UDIMs - Modelling and Texturing Essentials
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- Опубліковано 29 вер 2024
- In this video tutorial, we talk about UDIMs and why they are important. We cover the theory of how it works and production tips from the VFX field.
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Hi, I am a student and in games you have this problem too. I used to deal with it by applying multiple Materials (Shaders) for one object.
Great Video!
Hey! That's what I used to do too before I learn about UDIMs too. It's pretty cumbersome though when it comes to objects where you need to have multiple shaders, like for this crocodile. UDIMs solves this really elegantly.
/H
Using multiple materials has nothing to do with working with udims... the trick here is to get more texture space, not to divide uvs into several parts... no matter how many materials you use, you cant divide uvs the way its done using udims.
I guess this has changed, since UDIM's are used in the game industry. Actually I am working in the game industry and I was using UDIM's 3-4 years ago.
the answer i was looking for. thanks for letting us know!
Mind blown.
Hey mates you're doing great.
Love the videos keep it up!
Thanks a lot!
But doesn't that mean you need to have a lowpoly as your zbrush lowest sub? So at some point you need to retopo your mesh, bring it into zbrush, project/split, or split/project
OK, question here. I'm the Substance user but recently got an asset that contains over two hundred of UDIMs. And substance started to be very lagy. And to be honest, painting between UDIMs is a truggle. Or just impossible in Substence. So for that case can anyone tell if Mari is better solution? I'm asking because I have no experioence using Mari yet. THANKS!!!
What is your opinion on PTEX? I don't hear much about it anymore.
Hey! Essentially, it's not used at all, at least not in film. I've never seen it used anywhere outside of tech-demos. Maybe it's practical, but I don't see why it's more useful than UVs - as it really doesn't take take a whole lot of time to UV map a character, at least not compared to the potential hassle of using something like ptex.
I'd be curious to hear if anyone has actually used it successfully!
/H
Same here! From what I know Pixar worked with Autodesk to develop it. But I feel like us and the rest of the world use ZBrush not Mudbox. I'd like to try it out one of these days. It seems like its been in development for ages.
It was actually developed at Disney, and I believed they used it on some of their movies (Bolt, at least), I'm unsure if it's used anymore. Having UVs is just so practical in a lot of ways, as you can up-res your textures, use them for selection sets, transfer stuff between meshes, etc - plus it's really the first step at texturing. A good UV layout can speed up your work SO much while texturing. Imagine you need to texture teeth and you're smart about it. You now only texture a single tooth and copy the textures across all of them. I'm not even sure how this would be possible with PTEX.
Hope this sheds some light on it from a film-perspective :)
/H
Have you used Unfold3D for UV's guys?
+FlippedNormals I hadn't thought about that.
+Tritoon710 nope but I just checked out their promo video and it looks freaking sweet. "Rent to own" is awesome. Have you tried it?
Ferdinand looked a bit shy
Hi guys. Do you use Maya to arrange your uvs like this? I guess some of them are flipped. Thank you.
Yes, we use Maya for this. We'll cover specifically how to make a good UDIM layout in the future. Don't look too much at the UDIM layout in this video, as it can be improved a lot from here.
H
Thanks! I hope it comes soon :) Ive always arranged my uvs by hand. I see a lot of people use symmetrical uvs so patches can be copied and pasted. I guess it speeds up texturing a lot.
We'll show specifically how we prefer to work with UDIMs from a speed point of view, where symmetry is a major part :) It will probably be out in a few weeks or so.
Great! Symmetry is nice :)
Besides the fact you spend the first third of the video talking about the layout and numbering format for UDIMs-- you never get around to explaining the WHAT and more importantly the WHY. I couldn't watch this one to the end because it was clear from the beginning there was no real structure. PRO TIP: Start off with WHAT and WHY before diving into the details. Show a real example that makes it crystal clear WHAT UDIMs are and WHY and WHEN to use them. AND THEN... Dive into the details
Came here just because this is coming to blender 2.82 and agree with you completely..
UDIMs are VERY useful, especially for creatures that you want extreme details for... I normally work with game characters and I was intimidated by splitting my model's UVs into many shells, but when I tested it in Modo, it looked REALLY good up close...
