I do not believe it was valid due to turnout I believe they would have lost anyway in a legitimate referendum But honoring their customs about death and emphasizing a better turnout would have solidified the legitimacy of the vote Hopefully, the people would accept that
The boycott was deliberate to expire the timeframe of the referendum that would make the terms and conditions of Noumea Accords invalid and hence, reinstating the talks of independence again. France ignored their pathetic tactics and went ahead with the democratic process. End of.
Nope. And in any case France has no business there almost at their antipodes. France is not anymore a great power and can't expect to hold to its residual colonial empire in general, not even in Corsica, which is in Europe. It's just a matter of time: Kanaky will be free and so will be Guadaloupe, Reunion, Martinique (the motherland of Fannon), Guyenne, Reunion, Mayotte and "French" Polynesia.
I think the voting process was valid - in that France, didn't stuff the ballot or anything like that - but Paris easily could've delayed the referendum to allow the pro-independence parties to participate. Even if they had lost again, which I think was more than likely, it would've been a more definitive and fair end to the process started with the Noumea Accord. So, in that sense, I don't think how the 2021 referendum was conducted is valid.
@@LuisAldamizSo you’re saying the referendums don’t matter now, the French have to leave regardless. Then whats the point of the referendums. The majority of NC have the voted to stay with France and only a minority wants independence.
It is, but New Caledonia being under French rule is interesting too. We're just used to western powers meddling with countries in the other side of the world
azerbaijan thinks of itself as invincible thanks to their successful military campaign, the temporary leverage they have over the eu and the support that turkey gives them, now they're trying to use their perceived power to fight against the countries that have wronged them in the past(armenia, france, USA, russia, iran), they know that donig anything against the USA is suicide and they're too scared of starting a conflict against neighboring russia and iran so currently all they're doing is trying to bully france and armenia
@@firecreeper2249 Does 10 million Azerbaijan bullying 70 million France sound believable to you? Have you read the egregious statements Macron or the French senate had made about Azerbaijan? The real bullying is France not doing anything as the head of the Minsk Group, and now fueling Armenian revanchism with military aid while trying to prevent the peace treaty between Azerbaijan and Armenia from being signed. With France undermining the territorial integrity of Azerbaijan for the last 30 years, there's little recourse left, other than to retaliate in the same vein. If you don't retaliate, the bullying only gets worse.
The irony that the patriots of a country that just expelled the entire native population of a region that is dejure under their control now act appaled about voting reforms in french territory is not lost on me.
It sounds surreal until you see it happening everywhere. One thing making so many people hesitant about the west's support for Ukraine getting invaded by Russia, is that western countries invade other countries all of the time - there's a thing swaying those who support some independences & not others.
@@bneymanov territorial integrity of Azeribaijan? I think the fact they pogromed armenians out of their territory then declared intent to pressure for even more border changes along ethnic grounds, EXACTLY WHAT ARMENIA DID, makes this excuse laughable. the fucking legislature of Nagorno-Karabakh voted to join Armenia, so if the baku regime wants to play ethnic determinism after obliterating their minorites they should be ignored.
@@TingTong2568 classic, gets shot up with facts and copes with “bs” 😢😢😢. You literally have no argument because you’re a brainwashed zombie who only listens to one side
@@bneymanov quick question, why did Armenia not annex the entirety of Nakhichevan then? It was entirely cut off from Baku during the entire war. How did the Azeris stop being to majority in Armenia???? Are you fucking stupid? They NEVER were the majority in Modern Armenian territories. this is a total lie. Armenia had a sizeable Azeri minority, mostly centered in Yerevan. Likewise, Azerbaijan had an Armenian minority, concentrated in Baku and Kirovabad. if they wanted to be psychos and larp as Greater Armenia, Mets Hayk, then that land is fucking dead to rights included. But amazingly they didn't, isn't that crazy? almost like their goal wasn't to kill all Azeris and restore historical lands. maybe it was about the population that wanted to leave. Ohh but why would they feel unsafe, Azeris never did anything to Armenians before 1990!!!! That's a lie. the Shusha pogrom was brutal killing FIVE HUNDRED Armenians on the Conservative end of estimates, the high end estimates are in the thousands! Citing a contemporary Armenian government report, Hovannisian places the death toll of the massacre at 500 Armenians and the destruction of many buildings in Shusha. German historian Jörg Baberowski states that the Armenian quarter of Shusha was "wiped off the face of the earth", indicated by 25 of 1,700 homes surviving the pogrom; also adding that 8,000 Armenians were massacred during the pogrom. Soviet historian Marietta Shaginyan wrote that 3-4 thousand or more than 12 thousand Armenians were killed and 7,000 homes were destroyed in three-days. The Great Soviet Encyclopedia entry for Shusha writes that "up to 20 percent of the population [of Shusha] died" when the city was burned. That was committed by Azeris in 1920! Fucking ages before 1990. There were in total 11 massacres of Armenians committed by Azeris. Armenians massacring Azeris? There were 3. Four, if you count the one where the Russian Army was involved. I will not deny that the Armenians failed to prevent war crimes. Their conduct was horrendous in Khojaly. But I bet you will fucking lie through your teeth about Azeri forces also massacring Armenians in the exact same region. Kirovabad pogrom. Baku Pogrom. Operation Ring. Maraga Massacre. Only fucking Azerbaijan says 613 people died in Khojaly. More than 200 (per Human Rights Watch) was the original estimate with a swing upwards. If you wanna play a numbers game like a sicko, all the fucking massacres combined that Azeris did meets or exceeds the deaths that Armenia caused. That shouldn't be the POINT. ANY death was bad, but you play this whataboutism to justify when Azeris fucking murder Armenians, instead of admitting both are atrocious. Losing the war for Nagorno-Karabakh doesn't make you some innocent martyr, it just makes you the loser in a war between two Ethnonationalist states. They even got Karabakh back. That should've been the end, if they had ANY intention of ruling as a fair, moral government. But No. they immediately betray their claims of national border integrity by pushing for border adjustments in Armenia proper. Disgusting rampant ethno-nationalism dressed up in a victim complex, with the mask dropped as soon as they had the advantage.
@@bneymanov quick question, why did Armenia not annex the entirety of Nakhichevan then? It was entirely cut off from Baku during the entire war. How did the Azeris stop being to majority in Armenia???? Are you stupid? They NEVER were the majority in Modern Armenian territories. this is a total lie. Armenia had a sizeable Azeri minority, mostly centered in Yerevan. Likewise, Azerbaijan had an Armenian minority, concentrated in Baku and Kirovabad. That was it. if they wanted to be psychos and larp as Greater Armenia, Mets Hayk, then that land is dead to rights included. But amazingly they didn't, isn't that crazy? almost like their goal wasn't to kill all Azeris and restore historical lands. maybe it was about the population that wanted to leave. Ohh but why would they feel unsafe, Azeris never did anything to Armenians before 1990!!!! That's a lie. the Shusha pogrom was brutal killing FIVE HUNDRED Armenians on the Conservative end of estimates, the high end estimates are in the thousands! Citing a contemporary Armenian government report, Hovannisian places the death toll of the massacre at 500 Armenians and the destruction of many buildings in Shusha. German historian Jörg Baberowski states that the Armenian quarter of Shusha was "wiped off the face of the earth", indicated by 25 of 1,700 homes surviving the pogrom; also adding that 8,000 Armenians were massacred during the pogrom. Soviet historian Marietta Shaginyan wrote that 3-4 thousand or more than 12 thousand Armenians were killed and 7,000 homes were destroyed in three-days. The Great Soviet Encyclopedia entry for Shusha writes that "up to 20 percent of the population [of Shusha] died" when the city was burned. That was committed by Azeris in 1920! Ages before 1990! There were in total 11 massacres of Armenians committed by Azeris. Armenians massacring Azeris? There were 3. Four, if you count the one where the Russian Army was involved. I will not deny that the Armenians failed to prevent war crimes. Their conduct was horrendous in Khojaly. But I bet you will lie through your teeth about Azeri forces also massacring Armenians in the exact same region. Kirovabad pogrom. Baku Pogrom. Operation Ring. Maraga Massacre. Only Azerbaijan says 613 people absolutely died in Khojaly, so if you wanna play a numbers game like a sicko, all the massacres combined that Azeris did meets or exceeds the deaths that Armenia caused. That shouldn't be the POINT. ANY death was bad, but you play this whataboutism to justify when Azeris murder Armenians, instead of admitting both are atrocious. Losing the war for Nagorno-Karabakh doesn't make you some innocent martyr, it just makes you the loser in a war between two Ethnonationalist states. Azerbaijan even got Karabakh back. That should've been the end, if they had ANY intention of ruling as a fair, moral government. But No. they immediately betray their claims of national border integrity by pushing for border adjustments in Armenia proper. Disgusting rampant ethno-nationalism dressed up in a victim complex, with the mask dropped as soon as they had the advantage.
