with me at all. I was last on her list of her priorities and she clearly resented any time she had to spend with me. It was a horrible childhood filled with neglect criticism and rejection. It took me five decades to realize that I was never really loved. I was an obligation she tried to endure. I relate to your feelings on so many levels. We are a unique club. My broken heart feels so much for yours.
I can relate. I don't have a single memory of my mother touching me, let alone hugging me. Neither in my childhood nor as an adult. I was 46 when it really sank in that the reason my mother doesn't love me was that she is not capable of loving neither me nor anyone else. Realizing this felt very liberating. I was finally able to stop trying. The only person she cares about is herself. But there are many people who care about me! I am sure there are people who care about you! I hope you can heal like I have. I took me a long time, but now I am free.
I’m watching a child grow up like this now
It’s horrific to watch, at 7, the child already knows they are worthless and does very little right. Their gma reinforces it, after all she raised the “mom”.
The way someone treats you says a lot more about them than it does about you. And sometimes the intentions are good, they just don't have the skills or know how to show love. Ultimately, the reasons don't matter. What matters is that we only allow those in our lives who see our value.
@@zenitaocelic4226yes!!! Thank you for understanding. My mother never EVER touched me or held me stroked my hair. All the little sweet things that parents feel so compelled to do. You can’t stop from wanting to love on your children but my mother never did. I honestly don’t know why it took me so many decades to see it all so clearly. She was utterly disinterested in all of us. I knew something was off my whole life. The fallout with other connections and relationships is incalculable because somehow others pick up on how broken and unsure your childhood neglect has left you. The irony is my mother was always kinder, warmer and more compassionate to total strangers than she was to her own children. I’m still processing all of it. Thank you all for your empathy and understanding. I deeply appreciate it. ❤
This was my mother, too. In addition to this treatment, she favored my 2 older siblings, and played the martyr in the care that she did give to me. She favored my oldest child in the same way, and my relationship with my child is lost. My mother wanted my oldest to be my sister’s child, and I didn’t understand what she was doing. I was so conditioned to devalue myself with them. I am so sorry for your pain.
When your parents told you it was inconvenient for you to come visit them, it reminded me of my mom. I lived in another state, about 1.5 hours away by plane, and had just started my last year of pharmacy school. I told her I was going to graduate in May of the following year. At the restaurant she said in front of my dad and my husband that she would not be able to attend my graduation as she will be busy on the day I graduate. What a painful memory. Neither my dad or mom wanted to attend my graduation so I did not attend my graduation either. It's something I really regret. When I graduated and moved back, I took the boards and passed. Neither parent congratulated me or offered to do any type of celebration for me. Even after all of that, I took them on expensive vacations, flew them first class multiple times, bought them a car, paid their bills and constantly take them out to eat and even cook and clean for them. Not once did they ever do anything nice for me. When I turned 50, I said enough was enough and I stopped talking to them. It's been the happiest 3 years of my life. No matter what you do, you can never make someone love you. Learn to love yourself.
Wow! Im sorry that happened to you! Pharmacy school is harder the med school! You should have left SO much sooner! Like after you graduated, took the boards packed up and moved to another state. So painful!
So sorry for you. I'm here for you. Been there myself.
🥺I'm so sorry that you experienced such painful rejection by the two people who should love you the most. My husband and I reside in Europe, while our son and his wife live in the United States. We visit them at least once a year, typically in late summer or early autumn. My daughter-in-law is set to graduate from nursing school in May 2025, and I would not dream of missing her graduation. Consequently, we have booked a flight in instead of early fall so we can be there to watch her walk across that stage to receive her diploma and to help organize her graduation party. I regret that your parents were not able to be supportive and proud of you as I am of my daughter-in-law, but you made the right decision by estranging yourself from them, because THEY don't deserve YOU.
Love your last lines. Amen!
Yup….I get it😵💫
I haven’t even watched the video yet…just read the comments.
As a scapegoated child to a narcissistic mother and brother I simply say thank you to all. I have never felt so validated and heard, and all I did was to read (and feel) each of the comments.
May we all find peace…
@deanh1627 ... same here; I watched a few minutes only of the video before coming to read comments.
I'm so sorry. As one who is highly empathic - these are never easy decisions ... they're really shitty dynamics, and it is what it is.
Estranged from my adult children ... It's such a sad story, so needless. Ex-husband ALWAYS right, me - ALWAYS wrong, a.k.a. the problem.
Divorced eons ago, but only in the past few years learned the details to vulnerable/fragile narcissism.
My children don't understand this, but all the reasons that they think I'm so terrible revolve around the person he sees me as being.
Divorced over 20 years ago - I never did anything 'right', and he was so benevolent to 'put up' with me.
When it comes to my son's, I can't say anything to defend myself, and there's nothing I can say that puts him in a bad light.
They have no idea how much his toxic self-love has robbed them of their own sense of self-worth and wellbeing. They are unlikely to see or understand his narcissism, that they have been conditioned to function as flying monkeys (what that actually is/means) and certainly will likely not have the capabilities to understand that I have served as scapegoat to him. 😢
I have been trying to have a decent relationship between us for years ... they are so filled with his blame and poisoned perception of me that our time together ends in misery.
They themselves have become individuals with 'difficult personalities'. Symptoms or aspects of BPD. Almost certain my oldest would fit at least 5 out of the 9 symptoms to qualify for the personality disorder.
I spent several years in therapy myself, utilized CBT, DBT; mindfulness... completely overhauled my own issues. I wish I could help them to choose a similar path of growth and self-actualizing.
This man (ex-husband) is 15 years my senior. It's an awful thing to verbalize, but if he goes before me ... there might be a sliver of hope they (my children) could be reached.
It's hard to say as to how much of a hold his indoctrinations have on them. Or that they could come to realize how beautiful, deserving, or worthy they are of their own (healthy and balanced) self-love.
I've only recently discovered that family estrangement like this is a whole 'thing'! It is a very real and tragic reality for those of us as survivors of narcissistic abuse/neglect.
Love always reigns ... if not in this 3D reality for the psychologically and emotionally stunted, then in the heart (the portal to the soul) of those of us who know its power.
Thank you for this video, for this community and each of you with the courage to share your experiences. It helps. Thank you so much!
