Science Failed FISETIN - Here's Why
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- Опубліковано 12 чер 2024
- THIS IS AN ABRIDGED VERSION
Last year, Dr. Brad Stanfield posted a video on why he stopped taking Fisetin and Quercetin,
two of the most popular supplements in our longevity community.
This comes in contrast to many other longevity experts such as Dr. David Sinclair, Dr Robbins, and Dr. Kirkland.
This contradiction was based on a new Fisetin study conducted by the prestigious ITP organization showing no lifespan benefits nor senescent cell removal.
And today, we’ll do a very thorough investigation into the Study brad Stanfield mentioned.
This study was conducted by an organization called the ITP.
I've found something that shocked me about their study which I’ll show you today.
And what do I do with this information - do I take fisetin or shun it like Brad Stanfield?
I've published a free concise report on QUERCETIN after 6 months of research with 300+ studies, at:
www.WellnessMessiah.com/Gift
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✅ Suggest watching next:
• EXERCISE, Resveratrol ...
Study References:
www.nia.nih.gov/research/dab/...
journals.plos.org/plosbiology...
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✅ The favorite videos on this channel - playlist:
• Longevity Favorites
Chapters:
00:00 Intro
3:44 The Perpetrators: ITP
12:28 The Supporting Actors: Mice
23:30 The Secret Agent: Fisetin
25:33 Questions for the Study
31:22 Entering the Crime Scene
44:01 What Do I Do
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The Wellness Messiah podcast is available on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and Overcast.
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Credits: Scott Buckley
Disclaimer & Disclosure: The information in this video and/or at this channel is not intended to replace a one-on-one relationship with a qualified health care professional and is not intended as medical advice. It is intended as a sharing of knowledge, educational and information from the research and experience of Rimon, who encourages you to make your own health care decisions based upon your research and in partnership with a qualified health care professional.
Rimon is not a medical doctor. If there is a contradiction between the advice here to your doctor or local authorities, always go with the doctor and the authorities.
Statements made, or solutions suggested in this video and/or at this channel are not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease.
I've published a free concise report on quercetin after 6 months of research with 300+ studies, at:
www.WellnessMessiah.com/Gift
✅ Check the special deal of habits creation app + my routine for longevity:
wellnessmessiah.com/app
Disclaimer: I'm an affiliate of the company - I trust their product. Buying will support my channel.
Thank you so much for breaking this down for us. And thank you for all of the wonderful work and research you do to distill down the massive amounts of contradictory information thrown at us as we seek to live longer and better lives. Bless you, dear boy!
Your research , knowledge & time are appreciated .
You have a real talent for making complex material so easy to understand - thank you!!
Thank you Julie, you're very kind.
Again great explained video!
This was great! Thank you for this
Another brilliant Analysis!!!
That’s my boy! I love your brain !
Thanks for the summary, very helpful
Thank you for the simplification of the material
Really nice, clear and logic. Have you seen the interview with one of the responsible of ITP in the Sheeky science show? Especially the talk on rapamycine and benefit of exercise? There was as well the talk on acaborse.
Rimon 😂 Always appreciate the light heated self deprecating sarcastic dry humor!
I didn’t finish the longer version of this either but fully intended to do thanks for this. Btw, if you’re a 1-man shop I’m sure you could solicit a volunteer “hire” that would help you with edits on things like this. Paul Saladino does a great job of this where he takes 60+ min interviews and chunks them down and releases them topically as a stand-alone. Sometimes this also helps when we need to rewatch to help retain something of particular internet to us. You have enough subscribers now to get volunteer help like Anthony Chaffee did.
It's an excellent idea Tom. and I'm not sarcastic at all!
My pre-meditated idea was to find someone physically here in London just because my editing requires a deep understanding of the issue. The question would be then: would the teaching make sense to be done on a long term employee instead of a volunteer.
@@WellnessMessiah Tnat makes sense but it sure how costly it would be. In the nature of a global remote world you might just solicit interest initially and see if you recognize any reliable names who’d like to just help you out? Some could probably do this skill set in their sleep. Should it yield an aggregate increase in viewers for you it could always become a paid role, maybe?
You’re a likable guy and knowledgeable and we are all waiting to hear great recovery news for your wife too so surely someone will happily help!
Really appreciate the content too. I’m still torn now on fisetin since I’m healthy and fit 44 year old so not sure if senescence applies to me much yet. Will have to watch your video again and see if low dose fisetin ultimately applies to me.
What are your thoughts on a monthly or bi-monthly blast of senolytics with higher dosed fisetin and Resveratrol? Or is the research pretty clear about senescent cells in healthy folks not being an issue at all until the 50’s?
