50 years ago I used a human trained mechanic for servicing my cars. He could fix most things by just listening close to the exhaust. Then adjusting the carburetor, (remember those?) or Distributor/plugs manually until it sounded right to his trained ear. Job done and we were good to go for another 25,000 miles. Oil change extra. Cup of tea gratis from his wife unit whilst we waited. Good feature Ray.
When we used a broomstick or used an empty funnel at the block to our ear to find out which valve was tapping .. or when we would take out the #1 plug and put our finger over the hole and have our buddy crank until we felt pressure.. how we found top dead center back in the day. (Yeah, im thay old to remember that) lol
@@jimdavis6833 In those days, cars were affordable to the average person. That same person could repair that car out in the backyard on a beautiful summer day. Cars were far less complicated than they are today.
Cost is relative. I was making about $250 a week back then. Also we didn't have Google to search every little problem. We had to use our heads.@@donaldmickunas8552
He taught us about turn signals and high beams. This time he FAILS MISERABLY as he stopped traffic completely at a corner without a stop sign that was designed with a special lane only for people turning right to go into WITHOUT STOPPING
@@jameslastname9171 and with that mentality, you will become a FORD. I would inconvenience the person behind me instead of being a road killed. That's the problem with today's mentality, don't think about safety, just go and wing it. If it comes 2 inches in front of your face but don't get metal slapped, you laugh it off, but when you do get metal slapped, and in near death, you sit back and curse at yourself for being dumb. Then you are quick to sue the other driver for your own stupidity. Think about your safety first and those around you before you leap. You will get to live another day to tell your story.
@@jameslastname9171 Watch it again and look closer at 2:24. There is no merging lane at that intersection, just a triangular merging area that you have to wait for traffic before using unless you want to cause an accident or run someone off the road like Ray is describing.
As an experienced VR/AR developer, at *best*, mixed reality could be used during the assembly process to train new line workers or maybe quality control but under ideal factory conditions. Dirty, crusty, and/or leaking engine compartments aren't going to have the fidelity to help accurately diagnose within VR/AR. Despite best efforts, digital will never be the end-all answer - there will always be a need for analog diagnostics by a dirty, crusty leaking technician.:)
I was a member of the UK RX-8 owners club and owned one of the first cars in the country from 2003 to 2008. No, there should be zero vibration. My dealer put a full glass of champagne on the engine and revved it to 9500 rpm with not a ripple. The engine actually displaces 3.5 litres because of the way it works and is good for 250hp in the manual (stick) version and 0-60 in under 6 seconds. Putting an automatic transmission on an RX-8 was both idiotic and a sin because it fundamentally undermines the benefits of the engine. The engine revs to 9500 rpm and should be used, always, in that rev range because it's good for the rotor seals and delivers full power.
Is the rx-8 A 1.3 engine and heavy on petrol,I've always fancied one of these suicide back doors Well cool Very High reving engine , has any body else made a Wankel engine or is it only Mazda motor cars
@@DainSmart-vm7pc Yes, very heavy on fuel for the UK because our petrol is crazy expensive. I got about 23mpg although in the USA that's considered OK. It also, necessarily, consumes some oil in use (similar to a 2 stroke piston engine) but it's not too bad. Several other companies tried rotary engines including NSU, Porsche, Daimler Benz, Nissan, General Motors, Suzuki, Toyota and Norton motorcycles to name but a few. Go read the wikipedia Wankel Engine page. It's pronounced 'Vankel' by the way because it's a German name.
Rotary engines weren't fuel efficient plus the RX7 had a large gas tank for it's size. On top of that the engine had engine oil sprayers/misters that sprayed a little oil into the combustion chambers for rotor lubrication. The owners manual stated that the engine was designed to consume one quart of engine oil every three thousand miles but they were fun.
Anyone remember Google Glasses? - Also, a headset can't turn a wrench. Sure, in a perfect setting, with NOTHING out of place, a computer could control a robot to turn a wrench. But add some dirt, the variability of rust, aged plastic connectors that break when touched, missing fastener, broken studs, and customer modifications. Is that engine leaking or did the car just drive through a puddle? Can the computer adjust for every possible level and color of dirt? As Ray's example, will it find a chewed wire or will it keep replacing the same sensor?
I am 76 years old. You and I think identically the same when it comes to driving. Safety first I am a former aircraft mechanic who also tinkered with cars. I have learned a lot watching your videos, thanks.
Im currently going to UTI and I asked chat GPT for instructions to diagnose a DTC and it gave me very thorough instructions 😂 it was a lot to read but it had step by step procedures
I liked your rant and eventually a PSA! Along with your voice I’d like to add my motto, I Never get in too much of a hurry to cause or get into an accident. And believe me I had plenty of opportunities to do so with working over 30 years in the Fire & EMS service.
I want one of these. I don't care if the engine is worn out, so long as it's rebuildable. Definitely would do the oil injection pump bypass so it has a stand alone sump separate from the injection oil. And probably a few other goodies (minor mods) but a nice clean car otherwise. Nor even picky over color. But absolutely has to be a manual.
I only recently found you Ray but the reason I continue and in fact have gone back a year is because you don't just fire the parts cannon. I have been a home mechanic since I was a 63B in the US Army and fell in love with fixing things...now people just buy another and I refuse. I went off, its your diagnosing that I watch and no VR can know something is "slightly" unplugged. Anyone can replace parts, won't be fast if you aren't experienced but anyone can do it. It's firing that cannon and it being one shot one kill... that is what I strive to learn more of every day. Ironically maybe but getting a real OBD 2 computer has helped me a lot and it's also opened up a world to me that I didn't have with a code reader.
I was a ASE parts specialist. We used books and experience before the computer screen arrived at the parts counter. The computer displaced or ended the careers of many talented people. I saw it coming and I learned how to fix, build and repair computers back in the last century, taking advantage of the new technology. VR is a dead end in my opinion.
The problem with VR is it's too god damn expensive. And sure when it first came out, early adopter fees are a thing. But now that they've been around for nearly a decade, the prices just ain't dropping unless you want a third party set that'll give you motion sickness. Like how are shops going to afford to put a headset on every mechanic in every shop? They already have to buy expensive tools as is.
Yeah, I can either buy a set of snap on flank drive plus 4 angle wrenches or one headset that is extremely sensitive to harsh environments, it’s kind of a no brainer which is more important
@@Thatonefuckinguy so, just like the dipshit that was making the claim about vr replacing mechanics, you dont know what the hell you're talking about. VR rigs prices are pretty much equivalent to the prices of smart phones. and no, the apple vision pro is not over priced.....not anymore overpriced than your average apple iphone. the quest 3 128 gig is only 500 dollar; maybe with any accessories that you would need to buy (like a decent head strap), the cost would go up to about 650.....that is not expensive, considering the tech thats inside it. im pretty sure that some of Ray's hand tools cost more than that
@@Thatonefuckinguythe price is definitely not the problem with VR. A decent "first-party" headset can be had for $350. Unless you're talking AR, which is more expensive and technically challenging to do.
Yeah but we're still talking about 350 times 5-10 depending on how big the shop is. Adds up fast. And then we gotta talk trackers that you need in the correct zones. That's a mess to set up. @@surewhynot6259
you missed something about the AR goggles Ray. The goggles have a camera, so they can use image recognition to highlight what that camera sees. Instead of you needing to search for that leak, the goggles will detect it, and point it out, so you can see it immediately and start tracking it back to it's source. You are still right: technicians are NOT going away because of this tech, and it will be something to help identify problems, and even help harder to spot things. Eventually, they'll be compact enough to wear light regular glasses, but for now, they are bulky first steps only. Useful, but not must have items.
As someone in an industry where we make, and use videos like this: our viewpoint is that it is a supplement to lower the barrier of entry for a new hire. It will never replace experience, there are too many "gotcha" technicalities that happen in machines, but they do reduce the burdens that the old guard have when training the new hires. I tend to give it about 2 years in the industry before a technician has enough competency under their belt to do diag work solo without getting lost in the weeds. Videos provide a refresher for old technicians, and standardized starting points for new hires.
Had a company try to sell a “decision support diagnosis”package to GB National Health Service. It could diagnose appendicitis better than junior doctors and similar to the senior staff. Took twice as long and 40 years later there still isn’t a machine to take your appendix out unless there is a human pulling the levers.
