Oh I loved this interview and have it saved somewhere. It was awesome!! Zappa rules! So sad he is no longer with us. What a great loss! Thank you for posting this! Great how he pings back about 'morality in terms of behavior not in terms of theology!'
A great statement by Frank and one of the take aways from the show. The rest of the cast seemed to miss that as the subject changed. It's an odd thread with replies 14 years apart!
It is now 2019 and, when Zappa mentions "fascist theocracy" at 0:11, I get a whiff of Nostradamus because that's where the current administration desperately wants to go. Zappa says it in 1986, and he nails it.
Anybody else notice how the camera zooms in whenever John Loftan is about to make a statement? It did this in part 1 too. I wonder what the producers were trying to do there.
how comical is too see how just little less than twenty years people were laughing to the possibility of a theocracy, laugh now, we have it over our heads.
That John Lofton is a serious example how close-minded you can get if you have such fanatic beliefs in something that oppresses something else. He just mumbles on and on, giving out nothing to catch on and to think about. And the same situation is happening in this century too.
I agree with what Zappa is saying. You can put anything out there but you don't have to listen to it. No one is making you. He's just stating that people have free will to do as they please. If only more people knew that
These guys are bitchin' about "bad" words and censorship and then fast forward take a look at music today.. Rap music is hugely popular and has exploded as a genre. Just take some time to listen to those lyrics. It makes this argument seem pretty funny.
I wonder if Lofton WANTED TO BE HATED? Could he not understand that, while he spouted hate at Frank, and Frank was all cool and well mannered, that Lofton's behavior was something NOT TO BE CONDONED? And at the beginning of this clip Lofton suggested that he himself "found it difficult" to control kids as they became adults? How perverse. And Lofton also said he "wanted to control other families and was worried about other families;" but he could "control" his own. Again, how insulting.
What's funny here is we talk about freedom of speech in a censored comments section. It's really irritating not to be able to read some comments, as stupid as they might be. So, in a way, we're proving Zappa was right back then. It should be taken as a lesson for the present and the future. Some of the out of the box, borderline, shocking ideas of today are the mainstream ideas of tomorrow, examples are countless.
Interestingly, that's UA-cam's decision, not the governments. Company's that allow the general public to use their platforms get to make their own policies and decide what's appropriate for their platform. the government doesn't really have a direct part in. Maybe somewhat, I think it's illegal to threaten people and stuff like that, but beyond that, UA-cam can censor what it wants because they make the terms and conditions that we agree to when we make an account. They have community guidelines and they run their platforms based on what they think is right along with what's already law. After all, the people who own UA-cam make those decisions, for a number of reasons. If you agree to their rules you get to have an account
@@jordanestes1997 You know what? I kind of agree with you now. Their platform, their rules, as long as it respects the law. And if said law is unfair, it should be modified. I think the uploader of the video also has some moderation rights in the comments as well though, so it’s not only up to the platform (I didn’t say so myself though). That being said, I still think that we should be careful about it, and not muffle freedom of speech too much based on current mainstream way of thinking/conformism. Some things are probably downright wrong, some others are probably just opinions. Anyhow, reading past comments and reactions to those today is illuminating about how to navigate these kind of issues. So thanks for your reply!
@Pierre Jean Parra I wasn't really defending it, more so just saying the internet makes the issue kind of different than just government regulation. Recently UA-cam has been demonetizing videos that use certain words, if you say certain words in a video, youtube won't pay you. so content creators are encouraged to do self censorship in a way, to ensure they get paid by the platform, and that has everything to do with what advertisers want, not even UA-cam. Brands don't want their products advertised on certain "bad videos" and since UA-cam makes a lot of its money from advertising, they basically make it where if you hurt youtubes money with certain content, they'll hurt you. They bend to the will of what the advertisers want because that's who pays them, so now censorship isn't only about morality but just straight up money. It's like it doesn't even matter the context or the content, if you say a certain word, you're video won't make ad revenue, it's frustrating
It's too bad that John Lofton never realized his full potential and started a business that focused on the production of scarecrows. He's just so good at creating strawmen.
Lofton's attitude was seething with such self-righteousness it almost made you want to puke! He goes rambling on about the kids not even knowing the meaning of life and dogging out Zappa for ecouraging kids to vote and run for office. Lofton had no faith in the youth. Zappa did. Who would motivate them more? Certainly Zappa.
we're talking about words.. words, not an actual action, but words. then there's A . Iverson Practice, we're talking about practice, not the actual game, but practice😂 funniest thing of all is that they're both right
Please tell me John Lofton is dead. If he's not i don't want to live in a world where Frank Zappas is gone but that tubby facist who just compared Van Halen to Adolph Hitler still waddling around.