Honestly one of the most wild geopolitical things right now.. I mean Azerbaijan, a caucasus nation, supporting a Pacific Island territory of France with a similar flag tricolor???
@@theblueskyisstolensunlight it's not really for the good of Baku's heart, it's just to hurt France, but I mean they SHOULD let go of their influence in Africa and whoever desires independence, because self determination is quite important. But if you tell that to Azerbaijan, they would quickly say "No" about self determination which really goes to show what their true desire is in doing this.
@flappley look, Baku will never seriously support any separatist movement within France métropole. But Africa and the Pacific are different. These are territories of colonies, however you call them. In the case of Caledonia and French Polynesia, bad relationships with France are a bonus, not a cause. Azerbaijan has talked against neo-colonialism for years.
France has been undermining azerbaijan's territorial integrity by supporting the karabakh terrorists for ages. Are you really surprised when Azer does the same back to France?
Your statistics part is a bit wrong. The Europeans (including Caldoches, Zoreilles and Metros) make up 30% of the island population. And it's too simplistic to qualify each people orientation toward independence based on their origin, since there's some mix. Kanaks makes up of the majority of the electorate for the referendums for example
Your data is incorrect because the Kanaks comprise just 42% of the population while the French settlers 37% (not 30% as what you said) and remaining percentage are made up of Polynesians, Wallisians, Indonesians, Vietnamese, and others which totals 58% of the population of NewCal and all theirs voters are for "Non".
@@flxdz7103 Most of them CANT VOTE based on the Noumea Accords. Most the electorate for the referendums are consisting of Kanaks and they still voted NO. NewCal is and will be French. Move on.
@@xhaozhaoWhy support France holding on to its colonies like a tick? They along with anyone who supports colonialism/imperialism should be made a pariah its embarrassing for a country like France which loves to repeat American rhetoric about freedom and democracy. This idea that “they held a referendum and lost, move on” is very childish id be surprised if you’re stupid enough to speak like that in public. Again its very embarrassing for you. Which referendum was held for France to be there in the first place? Moving its own citizens and other europeans over take over homes and land while they ship most of the non European inhabitants to various other islands to work as plantation slaves. Was there a referendum for that? The kanak couldn’t even vote until the 60s, do you think that hundreds of years of brutal indignation can just be wiped away by dubious referendums which already inherently favour loyalists? I dont know what to say to people like you who think simply stating “democracy” is a valid argument. As though “democracy = right”
@@flxdz7103everyone on New Caledonia is a settler. Get this atavistic racist essentialism out of here fascist. New Caledonia is a nation of immigrants.
@adrianmcconnell5984 these ppl voted against not even pure kanaka and most them are foreigners. Imagine someone coming to your house demand u hand over your house
@@hittingdasaucesmart people will not choose independence. Just look at all those independent pacific nations and how they are doing. Also mayotte va comoros.
This episode was more of an update to our older one; I can’t say exactly when, but I do plan to cover Bougainville soon - especially since this video performed reasonably well!
New Caledonia is a non-Western nation in Melanesia that’s still under French colonial rule. Give it up France, the time of overseas colonial empires is over. Let the Kanak people have their own independent sovereign state.
The island had three independence referendums and all three ended with them wanting to stay in France. The case is closed. It's French land. Every adult French citizen should be given full voting rights and these rioters charged with insurrection.
@@elguido That is a foolish comparison. New Caledonia has been a French territory for over a 150 years. Turkish immigrants are just immigrants. They don't have any rights or claim to revert sovereign territory to a foreign nation. Try another ridiculous straw man next time.
@@elguido If they are not German citizen they can't vote. And a town is still under the legislation of the country it's a part of... your example is really bad
@HisShadow No, your argument is the ridiculous one. Its very arbitrary. Where is the line? Turkish immigrants have been in Germany for like 40 years or so now. You say New Caledonia was colonized 150 years ago. I guess there's a universal 150-year rule that says if u own a land for that time its yours forever? What kind of nonsense is that. People have the right to self determination regardless of ur arbitrary rules
Because they can or rather because they *could* (past tense). 150 years ago there were no great powers on Earth other than those of Europe (incipiently the USA maybe, not even Japan had kickstarted yet) and one of the most persistent European powers was always France. This have of course changed a bit in the last century or so but old habits die hard and the great superpower USA is not particularly interested in dissolving the residual colonial empires of its vassals, which come handy oftentimes.
We kind of will address that in a future video about some of France’s other overseas territories, but I definitely think we’ll do a video on the Second French colonial empire at some point as well.
@@GhostCountries I don't know which territories you're going to cover, but I personally have always found French Guiana pretty interesting - it actually sort of has a history similar to that of New Caledonia, having been a penal colony, etc.
Why France has an empire could be answered in so many ways, but considering 3 days ago was the anniversary of the 1944 Normandy Landing a simple answer can just be: Nobody stopped the French empire.
Is it an Empire if the population are Full Citizens with complete rights? Unless France has completely banned Independence referendums, its hard to call this an Empire on the levels of the Old Imperial ones.
@@gorkaaustin5306 I hope you agree then with the Indigenous peoples of Europe rising up against the invasion of their homelands by non-Indigenous people from Africa and Asia.
2:48 - this fact changed my mind! I initially read the situation through my personal biases: 1) a lot of referendum movements seem to love calling a second referendum until they get the results they want. I see those movements as less legitimate. Hearing the Nouméa Accords were set up to have a series of referenda, well that changes that in my eyes. 2) I’m generally critical of the UN definition of colonies, the list points the finger at US, UK, and French islands but totally consigns the policies of Russia and China towards their “autonomous” regions as sufficiently not colonial. I know China has agitated the Kanaky movement which gets me critical. I thought the agreement was very fair saying these French that came here in the 70s, their children, New Caledonia is the only home they know they have a say. But the expiring timeline opening up the referendum to new arrivals, I have to concede, it would be more legitimate to postpone the agreed upon final referendum to happen after the pandemic with the voting requirements of the Noumea accords still applicable. 3) In my generally right wing worldview, it’s easy to see anti-colonialism as that old meme of the guy on the bike putting a rod in the spokes and then blaming whatever the meme is about. My first scan of the issue was France pours a lot of development money into New Caledonia, would an independent Kanaky pull an *almost everywhere in Africa* and turn into a corrupt, economic laggard and still be demanding this development as “reparations” - I thought obviously. But hearing they’re concerned with replacement migration? I… kind of have to say maybe they’re more based than I thought?
Really? I'm not really "surprised" (the whole "Weimar Regime" in all Europe is showing terrible cracks as it operates against objective European interests and in favor of foreign ones rather) but I'm not aware of the details re. Austria either.
@@LuisAldamizwhat the fuck are you talking about, what does this have to do with the Weimarer Republik. It seems its not only the details youre unaware of
@@drillerkiller9 - The Weimar Republic was ruled by a coalition of conservative and social-dems much like the EU (and many of its member states) is. That's the core comparison and you should be able to understand it if you know the relevant history. It was in Germany the "Grosse Koalition" over and over, largely because the opposition was the KPD, which was very much undesired for the bourgeois direction of the post-revolution regime. The Weimar coalition also facilitated in various ways the rise of Nazism, first of all with the murderous violence of the Freikorps, later by pretty much voting a red carpet for the rise of Hitler to power. This last is also happening now in the EU, with Von der Leyen getting cozy with the likes of Meloni, a confessed follower of Mussolini's ideas and political project, supporting the Nazi regime in Ukraine, repressing the anti-genocide protests, etc. The comparison may not be perfect (no comparison is) but it's quite good anyhow.
The amount of mental fuc*ery you must’ve done for this to be your conclusion. Tell me why France should be there? What referendum was held for them to invade and commit the most egregious forms of human rights abuses toward the people of those islands in the first place? Who cares about Azerbaijan and turkey this kind of coping is just pathetic when by every definition France is wrong.