Let there be peace on earth and let it begin with me. 🕊 🫶 💪 🪷
Great insightful comments here, thanks. I was struck with the reflection today that I have served and suffered and learned so much that in this last quarter of life I can anticipate remaking my life anew. And why not! It’s really quite exciting to have worked through the guilt and doubt to the point that I’m thrilled to have holidays that flow from genuine connection to what pleases me. It gives me the joy to join with others and try new things if I feel so moved.
I’m not even interested in any sort of identification with phenomenon of estrangement. It’s not denial it’s just that my family are finally just people to me and I hope they can be happy because I wish to cause nobody pain with my presence. I figure if I got it wrong and they really want to relate that they will reach out. Until then I’m wishing them their best life and moving on with mine. No time for games or struggle because there is none for me. Somehow I’ve disentangled and I’m really interested in learning about me unencumbered as well as others who are genuinely interested in life as well.
Shalom brother!
Hugs 🤗
@@feelthepeaceThat’s very tragic 😔 the wrong husband (eg covert narcissist) can ruin even the best relationship between the mother and her children. But I hope that they will figure out what really happened some time…🙏🏻 I pray for you, lovely ❤️
Just now found your channel. I am not a professional mental health clinician but I am 79 years old, a loving mother and a dedicated loving grandmother. I can tell by the sheer depth of your emotions that this had nothing to do with you. You made every effort to fix this relationship and to make it work by stuffing down your own feelings and how you needed to be loved or at a bare minimum accepted. Estrangement was the only way forward. And here’s the good news for you… in their brokenness …. they most certainly don’t realize what they have lost. Wipe
your tears, this is a very healthy decision you made.
Amen HalleluYah 🙌🕊️💕
Beautifully stated .
thank you so much, I feel like you just gave me a huge hug
BS....grow up and learn to not take things so seriously, respect your parents, and quit playing the victim!
@aweeks6649 Respect goes two ways. Respect is earned. We are told to love one another. Some parents do not accept our efforts to love and respect them. They are unwilling to.
Chess, my heart broke as I listened to your story. You are a lovely, warm and compassionate person with whom I would be honored to have as a family member. What your family has done to you and what they have put you through emotionally is unconscionable. It was never your fault. I'm happy you see that now. I wish you self love, healing and peace. I'm also estranged from my family.
After four years of living 3 thousands of miles away , I went back to sell a home I still owned and to visit. It was a huge mistake! I felt sick walking through the door and it got worse. My husband and I had been training for a marathon and we were in top shape. We were very happy with our lives and it showed. The evil look on her face said it all. In front of strangers, she attacked me with all kinds of insults and accusations. Her words: " You look so horrible I can't stand to even look at you!" She said the same thing over and over and then berated me for getting married without a big wedding. (one, that she would not have paid for). I was so embarrassed and my husband was in shock. We quickly left and did not visit again. I did not return her phone calls but picked up by mistake one day. She asked when I would be coming home again and I told her I was never coming back. She kept saying I was mad at her but I wasn't. When she died I did not go to her funeral nor did I shed a tear for her. When you are done, you are done!
I struggle with the future decision of whether to show up for a parent or sibling funeral since I am estranged from my family of origin. I am close to my aunt (my mom’s twin sister), but she can be a flying monkey at times. I resonate with this video and commenters and am thankful for this community. Happy Thanksgiving surrogates. (Robin, posting under my husband’s account as I am social media private).
Didn’t go to my mother’s funeral either. Sooooo done!
Wow! I can relate. I moved thousands of miles away too. It took me years to break away internally and I still find myself getting enmeshed in the toxic family "system" all by myself just because of all of trauma and conditioning. Trying to have a good relationship with a toxic family is like trying to have a "good relationship" with a rabid dog or a pit of vipers. Not possible and not very wise.
I'm not a Black sheep anymore 👍🇺🇲
Thank you so much for this. I too did not go to my mom's funeral. She was physically mentally in any way. She could be abusive to me while she put on a good act for other people. She never took that good act home under her own roof I don't feel so bad now for staying away. Family members have turned their back on me. But that's OK, the only people who love abusers are abusers themselves. Thank you for helping me to feel better about my decision and big hugs to you for what happened with you.
This has really made me appreciate my kind, considerate parents. I was so lucky.
I lost my parents 29 years ago this Christmas time. I miss them every day. I was blessed with wonderful, loving parents. It breaks my heart that parents treat their children this way.
I was lucky too..
Very grateful
lol I thought I was a kind, considerate parent…..apparently not
I can’t even IMAGINE that. ❤
That’s the true meaning when they say you are blessed.
After listening to you for about 30 seconds, I could tell you were the empathetic person in that family, and the perfect family member to punish, gaslight, demonise, ridicule etc etc. It’s just sad that it normally takes people until they’re in their 40’s before they start to grasp that there’s a problem…and it may not be them. If a person can get to the point that they see it’s literally in NO WAY their fault before they turn 50, they’re doing exceptionally well! 🎉
Sometimes you just can't win with toxic family members.After my Mother died my two sisters turned showed their true colors.I no longer have any family left and although it's caused me untold grief it's better than hypocrisy.I wish everyone healing from this sort of heartbreak boat loads of live & light!!
You are not alone!
I have a Horror story with my 3 older brothers after our Mom died.
When parents die, it changes the sibling dynamic. Sometimes time and distance allows everyone to gain perspective. sometimes it doesn't. Please don't allow the past to get in the way of your future.
Being from a toxic family is so bad.
I've had my son come to my house today and he tore me apart saying hurtful stuff which is lies but behind this trouble stands my daughter who has started a whole toxic I will use the word abuse against me.
I can't believe this is happening to me right now but for sure I'm not going to retaliate.
after my father died, my sister (who never even tried to get along with him) tried to take over as the boss of everybody---she can get away with it with our mother (they look identical and are both narcissists among other things). It's always been dad's family vs mom's family. You can guess who they say i take after. I got tired of it all about 3 years ago and gradually pulled away, doing my own thing with my own kids and very ill husband. My daughter helped me see that they were constantly scheming and talking about us behind our backs. My daughter put up with the family power struggle for years too. She wrote them off a year or two before i did. Things are quieter and more peaceful now.
The first holiday I was estranged from my family was hard. The second holiday I realized hell yes, I can be happy and never live like that again.
The holidays are the hardest. I'm almost 50 and I still feel guilty about deciding not to visit my parents. This is the first year that I have stayed away for the entire holiday. I'm hoping next year will be easier.