Similar thing in aviation. New pilots learn on flat panel displays (EFIS) in Cessna's and Pipers these days, and few learn the old "steam gauges". Their attitude is that "Our students will go straight into a jet with EFIS, and will likely never see the old system, so why should they learn it? Famous last words. The old stuff was difficult to interpret, so you learned to determine your position in your mind rather than simply look on the screen. That built situational awareness; The new training planes do not build this sufficiently in my opinion. EFIS should only be used in professional cockpits, not in training planes! Great video!
VR will never replace us. These days it takes a technician with college level skills to diagnose and repair these vehicles. Some actually have college training, some (myself included) have learned through experience, and other have both. But a pair of goggles will never turn an untrained individual into someone with your experience or mine (28 years). It would make access to service data quicker, but we are still much needed. Great video brother! 👍👍
I completely concur with the rant! People with no experience or the proper tools but with a fancy, digital repair manual strapped to their Noggin will in no way replace the experienced, seasoned repair technician! GO RAY GO!!
I used UA-cam to change a timing belt and water pump on my 2008 Hyundai Elantra. Took 3 hours and worked great afterwards. If I didn't have the UA-cam video I would not have attempted to change a timing belt. There are however bigger jobs like transmission work or engine rebuild that I would never even try to do no matter how many UA-cam videos there are.
I had a similar “Doomsday for Mechanics” conversation with an EV guy not long ago. He seemed firm that the auto mechanic industry would completely die off, as everyone moved toward EV’s (not to mention he was very smug about it, as if he was happy that potentially thousands would no longer have their livelihood.) but he didn’t have much to say on the subject after I explained that there would still be mechanics, as there are still many moving wear parts on an EV, brakes, electrical systems, bearings, ball joints, etc. it’s amazing to me that there’s folks out there who are thrilled at the thought of people losing jobs, if it includes doing away with an item/industry that they don’t agree with.
@@vthegoose Of course not. There’s only a handful of EV supporters that understand the need for infrastructure improvements. Most think that all it needs is the stroke of a lawmakers pen, and bam, everyone should have an EV charging in the driveway, A/C blowing wide open without rolling blackouts.
There will be some impact from fewer wear parts needing replaced. No exhaust, no oil changes or any of the seals and gaskets needed to keep it from leaking, none of the dodads going on or through the valve cover into the head(s), with most braking being regenerative the friction brakes will last a lot longer, LED lights should last the life of the vehicle (also on newer ICE cars. Other stuff like suspension, steering, and HVAC will still be there, and everything will be even more computerized.
Just had a classic example of this Ray. ABS light on, scan tool showed faulty rear right sensor. Nope. Something with four legs and sharp teeth had chewed through part of the wiring loom.
Before I retired from being a mechanic the best and only new tool that was worth it's weight in gold was ratcheting wrenches. When they first started putting computers in vehicles my boss expected me to buy a computer diagnosis tool for each brand of car...lol...wasn't going to happen. Glad they made one diagnosis tool for all.
Ray, like you said in the video, check the connector, but in this case the throttlebody connector and check the pinclamps and / or wires. And or the other side at the throttle pedal. No PCM replacement required. Been there, done that ;-)
I will agree with you about the VR I think the Apple thing is a nice TOOL it will help if you’re working with wiring or trying to trouble shoot and keep needing to look things up, but it’s not going to replace anyone because people today are scared to touch things to fix them.
Technicians gain skills and knowledge over time. A headset cannot do that. When I first started out I was slow doing electrical work but after years of learning and real world experience I know where I need to look and how to do it quickly. I have learned shortcuts over the years that's what makes a technician good. The ability to learn and grow. When the headset wearer breaks off an exhaust stud, will the headset teach them how to weld on a nut and how not to get frustrated when it happens?
Ppl do not understand that like you said you still have to get your hands literary dirty to fix or diagnose a problem.....way to go Ray.... be positive about it and look at e cars....nice input
We used to own a 2006 of the 14:22 same car and color. Blast to drive, and handles very very well right off the showroom floor. However we had so many computer issues. So bad they pulled the computers and sent them off to Mazada in CA to be flashed and reprogrammed. Still had issues, and then an engine recall came out. Mazda ended up buying the car back. Only had it for about 6 months. The rotary engine is very smooth and loves high RPMs.
When they showed the airplane engine and how you can take it apart in virtual space as it’s running… I was thinking someone is gonna stick their hand in an actual running engine by accident.
Lol.. a running jet engine ..i remember when one guy got sucked up and spit out as burger meat because he made the mistake of walking in front of one ..im sure the VR helmet wont last inside after hitting every blade...lol
Ray, it is just like 'webmed' it is a great reference material, but you ultimately need someone that can analyze the data and put forth a real repair. They said it was going to replace your family doctor - see where that went...
I use augumented reality in civil engineering. This usefully overlays the design in the real world. So when talking to designers, contractors, about progress, I can pull in people anywhere in the world to be on site with me. I can show progress against design, and discuss where design changes are needed. In small spaces where one person can go, you take all audience with you.
Ray, no AI could replace what you do. It takes a trained mechanic to interpret the data you get from your scan tool. You always explain that that something is 'A' problem but not necessarily 'THE' problem and AI can't do that. An experienced person such as yourself knows what to ignore because it may just be a symptom of the core problem and that's beyond the ability of AI. At best, It's just a tool that might give you some info or leads to follow up on but you know what's relevant or not. Keep doing what you do and you are absolutely correct that AI is not going to replace you.
Hey Ray I really liked your PSA on driving. The problem is we don't teach people how to drive in this country, we just teach people how to generally guide their vehicle kind of down the road maybe kind of between the lines. We're more worried about teaching people stupid rules. Instead of actually driving. Oh never exceed the speed limit. But let's not even tell people how to control their vehicle if it's wet or snowy. Driving is a privilege in this country not a right. As opposed to amendment 2.
Ray I totally agree. There will always be a need for a skilled tech to interpret and repair. I am a 71 year old retired engine builder. Someone will always have to turn a wrench. And I also agree Skynet is real.
Ray, you did an amazing job explaining what it is to be a mechanic. Robots may be able to build a car, but they will never repair them. I forget, did you mention bolts that can't be reomoved because a 3inch bolt was used where a 2 inch should have been?
I remember an old NSU (50 years ago I was 18yo) witch had a rotary engine that an older couple had and was always having some issues, I was working as a chef in their hotel at the time, they took me for a drive because I had spent many school years helping my uncle in his garage and knew a little about engines. They didn’t get to 50 mph and said that they never go much over 40 mph, and always drive very gently and their car didn’t like it at all, I told them that a rotary engine loves and should be used like a racing car and needs to be driven at higher revs in each gear, I drove it part of the way back to the hotel to show them what the car likes to be driven, she just sat there very quietly while I was showing them, he then drove it harder than they used too and was surprised how different the car was driving, he then dropped me back at work and they drove to Birmingham for a couple of days and when they came home they said that they now loved the car’s performance and was also cheaper on fuel than it used to be, I said that it’s not dragging it weight around anymore. Before I gave them that information the car was in the mechanics workshop at least once every two weeks, but after that it only went in for its regular servicing and oil change.
Calling a PCM that quick is something I've never seen... Usually I would at least check powers and grounds and for terminal fretting... Maybe do a visual inspection on the harnesses and connectors, and see if there is any live data pid's on the scanner to look for anomalies....
Really loved your rant. I was working in the automotive field when OBD was being replaced by OBDII and from my experience since then all OBDII has done is piss off Back Yard Bob. Amateur mechanics have forgotten how to properly troubleshoot. When I was a service writer, we had guys who I called "shopping cart diagnosticians" which was basically a tech that would check the codes and rather than troubleshoot and diagnose what was broken, he would simply fill a shopping cart with parts until one fixed the issue. I had one guy who was so notorious for this we finally had to put a stop to it because if a customer requests an old part that we recommended they replace, and the part wasn't bad, we would likely lose a lawsuit. Part of why I like your videos Ray, is how thorough you troubleshoot. I'm well aware that your experience would likely get you through some of these issues quicker, but I like that, for the sake of the video and entertainment, you go through the entire process of proving a theory. I'll take it a step further to make my point. I'm a member of a few FB groups and forums and daily, someone will post "CEL came on and I got xxxx code, what do you think it is?" It never fails there will be 10 responses of people saying change this or that. Typically, I'll give them a few possibilities of the root of the issue along with the process to narrow it down. The biggest reason for that is, new doesn't mean good, it just means unused and clean. There is almost nothing worse than assuming a part is bad and going through the labor to change it only to find out either the old one is good, and you still have the issue, or worse the new part is bad and now you have 2 issues both causing the same symptom. Not everyone loves their job enough to do it twice. (I quote that from you all the time BTW). Long story short, I agree with you 100%. AI or VR isn't replacing anything or anyone, it's just another tool that in the right hands will improve efficiency, but in the wrong hands will just cost more, which is exactly what OBDII scanners did and in some cases still do.