0:15 Looks like Frank was right (I'm almost glad he isn't around today to see just how much like a fascist theocracy we've become)... I think he deserves a posthumous apology.
@ballbellyswaller : You need to check it again, bud. Frank was NEVER racist OR sexist. He may have said some things in a racist or sexist context, but he did so only to show the stupidity in such viewpoints. It's called "satire", and actually serves as a political statement AGAINST such stupidity. Furthermore, being "foulmouthed" is the right of every american, as per the Constitution of the United States of America. It's called free speech.
Cristian Bustos Look, ad hominem is not how you refute someone. If you have a problem with his arguments, point them out. I have seen nothing wrong with them so far.
+Ben Thrasher 3 subjective fallacies for a start: the undressing teacher video with sexual content should not be banned (or it's are alright, whatever) because "I find it amusing". Aha... And then "why is that amusing?"; "why shouldn't be that amusing?", Zappa replies (the argument being (???). Then he says it's amusing only "to the people who like the concept". So, just because it's good for him and a small crowd (and it helps him to sale records), is got to be accepted by everybody. Jumm. Very argumentative...
Cristian Bustos You need to organize your comment with spaces. I can't tell where a thought begins and ends. You are the one who has a subjective fallacy. Our country has a very specific basis upon which laws are to be made. Over time, we have evolved to be more and more caring of civil rights. It is a right of a person to be able to purchase whatever kind of media they want. Using your moral code to define what others can and cannot consume is fascist. That is what Zappa is saying. To be clear, they asked his opinion. So his saying "I find it amusing" is really just his opinion. His opinion has nothing to do with the subject, though. Zappa never says it needs to be accepted by everybody. If you don't want it, don't buy it. If you were to say that "Hot for Teacher" shouldn't be played (especially in video form) in public places, I'm sure you could make a solid argument for that because it is unequivocally being pushed on people who may not want it. I'm sure that Mr. Zappa would have agreed, even. But to ban the song entirely on your moral basis is wrong. Some people like it. If you don't want your children to listen to it, that's your prerogative. Just don't shove your convictions down other people's throat.
Frank was brilliant, but reflecting back upon this at a much later age I have to say that he actually was the Jack a $$ in this. He talks about freedom, thinking outside the box, etc. and they call him an anarchist. Fact is, it really is easier and less creative to think "outside the box" and complain about the "system" than it is to try and create and maintain a system that so many people are constantly trying to pull apart. Its easy to point out the flaws in the system, but good luck trying to create a new one with all of those same people trying to pull it apart all the time. Tear down what exists with a bunch of good idea fairies, and lets see if they can agree on a new set of rules where people actually work together in a meaningful way. Yeah right...
it's really annoying how every time frank is about to finish the point he's trying to make, john lofton has to butt in, interupt him and change the subject. it seems like he doesn't even listen to frank at all. he constantly refers to the music frank makes/supports as 'garbage/trash'... pulls ad hominem attacks out of his ass and just insults everything frank zappa has to say. it seems that john has no intention of listening to frank, but every intention of making frank look dumb.
"why should I smile when I'm sitting here with you"... man Zappa was awesome.
Just watched 2nd Presidential debate... People like Frank Zappa are deeply missed in times like these
"You mean both, or in combination?" LOL, classic Frank.
I miss Frank...the biggest mistake anyone ever made was to underestimate him.
I swear, if this was an RPG game, Frank Zappa just became a 12th level wizard in the magical art of denouncing ignorantly self-entitled pricks
John Lofton almost made my head explode.
He got his crap shoved down his own throat by Zappa THE MAN.
His Fascist Theocracy prediction is so on the ball ...
Oh I loved this interview and have it saved somewhere. It was awesome!!
Zappa rules! So sad he is no longer with us. What a great loss! Thank you for posting this!
Great how he pings back about 'morality in terms of behavior not in terms of theology!'
A great statement by Frank and one of the take aways from the show. The rest of the cast seemed to miss that as the subject changed. It's an odd thread with replies 14 years apart!
Morality in government...too funny
In no way were these fools prepared for Frank's intelligence.
It is now 2019 and, when Zappa mentions "fascist theocracy" at 0:11, I get a whiff of Nostradamus because that's where the current administration desperately wants to go. Zappa says it in 1986, and he nails it.
Frank is such a goddamn intellectual powerhouse that he appears psychic. He could see the progession way back then that we are now in, in 2023. Damn.
Fantastic, thx for posting it!
frank - cool calm collected, well informed brilliant ahead of his time.
so far ahead of time
...Yes Mr. Zappa
So weird to hear them talk about such an iconic song and video like Hot for Teacher in terms of it being brand new. Haha that just made me geek out
Anybody else notice how the camera zooms in whenever John Loftan is about to make a statement? It did this in part 1 too. I wonder what the producers were trying to do there.