It was an OK video, but I wish you had been a bit more focused in defining UDIMS and how they work instead of bouncing around and alibiing. It was well into the video before you noted that UDIMS pertained to resolution. I'm biased in that I was taught how to present material in the military: tell them what you want them to know, tell them the details, and then reinforce what you told them.
I did finally get the idea of UDIMS, but the same material could have been presented in 5 min instead of nearly 20 min.
Don't mean to be too critical. Just my personal impression.
But you can't fit 6-7 ads to five minutes video ;)
Very useful workflow but i didn`t understand how they create these kind of uvs. I thought that It is just move the island to another coordinates, but it is not.
i would be very much appreiated if you guys can make a tutorial of how to import udim multiple uvs map into zbrush.
Great stuff! These guys sound like Jason Bussby & Zak Parish from 3DBuzz. They produced great Maya stuff in 2005-2006, Jason (R.I.P) Zack now (Developer relations Technical artist) at Epic Games.
I don't want to be rude, but the video has like 3 sentences of actual content:
Udims are multiple textures for a single, split up model.
It gives you more resolution where you need it.
It's used professionally all the time.
I agree, most of their tutorials are like that. they not bad at all, but there is just too much talking
Thanks for saving 18 mins of my time!
I'm 8 minutes in an was getting frustrated lol. Thanks for saving me time.
I'm a bit late, but who cares. The Problem is they learned and took maybe 3 Years to learn there sh*t. So They will share in order to get views and attention, but they do not want to give everything away. I guess you can say.. they are teaching the same way they were taught. it is SAD, but very true. This is the same in almost any Subject on this Planet. "DRAG everything out" "Milk it"
@@itelludatruth4869 I care.
.... next a tutorial on the workflow and how to split a model??
We'll definitely do this at some point!
@@FlippedNormals Please do.. i will love to use UDIMS but i dont get the workflow
This video can be summed up as giving you more resolution, breaking up textures into multiple UV tiles and its used professionally. These two ramble and joke the rest of the way. No technical information is explained and there are no demonstrations of using UDIM's in game engines (you know...like brief overview's of how this would work in other engines, before actually making videos...). Except for a 18 minute demo of what a UDIM looks like, this video is just shy of useless.
Sad to say I got to 13 minutes before realising they were just rambling about shit.
My understanding is that UDIMs do not necessarily create more resolution-- after all you can always increase map sizes and you can also adjust models UVs so that higher detailed areas are represented with more map area. From what I can gather-- it's a good workflow tool-- helps with organization-- and also good for interoperability.
I’m sooooo glad unreal added udim support! I absolutely despise Maya’s uv set editor, so I will use udons whenever possible. Kinda dreading the time that I might have to use an engine that doesn’t take udims, because I’ve gotten so used to them that I would hate going back to traditional sets
Lol Maya has the best UV editor I've ever used
can you guys do a tutorial about how to buy a computer or desktop for this kind of work? i need a new one and would love tips on what to look for/recommendations
Um, I'm pretty sure Ferdinand is an alligator. Nope. Just checked. He's a croc. His snout is too narrow.
Nice video! :)
I have a question.
should I need to export Udims of combined modeling to substance paintet, if is separete model like robotic body?
thanks!
No problem!
5 years later, still no link for that symmetry they talked about..
Thank you guys and waiting for Mari tutorials :)
Yea, cant wait to do some Mari tutorials!
/H
can you do a little video about the difference between 3d coat, painter, & mari ? i never understood what's the difference between mari and the others
Unity is working on UDIM Materials. Check it out here blogs.unity3d.com/2017/08/01/multi-material-using-custom-inspectors-and-scriptable-objects-for-udim-materials/
Very nice! That's awesome to hear.
How about doing UDIMS in max?. My shit keeps on crashing
Damn you max.. damn you to hell! Lol
Hmmm - honestly Im not sure. Havent used Max in around 10 years :D
whats the difference using udims over a high res map. let say one 8k map vs two 4k maps
UDIMS simply refers to a system of UV'in.
Being able to spread detail across multiple maps.
For film it's not unusual to have betweem 20-100 UDIMS.
If you were to cram all that detail into one 8k or even 16k map, you would lose a lot of resolution
with this coming to blender, I started looking into this. Does this work in UE4?
