For anyone considering the Grenadier....there's no substitute for time behind the wheel of it. I have owned one for several months and expected to have the same list of gripes that others have posted about. I was shocked to find that most of what others talked about were TOTALLY non issues for me. We all come with different experiences and use cases. This is an incredible vehicle that I cannot ever image parting with. If you are thinking about it, go spend a day behind the wheel. I think you'll be pleasantly surprised.
Hey Josh. Two things. The car will remember 2 separate display brightness settings. Just set the brightness with your headlights on, and then set it again with your headlights off. Also, remember that not everywhere has fuel available just around the corner. I can easily be 100km away from fuel, so an early fuel warning suits me fine. 🙂
Thank you for pointing out the dual setting on brightness! I will be doing that tomorrow. As for the fuel warning, I think the reasonable compromise would be to have a min/max setting so that both near and far can receive an appropriate warning. I always prefer to be able to customize such settings as it's clear that one size does not fit all.
Josh, Thanks for all the great content each week. I have owned a Grenadier for several months and have found your videos to be very helpful and well produced, etc. I am on the forum as well, but that takes a fair amount of time that I don't always have. You always seem to up on the latest all things Ineos and it's the best use of my time. Thank you & please don't stop.
Thank you for the kind words. I love the Grenadier forum and appreciate the collective knowledge that hangs out there. We got to watch the UK have their teething issues and were better prepared for the US arrival.
It's funny that the key is so polarizing! I know others who share your point of view. I think I became spoiled with my last car and found that you can walk up with arms full and still make your way in easily. I mind it less for the ignition - that's quite alright. Thanks for your comment!
Josh, we have 2 Grenadiers and can relate to your 'obsession' for sure. Just had to say that the image you posted for this video struck me as beautifully hilarious. Thank you for the content.
Thanks for your comment. I've polarized a few folks with my comments in this video as some don't want to hear anything critical about the Grenadier. I love mine, and am glad to hear you're enjoying yours. Thanks for getting the subtlety of my video thumbnail...
I love the complaints you have on this. I do not have a Grenadier (yet), but am deciding on getting one. Hearing your annoyances is very helpful. Several of them are non-issues for me, such as the lack of auto-leveling headlights. Others may annoy me, like the Grenadier re-locking itself as I am walking up to it. This video is helpful and I am glad you posted it. Real-life experiences and complaints are helpful.
Thanks for your comment. When you step back and realize that no car is absolutely perfect, it becomes more important to find the one that it absolutely perfect for you. That's how I feel about the Grenadier. I love it, but I do have my complaints! The re-locking can be set (by you), so that then becomes a non-issue. There are other settings that I wish we had similar control over as I think that would eliminate many of the issues the owners report. Overall, it's very well built - which is probably the most important "feature"
You might be right - I've had 6 Land Rovers over the years and now feel like they got to "elegant" and less off-roady - even though I'm not a frequent off-road adventurer. The bigger issue I had with LR was inconsistent quality. I really do like my Grenadier, but just don't like everything about it - but your point is well taken. Thanks for commenting.
Great question and I just had a conversation with my Service Manager 2 days ago about this, but I wasn't completely happy with the answer. Firstly, the power steering has a separate motor and isn't driven/powered by the engine and this electronic motor makes this high-pitched whine that they consider to be a normal sound(!). I just connected the dots that the noise I have been hearing was connected to my power steering and if you turn your Grenadier on, leave in park and open the door or hang your head out the window, you'll notice that if you don't touch the steering wheel there is no sound, and when you touch or pull the wheel to the left or right you will hear the whine - which increases the more that you tug on the wheel. I don't know why it needs to make such noise, but have been assured that it is operating as designed. Not 100% sure I agree, but know that if it fails or changes for the worse, my dealer will address it - I have a pretty good relationship with my dealer so I have no reason to feel that they're not on the level with me. So - let's watch this space and see if this noise morphs into something worse or if more data comes in to the contrary (I hear from lots of owners and this really helps at getting to the bottom of things. So thanks for taking the time to comment. Time will tell!
@@MyAutomobileObsession - Thanks for the quick reply. Whats annoying is that there are quite a number of owners stating that their vehicles are making a terrible whining noise, while others on “The Ineos Forum” are saying their units don’t make that noise at all. Ineos says it’s normal, but I’d prefer that my $80k unit didn’t sound like a dentist drill.
Enjoy your work. I happen to love the key. Keyless entry has a host of security issues and if it fails (and they do) you’re toast. Key eliminates that failure point. But, to your point, it would be easy for INEOS to put a small LED ring around the keyhole in new production models. Lot of rumors concerning an ADAS update. Would love a video on that. Thanks for what you do.
Thanks for your comment. I've been speaking with my dealer and a video about ADAS is probably a good idea as there are a lot of mixed notions on it and also what INEOS will be doing about it. As for the key, I fully accept your point about security and realize that my dream of a keyless entry and start/stop are a tradeoff in security. I just wish they implemented the key better. A little "bump" on the lock or unlock button (similar to a US typewriter keyboard letter F or J) would mean that I could quickly reach into my pocket and unlock as I approach while carrying other things. Presently, I pretty much have to take the key out and look at it to be sure I am pressing the correct button. And the lock/unlock graphic should be better for those of us who wear reading glasses! The little symbols are currently too similar.
Thanks for your comment. Yes, I did add usb power near the key area and have a USB LED light that casts that blue light into the area and around the footwell. My video on the Rear View camera installation discusses this (includes a couple of photos) - so I'll add a link: ua-cam.com/video/D1ZJ5RlcqJw/v-deo.htmlsi=nmiuwKCwMByIBtZC
@@MyAutomobileObsession Hi Josh, thanks but I was looking for the link for the USB Blue Light us to light up the interior foot well , which you plugged into the USB Outlet, I like the look of the Apple Watch charger too ;-P
In my opinion this car is a fantastic car. If you want a car that you want to turn really quick and drive in the city by a BMW3 series. This is a solid front and rear axle car. If you complain too much, they’re going to convert this to IFS And then you will complain it’s no longer good in off road. Buy the car for what it is
Thanks for your comment. It is a great car. Just not perfect, but what car is? I think they go so many things right on their very first try that it's hard to be mad about the things that we know can be done better. But you are right that at some point they will have to choose if they stay true to off-road or focus more on the on-road crowd as the needs/wants are different.