I feel really, really fucking sorry for John Lofton's kids. Jesus that childhood must have sucked balls.
And now here we are 2021...
i like how proud of himself he looked after he said "i can't smile, i'm here with you"
Lofton has the audacity to suggest that he knows the meaning of life, wow.
how comical is too see how just little less than twenty years people were laughing to the possibility of a theocracy, laugh now, we have it over our heads.
That John Lofton is a serious example how close-minded you can get if you have such fanatic beliefs in something that oppresses something else. He just mumbles on and on, giving out nothing to catch on and to think about. And the same situation is happening in this century too.
The only actual point they made he absolutely fucking demolished, I love him
I agree with what Zappa is saying. You can put anything out there but you don't have to listen to it. No one is making you. He's just stating that people have free will to do as they please. If only more people knew that
These were the most awkward 20 minutes of my life.
smart, if you dont interrupt him every mid-sentence you may run the danger of allowing a coherent thought to be expressed
Nailed it.
9:31
Yes. Yes they are.
These guys are bitchin' about "bad" words and censorship and then fast forward take a look at music today.. Rap music is hugely popular and has exploded as a genre. Just take some time to listen to those lyrics. It makes this argument seem pretty funny.
Zappa was brilliant. Today kids got Miley Cyrus and Kanye.
That guy next to Zappa looks like Bubbles from the trailer park boys?
Brilliant.....
What' are the names of the songs played on the commercial
I wonder if Lofton WANTED TO BE HATED? Could he not understand that, while he spouted hate at Frank, and Frank was all cool and well mannered, that Lofton's behavior was something NOT TO BE CONDONED? And at the beginning of this clip Lofton suggested that he himself "found it difficult" to control kids as they became adults? How perverse. And Lofton also said he "wanted to control other families and was worried about other families;" but he could "control" his own. Again, how insulting.
lol this is a very funny debate..:) one of the best ive seen so far..
The way that smarmy tub of lard says "Other peoples children" makes me want to break something.
Out of time? More like out of arguments to make
I think Frank Zappa's head is hurting from all the stupidity of these people because my head is hurting too lol
RIP Frank.
If you are in favor of censorship, then you prove his argument.
holy hell!
You think freedom is the answer?!
5:55 Godwin's Law
I was hot for teacher....Home ed. blonde sweater puppies oh momma.
***** Mrs. Leslie! Yum! Of course I was only 15.
What's funny here is we talk about freedom of speech in a censored comments section. It's really irritating not to be able to read some comments, as stupid as they might be.
So, in a way, we're proving Zappa was right back then. It should be taken as a lesson for the present and the future. Some of the out of the box, borderline, shocking ideas of today are the mainstream ideas of tomorrow, examples are countless.
Interestingly, that's UA-cam's decision, not the governments. Company's that allow the general public to use their platforms get to make their own policies and decide what's appropriate for their platform. the government doesn't really have a direct part in. Maybe somewhat, I think it's illegal to threaten people and stuff like that, but beyond that, UA-cam can censor what it wants because they make the terms and conditions that we agree to when we make an account. They have community guidelines and they run their platforms based on what they think is right along with what's already law. After all, the people who own UA-cam make those decisions, for a number of reasons. If you agree to their rules you get to have an account
@@jordanestes1997 You know what? I kind of agree with you now. Their platform, their rules, as long as it respects the law. And if said law is unfair, it should be modified. I think the uploader of the video also has some moderation rights in the comments as well though, so it’s not only up to the platform (I didn’t say so myself though). That being said, I still think that we should be careful about it, and not muffle freedom of speech too much based on current mainstream way of thinking/conformism. Some things are probably downright wrong, some others are probably just opinions.
Anyhow, reading past comments and reactions to those today is illuminating about how to navigate these kind of issues. So thanks for your reply!
@Pierre Jean Parra I wasn't really defending it, more so just saying the internet makes the issue kind of different than just government regulation. Recently UA-cam has been demonetizing videos that use certain words, if you say certain words in a video, youtube won't pay you. so content creators are encouraged to do self censorship in a way, to ensure they get paid by the platform, and that has everything to do with what advertisers want, not even UA-cam. Brands don't want their products advertised on certain "bad videos" and since UA-cam makes a lot of its money from advertising, they basically make it where if you hurt youtubes money with certain content, they'll hurt you. They bend to the will of what the advertisers want because that's who pays them, so now censorship isn't only about morality but just straight up money. It's like it doesn't even matter the context or the content, if you say a certain word, you're video won't make ad revenue, it's frustrating
@Pierre Jean Parra but of course if people don't give a shit about making money from their UA-cam videos, they have more freedom in what they say
It's too bad that John Lofton never realized his full potential and started a business that focused on the production of scarecrows. He's just so good at creating strawmen.
zappa owned that shit!
john lofton is pissing me off
Lofton's attitude was seething with such self-righteousness it almost made you want to puke! He goes rambling on about the kids not even knowing the meaning of life and dogging out Zappa for ecouraging kids to vote and run for office. Lofton had no faith in the youth. Zappa did. Who would motivate them more? Certainly Zappa.
we're talking about words.. words, not an actual action, but words.
then there's A . Iverson
Practice, we're talking about practice, not the actual game, but practice😂 funniest thing of all is that they're both right
You can tell Zaps cancer was going on at this point.