I wish Marmoset Toolbag supported UDIMs
For sure!
please make a tutorial on how to make a symmetrical UVs like ( left and right leg of the crocodile )
and after that heading to mari , projecting your texture on 1 leg then coping that leg to the other ( symmetrical ) leg .
It's on our list!
Is there any tutorial for 3dsmax?
I have a question!!.. What is the difference if i projected from Textures in Zbrush not Mari ???
does that mean the resolution or number of polys of your model actually doesnt really matter in terms of
Great lesson! Udims are new to me and You explained the subject truly great! Thank You!
Thank you so much for this!!! i've worked for COD WWII and we used UDIMs for buildings. :) Mine had 5 though. You gotta have them for large objects. Am relearning this now.
So would you say it works very well for a modular workflow? I was thinking of using UDIM's for distant terrain.
I would like these two-ish questions answered if possible.
If you have many meshes in a single model, what advantage does udimming things have over separate UV maps? Is it a resource thing.
3D Coat can draw a UV that Substance can paint just by pushing a button. I combine some objects.
And if I have several identical items. Should I just uv one of them and copy or UV them together.
Both produce sufficent results. But which is better?
For example, it is better to have 1 2k map or 4 512 maps in terms of resources and render times. I'd guess the two k map would be lighter if you have like nine texture maps goin. But what do I know?
Oh and I use Redshift if that means anything.
The advantage is that you can have one shader assigned to the model instead of many. Imagine a spaceship with 10000 pieces. Now you can have one shader instead of 10000.
If you have several identical objects, its definitely a good idea to uv map just one and transfer it - or you can uv map it first then duplicate it. Up to you!
@@FlippedNormals Thanks for the fast and awesome reply.
great tutorial!, I would love to see more tuts about character look development and texturing.
Thanks Daniel! We'll definitely make more tutorials on texturing.
So essentially what you are saying is that pieces of the texture landscape are compartmentalized and loaded only as needed for a model if that portion of the model is close enough to camera to need it? Can the different squares (map sections) of the UDIM be different pieces of the same file? Do files (if used) have to be separate? Where is the compartmentalization stored and (memory in/out) happening specifically with a UDM?
Thanks for the vid! Hey, do you know the most up to date process in Blender for importing textures for multiple UDIMs?
When using NodeWrangler, is it common practice to have to select each image individually (baseCol, height, rough, etc) and add the requisite number of UDIMs? Seems like NodeWrangler would do this automatically. Am I doing something wrong?
I've got a character with 3 tiles (1001-1003) which has been textured in Substance Painter and I've got all my maps exported according to standard UDIM protocol, just need to get them all hooked up to my BSDF shader in Blender.
I'd rather not have to edit each image as I'm setting up a scene which will have dozens if not hundreds of image files in it.
Sorry, I know this isn't a Blender video, but I'm struggling to find the answers I need.
If you name your video "Essentials" people will expect filtered content with specific information instead of 20 min casual talk about some subject with a bunch of irrelevant data. That being said, still decent video on UDIMs subject and thank you for that.
Hello guys from 4 years ago :D
How would this model get those udims?
1. model in zbrush,
2. create a low model (retopology) based on highpoly
3. prepare uvs (udim) in 3d software (max, maya)
4 import to zbush, subdiv a couple times, project the highpoly onto the new mesh
5 follow this video?
did i miss anythig?
Thank you for sharing UDIMS, yes, a more in-depth use of the set numbers would be awesome.
We'll definitely going to be doing more videos on this in the future :) There's a video coming out next week showing how to work with ZBrush and Arnold for displacement maps where we show how to set up the file node to work with UDIMs in Maya.
Isn't uneven texel density will cause visible seams which hard to hide?
in general its good to have even textel density. especially for materials and patterns that will react different of they are not same ish
There's UDIM tricks for RT engines, but.... Acordingly to substance painter support website, its expensive on the hardware, but i guess it would depend on the situation. Vertex paint does search for multiple maps at once, so, having a draw call for 4k maps UDIM for an object, witch has all its info on one shader, and having a draw for 3 or 4 diferent textures on vertex paint seems to be the same thing to me. With UDIM one can actualy project all the texture info in a few UVs, and not have multi materials being combined. I'll try it when i have the time, but yeah its possible (map composite, and UV offset, 1rst goes U=0, 2nd goes U=1 etc, then plug on the shader), but seems a better aproach for the future. Vertex paint through masking is kinda a pain.