Not much to do with the seriousness of this video but please bear with me. Firstly, I live in British Columbia, Canada whose original name was "New Caledonia". When it was pointed out than another place already had that name, we changed it. I mean how many "London's", "Paris's, and "Berlin's" are there in the world? Secondly BC had a gold rush and many Hawaiians came to the nearby English Colony to search for gold, and stayed. They called themselves "Kanaka's" which sound remarkably similar to "Kanak" . Does anyone know if these words are related or just a coincidence. P.S, there is the village of "Kanaka", on the Fraser River there is "Kanaka Bar", There is also "Kanaka Bay" and many "Kanaka Road (street, etc.) Of note is that we have a US friend born in Hawaii and today "Kanaka" is not a good term, in Hawaii, being their equivalent to "Half breed" (yes, like the Cher song). Thank you for letting me ask my questions.
Okay; so, I looked into this a bit after seeing your comment and what I found is the term "kanaka" comes from "kanaka ʻoiwi" or "kanaka maoli" and basically means "man" or "human" in the Hawaiian language. While it originally was just used for Hawaiians, the term did eventually get applied to other peoples from Polynesia and Melanesia. The word seems to have existed for centuries before European contact, but still, I will admit it does sound a lot like Kanak.
@@GhostCountries Above and beyond the call of duty. Thank You for something I had no idea how to "solve". P.S. the Gold Rush was in 1858 Of interest I found this reference from Australia:- 'A Kanaka refers to South Pacific islanders who were employed in Queensland, Australia, during the late 19th and early 20th centuries. Most of these laborers were from Melanesia," might be connection to New Caledonia and the Kanak.
It is the subject of considerable debate. There are those who see the benefits of this union of two worlds. But there is diversity even within this ethnic group. For some the consequences are not as important as the vision of independence.
@@Retroist2024diversity is strength full stop. Are you implying that the kanak’s aren’t fully human. I’m open to being convinced- not exactly a culture that was going to split the atom of their own- but that is a pretty radical claim.
Any geographically and ethnically non-European country- its our land, we are native and everyone arriving 5 minutes after us is coloniser and have no right and should leave and we should be independent, no matter how small and remote our island is, we change nothing and say we should is racist imperialism and colonialism. European country- there are no thing like native, we were always country of immigrants, and its racist to demand any special consideration for locals over anyone just arriving from other part of world, no person is illegal, local must accommodate them and change so they feel welcome and as home, nationalism and sovereignty should die with 19th century imperialists.
Not true for Africa or even most of Asia. Try and see how hard it would be for a European citizen to move there. And if you think all of Europe is all rainbows and unicorns around immigration just look at the way ethno nationalism built the European borders of the world we live in today and look at how native European minorities were treated. Or just look at what happens to the people small islands IN Europe. Extinguished languages, cultures, nationalities. Forced migrations, religious conflict. But sure, your social media (woke/anti-woke) informed view is valid too.
At first, I was quite sympathetic to the Kanak. However, over time, I've become less so. While for a time restricting votes from recent immigrants made sense to "decolonialize" the local government and to give power to a group that previously was unable to control their fate, times are now different. Recent immigrants are not just French, they are also Indonesians, Vietnamese, and Tahitians. How can you expect such people to control their own fate while disenfranchised from local elections?
ah so its ok to disenfranchise white people now? Racial double standards much? whats up with the anti white hatred and bias now? is it not okay to be white?
The Kanak are a minority on the island, hence why they are so preciously guarding the right to vote on the island. If it "got independence" would they deny the vote to non-ethnic Kanak?
Subject of the vote is their independence, so you could ask if any country on earth with an independence from somebody else would deny the vote. Long story short: Not inherently, but if it happened or not depends on how strong conservatives are after independence. If conservatism is a reason to deny independence, the independence of France itself can be ended right now.
@@Weda01 in 2 of the 3 votes loyalists narrowly won, the third vote was carried out below threshhold by maybe a third of the voting population & with exclusion of the opposition. This was also kinda said in the video you're commenting under even if it held back talking about the full extend of the vote.
@@Argacyan But isn't that the mistake of the opposition, by choosing not to vote? I mean if we vote in any other democratic country (where voting isn't mandatory like in Belgium for example) then the party who gets the most votes wins the election, no matter how low the turn-out.
@@Weda01 That's actually not the case, if turn-out is too low a vote doesn't count in most countries due to lacking mandate. It's one reason why boycotts can happen, outside of other causes such as the content or conduct of a vote being seen as obscene to society - which is also a reason mentioned for this vote as the opposition cites it would violate funerary tradition. The vote took place after a wave of Covid-related deaths during the pandemic.
Pacific Islanders aren't used to the treatment Western governments tend to reserve for their former metropolitan core population, so the anger is understandable.
Almost booked a holiday here 6 months ago, but found cheaper tickets to hawaii, luckily as we would have arrived the exact day this kicked off. Real shame what is happening, and so simple to fix, just give the locals more training and jobs in mining and nobody would be angry. Now with the French election result, I would say it's highly likely they will gain independence in the next few years.
As a resident, the reason why we are unhappy is because why are we called New Caledonia? can't we be called regular Caledonia? the Scots don't use that name anymore
Very good question. French political parties have contradictory opinions when they talk about France or New Caledonia. The far right is against the colonization of France by African people and supports equal rights in New Caledonia. The left supports equal rights in France but supports racial discrimination in New Caledonia.
When one inherits a legacy of fire it is best not to fight fire with fire. The horrors of the colonial era must be minimised. But taking away certain people’s rights and this talk ethnic cleansing is the same sort of evil and it must be prevented.
Anticolonialism is often not quite democratic. It is very often supported by communists, maoists and extreme-left, not very democratic. Of course it's not always the case.
Correction 1:29 where you said European first discover New Caledonia. New Caledonia is not discovered as you mention. Kanak which is the indigenous people were already living in the Island before European illegally overtook the Island. Don't write other people's history if you know nothing about. Let the Kanak people write their own story which is genuine and true.
Hey, I think there’s a bit of a misunderstanding here. The phrasing “first discovered by Europeans“ means the first time New Caledonia was discovered by Europeans, not the first time it was ever discovered. Plus, we refer to the Kanak as the archipelago’s indigenous people. That all being said, we go more into New Caledonia’s history prior to the arrival of Europeans in a separate video (which is linked in the description), including the Lapita culture, etc.
The Kanak more than likely are descendants of the Lapita, who were the first known people to settle Island Melanesia. However, there is some evidence suggesting a possible pre-Lapita culture in New Caledonia too. Long story short, the origin of Kanak people is still kind of unclear (from an archeological perspective), but they likely are connected to the Lapita in some way.
If it's true most people in the Islands voted to remain as part of France in the last referendum it will not represent a threat for the French Republic's interests
@@Argacyan Im looking for the alternate reality where 2 independence referendums that granted automatic eligibility to voters of Kanak origin but excluded those of other origins who had not been longtime residents of the territory didnt fail. I know its hard for your brain to understand but people can get over bad things happening 200 years ago. oh, and an accord that excludes people who lived there for a quarter of a century from voting is just reverse apartheid. and it didnt even give independence.
@@Argacyan I'm looking for an alternate reality where the French were asked democratically to be invaded by the Roman, the Frank, the British, the German, the Maure...
Inheriting a colonial mess is the fault of the current generation. It is merely their responsibility to deal with. You might not like these people for being to white for pacific paradise. But they are all French citizens under the law. It is one thing to more from one country to another and a very different thing moving from one part of the country to another part of the same country.
The french conquered the land and it became french. Savages must learn when they are conquered and act accordingly and be grateful for building a civilization there.
They're not really a colony though, they have voting representation in the French National Assembly, their own local government and law. The only thing they dont have is basically independence which even giving the locals an undemocratic edge they still reject. At that stage calling it a colony seems unfair to me.
Lol, this might be the most fearful anybody ever spoke of Azerbaijan. Here's your Azerbaijan 101: - It is a country of 10 million that was a colony of Russia for the last ~200 years (bar 30). - Every 10th person in the country was internally displaced, and a fifth of the territory was occupied by Armenia with the help of their colonial benefactor Russia (whom France aims to replace). - What today is referred as Armenia only exists because the Azerbaijani Turkic majority was ethnically cleansed from there over the past 200 years. The country is freaking split in two, for Christ's sake. It's a small guy on the block, who is simply naturally allied with those being bullied by the big guys. And after all, if France supports separatists within Azerbaijan, why shouldn't Azerbaijan play an uno reverse card here?