Which of the four pixels is Frank Zappa?
Bubbles is way too cool to be compared to that guy lol.
Please tell me John Lofton is dead. If he's not i don't want to live in a world where Frank Zappas is gone but that tubby facist who just compared Van Halen to Adolph Hitler still waddling around.
0:15 Looks like Frank was right (I'm almost glad he isn't around today to see just how much like a fascist theocracy we've become)... I think he deserves a posthumous apology.
@CadicusTheDamned No, he really ought to get a lobotomy instead.
*point of order* He mentioned Hitler. He loses the debate. Zappa wins. I don't make the rules, I just follow them.
@ballbellyswaller :
You need to check it again, bud. Frank was NEVER racist OR sexist. He may have said some things in a racist or sexist context, but he did so only to show the stupidity in such viewpoints. It's called "satire", and actually serves as a political statement AGAINST such stupidity. Furthermore, being "foulmouthed" is the right of every american, as per the Constitution of the United States of America. It's called free speech.
2018 look around describe what you saw for the last 18 years mmmmmm
A fascist theocracy has come true. He had it right in 1986.
Clearly, Zappas music is better than his arguments! He looks like he is swallowing pepper pebbles!
+Cristian Bustos I think that what you're seeing is him choking down copious amounts of rage.
bah! never, he is clearly in a pigeon hole! His arguments are actually really lame!
Cristian Bustos Look, ad hominem is not how you refute someone. If you have a problem with his arguments, point them out. I have seen nothing wrong with them so far.
+Ben Thrasher 3 subjective fallacies for a start: the undressing teacher video with sexual content should not be banned (or it's are alright, whatever) because "I find it amusing". Aha... And then "why is that amusing?"; "why shouldn't be that amusing?", Zappa replies (the argument being (???). Then he says it's amusing only "to the people who like the concept". So, just because it's good for him and a small crowd (and it helps him to sale records), is got to be accepted by everybody. Jumm. Very argumentative...
Cristian Bustos You need to organize your comment with spaces. I can't tell where a thought begins and ends.
You are the one who has a subjective fallacy. Our country has a very specific basis upon which laws are to be made. Over time, we have evolved to be more and more caring of civil rights. It is a right of a person to be able to purchase whatever kind of media they want.
Using your moral code to define what others can and cannot consume is fascist. That is what Zappa is saying. To be clear, they asked his opinion. So his saying "I find it amusing" is really just his opinion. His opinion has nothing to do with the subject, though.
Zappa never says it needs to be accepted by everybody. If you don't want it, don't buy it. If you were to say that "Hot for Teacher" shouldn't be played (especially in video form) in public places, I'm sure you could make a solid argument for that because it is unequivocally being pushed on people who may not want it. I'm sure that Mr. Zappa would have agreed, even.
But to ban the song entirely on your moral basis is wrong. Some people like it. If you don't want your children to listen to it, that's your prerogative. Just don't shove your convictions down other people's throat.
Frank was brilliant, but reflecting back upon this at a much later age I have to say that he actually was the Jack a $$ in this. He talks about freedom, thinking outside the box, etc. and they call him an anarchist. Fact is, it really is easier and less creative to think "outside the box" and complain about the "system" than it is to try and create and maintain a system that so many people are constantly trying to pull apart. Its easy to point out the flaws in the system, but good luck trying to create a new one with all of those same people trying to pull it apart all the time.
Tear down what exists with a bunch of good idea fairies, and lets see if they can agree on a new set of rules where people actually work together in a meaningful way. Yeah right...
Did you listen to the whole thing?
@@CadicusTheDamned Admittedly no, but I've listened to him many times, long time fan actually. Brilliant man no doubt.
it's really annoying how every time frank is about to finish the point he's trying to make, john lofton has to butt in, interupt him and change the subject. it seems like he doesn't even listen to frank at all. he constantly refers to the music frank makes/supports as 'garbage/trash'... pulls ad hominem attacks out of his ass and just insults everything frank zappa has to say.
it seems that john has no intention of listening to frank, but every intention of making frank look dumb.
You work out way to much!