Thanks for the question. They came from Amazon. I'm actually working on a video where I talk about the modifications and accessories that I have purchased from Amazon and a few other companies and will be posting it soon including links to all of the items that I selected and some of the reasons why I chose specific parts. It'll be out soon.
You can set the ambient to a different lever to the screen as others have said different display levels headlights on or off and you can kill the centre display by holding the mute button in for 30 seconds. As to the key keyless entry is the reason you can’t insure a Range Rover in the Uk
Thanks for your comments. I forget that INEOS is trying to create a worldwide vehicle, and I don't think we have quite the same theft issue in the US, but I have heard about rampant Range Rover theft in the UK. I don't think I would be so bothered by the Grenadier key if it weren't so big, heavy and obtuse. They could put one raised edge on one of the buttons and then I could reach in my pocket to lock/unlock and hit the correct button. They could also update the lock/unlock graphic on the key to look a little different as the image looks too similar if your the kind of person who needs reading glasses for finer detail. I don't need glasses to drive, so I don't want to need them to interpret my key. I'm sure this is more than you wanted to hear about the key! LOL.
Very good point! I have since learned that there are 2 settings for the infotainment - 1 with the headlights on and the other when they're off. That allowed me to turn the brightness down significantly when driving at night. Thanks for commenting.
Thanks for your honest video. It would appear that your enthusiasm for Ineos is waning somewhat. I hear a note in your voice that reminds me of when I realised that my marriage was heading towards a cliff 😉 It was a very brave thing to buy the first generation of a brand new vehicle from a novice car maker. I love your generally positive and informative videos. I think Ineos would be well served if they hired you as a consultant to help them improve their design. Nothing can beat real world hands on, experience. BTW, have you made any videos showcasing the area where you have your excursions / weekend field trips?
Thanks for your comment. Your analogy to your marriage gave me a chuckle, but I'm not quite that near to the cliff. I'm trying to report things as I see them, and while the Grenadier is a really great 1.0 vehicle, it's not perfect. And it actually may be perfect in the eyes of some, but that's where individual preferences come in to play. I don't care about the cup holders (which many do), or the lack of a vanity mirror (an occasional comment), I just dislike the key and the annoying warnings which I am learning more an more are regulatory and not direct fault of INEOS. They can only be to blame for their implementation of the feature. I do know that videos such as mine garner the attention of INEOS and the dealer network - so not sugar coating things is important in my opinion. As for videos showcasing some of my outings, I'm still in the novice category of videographer and sometimes struggle with the decision to enjoy the day or to get the right shot - which can delete some of that enjoyment. It's a balance that I am trying to establish!
The Grenadier is new to America but has been sold in Europe, Africa and Australia for over three years not to mention 1.8 mill Kilometers of testing and I challenge you to find a single review that defines a failure not at least tacitly admitted to being user error by the content creator. Only one comes to mind, a never connected Low Range linkage that was fixed on the trail with hand tools in time enough to enjoy a cold beverage. No one has to like the Grenadier but we can all refrain from ill formulated opinions. Yes I’m a fanboy. I have drank the entire punch bowl of cool aide, gobbled down every pill and am looking for more, but that doesn’t make me wrong necessarily. Crazy, maybe because I’d own one in every color and cash in the kids college funds if I weren’t married, but wrong…..?
Thanks for the question. It's an aftermarket camera called a Wolfbox. I did a video on it and here's a link. I added it because the rearward view was a little lacking and I wish they would have included something like this as standard equipment. Link: ua-cam.com/video/D1ZJ5RlcqJw/v-deo.htmlsi=gkm0o8PjeJf9BnBh
To "permanently" deactivate the "Start-Stop Thing" just keep the button pressed (e.g. by adding a small transparent piece of plastic over the button using the existing 4 screws that pushes the button). Btw it's a regulatory thing to safe fuel and it's deactivated in offroad mode.
75 miles for an amber warning for fuel is because if you are overlanding, you don't have petrol stations every few miles. Even in the UK, you can have over 50 miles between petrol stations. Let alone Australia or Africa. I am sure parts of the US have long distance gaps too. You need early warnings when you are not in cities. I note someone has already mentioned how to configure the brightness for night driving as there is a day setting and night (lights on) setting. I find the head unit display works best with wireless android or wireless car play. Its a bit bland without them. The speed assist camera alert is because the road you are on is not in the ISA database and the camera cannot pick up any road markings. Its purpose is only to show what speed you should be travelling. It is not linked to braking. That alert would be AEB not available. The Grenadier does over-emphasise the importance of some minor alerts. The new MINI has similar alerts (my wife has the new one with ADAS forced and that has similar beeps/booms and alerts). The emphasis on the mini is much lower (greyed out rather than an alert box if the camera cannot detect anything). Stop/start is normal on cars in Europe and has been for a while. Air con shouldn't stop with auto-stop/start. It doesn't on mine and it shouldn't on yours. If the car is worried about battery, then stop start would be disabled until battery is strong enough. oh, back on the MINI, the new mini key is massive. Its almost twice the size of the grenadier key.
Thanks for your comments. I appreciate the context and also the comparison with MINI as that was my other ride. I think you hit it on the head when you said Grenadier seems to over-emphasize some of the less important warnings. I think the better solution is more choice/customizability in the menus so that you could have your longer range fuel warning and me (the city boy with petrol on every other corner) can get a warning at a lower remaining fuel level. Likewise with the severity of the warnings, I'd take a flashing light without a sound all day long - I understand that regulatory bodies dictate some of these things, so I guess it boils down to implementation for me.
I have precisely all these issues and frustrations which tells me every Grenadier is precisely the same. Every Grenny owner is self taught when it comes to the ‘finger and key parallel move’ to find the key hole. Once we start the vehicle we reach for the Start/Stop button followed by the favorites button to turn off the three Speed Limit warnings. Then we have to live with the warning light on the dash and the dinging, and bonging sounds…ARGH!🤦 Rusnak in Pasadena told me there may be a software update (I don’t believe them) but I think that’s just their standard reply. They also said the camera warning light will stay on until it collects sufficient data at which point it will turn itself off. Not sure I believe them on this either. Thanks for the video!
There was a software update that was delivered to INEOS NA for testing at the beginning of July, with the intention to begin releasing it to customers at the end of Q3 - which just happened. I will be speaking with my dealer this week and will report back on anything that I learn. I was told it wasn't expected to be much more than the ability to permanently turn off the over-speed warning. As for the camera warning light, that's interesting what you are hearing. I'll try to confirm that too. Thanks for your comments!