@@bneymanov "What today is referred as Armenia only exists because the Azerbaijani Turkic majority was ethnically cleansed from there over the past 200 years. The country is freaking split in two, for Christ's sake." Holy shit mongol-turkoman hordes invading and displacing the people living there causes strange demographics? say it isnt so, Ive never heard this. I wonder where the room for Azeris came from, im sure the Classical Armenians just moved out of the way when the Mongol Empire arrived.
France should embrace this and just take only the ethnic French people off the island and let the Kanaks tribe deport to the rest migrants back to their various ethnic homelands. This might even set a standard to help get rid of the troublesome Muslims squatting in mainland France. This is why many news organizations are hesitant to discuss the issue of New Caledonia too much; and when they do, they try to "sugar" their words away from Kanak ethnic supremacy and focus on the narrative of colonialism.
Good video but I will not accept that Europeans "discovered" New Caledonia as there were already native Kanak people who inhabited these islands long before the arrival of these latter day European arrivals. Europeans did not discover New Caledonia, Kanaks did! Kanaks should take heart and learn from the Algerians and Vietnamese & others around the world who were colonised by the French and other Europeans but eventually freed themselves from French & other Western colonial rule and gained complete independence. Fight, fight, fight and fight somemore regardless of the cost and how long it will take to free yourselves from French colonial rule and become masters of your own land and to decide your own national and ethnic destiny.
Hey, thanks for the comment and I'm glad you liked the video! Oh, I think there’s a bit of a misunderstanding here. The phrasing “first discovered by Europeans“ means the first time New Caledonia was discovered by Europeans, not the first time it was ever discovered. Plus, we refer to the Kanak as the archipelago’s indigenous people. That all being said, we go more into New Caledonia’s history prior to the arrival of Europeans in a separate video (which is linked in the description), including the Lapita culture, etc.
Hey, I think there’s a bit of a misunderstanding here. The phrasing “first discovered by Europeans“ means the first time New Caledonia was discovered by Europeans, not the first time it was ever discovered. We go more into New Caledonia’s history prior to the arrival of Europeans in a separate video (which is linked in the description), including the Lapita culture, etc.
Its wild how some countries are allowed to do this in 2024. I guess colonialism isnt that easy to get rid of, but Im sure if you replace the name France with China and the West's view on this matter would change completely.
But WHY has Kanak's voted to reject the Independence 2 times in a row? Do they don't want independence from France? Or is it lack of trust on local government?
Simply put: the majority of NC, both non-Kanaks and Kanaks alike don’t want independence for they benefit greatly from France through economic support, incentives and exclusivity through European markets. However a small group of “Melanesian Socialists” AKA Tribal Communists are not having it and are throwing their toys out the pram and destroying the lives of the rest of NC through arson and violence. Because that is exactly what communists do: make others as miserable as themselves so that they are equal.
People are human beings and that means there are more to life than separatism. Cut France out the equation and the economy, education system and financial sector goes down the drain and don’t even get me started alienating quarters of the population.
What rights would that be? The only one I can find is the right to disproportionate representation and when they got that it didn’t turn out well. Every citizen should be equal regardless of race, background or ancestry.
@@erikthomsen4768 ok, i don't see it the colonial way, but that equality you feel should exist, does not, definitely not for the oppressed, but they must be getting what they deserve? It is not OK to plunder from people under the guise of "we are making your life better, more like ours" with no consideration that perhaps wanting their own culture matters, that is the sovereignty that is so quickly forgotten, especially when you have a strong belief that your way is best, but thank you for your narrow selfish perspective
@@WASHINGinAZ I won’t try to justify colonialism. I am not that stupid. What I am saying is that I can’t any rights denied to the indigenous people. In fact it would seem they are over represented in every election because a large number of citizens can’t vote because of the 30 year rule. This disproportionately affects non-indigenous people.
Just give them a binding independence or province referendum in which all the parties agree to abide by the vote of the majority. Puerto Rico needs such a referendum to get out of its centuries long colonial status one in which the status quo isn't an option because it really isn't.
There are many inaccurate and simplified statements in this video. I understand that you can't cover all the historical information in one video however you may want to check the census information for the Kanak population because I am sure the the Melanesian and Wallisian people do not like to be included in that population Although they do want some autonomy from France they also know and respect who actually built the country. It is all well and good to want independence and I don't necessarily disagree but the Kanaks aren't the ones pouring thousands and millions of francs into the economy to support the social welfare that the kanaks are demanding. If, like many Metros and other nationalities, you are willing to relocate your family and/or build your business and life in New Caledonia and therefore contributing not only to the economy but the betterment of the society BUT not allowed to have a say in how your tax dollars are spent then that's another form of inequality. I am of New Caledonian descent and although no living there presently, I still have my family and many friends there. Our families and many others of "Les acien familles" poured their lives into building it and it's industries from the very tip of Belep and Koumac to the South. Not just the European settlers but they worked alongside and with the Kanaks, Javaese, Algerians and many more that came to establish it to what it was. We are proud of what our ancestors built and although we can't turn back time at least they all respected each other and worked together to build their nation. The younger generation like many other countries, have forgotten how to work to build a better society instead of blaming the past for their mistakes. Azerbaijan and the BAKU initiative group is getting the younger generation to incite the violence and if you had been to Noumea prior and spoken to the Kanaks, Melanesian and Wallis community that are worth speaking to you would know the real story. Did you also know that many of these young "rebels" are not even residents of New Caledonia. Many were there after a nearby conference and stayed on visiting and they were the ones that are pushing for much of this violence. They don't care because it's not their home. No one is trashing and burning Lifou, Mare or Ouvea. Like I said it's a complex story the New Caledonian one and you have made many good points but for me hearing the real stories from my family both white and indigenous it's sad when people publish inaccurate information.. Many of the Australian media even with the supposedly "expert" journalists still report one version of the story :(
The terrorist republic of Azerbaijan has a lot of audacity to stoke division, when they don't have democracy or protected civil and political rights for their own subjects, let alone the indigenous Armenians of Nagorno-Karabakh that they ethnically cleansed.
you have no idea about azerbaijan armenia invading azerbaijan everybody (of course they are christians they can do it😊) when azerbaijan get their lands back (what !? terrorists they are muslims they are stealing lands😡)
@@sefhammer6276 you can’t “discover” land where people were already living. The word “discover” justifies colonialism and imperialism and suggests no one was there and that the colonizers are the rightful owners. Kanaky is occupied territory!
It's interesting to see a non-European anti-immigrant movement based upon fear of racial and cultural replacement. While I do understand where the Kanak are coming from, I don't think separatism is a good idea. Like it or not, being a French territory gives them far more political stability than they would have otherwise. I'm not saying that independence means they end up like Haiti, but it would make it more likely. Also kinda funny that Azerbaijan is trying to support anti-French revolution in the south pacific.
I have read that indigenous residents of New Caledonia are resisting French legislation that would result in their losing the identity. This is kind of ironic since Europe is resisting inflluence of Muslim culture.
In what world are they resisting? All of the Muslim world is literally dominated by European or more accurately US culture. On top of that immigrants copy the culture and everything of their home country WAY faster than those who stay behind, even in a place as much into preserving old cultures and regional minorities as Europe Maybe stop getting your views on reality from social media headlines. Just because you see somthing more often on your phone doesn’t mean that reality matches that. It just means those stories are good clickbait and popular.
A referendum should be held where only the natives can vote. The colonizers shouldn't vote. Imagine if Nigeria invaded France and sent 120 millions Nigerians and then said let's vote and the Nigerians vote to change the culture, language and control the resources. This is exactly what France is doing in new Caledonia.
Have you heard of immigration since 2012 into Europe. If we go by your rules, only native Europeans can vote in those elections, literally 90% of all POC in Europe would have their voting rights taken away. Democracy means everybody with citizenship in the country should be able to vote in local and national elections, thinking otherwise is a slippery slope towards racial nationalism and we saw how that went during the 30-40s.
Yeah, fuck that. Colonized Islands deserve ti have their independence if they choose to. The immigrants that came to Europe didn't have the same motives for migration that the colonizing countries have, no african comes to Europe with the purpose of controlling Belgium or something. The colonizers of these islands came and changed the ethnic composition of the island with the exact purpose of mantaing political and economic power over the natives.
Kind of curious here, but what do you think: was the 2021 New Caledonian 🇫🇷 🇳🇨 independence referendum valid?
