Did Jesus' first followers think he was God? With Dr. James Tabor (part 1)
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- Опубліковано 23 сер 2024
- James Tabor on UA-cam: @JamesTaborVideos
Blog: jamestabor.com/
Join Dr. James D. Tabor for an in-depth study of the Gospel of Mark - "Creating Jesus: Why Mark's Gospel Was Forgotten?" sales.mvp-cour...
I am a Jewish believer. Thank you for being a voice of logic and truth. Shalom to all and my Muslim brothers and sisters.
Peace be upon you too 😊
Salam brother
Well, that's a good point.
Monotheists had better cooperate (and we do).
Look at what's waiting out there.
@@Kitiwake There's only one Monotheistic religion
@Remnant Resurrected
God Almighty commands in Deuteronomy 18:18-19 to harken to a certain Prophet. In this prophecy the w-a-rning and th-reat from God is so se-vere and se-rious that he testifies that He Himself will require it of people to harken to this Prophet otherwise He Himself will be THE REV-ENGER against them / seek venge-ance aga-inst them / will require it of them / will hold them accountable. Is that command of God not worth looking in to?🤔. Is that se-rious warn-ing irrelevant?🤔
My contention is that Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) is that Prophet of Deuteronomy 18:18-19. So let's reason.
On Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him)
Deuteronomy 18:18 “I (God) will raise them up a Prophet from among their
brethren, like unto thee (Moses), and will put my words in his mouth; and he shall speak unto them all that I shall command him.”
Deuteronomy 18:19 we read: “And it shall come to pass, [that] whosoever will not hearken unto my words which he shall speak in my name, I will require [it] of him.”
(I will require [it] of him - in some translations: “I will be the RE-VE-NG-ER” / “I will take VE-NG-EA-NC-E” / "I WILL HOLD HIM. ACCOUNTABLE"
************
*RE-ME-MB-ER: THE RE-VE-NG-ER* 💔
THE ONLY TRUE GOD - The Father, has testified that he will be THE REVENGER against those who reject the Prophet of Deuteronomy 18:18-19.
***************
Isaiah 1:18
"Come now, and let us reason together, saith the LORD..."
So let us reason. :-)
And how can anyone reason without using evidence and intellect?
Otherwise the call for reason makes no sense. After all, God Almighty gave us a mind and the ability to think for a purpose.
***********
*The scriptures call for reason so won't you reason?* 🤔
Let's get the scriptures GUIDE us and SETTLE the matter between us to bring us to the truth.
I get goosebumps when I heard Dr Tabor quoted "no one is good but God alone"
Me too ! No one could ever explain that to me as a Christian
Laila Ilallah
"Why do you call me good - no one is good but God alone".
Psalm 118:1 "Confess that the Lord is good"
The rich young man is given the opportunity to make the good confession but fails.
@@catherine9808 [3:42]
And when the angels said: O Mary! Lo! Allah hath chosen thee and made thee pure, and hath preferred thee above (all) the women of creation.
[3:43]
O Mary! Be obedient to thy Lord, prostrate thyself and bow with those who bow (in worship).
[3:44]
This is of the tidings of things hidden. We reveal it unto thee (Muhammad). Thou wast not present with them when they threw their pens (to know) which of them should be the guardian of Mary, nor wast thou present with them when they quarrelled (thereupon).
[3:45]
(And remember) when the angels said: O Mary! Lo! Allah giveth thee glad tidings of a word from him, whose name is the Messiah, Jesus, son of Mary, illustrious in the world and the Hereafter, and one of those brought near (unto Allah).
[3:46]
He will speak unto mankind in his cradle and in his manhood, and he is of the righteous.
[3:47]
She said: My Lord! How can I have a child when no mortal hath touched me ? He said: So (it will be). Allah createth what He will. If He decreeth a thing, He saith unto it only: Be! and it is.
[3:48]
And He will teach him the Scripture and wisdom, and the Torah and the Gospel,
[3:49]
And will make him a messenger unto the Children of Israel, (saying): Lo! I come unto you with a sign from your Lord. Lo! I fashion for you out of clay the likeness of a bird, and I breathe into it and it is a bird, by Allah’s leave. I heal him who was born blind, and the leper, and I raise the dead, by Allah’s leave. And I announce unto you what ye eat and what ye store up in your houses. Lo! herein verily is a portent for you, if ye are to be believers.
[3:50]
And (I come) confirming that which was before me of the Torah, and to make lawful some of that which was forbidden unto you. I come unto you with a sign from your Lord, so keep your duty to Allah and obey me.
[3:51]
Lo! Allah is my Lord and your Lord, so worship Him. That is a straight path.
[3:52]
But when Jesus became conscious of their disbelief, he cried: Who will be my helpers in the cause of Allah ? The disciples said: We will be Allah’s helpers. We believe in Allah, and bear thou witness that we have surrendered (unto Him).
[3:53]
Our Lord! We believe in that which Thou hast revealed and we follow him whom Thou hast sent. Enrol us among those who witness (to the truth).
[3:54]
And they (the disbelievers) schemed, and Allah schemed (against them): and Allah is the best of schemers.
[3:55]
(And remember) when Allah said: O Jesus! Lo! I am gathering thee and causing thee to ascend unto Me, and am cleansing thee of those who disbelieve and am setting those who follow thee above those who disbelieve until the Day of Resurrection. Then unto Me ye will (all) return, and I shall judge between you as to that wherein ye used to differ.
[3:56]
As for those who disbelieve I shall chastise them with a heavy chastisement in the world and the Hereafter; and they will have no helpers.
[3:57]
And as for those who believe and do good works, He will pay them their wages in full. Allah loveth not wrong-doers.
[3:58]
This (which) We recite unto thee is a revelation and a wise reminder.
[3:59]
Lo! the likeness of Jesus with Allah is as the likeness of Adam. He created him of dust, then He said unto him: Be! and he is.
[3:60]
(This is) the truth from thy Lord (O Muhammad), so be not thou of those who waver.
[3:61]
And whoso disputeth with thee concerning him, after the knowledge which hath come unto thee, say (unto him): Come! We will summon our sons and your sons, and our women and your women, and ourselves and yourselves, then we will pray humbly (to our Lord) and (solemnly) invoke the curse of Allah upon those who lie.
[3:62]
Lo! This verily is the true narrative. There is no God save Allah, and lo! Allah, He verily is, is the Mighty, the Wise.
Interestingly enough, this biblical quote is actually Jesus testing the young man. In other words, Jesus is leading him…
He’s saying “if you’re prepared to call me good….well than…guess what that means…*wink *wink *nudge *nudge.
This text is actually pro-deity of Christ. Jesus is waiting for the young man to confess the true implications of what he’s recognizing.
I’ve been following Dr Tabor for years, wallahi i got to say he has potential to be a Muslim, so honest & his views of Jesus are perfectly inline with Islam
May Allah (SWT) guide him
His name is James as well 🥲
May Allah guide him
[2:255]
Allah! There is no God save Him, the Alive, the Eternal. Neither slumber nor sleep overtaketh Him. Unto Him belongeth whatsoever is in the heavens and whatsoever is in the earth. Who is he that intercedeth with Him save by His leave ? He knoweth that which is in front of them and that which is behind them, while they encompass nothing of His knowledge save what He will. His throne includeth the heavens and the earth, and He is never weary of preserving them. He is the Sublime, the Tremendous.
[24:35]
Allah is the Light of the heavens and the earth. The similitude of His light is as a niche wherein is a lamp. The lamp is in a glass. The glass is as it were a shining star. (This lamp is) kindled from a blessed tree, an olive neither of the East nor of the West, whose oil would almost glow forth (of itself) though no fire touched it. Light upon light. Allah guideth unto His light whom He will. And Allah speaketh to mankind in allegories, for Allah is Knower of all things.