Yes, and the left side brings us the tilt angle of the rear camera. I can dim the wolfbox quite easily, but the infotainment display is a little more difficult. However, another viewer noted that the system retains two settings of brightness - one for headlights on and the other for headlights off. I'll be trying that tomorrow. Thanks for your comment!
The Grenadier is perfect in every respect except range, but I installed aux fuel transfer tanks on both of my 200 series Land Cruisers that I just assume throw rocks at now having owned my Grenadier and though it might not be the bargain of the century it is very reasonably priced considering. I feel so strongly in this opinion that I ordered a Quartermaster to sit beside my Wagon. My desire to get two, three if I would have been successful in convincing my wife that three Genadiers in the Garage wasn’t nearing Psychosis especially considering that with unlimited funds and unmarried, obviously, I’d likely have one in every color, early production Ineos’ for fear that they will make precisely some, all, or more changes that you are suggesting and ruin it, at least for the North American market. A superb off-road vehicle, seemingly reliable that can propel itself and copious amounts of gear 80 mph’s down the freeway confidently and reasonably comfortably. What more could anyone outside City Limits ever ask for? Excellent content and review. Thanks.
Thanks for your comments! I love your passion for the Grenadier and Quartermaster. It is truly unique. I still think I would be less bothered with the range if I were able to choose when I was warned about refueling. If you fill up your stable with Grenadiers, I want a photo! Cheers!
Thanks for your comment and sorry to hear. I'm not trying to dissuade anybody, but do want to be forthcoming in my assessment. The Grenadier is a great and sturdy vehicle, but it's currently a 1.0 version. Improvements will surely take place as the model years progress, but we all understood that INEOS had to start somewhere. For the most part, they did an excellent job. But, you are correct that some things could, or maybe should be better and if you have the ability to wait, that may be the appropriate option for you. There are a lot of great vehicles competing for consumer dollars and I think the Grenadier will continue to be a bit niche, and a bit more expensive than desired for the product delivered. But some owners are happy with it being that way.
Your honesty is the bedrock of your site's value. Your insights on V1.0 are spot on. In the first version, Ineos got many things right, more than they got wrong. When I consider the purpose of the Ineos, having owned many Jeeps, I believe it is superior to the Jeep in many meaningful ways. Engineers designing the Ineos focused on off-road ability. From that perspective, they got the turning radius very wrong, at least for America. Maybe during the stop in production, the software guys can catch up? With Stellantis being run by bean counters, and Jeep dealers overflowing with inventory they cannot sell; I won't be a new Jeep owner. As far as the price for the Ineos; have you priced a Jeep Rubicon optioned out to compete with the Ineos? The BMW engine in the Ineos is far superior to any engine in the Jeep.
You need to go into settings, vehicle functions . With engine running and handbrake on you’ll open up a hidden airbag setting select what you prefer on or off then press the brake pedal for three seconds . I guess you want it on when a passenger gets in . Then when you start car and set off it will be bright airbag 2 ON after 30 seconds the light ON will go off and the centre passenger lights will dim down. I’ve just done this after my dealer forgot whilst doing the software update . YOU WONT FIND passenger airbag in settings / vehicle functions unless you have car running and handbrake on . The as I just said press brake pedal and hold for 3 seconds . Hope that helps . Regarding centre display I’ve not checked but with it being bmw I’ll wager it has a day / night & AUTO brightness setting .
I had a third of the tank left when i parked. A few hours later, when i started the engine, it showed my tank was almost empty! Gave me a scare so i had to get gas at the nearest station. Not sure if this happened to anyone else.
It's the large and heavy part that I think I find the most annoying. Whatever you do, don't lose a key! I have heard pricing between $900 and $1200 to replace one as it has to be laser cut and re-coded to the vehicle. It may look cheap, but it isn't!
Thanks for commenting. I think that regardless of country, the BMW engine chosen is quite sophisticated and requires a master technician rather than a basic auto mechanic. I don't think that's a uniquely American problem. My service manager said that while INEOS wanted to keep simplicity in the Grenadier (and they have basically done so with all things being considered), but modern day regulations force some of the unwanted complexities that make working on the Grenadier in the outback a much tougher challenge than originally desired.
I really dont understand the point. Does like the key because he has trouble finding slots in the dark or daytime. Despite it not moving and im the same location day after day. Not reading the owners manual to understand the different functions. I get you are trying to inform people but inform them of what?
For me, the finding of the keyhole is more of a silly oversight on the part of INEOS and not the reason that I don't like the key. It has more to do with carrying around a heavy and poorly designed key, and I guess I became spoiled by my most two recent vehicles that had keyless ignitions and a more appropriately sized/weighted key. Clearly my problem, but I own that. You didn't mention if you are a Grenadier owner, but if you are you've probably discovered some curious functions or button behaviors that are only spelled out in the owners manual. This is the first car I've had in years where reading the manual was step one in ownership as there are many non-intuitive features. My intention in this video is to share the experience of Grenadier ownership both highlights and lowlights. Thanks for your comments.
WOW! LOTS of complaining in this video for things that are solvable or not such a big deal. Do some research first. Look up AEB, for example, before admitting you don't know that it is Automatic Emergency Braking. For example, dimming the display. When I refuel it almost always shows >320 miles on remaining range. It is a 23.7 gallon tank with a range of 350 miles at 15mpg. Try using recirculation mode on the HVAC to reduce airflow noise. Keep windshield clean and front facing camera will stay on. My trick with inserting the key is to put my index finger along the key and just over the end of the key so tip of my fingertip finds the keyhole easily by touch and then slide the key in. My creds for giving my opinion are >18,500 miles on the odometer. Oh, the turning radius... I used to drive a F-150 crew cab pickup. By comparison, the Grenadier has a very good turning radius. I can do a 3-point turn on a narrow gravel road with no prob. I'm sure other vehicles have a better turning radius.
Thanks for commenting. I humbly accept your assessment. I made this video a little earlier in my Grenadier journey and while some of my comments were a bit ignorant, I still maintain that the Grenadier is a vehicle that you have to figure out when you first get it. I am not longer bothered by the plethora of warnings, but it came quite easy after a good conversation with the service manager at my dealer. Now, there are some things that I wish they did differently - like the refuel warning coming on a bit early. I'm not certain is you are in the U.S., but my grenadier on a full tank shows >270 miles on a refuel so your comment got my attention on that point. Anyway, I apologize if I upset you - I do love my Grenadier, but do feel like there are a few things that will likely change in the coming years and we'll say "remember when you had to put your finger on the end of the key to guide it to the keyhole..." Looking forward to that!