You almost had me on the sarcastic sarcasm comment too! Lol
Thank you for your time very helpful
Thanks for your kindness mike!
I'm wondering about any downsides of removing senescent cells, as they also can promote homeostasis and repair. I have an autoimmune disease. Can senolytics help or hurt me?
I think that we also need to factor in that mice usually absorb these molecules way better.
But by now, there's no need to doubt that these molecules will kill senescent cells due to studies on molecular pathways.
I think the dosage will be heavily dependant on the individual due to many factors, but mainly liver enzymes and lifestyle.
Since a more stressful life increases need of anti oxidants by a lot, so it changes the equation also.
Personally I take around 2g of polyphenols overall, but I do strength training and have a stressful life + I am heavy.
If I had an office job and didn't strength train, I would probably take around 1g at most, doubt there's a benefit to more unless sick, or overweight.
I would say even the choice of polyphenols is dependant on the individual and their bloodpanel/goals tbh.
On a side note: EGCG seems to also have senolytic properties.
As a 65 yo male in excellent physical condition via resistance and cardio training (185lbs, 6’2” and 11% body fat) your thoughts on taking Fisetin 3 days of the month @ 20 mg/kg and low dose 3 mg/kg the remaking days. Thank you
Rimon takes a low dose fisetin (which range in mg?) in combination with a low dose resveratrol (which range in mg) / at the end of this video he says he would take it every quarter and this confuses me : does this mean he takes it every day during first and third quarter of the year ? (I am 80 years old)
Thank you very, very much. I was taking high does Fisetin, or close, about 13 mg/kg, but cut back to half that for convenience. Based on what I have learned, that was a mistake. Instead of decreasing it 50%, I should have increased it 50%. I am about 70, so no doubt I have a few senescent cells to clear. I also have low-intermediate grade Prostate Cancer. Can I presume that high-does Fisetin is more effective at encouraging apoptosis?
What kind of food needs to be used to take fisetin? Oily like avocado, or fruits like kiwi will work?
Also, fisetin clearance is fairly fast in mice with a half life of about 3 hours, so by adding to food, and if food is consumed over the course of a day you never get a peak amount which might be needed to kill SCs. On other hand if taken as a bolus, should we take with a small amount of fatty food (or food with piperine) to aid in absorption?
MY QUESTION: I am 79. Should i take low dosages of F, R, AND Q DAILY N ADDITION 2 HIGH DOSAGES PERHAPS QUARTERLY? Secondly, when doing a high dosage, is it wise to do all 3 at the same time or rotate doing 1 one month another the next month?
The recent astaxanthin study as well as this fisetin study highlights other study problems, even with ITP.
They need to provide human equivalent dose in summary.
They need to provide information on absorption and how food matrix or water affects absorption (maybe check blood levels).
Provide rationale for dosing regime. The astaxanthin study used a very high dose which was not at all near what normal dietary or even supplement dosage would be and never showed what human equivalent would be making it easy for people to jump to conclusions. Why?
Hi! Trying to buy your infoproduct but it does not complete the purchase. 😢
Hi, interesting. I will check it out. In the meantime, try a different device (PC vs phone) or credit card (could be blocked by your credit card company)
@@WellnessMessiah Thanks. Did it. Tryed in two devices and two credit cards.
@@DrNoeNutrologo Hi, the customer service wants to contact you but they need your email. So the best way is simply to send them an email yourself at info@ultiself.com and add a screenshot of our conversation here.
@DrNoeAlvaregnfa The tech team has checked to my request, the page, and it has had many sales in the last week. They tested the page also and it works. Most likely it's the browser (especially Safari is known to cause problems) or the credit card.
If one is taking for senescence effects would it not be best to take it alternately..so the body has a period to rebuild from the autophagy?
Yes, but focus on toxicity instead of autophagy. High-dose quercetin becomes toxic to senescent cells but possibly to other cells. Hence toxicity has to be controlled. It takes 14-21 days for new senescent cells to wake up. So 3 weeks is the bare minimum between cycling.
Thank you. And what period of dosing at the high dose would you surmise to destroy the senescent cells?
Is this video about longevity?
How does DNA 'think' what is the mechanism that DNA uses to decide if the cell should live or die. Do you have any studies you can recommend that would help explain this process
Hi what I give you is interpretation. The studies well document how the DNA behaves differently based on the dose. In essence, there is an observation and there is the meaning.
There are pathway such as MAPK and "tell" the DNA what's going on, too.