[39:62]
Allah is Creator of all things, and He is Guardian over all things.
[39:63]
His are the keys of the heavens and the earth, and they who disbelieve the revelations of Allah - such are they who are the losers.
[39:64]
Say (O Muhammad, to the disbelievers): Do ye bid me serve other than Allah ? O ye fools!
[39:65]
And verily it hath been revealed unto thee as unto those before thee (saying): If thou ascribe a partner to Allah thy work will fail and thou indeed wilt be among the losers.
[39:66]
Nay, but Allah must thou serve, and be among the thankful!
[39:67]
And they esteem not Allah as He hath the right to be esteemed, when the whole earth is His handful on the Day of Resurrection, and the heavens are rolled in His right hand. Glorified is He and High Exalted from all that they ascribe as partner (unto Him).
[39:68]
And the trumpet is blown, and all who are in the heavens and all who are in the earth swoon away, save him whom Allah willeth. Then it is blown a second time, and behold them standing waiting!
[39:69]
And the earth shineth with the light of her Lord, and the Book is set up, and the prophets and the witnesses are brought, and it is judged between them with truth, and they are not wronged.
[39:70]
And each soul is paid in full for what it did. And He is Best Aware of what they do.
[39:71]
And those who disbelieve are driven unto hell in troops till, when they reach it and the gates thereof are opened, and the warders thereof say unto them: Came there not unto you messengers of your own, reciting unto you the revelations of your Lord and warning you of the meeting of this your Day ? they say: Yea, verily. But the word of doom of disbelievers is fulfilled.
[39:72]
It is said (unto them): Enter ye the gates of hell to dwell therein. Thus hapless is the journey’s end of the scorners.
[39:73]
And those who keep their duty to their Lord are driven unto the Garden in troops till, when they reach it, and the gates thereof are opened, and the warders thereof say unto them: Peace be unto you! Ye are good, so enter ye (the Garden of delight), to dwell therein;
[39:74]
They say: Praise be to Allah, Who hath fulfilled His promise unto us and hath made us inherit the land, sojourning in the Garden where we will! So bounteous is the wage of workers.
[39:75]
And thou (O Muhammad) seest the angels thronging round the Throne, hymning the praises of their Lord. And they are judged aright. And it is said: Praise be to Allah, the Lord of the Worlds!
[59:22]
He is Allah, than Whom there is no other God, the Knower of the Invisible and the Visible. He is the Beneficent, Merciful.
[59:23]
He is Allah, than Whom there is no other God, the Sovereign Lord, the Holy One, Peace, the Keeper of Faith, the Guardian, the Majestic, the Compeller, the Superb. Glorified be Allah from all that they ascribe as partner (unto Him).
[59:24]
He is Allah, the Creator, the Shaper out of naught, the Fashioner. His are the most beautiful names. All that is in the heavens and the earth glorifieth Him, and He is the Mighty, the Wise.
according to 1 John 2:22 and Deuteronomy 24:1-4, Mo is: 1) a liar; 2) antichrist; 3) disgusting
Peace be behind him
if he doesn't think Jesus is God, he is already a muslim "people of the book" that book happens to be different.
@@noahwamalwa4385 anything you quote from a book that was written 600 years later and in a translation of translation of oral transmission as a third hand account of a person who lived 100s of years after prophet talking about prophet... Just can't be taken seriously
Interesting conversation. When I used to be a Christian the idea of praying through Jesus or him being killed for my sins never resonated with me. I guess I would pretend it did but had a tornado in the back of my mind of “how can this be right?” Alhamdullilah! Allah guides who He wills and He brought me to Islam and allowed me to accept it.
So you swapped that for another bullshit religion
The Koran and islam is false and full of holes too. Like not going to paradise for dying your hair black, for no given or having other God's names like Yahweh for one in the prophets mentioned on the Koran. It's ridiculous. If you believe that you'll believe anything
This channel has become a reliable source to dig a deeper objective understanding in theological materials. I was watching Dr. James from various channels and thinking that Dr. James could contribute significant information, and suddenly here he is in Paul's channel. Jazakallah khair Paul, thank you for the video like always.
Just a question dont you think that this channel is weird and pointless and very odd
and im asking as a muslim
@@theguyver4934 I think this channel is amazing and much better than other Muslim channels
@@theguyver4934 I know this character named guyver. Paul's channel paths a way for those who is in search for the truth, some people are lost in a bad narrative and to those that are still trying to find the truth, surely this is a channel to go to. And I've been a subscriber to Paul's channel for quite some time, and he's been unveiling hidden narratives through eligible sources that deligitimize the fallacies.
@@theguyver4934 as a Muslim 😂😂😂 really why the lie
Ironically in this video “James” & “Paul” are respecting each other 😵💫 cough cough
Good one 🤣
Ha
😂 classic
Paul is more credible these days ,, 🙃
@@TheWatchmanWebsite
Why do you believe bible is true?
Brother Paul call him to Islam for he is a honourable friend. What a respectful and honest Gentleman. What an academic teacher and professor! We need more in depth videos with him. We benefitted a lot from this video. Many thanks from Mr professor and you dear Paul
I did not know this was coming. You just blessed my UA-cam with this video. BaarakAllahu feek my brother ❤
Muhammad copied books of Bible and made Quran.
He married many to help them.
He killed many as they were bad.
So he added polygamy and jihad and made Quran.
You will get many women on earth and in heaven.
Beware in the last days many logical men will make many to fall.
Pray nonstop till you know God
Jesus is the only way ,truth and life.
Muslims believe in One God but there god is false god the true God is Jesus Christ the Word was God manifest in flesh 1 Timothy 3 16 1 John 5 20. Jesus said if I seen me you seen the father
@@davidortega357 first commandment, God said don't bring other gods against my face. Jesus was servant of God Matthew 12:18. God made you blind. Your god of gods or begotten son of gods was a human used to eat and went to toilet 3 times or more.
You god of gods died and went to hell 1Peter3 : 18- 20. God doesn't die and get get kiked. Your gods are died.
@@davidortega357 why are you so sure!!!
@@IsmailIsmail-mi9nsyour religion is bogus bruv
There is none good but God ❤ Jesus himself admonishing those who dared to call him good . No pastor was ever able to explain this to me likewise “son of man “ Ezekiel was referred to as son of man also . We need to remember that to have your beliefs questioned is very painful for people as it is paradigm shifting for many . It’s their whole identity and way of living , we are human . So important to be kind to genuine Christian’s when dealing with them on these matters ❤
True. Well said 👏
Indeed. Well said.
Often it depends on whether the Christian decides to bring their faith into the conversation. I wouldn't be able to just sit there & listen to subjects I find preposterous & say nothing. Why should I?
@@TheWatchmanWebsite where you copy and paste your essay/sermon from ? Ezekiel was also called son of man and Jesus calling himself the good shepherd still doesn’t refute the fact he says there is no one good but God . Isn’t God not the author of confusion?? Seems confusing when you have to write essays to try explain what the Bible is clear on
@@TheWatchmanWebsite Like anyone is gonna read that, smh.
Another thought-provoking episode distributed by the channel of all channels-Blogging Theology :
Asr is due in 5 minutes down here in India-occupied Kashmir. I and my friend tuned in together. Thanks, Paul!
How's things there Akhi.I suppose it's better then in Gaza strip etc
I am a Christian who believes in the gifts of the Spirit and healing and Jesus as the incarnate word and all that. And I love to listen to James Tabor. Every time I listen, feel my faith grow deeper and I have no idea why. Thank you for your work, Professor Tabor.