I started to watch your youtube videos with the intent to purchase IG, however my interest also started to wane over time. Instead I bought a Defender 110. My cons is how do I get use to the way the steering behaves on IG, not my favorite. Lastly the fact that I have to install a 3rd party rear view mirror is also another drawback for a $100k vehicle 😢
Thanks for your comment. Enjoy your D110 for the time being and keep your eyes on INEOS to see how they do and grow. The Defender (v2) has been out for several years now and has undergone refinement that the Grenadier simply hasn't had time to achieve yet. I feel confident that INEOS is paying attention to all of the comments and want to make a vehicle that makes sense. They came out of the gate targeting the off-road market. Time will tell if that is where their bread is actually buttered, of if they need to shift to satisfying those who mainly drive on-road.
If you are happy with a 110 Defender, great, awesome, but the Grenadier would never have been for you at any price and you can get a Grenadier with everything that suits its purpose for about $76,000.
When my wife vetoed, totally unreasonably, the purchase of a Third Ineos, yes Third, Wagon is in the Garage and deposit down on the Quartermaster, and I was more than happy to chuck her well modified 2021 Toyota Land Cruiser that I swore up and down that I would never sell but just assume throw rocks at now after owning a Grenadier for nearly 9 months now, I tried to convince her to get a Defender. All this is to let you know I like the Defender and have had great luck with the four Land Rovers we’ve owned, but I wouldn’t drive a Defender any further into the woods than I’d be comfortable walking out of. The Grenadier? BRING IT ON!
I forgot that I was wearing my San Diego jersey on my Trip up to LA, but certainly heard about it once I arrived. I've lived in both cities, but originated and again live in San Diego, so their my team. Fingers crossed!
Thanks for commenting. Trust me, I don't hate my Grenadier - far from it. I'm just pointing out a few things that I feel they can improve upon and know that INEOS is paying attention to owner feedback. I apologize if I struck a nerve. I'm sorry to see you go, but appreciate your opinion.
Having the speedometer and gauges located in the center rather than in front of the driver, requires the driver takes his/her eyes off the road to look at the speed, gas tank level, etc.., not an ideal ergonomic or safety engineering design. The interior should be redesigned to have an analog cluster in front of the driver, or a heads-up display available.
As an "on the fence" buyer, every video I see of the Grenadier makes think an HUD would be ideal. Just the basics - speed, fuel level, range, maybe bookended by turn indicators. Wouldn't be surprised to see an aftermarket solution at some point.
@@BigTodd70 After test driving a TrialMaster edition, I found the steering, not returning to the zero position took a little getting used to, but it was something I could deal with. The very poor turning radius would present more of an issue for me, as a have to routinely navigate tight roads, and make sharp turns, which with the Grenadier is a virtual impossibility. Little things like no power seats in a 90K vehicle, no bluetooth cellphone hands free integration, no on-board navigation, no blind-spot monitoring are all nice things to have. The hands free cellphone integration is really a must for todays world. One could use their cellphone for navigation, it does sync with the Grenadier infotainment system, but I do not have a Cellphone data plan with unlimited data access thru Verizon. The rearview vision in very poor in the Grenadier, obstructed by the rear mounted spare tire and double doors. The ride was well mannered, acceleration not spectacular, but more than sufficient for a 6,000+ lb vehicle. Fit and finish and interior construction was more than acceptable. The underpinnings of this vehicle are heavy duty, purpose built to handle off-roading, and that I greatly appreciate. In-cabin noise levels were acceptable at speeds below 55 mph, above that in-cabin noise levels became somewhat intrusive in my humble opinion, comparing it to my Lexus GX 460 and Ram 1500 Limited. My greatest concern would be short and long term reliability, and servicing. The closest dealer and service center to me was a 2 hour drive. If I was retired and driving primarily around town, I may have already purchased a Grenadier, but I drive 30,000+ miles annually and need a dependable and reliable daily commuter, once I sell my GX-460.
LOL - I so forgot that I was wearing that Jersey - and on my trip to LA no less! I certainly heard about it from friends and businesses that I walked into while I was there. I lived in LA for 33 years, but originated (and again live) in San Diego. So, I have an affinity for both teams. But let's face it, the Dodgers don't need my support. They're doing fine. The Padres are a little more touch and go... Thanks for calling me out!
Thanks for your comment. If I sold a car off every time I discovered something that I didn't completely like, I'd be going through a lot of cars! I don't hate my Grenadier - not even close. I just want to give a representation that the average sales person might mention to a prospective buyer. The seat, however, is dry!
Ineos refuses to sell a service manual and insists you must phone their service department in case of breakdown. Good luck with that when you are 300 km into the backcountry! Not a smart company….
Please consider Subscribing if you haven't already. I always forget to ask!😉
For anyone considering the Grenadier....there's no substitute for time behind the wheel of it. I have owned one for several months and expected to have the same list of gripes that others have posted about. I was shocked to find that most of what others talked about were TOTALLY non issues for me. We all come with different experiences and use cases. This is an incredible vehicle that I cannot ever image parting with. If you are thinking about it, go spend a day behind the wheel. I think you'll be pleasantly surprised.
All great points and very true. There is no substitute for spending time behind the wheel. I took a 2 hour test drive before I bought mine.
Agreed
Hey Josh. Two things. The car will remember 2 separate display brightness settings. Just set the brightness with your headlights on, and then set it again with your headlights off.
Also, remember that not everywhere has fuel available just around the corner. I can easily be 100km away from fuel, so an early fuel warning suits me fine. 🙂
Thank you for pointing out the dual setting on brightness! I will be doing that tomorrow.
As for the fuel warning, I think the reasonable compromise would be to have a min/max setting so that both near and far can receive an appropriate warning. I always prefer to be able to customize such settings as it's clear that one size does not fit all.
You are my Hero!
Josh, Thanks for all the great content each week. I have owned a Grenadier for several months and have found your videos to be very helpful and well produced, etc. I am on the forum as well, but that takes a fair amount of time that I don't always have. You always seem to up on the latest all things Ineos and it's the best use of my time. Thank you & please don't stop.