I’m a truck driver I’m not afraid of losing my job because there is no way I could drive a tractor-trailer around into a city or a lot of rural tight roads😊
Agree about the auto trans on this car, used to have an 80' rx-7 - wouldn't have been as much fun as the manual but yes they do burn some crude! especially as the rotor seals wear out 😂 Can't replace technicians, without them the digital world collapses and we all go back to the 19th century. Ray knows this - he lives in a Hurricane zone, when those happen power goes out, water can be shut off and you have to survive on your own until skilled technicians make systems safe and get services re-connected. Good luck trying to fix mains power by VR 🤣
You’re correct in your assessment, as far as I am thinking. In order for it to work, at least Artificial Intelligence and robotics needs to be combined with such technology and we would still need a technician in place.
VR might be handy in providing a display at a glance so you don’t have to walk back to take another look, but it won’t replace the skill and experience needed to solve problems. Other than having access to information on the spot it’s no different than what we’ve had for several years now.
I loved the VR section. I had to correct someone’s bad information on Facebook. Some dude said “you NEED a super special socket to change plugs on a ram 5.7 gas engine” I was like what special socket I done the same job with a regular 5/8 plug socket. So I looked it up it’s real a set of swivel socket’s constructed of a plug socket, universal, and extension. I said I’m sure it’s nice and cuts down on dropped sockets but I don’t NEED IT and I’m not spending $40 on a set of sockets when I have the same stuff already paid for in a box
A big part of diagnosis is observing and interpreting in order to react/make decisions. If you don't make the observation or interpret it properly, you can't make the right decisions. No VR headset can do that for you.
VR is an expensive way to load the parts cannon. You still need the experience and tools to effectively diagnose and fix cars. Just being able to access them closer to your eyes doesn’t mean everyone’s suddenly a mechanic.
1st time commenting, your reasoning behind technology is very sound, and accurate. Common sense is a rarity and more and more hard to find. You have an abundance of it over your 20 years of EXPERIENCE. Being 71 years old and know the value of experience for trouble shooting and problem solving. Keep up the fight. 😁
I agree, using AR to diagnose and repair problems is just making a Bee-line to the parts cannon. Great mechanics like yourself, and even good mechanics, always look at the big picture. BTW, using a damp rag to wipe the dust off that PCM instead of a quick rub with your fingers might make the lettering more visible. 😆
for the vr stuff i can see it increase productiveity for veteran mechanics as they would have whatever relevant info in their face instead of leaving to find a laptop etc
To this day as a HD mechanic for years now. I have gone to you tube to help look up things and yet to ever find a video or anything that has had the same issue I’m dealing with. They have only helped with looking at the problem a different way.
The whole VR thing might help in some circumstances, but most of the time good old common sense and experience will solve your problems. I once watched a video about a car bought at auction, that was supposedly complete junk, just to find out that it had run out of gas!
Sorry, no V.R. for me. I agree, you need to be hands on especially on older cars. As for the Mazda, that problem makes me glad I have a good ole fashioned throttle cable on my ride as well as one module (Ignition Box). Crazy a TAC fault and you gotta replace the PCM. - Jamie
I agree, with you, it will only make things faster, and more expensive. I can't do what you do because I don't have the fancy subscriptions and equipment for just an occasional repair.
Hey Raymond That may be ar headsets The reason I say that cause if you can see through the lens and still see the cartheir, augmented reality and people do use them doctors and other professions. And they help a lot. And sorry I've got a lot of help from UA-cam. Love your show in your mechanic shop. Have a nice day.
Boeing has had those VR sets on the line for years. Extremely handy for building wiring harnesses but it won't catch things like bolts missing in a door.
Agree with all of Ray's points in the video. AI will likely only be an assistant at least in the near future. The AR/VR headsets are at most a convenience right now.
Actually, I heard a funny report about the consequences of VR helmets: more insurance claims for damage to homes. Seems people gesticulate a little too much while absorbed into the VR world thus breaking lamps, tv's, furniture especially when using golf clubs, bats, etc. I like your commentary. VR has a place but it isn't to replace.
I normally agree with your diagnosis but this time, I question going right to the PCM. The “throttle control module” to me speaks to the electronic throttle body. It could easily be gummed up, stripped out, or have a bad connection, so I would first try to thoroughly inspect the throttle body/actuator and its wiring before firing the proverbial parts cannon.
Those headsets remind me of those do-it-all tools that get advertised every so often - the ones that will "replace a whole box of tools", but really turn out have a small number of very specialised uses. They'll be handy to have and use once every six months or so, but otherwise just be an expensive toy that gathers dust.
I think there's a place for augmented reality where you have a small camera/ heads up display connected to your phone so you can video chat someone in your professional network who knows more about the car. If anything that just means automotive technicians can charge for consults and not have to get their hands dirty 😂
It would be advantagous in a classroom setting to give young people an idea of how to diagnose OBDII faults if the whole vehicle could be looked at as you can survaile the background in games.
I bought a Chevy Trailblazer and had some recall notices after a year or so. I was floored that all of the recalls were firmware upgrades & patches and were performed simply by plugging a cable in. I think I received 3 notices by mail (critical) and there were 6 minor recalls.
It's the same with going to school to be a mechanic. They teach you how to do maintenence and repair of the most common issues, but they don't teach you how to diagnose the uncommon issues. I had an ASE certified, Lincoln Tech educated kid that couldn't do a proper oil change or even remove a brake drum that was rusted on, much less replace brake shoes. He only knew disc brakes and had only been trained on new, rust free cars that were donated from the manufacturers. In most cases, there's absolutely nothing wrong with these cars and they're just taking apart and putting them back together, over and over. I was taught in the real world, with cars that had been in daily service for years and corroded from driving through salt covered winter roads. You need common sense to diagnose, which you can't teach. I excel at electrical problems, which is not taught in any book. In fact, I took a class on automotive electrical diagnosis and tested out by explaining how a GM turn/parking/side marker light work with no ground to the marker light. I saw the circuit and instantly saw that the marker finds its ground through the filament of either the parking light (when using the turn signal) or the turn signal (when using the parking lights) and flashes opposite when both are in use because it needs the positive to the turn signal to be open to use the ground. I really wish I would have stayed in the class for the fun of it, though.
I have an I.C.D. (Implanted Cardiac Defibrillator) that monitors my vitals, and stands at the ready, with 15 years of battery life, to "jumpstart" my heart if it stops again. It is bluetoothed into my phone, which has a wifi connection, so it can be monitored by nurses at the cardiology center in Grand Rapids, MI., so I have microchips implated in my body...
The vr glasses are a monitor with sensors to see movements. Not ai... You are correct. Hands on stuff will be hard to automate. Imagine replacing nurses, electricians, etc. The information side is one thing the physical side quite another.
Funny that you mentioned the smoke machine again today. I just recently viewed the video where you showed the failure of a vacuum brake booster, and it went undetected based on where the smoke machine is often connected. Last week, i was trying to diagnose a lambda issue, because my car failed an emissions inspection (lambda value too high, meaning that the car is running lean.) I hooked the smoke machine up to the hose that comes from the brake booster to the intake. I didn't see smoke. Tonight, I reconnected the machine to the intake air hose and find that it was leaking between the air filter box and the throttle body, right at the throttle body end of the hose. I relaxed the hose clamps, reset the learned values and checked the lambda. It should pass now.
Ray, I have watched a few other mechanics on UA-cam talk about VR and I agree with your. IT will not replace a real mechanic. I also agree that watching a UA-cam video does not accurately Diagnose a problem. I have used your videos to see how to do something that I have to do like replace and alternator or battery etc... but VR can't diagnose a real problem. Technology like your scanner points you to POSSIBLE issues, many times the most likely issue, but you The Trained Technician have to go through the steps and find the problem, sometimes the technology helps but you are right it cant see the broken connector, the frayed wires, the wrong part used, etc.... I personally would not go to a Garage where I saw the tech wearing VR googles, unless I know the Tech is also a top notch mechanic.
Hi Ray, I totally agree with you about the VR rubbish, if my car needs work then I will take it to some one like yourself to diagnose and repair for peace of mind. I do watch a lot of channels like yours such as Flying Sparks Garage, Junkyard Digs and Diesel Creek and have learnt a heck of alot on how to fix vehicles both Diesel and Gasoline/Petrol, but I only use the knowledge when restoring a vehicle once restored I will then take said vehicle to a trusted mechanic to make sure everything is working properly. VR is garbage and should only be used for gaming, the real world is a better place to be. Have a great day mate and love Lauren's wife unit channel also.