Your so full of shit...coz your burning up inside
Fascinating discussion and very happy to see a part 1 in the title. Thank you for bringing critical biblical scholarship to the English speaking Muslim audience.
I was GLUED to this. Jazak'Allahu khair brother Paul and thank you Dr. Tabor, what a wonderful presentation
@@noahwamalwa4385 what's Mark's last name or his evidence? Open your eyes, the majority of those events would have been witnessed by Romans and Jews and yet none report these things
You couldn't get anymore ironic. Your religion is false.
Done watched it in full and didnt blink an eye. Fascinating. Also loved the friendship between these gentlements.
You are a treasure for the ummah and especially for bemused youngsters like my self who are seeking the ultimate purpose , l just feel so humbled watching your videos as an Arab syrian and a born muslim but far less knowledgeable , may allah bless you and benefit the ummah from your knowledge , l must say we really lack such content on the contemprary arabic front
These videos are amazing to listen to like a podcast/audio only while on commutes or morning walks, very insightful and well structured; brilliant subject matter which should be of importance to most people today.
Thank you very much for offering this content.
I always gain some knowledge from these videos. Mashallah. Amazing job Paul. Jazak Allahu Khairan.
This is going to be a succulent listen, jazakAllahu Khairan for hosting dr Tabor Paul
Superb topic! Thank you for your work Paul and the rest of the Blogging theology team
Salaam Alaikum brother Paul , such a pleasure to hear you very appropriate questions . The speaker is wonderful . May God bless you both with long & healthy life .
Wa alaykumu s-salam
@@BloggingTheology
Can you prove al lah is a living ged.
Simple questions,
- Does al la have a soul?
- Is the soul part of al lah?
@@renatolopez6337 it's the answer for your questions...
Qul Huwallahu Ahad Surah In English
Say: He, Allah, is One.
Allah, Who is sought by all.
He begets not nor was He begotten
And there is none comparable to Him.
So if you want to know more about Allah Read QUR'AN.its will answer to all your questions.(In shall Allah) "God willing"
@@renatolopez6337 my br in Humanity :
Just like no one saw the creation of this world , no one also saw its own creation eg who my father is , and neither did you .
One accepts that mothers says so and that in most cases he is in house obtaining bread for family and proving a roof over the family .
I know God is One and he is the CREATOR OF HEAVEN AND OTHER AND ALL IN BETWEEN . I am here in this world because of the living and forgiving and Mighty and Merciful God .
As the above note says just read Quran . You may have tried everything else try Quran . You will feel His presence .
I wish you peace happiness .
@@renatolopez6337 God is not a Man that he should have soul. Have some sense, you people with no brain really make me frustrated. Don't blaspheme against God of Abraham ever.
Thanks, Paul! This really opens my mind to so many new things and perspectives.
Many thanks!
@@noahwamalwa4385
How many Son does God have in the Bible?
Read your Bible thoroughly.
According to the Bible, Genesis 6:2
"THE SONS OF GOD saw that the daughters of humans were beautiful, and they married any of them they chose."
Excellent outstanding talk Thank you Paul for this, can't wait for part 2.
My favourite biblical scholar and my favourite channel😃
May Almighty bless Brother Paul with a healthy and long life ahead...
What an amazing topic you’ve chosen to create this content Mr. Paul ! Digging up the truth from the lies isn’t an easy task but certainly you’ve done it well combining your expertise with another expert personnel’s 👏 took three days for me to finish this video due to lack of time but I enjoyed every bit of this content. You made more interesting contents, might take time for me but insha Allah I’ll watch them all. keep up these good works always! Many thanks , respect and good wishes 😊
Thank you Paul your doing a great service to all
Honestly my fav channel on UA-cam.
from indonesia. thank's for the lectures, god bless you all.
very enlightining dialogue .. thanks for both speakers
Growing up in America as a Southern Baptist in the Bible Belt where most everyone in my family, work, or friend group was some sort of Christian: I find that most Christians interpret the Bible in the way that Paul’s old pastor did. They see it as one item, the word of God, and not a collection of individual writings and interpretations.
Trinity was created by 9th century Romans illogical
@@DomainofKnowlegdia I am a Muslim Alhamdulilah ☺️
@@funkycacahuete2933ude, when you engage a bit more with the Historical Critical Method being applied to Islam, that thing of "being a Muslim" will likely also change step by step. Islam is even more made up then Christianity, the Arabs copied so many stories from heretical Christian sources, it is mind boggling. Everything that Islam says about Jesus is from HERETICAL MADE UP Christian sources. Most other things are randomly copied from Jewish scripture, without actually understanding it. Read for yourself and find out.
As historical critical scholars of Islamic texts do not survive long in Muslim countries, most of the academic work takes place in France and Germany for the last 30 years. Good luck with the reading.
What a difference between our Paul and their one
Allhamdulillah for his gift and blessing of Paul Williams
Subhan Allah! I've also thought the same. What a huge contrast between the two Pauls !!! Whereas theirs is cunning, lying, advantageous and altering the truth of Jesus' doctrine to suit the Roman emperors' opinion, ours is honest, humble, accepting the truth, and challenging the hardships caused by his decision to seek the only true God. Really, God chooses the best moral people to convert to His religion, Islam. Thank God for the bliss of Islam 💐
Your religion is false
@@user-zy9qu9uh3byour religion is false
Dr. Tabor's book on THE JESUS DYNASTY is a brilliant and thought-provoking scholarship.
Great intellectual discussion , very valuable
LOVE FOR OUR CHRISTIAN BROTHERS AND SISTERS.
Ameen💜We must always be kind and fair to each, Alhumdullilah -even if some gangs did destruction to us.
Another video! Nice consistency, BT! 👏
Wat I cannot understand how a genuinely knowledgable scholar with probably early manuscripts n says the disciples did not see Jesus as God n yet he has not been convinced that the Bible is full of contradictions n interpolation n relying on the new testament! Our brother Paul is a living example of being honest n sincere in accepting the true religion prescribed for mankind! Just shows our Creator is Sovereign n Mighty in even allowing enlightenment to whom He pleases!
Unbelievable isn't it
The answer is no they did not believe he was God. The evidence is they were all God fearing Jews and all worshiped God alongside Jesus.
Excellent as usual with Dr. Tabor's deep knowledge and scholarship! 👍🏼😊
such an interesting discussion, DR Tabor what an interesting human, and thank you paul for your insights and good humor
Awesome show as always. Love you Paul.
Glad you enjoyed it!
Awesome Content Massallah💯❤️
Wow Paul very very Interesting and Enlightening Conversation, Than you Sir you just helped me take a huge Leap towards Islam, worshipping a fellow human being Born of a young girl, Circumcised when he was 8 days old as god or part of a Trinity of god'S was always REPULSIVE to me.
Allah will guide you. Jesus God and our God.
Several things emerge from the opening of this discussion:
*1)* In James Tabor's opinion, there was no "virgin birth of Jesus" and thus the Quran has a significant error in it by claiming that Jesus was born to a virgin mother, if James Tabor is to be relied upon.
*2)* According to Tabor: "He is the son of God in Mark, but we got to talk about what that means". Tabor says Mark says: "You are my beloved son, its a revelation to Jesus".
*3)* According to Tabor, Isaiah 42 is a passage which speaks of Jesus prophetically and therefore not of Mohammed as some people have falsely claimed. Tabor says that Isaiah 42 speaks of the Servant of YHWH (ie not Allah).