Thank you for the kind words. I love the Grenadier forum and appreciate the collective knowledge that hangs out there. We got to watch the UK have their teething issues and were better prepared for the US arrival.
Finally, a new car that actually has a key. That's a huge plus in my opinion. I hate all the new tech crap, just more stuff to break.
It's funny that the key is so polarizing! I know others who share your point of view. I think I became spoiled with my last car and found that you can walk up with arms full and still make your way in easily. I mind it less for the ignition - that's quite alright. Thanks for your comment!
Josh, we have 2 Grenadiers and can relate to your 'obsession' for sure. Just had to say that the image you posted for this video struck me as beautifully hilarious. Thank you for the content.
Thanks for your comment. I've polarized a few folks with my comments in this video as some don't want to hear anything critical about the Grenadier. I love mine, and am glad to hear you're enjoying yours. Thanks for getting the subtlety of my video thumbnail...
I love the complaints you have on this. I do not have a Grenadier (yet), but am deciding on getting one. Hearing your annoyances is very helpful. Several of them are non-issues for me, such as the lack of auto-leveling headlights. Others may annoy me, like the Grenadier re-locking itself as I am walking up to it. This video is helpful and I am glad you posted it. Real-life experiences and complaints are helpful.
Thanks for your comment. When you step back and realize that no car is absolutely perfect, it becomes more important to find the one that it absolutely perfect for you. That's how I feel about the Grenadier. I love it, but I do have my complaints! The re-locking can be set (by you), so that then becomes a non-issue. There are other settings that I wish we had similar control over as I think that would eliminate many of the issues the owners report. Overall, it's very well built - which is probably the most important "feature"
Re-locking is a configurable option in the settings.
I think the vehicle is designed for work, adventure and off road.
It sounds like you would be better suited to a new landrover
You might be right - I've had 6 Land Rovers over the years and now feel like they got to "elegant" and less off-roady - even though I'm not a frequent off-road adventurer. The bigger issue I had with LR was inconsistent quality. I really do like my Grenadier, but just don't like everything about it - but your point is well taken. Thanks for commenting.
Hey Josh, can you explain the steering whine? Why does the grenadier have that loud whistling whine when steering?
Great question and I just had a conversation with my Service Manager 2 days ago about this, but I wasn't completely happy with the answer. Firstly, the power steering has a separate motor and isn't driven/powered by the engine and this electronic motor makes this high-pitched whine that they consider to be a normal sound(!). I just connected the dots that the noise I have been hearing was connected to my power steering and if you turn your Grenadier on, leave in park and open the door or hang your head out the window, you'll notice that if you don't touch the steering wheel there is no sound, and when you touch or pull the wheel to the left or right you will hear the whine - which increases the more that you tug on the wheel. I don't know why it needs to make such noise, but have been assured that it is operating as designed. Not 100% sure I agree, but know that if it fails or changes for the worse, my dealer will address it - I have a pretty good relationship with my dealer so I have no reason to feel that they're not on the level with me. So - let's watch this space and see if this noise morphs into something worse or if more data comes in to the contrary (I hear from lots of owners and this really helps at getting to the bottom of things. So thanks for taking the time to comment. Time will tell!
@@MyAutomobileObsession - Thanks for the quick reply. Whats annoying is that there are quite a number of owners stating that their vehicles are making a terrible whining noise, while others on “The Ineos Forum” are saying their units don’t make that noise at all. Ineos says it’s normal, but I’d prefer that my $80k unit didn’t sound like a dentist drill.
Enjoy your work. I happen to love the key. Keyless entry has a host of security issues and if it fails (and they do) you’re toast. Key eliminates that failure point. But, to your point, it would be easy for INEOS to put a small LED ring around the keyhole in new production models.
Lot of rumors concerning an ADAS update. Would love a video on that.
Thanks for what you do.
Thanks for your comment. I've been speaking with my dealer and a video about ADAS is probably a good idea as there are a lot of mixed notions on it and also what INEOS will be doing about it. As for the key, I fully accept your point about security and realize that my dream of a keyless entry and start/stop are a tradeoff in security. I just wish they implemented the key better. A little "bump" on the lock or unlock button (similar to a US typewriter keyboard letter F or J) would mean that I could quickly reach into my pocket and unlock as I approach while carrying other things. Presently, I pretty much have to take the key out and look at it to be sure I am pressing the correct button. And the lock/unlock graphic should be better for those of us who wear reading glasses! The little symbols are currently too similar.
Great review, where I did you find ge blue footwell down lighters, is there a link, please, Huw
Thanks for your comment. Yes, I did add usb power near the key area and have a USB LED light that casts that blue light into the area and around the footwell. My video on the Rear View camera installation discusses this (includes a couple of photos) - so I'll add a link: ua-cam.com/video/D1ZJ5RlcqJw/v-deo.htmlsi=nmiuwKCwMByIBtZC
@@MyAutomobileObsession Hi Josh, thanks but I was looking for the link for the USB Blue Light us to light up the interior foot well , which you plugged into the USB Outlet, I like the look of the Apple Watch charger too ;-P
Fantastic headline opener fantastic for Halloween 👀. I appreciate you for the update.
Thanks!
In my opinion this car is a fantastic car. If you want a car that you want to turn really quick and drive in the city by a BMW3 series. This is a solid front and rear axle car. If you complain too much, they’re going to convert this to IFS And then you will complain it’s no longer good in off road. Buy the car for what it is
Thanks for your comment. It is a great car. Just not perfect, but what car is? I think they go so many things right on their very first try that it's hard to be mad about the things that we know can be done better. But you are right that at some point they will have to choose if they stay true to off-road or focus more on the on-road crowd as the needs/wants are different.
Where did you get those USB outlets?
Thanks for the question. They came from Amazon. I'm actually working on a video where I talk about the modifications and accessories that I have purchased from Amazon and a few other companies and will be posting it soon including links to all of the items that I selected and some of the reasons why I chose specific parts. It'll be out soon.
Very valuable video.
Thank you.