I do not believe it was valid due to turnout
I believe they would have lost anyway in a legitimate referendum
But honoring their customs about death and emphasizing a better turnout would have solidified the legitimacy of the vote
Hopefully, the people would accept that
The boycott was deliberate to expire the timeframe of the referendum that would make the terms and conditions of Noumea Accords invalid and hence, reinstating the talks of independence again. France ignored their pathetic tactics and went ahead with the democratic process. End of.
Nope. And in any case France has no business there almost at their antipodes. France is not anymore a great power and can't expect to hold to its residual colonial empire in general, not even in Corsica, which is in Europe. It's just a matter of time: Kanaky will be free and so will be Guadaloupe, Reunion, Martinique (the motherland of Fannon), Guyenne, Reunion, Mayotte and "French" Polynesia.
I think the voting process was valid - in that France, didn't stuff the ballot or anything like that - but Paris easily could've delayed the referendum to allow the pro-independence parties to participate. Even if they had lost again, which I think was more than likely, it would've been a more definitive and fair end to the process started with the Noumea Accord. So, in that sense, I don't think how the 2021 referendum was conducted is valid.
@@LuisAldamizSo you’re saying the referendums don’t matter now, the French have to leave regardless. Then whats the point of the referendums. The majority of NC have the voted to stay with France and only a minority wants independence.
The Azerbaijan connection is interesting
Many unexpected liaisons in world economics
It is, but New Caledonia being under French rule is interesting too. We're just used to western powers meddling with countries in the other side of the world
Yeah, I honestly didn’t expect that episode we did on Nagorno-Karabakh and New Caledonia to come full circle.
@@GhostCountriesWhat is this, a crossover episode?
Kind of unexpectedly…yes. 😅
It's because france is supporting Armenia against the invasion of Azerbaijan.
The irony is that this act of violent rebellion against the authorities is the Frenchest behaviour possible.
Because the Kanak people ARE French. Simple as.
@@xhaozhao Kanak people are NOT FRENCH🙄
@@nele1339 French of Kanak descent
@@xhaozhaothey are for independence
@@Mathis100-qw7wi Not all. Don’t be ignorant.
9:31 Azerbaijan... serious?
Mercenaries??
azerbaijan thinks of itself as invincible thanks to their successful military campaign, the temporary leverage they have over the eu and the support that turkey gives them, now they're trying to use their perceived power to fight against the countries that have wronged them in the past(armenia, france, USA, russia, iran), they know that donig anything against the USA is suicide and they're too scared of starting a conflict against neighboring russia and iran so currently all they're doing is trying to bully france and armenia
@@firecreeper2249 Does 10 million Azerbaijan bullying 70 million France sound believable to you? Have you read the egregious statements Macron or the French senate had made about Azerbaijan?
The real bullying is France not doing anything as the head of the Minsk Group, and now fueling Armenian revanchism with military aid while trying to prevent the peace treaty between Azerbaijan and Armenia from being signed. With France undermining the territorial integrity of Azerbaijan for the last 30 years, there's little recourse left, other than to retaliate in the same vein. If you don't retaliate, the bullying only gets worse.
Well their country is run by a nazi dictator so it's not surprising he's acting like Ghadafi
That probably one of the most hypocritical things done in the 21st century
Seeing so many Azeri accounts online voicing their support for the cause of the Kanak people was surreal. It's like a joke I'm not in on.
The irony that the patriots of a country that just expelled the entire native population of a region that is dejure under their control now act appaled about voting reforms in french territory is not lost on me.
@@aabbccdd4710 Lol if France undermines the territorial integrity of Azerbaijan, why are you so shocked when Azerbaijan retaliates in the same vein?
It sounds surreal until you see it happening everywhere. One thing making so many people hesitant about the west's support for Ukraine getting invaded by Russia, is that western countries invade other countries all of the time - there's a thing swaying those who support some independences & not others.
@@bneymanovhow come the Azeris did not apply the same tactic to Russia when it supported Armenia?
@@bneymanov territorial integrity of Azeribaijan? I think the fact they pogromed armenians out of their territory then declared intent to pressure for even more border changes along ethnic grounds, EXACTLY WHAT ARMENIA DID, makes this excuse laughable. the fucking legislature of Nagorno-Karabakh voted to join Armenia, so if the baku regime wants to play ethnic determinism after obliterating their minorites they should be ignored.
I think azerbajian should focus more on treating armenians better...
@@bneymanov that's bs
I think france should focus on treating minorities better…
@@TingTong2568 classic, gets shot up with facts and copes with “bs” 😢😢😢. You literally have no argument because you’re a brainwashed zombie who only listens to one side
@@bneymanov quick question, why did Armenia not annex the entirety of Nakhichevan then? It was entirely cut off from Baku during the entire war. How did the Azeris stop being to majority in Armenia???? Are you fucking stupid? They NEVER were the majority in Modern Armenian territories. this is a total lie. Armenia had a sizeable Azeri minority, mostly centered in Yerevan. Likewise, Azerbaijan had an Armenian minority, concentrated in Baku and Kirovabad. if they wanted to be psychos and larp as Greater Armenia, Mets Hayk, then that land is fucking dead to rights included. But amazingly they didn't, isn't that crazy? almost like their goal wasn't to kill all Azeris and restore historical lands. maybe it was about the population that wanted to leave. Ohh but why would they feel unsafe, Azeris never did anything to Armenians before 1990!!!! That's a lie. the Shusha pogrom was brutal killing FIVE HUNDRED Armenians on the Conservative end of estimates, the high end estimates are in the thousands! Citing a contemporary Armenian government report, Hovannisian places the death toll of the massacre at 500 Armenians and the destruction of many buildings in Shusha. German historian Jörg Baberowski states that the Armenian quarter of Shusha was "wiped off the face of the earth", indicated by 25 of 1,700 homes surviving the pogrom; also adding that 8,000 Armenians were massacred during the pogrom. Soviet historian Marietta Shaginyan wrote that 3-4 thousand or more than 12 thousand Armenians were killed and 7,000 homes were destroyed in three-days. The Great Soviet Encyclopedia entry for Shusha writes that "up to 20 percent of the population [of Shusha] died" when the city was burned. That was committed by Azeris in 1920! Fucking ages before 1990. There were in total 11 massacres of Armenians committed by Azeris. Armenians massacring Azeris? There were 3. Four, if you count the one where the Russian Army was involved. I will not deny that the Armenians failed to prevent war crimes. Their conduct was horrendous in Khojaly. But I bet you will fucking lie through your teeth about Azeri forces also massacring Armenians in the exact same region. Kirovabad pogrom. Baku Pogrom. Operation Ring. Maraga Massacre. Only fucking Azerbaijan says 613 people died in Khojaly. More than 200 (per Human Rights Watch) was the original estimate with a swing upwards. If you wanna play a numbers game like a sicko, all the fucking massacres combined that Azeris did meets or exceeds the deaths that Armenia caused. That shouldn't be the POINT. ANY death was bad, but you play this whataboutism to justify when Azeris fucking murder Armenians, instead of admitting both are atrocious. Losing the war for Nagorno-Karabakh doesn't make you some innocent martyr, it just makes you the loser in a war between two Ethnonationalist states. They even got Karabakh back. That should've been the end, if they had ANY intention of ruling as a fair, moral government. But No. they immediately betray their claims of national border integrity by pushing for border adjustments in Armenia proper. Disgusting rampant ethno-nationalism dressed up in a victim complex, with the mask dropped as soon as they had the advantage.