@@leep7439 I hope so too.
Exciting video, A year ago I took the no contact route, well i wouldnt say it didn't go well, but i missed her and sometimes you have to leave your comfort zone and go for what you want, Without knowing and having a huge ego, we might actually miss out on our soul mate all in the name of not settling for less, I know who i am, and at the same time i know what i want for me, so i did all i could to get her back, and I must say, it was the best decision i have ever made, we have been together again for over 7 months, yes marriage isn't always rosy, but i am lucky to have her, just as she is to have me, we compliment each other
its difficult to let go of someone you love, i am in a similar situation, and i do not know what else do to have him back, i have been dying inside, people actually think i am happy, i am not.
I feel your pain sister , after trying out the no contact experiment that failed miserably, i had to find other means, i had to reach out to a spiritual adviser, it was brilliant idea which i never thought it was, but it worked wonders for me.
Amazing, how did you get a spiritual counselor, and how do i reach him/ her?
Her name is Shelly renee white , and she is a great spiritual counselor who can bring back your ex.
Thank you for this valuable information, i just looked her up now online. impressive
To all the scapegoats out there always remember, when dealing with narcissistic family members, it's not you, it's them. Also remember being a scapegoat is the role of a lifetime. No amount of time away can ever change that. Even in their death bed, while they take their last breaths, they will still find a way to hurt you. Stay away for good!
Thank you, so true.,.,,....
Best advice - “stay away for good” .Blessings
This broke my heart. Chess you are beautiful, you are worthy and you are loved. I'm sorry you were treated that way.
Sending you love and light. I was scapegoat and was tortured by my parents and my five siblings tried to drown me. I’d be locked in the basement tied to a chair, extreme abuse and it is hard to work through, but it’s not you. It’s generational trauma they pour onto you because they can’t be accountable themselves.
Key word: Generational trauma. The key is to break from the past.
Me too. .and my family. I never cease to be amazed at such casual cruelty.. . and the **** that comes out of some people's mouths. You have my heartfelt sympathy.
And back to you! Take care
@@thescapegoatcluboh love I'm only 10 minutes and 24 seconds into the video and I just have to say what I believe is one they are toxic and two they're so immature and jealous and are unable to somehow be kind! Fascinating that you would turn out to be the empathetic individual you are from their household growing up. You shouldn't have to deal with this and while we are only getting your experience you strike me as very credible. It's unbelievable if someone doesn't want a visit it's okay to say oh it's just not a good time you don't have to turn it on to the person and say it was inconsiderate of you to suggest it! Sometimes toxic is toxic and even if it is your family I'm so glad you estranged because your mental health is way more important than maintaining a relationship with them. We appreciate you! Yeah I would love a visit!
You are not alone either Chess. I’m 9 years old and it took me three years to get to the point where I SEE the entire side of my mothers family is mentally and physically abusive and cruel, using each other and have no love to give b it has been and still is a truly NON- functional “family”. And I choose to no longer consider myself a part of them. In searching to make sense of the nonsense, I have read thru a lot of journal/notes of my mother and letters from her mother (as some kind of proof of her existence?? Or value??) and I know it has been honed thru more than three generations back.
Truly like a self isolated, non functional cult. I really cannot determine even if they have souls as it is so easy to use, abuse, exploit and lie and I seem to have been resented since I was born because my loving dad wanted a little girl. They hated him and when he died 30 years ago, I became the scapegoat in his place and I was emotionally exploited and manipulated since birth and did not realize she was exploiting us financially too until I finally couldn’t figure out what I WAS DOING WRONG and 15 years of EMDR therapy, understanding I was completely codependent and had my own mental health crisis flipping off that switch and no longer submitting myself to her for more resentment, abuse and betrayal (telling the rest of the family how awful I am - when she doesn’t even know who I am). Their letters prove they’ve been criticizing me since I was a child about things I never did. Ha. It is a cult. And in 2024 I am out. please wish me peace and freedom in my forward growth!!!❤❤ we align with you here!!
Your dad’s speech is where I’m at in your video. I have a lump in my throat. First time watching you. I’m so sorry. 😭🙏🏼
Exactly what you said! 💯 This whole comment section is heart wrenching.
God Bless You. I would have stood up and said “Thanks Dad. I really needed to hear that today”. I would have walked out of their life and gone home. Estrangement is probably the best way for you to cope with this toxic environment .
@@daniellesmith8568it's heart-wrenching and it's also comforting.
He didn't make you look awful he made himself look awful.
The worse part is "That didn't happen. We would have remembered if it did." The gaslighting!!!! I experienced that first-hand, more than once.
They never do remember the nasty things they do do they?
Unfortunately they can be so careless with really hurtful remarks that stab us in the heart, but I honestly think they don't remember their careless cruelty .... my father , a medical professional, told me it was " natural selection," was I too dumb to even understand that, and if I DID manage to conceive with medical help, I would have a retard.... that totally gutted me, considered by my own father too worthless to breed ... I never did have any children
My mother's favorite was, "You're just making that up."
Yes, they ALWAYS deny what they say and do.
The gaslighting and denial is revolting…
The undermining is subtle. One "passing" dig, laughed off by the speaker. The target shockingly tosses it into a dark corner, to rot with the others that are accumulating into quite the pile. And then one day, after so many years, decades even, when this "insignificant" pile has become an Everest-sized mountain with the weight of a black hole, the next item for the corner just happens to be the final straw. You don't toss it up there. You climb to the top, summit Mt. Everest, plant that straw like a flagpole, then walk down the other side and into the rest of your life. Your foolhardy ways and disappearance are disparagingly whispered about at every family gathering. It matters not. You are a successful mountaineer. Scars and all. You climbed out of that hell hole, now only a speck in your rearview mirror, and now have a life. Congratulations, and welcome!
That is one of the best written ways to describe this that I have ever read. Your comment brought me to tears. After being married for over 31 years, my husband puts me down similar to this. It has affected my self esteem and I feel like all these little comments keep adding to my pile. I’m too scared to be a separate mountaineer.
