D&D Fighting Styles Ranked for the Echo Knight 5e
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- Опубліковано 9 лют 2025
- D&D Fighting Styles Ranked for the Echo Knight 5e
Nerdarchy ranks fighting style in 5e D&D for the echo knight subclass from the Explorer's Guide to Wildemount by Matt Mercer and Critical Role. We look at all the fighting styles for the fighter D&D character class.
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If you've ever ran in the dark where you can only see ten feet around yourself, you know it's dangerous. I've done night hikes with and without red lights. You're moving half speed if you're lucky.
When I played an Echo Knight I loved Great Weapon Fighting with a maul (2d6 so better odds of changing those low numbers and getting better overall damage) and the Crusher feat. Crusher worked really well because you can have the echo weave through the battlefield and "unstick" allies from enemies so they could gain some distance or post up yourself (or echo) near a friendly caster and have them move an opponent with an opportunity attack to hopefully not let them get into melee range with the squishies (add Sentinel feat to improve). Also if an enemy is near an environmental hazard the echo can easily run over and try to smack them into it.
It sounds like your Echo Knight makes for a solid anti-caster, especially if you gave it Mage Slayer. That sounds like a pretty groovy build 👍🏻
@@fightingfalcon777 Echos are great for hunting mages in general since they don't trigger opportunity attacks and cover a lot of distance. You can summon them with a bonus action 15 feet away (if I remember correctly) and have them move 30 to smack a caster plus if you move before summoning that's even more distance. Sure the echo will disappear if it's too far away from you (at end of turn) but you can just do it again next turn if need be but by that next turn you'll probably be close enough for the echo to stick around and keep the mage locked down. It's also great how if the echo is attacked by the mage then it's no real loss and the mage basically wasted his attack that turn. Definitely one of my favorite classes I've played that can give you a lot of tactical options in a turn.
We've got a feat vid coming soon as well.
Nerdarchist Dave
The Crusher feat is a great idea. I’ve seen a lot of builds that take advantage of the echo to build up damage, but not as many that truly work with the battlefield mobility. Teleporting into your echo and then shoving something away from a squishy is a great way to work with your team.
I’m also thinking Alert, and a really high competence with grapple checks. Dragging enemies around the battlefield sounds like fun especially if someone has set up an AoE.
For RP I don’t think I would want my guy running full speed with only 10ft of vision. IRL if you’re running as fast as you can and only notice a cliff when it’s 10 feet away you’d go flying. However RAW characters can stop on a dime immediately when they see it, no reaction time or forward momentum.
I might require athletics or acrobatics checks.
Nerdarchist Dave
Blind fighting with echo knight make a way to make roleplay more interesting. You could be at anywhere doing alot of thing while you in your echo doing some other thing in the dark.
So, with blind fighting, an eldritch knight with find familiar could be able to fight in melee while scouting with their familiar? 🤔 I may have some brewing to do with a warlock or wizard that has the fighter initiate feat...
I think Warlock with Pact of Chain would work for that
@@castbet9183 if you take the fighting initiate feat. EK gets the fighting style naturally.
I think if you’re using blind fighting and trying to walk while you have your echo well I do think you will be moving a half speed because you can only see that 10 feet around you and of course you do have your party members with you most likely but especially if we consider where you are things can always move around so for example creatures so yes the echoe already scouted it out but something could’ve moved so it’s better to move at the half movement speed for safety reasons and also it makes it a little bit more balance for the DM😁👍
The fun part of the Echo Knight is that if you are a Vengeance Paladin/Echo Knight multiclass, you are playing a Dark Knight from Final Fantasy XIV. (Lore-wise, they are Oath of Vengeance Paladins buy at high level they gain an Echo, thus the Fighter multiclass in 5e.)
An echo knight with unarmed fighting makes a mean professional wrestler style character who is his own tag team partner
For flavor you can use some of Noob Saibot's moves from Mortal Kombat.
Love to see a rune knight. I’m gonna be playing one in a couple weeks
I play an Ancestral Guardian Barbarian/Rune Knight Fighter multiclass in a game, and the Rune Knight has become my favorite Fighter subclass. It is so much fun, you’re gonna have a fun time with it
We might just have to take a look at that. The fighting style vids are fun. It also depends on the subclass. We don't want to do a bunch of videos that are the same.
Nerdarchist Dave
I hike at night with a headlamp. I definitely go slower than I do during the day. Off of a known trail, half would be reasonable. And, of course, I'm obviously not worried about being attacked by monsters or bandits that I can't see on the trail ahead of me. That would probably slow me down a bit more...