This is the meaning that I gave to the observation, which is well documented. Check for example what I showed in this episode on the tiebreaker system:
ua-cam.com/video/JYs1on8EiFU/v-deo.html
You mention your wife had a stroke. Might perispinal etanercept stroke treatment help her?
How is your wife doing?
I haven't heard anything really recently, and I'm really curious and what are you doing to help her regain who she is. I'm doing pretty well myself I have and I'm just chugging along. More than anything, I am really curious about both your wife and my and myself as when it comes to a possible MRI of our areas that were affected sometime in the future.
George Davis
Thank you for asking George. I was just speaking to her today about making another update, and I will show the complete home program we have. I hope you can use it to accelerate your progress. She progresses nicely but started with such a severe stroke that she has a long way to go.
@@WellnessMessiah Because they were able to get me in so quickly I was able to retain most who I am. They pulled 2 blood clots out of me. So at this point in my journey, I have most of who I want to be. Take care of yourself
George Davis
Is it okay to take for a 39 year old liposomally once or twice a week?
I would like some help i bought the app but never received anything. What can i do? Thank you.
Hi Shirley, sorry for that. 99% it's in the spam folder. Also, contact info@ultiself.com. They will help you
Low dose fisetin and quercetin could well lower the SASPs without killing senescent cells, which could lead to less senescent cells accumulation over time, since the SASP increase the degeneration of neighbouring cells. Many compounds can do that without being senolytics per se.
You say you combine several polyphenols at low dose to get a synergistic effect, but maybe by doing that you get an effect that might be strong enough to kill senescent cells. Like if Sinclair takes 500mg quercetin and 500mg fisetin plus the resveratrol that may be enough to kill the senescent cells, all the more that he does CR I believe, which should make the senescent cells easier to kill. If that's really the case and if he does that all the time he may be killing too many senescent cells. And also these senolytics don't have very good selectivity ( I think it's about 60% for quercetin and 90% for fisetin or something like that ), so he might be killing a lot of good cells.
This is correct. Low dose quercetin is senomorphic, reducing SASP. High dose probaly is senolytic, kills them. These supplements live and die on the dose.
Dr Brad just released a video saying Resveretrol decreases testosterone. Can you comment in this please?
dude ur amazing lol
Does Rimon Lumen ( metabolic researcher) have any medical education? If not, what is his education? Why do have to listen to his advice?
Hi Maxim yes studied chemistry, biotechnology, biotechnology, did labs, and statistics. Certified in metabolic typing, too. Have excellence scholarships and such. But I care more about results than certifications, which I show here. very few achieve results in real life - the end goal of all research and the ultimate proof of interpretation of studies:
ua-cam.com/video/S0zvpeWvU_k/v-deo.html
basically no
Can you discuss fisetin as a topoisomerase 2 poison, and possible long term effects?
Haven't researched it enough (hence the jury is still out on low-dose fisetin). Barry, Send me studies I will check them and use for a future fisetin video
@@WellnessMessiah This is one of many papers: The dietary flavonoids myricetin and fisetin act as dual inhibitors of DNA topoisomerases I and II in cells
Author links open overlay panelMiguel López-Lázaro a b, Elaine Willmore a c, Caroline A. Austin
Also: Phytochemicals as Anticancer and Chemopreventive
Topoisomerase II Poisons 10.1007/s11101-013-9291-7
Too bad all the men don't have a character like yours Rimon
i GET SICK OF THESE GUYS TELLING YOU TAKE THIS AND THE OTHER HALF TELLING YOU NO! MY QUERCERTIN CAME TODAY AND I SHALL TAKE IT! NOT SURE ABOUT FISETIN, FIRST TIME I'VE HEARD OF IT
Same with everything isn't it? Half will tell you it's good, and the other half will tell you it's bad. It's been to try it yourself and make up your own mind.
enjoy wasting your money and risking your health on unproven supplements
Why waste your money on quercetin given its probably miniscule life extension? The only thing worth spending money on is rapamycin. Probably will even help with your wife's stroke. Try to do a video on rapamycin and stroke.
rapamycin is a double-edged sword
The issue is - 99.9% of viewers won't be able to access rapamycin. Do I really help them by showing benefits and instructions for taking something they don't have access to? I'd be frustrated in their shoes. And my sister is a doctor, I could get this drug myself, BTW.
You can get it overseas online. I just started three weeks ago a once weekly dose of 6 mg.. I'm 63 and super healthy, rock climb three times a week. I'm interested in seeing what happens. @@WellnessMessiah
After watching all the interviews I could find, I think Richard from ITP doesnt like fisetin and designed it to fail.
Does Dr Brad and Dr Sinclair have a problem with each other? I think so