You can set the ambient to a different lever to the screen as others have said different display levels headlights on or off and you can kill the centre display by holding the mute button in for 30 seconds. As to the key keyless entry is the reason you can’t insure a Range Rover in the Uk
Thanks for your comments. I forget that INEOS is trying to create a worldwide vehicle, and I don't think we have quite the same theft issue in the US, but I have heard about rampant Range Rover theft in the UK. I don't think I would be so bothered by the Grenadier key if it weren't so big, heavy and obtuse. They could put one raised edge on one of the buttons and then I could reach in my pocket to lock/unlock and hit the correct button. They could also update the lock/unlock graphic on the key to look a little different as the image looks too similar if your the kind of person who needs reading glasses for finer detail. I don't need glasses to drive, so I don't want to need them to interpret my key. I'm sure this is more than you wanted to hear about the key! LOL.
All that interior light will play havoc on your vision when driving on dark country roads
Very good point! I have since learned that there are 2 settings for the infotainment - 1 with the headlights on and the other when they're off. That allowed me to turn the brightness down significantly when driving at night. Thanks for commenting.
wolf box goin in this week, excited for that
I think you'll find that it's a good addition. Congrats!
Thanks for your honest video. It would appear that your enthusiasm for Ineos is waning somewhat. I hear a note in your voice that reminds me of when I realised that my marriage was heading towards a cliff 😉 It was a very brave thing to buy the first generation of a brand new vehicle from a novice car maker. I love your generally positive and informative videos. I think Ineos would be well served if they hired you as a consultant to help them improve their design. Nothing can beat real world hands on, experience. BTW, have you made any videos showcasing the area where you have your excursions / weekend field trips?
Thanks for your comment. Your analogy to your marriage gave me a chuckle, but I'm not quite that near to the cliff. I'm trying to report things as I see them, and while the Grenadier is a really great 1.0 vehicle, it's not perfect. And it actually may be perfect in the eyes of some, but that's where individual preferences come in to play. I don't care about the cup holders (which many do), or the lack of a vanity mirror (an occasional comment), I just dislike the key and the annoying warnings which I am learning more an more are regulatory and not direct fault of INEOS. They can only be to blame for their implementation of the feature. I do know that videos such as mine garner the attention of INEOS and the dealer network - so not sugar coating things is important in my opinion. As for videos showcasing some of my outings, I'm still in the novice category of videographer and sometimes struggle with the decision to enjoy the day or to get the right shot - which can delete some of that enjoyment. It's a balance that I am trying to establish!
The Grenadier is new to America but has been sold in Europe, Africa and Australia for over three years not to mention 1.8 mill Kilometers of testing and I challenge you to find a single review that defines a failure not at least tacitly admitted to being user error by the content creator. Only one comes to mind, a never connected Low Range linkage that was fixed on the trail with hand tools in time enough to enjoy a cold beverage.
No one has to like the Grenadier but we can all refrain from ill formulated opinions.
Yes I’m a fanboy. I have drank the entire punch bowl of cool aide, gobbled down every pill and am looking for more, but that doesn’t make me wrong necessarily. Crazy, maybe because I’d own one in every color and cash in the kids college funds if I weren’t married, but wrong…..?
Is that rear mirror camera standard?
Thanks for the question. It's an aftermarket camera called a Wolfbox. I did a video on it and here's a link. I added it because the rearward view was a little lacking and I wish they would have included something like this as standard equipment. Link: ua-cam.com/video/D1ZJ5RlcqJw/v-deo.htmlsi=gkm0o8PjeJf9BnBh
To "permanently" deactivate the "Start-Stop Thing" just keep the button pressed (e.g. by adding a small transparent piece of plastic over the button using the existing 4 screws that pushes the button). Btw it's a regulatory thing to safe fuel and it's deactivated in offroad mode.
Thanks for your comment. I figured that re-setting the Auto Start-Stop was based in a regulation, so thanks for your workaround suggestion.
75 miles for an amber warning for fuel is because if you are overlanding, you don't have petrol stations every few miles. Even in the UK, you can have over 50 miles between petrol stations. Let alone Australia or Africa. I am sure parts of the US have long distance gaps too. You need early warnings when you are not in cities. I note someone has already mentioned how to configure the brightness for night driving as there is a day setting and night (lights on) setting. I find the head unit display works best with wireless android or wireless car play. Its a bit bland without them. The speed assist camera alert is because the road you are on is not in the ISA database and the camera cannot pick up any road markings. Its purpose is only to show what speed you should be travelling. It is not linked to braking. That alert would be AEB not available. The Grenadier does over-emphasise the importance of some minor alerts. The new MINI has similar alerts (my wife has the new one with ADAS forced and that has similar beeps/booms and alerts). The emphasis on the mini is much lower (greyed out rather than an alert box if the camera cannot detect anything). Stop/start is normal on cars in Europe and has been for a while. Air con shouldn't stop with auto-stop/start. It doesn't on mine and it shouldn't on yours. If the car is worried about battery, then stop start would be disabled until battery is strong enough. oh, back on the MINI, the new mini key is massive. Its almost twice the size of the grenadier key.
Thanks for your comments. I appreciate the context and also the comparison with MINI as that was my other ride. I think you hit it on the head when you said Grenadier seems to over-emphasize some of the less important warnings. I think the better solution is more choice/customizability in the menus so that you could have your longer range fuel warning and me (the city boy with petrol on every other corner) can get a warning at a lower remaining fuel level. Likewise with the severity of the warnings, I'd take a flashing light without a sound all day long - I understand that regulatory bodies dictate some of these things, so I guess it boils down to implementation for me.
I have precisely all these issues and frustrations which tells me every Grenadier is precisely the same.
Every Grenny owner is self taught when it comes to the ‘finger and key parallel move’ to find the key hole. Once we start the vehicle we reach for the Start/Stop button followed by the favorites button to turn off the three Speed Limit warnings. Then we have to live with the warning light on the dash and the dinging, and bonging sounds…ARGH!🤦
Rusnak in Pasadena told me there may be a software update (I don’t believe them) but I think that’s just their standard reply. They also said the camera warning light will stay on until it collects sufficient data at which point it will turn itself off. Not sure I believe them on this either.
Thanks for the video!
There was a software update that was delivered to INEOS NA for testing at the beginning of July, with the intention to begin releasing it to customers at the end of Q3 - which just happened. I will be speaking with my dealer this week and will report back on anything that I learn. I was told it wasn't expected to be much more than the ability to permanently turn off the over-speed warning. As for the camera warning light, that's interesting what you are hearing. I'll try to confirm that too. Thanks for your comments!
@@MyAutomobileObsession if I hear any updates from Rusnak I’ll let you know.