The idea of grabbing enimies and a second me comes back to punch them in the face is the best way to fight in D&d it's everything I wanted sense mortal combat 2 with noob sibot! 😂
it's not that you're only seeing 'back there' it's the reaction time to seeing something suddenly only 10ft away. Like a deer jumping out into your headlights while driving at night. During the day you'd see him coming but at night you don't have the time to react.
Me, inspired by Cleric Corner's reflavoring of echo knight as a turret/automaton controller along with a multi of artillerist artificer: *chuckles nervously.*
There is another interaction for you to consider. My character in Tomb of Annihilation is a Bugbear Echo Knight so I can be in magical darkness and be a one person defence line as my blind fighting allows me to threaten a 20’ wide corridor with my echo.
I love you guys content and your approach to the topics y'all pick. You've helped me build characters and roleplay for years and i am really grateful for that. If it is okay to ask, Would you ever do a video on holy characters that aren't paladins and clerics? Like a better themed(or built) favored soul sorcerer? A religious druid? A prayerful Ranger? A devout Rogue?
And hey there are 0 videos on Pact of the Blade and Pact of the Talisman Celestial Warlock. Would you guys ever be willing do something like that?
I once asked about the all bard group and that video was incredible. Thank you again. I really do need to join the patreon.
I'm intrigued by the religious character concept.
Nerdarchist Dave
Perfect timing. I will be playing an echo knight in September. So thanks I guess
Normal movement 30' with a dex save every turn to avoid tripping. Higher save when going farther in one movement turn
currently playing a Barbarian/fighter (6/2). He's built as an unarmed grappler. was just infected with lycanthropy (werebear) two weeks ago. Planning to be an Echo Knight when third level fighter gets here. one plan I have is to grapple and prone an enemy, suspend the echo 30' above me at the end of my turn. Next turn, move echo another 30' up, switch places with the echo and come off the top turnbuckle at 60' with an atomic Werebear Elbow, followed by my normal attacks. What do you think?
That's great!
Nerdarchist Dave
How did this play out?
@@k2k4 Spectacularly! It was a Beautiful thing. 13 points bludgeoning dmg on my move phase. I did, however, need to reestablish my grapple on the next turn.
I actually have 2 weapon fighting on my echo knight but I rarely used my teleport only to support the back or change priority worked well
You only need a bonus action to summon the Echo and to teleport with it. Once its summoned, it stays summond until destroyed or until you dismiss it.
With that in mind, two weapon fighting so that you can still deal as much damage with an off hand weapon is really good for melting bosses.
Lv 20 echo knight can get 10 attacks in 1 turn, not counting bonus actions. Which means, 22 attacks in the first 2 rounds of combat.
Team Ted
So, 10 ft moves with you. Okay, you try running at full speed, but only looking at the ground so you can only see 3 stride infront of you. Can you do it? Yes, in a very familiar environment.
People trip and fall having perfect vision, but now you are driving your car through thick fog. Sure it's fine for a while, then BAM the car in front of you came outta nowhere.
the wording for manifest echo is manifest an echo of yourself in an unoccupied space YOU CAN SEE., blind fighting is You have blindsight with a range of 10 feet. Within that range, you can effectively see anything that isn't behind total cover, even if you're blinded or in darkness. this makes blind fighting almost must pick for an echo knight
I kind of worry about things getting unbalanced. If the game turns into long sessions of “I send my echo on ahead while the party waits to see what I encounter” then that may not play well in the long run.
I like it. Move with a normal pace and not run into anything, but you're still deaf, so someone could still sneak up on you. Counter to that is to be surrounded by your party. Nerds rule ❤
2:00 this might be a bit overcritical, but as an echo knight, I would always have my echo with me to free up my bonus action on the first round of combat.
Gonna be using an unarmed warforge echo knight with crusher to bop enemies around the map. His echo is his ejected endo skeleton 😅 might merge in some monk levels too
As a DM, I'd rule that your senses are in the echo, except that you can still feel. I would allow the player to use blindsight to sense changes around them (such as sudden movement or smells), but they would still be unable to sense other things. Effectively they have 3rd edition blindsense while in this state. But I can see how you may interprete the rules differently, given blindsight doesn't specify how you're seeing while blind. As a player, absolutely i can double move while blinded and deafened and i won't accept any other results from my DM. ;-)
Blind fighting movement when walking should be fine, but if running, you should be at disadvantage as you are for all perception checks when not moving at half speed.
Would tunnel fighter be viable if you used something like a glaive?
30feet in 6 seconds is a reasonable fast walking speed you can definetly react to walls and other stuff 10 feet infront of you
Thoughts on a echo knight gunslinger with a theme of radiant magic?
Are playing at ecco knight barbarian. Reckless attack works much better when they can't get to you. I have boots and flying but also playing a medium armor flying race like a tiefling would rock
If a PC is relying on Blindsight, I would cap their movement at 10ft.
Normally time is the issue,but now I would rule it is distance.