*4)* Tabor says that the term 'son of God' speaks of a beloved relationship and according to Tabor: "all humans in the Bible are children of God" - thus Judas was a 'son of God' even though he committed great evil, and Adam who is equally the son of God to Jesus according to Tabor, was thrown out of the Garden of Eden for disobedience! Besides Tabor's strange ideas about this, we should also note that neither Mark in reference to Jesus being the son of God, nor Isaiah 42 in reference to the same, are speaking in the Plural - instead both passages speak only of a Singular individual.....not to 'all humans in the Bible' nor to Adam or Judas!
*5)* The flaw in Paul Williams comment in which he derived from the NT that anyone who is a peace maker is called 'a son of God', is that on the contrary, Jesus stated specifically that he did not come to bring peace, but a sword - meaning division between one person from their family or tribe, because of following Jesus as a disciple! ...hence 'if anyone loves father or mother more than me, he is not worthy of me', etc - thus Paul Williams's idea that if you are a peace maker you are an equivalent 'son of God' to Jesus, cannot hold.
....following on from this (20:33 in video), Paul and Tabor's claim that Jesus being a unique son of God is a 'new innovation after the gospel of Matthew and Mark', to which Tabor answers glibly 'it actually is'. However, if they stopped to consider the logic of such a claim, they would realise that they are in fact contradicting the gospel, since the very reason the gospel goes on to describe Jesus's crucifixion is precisely because of his claims to be the Son of God in Mark 15:61 cannot be ignored! Mark 15:61 ",....Again the High Priest asked him, are you the Christ, the Son of the Blessed?' and Jesus said 'I am'". Thus intrinsic to Mark's gospel, is the trial of Jesus before the High Priest, in which Jesus contrary to Paul and Tabor, defines himself as a 'unique Son of God' not simply one of many as Paul and Tabor like to claim. Its this kind contradiction in Paul's thinking that reveals that despite his wishes and keenness for Tabor to support his beliefs, these ideas do not in fact support them!
Actually, there is a tafseer of Quran that dosent believe the virgin birth
Paul and James Taboor very knowledgeable.. 👍
In what they weren't there
Dr. James accept Islam as your religion now. You do believe and understand and will be judged accordingly as to the knowledge which has reached you.
Study Quran and Arabic, as it is the key to conversion for most of us who reverted.
May Allah reward you for your excellent clarifying presentation.
I pray he will be a muslim, amin, May God grant you light in your wrods, face, action and heart, and your loved ones and all of us amin. Jazak Allah kheir.
So you sold your soul to the Devil?
And you a woman follow a pedophile, child molester, adulterer, misogynist, murderer, schizophrenic, suicidal, Satanic false self made prophet?
Have you read Sahih al-Bukhari 304?
Do you agree with Muhammad's misogynistic opinions of women?
And that doesn't bother you,?
You agree that women have half the brain of a man?
Are you serious?
Enlightening and fulfilling discussion. Many thanks. brothers. May Allah keep blessing you both In’sha’Allah.
Your religion is false
My great brother Paul, my monotheistic companion. I love you for Allah❤❤❤,Allah bless you, I have watched your most recent guests being interviewed on other channels, by non-Muslims, and was actually asking Allah for you to bring them on your channel because no one interviews as well as you do, my brother,
Oh Allah reward this man named Paul Willaim with good in this life and after his journey on this earth, and, those educated christians or non muslims that he dialogued on this blog, seeing their honest and clear cut sincerity that they die on tawhid and not outside it. Aameen.
Ramadhan Mabrook stil. InshaAllah Eidl Fitri Mabrook. JzK, Paul. Continue in what you do in the path of dawah fi sebiIllah. Spread the Message of Prophet Muhammad SA, because the world needs to hear it and each of us is a messenger of this Noble Messenger SA with the final Message.
Amin ya Rabb
Wonderful, excellent and intellectually engaging.
Amazing of you Paul sir . ❤️❤️❤️❤️.salam .
Very appropriate timing with Palm Sunday and Easter I will comment further when I've finished the presentation, in shaa Allah
. One important point is that the Quran repeatedly mentions Abraham Isaac and Jacob in a row.
Also the Quran repeatedly describes the Torah, the Injeel and Quran as a guidance and a light.
The word family is used in Arabic at times to mean blood relation and moreover to mean those who are connected with a deep belief and action.
In Arabic there are two words for son
walad and ibn.
Same for father..waalid and abb.
The root meanings are the key to understanding any written text.
Hearin, Arabic is the only definitive
extant.
From an Islamic perspective, the "Torah" and "Injeel" that we have today are NOT the original Torah given to Moses and original Gospel given to Jesus. The originals do not exist anymore. There are remnants of truth from the original Torah/Gospel in today's Bible. The things in Bible that agree with Quran/Hadith, we say that those parts are true. Things that contradict Quran/hadith, we say that those are false. Things where Quran/Hadith are silent on, we remain agnostic about them.
@@AdrianMuslim Can we follow the Sunnah of Isa (AS) and Musa (AS) then. As a revert, I am often confused that while the Quran commands us to follow their message (as long as the Quran does not contradict them), the actual practice is that the ummah discards them all and only follows Mohammed (SAW). Further with discouragement to read the Bible (which I believe is the OT contains the Torah too).
I came from Christianity and love the teachings of Isa(AS), I only disagreed with Paulism, Catholic Church's innovations of ' Sainthood', fathership and the divinity of Mary. Should I discard Isa(AS) altogether
@@amayoka Salam brother. Congratulations for finding Islam. Happy for you brother. May Allah bless and reward you immensely. ✨💗✨
As for your question...
Previous scriptures have been corrupted so there's no original teachings of Moses and Jesus _(peace be upon them)_ now other than what's mentioned about them in Quran.
So as Muslims, we can learn from their stories, teachings, character, etc. mentioned in Quran.
As for *emulating* a person, that is to follow prophet Muhammad _(peace be upon him)._ Because each prophet before him was sent for specific people for specific time. While prophet Muhammad (pbuh) was sent for the whole world from the day be became a prophet until the day of judgment. So we're living at the time of the last prophet and he was sent for US.
When Jesus (pbuh) returns by the will of Allah, he will follow and establish the guidance of Quran and Sunnah (teachings of prophet Muhammad pbuh). He will live for 40 years, then die and be buried next to the grave of prophet Muhammad (pbuh).
Hope that helps. If you have questions, feel free to ask dear brother.
@@AdrianMuslim thank you
@@AdrianMuslim Abdool: No Gospels were given to Jesus
The Gospels were written by the disciples and eyewitnesses 40-60 years after Jesus' Reserrection.
So why believe in such nonsense that they were given to Christ.
And the Quran and your false self made prophet confirm the Gospels and the Torah not anything rewritten.
Read the Gospels for the Truth about Jesus Christ.
the Messiah has said, "O Children of Israel, worship Allah, my rabb (lord) and your rabb."
(Al-Quran 5: 72)
Indeed, your rabb (Lord) is Allah, who created the heavens and earth ...
(Al-Quran translation 7: 54)
God is only one.
God is not one group of three.
God sent messengers.
God is not a messenger.
Jesus was a messenger from a long line of messengers that includes Noah, Abraham and Moses.
Messengers are chosen from men to convey message to men.
And We have already SENT Noah and Abraham and placed in their descendants prophethood and scripture; and among them is he who is guided, but many of them are defiantly disobedient.
Then We SENT following their footsteps Our messengers and followed [them] with Jesus, the son of Mary, and gave him the Injil (Gospel).
(Al-Quran 57: 26-27)
Then We SENT after them Moses with Our signs to Pharaoh and his establishment, but they were unjust toward them. So see how was the end of the corrupters.
And Moses said, O Pharaoh, I am a messenger from the Lord of the worlds
Obligated not to say about Allah except the truth. I have come to you with clear evidence from your Lord, so send with me the Children of Israel.
(Al-Quran 7: 103-105)
And We did certainly give Moses the Torah and followed up after him with messengers.