I can see VR in the classrooms for training and introduction to training and new concepts, putting you inside an engine or module to show you how is suppaes to work. When cell phone came out, everyone started losing their memories of even the most common numbers for us to call. So it has its place in learning, but not yet in the shop, especially with all of the nasty that can happen in the shop environment.
Automatic RX-8's hurt my soul. Shifting 6 gears at 9500RPM is where it's at with these. I had both a Series 1 and Series 2, so much fun to drive and get 9 MPG in. These really need a specialized mechanic. The ignition systems are so touchy, and using aftermarket coil packs or wires causes a lot of issues, but people do because the OEM's are very pricey. But it is always more costly to replace a second time.
VR will have even less of an impact on mechanics than OBD 2. Most people don't want to work on their cars, they just want the car to work when they get in it to drive somewhere.
Ability of computer to assist mechanic (and, maybe call in the mechanic) will depend on instrumentation added to cars (with - I hope - standardization. The engine could tell you there is a leak of any fluid or pressurized system. And perhaps pinpoint it. Someday. Maybe.
@jdub264 I would at least check powers and grounds... And like you said, terminal fretting at the connectors... Check and test everything you can before calling a PCM...
I am called a Luddite because of my resistance to certain technology. I do not upgrade my phone when the latest one comes out; they do not make calls any better. I frequently leave my phone at home while running errands around town. I seek cars with minimal technology avoiding things like lane assist and auto-parking which are all sizzle, no steak.
Great video, as usual. Fun fact about AI. AI develops it's so call knowledge from on-line sources. As more and more on-line source become AI generated, it means it will become a feedback loop. Garbage in means garbage out.
When i go to a mechanic, and I'm sure most people share this sentiment.. It's primarily for 2 reasons: 1. I don't have the tools, 2. I seriously have better things to do then fold myself into an S to reach some part.. There's people for this with the tools to do it, and they're called mechanics .. I'll keep paying a pro to work on my cars because experience matters!
For the most part I agree with your assessment of how VR will impact mechanics. I do think it could grow to be a vital tool over time if onboarded correctly. It could replace the need to buy a number of other individual tools like thermal meters. Especially if it gets tuned to the point it can recognize things like hot spots in wiring. The data is there, it's a question of whether the human eye can see it, or feel it. Image recognition could quickly pull part numbers. At the end of the day, more data to make an accurate diagnosis is great. But you still need someone to do the work, and assess whether AI got it right. The AI relies on input to build its own model. It doesn't take much garbage input to bias or invalidate an AI model.
The only way such vr glasses can work is when a technician can see what the customer is looking at in his vr glasses and is able to make an arrow on that screen so the customer can plug it back. But that is a very limited use case that can be solved with a video call
Computers have already made people stupid with cars. I have been a mechanic, service writer, and parts guy. I have seen it all! But my best proof that everyone, even most "professional" mechanics (except you ray which is why we love you), have become way to dependent on machines is this. A lady comes into my shop and says I have a (I forget excat make model, but GM 5.3L engine) I need a oil pump. I am not paying you guys your rip off fee for looking at it, I have already had it looked at I need a oil pump. I just want you to put the oil pump in as cheap as possible. So I say "ok have the tow truck drop it in a spot, I will get you written up". She says "tow truck"? I say "yeah isn't it on a tow truck here"? "No why would it be towed?" "Well it's a oil pump, so the engine has no/low oil pressure?" I asked. "Well yeah, I guess, I don't know. My check engine light came on, I had someone pull the codes, they told me I need a oil pump. They wanted thousands of dollars and I didn't have it at the time, so I have been saving up and finally have enough money to do it, which is why I don't want to pay to tell me the same thing again". (Not sure why she didn't return to the original guy to have him do the job but I digress) "Wait back up a moment, how long ago was this?" I ask. "Um probably like 6 months ago". "And you have just been driving it around normal? And there are no weird crazy knocking or banging noises coming from the engine?" I ask. For those of you who don't a engine with no oil pressure would be luck to survive minutes before making crazy noises and self destructing, a engine with low oil pressure depending on how low and when could potentially make it 6 months, but even that is unlikely. So on ward with the story. So she responds "no no issues, just the check engine light". So I explain to her it is highly, highly unlikely she actually needs a oil pump and she really needs to pay me my diagnostic fee to tell her what she really needs (I suspect I already know the answer) and diagnostic fee and cost to replace whatever it is combined will probably be cheaper then just doing the oil pump. I will do the oil pump but it will not fix her issue and she will have to pay that and for me to diagnose it. She kind of hims and haws but I am confident I am right and she is wasting money. I really hate to see people waste money, and I am so confident I am right I finally say "tell you what agree to pay me diagnose it, if I come up with it needing a oil pump I won't charge you the diag fee, and I will even knock a little bit off the job. If I come back something else you will pay my normal diag fee, and then what ever the correct job is you need done". She says deal. For those of you who don't know the GM 5.3s are known to have the oil pressure sensor fail. More specifically there is a little screen that clogs that prevents the oil pressure from making it to the sensor. Either way the cars ECM sees a no oil pressure reading on the oil pressure sensor and triggers a code and check engine light. The code says "low/no oil pressure" (I forget the exact code and am to lazy to Google). If one sees a code that says low no oil pressure one might be inclined to instantly jump to you need what ever it is that creates said oil pressure, in this case the oil pump (after taking the most basics of step of making sure there is oil in the engine I would hope thou in this day and age who the heck knows). I mean the engine has oil, and the computer is telling you there is no pressure so clearly the pressure making device has failed right? Right? Wrong in all my years of working on cars I have never, ever seen one that actually had a failed pump. I have seen hundreds where I ended up replacing the sensor and screen (after a thoro diagnosis of making sure I am actually getting oil pressure and getting power and grounds where I should). But I guess what? Even thou every single one I have seen has had the same issue, and even thou there is a 99.99% chance the next one I see will also, every. Single. Time. I come across this I do a proper check. Do we have? What condition is it in? Is the sensor plugged in and all the wiring good? Are we actually making oil pressure? Then and only then do I replace that sensor and screen. If it were my car I would probably take the risk and just replace the sensor once I seen that code, but a customers car? Nope no way Jose. By the way in case you were wondering yes I was correct on that ladies car, that was exactly what she needed.
The USAF tried a similar thing with Google Glasses years ago. While it was really handy to have the technical data in front of you at all times, it did not replace the intellect of the mechanic repairing/inspecting the equipment. Also, it turned out the glasses were stupidly expensive and not very durable.
I wonder what Eric O 's opinion will be about the VR Headsets ? Or Maybe what Pine Hollow has to add to that concept. Thank you for another great video. Stay safe out there. Cheers
50 years ago I used a human trained mechanic for servicing my cars. He could fix most things by just listening close to the exhaust. Then adjusting the carburetor, (remember those?) or Distributor/plugs manually until it sounded right to his trained ear. Job done and we were good to go for another 25,000 miles. Oil change extra. Cup of tea gratis from his wife unit whilst we waited.
Good feature Ray.
Those were the days, my friend. 😉
When we used a broomstick or used an empty funnel at the block to our ear to find out which valve was tapping .. or when we would take out the #1 plug and put our finger over the hole and have our buddy crank until we felt pressure.. how we found top dead center back in the day. (Yeah, im thay old to remember that) lol
Back in those leaded gas days I couldn't get 25,000 miles on a set of plugs, maybe 20,000 at best.
@@jimdavis6833 In those days, cars were affordable to the average person. That same person could repair that car out in the backyard on a beautiful summer day. Cars were far less complicated than they are today.
Cost is relative. I was making about $250 a week back then. Also we didn't have Google to search every little problem. We had to use our heads.@@donaldmickunas8552
He teaches to how drive a car, how to fix one, and construction. He’s the Ray of all trades.
He taught us about turn signals and high beams. This time he FAILS MISERABLY as he stopped traffic completely at a corner without a stop sign that was designed with a special lane only for people turning right to go into WITHOUT STOPPING
@@jameslastname9171 and with that mentality, you will become a FORD. I would inconvenience the person behind me instead of being a road killed.
That's the problem with today's mentality, don't think about safety, just go and wing it. If it comes 2 inches in front of your face but don't get metal slapped, you laugh it off, but when you do get metal slapped, and in near death, you sit back and curse at yourself for being dumb. Then you are quick to sue the other driver for your own stupidity.