@@bneymanov quick question, why did Armenia not annex the entirety of Nakhichevan then? It was entirely cut off from Baku during the entire war. How did the Azeris stop being to majority in Armenia???? Are you stupid? They NEVER were the majority in Modern Armenian territories. this is a total lie. Armenia had a sizeable Azeri minority, mostly centered in Yerevan. Likewise, Azerbaijan had an Armenian minority, concentrated in Baku and Kirovabad. That was it. if they wanted to be psychos and larp as Greater Armenia, Mets Hayk, then that land is dead to rights included. But amazingly they didn't, isn't that crazy? almost like their goal wasn't to kill all Azeris and restore historical lands. maybe it was about the population that wanted to leave. Ohh but why would they feel unsafe, Azeris never did anything to Armenians before 1990!!!! That's a lie. the Shusha pogrom was brutal killing FIVE HUNDRED Armenians on the Conservative end of estimates, the high end estimates are in the thousands! Citing a contemporary Armenian government report, Hovannisian places the death toll of the massacre at 500 Armenians and the destruction of many buildings in Shusha. German historian Jörg Baberowski states that the Armenian quarter of Shusha was "wiped off the face of the earth", indicated by 25 of 1,700 homes surviving the pogrom; also adding that 8,000 Armenians were massacred during the pogrom. Soviet historian Marietta Shaginyan wrote that 3-4 thousand or more than 12 thousand Armenians were killed and 7,000 homes were destroyed in three-days. The Great Soviet Encyclopedia entry for Shusha writes that "up to 20 percent of the population [of Shusha] died" when the city was burned. That was committed by Azeris in 1920! Ages before 1990! There were in total 11 massacres of Armenians committed by Azeris. Armenians massacring Azeris? There were 3. Four, if you count the one where the Russian Army was involved. I will not deny that the Armenians failed to prevent war crimes. Their conduct was horrendous in Khojaly. But I bet you will lie through your teeth about Azeri forces also massacring Armenians in the exact same region. Kirovabad pogrom. Baku Pogrom. Operation Ring. Maraga Massacre. Only Azerbaijan says 613 people absolutely died in Khojaly, so if you wanna play a numbers game like a sicko, all the massacres combined that Azeris did meets or exceeds the deaths that Armenia caused. That shouldn't be the POINT. ANY death was bad, but you play this whataboutism to justify when Azeris murder Armenians, instead of admitting both are atrocious. Losing the war for Nagorno-Karabakh doesn't make you some innocent martyr, it just makes you the loser in a war between two Ethnonationalist states. Azerbaijan even got Karabakh back. That should've been the end, if they had ANY intention of ruling as a fair, moral government. But No. they immediately betray their claims of national border integrity by pushing for border adjustments in Armenia proper. Disgusting rampant ethno-nationalism dressed up in a victim complex, with the mask dropped as soon as they had the advantage.
Honestly one of the most wild geopolitical things right now.. I mean Azerbaijan, a caucasus nation, supporting a Pacific Island territory of France with a similar flag tricolor???
Baku Initiative Group is a purely anti-colonialist movement, and it was a big thing for Azerbaijan's politics in the Non-Aligned Movement
@@theblueskyisstolensunlight it's not really for the good of Baku's heart, it's just to hurt France, but I mean they SHOULD let go of their influence in Africa and whoever desires independence, because self determination is quite important.
But if you tell that to Azerbaijan, they would quickly say "No" about self determination which really goes to show what their true desire is in doing this.
@@flappleyyep but the enemy of my enemy can be my ally…!
@@SOARSA-fr6uj Yup
@flappley look, Baku will never seriously support any separatist movement within France métropole. But Africa and the Pacific are different. These are territories of colonies, however you call them. In the case of Caledonia and French Polynesia, bad relationships with France are a bonus, not a cause. Azerbaijan has talked against neo-colonialism for years.
Great video man - a few other comments have mentioned it, but I personally think doing a country profile on Nauru would be pretty interesting too!
Definitely; I’ve got a growing list of country profiles (kind of like The Gambia 🇬🇲) that we plan to cover!
Excellent video! Keep making these!
9:13 finally I’ve been waiting for the eternal Azerbaijanian to show up (they replaced the eternal Anglo)
France has been undermining azerbaijan's territorial integrity by supporting the karabakh terrorists for ages. Are you really surprised when Azer does the same back to France?
This is great stuff man, awesome video!
Fascinating. Thanks GoCo for another great vid!
Hey, thanks; glad you enjoyed it!
Very informative!
Your statistics part is a bit wrong. The Europeans (including Caldoches, Zoreilles and Metros) make up 30% of the island population. And it's too simplistic to qualify each people orientation toward independence based on their origin, since there's some mix. Kanaks makes up of the majority of the electorate for the referendums for example
And most of them voted NON.
Your data is incorrect because the Kanaks comprise just 42% of the population while the French settlers 37% (not 30% as what you said) and remaining percentage are made up of Polynesians, Wallisians, Indonesians, Vietnamese, and others which totals 58% of the population of NewCal and all theirs voters are for "Non".
@@flxdz7103 Most of them CANT VOTE based on the Noumea Accords. Most the electorate for the referendums are consisting of Kanaks and they still voted NO. NewCal is and will be French. Move on.
@@xhaozhaoWhy support France holding on to its colonies like a tick? They along with anyone who supports colonialism/imperialism should be made a pariah its embarrassing for a country like France which loves to repeat American rhetoric about freedom and democracy.
This idea that “they held a referendum and lost, move on” is very childish id be surprised if you’re stupid enough to speak like that in public. Again its very embarrassing for you.
Which referendum was held for France to be there in the first place? Moving its own citizens and other europeans over take over homes and land while they ship most of the non European inhabitants to various other islands to work as plantation slaves. Was there a referendum for that? The kanak couldn’t even vote until the 60s, do you think that hundreds of years of brutal indignation can just be wiped away by dubious referendums which already inherently favour loyalists?
I dont know what to say to people like you who think simply stating “democracy” is a valid argument. As though “democracy = right”
@@flxdz7103everyone on New Caledonia is a settler. Get this atavistic racist essentialism out of here fascist. New Caledonia is a nation of immigrants.
It's a colony and it deserves independence.
but the people voted against independence in several referenda
@adrianmcconnell5984 these ppl voted against not even pure kanaka and most them are foreigners. Imagine someone coming to your house demand u hand over your house
@@hittingdasaucesmart people will not choose independence. Just look at all those independent pacific nations and how they are doing. Also mayotte va comoros.
@rojgo7760 i heard u on that but having no power in your own country n being controlled by foreigners is no way to live
@@rojgo7760 you mean like samoa, tonga, cook islands etc
For some other (sort of) related news you could cover, maybe consider talking about the recent elections in the Solomon Islands 🇸🇧
Oh, definitely; the election Jeremiah Manele really could have some far-reaching geopolitical implications for Oceania.
Another successful democratically elected government despised by Melanesian socialist groups.
China has the Solomon Islands wrapped up :) nothing to see here. Move along please.
We get New Caledonia before Bougainville?
This episode was more of an update to our older one; I can’t say exactly when, but I do plan to cover Bougainville soon - especially since this video performed reasonably well!
interesting and insightful Chanel. I really like your videos.😊
Thank you as always Jiayi!
What is Ghost Countries index
New Caledonia is a non-Western nation in Melanesia that’s still under French colonial rule.
Give it up France, the time of overseas colonial empires is over. Let the Kanak people have their own independent sovereign state.
Yes it would he nice to have more poorer countries in the world so we can feel better in the rankings.
I doubt that the non kanak majority sees it that way
Shouldn't that be up to the people of New Caledonia though?
5:46 unfreezing the electorate would be for the Provincial elections, not the referendum
The island had three independence referendums and all three ended with them wanting to stay in France. The case is closed. It's French land. Every adult French citizen should be given full voting rights and these rioters charged with insurrection.
If all the turkish residents of a german town decide they want to be part of turkey and they get majority, is it case closed?
@@elguido That is a foolish comparison. New Caledonia has been a French territory for over a 150 years. Turkish immigrants are just immigrants. They don't have any rights or claim to revert sovereign territory to a foreign nation.
Try another ridiculous straw man next time.
@@elguido If they are not German citizen they can't vote. And a town is still under the legislation of the country it's a part of... your example is really bad
@HisShadow
No, your argument is the ridiculous one. Its very arbitrary. Where is the line? Turkish immigrants have been in Germany for like 40 years or so now. You say New Caledonia was colonized 150 years ago. I guess there's a universal 150-year rule that says if u own a land for that time its yours forever? What kind of nonsense is that. People have the right to self determination regardless of ur arbitrary rules
@@HisShadowSome turks are here in the 4th generation, longer than many French people in new caledonia.
The question should really be: why does France have an overseas empire in the first place?
Because they can or rather because they *could* (past tense). 150 years ago there were no great powers on Earth other than those of Europe (incipiently the USA maybe, not even Japan had kickstarted yet) and one of the most persistent European powers was always France. This have of course changed a bit in the last century or so but old habits die hard and the great superpower USA is not particularly interested in dissolving the residual colonial empires of its vassals, which come handy oftentimes.
We kind of will address that in a future video about some of France’s other overseas territories, but I definitely think we’ll do a video on the Second French colonial empire at some point as well.