@@MyAutomobileObsessiondid they do an update? If so what does it cover?
found this in the Wolfbox manual: On the RIGHT side of the screen: Slide up and down to adjust the brightness!
Yes, and the left side brings us the tilt angle of the rear camera. I can dim the wolfbox quite easily, but the infotainment display is a little more difficult. However, another viewer noted that the system retains two settings of brightness - one for headlights on and the other for headlights off. I'll be trying that tomorrow. Thanks for your comment!
You want dark? 1991 ford explorer no window lights, steering wheel lights. It's nice actually.
Thanks for the comment. It gave me a chuckle - but you're absolutely right!
The Grenadier is perfect in every respect except range, but I installed aux fuel transfer tanks on both of my 200 series Land Cruisers that I just assume throw rocks at now having owned my Grenadier and though it might not be the bargain of the century it is very reasonably priced considering. I feel so strongly in this opinion that I ordered a Quartermaster to sit beside my Wagon. My desire to get two, three if I would have been successful in convincing my wife that three Genadiers in the Garage wasn’t nearing Psychosis especially considering that with unlimited funds and unmarried, obviously, I’d likely have one in every color, early production Ineos’ for fear that they will make precisely some, all, or more changes that you are suggesting and ruin it, at least for the North American market. A superb off-road vehicle, seemingly reliable that can propel itself and copious amounts of gear 80 mph’s down the freeway confidently and reasonably comfortably. What more could anyone outside City Limits ever ask for?
Excellent content and review. Thanks.
Thanks for your comments! I love your passion for the Grenadier and Quartermaster. It is truly unique. I still think I would be less bothered with the range if I were able to choose when I was warned about refueling. If you fill up your stable with Grenadiers, I want a photo! Cheers!
You have convinced me to wait until the 2027 model if they have solved some of these troubling issues.
Thanks for your comment and sorry to hear. I'm not trying to dissuade anybody, but do want to be forthcoming in my assessment. The Grenadier is a great and sturdy vehicle, but it's currently a 1.0 version. Improvements will surely take place as the model years progress, but we all understood that INEOS had to start somewhere. For the most part, they did an excellent job. But, you are correct that some things could, or maybe should be better and if you have the ability to wait, that may be the appropriate option for you. There are a lot of great vehicles competing for consumer dollars and I think the Grenadier will continue to be a bit niche, and a bit more expensive than desired for the product delivered. But some owners are happy with it being that way.
Your honesty is the bedrock of your site's value. Your insights on V1.0 are spot on. In the first version, Ineos got many things right, more than they got wrong.
When I consider the purpose of the Ineos, having owned many Jeeps, I believe it is superior to the Jeep in many meaningful ways.
Engineers designing the Ineos focused on off-road ability. From that perspective, they got the turning radius very wrong, at least for America.
Maybe during the stop in production, the software guys can catch up?
With Stellantis being run by bean counters, and Jeep dealers overflowing with inventory they cannot sell; I won't be a new Jeep owner.
As far as the price for the Ineos; have you priced a Jeep Rubicon optioned out to compete with the Ineos? The BMW engine in the Ineos is far superior to any engine in the Jeep.
You need to go into settings, vehicle functions . With engine running and handbrake on you’ll open up a hidden airbag setting select what you prefer on or off then press the brake pedal for three seconds . I guess you want it on when a passenger gets in . Then when you start car and set off it will be bright airbag 2 ON after 30 seconds the light ON will go off and the centre passenger lights will dim down. I’ve just done this after my dealer forgot whilst doing the software update . YOU WONT FIND passenger airbag in settings / vehicle functions unless you have car running and handbrake on . The as I just said press brake pedal and hold for 3 seconds . Hope that helps . Regarding centre display I’ve not checked but with it being bmw I’ll wager it has a day / night & AUTO brightness setting .
Wow! This is great information. I am printing this comment and taking it downstairs to try this out in the morning. Thanks for your comment!
That sounds complicated lol
I had a third of the tank left when i parked. A few hours later, when i started the engine, it showed my tank was almost empty! Gave me a scare so i had to get gas at the nearest station. Not sure if this happened to anyone else.
Thanks for commenting. I'm still feeling too new in experience to say that I have personally seen this, but others may chime in.
No "dash lights" at steering wheel at night is indeed very dark. Still thinking of options.
Yes - it caught me off guard the first time I drove at night. It's not horrible, just different. Thanks for commenting.
I have less of an issue with the key and more so on how large and cheap it is.
It's the large and heavy part that I think I find the most annoying. Whatever you do, don't lose a key! I have heard pricing between $900 and $1200 to replace one as it has to be laser cut and re-coded to the vehicle. It may look cheap, but it isn't!
This is not a car for Americans. It is made to be as simple and reliable and easy to fix as possible in Africa and any remote arias of the world.
Thanks for commenting. I think that regardless of country, the BMW engine chosen is quite sophisticated and requires a master technician rather than a basic auto mechanic. I don't think that's a uniquely American problem. My service manager said that while INEOS wanted to keep simplicity in the Grenadier (and they have basically done so with all things being considered), but modern day regulations force some of the unwanted complexities that make working on the Grenadier in the outback a much tougher challenge than originally desired.
I really dont understand the point. Does like the key because he has trouble finding slots in the dark or daytime. Despite it not moving and im the same location day after day. Not reading the owners manual to understand the different functions. I get you are trying to inform people but inform them of what?
For me, the finding of the keyhole is more of a silly oversight on the part of INEOS and not the reason that I don't like the key. It has more to do with carrying around a heavy and poorly designed key, and I guess I became spoiled by my most two recent vehicles that had keyless ignitions and a more appropriately sized/weighted key. Clearly my problem, but I own that. You didn't mention if you are a Grenadier owner, but if you are you've probably discovered some curious functions or button behaviors that are only spelled out in the owners manual. This is the first car I've had in years where reading the manual was step one in ownership as there are many non-intuitive features. My intention in this video is to share the experience of Grenadier ownership both highlights and lowlights. Thanks for your comments.