Haveing a single 20K UVMap costs less resources than five 4K UDIMs. Resolution is the same but you only have to handle a single file, not five.
UDIMs are made by people who have absolutely no technical background. They may be good designers but that's it.
Can anyone tell me full form of UDIM
Is it just a more comfortable way of working with textures? Cuz say in blender you always could just throw a copy of the same material on each uv island on the mesh and have everything piled up in the single area of the uv editor, but because each part has it's own material and image texture the model shows up correctly.
And now we have this comfortalbe way of organizing everything and automatically naming the files, saving and loading them and also you can use one material for the whole mesh vs. having like 10 of them for hands, arms, legs, body, face etc.
It would be nice if you guys stick to actually showing the fundamentals/concepts and leave the anecdotes. The video can be summed up in less than half the current length.
thank you, it was usefull
So, it's just a series of UV maps instead of one all-in-one?
Instead of applying a single texture map to your model, youre applying several, spread out over different udims. You reach a point where you just cant add more resolution to your maps, so adding more maps is better instead.
mistitled and misleading video
sorry guys when export my texture i get a lot image im working with udims how can i put all this image in my hipershade or how export the texture in mari? thanks
I am using Maya 2018, I couldn't find UDIM option in UV sets (UV editor). could you plz help me.
for max ?
thanks for the video...but
do I have to detach the model too or giving names to the parts??
and I want to know the workflow for unity plz get me link or some info about it...important
What's the max polycont can mari handle?
have used quite a lot polys in Mari on different shows. millions polys.
Games can use UDIMS if implemented. So far I don't think there is any that shipped with UDIMS but since game engines are becoming more popular for realtime rendering of films, they will start to support UDIMS more. Unity made a UDIM shader a while back that's available to the public, this is also possible in Unreal with some material magic but I haven't seen any official support/workflow from Unreal or any other big engines yet. Can't imagine Unreal being far behind with an official implementation especially with Unreal Studio coming. Then it will probably become popular in game engines because "Unreal"
Article about UDIM in unity - blogs.unity3d.com/2017/08/01/multi-material-using-custom-inspectors-and-scriptable-objects-for-udim-materials/
Polycount Forum UDIM in Unreal with Mat Magic - polycount.com/discussion/188423/udims-in-ue4
Awesome, thanks a lot for your insights - much appreciated.
You could shown how to set up the a textures in maya anyway. Uv tiling mode :)
We're doing this in a future video :) Didnt want this to be Maya specific.
waiting for this, thanks
of ti...cheers!
Life... No... Career saver and starter video!
Never taught this in college!
WTF!
SIR PLEASE SHARE MODEL
i cant subdivide as per udims in z brush...when i morph uv all uvs are coming together please help
what is the difference between uv slot and udim
A UDIM is just a way of describing a set of uvs that span across multiple UV squares. This is useful if you want more resolution than what can be cramped into one square.
I use UDIM'S in games .... another issue is keeping the UDIM's organised for the substance painter texture workflow
Hey, flipped normal I Wana ask a question , can a displacement map used in an animation.
If I understood right, all UDIM cells have the same resolution, the only thing that gets change is the scale of a certain region of the UV. Question: what if one region needs to be high res and the neighbor region can be low res, how to make seamless transition between these two regions in such a way that seams at the border of the regions will not be visible? For example, transition from the back of the crocodile to his leg. There are two UV sets.
Hey! While texturing, you can make different UDIMs be of different sizes, so one can be 1k and another 4k, depending on the need.
Hi. So what would be actually the workaround for video games. I am currently working on the jet engine drive.google.com/open?id=19iOaLHTcmvLdVDwoR4A4DHtxnoUEnoeI . I plan to put a lot of intricate details in height map on the surface of the engine. I actually thought about texturing with udims but now I am puzzled. Should I use 2 unique 4k maps instead? Thanks in advance!
What you can do is to have separate shaders and maps for the various parts. UDIMs are particularly useful when you have a model which can't be split up, like a character, but for something like your rocket (looks great btw!), multiple shaders and materials should work fine.
awesome information ....... thank you so much and please keep posting
You do great tutorials, but they aren't very... beginner-friendly. They rely heavily on switching between a number of expensive programs. I'd like to see you give an example of what can be done with a limited toolset when you're looking to get into the industry. Like in my case, I only have access to Photoshop and student license Maya, so maybe you could show what can be done with just those?