@@GhostCountries I don't know which territories you're going to cover, but I personally have always found French Guiana pretty interesting - it actually sort of has a history similar to that of New Caledonia, having been a penal colony, etc.
Why France has an empire could be answered in so many ways, but considering 3 days ago was the anniversary of the 1944 Normandy Landing a simple answer can just be: Nobody stopped the French empire.
Is it an Empire if the population are Full Citizens with complete rights? Unless France has completely banned Independence referendums, its hard to call this an Empire on the levels of the Old Imperial ones.
Power to all indigenous peoples!
No such thing as indigenous.
@@xhaozhaoa simple google search of the definition would help! but I know some people are just a bit slower ❤
@@xhaozhaook Mao
@@gorkaaustin5306 xie xie ni
@@gorkaaustin5306 I hope you agree then with the Indigenous peoples of Europe rising up against the invasion of their homelands by non-Indigenous people from Africa and Asia.
2:48 - this fact changed my mind!
I initially read the situation through my personal biases:
1) a lot of referendum movements seem to love calling a second referendum until they get the results they want. I see those movements as less legitimate. Hearing the Nouméa Accords were set up to have a series of referenda, well that changes that in my eyes.
2) I’m generally critical of the UN definition of colonies, the list points the finger at US, UK, and French islands but totally consigns the policies of Russia and China towards their “autonomous” regions as sufficiently not colonial. I know China has agitated the Kanaky movement which gets me critical. I thought the agreement was very fair saying these French that came here in the 70s, their children, New Caledonia is the only home they know they have a say. But the expiring timeline opening up the referendum to new arrivals, I have to concede, it would be more legitimate to postpone the agreed upon final referendum to happen after the pandemic with the voting requirements of the Noumea accords still applicable.
3) In my generally right wing worldview, it’s easy to see anti-colonialism as that old meme of the guy on the bike putting a rod in the spokes and then blaming whatever the meme is about. My first scan of the issue was France pours a lot of development money into New Caledonia, would an independent Kanaky pull an *almost everywhere in Africa* and turn into a corrupt, economic laggard and still be demanding this development as “reparations” - I thought obviously. But hearing they’re concerned with replacement migration? I… kind of have to say maybe they’re more based than I thought?
i know your mascot is supposed to look like a ghost but before i read your channel name i thought it was something else
Azeri intervention is Aliyev’s retaliation for French support for Armenia since the genocide.
Can you cover the next austrian elections because its getting really crazy here with new parties getting seats etc
Really? I'm not really "surprised" (the whole "Weimar Regime" in all Europe is showing terrible cracks as it operates against objective European interests and in favor of foreign ones rather) but I'm not aware of the details re. Austria either.
@@LuisAldamizwhat the fuck are you talking about, what does this have to do with the Weimarer Republik. It seems its not only the details youre unaware of
@@drillerkiller9 - The Weimar Republic was ruled by a coalition of conservative and social-dems much like the EU (and many of its member states) is. That's the core comparison and you should be able to understand it if you know the relevant history. It was in Germany the "Grosse Koalition" over and over, largely because the opposition was the KPD, which was very much undesired for the bourgeois direction of the post-revolution regime. The Weimar coalition also facilitated in various ways the rise of Nazism, first of all with the murderous violence of the Freikorps, later by pretty much voting a red carpet for the rise of Hitler to power.
This last is also happening now in the EU, with Von der Leyen getting cozy with the likes of Meloni, a confessed follower of Mussolini's ideas and political project, supporting the Nazi regime in Ukraine, repressing the anti-genocide protests, etc.
The comparison may not be perfect (no comparison is) but it's quite good anyhow.
Azerbaijan is backed by Turkey. They are both in cohorts in this movement.
The amount of mental fuc*ery you must’ve done for this to be your conclusion.
Tell me why France should be there? What referendum was held for them to invade and commit the most egregious forms of human rights abuses toward the people of those islands in the first place?
Who cares about Azerbaijan and turkey this kind of coping is just pathetic when by every definition France is wrong.
Anybody who doesn’t believe in this nation’s independence is a literal glue sniffer.
Who cares about turkey and azerbaijan what kind of pathetic coping is this.
France needs to leave thats all there is to it.
*cahoots, not cohorts 😊
Not much to do with the seriousness of this video but please bear with me. Firstly, I live in British Columbia, Canada whose original name was "New Caledonia". When it was pointed out than another place already had that name, we changed it. I mean how many "London's", "Paris's, and "Berlin's" are there in the world? Secondly BC had a gold rush and many Hawaiians came to the nearby English Colony to search for gold, and stayed. They called themselves "Kanaka's" which sound remarkably similar to "Kanak" . Does anyone know if these words are related or just a coincidence. P.S, there is the village of "Kanaka", on the Fraser River there is "Kanaka Bar", There is also "Kanaka Bay" and many "Kanaka Road (street, etc.) Of note is that we have a US friend born in Hawaii and today "Kanaka" is not a good term, in Hawaii, being their equivalent to "Half breed" (yes, like the Cher song). Thank you for letting me ask my questions.
Okay; so, I looked into this a bit after seeing your comment and what I found is the term "kanaka" comes from "kanaka ʻoiwi" or "kanaka maoli" and basically means "man" or "human" in the Hawaiian language. While it originally was just used for Hawaiians, the term did eventually get applied to other peoples from Polynesia and Melanesia. The word seems to have existed for centuries before European contact, but still, I will admit it does sound a lot like Kanak.
@@GhostCountries Above and beyond the call of duty. Thank You for something I had no idea how to "solve". P.S. the Gold Rush was in 1858
Of interest I found this reference from Australia:- 'A Kanaka refers to South Pacific islanders who were employed in Queensland, Australia, during the late 19th and early 20th centuries. Most of these laborers were from Melanesia," might be connection to New Caledonia and the Kanak.
That’s a very reasonable argument on the part of the New Caledonians but I think France should work on preserving their own people firstly.
Reasonable? Also what do you mean preserve their own people? They can all go back to France if thats what they want.
So then France should let Caledonia be free since you wanna treat them like second class citizens
@@rickycoverrubias6176 All they’re looking for is the same dignity people are afforded In practically every free nation.
@@che8866 who?? The french?
@@rickycoverrubias6176 The Kanak along with the others who don’t need Paris to govern them from across oceans.
We'll see how Macron's dissolution of parliament and subsequent election affects this whole situation
And we'll see how he will have to deal with the French far right (RM) party. Bet he's sweating now
TLDR: France is still participating in Colonialism and doesnt want to give the Island to the Native "kanak" people back.
The indigenous people of New Caledonia, given power and autonomy, will turn the place into a Haiti of the south Pacific.
They’d vote some shithead into power that would sellout the islands to the Chinese like the solomons
Sounds about white
Another problem the French have is the Comorro Islands want to take the island of Mayot off the French near Madagascar.
Haven’t Kanaks been told that diversity is a strength?
It is the subject of considerable debate. There are those who see the benefits of this union of two worlds. But there is diversity even within this ethnic group. For some the consequences are not as important as the vision of independence.
diversity is the strength of France, not kanaks
@@Retroist2024diversity is strength full stop. Are you implying that the kanak’s aren’t fully human. I’m open to being convinced- not exactly a culture that was going to split the atom of their own- but that is a pretty radical claim.
The anti-settler movement is *_quite diverse._*
Any geographically and ethnically non-European country- its our land, we are native and everyone arriving 5 minutes after us is coloniser and have no right and should leave and we should be independent, no matter how small and remote our island is, we change nothing and say we should is racist imperialism and colonialism.
European country- there are no thing like native, we were always country of immigrants, and its racist to demand any special consideration for locals over anyone just arriving from other part of world, no person is illegal, local must accommodate them and change so they feel welcome and as home, nationalism and sovereignty should die with 19th century imperialists.
Not true for Africa or even most of Asia. Try and see how hard it would be for a European citizen to move there.
And if you think all of Europe is all rainbows and unicorns around immigration just look at the way ethno nationalism built the European borders of the world we live in today and look at how native European minorities were treated. Or just look at what happens to the people small islands IN Europe. Extinguished languages, cultures, nationalities. Forced migrations, religious conflict.
But sure, your social media (woke/anti-woke) informed view is valid too.
I call them the" British of the pacific." Thinking of being alone will boost the economy.