(Al-Quran 2: 87)
The Messiah, son of Mary, was not but a messenger; [other] messengers have passed on before him. And his mother was a supporter of truth.
(Al-Quran 5: 75)
Their messengers said to them, "We are only men like you, but Allah confers favor upon whom He wills of His servants. It has never been for us to bring you evidence except by permission of Allah . And upon Allah let the believers rely.
(Al-Quran 14: 11)
God sent Jesus.
God is not Jesus.
Allah chooses from the angels, messengers and from men.
Surely, Allah is All-Hearing, All-Seeing.
(Al-Quran 22: 75)
There are angel messengers
He sends down the angels, with the inspiration of His command, upon whom He wills of His servants, "Warn that there is no ilah (deity/god) except Me; so fear Me."
(Al-Quran 16: 2)
Angel Gabriel is referred to as The Spirit.
And mention, in AlKitab (the Book), Mary, when she withdrew from her family to a place toward the east.
And she took, in seclusion from them, a screen. Then We sent to her Our Spirit (Angel Gabriel), and he represented himself to her as a well-proportioned man.
She said, "Indeed, I seek refuge in the Most Merciful from you, [so leave me], if you should be fearing of Allah ."
He said, "I am only the messenger of your Lord to give you [news of] a pure boy."
She said, "How can I have a boy while no man has touched me and I have not been unchaste?"
He said, "Thus [it will be]; your Lord says, 'It is easy for Me, and We will make him a sign to the people and a mercy from Us. And it is a matter [already] decreed.'
(Al-Quran Translation/interpretation Chapter Mary/Maryam(19) : 16-21)
Gabriel identified himself to Mary as "the messenger of your Lord".
The story of Gabriel appearing before Mary(Maryam) to inform her about her future son (Jesus/Isa) is also mentioned in the gospels.
*Angels informing the coming of a newborn child is consistent with angels visiting Abraham and his wife informing them about their future son, Isaac and Jacob and an angel informing Zachariah about his future son, John (Yahya), both incidents mentioned in the current gospels and in the Quran.
Angel Gabriel (Jibril) is mentioned by name as the one who brought down the Quran to Prophet Muhammad:
Say, "Whoever is an enemy to Jibril (Gabriel) - it is he who has brought it (the Qur'an) down upon your heart, [O Muhammad], by permission of Allah, confirming that which was before it and as guidance and good tidings for the believers."
Whoever is an enemy to Allah and His angels and His messengers and Jibril and Mikal (Michael) - then indeed, Allah is an enemy to the disbelievers.
(Al-Quran translation 2: 97-98)
The one who brought it down is also referred to as below:
And indeed, it (the Qur'an) is the revelation of the Lord of the worlds.
Has brought it down by Arruhul-amin (The Trustworthy Spirit)
(Al-Quran translation 26: 192- 193)
Say, [O Muhammad], "ruhulQudus (spirit of the Holy) has brought it down from your rabb (Lord) in truth to make firm those who believe and as guidance and good tidings to the Muslims."
(Al-Quran translations 16: 102)
Ruh Al-Quddus is mentioned in the arabic Quran.
Ruh meaning spirit,
Al-Quddus is one of the names of God, meaning The Holy/ All-Holy/ All-Pure.
Angels have wings.
[All] praise is [due] to Allah, Creator of the heavens and the earth, [who] made the angels messengers having wings, two or three or four. He increases in creation what He wills. Indeed, Allah is over all things competent.
(Al-Quran 35: 1)
Who did Jesus actually see descending that is mentioned in the gospels.
[Gabriel said], "And we [angels] descend not except by the order of your Lord. To Him belongs that before us and that behind us and what is in between. And never is your Lord forgetful -
(Al-Quran 19: 64)
God sent angels.
God is not an angel.
It is not for a human [prophet] that Allah should give him the Scripture and authority and prophethood and then he would say to the people, "Be servants to me rather than Allah," rather, "be rabbaniyyun, because you are teaching the Book, and you are studying it."
Nor could he order you to take the angels and prophets as arbaban (lords). Would he order you to disbelief after you had been Muslims?
(Al-Quran 3: 79-80)
There are angel messengers
There are human messengers.
God is not an angel.
God is not a human.
God is only one.
God have no son.
God is not one third of three.
God is not a messenger.
God sent messengers.
Indeed, Allah is but one ilah (deity/god). Exalted is He above having a son. To Him belongs whatever is in the heavens and whatever is on the earth. And sufficient is Allah as Disposer of affairs.
(Al-Quran 4: 171)
فِي الْبَدْءِ خَلَقَ اللهُ (Allah) السَّمَاوَاتِ وَالأَرْضَ
According to arabic translations of the bible that you can find online, Allah (الله ) is the Creator of the heavens and the earth in Genesis 1: 1
Indeed, your rabb (Lord) is Allah, who created the heavens and earth ...
(Al-Quran translation 7: 54)
Alaha refers to God in aramaic.
Aramaic is a semitic language believed to be spoken by Jesus.
Semitic languages include hebrew and arabic and have similarities.
ABDOOL: Jesus never called God his heavenly Father Allah.
Jesus praying to his Heavenly Father, " And now Abba, Father glorify me in your presence with the glory I had with you before the world was created".
John 17:5
What else did Jesus say besides worship the One true God?
" The Father judges no one but has entrusted all judgement to the Son so that all will honor the Son in the same way as they honor the Father.
He that honereth not the Son honoreth not the Father who sent him".
John 5:22-23
" Again the Jews picked up stones to throw at him.
Jesus asked them for what good work do you stone me?"
They answered, " We stone you not for any good work but for blasphemy because you a mere man make yourself God".
Jesus replied, " Why do you accuse me of blasphemy because I said that I am God's Son?
" Do not believe me unless I do the works of my Father. But if I do them then believe them even though you do not believe me, believe the works that you may know and that the Father is in me and I am in the Father".
John 10:31-36
Jesus said, " The Father judges no one but has entrusted all judgement to the Son so that all will honor the Son in the same way as they honor the Father.
He that honereth not the Son honoreth not the Father who sent him".
John 5:22-23
Thus is why we Christians worship Jesus just as we worship God his heavenly Father.
Jesus Never referred to himself as just a mere prophet.
Jesus was called by many names, Rabbi, Messiah, prophet, Blasphemer, Demon possessed, Good Master, Teacher, King of the Jews, Son of David, Son of God and God.
Jesus and his disciples were in the region of Caesaria Philipi when He asked them, " Who do the people say the Son of Man is?"
They answered, " Some say you are John the Baptist others say that you are the prophet Elijah and others say you are the prophet Jeremiah and others say you are some other prophet.
Jesus asked Peter " Who do you say I am?"
Peter answered, "You are the Messiah the Son of the living God ".
Jesus replied, " Blessed are you Simon bar Jonah ( Son of Jonah) for flesh and blood have not revealed this to you but my Father in heaven ".
Matthew 16:13-20
Jesus didn't shout from atop hills and in the center of market places that He was the Son of God but let people come to their own conclusions by his parables allegories and simply proclaiming himself equal to God his heavenly Father.
Why didn't Jesus shout out loud who He was?
What would be the reaction?
People would walk away from him saying that He was a madman and they would stone him as they tried to.
" I and my Father are One '
John 10:30
" If you see me you see the Father.
For the Father is in me and I am in the Father ".
John 14:9
Thank you both for this fascinating video, you sir and your respectful guest ❤
Glad you enjoyed it
@@BloggingTheology Paul, you and Dr. Tabor are preaching Herecy and you are condemned by Jesus for denying that He is the Son of God.
" Whoever believes in me and is baptized shall be saved.