Think about your safety first and those around you before you leap. You will get to live another day to tell your story.
@@jameslastname9171 Just because you HAVE the right of way doesn't make it right to take it.
@@jameslastname9171 Watch it again and look closer at 2:24. There is no merging lane at that intersection, just a triangular merging area that you have to wait for traffic before using unless you want to cause an accident or run someone off the road like Ray is describing.
As an experienced VR/AR developer, at *best*, mixed reality could be used during the assembly process to train new line workers or maybe quality control but under ideal factory conditions. Dirty, crusty, and/or leaking engine compartments aren't going to have the fidelity to help accurately diagnose within VR/AR. Despite best efforts, digital will never be the end-all answer - there will always be a need for analog diagnostics by a dirty, crusty leaking technician.:)
Dirty crusty leaking tech! 🤣🤣🤣
I was a member of the UK RX-8 owners club and owned one of the first cars in the country from 2003 to 2008. No, there should be zero vibration. My dealer put a full glass of champagne on the engine and revved it to 9500 rpm with not a ripple. The engine actually displaces 3.5 litres because of the way it works and is good for 250hp in the manual (stick) version and 0-60 in under 6 seconds. Putting an automatic transmission on an RX-8 was both idiotic and a sin because it fundamentally undermines the benefits of the engine. The engine revs to 9500 rpm and should be used, always, in that rev range because it's good for the rotor seals and delivers full power.
Unless its a Renesis like this one.
Is the rx-8 A 1.3 engine and heavy on petrol,I've always fancied one of these suicide back doors Well cool Very High reving engine , has any body else made a Wankel engine or is it only Mazda motor cars
@@theroyalaustralian
The rotary engine in all variants of the Mazda RX-8 was named Renesis so I don't understand your point.
@@DainSmart-vm7pc
Yes, very heavy on fuel for the UK because our petrol is crazy expensive. I got about 23mpg although in the USA that's considered OK. It also, necessarily, consumes some oil in use (similar to a 2 stroke piston engine) but it's not too bad.
Several other companies tried rotary engines including NSU, Porsche, Daimler Benz, Nissan, General Motors, Suzuki, Toyota and Norton motorcycles to name but a few. Go read the wikipedia Wankel Engine page.
It's pronounced 'Vankel' by the way because it's a German name.
Rotary engines weren't fuel efficient plus the RX7 had a large gas tank for it's size. On top of that the engine had engine oil sprayers/misters that sprayed a little oil into the combustion chambers for rotor lubrication. The owners manual stated that the engine was designed to consume one quart of engine oil every three thousand miles but they were fun.
No kind of AI could ever replace Raymond and Lauren...does not compute!!!!✨️✨️✨️
There's no such thing as AI Unit. Who can replace a Wife Unit with an AI Unit?
Anyone remember Google Glasses?
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Also, a headset can't turn a wrench.
Sure, in a perfect setting, with NOTHING out of place, a computer could control a robot to turn a wrench.
But add some dirt, the variability of rust, aged plastic connectors that break when touched, missing fastener, broken studs, and customer modifications.
Is that engine leaking or did the car just drive through a puddle? Can the computer adjust for every possible level and color of dirt? As Ray's example, will it find a chewed wire or will it keep replacing the same sensor?
I am 76 years old. You and I think identically the same when it comes to driving. Safety first
I am a former aircraft mechanic who also tinkered with cars. I have learned a lot watching your videos, thanks.
Im currently going to UTI and I asked chat GPT for instructions to diagnose a DTC and it gave me very thorough instructions 😂 it was a lot to read but it had step by step procedures
I liked your rant and eventually a PSA! Along with your voice I’d like to add my motto, I Never get in too much of a hurry to cause or get into an accident. And believe me I had plenty of opportunities to do so with working over 30 years in the Fire & EMS service.
I want one of these. I don't care if the engine is worn out, so long as it's rebuildable. Definitely would do the oil injection pump bypass so it has a stand alone sump separate from the injection oil. And probably a few other goodies (minor mods) but a nice clean car otherwise. Nor even picky over color. But absolutely has to be a manual.
I only recently found you Ray but the reason I continue and in fact have gone back a year is because you don't just fire the parts cannon. I have been a home mechanic since I was a 63B in the US Army and fell in love with fixing things...now people just buy another and I refuse. I went off, its your diagnosing that I watch and no VR can know something is "slightly" unplugged. Anyone can replace parts, won't be fast if you aren't experienced but anyone can do it. It's firing that cannon and it being one shot one kill... that is what I strive to learn more of every day. Ironically maybe but getting a real OBD 2 computer has helped me a lot and it's also opened up a world to me that I didn't have with a code reader.
I was a ASE parts specialist. We used books and experience before the computer screen arrived at the parts counter. The computer displaced or ended the careers of many talented people. I saw it coming and I learned how to fix, build and repair computers back in the last century, taking advantage of the new technology. VR is a dead end in my opinion.
The problem with VR is it's too god damn expensive. And sure when it first came out, early adopter fees are a thing. But now that they've been around for nearly a decade, the prices just ain't dropping unless you want a third party set that'll give you motion sickness. Like how are shops going to afford to put a headset on every mechanic in every shop? They already have to buy expensive tools as is.
Yeah, I can either buy a set of snap on flank drive plus 4 angle wrenches or one headset that is extremely sensitive to harsh environments, it’s kind of a no brainer which is more important
@@Thatonefuckinguy so, just like the dipshit that was making the claim about vr replacing mechanics, you dont know what the hell you're talking about. VR rigs prices are pretty much equivalent to the prices of smart phones.
and no, the apple vision pro is not over priced.....not anymore overpriced than your average apple iphone.
the quest 3 128 gig is only 500 dollar; maybe with any accessories that you would need to buy (like a decent head strap), the cost would go up to about 650.....that is not expensive, considering the tech thats inside it. im pretty sure that some of Ray's hand tools cost more than that
@@Thatonefuckinguythe price is definitely not the problem with VR. A decent "first-party" headset can be had for $350. Unless you're talking AR, which is more expensive and technically challenging to do.
Yeah but we're still talking about 350 times 5-10 depending on how big the shop is. Adds up fast.
And then we gotta talk trackers that you need in the correct zones. That's a mess to set up. @@surewhynot6259
you missed something about the AR goggles Ray.
The goggles have a camera, so they can use image recognition to highlight what that camera sees. Instead of you needing to search for that leak, the goggles will detect it, and point it out, so you can see it immediately and start tracking it back to it's source.
You are still right: technicians are NOT going away because of this tech, and it will be something to help identify problems, and even help harder to spot things. Eventually, they'll be compact enough to wear light regular glasses, but for now, they are bulky first steps only. Useful, but not must have items.
thank you for everything in 2023. best wishes for 2024.
As someone in an industry where we make, and use videos like this: our viewpoint is that it is a supplement to lower the barrier of entry for a new hire. It will never replace experience, there are too many "gotcha" technicalities that happen in machines, but they do reduce the burdens that the old guard have when training the new hires. I tend to give it about 2 years in the industry before a technician has enough competency under their belt to do diag work solo without getting lost in the weeds. Videos provide a refresher for old technicians, and standardized starting points for new hires.
Had a company try to sell a “decision support diagnosis”package to GB National Health Service. It could diagnose appendicitis better than junior doctors and similar to the senior staff.
Took twice as long and 40 years later there still isn’t a machine to take your appendix out unless there is a human pulling the levers.
Similar thing in aviation. New pilots learn on flat panel displays (EFIS) in Cessna's and Pipers these days, and few learn the old "steam gauges". Their attitude is that "Our students will go straight into a jet with EFIS, and will likely never see the old system, so why should they learn it?
Famous last words. The old stuff was difficult to interpret, so you learned to determine your position in your mind rather than simply look on the screen. That built situational awareness; The new training planes do not build this sufficiently in my opinion. EFIS should only be used in professional cockpits, not in training planes!
Great video!
VR will never replace us. These days it takes a technician with college level skills to diagnose and repair these vehicles. Some actually have college training, some (myself included) have learned through experience, and other have both. But a pair of goggles will never turn an untrained individual into someone with your experience or mine (28 years). It would make access to service data quicker, but we are still much needed. Great video brother! 👍👍
I completely concur with the rant! People with no experience or the proper tools but with a fancy, digital repair manual strapped to their Noggin will in no way replace the experienced, seasoned repair technician! GO RAY GO!!