Very well worded.❤
Well said. Thanks
I had a devastating trauma as a child and my family used my hardships against me in everyway. I struggled sorting out my problems for years with no support from my parents and 3 sisters. I married lived abroard for years. The visits home saw my flying from Africa and having to get a bus from the airport home. I tried and tried for years leaving gaps of years in-between. I eventually came home, still struggling with health issues and breast cancer. No support at all. I went to a Councillor and she told me to put it in the cant fix it basket. You are brave and can make it without them. I have. Unfortunately my husband of 30yrs decided to leave too so now i am totally alone but happy with my dogs , my home and my garden. Trauma can make you accept so many bad treatments from people because you are vulnerable. Alas, al9ne i found my courage and my worth.🙏
God is with you through all this, you are never alone in that respect. You are better off without those demons pretending to be family! You are a very special and strong woman. A xx
@annasisk9861 💓💓🙏
I so needed to see this today. I had a miserable time at Thanksgiving and I just can't let go of it because none of it was fair or right. I was there to celebrate and everything I did was wrong instead. I'm so sorry for what happened to you. I'm glad we can be here together.
Hope you feel better, I am sorry your Thanksgiving was bad 🙏
Regards from Germany
Don’t do that again.
I'm so sorry you went through this ordeal
I know this feeling. Bless you.
Thank you for your kindness. Greetings from the US(Texas). @barbarabode4041
Happy you finally worked it out. I am 60 and just went no-contact with my sister (the last one in my family of 7) after having started the process with my father around 20.
There is NOTHING wrong with permenently and completely separating from a toxic, abusive, and mentally ill family.
The problem is the society that puts so much emphasis the preference for sustaining these relations as well as the stigma and judgement for those who have the courage to cut it off.
It is a form of mental illness, and even demonic activity. Pray for them, but stay away from them. Your family is whoever truly cherishes you. I have lived through this, too. Free now. The Lord protected me through all of it. Ask Him for the same.
So Bunny, does that mean you’re estranged from your whole family, or that your whole family is now estranged from her?
@i.ehrenfest349 I don't know but I can breathe easilier just reading her story. I can only imagine how she feels. Free at last. Free at last.
Right on! There is so much pressure to "treasure your family" but if they are an unhealthy bunch you can't do that. And yes, so much judgment if you cut them off. "What's the matter with you?" "Why would you do that?" and so on. Answer: "Well, do you want the whole story? You probably don't have time."
@@user-es9mb8wi3m Yup, demonic. Plain evil.
Truthfully said - "The real heartbreak that can come from families that can't be families. They just can't do it".
My faith in Abba has grown from having the family I have. They haven't changed, but I have. I pray for them and continue to ask Abba to bless them. Remember, its through our trials, that YAH gets the best growth out of us. I have found that I have been change more by the ones closest to myself, hence, I truly believe we are "given" the families we have. We didn't choose them. And its all for Heavenly Fathers glory. Shalom and love to you.
As the scapegoat that left the family, I sit back now and see how they are destroying everyone who's left in the family. I'm grateful they can never affect me again. I still talk to them, but they know nothing about my life. They see no pictures, get no updates, etc. I have no drama in my life anymore, so when they ask how we are, I say we're wonderful and that drives them crazy. They get nothing but a big grey rock from me and let me tell you, my life is soooo peaceful now!!! You don't realize all the drama and chaos you endure inside a toxic family until you step away and never let them into your world again. It's validating, liberating, and worth it!
The "grey rock" stance can bring so much peace!
Yes!
That was a KING move!
@Charactermatters1,
Your comment validates what I'm going through.
When my daughter told me, "mom, they are horrible people!" a light went on in my head.
I suddenly realized it WASN'T me.
Years later, a nephew commented about my siblings constantly conniving and scheming against others.
They work in tandem, making pronouncements that are planned, actions that are announced to create the most hurtful impact.
The Monster behind this scapegoating is our mom. She has taught them how to hate, how to create drama, and how to corner their target by pretending it's "just a family meeting".
There's never any give and take. No compromise.
No listening.
I'm searching for an apartment I can afford; it isn't easy, and at times I'm scared...but I'm planning my escape.
I walked away from my family 10 years ago and my only regret was that i didn't do it sooner. This was the most precious gift I gave to myself ❤ There is nothing that compares to achieving inner peace 🙌
Chess- I also sought therapy. Ive been diagnosed with CPTSD from severe child abuse by both my parents. The moment of realising the people you trusted to care for in fact cared more about themselves is brutal! I sympathise with you completely. You’re a better person and now stronger for your decision.
I am sorry you have a family like this. They don't deserve you. Set yourself free. 💚👣🌏
Exactly..what I think. They do not deserve her.
I can see she has a great big heart!❤
Set yourself free
ua-cam.com/video/sGQNRyxmhhg/v-deo.html
When you’ve been clearly informed that your presence is undesired, the kindest thing to do for everyone is to walk away and close the door behind you. You don’t always have to lock it, but you don’t need to open it again…ever. ❤
Thank you for sharing your experience it really helps to hear and confirm we are not alone
I gasped a little when you said "unsafe" - that is EXACTLY how my family makes me feel, but I never thought of it that way. I'm sorry your family is shit. I'm sorry they said those things to you.
Heartbreaking 🥺💔
That's what it came down to for me, I wasn't even thinking about that directly, I don't know, an inner voice said "now". Looking back I'm "what?" Now I tell the tale of my older sister (last person left) bottle of wine a day "plate chucker patty" who punched a window and tried to get me to move in with her in a foreign country after her husband died because idk she needed another convinient target?
How I normalized her for so long never ceases to amaze me. I boggle myself.
Some people are just bullies. Sounds like dad is and everyone goes along with it.
If he's deeply insecure and the daughter arrives from abroad successful and looking healthy and happy he's obviously going to be very threatened by that and need to belittle her
What a shame he couldn't just say "I'm proud to be your father"
Wow. This really validated the dynamics between me and my family. Coming from a dysfunctional childhood and the struggle to gain attention and support from people around you. They were only there in the physical sense. Not the mental and emotional sense.
Trying to interact with them, you get backlash. Not interacting with them, you get backlash.
It's an endless vicious cycle.
Thank you for sharing.
At 62, I learned a long time ago that if you can’t change the people around you. Change the people around you. It is so very liberating when you know that you don’t have to worry about certain toxic personalities anymore.
Brilliant 🩷
Absolutely! It’s very freeing to let go .
?