Move at normal pace, the argument that it's half pace because one wasn't paying attention and ran into thing applies to non-blinded good visibility if NOT paying attention. If you are scout etc. you are very specifically paying attention.
I thought the rulebook basically said you are in a meditative state and that's why you're blinded. Like blind fighting might be able to make your body see but definitely can't move
Sorry I don’t understand the last part is your echo blind or does being near your echo make you blind or does the fighting style make you blind?
The fighting style gives you blind sight 10'. At 7th level you can transfer your consciousness to your echo seeing and hearing though your echo. Your body is blinded and deafened, but technically would still have blind sight. A side it's been awhile since we made this video so I'm not sure 100% what we said at that time.
Nerdarchist Dave
What about tunnel fighter for unlimited reactions..?
The sight moves with you but you have way less time to react to things infront of you. So it would be hard to run at full tilt. That said I would just give them dex saves if they encounter any major abstruction.
Am I the only one planning a two weapon fighting dual wielding echo knight?
Everyday upon wake up summon echo so the initial bonus action is only used for remanifesting destroyed echos and for teleporting to either get yourself out of danger or to get to an ally to assist them.
Also using 1 attack to have echo grapple or shove flying enemies to ground then using leftover attacks possibly with advantage.
RAW your echo can't grapple. If it could you could make it grapple yourself and fly
@@Dighpo The echo can be used to grapple: from Manifest Echo: "When you take the Attack action on your turn, any attack you make with that action can originate from your space or the echo's space.", from Grapple: "When you want to grab a creature or wrestle with it, you can use the Attack action to make a special melee attack, a grapple." So for starters, you can use the echo to grapple.
The next problem is the Grappled condition, as you note: "The condition also ends if an effect removes the grappled creature from the reach of the grappler or grappling effect" notice the use of the word "removes"?
Remove means: "take (something) away or off from the position occupied." or "abolish or get rid of." The question is, has the grappled creature been removed from the reach of the grappler or grappling effect? From my reading, no. The grappled creature was never within your reach, therefore it could not be "removed" from reach. Alternately, if Manifest Echo is a vehicle for a "grappling effect", then the grappled creature has remained within reach of the grappling effect.
After playing one, can't attack once grappling someone since it's essentially up holding then via your echo, but can still grapple it with echo.
I think you could still move at normal pace, dashing might cause issues depending on the environment
As a runner and more importantly a guide to blind runners. Yes you could run while blinded.
If you’re deafened you can still use blind fighting?
Yes. Doesn't say anything about being hearing dependant.
Nerdarchist Dave
@@Nerdarchy blind fighting gives tremor sense confirmed
Since the round is 6 seconds, moving the full 30 feet would give you 2 or maybe 3 seconds to register wjat you are approaching and passing. So you would be at risk of stepping over a ledge or running into an obstacle. Also you would have very little time to notice anything on the edge of the path before it was out of range, so poor scouting technique
The echo is doing the scouting you are just following to keep it ranging further out.
Nerdarchist Dave
Have a fellow party member lead your horse
You can "see" 10 feet of you... sure.... but will you be able to react quick enough to notice the 50 feet cliffside drop and stop your movement, IGNORING all laws of physics by saying "screw you momentum"?
Im about to play a strixhaven echo knight. We’re doing some homebrew so I can also get ‘tunnel fighter’… muwahahaha
If you're taking a Strixhaven background on echo knight consider taking two or more levels of war wizard to make use of the bonus spell list. It's amazing how much versatility fighters get out of the first 2 levels of war wizard.
full pace
Echo Knight is currently the only official subclass I don't allow in my campaigns. I feel as if it is a little too poorly set in the book, and I don't care to spend the time fixing it, given all the other options. So far it has not been an issue, and I would probably work with a player who was heart set on it, but I just feel like it is too convoluted as written.
When I asked my DM if I could play one I pretty much opened with a nerf option and that was that the echo couldn't be summoned or move freely in the air (since it says "any direction"). Never really seemed broken with that nerf though they are pretty crazy against a single enemy especially with a feat like Sentinel.
The things i think are too powerful about it are the unlimited resources. That's my opinion anyways. So limit the number of teleports to your fighter level, limit the number of echoes you can manifest to con mod plus proficiency bonus per short test, but i think give the echo half your hp rounded down instead of just one and make it able to be hit with conditions and able to make special attacks for you (such as grapple). I'm sure there's minutia to be considered but changing it to this would really bring it down to a more manageable level in my opinion.
I really think that instead of you BANING AN ENTIRE SUBCLASS, you could set the things that you think are not properly set in the book for example "The Echo can fly or not?" you know? You are the DM in the end of the day, i dont think something like "oh i dont understand this book so i will burn it" will solve anything