I used UA-cam to change a timing belt and water pump on my 2008 Hyundai Elantra. Took 3 hours and worked great afterwards. If I didn't have the UA-cam video I would not have attempted to change a timing belt. There are however bigger jobs like transmission work or engine rebuild that I would never even try to do no matter how many UA-cam videos there are.
I had a similar “Doomsday for Mechanics” conversation with an EV guy not long ago. He seemed firm that the auto mechanic industry would completely die off, as everyone moved toward EV’s (not to mention he was very smug about it, as if he was happy that potentially thousands would no longer have their livelihood.) but he didn’t have much to say on the subject after I explained that there would still be mechanics, as there are still many moving wear parts on an EV, brakes, electrical systems, bearings, ball joints, etc.
it’s amazing to me that there’s folks out there who are thrilled at the thought of people losing jobs, if it includes doing away with an item/industry that they don’t agree with.
I assume he didn’t understand that the grid won’t be ready for that amount of draw for a couple decades?
@@vthegoose Of course not. There’s only a handful of EV supporters that understand the need for infrastructure improvements. Most think that all it needs is the stroke of a lawmakers pen, and bam, everyone should have an EV charging in the driveway, A/C blowing wide open without rolling blackouts.
There will be some impact from fewer wear parts needing replaced. No exhaust, no oil changes or any of the seals and gaskets needed to keep it from leaking, none of the dodads going on or through the valve cover into the head(s), with most braking being regenerative the friction brakes will last a lot longer, LED lights should last the life of the vehicle (also on newer ICE cars. Other stuff like suspension, steering, and HVAC will still be there, and everything will be even more computerized.
I agree with you 100%. Robots and VR won’t replace skilled labor. Doodly doo do!! Have a good day Ray Ray 👍🏼
One thing they WILL do is either cut into mechanics' profit margins, or more realistically, add to the customers' bills.
Just had a classic example of this Ray. ABS light on, scan tool showed faulty rear right sensor.
Nope. Something with four legs and sharp teeth had chewed through part of the wiring loom.
Before I retired from being a mechanic the best and only new tool that was worth it's weight in gold was ratcheting wrenches. When they first started putting computers in vehicles my boss expected me to buy a computer diagnosis tool for each brand of car...lol...wasn't going to happen. Glad they made one diagnosis tool for all.
Ray, like you said in the video, check the connector, but in this case the throttlebody connector and check the pinclamps and / or wires. And or the other side at the throttle pedal. No PCM replacement required. Been there, done that ;-)
I will agree with you about the VR I think the Apple thing is a nice TOOL it will help if you’re working with wiring or trying to trouble shoot and keep needing to look things up, but it’s not going to replace anyone because people today are scared to touch things to fix them.
Yes you are right they can’t think and problem solve .👍
Technicians gain skills and knowledge over time. A headset cannot do that. When I first started out I was slow doing electrical work but after years of learning and real world experience I know where I need to look and how to do it quickly. I have learned shortcuts over the years that's what makes a technician good. The ability to learn and grow. When the headset wearer breaks off an exhaust stud, will the headset teach them how to weld on a nut and how not to get frustrated when it happens?
Nope, but he will probably use that $3,500 head set to weld with : 0 Scratches at a level two, deeper scratches level 3. Welding splatter - Priceless
Ppl do not understand that like you said you still have to get your hands literary dirty to fix or diagnose a problem.....way to go Ray.... be positive about it and look at e cars....nice input
We used to own a 2006 of the 14:22 same car and color. Blast to drive, and handles very very well right off the showroom floor. However we had so many computer issues. So bad they pulled the computers and sent them off to Mazada in CA to be flashed and reprogrammed. Still had issues, and then an engine recall came out. Mazda ended up buying the car back. Only had it for about 6 months. The rotary engine is very smooth and loves high RPMs.
When they showed the airplane engine and how you can take it apart in virtual space as it’s running… I was thinking someone is gonna stick their hand in an actual running engine by accident.
Lol.. a running jet engine ..i remember when one guy got sucked up and spit out as burger meat because he made the mistake of walking in front of one
..im sure the VR helmet wont last inside after hitting every blade...lol
I enjoy your videos they let me know what I can tackle my self an d what I need an actual mechanic for as a home gamer who likes to do my own work
Ray, it is just like 'webmed' it is a great reference material, but you ultimately need someone that can analyze the data and put forth a real repair. They said it was going to replace your family doctor - see where that went...
Akin to your point:
Erasing the error codes just before bringing your car to the mechanic is like refusing to explain your symptoms to the ER doctor.
I use augumented reality in civil engineering. This usefully overlays the design in the real world. So when talking to designers, contractors, about progress, I can pull in people anywhere in the world to be on site with me. I can show progress against design, and discuss where design changes are needed. In small spaces where one person can go, you take all audience with you.
Ray, no AI could replace what you do. It takes a trained mechanic to interpret the data you get from your scan tool. You always explain that that something is 'A' problem but not necessarily 'THE' problem and AI can't do that. An experienced person such as yourself knows what to ignore because it may just be a symptom of the core problem and that's beyond the ability of AI. At best, It's just a tool that might give you some info or leads to follow up on but you know what's relevant or not. Keep doing what you do and you are absolutely correct that AI is not going to replace you.
Hey Ray I really liked your PSA on driving. The problem is we don't teach people how to drive in this country, we just teach people how to generally guide their vehicle kind of down the road maybe kind of between the lines. We're more worried about teaching people stupid rules. Instead of actually driving. Oh never exceed the speed limit. But let's not even tell people how to control their vehicle if it's wet or snowy. Driving is a privilege in this country not a right. As opposed to amendment 2.
Don’t worry, your job is about as simple as it comes, you won’t be replaced by technology
Ray I totally agree. There will always be a need for a skilled tech to interpret and repair. I am a 71 year old retired engine builder. Someone will always have to turn a wrench. And I also agree Skynet is real.
Ray, you did an amazing job explaining what it is to be a mechanic. Robots may be able to build a car, but they will never repair them. I forget, did you mention bolts that can't be reomoved because a 3inch bolt was used where a 2 inch should have been?
I remember an old NSU (50 years ago I was 18yo) witch had a rotary engine that an older couple had and was always having some issues, I was working as a chef in their hotel at the time, they took me for a drive because I had spent many school years helping my uncle in his garage and knew a little about engines. They didn’t get to 50 mph and said that they never go much over 40 mph, and always drive very gently and their car didn’t like it at all, I told them that a rotary engine loves and should be used like a racing car and needs to be driven at higher revs in each gear, I drove it part of the way back to the hotel to show them what the car likes to be driven, she just sat there very quietly while I was showing them, he then drove it harder than they used too and was surprised how different the car was driving, he then dropped me back at work and they drove to Birmingham for a couple of days and when they came home they said that they now loved the car’s performance and was also cheaper on fuel than it used to be, I said that it’s not dragging it weight around anymore.
Before I gave them that information the car was in the mechanics workshop at least once every two weeks, but after that it only went in for its regular servicing and oil change.
Ray, VR is extremely useful for repairing virtual cars.
Calling a PCM that quick is something I've never seen... Usually I would at least check powers and grounds and for terminal fretting... Maybe do a visual inspection on the harnesses and connectors, and see if there is any live data pid's on the scanner to look for anomalies....
Really loved your rant. I was working in the automotive field when OBD was being replaced by OBDII and from my experience since then all OBDII has done is piss off Back Yard Bob. Amateur mechanics have forgotten how to properly troubleshoot. When I was a service writer, we had guys who I called "shopping cart diagnosticians" which was basically a tech that would check the codes and rather than troubleshoot and diagnose what was broken, he would simply fill a shopping cart with parts until one fixed the issue. I had one guy who was so notorious for this we finally had to put a stop to it because if a customer requests an old part that we recommended they replace, and the part wasn't bad, we would likely lose a lawsuit. Part of why I like your videos Ray, is how thorough you troubleshoot. I'm well aware that your experience would likely get you through some of these issues quicker, but I like that, for the sake of the video and entertainment, you go through the entire process of proving a theory. I'll take it a step further to make my point. I'm a member of a few FB groups and forums and daily, someone will post "CEL came on and I got xxxx code, what do you think it is?" It never fails there will be 10 responses of people saying change this or that. Typically, I'll give them a few possibilities of the root of the issue along with the process to narrow it down. The biggest reason for that is, new doesn't mean good, it just means unused and clean. There is almost nothing worse than assuming a part is bad and going through the labor to change it only to find out either the old one is good, and you still have the issue, or worse the new part is bad and now you have 2 issues both causing the same symptom. Not everyone loves their job enough to do it twice. (I quote that from you all the time BTW).