This is a great idea! Thanks a lot :)
Can you please do a tutorial on how to actually get a model from zbrush and export the uvs and maps as a UDIM uv set? that is ready to be open in another 3d package???????????? because i just cant get it to work and all of your "tutorials" are very uninformative just please make a clear concise tutorial on how to do this
Hey! If you import your OBJ into ZBrush with your UVs laid out, they will be like that in ZBrush, as it can read the UDIMs. If you export the model out again, the UDIM layout will be the same.
So udims are different texture assignments to different faces on the same model? I've seen that in games since the late 90s.
But they werent called UDIMS. I'm a bit confused as to what the difference is.
You are thinking about multi sub material. I’m also interested in this, is there a reason to use UDIMS instead of multisub ? The way I understand it, UDIMS have a very specific use, mostly in VFX where you have assets with hundreds of texture sets. I understand that multisub can get extremely hard to manipulate once you have dozens of materials. But unlike UDIMS, multisub works in every 3D software and game engine.
Can you guys do more advanced Mari tutorials. Thx
Back to the Future, Flipped Normals edition XD Awesome vid guys! I had no idea what UDIMs were!
Definitely create more vids on UDIMs especially for maya and Zbrush.
On our list! :)
fantastic as always, you two are awesome
Thanks Pedro! Much appreciated mate
Guys why is so hard to find good tutorials for MARI and RenderMan? Even though, both are well known programs.
Honestly, Im not sure. We are definitely planning on doing Mari tutorials in the future, though we have no current plans for talking about Renderman.
You can use UDIMs in Unity with Amplify Texture for couple years now
OK, thats great to hear. Thanks!
Thankksssss ! I don't have enough fingers to count how many super important things you learned me ^^
Happy to help!
How do you keep texel density across UDIM tiles Maya layout has issues with this is there some settings you can share to help with this?
William Parks you can layout all the uvs in the first udim to keep texel density and after that scale them up all together and move them manually across multiple udims.
The point is to scale them all together once the texel density is uniform but I don't know if maya can do it automatically.
Very informative but i still have a question: back in Maya how do you tell maya in wich Udim the specific Mesh has its UVS so that the correct texture gets assigned?
Do you have a tutorial on this ?
This is very simple: In Maya, you go to your file node, input any one of the textures in the UDIM sequence and then set the 'UV Tiling Mode' to 'UDIM (mari)'. Hope his helps!
hi, thanks for all what you do,
i have small question please, i want to do UVs for a car model, and i want to have equal res. all over the model, is there any way to do it specifically or i should just judge by eye depending on the texture quads size?
( im using 3ds max )
Hey, it's been way too long since I used Max, so honestly I cant remember. There are definitely tools to do this though. Do a search for Texel Density scripts, or something akin to that.
/H
yea thanks, i was only wondering if such thing exist or not, i didn't do serious search so far hope will find something
yes bro im using 2018, i am asking about doing the UVs.. for a car it takes a lot of time and even longer to make the texture density even all over the car, that's why im wondering is there anyway to make the texture density even all around or i should manually resize all pieces to get the same density everywhere?
i've been doing this most of the time but now i have a car with a lot of details and doing UVs this way will take a lot of time :(
maybe you know some good third party application to do the job quickly and in a decant way
Hi guys, I am confused after modelling in Maya which software should we texturing keyshort or Maya or substance painter or zbreach .
For texturing software, the most popular ones are Substance Painter and Mari. We have a video coming out in 5 hours talking about the various 3D software out there :)
Texturing in substance painter is finel out put or we should import model into Maya and again we should work on it . Can you please make a tutorial on this topic .
udims r Avaliable in Blender? Alternative?
Great vid! Always enjoy the content you guys put out. Informative too! Very curious about implementation in games, right now I just use multiple materials
Thanks Nate! Appreciated. More to come.
/H
Is there a way to workwith UDIM and nHair in maya?
If you have mutiple udim tiles you can't place the hair unless it's within the 0 -1 space
I dont believe so. When dealing with hair and fur, I usually put the UVs in a separate UV set (like we did in the video).