WOW! LOTS of complaining in this video for things that are solvable or not such a big deal. Do some research first. Look up AEB, for example, before admitting you don't know that it is Automatic Emergency Braking. For example, dimming the display. When I refuel it almost always shows >320 miles on remaining range. It is a 23.7 gallon tank with a range of 350 miles at 15mpg. Try using recirculation mode on the HVAC to reduce airflow noise. Keep windshield clean and front facing camera will stay on. My trick with inserting the key is to put my index finger along the key and just over the end of the key so tip of my fingertip finds the keyhole easily by touch and then slide the key in. My creds for giving my opinion are >18,500 miles on the odometer. Oh, the turning radius... I used to drive a F-150 crew cab pickup. By comparison, the Grenadier has a very good turning radius. I can do a 3-point turn on a narrow gravel road with no prob. I'm sure other vehicles have a better turning radius.
Thanks for commenting. I humbly accept your assessment. I made this video a little earlier in my Grenadier journey and while some of my comments were a bit ignorant, I still maintain that the Grenadier is a vehicle that you have to figure out when you first get it. I am not longer bothered by the plethora of warnings, but it came quite easy after a good conversation with the service manager at my dealer. Now, there are some things that I wish they did differently - like the refuel warning coming on a bit early. I'm not certain is you are in the U.S., but my grenadier on a full tank shows >270 miles on a refuel so your comment got my attention on that point. Anyway, I apologize if I upset you - I do love my Grenadier, but do feel like there are a few things that will likely change in the coming years and we'll say "remember when you had to put your finger on the end of the key to guide it to the keyhole..." Looking forward to that!
I started to watch your youtube videos with the intent to purchase IG, however my interest also started to wane over time. Instead I bought a Defender 110. My cons is how do I get use to the way the steering behaves on IG, not my favorite. Lastly the fact that I have to install a 3rd party rear view mirror is also another drawback for a $100k vehicle 😢
Thanks for your comment. Enjoy your D110 for the time being and keep your eyes on INEOS to see how they do and grow. The Defender (v2) has been out for several years now and has undergone refinement that the Grenadier simply hasn't had time to achieve yet. I feel confident that INEOS is paying attention to all of the comments and want to make a vehicle that makes sense. They came out of the gate targeting the off-road market. Time will tell if that is where their bread is actually buttered, of if they need to shift to satisfying those who mainly drive on-road.
If you are happy with a 110 Defender, great, awesome, but the Grenadier would never have been for you at any price and you can get a Grenadier with everything that suits its purpose for about $76,000.
When my wife vetoed, totally unreasonably, the purchase of a Third Ineos, yes Third, Wagon is in the Garage and deposit down on the Quartermaster, and I was more than happy to chuck her well modified 2021 Toyota Land Cruiser that I swore up and down that I would never sell but just assume throw rocks at now after owning a Grenadier for nearly 9 months now, I tried to convince her to get a Defender. All this is to let you know I like the Defender and have had great luck with the four Land Rovers we’ve owned, but I wouldn’t drive a Defender any further into the woods than I’d be comfortable walking out of. The Grenadier? BRING IT ON!
Go Padres
I forgot that I was wearing my San Diego jersey on my Trip up to LA, but certainly heard about it once I arrived. I've lived in both cities, but originated and again live in San Diego, so their my team. Fingers crossed!
Buy another vehicle dude after all this whining. Love my Grennie. Lastt of your vids for me.
Thanks for commenting. Trust me, I don't hate my Grenadier - far from it. I'm just pointing out a few things that I feel they can improve upon and know that INEOS is paying attention to owner feedback. I apologize if I struck a nerve. I'm sorry to see you go, but appreciate your opinion.
Having the speedometer and gauges located in the center rather than in front of the driver, requires the driver takes his/her eyes off the road to look at the speed, gas tank level, etc.., not an ideal ergonomic or safety engineering design. The interior should be redesigned to have an analog cluster in front of the driver, or a heads-up display available.
What a load of rubbish it’s brilliant
As an "on the fence" buyer, every video I see of the Grenadier makes think an HUD would be ideal. Just the basics - speed, fuel level, range, maybe bookended by turn indicators. Wouldn't be surprised to see an aftermarket solution at some point.
Have to ask, do you listen with the radio off and not use Google or apple maps?
@@peopleschamp7258 I do not use Apple Maps. My vehicles all have their own navigation and hands free cellphone integration.
@@BigTodd70 After test driving a TrialMaster edition, I found the steering, not returning to the zero position took a little getting used to, but it was something I could deal with. The very poor turning radius would present more of an issue for me, as a have to routinely navigate tight roads, and make sharp turns, which with the Grenadier is a virtual impossibility. Little things like no power seats in a 90K vehicle, no bluetooth cellphone hands free integration, no on-board navigation, no blind-spot monitoring are all nice things to have. The hands free cellphone integration is really a must for todays world. One could use their cellphone for navigation, it does sync with the Grenadier infotainment system, but I do not have a Cellphone data plan with unlimited data access thru Verizon. The rearview vision in very poor in the Grenadier, obstructed by the rear mounted spare tire and double doors. The ride was well mannered, acceleration not spectacular, but more than sufficient for a 6,000+ lb vehicle. Fit and finish and interior construction was more than acceptable. The underpinnings of this vehicle are heavy duty, purpose built to handle off-roading, and that I greatly appreciate. In-cabin noise levels were acceptable at speeds below 55 mph, above that in-cabin noise levels became somewhat intrusive in my humble opinion, comparing it to my Lexus GX 460 and Ram 1500 Limited. My greatest concern would be short and long term reliability, and servicing. The closest dealer and service center to me was a 2 hour drive. If I was retired and driving primarily around town, I may have already purchased a Grenadier, but I drive 30,000+ miles annually and need a dependable and reliable daily commuter, once I sell my GX-460.
Go dodgers
LOL - I so forgot that I was wearing that Jersey - and on my trip to LA no less! I certainly heard about it from friends and businesses that I walked into while I was there. I lived in LA for 33 years, but originated (and again live) in San Diego. So, I have an affinity for both teams. But let's face it, the Dodgers don't need my support. They're doing fine. The Padres are a little more touch and go... Thanks for calling me out!
Sell the Flippen car and buy something else. I believe your pants and seat is wet
Thanks for your comment. If I sold a car off every time I discovered something that I didn't completely like, I'd be going through a lot of cars! I don't hate my Grenadier - not even close. I just want to give a representation that the average sales person might mention to a prospective buyer. The seat, however, is dry!
Ineos refuses to sell a service manual and insists you must phone their service department in case of breakdown. Good luck with that when you are 300 km into the backcountry! Not a smart company….
Thanks for commenting on this. I'm going to investigate.
@@MyAutomobileObsession Please share your findings. Thanks