Long story short, I agree with you 100%. AI or VR isn't replacing anything or anyone, it's just another tool that in the right hands will improve efficiency, but in the wrong hands will just cost more, which is exactly what OBDII scanners did and in some cases still do.
Long story short🤣👍
I’m a truck driver I’m not afraid of losing my job because there is no way I could drive a tractor-trailer around into a city or a lot of rural tight roads😊
Agree about the auto trans on this car, used to have an 80' rx-7 - wouldn't have been as much fun as the manual but yes they do burn some crude! especially as the rotor seals wear out 😂
Can't replace technicians, without them the digital world collapses and we all go back to the 19th century.
Ray knows this - he lives in a Hurricane zone, when those happen power goes out, water can be shut off and you have to survive on your own until skilled technicians make systems safe and get services re-connected. Good luck trying to fix mains power by VR 🤣
You’re correct in your assessment, as far as I am thinking. In order for it to work, at least Artificial Intelligence and robotics needs to be combined with such technology and we would still need a technician in place.
VR might be handy in providing a display at a glance so you don’t have to walk back to take another look, but it won’t replace the skill and experience needed to solve problems. Other than having access to information on the spot it’s no different than what we’ve had for several years now.
As a computer person I love the first step as clear the code and see if it came back😊
I loved the VR section. I had to correct someone’s bad information on Facebook. Some dude said “you NEED a super special socket to change plugs on a ram 5.7 gas engine” I was like what special socket I done the same job with a regular 5/8 plug socket. So I looked it up it’s real a set of swivel socket’s constructed of a plug socket, universal, and extension. I said I’m sure it’s nice and cuts down on dropped sockets but I don’t NEED IT and I’m not spending $40 on a set of sockets when I have the same stuff already paid for in a box
A big part of diagnosis is observing and interpreting in order to react/make decisions. If you don't make the observation or interpret it properly, you can't make the right decisions. No VR headset can do that for you.
VR is an expensive way to load the parts cannon. You still need the experience and tools to effectively diagnose and fix cars. Just being able to access them closer to your eyes doesn’t mean everyone’s suddenly a mechanic.
Knowledge stored in human brain 🧠 is still going to be a valuable asset for a looooong time...
1st time commenting, your reasoning behind technology is very sound, and accurate. Common sense is a rarity and more and more hard to find. You have an abundance of it over your 20 years of EXPERIENCE. Being 71 years old and know the value of experience for trouble shooting and problem solving. Keep up the fight. 😁
i agree with you ,i remember when you could fix with farmer wire which would not work today. a tool is a tool to help but does not make the mechanic.
I agree, using AR to diagnose and repair problems is just making a Bee-line to the parts cannon. Great mechanics like yourself, and even good mechanics, always look at the big picture.
BTW, using a damp rag to wipe the dust off that PCM instead of a quick rub with your fingers might make the lettering more visible. 😆
for the vr stuff i can see it increase productiveity for veteran mechanics as they would have whatever relevant info in their face instead of leaving to find a laptop etc
To this day as a HD mechanic for years now. I have gone to you tube to help look up things and yet to ever find a video or anything that has had the same issue I’m dealing with. They have only helped with looking at the problem a different way.
The whole VR thing might help in some circumstances, but most of the time good old common sense and experience will solve your problems. I once watched a video about a car bought at auction, that was supposedly complete junk, just to find out that it had run out of gas!
Sorry, no V.R. for me. I agree, you need to be hands on especially on older cars. As for the Mazda, that problem makes me glad I have a good ole fashioned throttle cable on my ride as well as one module (Ignition Box). Crazy a TAC fault and you gotta replace the PCM. - Jamie
On rotary models Mazda places the rotary symbol in 3 locations on the vehicle.
I agree, with you, it will only make things faster, and more expensive. I can't do what you do because I don't have the fancy subscriptions and equipment for just an occasional repair.
Hey Raymond That may be ar headsets The reason I say that cause if you can see through the lens and still see the cartheir, augmented reality and people do use them doctors and other professions. And they help a lot.
And sorry I've got a lot of help from UA-cam. Love your show in your mechanic shop. Have a nice day.
RAY!! I think your job is safe brother!! Cheers!
OLD SCHOOL hands on are always going to be the best
Off topic: I think Every Garage should have a Hobart Dishwasher to keep tools Shiny
I watched you DIAGNOSE that Vdub beeetle pretty slick. Electrical drives me nutz to figure out but you nailed it...quick too~!
Boeing has had those VR sets on the line for years. Extremely handy for building wiring harnesses but it won't catch things like bolts missing in a door.
Happy Thursday Ray. Hopefully there is no EMP event while linking up to the Satellite 😎.
Agree with all of Ray's points in the video. AI will likely only be an assistant at least in the near future. The AR/VR headsets are at most a convenience right now.
Actually, I heard a funny report about the consequences of VR helmets: more insurance claims for damage to homes. Seems people gesticulate a little too much while absorbed into the VR world thus breaking lamps, tv's, furniture especially when using golf clubs, bats, etc.
I like your commentary. VR has a place but it isn't to replace.
I normally agree with your diagnosis but this time, I question going right to the PCM. The “throttle control module” to me speaks to the electronic throttle body. It could easily be gummed up, stripped out, or have a bad connection, so I would first try to thoroughly inspect the throttle body/actuator and its wiring before firing the proverbial parts cannon.
Those headsets remind me of those do-it-all tools that get advertised every so often - the ones that will "replace a whole box of tools", but really turn out have a small number of very specialised uses. They'll be handy to have and use once every six months or so, but otherwise just be an expensive toy that gathers dust.
I think there's a place for augmented reality where you have a small camera/ heads up display connected to your phone so you can video chat someone in your professional network who knows more about the car. If anything that just means automotive technicians can charge for consults and not have to get their hands dirty 😂
It would be advantagous in a classroom setting to give young people an idea of how to diagnose OBDII faults if the whole vehicle could be looked at as you can survaile the background in games.
I bought a Chevy Trailblazer and had some recall notices after a year or so.
I was floored that all of the recalls were firmware upgrades & patches and were performed simply by plugging a cable in. I think I received 3 notices by mail (critical) and there were 6 minor recalls.
It's the same with going to school to be a mechanic. They teach you how to do maintenence and repair of the most common issues, but they don't teach you how to diagnose the uncommon issues. I had an ASE certified, Lincoln Tech educated kid that couldn't do a proper oil change or even remove a brake drum that was rusted on, much less replace brake shoes. He only knew disc brakes and had only been trained on new, rust free cars that were donated from the manufacturers. In most cases, there's absolutely nothing wrong with these cars and they're just taking apart and putting them back together, over and over. I was taught in the real world, with cars that had been in daily service for years and corroded from driving through salt covered winter roads. You need common sense to diagnose, which you can't teach. I excel at electrical problems, which is not taught in any book. In fact, I took a class on automotive electrical diagnosis and tested out by explaining how a GM turn/parking/side marker light work with no ground to the marker light. I saw the circuit and instantly saw that the marker finds its ground through the filament of either the parking light (when using the turn signal) or the turn signal (when using the parking lights) and flashes opposite when both are in use because it needs the positive to the turn signal to be open to use the ground. I really wish I would have stayed in the class for the fun of it, though.
I have an I.C.D. (Implanted Cardiac Defibrillator) that monitors my vitals, and stands at the ready, with 15 years of battery life, to "jumpstart" my heart if it stops again. It is bluetoothed into my phone, which has a wifi connection, so it can be monitored by nurses at the cardiology center in Grand Rapids, MI., so I have microchips implated in my body...
The vr glasses are a monitor with sensors to see movements. Not ai... You are correct. Hands on stuff will be hard to automate. Imagine replacing nurses, electricians, etc. The information side is one thing the physical side quite another.
Funny that you mentioned the smoke machine again today. I just recently viewed the video where you showed the failure of a vacuum brake booster, and it went undetected based on where the smoke machine is often connected. Last week, i was trying to diagnose a lambda issue, because my car failed an emissions inspection (lambda value too high, meaning that the car is running lean.) I hooked the smoke machine up to the hose that comes from the brake booster to the intake. I didn't see smoke. Tonight, I reconnected the machine to the intake air hose and find that it was leaking between the air filter box and the throttle body, right at the throttle body end of the hose. I relaxed the hose clamps, reset the learned values and checked the lambda. It should pass now.