That was very helpful, Thank you. I managed to fix the issue i had. I didn't know what UV set's were used for but i'll definitely read more about it.
Could you do a tutorials about doing udims? Some workflow between Zbrush and Mari
Absolutely! On our list.
Do you guys come across Ptex in production? And if so, how often?
Honestly, I've never seen anyone use Ptex in production. We still use UVs (udims) and there's no indication that they are going away. It doesn't take that long to do and I'm not really sure if Ptex solves any real issues.
BUt this also means way and way more data when rendering. What is the knowledge or method of deciding how many maps should be used?
Quite the opposite, since just the required maps are loaded when rendering a given frame.
@@uwirl4338 Yeah but those maps are 4-8k, your comment doesnt make sense to this context. Even if needed or not, when needed its still HUGE. You dont switch between frames to different maps sizes, unless they got some script for that. Probably they do
awesome tutorial, thank you guys!
edit: i was so exited for the title, and then i saw Mari's shitty UI, like ughhhh it has to be the worst ui ever
No worries! Thanks :D
hmmm... is there a filtering issue when udim regions are different resolutions? so if the head is 4k but the neck is 1k, do you get a nasty seam?
Honestly havent had that issue at all to be honest. Mari also bleeds all the textures a lot from the border, which also helps eliminate seams. Maybe you get errors sometimes, but I havent experienced it.
/H
cool. haven't used mari but it's good to know that it's not a show stopper!
Sorry, but i still don't get it, or maybe i have...
Is UDIM just a system to tell the shader "ok now on this part of the croc we're using the UV setup of #1005 and the matching texture to that is "Body01.tga". Something like that? Like, you are still gonna end up with, in this case, 14 different textures when you export it, say out of Substance Painter, right?
So the whole point is to be able to work with a much higher resolution, drawing from >multiple< 8k+ textures, but all on ONE mesh and you don't have to use multiple shaders?
Your pretty much right, yes the painting software will output 14 different files for lets say the color map. However in most packages (Speaking from a commercial/film standpoint, I don't work in games) The software only needs to see one file, and then you tell it it has UDIMs associated with it. So only one shader is required, and the software/rendering package does all the work assigning them to the right spots. There's other technical stuff that usually happens with UDIMs, that make them very efficient for commercial rendering.
What Manuel said here is spot on! Thanks for your comment.
The maps will look something like 'body.1001.tif, body.1002.tif', etc If you have 30 udims, it will do from 1001-1030. When you load them into your render engine, you simply load one file node and set it to 'UDIM'. We'll explain more about this later.
/H
and instead of just linking to one texture you can link, say to a folder instead and every texture within gets applied to the designated uv space then? thx for the replies!
No - you normally cant link a folder, but instead an image sequence (1001 and up). The maps are automatically assigned to their correct UV space.
How come you use Mari and not something like Substance Painter? Personal preference?
Hey! We actually have a video coming out on Thursday where we specifically talk about this. In short, Mari can handle a LOT more data compared to Substance, and as I work in film, we need an insane amount of details. Like we talk about in the video, we might need over 100 UDIMs to get the details we need. So in short, not so much personal preference compared to just what the tools can do. One isnt better than the other, they just have different use-cases.
/H
Looking forward to it!
Hi,guys and thanks once again!:)
No worries! :D
Thanks for this
No worries at all
Super awesome tutorial...
Thanks Jaya!
I have a one doubt texturing artist should know modelling skill also..
You really need to watch more "tutorials"...
Texturing in substance painter is finel out put or we should import model into Maya and again we should work on it . Can you please make a tutorial on this topic .
I love you guys, thanks for explain this :3
Youre welcome! :3
"Fernand is going baaaad!!" jajajajajajaja xD
I've been going through googling UDIMs, reading and watching videos and it appears they are only used for characters. What if you wanted to do large environments for video games?
youd use several tiling textures instead, no need for UDIMS (since your environments are not 1 large object but consist of many loose modular parts).
thanks. Yes please, a detailed hands-on tutorial would be great: An in depth work flow walk through with UDIM in Substance Designer. Specifically the best way to work with multiple substance materials on one (several?) meshes. The Substance Painter flow is clear. Designer is a bit trickier for me. Allegorithmic has a new yt tut on the 2018 workflow, but it is just a quick overview.
Noted! Thanks for the suggestion.