Whoever does not shall be condemned".
Mark 16:16
When one looks at the instances where the Gospel writers only made very minute and subtle changes to improve upon the texts of Mark for instance, so that an elevated christology could be infered by the later generations, is a work of an utter genius. It deserves a grudging respect.
All those modern men who think that the ancient guys were stupid, read the Gospels and eat your heart out!
Mark is said to have an unsophisticated literary style
Quote
Mark's style of Greek is unique among the Gospels. Some scholars have argued that Mark's style is unsophisticated and unrefined or awkward. But others find Mark's Greek very dense and detailed. Mark is full of Latinisms, in idioms and vocabulary. Mark tends to conjoin verbs and sentences with καὶ (kai, "and"); in fact, more than half the verses in Mark begin with καὶ. Mark is also notably fond of εὐθὺς (euthùs, "immediately") and πάλιν (pálin, "again"), frequently uses dual expressions, and often prefers the historical present.[29] In essence, then, Mark's style is not so much literary as thoroughly colloquial.[30][31]
The parallel passages in Matthew and especially in Luke tend to be in a more polished and eloquent style of literary Greek. Where Mark uses an unusual word or expression, Matthew and Luke often substitute something more natural. Though they often add material of substance, they tend to trim down Mark's redundancies and verbosity and express his meaning more concisely.
Dr. James tabor love you ❤
Dr. Tabor is a grounded thinker.
Assalaam Alaykum and Ramadan Mubarak brother Paul. May Allah SWT bless you and Dr. James Tabor for such a splendid session. It begs the question, why did the author (s) of Mark's gospel leave it like that knowing about what Matthew, Luke and Paul had differences with it?
Islam is false. You know it deep in your heart
*_May Allah guide Dr Tabor to Islam._*
It's more about the history of religion & of the ancient texts than faith & spiritual endeavour. Dr Tabor specialises in Ancient Judaism & Early Christianity.
Great discussion, thanks.
My goodness I loooooooooove this channel !
Did he mention Ali Ataie’s view of the Son of Man? He mentioned it on another interview here on UA-cam, perhaps at mythvision.
Hello, Paul. I would like to hear your thoughts on the Gospel of Barnabas. This fascinating apocryphal gospel challenges mainstream Christian doctrine with its denial of Jesus' divinity and prophesize the coming of Muhammad as a prophet. Despite being written in the early Christian era, it was suppressed by the Church and is relatively unknown to modern-day Christians. Do you believe there is any validity to the Gospel of Barnabas, and if so, what implications could it have for our understanding of the early Christian movement?
It's forge
you have your information wrong. the gospel of barnabas is dated to the 13th - 15th centuries by historians. and in it, it calls muhammed the messiah not Jesus. it's a forgery and joke of a "gospel." stop lying.
@@moonlightravel calm tf down, i asked a question. There is debate about the origin of the Gospel of Barnabas, hence why i asked. If you can't provide an adequate answer, keep it to yourself
@@herraren9323 you literally said it was written in the “early Christian era” you didn’t say it could. it’s a forgery. plain and simple. Christian theologians know about it, it’s not unknown.
Excellent conversation
Those who believed in Christ at his time believed in him as a man and a prophet only
(1) And this is blind, Christ opened his eyes, and the people asked him about Christ, and he said that he is a prophet
(They also said to the blind man: What do you say about him as he opened your eyes?” He said: He is a prophet. - Gospel of John 9:17.
(2) And when the people heard the words of Jesus, they said, This is a prophet: (Many of the crowd, when they heard these words, said: This is indeed the prophet, and this John the Apostle is narrating from the people that they knew him that he was a prophet). - The Gospel of John 7:40
(3) (When the people saw the sign that Jesus did, they said: This is indeed the prophet to come.) - The Gospel of John 6:14
(4) And this is a Samaritan woman who knew him as a prophet. The woman said to him: “Sir, I see that you are a prophet.” - Gospel of John 4:19.
(5) This is another text in which one of the disciples says that Jesus is a prophet (Jesus, who was a man, a prophet mighty before God). - The Gospel of Luke 24:19
(6) And here is one of the disciples, Luke, who says about Christ as a prophet (Glorify God, saying: A great prophet has risen in us). - Luke 7:16
(7) And this is a text in which the revelation says Gabriel to Jesus, bringing good tidings to him that he is a prophet (and you, boy, are the prophet of the Most High, you will be called). - Gospel of Luke 1:76.
(8) And this is a second text in which people know that he is a prophet (the crowds said: This is Jesus the prophet who is from Nazareth of Galilee). - Gospel of Matthew 21:11.
There is also "Son of God".
1:05:28 Paul I always say that, but really if the Church teaching is correct Jesus would have said "The most important commandment is Hear o Israel (Mankind since he supposedly was universal)
Hear O Mankind , Believe in My death and resurrection and you will be saved" after all that what make a person a Christian, that what the Church MAIN teaching!!
The fact that he said "The lord our (not your) God is One Lord" that alone, without mental gymnastic, without needing a scholarship in textual criticism, that verse alone will condemn many people on that Day.
Great point
thank you Juce, may Allah accept your ramadan and give you jannah and all of us amin.
13:40, 17:50, 27:17
1:05:02, 1:06:27
1:09:40,
Nice funny man. Loved the conversation Paul.
Dear Paul, I can't but help but think this to be your most important video in your magnificent collection. I say this because using the rudiments and depths of the historical method for unearthing who Jesus was, in light of the evidences scrutinized - you and Prof Tabor lay down a robust sheet of evidence that points towards Jesus being a man. A very blessed Prophet, a Judaic 'son of God', an anointed preacher with the moral, rhetorical and spiritual gravitas almost unrivalled in history - but quite clearly not divine. Over-laying on this sheet, Quranic proofs and commentary on Christology (primarily the aswaar of Maryam {Mary} and Maidah {The Table Spread}), IMHO, would provide a solid shield against claims of divinity for Jesus - surely it would become (already is) as clear as day? These following verses for me are not Christological but facilitate a rendering of the Prophetic role, for both Muhammad and Jesus (peace be upon them both):
Quran 25:20 - 'We never sent any messenger before you ˹O Prophet˺, who did not eat food and go about in market-places' (..)
Quran 25:43 - 'Have you seen ˹O Prophet˺ the one who has taken their own desires as their god? Will you then be a keeper over them?'
Quran 3:144 - 'Muḥammad is not but a messenger. [Other] messengers have passed on before him (..)'
Paul, what about the point where he stated that the virgin birth was also added. I mean the Quran also confirms that so is there a contrast?
@@Jeri-Walk James is a historian so not defending any theology.
@@Jeri-Walk the Ebionites or original followers & family of Jesus were adoptionist so didn't believe in the virgin birth either.
@@robbielee2148 So is the virgin birth true or not?
@@Jeri-Walk All I have is opinion based on historical perspective, so IDK truth only what has been handed down. It would seem the virgin birth was a later development. If you have faith, then you are greater than I. Peace be with you.
I find that too many muslims today have an unhealthy focus on the corrupted bible and Jesus. Meanwhile, we have the Qur'an with an endless depth of knowledge, containing all things in relation to the deen, the truth.
We don't need to justify anything from or using the corrupted books. We have a pristine book to focus on and learn from.
First we empty their cup of poison, then we fill it with pure water. If you have a method that works for you, then use that. This work is just as beneficial
Perhaps this topic means more to those raised in a Christian culture, and worried about the direction of it as controlled by unthinking masses. Moreover, this stuff is referenced in the Quran itself!
@Abubakar Ahmad
If the Christian books are useless then why did Allah command us to tell them to produce their proof?
It's because it's an INBUILT thing that when we'll examine their books, their Theology and doctrines will crumble.