@rick Oh my!!! I absolutely loooooove that statement. Although I don't need to do this at this moment, I sure as heck am going to put it on my "remember" list. Thank you for posting these WISE words.💕💕💙💙💛💛❤
@@cherylj7460change who you have around you rather than change the personality of those presently around you
My heart has been crushed by my father’s words as well, telling me I just wasn’t good enough and would never make it in life. I was highly respected in a good job in the dental field, became a single mom and handled it all on my own, it’s debilitating. He did adore my little sister and handed her everything
The more successful my husband I became the more my family treated me like I was trash. I have a picture of my father with me when I graduated from college and he is literally biting his lower lip he is so angry. I was a very successful teacher and became a Title 1 administrator. My husband has a very successful construction business. As a child I remember him being so jealous of others success and nice homes, but how can one be jealous of their own child? He is dead now, but my mother carries on the abuse towards me. I haven't spoken to her in over eight years, never will and will NOT be at her funeral either. Let God be their judge!
geeze. I thought I was the only one. I was the bad daughter and my sister was his Golden Child. I refused to be controlled and my sister was easily bought with cars and college tuition.
@@jasdawn5 Never go back. It's like the story of King Lear. Cordelia was the scapegoat. She felt bad for her father, and went back to help her father, even after he banished her. Her sister ended up killing her AND their dad. :( I will never go back. There is evil there that I will no longer subject my kids and myself to.
Your dad did your little sister no favor by 'adoring' her. We all know, a man is not a plan.
Your pain is soooooo palpable. It hurts my heart to hear what you were able to share. I have been estranged from my family for 34 years. What I can tell you is that the pain becomes part of the static in the air ~ kinda like AM / FM radio static. It - for me - is always there right under the surface. I have learned to cope, I have learned to heal in many ways, but life circles back around and I will get smacked between the eyes with something that knocks me over out of the blue. The positive thing is that each time it gets easier to get back up.
I pray that you will find peace in your journey, and have supportive people surrounding you always.
God bless.
I estranged from my abusive father and step mother when I was just married a few months. I tried to reconnect later when I had children, but his behavior towards my husband ( mostly just ignored him) was the last straw, so I wrote him a letter stating we were done basically and never saw him again until his funeral. My sister got stuck being his chauffeur, health care advocate, etc til he died. Luckily I married 8th a very loving family who understood and treated me as their own. I have three sisters who I am closer to than my blood sister. I am now almost 63 years old and have been very happy without my toxic family around. You did the right thing, God bless you! 🙏🏻💙
You are so lucky
Now let it go x
I did exactly what you did with your family 25yrs ago never looked back and they done me a huge favor God bless you and all of Us👏👏👏🏴💪
I’m so sorry your parents treated you so cruelly. That is true “gaslighting,” which is crazy making. Accepting that any loved-one is not capable of loving us is painful and never understood by our hearts. I know this pain too. ❤
One of the biggest lies that society has force-fed us. . We need to forgive and let family treat us like shit because theyre family blood is thicker its your mom its you dad ... nope the best thing to do is drop toxic people and make a happy life with healthy loving supportive respectful people
Wishing everyone well joy and most importantly peace 🙏🏻💕🌻
Your story brought me to tears. Thank you for sharing. I had a similar revelation, a couple years ago, that I wasn't 'the problem' in my family, as I'd been made to look and feel for so many years. Primarily by toxic and narcissistic siblings. It's both a freeing and a heartbreaking revelation. As scapegoats, no matter the details of our journeys and stories, we all know the same kind of pain, and the strength it takes to walk away. Peace and blessings to you...
Sadly, it is normal for families to create a scapegoat. Please hold your head up enforce your boundaries. Your siblings may never admit it but, they will respect you for it.
Amen 🙏🏻
They always conveniently forget what they said that was so horrible.
The sword is a weapon while the tongue is total destruction.
Or family says, "you're nuts, iInever said that": making you feel as if you are crazy and it NEVER happened.
Say and DO.
💯 %
So true!!
Chess, I got 12:00 minutes in and decided it was time to write, I know it's hard but you have to let go now. You must choose yourself. You are love, you are loved, and you are not alone. Once you let go true freedom will arise and joy, happiness and peace will settle as this is your true essence. Your Dad is doing the best job he can at his level of consciousness. We cannot change the way people think and feel, we can only honor ourselves and realize when it is time to let go. Sending you love ♥
What finally brought me the clarity I needed was after they both passed away and the only photo I found of me in their apartment was facing down at the bottom of a drawer.
Both my parents died in a very sad way. I have only one photo of them, my favourite, that I took during a happy weeks holiday . I keep it in a drawer and bring it out at Xmas and birthdays and light a candle. Why not the rest of the time? I find it too painful to look at. They have been gone 15 years.
Interestingly, in my Mum's wallet, she had a photo of my Dad and her two dogs, but none of myself and my sister or her grand-daughter -who she adored.
John Deloney says, "Behavior is a language."
That has been my rule ever since I heard.
@@SentientdreamerOMG this! this is what I have been trying to say for years and yet the wording is so simple and profound. Thank you for being here and sharing this because it's exactly what I needed to see and hear today 😊❤
@laurie9377 watch what people do not what they say.
Ouch ! Sorry Corine - possibly because it triggered guilt in them when they saw it
I think the “estrangement” was you coming to the realization that your family, your parents, had always rejected you. They couldn’t face the fact they’ve failed to love, nurture & treat their own child the way you always deserved so instead they found excuses to put the blame on you. Just seeing you was like holding up a mirror to their own deficiencies, to their own childhood pain & trauma handicapping them filling them with guilt, anger & resentment. The family could only “pretend”, play a childhood game of “make believe” to save face without making any change.
The recurring issue between my family & me was my refusal to play make believe with them anymore. I experienced what I experienced, I felt what I felt, I knew what I knew but it took seeing a therapist to validate my reality before I could accept & face that truth.
Best comment ever. Thank you for your insight.
I believe the mirror ruins their narrative it’s all you & not them.
I’m moved by your story, and sorry for your pain. Congratulations on choosing yourself and mental health!
Chess thank you for sharing your story. After almost 10 years of estrangement, I don't think the pain ever goes away. "from my heart and soul" to yours, I am in the same situation. I still wonder what I could have done better but the answer is nothing. XOXOX
It helps when you realize that they do not behave that way intentionally. They do know that they hurt other people, but they can't help themselves. To me it doesn't matter whether they show me that they do not care or not. Not caring is bad enough. And I know that your pain will go away. At some point we simply don't care anymore what they think or (don't) feel because it becomes too exhausting to dwell on it. In the end we accept what we can't change. And then we feel free!