Ray, I have watched a few other mechanics on UA-cam talk about VR and I agree with your. IT will not replace a real mechanic.
I also agree that watching a UA-cam video does not accurately Diagnose a problem.
I have used your videos to see how to do something that I have to do like replace and alternator or battery etc... but VR can't diagnose a real problem. Technology like your scanner points you to POSSIBLE issues, many times the most likely issue, but you The Trained Technician have to go through the steps and find the problem, sometimes the technology helps but you are right it cant see the broken connector, the frayed wires, the wrong part used, etc.... I personally would not go to a Garage where I saw the tech wearing VR googles, unless I know the Tech is also a top notch mechanic.
Hi Ray, I totally agree with you about the VR rubbish, if my car needs work then I will take it to some one like yourself to diagnose and repair for peace of mind. I do watch a lot of channels like yours such as Flying Sparks Garage, Junkyard Digs and Diesel Creek and have learnt a heck of alot on how to fix vehicles both Diesel and Gasoline/Petrol, but I only use the knowledge when restoring a vehicle once restored I will then take said vehicle to a trusted mechanic to make sure everything is working properly. VR is garbage and should only be used for gaming, the real world is a better place to be. Have a great day mate and love Lauren's wife unit channel also.
Technology can be used to assist with troubleshooting but still needed a skilled person to interpret information and make repairs.
I can see VR in the classrooms for training and introduction to training and new concepts, putting you inside an engine or module to show you how is suppaes to work. When cell phone came out, everyone started losing their memories of even the most common numbers for us to call. So it has its place in learning, but not yet in the shop, especially with all of the nasty that can happen in the shop environment.
Automatic RX-8's hurt my soul. Shifting 6 gears at 9500RPM is where it's at with these. I had both a Series 1 and Series 2, so much fun to drive and get 9 MPG in. These really need a specialized mechanic. The ignition systems are so touchy, and using aftermarket coil packs or wires causes a lot of issues, but people do because the OEM's are very pricey. But it is always more costly to replace a second time.
VR will have even less of an impact on mechanics than OBD 2. Most people don't want to work on their cars, they just want the car to work when they get in it to drive somewhere.
Ability of computer to assist mechanic (and, maybe call in the mechanic) will depend on instrumentation added to cars (with - I hope - standardization. The engine could tell you there is a leak of any fluid or pressurized system. And perhaps pinpoint it. Someday. Maybe.
Wouldn’t a possible repair would be to clean the PCM connectors? Humid Florida is great and corroding electrical connectors.
@jdub264 I would at least check powers and grounds... And like you said, terminal fretting at the connectors... Check and test everything you can before calling a PCM...
When you said you might have to get your head in this little hole here, I couldn't help to think that, that dude has already accomplished that.
Bruhh
I'd get hurt wearing VR goggles. Great video Ray
I am called a Luddite because of my resistance to certain technology. I do not upgrade my phone when the latest one comes out; they do not make calls any better. I frequently leave my phone at home while running errands around town. I seek cars with minimal technology avoiding things like lane assist and auto-parking which are all sizzle, no steak.
Great video, as usual. Fun fact about AI. AI develops it's so call knowledge from on-line sources. As more and more on-line source become AI generated, it means it will become a feedback loop. Garbage in means garbage out.
When i go to a mechanic, and I'm sure most people share this sentiment.. It's primarily for 2 reasons: 1. I don't have the tools, 2. I seriously have better things to do then fold myself into an S to reach some part.. There's people for this with the tools to do it, and they're called mechanics .. I'll keep paying a pro to work on my cars because experience matters!
For the most part I agree with your assessment of how VR will impact mechanics. I do think it could grow to be a vital tool over time if onboarded correctly.
It could replace the need to buy a number of other individual tools like thermal meters. Especially if it gets tuned to the point it can recognize things like hot spots in wiring. The data is there, it's a question of whether the human eye can see it, or feel it.
Image recognition could quickly pull part numbers.
At the end of the day, more data to make an accurate diagnosis is great. But you still need someone to do the work, and assess whether AI got it right. The AI relies on input to build its own model. It doesn't take much garbage input to bias or invalidate an AI model.
Even the best guide is no replacement for actual experience. That's my thoughts on the VR thing.
Embrace the technology and take the mark
The only way such vr glasses can work is when a technician can see what the customer is looking at in his vr glasses and is able to make an arrow on that screen so the customer can plug it back. But that is a very limited use case that can be solved with a video call
Computers have already made people stupid with cars. I have been a mechanic, service writer, and parts guy. I have seen it all! But my best proof that everyone, even most "professional" mechanics (except you ray which is why we love you), have become way to dependent on machines is this.
A lady comes into my shop and says I have a (I forget excat make model, but GM 5.3L engine) I need a oil pump. I am not paying you guys your rip off fee for looking at it, I have already had it looked at I need a oil pump. I just want you to put the oil pump in as cheap as possible. So I say "ok have the tow truck drop it in a spot, I will get you written up". She says "tow truck"? I say "yeah isn't it on a tow truck here"? "No why would it be towed?" "Well it's a oil pump, so the engine has no/low oil pressure?" I asked. "Well yeah, I guess, I don't know. My check engine light came on, I had someone pull the codes, they told me I need a oil pump. They wanted thousands of dollars and I didn't have it at the time, so I have been saving up and finally have enough money to do it, which is why I don't want to pay to tell me the same thing again". (Not sure why she didn't return to the original guy to have him do the job but I digress) "Wait back up a moment, how long ago was this?" I ask. "Um probably like 6 months ago". "And you have just been driving it around normal? And there are no weird crazy knocking or banging noises coming from the engine?" I ask.
For those of you who don't a engine with no oil pressure would be luck to survive minutes before making crazy noises and self destructing, a engine with low oil pressure depending on how low and when could potentially make it 6 months, but even that is unlikely. So on ward with the story.
So she responds "no no issues, just the check engine light". So I explain to her it is highly, highly unlikely she actually needs a oil pump and she really needs to pay me my diagnostic fee to tell her what she really needs (I suspect I already know the answer) and diagnostic fee and cost to replace whatever it is combined will probably be cheaper then just doing the oil pump. I will do the oil pump but it will not fix her issue and she will have to pay that and for me to diagnose it. She kind of hims and haws but I am confident I am right and she is wasting money. I really hate to see people waste money, and I am so confident I am right I finally say "tell you what agree to pay me diagnose it, if I come up with it needing a oil pump I won't charge you the diag fee, and I will even knock a little bit off the job. If I come back something else you will pay my normal diag fee, and then what ever the correct job is you need done". She says deal.
For those of you who don't know the GM 5.3s are known to have the oil pressure sensor fail. More specifically there is a little screen that clogs that prevents the oil pressure from making it to the sensor. Either way the cars ECM sees a no oil pressure reading on the oil pressure sensor and triggers a code and check engine light. The code says "low/no oil pressure" (I forget the exact code and am to lazy to Google). If one sees a code that says low no oil pressure one might be inclined to instantly jump to you need what ever it is that creates said oil pressure, in this case the oil pump (after taking the most basics of step of making sure there is oil in the engine I would hope thou in this day and age who the heck knows). I mean the engine has oil, and the computer is telling you there is no pressure so clearly the pressure making device has failed right? Right?
Wrong in all my years of working on cars I have never, ever seen one that actually had a failed pump. I have seen hundreds where I ended up replacing the sensor and screen (after a thoro diagnosis of making sure I am actually getting oil pressure and getting power and grounds where I should). But I guess what? Even thou every single one I have seen has had the same issue, and even thou there is a 99.99% chance the next one I see will also, every. Single. Time. I come across this I do a proper check. Do we have? What condition is it in? Is the sensor plugged in and all the wiring good? Are we actually making oil pressure? Then and only then do I replace that sensor and screen. If it were my car I would probably take the risk and just replace the sensor once I seen that code, but a customers car? Nope no way Jose.
By the way in case you were wondering yes I was correct on that ladies car, that was exactly what she needed.
They said the same thing when robots entered into manufacturing. I still have a job, but it's a lot easier then it was before.
The USAF tried a similar thing with Google Glasses years ago. While it was really handy to have the technical data in front of you at all times, it did not replace the intellect of the mechanic repairing/inspecting the equipment. Also, it turned out the glasses were stupidly expensive and not very durable.
I wonder what Eric O 's opinion will be about the VR Headsets ? Or Maybe what Pine Hollow has to add to that concept. Thank you for another great video. Stay safe out there. Cheers
Lol, no matter what they come up with as long as there are vehicles, mechanics will always be needed.