@Abubakar Ahmed
Allah also tells us to tell them to come to common terms between us and them.
I mean if their Books carry 0 truth then why the call for commonality?
So you see Allah in His Wisdom has called us to do what Paul in the video and other Daees are doing. It's the Bible which makes such a compelling case for Islam that the den1ers have no escape route left BUT to actually evade and deny their own books.
Allah (God Almighty) says that there are those in the people of the previous scriptures who disregard their very own scriptures just to hold on to their falsehoods. God Almighty says in the Q-ur-an Chapter 2 Verse 101:
*And when a messenger from Allah came to them confirming that which was with them, a party of those who had been given the Scripture threw the Scripture of Allah behind their backs as if they did not know [what it contained]*
May be you're not in the field of Dawah from multiple angles so you made the comment unaware.
We want people of the book to come to the truth and it is necessary for them to understand what's wrong with their scripture
Many sunni-sufi tafsirs link Jesus (especially his last days) with an epiphany of the divine name Al Muntaqim '...now this seems also to make sense if we read Daniel 7...thank you for this wonderful conversation
When you try to use literature of another faith which opposes your beliefs explicitly, to confirm the divinely of Jesus according to your bible and beliefs.
Mmm I didn't understood your reply...many sahaba knew passages from the Torah so there might well be a link between Daniel 7 and the idea that Jesus alehi salam manifests the meanings of the name Al Muntaqim...but it is really nothing else than a mere hypothesis...
@@philipvalentini3112 You are trying to misinterpret islamic literature as you christians misinterpret Tanakh books, one of them Daniel 7 in these comments of yours here.
“It is much safer to be feared than loved”
-Machiavelli
9:00 That method should be the natural approach from everyone reading the text ..
Again, Jesus was not crucified, yet went through severe trials from the disbelievers in his prophetic calling.
He was taken up to return again..all this is in Quran. It appeared to them he had died and was resurrected after three days.
Who knows the truth? All the religious book were written decades if not longer after the actual events.
@@johnmichaelson9173God knows the truth and that’s why the Quran is most trusted in this
@@Iron_Ottoman That's your personal choice but to me it's just another book. The World is full of supposed Godly books & the readers all claim theirs is the real one.
@@johnmichaelson9173 the Quran was written by the end of the lifetime of the Prophet Muhammad pbuh, and it was already memorised completely before that by Abu Bakr, Umar, Aisha to name some, may Allah be pleased with them all.
@@phanatic4466 Why do we have so many different religions? Why do we not all believe the same thing? For me it's because human beings invented these religion's. The idea that a omnipotent, omnipresent God couldn't get everyone singing from the same hymn sheet just doesn't make sense.
Thanks 😊. Awesome discussion
Glad you liked it!
It would be very interesting to see a dialogue between Dr. Ataie and Dr. James Tabor..
Salam brother Paul, in trinity there are three entities, it is rare to hear how archangel Gabriel got dragged into trinity. It will be interesting to bring in a scholar on BT, for discussion, to discuss evolution of holy spirit being part of trinity. May Almighty protect. Thank you for your work.
But nobody here mentioned that "Archangel Gabriel is part of the Trinity". Nor is there any Christian who believes that. Where do you have that statement from?
Who are then part of trinity?
@@MrBleachfan321 Christians believe that the Triune God consists of
1. The Father
2. The Son (Jesus), which is the word of God who became flesh.
3. The Holy spirit (which is the Spirit of the Father).
But not the Angel Gabriel, as all Angels are created beings. These "persons" within God existed, according to Christian scripture, before all times and are all three uncreated. You can type in "explanation of the Trinity" here on UA-cam, as there is much more to it then that.
Thanks for the education.
@@MrBleachfan321 Thanks for being so open minded and humble to ask a question when you really don't know the answer. Such people, who are not blinded by their own pride and need to show of, have the right mindset to learn actually everything quite fast. Have a nice day and a good life.
“No one is good but God alone…”
Interestingly enough, this biblical quote is actually Jesus testing the young man. In other words, Jesus is leading him…
He’s saying “if you’re prepared to call me good….well than…guess what that means…*wink *wink *nudge *nudge.
This text is actually pro-deity of Christ. Jesus is waiting for the young man to confess the true implications of what he’s recognizing.
And Jesus said IAM the good shepherd.
Who is the good shepherd?
Ezequiel 34:11-16
None other than God himself.
Idolatry
Informative, great work!
Nice presentation! You know Br. Paul your suggestion regarding the classic image of the Virgin gave me the idea that French Muslim women might try wearing that very style to make a point
Bro you don't need a 1 hr 30 min video for this. The 12 disciples were handpicked by Jesus. All 12 of them acknowledge him as the son of God. The entire new testament shows you all the proof that you need.
Paul my dear brother, I don't even need to watch your long ass video to already know your answer to the question. At this point, you're just trying to avoid the undeniable truth, and that is, that Jesus christ is the son of the living God.
Funny that you still call yourself 'Paul'. Paul is such an important figure in the new testament. God had to strike him blind on the road to damascus for him to see the truth. And just like Paul in the new testament, I hope that one day, you'll come to see the truth too.
Is modern-day Christianity really what Jesus preached? Did you know that the biblical accounts of the 12 disciples might not be as straightforward as you were taught? While the Gospels of Matthew, Mark, and Luke do describe Jesus selecting 12 followers, there is some ambiguity surrounding whether or not they all believed in his divinity. In fact, the Gospels themselves show that the disciples had doubts and varied in their beliefs.
For example,In John's Gospel, there are several instances where the disciples express doubt or confusion about Jesus' teachings. In John 6:60-69, many of Jesus' disciples say that his teachings are "hard" and "difficult," and some of them even stop following him. What's more, early Christian groups like the Ebionites believed that Jesus was a prophet but not divine. They regarded him as the Messiah, but not the Son of God in the way that later Christians would come to understand the term. They also emphasized circumcision, dietary restrictions etc (interestingly VERY similar to what Muslims believe and do). Moreover, the Gospel of Barnabas, a text that has been largely ignored by mainstream Christianity, presents an intriguig perspective. It portrays Jesus as a prophet, not the son of God, and even predicts the coming of the prophet Muhammad. While it is not considered part of the New Testament canon, it was widely read and respected by early Christians, including St. Augustine (In his book "De Doctrina Christiana"). Docetists , like muslims, believed that Jesus' didn't die on the cross and that it was an illusion. Arians, also, held the view that Jesus was a prophet, not a divine being or the son of God. (This was WAY before the birth of Muhammad btw)
Now whether you agree with them or not, this suggests that there were multiple interpretations of Jesus' teachings in the early Christian community, and that modern Christianity is just one of many possible expressions of Christianity. This challenges modern-day Christianity and raises the question: are we really following the true teachings of Jesus? Therefore, we must objectively examine the historical evidence and consider the possibility that modern Christianity MIGHT NOT be what Jesus actually preached.
>"It (The Q Source) doesn't have the cross, doesn't have the death of Jesus, doesn't have anything about the blood of Jesus saving people from sin. How could you have a collection of the *earliest* sayings of Jesus that don't include some of those Christian fundamentals that people think are just bedrock faith?"
1. How can you say what the Q source, or any source, DOESN'T have if you don't have it? It is logically impossible. When you only have quotes from Q you can only say what it DOES include not what it doesn't. The full size and content of Q can only be known by consulting the document itself. We have Q being used by both Matthew and Luke. From these quotes we can only say what Q included not what it excluded.
2. We define Q as the common material found in Matthew and Luke that is not from Mark. However, this assumes a lot. What if Matthew quotes Q and Luke does not? In this case, it is Q material quoted that is not counted as Q but as the M source. Again, from the common material of Matthew and Luke we cannot make any conclusions about the size and scope of Q. We can know what was in it but not what was not in it.