@@zenitaocelic4226I disagree I think they do behave that way intentionally. Especially if the other sister doesn't receive the same treatment. They function perfectly well in society and they made a choice to be ugly and negative to one of their children. I'm curious how you don't think it's intentional help me understand
@@kathoproductions I think we are both right actually. Sometimes they hurt intentionally, sometimes they don't because they don't understand how normal people function emotionally.
Here are examples of hurting unintentionally. My sociopathic ex husband said the following when I asked him why he had chosen me if he was so dissatisfied with me all the time. His answer during a calm conversation: I thought it would make me look good if I had you next to me. He was surprised that I didn’t like the answer.
Another example: The day before our conversation he had been extremely hurtful towards me. I felt devastated. The next day I was still in shock which was obvious. In passing he looked at me and said genuinely surprised “What’s wrong? Can’t you see I am no longer upset?”
Of course in public they mostly try to come across as normal, feeling human beings, but if you are around them long enough, they often slip and seem awkward to say the least. In the beginning people tend to disregard their strange comments (“He didn’t mean it.” / “I must have misunderstood.”). But if they stick around, they understand that there’s something very wrong with them. All these unintentional reactions start to pile up. The disordered person would not behave that way if he was aware how strange and deranged he seems.
Chess, thank you for sharing part of your story. It’s heartbreaking to see the pain that is so obviously real. My husband has had to battle toxicity and abuse from his family and has recently decided not to reciprocate any more. All efforts to connect and even flying out there to help with various crises in the past have all been criticized for not being enough and gone unappreciated. After a childhood of zero support and endless criticism, he is done. I support him fully without adding any fuel to the fire.
This is heavy 💔
I'm glad he has your support.
I’m sorry you went through this. The ones who are supposed to love us most have a special ability to hurt us. I’m 75 and the painful memories from growing up haunt me still. Stay as strong and as brave as you appear to be. Hoping you can in some measure find release from these awful experiences.
I live in the middle of nowhere and talk to the mirror, gets hard sometimes but beats being in a toxic environment.
You are not alone.
“Thank you for sharing your painful journey” seems inadequate to the task. But, thank you so much. Degree of difficulty: 10/10. My daughter estranged me. I couldn’t handle it. Found a good therapist, and I still see her. My daughter has, with much love and forgiveness, un-estranged me. This is the abridged version; it actually took a lot of work, honesty, pain for both of us. My heart goes out to you, and I am sending you hugs and healing. I am so glad that you have your husband and children to buoy you up.
Well can you give us a hint as to why she did that to you
@@007nadineL I think the important message in her comment is that they were both willing to do the hard work to have a relationship. Congrats to them. It's nice to know that happens for some.
@ I can say that one of the problems was boundaries, or lack thereof. I had to learn that I needed to honor her boundaries, and that I wasn’t within the inner circle. I learned to keep my opinions to myself. I learned not to give advice. And I learned not to argue about her childhood. We have quite a different perspective on that, and it’s something I continue to work on.
This brought tears to my eyes. I had a similar situation with my father. The last thing he said to me was, I need not ever come by again. He died in a car accident not quite a year later. Therapy helped me but it still can hurt.
11:57 my dad used to say to me as a little girl when I’d say he hurt my feelings: “I never said that. You’re LYING.” DEVASTATING, even to this day.
So sorry. What you needed to hear was, "I don't recall saying that but I believe you. I am so sorry that I hurt your feelings. Your feelings matter to me and I don't want to hurt you because I love you. Please let me know in the future if I do or say something that hurts you. Thank you for being vulnerable enough to share your hurt with me. I am sorry for the pain I caused you. Please forgive me".
@ been waiting for that my whole life
It doesn't matter if they remember or not. When they remember they deflect either.
I got told I supposedly was too sensitive which is rubbish!
@@joannesaltfleet2071oh yes! I know that comment all too well. It’s good to be sensitive- better than being heartless!
My mother often used public places to put me down in front of other people.I understand exactly how you felt when your dad did that.
My mother was the only one in my family who knew who I am, and she was the only one who appreciated me for myself. When she died twenty years ago, I estranged the rest of my relatives and went looking for my real family. My sibling and I might have been born on different planets to different species for all that we have in common. I never regretted cutting them off.
Sad. But understandable.
At 50 I was widowed and I am remarried for 23 years now.
I am in a blended family that is so kind and considerate of me. When they get together to help me with something I need I can barely comprehend it. I felt in so many ways I had not had very many times where I felt like people were there for me. It’s a wonderful feeling. And today on Thanksgiving, I am grateful for the family. God gave me.
You give me hope and inspiration. Thank you. Be blessed.
Yup I had similar experience my mother inlaw said that’s what we do we help each other it was a very very strange feeling in he beginning to accept money from them for Christmas etc. I was use to doing without or working along time get some things I needed as want was never really in my world and of course the guilt for treating myself if I could was relentless as I did not want to live under a bridge as my mom would say 👿 evil possessed that woman…. Year of therapy victory is mine
Good for you. Much love. 🩷💛🩵
Well done Chess! Both realizing that they are the problem and that the only way to protect yourself from them is to end all contact. I love what your therapist said about them being unable to be a family. I had a therapist say something similar. I was protesting his suggestion that I have nothing to do with my family. I kept saying that I had to continue contact with them bc they were my family and he said "Well they're not acting like it now are they?" At that moment he opened a door to freedom for me. He was right. Like your family, mine just couldn't be and family and trying to make them act like a family is a fool's errand.
It took a long time after I cut my family off and that was an immense relief. Not having to bear their anger was a new life. However, it took much longer to admit that they didn't love me and never did. Decades later I have gotten to a point where my thought about that is "so what? I don't care."
My heart weeps for you, Chess. It can be very painful to share stories like this, and I appreciate your willingness to do so. I am emerging from my third mental health crisis over 50 years, all three having been the result of choices my mother made, and expected me to accept. Now, I am genuinely afraid of her, even though she is an old woman. I am afraid of the pain she can inflict, and all I want to do is stay away.