3. It is simply false to say that Q is the *earliest*. From source criticism, Mark is earlier.
This is poor scholarship.
I see the Bible is to a greater extent clear from any ambiguity when we read the prophecies of the different prophets and the prophesies of the Jesus (pbuh) that Jesus was one of the prophets sent by God of all the prophets but somehow he has been elevated to the level of trinity by the motivated elements in the past. That’s the reason this religion is hanging on till today with mounting criticisms.
You just love anything that aligns with your beliefs but Islam is completely false and made up. It's ridiculous
@@jamiesimms7084 your problem is the “holy spirit”. Ridiculous? But it is pervading and penetrating into the far east and South American countries! How? There is something wrong with you or the people of the countries. Let the world judge.
The mother of all channels.
If the Disciples believed Jesus (pbuh) was God, why did they run away when the Jews as a crowd with Roman soldiers led by Judas came to arrest him? Did Judas believe that Jesus (pbuh) was God? Was he aware that he was going to help arrest God? All points to the fact that they understood Jesus to be just a man, and under the circumstances it made sense to them to run for their lives. Jesus (pbuh) was so helpless he couldn't protect himself, let alone protect them.
I can't help but think has Dr Tabor considered Islam with an open mind but in a serious way - maybe a dialogue with Dr Ataie would assist him coming to an informed and honest conclusion
The followers of Issa(as) clearly knew who he was (the teacher from God)
The answer is no. They believed he was God’s chosen anointed king to rule over the nations in the kingdom to come, not God himself.
watching
Below is an AI powered summary of this video. Please note that it is not a substitution for the video, and is provided by the transcription, so it is likely an incomplete perspective (or even in error).
To the AI: What are some of the key points that Dr. Tabor makes about the beliefs of Jesus' first followers?
From the AI:
Dr. Tabor discusses the question of whether or not Jesus' first followers believed he was divine or God. He examines the Gospel of Mark and the writings of the Apostle Paul, as well as an alleged entity called Q, to explore what our earliest historical sources say about this topic. Dr. Tabor does not provide a definitive answer on whether or not Jesus' first followers believed he was divine or God. However, he suggests that there is evidence to support both sides of the argument. He examines the Gospel of Mark and the writings of the Apostle Paul, as well as an alleged entity called Q, to explore what our earliest historical sources say about this topic.
Dr. Tabor notes that the Gospel of Mark portrays Jesus as a human being who is later exalted to divine status, while Paul's letters suggest that Jesus was a pre-existent divine being who became human. He also discusses the idea of "Wisdom Christology," which suggests that Jesus was seen as a divine figure in the mold of Lady Wisdom from Jewish wisdom literature. Ultimately, Dr. Tabor argues that the question of whether or not Jesus' first followers believed he was God is complex and multifaceted, and requires careful examination of historical sources and scholarly debates.
During the conversation, Dr. Tabor also discusses the idea that Jesus' first followers may have believed in a "two powers" theology, which held that there were two divine figures in heaven: God the Father and a second figure who was also divine. This idea is based on some passages from Jewish texts and early Christian writings that suggest a belief in two divine figures. Dr. Tabor suggests that this theology may have influenced the beliefs of Jesus' first followers and contributed to their understanding of Jesus as a divine figure.
Dr. Tabor's presentation is nuanced and complex, and he acknowledges that there is much debate among scholars about the beliefs of Jesus' first followers. However, he provides a thoughtful analysis of the historical sources and offers some intriguing insights into this fascinating topic.
Dr. Tabor also discusses the idea that the Gospel of John presents Jesus as a divine figure from the very beginning, rather than portraying him as a human being who is later exalted to divine status. This view is sometimes referred to as "high Christology," and it is in contrast to the "low Christology" of Mark's Gospel. Dr. Tabor suggests that this difference in emphasis may reflect different theological perspectives among early Christian communities.
Throughout his presentation, Dr. Tabor emphasizes the importance of examining historical sources and engaging in scholarly debate when trying to understand the beliefs of Jesus' first followers. He acknowledges that there are many different perspectives on this topic, and encourages his audience to approach it with an open mind and a willingness to engage with diverse viewpoints.
Dr. Tabor also discusses the idea that the beliefs of Jesus' first followers may have evolved over time, as they grappled with the meaning of his life and teachings. He notes that the earliest Christian communities were diverse and complex, and that there was likely a great deal of debate and disagreement about the nature of Jesus' divinity.
Despite these differences, Dr. Tabor suggests that there are some common threads that run through the beliefs of Jesus' first followers. For example, he notes that many early Christians believed in the resurrection of Jesus, and saw this event as evidence of his divine status. He also suggests that many early Christians saw Jesus as a figure who could mediate between humanity and God, and who could offer salvation to those who followed him.
Overall, Dr. Tabor's presentation offers a fascinating glimpse into the complex world of early Christianity, and provides some valuable insights into the beliefs of Jesus' first followers.
Wow. I understood this much better than that a-way-too-long video.
this is why i read books from this kinds of people because bible alone and priest or pastors cant answer my questions im glad i embraced islam
I really enjoyed it.Barakallahu fik paul
They didn't just think he was God, they knew he was God. He told them he was God Almighty. Jesus is God:'s Name.
42:03
if you read some of these NT passages , this one for example, from Islamic narrative (you don't have to be a muslim, just an exercise) you would find it align with Jesus SECOND COMING (he will come , fight Anti Christ, rule the world, there will peace etc ) if only it is read as future event before day of Judgement, essentially. So I believe some of what Jesus says actually either allude to sign of Day of Judgement, sometimes allude to another figure (paraclytus ), a prophet (even in Jerome biblical commentary in the footnote it says one of the meaning is Nabi (in Hebrew and Arabic) meaning a prophet) hence Muhammad. The NT writers demonstrated that they play with many contexts, church too, "my father is greater than I " was easily, and weirdly, explained as "no no, it means he is co equal with God but he is humbling himself"
When Jesus return, many Christians would not recognize him as a prophet, if he insists that he is Human they would say "come one man, you are humble" if he keep at it, they may think he is anti Christ, or a liar.. The most powerful verse in the bible is when Jesus was asked what is the most important commandment (out of the 613) he did not say what church main creed, (Hear o Israel believe in my death and resurrection) rather "the lord our God the Lord is one) "our not your" , one not (3 persons in the god head)
that alone is enough of a red flag that church teaching is not accurate at all. Even the lord prayer did not mention Jesus death and resurrection!! Mark ending etc etc.. but that repetition of shema as the most important commandment will condemn many people on that Day without a need for mental gymnastic and scholarship.
Jazakallah khairan.
Assalamu alaikom brother Paul and Dr. Tabor, thank you for this stunning and enlightening exposition. Could you kindly recommend specifically which edition of the Bible (I think you said you're using the NRSV but I think even this has multiple versions) we might reference? Is there a favorite of yours? Thank you. JazakomoLlah kheir
Wa alaykumu s-salam the New Revised Standard edition is the best scholarly translation.
@@BloggingTheology BarakAllahu fik brother
And Eid Mubarak:)
Love your channel so much. Thank you!
Jesus first followers never worshipped. Rather they followed the teachings of Jesus PBUH. I LOVE JESUS.
Thanks both of you
Rewriting history, faith, and rethinking beliefs through application of logic and critical thinking.
Believe it or not, The sun is still there and still shining and so thus Jesus, believe it or not, Jesus is still God. After Jesus resurection and outpouring of the Holy Spirit , Jesus disciples witness Jesus as Lord and God, they change the world even they gave up their lives to die for their faith.