@jeanetteh.9240 It's extremely difficult to disentangle from the thorn-bramble of toxic relationships, especially with family. About 20 years ago after my brother violently went after me, my 80-year old Dad, and my Brother-In-Law, I experienced a light-bulb moment. I realized that individuals who had treated me like that or in similar toxic ways I excised from my life. It was hard to do but essential to my mental health and feeling of true self-worth. Then when my brother went after the three of us, I realized that the only person in my life who still treated me terribly was my brother. I disengaged from him from that moment on and cut off all contact. It was very difficult at first and it doesn't mean that I don't love him, but for the sake of having a healthy and stable life, it was the best decision I've ever made. Jeanette, it's not too late to create a healthier environment for yourself. Sometimes estrangement is the best gift you can give yourself. It does get better over time and I believe it will be a freeing feeling...one of escape...truly.
Honor yourself and do just that! We must protect ourselves from mean, unloving people, even if they are our close relatives.
@farrellrouse4820 Thank you so much for your thoughtful reply. I feel seen.
I deleted my "family" four years ago as well. I have never been happier. I wish i would have done it years sooner. They zapped me of my joyfulness. Now, i am VERY choosey with what i tolerate, and I will quickly let toxic people go at the first signs of toxicity. Estrangement was the most empowering step I have made as an adult.
I am so sorry that happened to you. I remember my last visit with my father. He was terminally ill. I won't go into the details of the visit. The night before I left I sat in my room getting drunk. I got up at 6 to go to the airport. As I was leaving I looked back at my father in the doorway and said to myself I will never see him alive again because I will never put myself through this again. A few days later I called and talked to him. I said I love you and I am praying for you. He responded, "Ya pray for me, do you want to talk to your mother?" I never spoke to him again. It took me years to emotionally recover. When you said what he said in the pub, I actually gasped and felt like a knife went through my heart. You are not alone, and it is NOT you. You were like pearls before swine.
I have experienced this myself. The horrible constant feeling that somehow you are in the wrong, the constant put downs which are always said as though it is established fact that you are a bad & difficult person & they are wonderful for putting up with you at all. As a thoroughly scapegoated person, gosh I know something of how you feel.
Id
I completely empathize. It took me years to understand the need to dump toxic relationships, no matter who they are. My parents, my brother and a so called friend. The relief is tremendous. I have a much better life when I can be me and be accepted than I did trying to be who others decided I should be. I wish you well on your journey!
I am so very deeply sorry for your pain. I cried watching you. I hope you are well, happy and full of joy. I moved to another country to get away from my family and 20 years later I don’t miss the bullying and disrespect. I just left a whole life behind and found wonderful people who love and accept me for me. I hope you have many of them by your side as well. Friends are the family we choose and honestly I think that is the best and most selfless love ever. Family is overrated. Peace. 🌷
I am so sorry for your pain. I am the scapegoat in my toxic, dysfunctional family of Narcissists. Both of my parents are Narcissists as well as some siblings. It's been very painful, as you know. This holiday season is the 1st one I'm declining to get together with family. I am on a journey of healing and they don't fit into that plan. God bless you. You are a beloved child of God and YOU ARE NOT THE PROBLEM!!! Sending love from Minnesota, USA. ❤
And Australia❤
And New Zealand 🇳🇿🤗💗
And Houston
I would love to have a daughter like you. Mine is an extreme narcissist. She is off and on but doesn't care about us. We love her dearly but will never have a normal relationship. We could be your surrogate parents. BTW.. what is wrong with your sister if she accepts this horrible behavior ?
I am so glad I found you. After years, since childhood, of being the scapegoat in the family, my sisters and brother learned from listening to my dad belittle me at the dinner table [and other events] that it is okay to treat me with cruelty. We are in our 70's, it has never stopped so I had to finally walk away from my sisters. It hurts alot, but it was worse being the target of their cruelty.
Going no contact with them will become one of the best choices that you'll ever make. That FOG (fear, obligation and guilt) keeps us in those toxic relationships. Your grief will pass. 15 years ago I was diagnosed with multiple sclerosis and I had a 10 year old daughter to care for. Now it's 12 years no contact with my mum and sisters and I have peace of heart and mind and I wish the same for you. ❤
I love, respect & understand your perspective. As a therapist who does family of origin work with my clients, whilst still attempting to heal my unhealable family situation, I am certain that I needed to read and watch this post from you. Brightest blessings. I will continue to do my work and may or may not have ANY MORE conversations/visits with my toxic family.
Sometimes people are born to the wrong families. It happens, it happened to me.
What always amazes me is that we tolerate abhorrent behavior from family that we would never allow from strangers or friends. We give family much more latitude than we would ever give to anyone else. Why? How many chances should they get? As I’ve gotten older, I tolerate far less. Abuse is abuse, regardless of where it comes from or from whom. Family respect is earned, it shouldn’t be a given. Share your life and your heart and your time with giving, empathic people who can appreciate your worth and value. Stop going to a dry well expecting things to be different from empty, selfish people who have chosen to treat you badly. Sadly, your parents don’t appear to have the capacity for genuine warmth or love. None of it is your fault. You don’t deserve to subject yourself to their cruelty. Let them go, secure in the knowledge that you are an accomplished and vital woman, deserving of all that they are emotionally incapable of providing. Don’t waste another moment with people who don’t deserve you. Wishing you all the best.
Well said Susan--the unfortunate part is in these end times we all have to confront the reality of what you described.
I agree, none of it is your fault. So important. It's so easy to internalize the feeling that you (or I) somehow deserve that awful treatment.
It’s not your fault & You are not alone are some of the most powerful words we can hear when we are suffering in this way. I come from a very similar family system; at almost 57 yo, being very accomplished, retired, raising 3 step daughters from teens to adulthood and moving overseas I finally gained enough distance to see my family members as PEOPLE who just do not possess the facility or capacity to love or appreciate on the same level I do. They needed an emotional trashcan bc they do not have the depth or strength of character to serve that function for themselves. I am fortunate to have that resolve…and I am fortunate not to have to live my life as one of them. I can love them from a distance. I only reach out when I have prepared myself and am in a strong and positive emotional place - and have conditioned them to understand that me getting in touch is a gift, they should treat it that way. It works now…tenuously but they do not steal my peace any longer.
Chess thank you for sharing your story. Today is Thanksgiving in the U.S. and I can't think of a more befitting video. I'm estranged from my family of origin and my son. The holidays has been difficult in the past. Your video plus the comments have given me validation and support. I am not alone!!! Hope everyone has a very Happy Thanksgiving!!!
You are not alone! Narcs mess with the holidays tired of torture lies bs
This is my first Thanksgiving I chose to NOT dine with my family and I am figuring out how to get out of Christmas.
I have taken early retirement from Family Funishment at the holidays. So sorry for what you go through, especially with your child. You are definitely not alone! 🧡
Rosalind, it's just a day, another day like any other day. Don't spend your valuable feelings be invested in it. Invest them in something worthwhile to you.
Thank You for helping me feel less guilty and alone this season. Your video helped me.
I don’t think that if I had to live 1000 lifetimes I’d still never comprehend the evil families that some of us are born into. Estranging oneself is the best gift we can give ourselves ❤
I could not disconnect from my family until my mother died. My relationship with her had always been difficult. She was a classic narcissist and my brother her “golden child” - also a particularly cruel narcissist. I spent the last 6 years of her life caring for her full time. She was nearly 100 when she died, but she did thank me for what I had done for her, and recognised that her other children had abandoned her once she became very frail, still mentally alert though. The relief of not having to deal with the rest of the family anymore is immeasurable. Every Christmas I spend alone by choice, I enjoy. So many Christmases forced to be spent with a toxic group of people because they are “family”. For me, estrangement is freedom and relief!😂🎉
My siblings estranged from me after my mother died. Looking back it was the best thing that could have happened. During that time it hurt so much.
Same here. After dad died the lawyer’s wife( my toxic sister) turned on me and the lot of them followed. Was tough then but so peaceful now. Wish you the best.
@ isn’t it amazing what money means to people? I would have done anything for my sister. Amazing thing is that you find out who they really are. You were fooled your whole life?! It’s quite a shock. But now I am blessed beyond all blessings. I would’ve given them anything they wanted if they could’ve accepted my terms on when. But no. I hope and pray that they will change their ways. God bless you today, there’s so much to be thankful for.
🩷
@@glorytogodhomestead3495 not really fooled but dragged into an “ us vs them” scenario on my moms side. But, she was the architect of all this misery and abuse. Neglect and abusive and never there for us, but demanded I champion her. No more, Free of it. Thankful for a community like this and you that get it. Understand.
Thanks for sharing. So bravely! Stay strong and well and safe
Thank you! You too!
Thank you for sharing your experience within a toxic family Chess. Speaking from my own experience, staying in contact with destructive people, parents, or otherwise, does nothing to improve our own self-worth over time. I believe distance and self care to be the best course of action. Time won't fix them. They get worse with age. ❤ Remember, their behavior is not a reflection of you, and it never was!
If you have a problem with someone, it's because they have a problem with you. Therefore, look inward first about your possible role, before writing them off.
@@janesmith9968 You clearly didn't watch the video.
I see how you’re working so hard to tell your story as you’re struggling to maintain control of your emotions. I’m so sorry your situation was so fraught for you. I separated from my father first and then my mother in 2012 and this past Spring, I went no contact with my twin sister. Didn’t attend either funeral when my parents passed. Sad to say, my family has always believed that I was punishing them when I chose to sever ties with them, that it was my fault that things went so bad. My friends have become my family and while it’ll never be the same and I miss the parents I wanted and needed, I am grateful for these people who I now consider my family.
Hello Chess.
I was always the Scapegoat. The Mistake. In the Summer of 1994, I was diagnosed with terminal AIDS, and doctors told me to go home and wait to die. I was living alone.
That Christmas I went home for the last time, (I thought). My father invited all of his friends and neighbors for Christmas Dinner. As the dinner began, my father went into the closet and dug out a card table, and a folding chair, and set it in the living room (adjacent to the dining room). He set down a plastic plate, and plastic utensils and a plastic cup. He did this in front of everyone sitting at the Dining Table. He then looked me dead in the eye and said that I was "unworthy to sit at his table," and that if I wanted to eat, I could sit at the card table.
My mother did not look at me nor say one word in my defense, God Forbid !!
Needless to say I was mortified. One of the next door neighbor's son watched this go down intently. I began to eat alone, mortified. He got up from the table, and drug his chair over to me, and sat with me and said that he could not sit there and watch me be mortified and eat alone !!! That was the straw that broke the camel's back for me.
The next day, that particular family took me out on their boat and I had an opportunity to explain. I never went home again. 6 years later I left the country and moved abroad, after divorcing them as family, to wipe them off the "Next of Kin" responsibility. My father was enraged I would do that to him. He died unrepentant in 2018. We had not spoken since that visit.
The poetic justice was that, for every holiday they invited others to dine with them, the specter of that empty chair haunted them forevermore ...
Chess, I’m so very sorry you had to endure that pain. I can hear the heartbreak in your voice. I’m also estranged from my family and spent most of my life thinking it was me. It took years of therapy. I am forever damaged from the trauma, but at 57 now, I at least finally feel safe. Yes, I isolate and won’t let anyone into my life, but I’m not scared anymore. Thank you for sharing your story with us. It takes a lot of courage. But please know, you are not alone. Thanks for creating a space for all of us to come together. 🙏🏻
"Yes, I isolate... but I'm not scared anymore". That hit THIS 57 y/o like a ton of bricks. How true!!!
@@cpuffer7978same! I'm 55.
I can relate. Thank you for sharing. It does help to know I am not alone. ❤
Good luck to you. I went through a time of estrangement and it is agonizing. I hope you have found your people who love you and support u.
Eff ‘em. They aren’t worth it. You seem like a lovely person. Take care of yourself ❤
I cut my mother off 23 years ago. It was too painful not to. The following ten years were the worst, huge depression and anxiety, but I came out the other end, sort of reborn. Life is good now. I survived. My mother was the last surviving member of my family, there was no one to turn to after that. Mid 50s now. I wouldn't wish this on my worst enemy.
This thread is so comforting and validating …. So many of us in same situation with estranged family and it still hurts but I feel better knowing I am not alone!❤️
You’re absolutely not alone. The hardest part for me is learning to refrain from rumination and replay. I’ve even had to work within my dream life to shake off repetitive dreams. Your internal congruence and integrity are hard-earned. Be proud of what you’ve accomplished!
Jealousy is a very powerful, destructive force. You are a totally lovely person and they couldn't handle it.
It's Evil. One of the deadly sins.
Why do others believe the evil ones tho?