At first, I was quite sympathetic to the Kanak. However, over time, I've become less so. While for a time restricting votes from recent immigrants made sense to "decolonialize" the local government and to give power to a group that previously was unable to control their fate, times are now different. Recent immigrants are not just French, they are also Indonesians, Vietnamese, and Tahitians. How can you expect such people to control their own fate while disenfranchised from local elections?
ah so its ok to disenfranchise white people now? Racial double standards much? whats up with the anti white hatred and bias now? is it not okay to be white?
The Kanak are a minority on the island, hence why they are so preciously guarding the right to vote on the island. If it "got independence" would they deny the vote to non-ethnic Kanak?
Subject of the vote is their independence, so you could ask if any country on earth with an independence from somebody else would deny the vote. Long story short: Not inherently, but if it happened or not depends on how strong conservatives are after independence. If conservatism is a reason to deny independence, the independence of France itself can be ended right now.
@@ArgacyanDidn't the majority already vote to stay with France?
@@Weda01 in 2 of the 3 votes loyalists narrowly won, the third vote was carried out below threshhold by maybe a third of the voting population & with exclusion of the opposition. This was also kinda said in the video you're commenting under even if it held back talking about the full extend of the vote.
@@Argacyan But isn't that the mistake of the opposition, by choosing not to vote? I mean if we vote in any other democratic country (where voting isn't mandatory like in Belgium for example) then the party who gets the most votes wins the election, no matter how low the turn-out.
@@Weda01 That's actually not the case, if turn-out is too low a vote doesn't count in most countries due to lacking mandate. It's one reason why boycotts can happen, outside of other causes such as the content or conduct of a vote being seen as obscene to society - which is also a reason mentioned for this vote as the opposition cites it would violate funerary tradition. The vote took place after a wave of Covid-related deaths during the pandemic.
“Can France lose new caldoneia” more like “can new caldoneia free themselves”
but.. didnt more then 50% of the island vote to stay in france..
Its weird that french people are being replaced in mainland france while ate the same time kanaks are being replaced bh French people.
What is new caledonia?
Azerbaijan to Turkey is Belarus to Russia
I am for the Democraty!
Thank you for supporting France.
I am for freedom
Pacific Islanders aren't used to the treatment Western governments tend to reserve for their former metropolitan core population, so the anger is understandable.
Almost booked a holiday here 6 months ago, but found cheaper tickets to hawaii, luckily as we would have arrived the exact day this kicked off. Real shame what is happening, and so simple to fix, just give the locals more training and jobs in mining and nobody would be angry. Now with the French election result, I would say it's highly likely they will gain independence in the next few years.
Interesting comment... where will all the money come from to support their new lifestyle? They don't have a stable economy.
Lol i thought this was a 1940s news
No, if they did the nation would go to hell within a few years.
As a resident, the reason why we are unhappy is because why are we called New Caledonia? can't we be called regular Caledonia? the Scots don't use that name anymore
This is the most fern thing I have ever seen
Its already taken care of.
When anticolonialism and democratic principals collide which should win ?
Very good question.
French political parties have contradictory opinions when they talk about France or New Caledonia.
The far right is against the colonization of France by African people and supports equal rights in New Caledonia.
The left supports equal rights in France but supports racial discrimination in New Caledonia.
When one inherits a legacy of fire it is best not to fight fire with fire. The horrors of the colonial era must be minimised. But taking away certain people’s rights and this talk ethnic cleansing is the same sort of evil and it must be prevented.
Anticolonialism is often not quite democratic. It is very often supported by communists, maoists and extreme-left, not very democratic. Of course it's not always the case.
No way in Hell nor Heaven we will ever let go of New-Caledonia.😂
Free the people!
Next free Corsica, support FLNC
Les Corses veulent redevenir Italiens ?
Majority of french people would agree. Maybe more than corsican.
And it will surely become a mafia island, like Sicily.
CCP be condemned for this unrest.
Correction 1:29 where you said European first discover New Caledonia. New Caledonia is not discovered as you mention. Kanak which is the indigenous people were already living in the Island before European illegally overtook the Island. Don't write other people's history if you know nothing about. Let the Kanak people write their own story which is genuine and true.
Which law or constitutional part of the state of Kanaky did the French break by overtaking the island? Exactly.
Hey, I think there’s a bit of a misunderstanding here. The phrasing “first discovered by Europeans“ means the first time New Caledonia was discovered by Europeans, not the first time it was ever discovered. Plus, we refer to the Kanak as the archipelago’s indigenous people. That all being said, we go more into New Caledonia’s history prior to the arrival of Europeans in a separate video (which is linked in the description), including the Lapita culture, etc.
@@GhostCountries So there was another culture that existed before the Kanaks? So the Kanaks aren’t indigenous then.
The Kanak more than likely are descendants of the Lapita, who were the first known people to settle Island Melanesia. However, there is some evidence suggesting a possible pre-Lapita culture in New Caledonia too. Long story short, the origin of Kanak people is still kind of unclear (from an archeological perspective), but they likely are connected to the Lapita in some way.
@@GhostCountries And hence, the Kanak people are not the true indigenous people of New Caledonia. Thank you for clarifying.
If it's true most people in the Islands voted to remain as part of France in the last referendum it will not represent a threat for the French Republic's interests
The pro independence movement boycotted the last election, so clearly it was not any actual representation
That's European voting not the indigenous
Free New Caledonia! 🇳🇨
no, Long Live the Democracy !!
Are you stupid? nous de nouveau caledonia voulons rester chez la france
@@adamradziwill I'm looking for an alternate reality where the Kanak were asked democratically to be invaded by France in the 19th century.
@@Argacyan Im looking for the alternate reality where 2 independence referendums that granted automatic eligibility to voters of Kanak origin but excluded those of other origins who had not been longtime residents of the territory didnt fail. I know its hard for your brain to understand but people can get over bad things happening 200 years ago. oh, and an accord that excludes people who lived there for a quarter of a century from voting is just reverse apartheid. and it didnt even give independence.
@@Argacyan I'm looking for an alternate reality where the French were asked democratically to be invaded by the Roman, the Frank, the British, the German, the Maure...
They are exporting Western ikigial immigrant to other countries, but they are afraid of immigrant in there iwn country
Inheriting a colonial mess is the fault of the current generation. It is merely their responsibility to deal with. You might not like these people for being to white for pacific paradise. But they are all French citizens under the law.
It is one thing to more from one country to another and a very different thing moving from one part of the country to another part of the same country.
The french conquered the land and it became french. Savages must learn when they are conquered and act accordingly and be grateful for building a civilization there.
@@gostavoadolfos2023 The era for western _"civilization"_ is ending. *alien* behaviour is not build to last...
Latvia supports New Caledonian independence! COLONIAL TIMES ARE OVER! 🏳🏳🏳
Even at the expense of equal representation. Maybe we should ask Russia if they feel Latvia’s democracy should be ignored.
@@erikthomsen4768
HYPOCRITE Lithuanians, Latvians, and Estonians.
The fact that they are still a colony in the 21st century.
They're not really a colony though, they have voting representation in the French National Assembly, their own local government and law. The only thing they dont have is basically independence which even giving the locals an undemocratic edge they still reject. At that stage calling it a colony seems unfair to me.
Kind of tired of ruthless colonizing powers like Azerbaijan and France playing games with the weak. My thoughts go out to the Armenians and the Kanaks
Ditto.
Lol, this might be the most fearful anybody ever spoke of Azerbaijan. Here's your Azerbaijan 101:
- It is a country of 10 million that was a colony of Russia for the last ~200 years (bar 30).
- Every 10th person in the country was internally displaced, and a fifth of the territory was occupied by Armenia with the help of their colonial benefactor Russia (whom France aims to replace).
- What today is referred as Armenia only exists because the Azerbaijani Turkic majority was ethnically cleansed from there over the past 200 years. The country is freaking split in two, for Christ's sake.
It's a small guy on the block, who is simply naturally allied with those being bullied by the big guys. And after all, if France supports separatists within Azerbaijan, why shouldn't Azerbaijan play an uno reverse card here?
@@bneymanovlmao shut up nerd.
@@bneymanov "What today is referred as Armenia only exists because the Azerbaijani Turkic majority was ethnically cleansed from there over the past 200 years. The country is freaking split in two, for Christ's sake."
Holy shit mongol-turkoman hordes invading and displacing the people living there causes strange demographics? say it isnt so, Ive never heard this. I wonder where the room for Azeris came from, im sure the Classical Armenians just moved out of the way when the Mongol Empire arrived.
Me too
Azerbaijan didn’t “stare down Russia”. The Russians have good relations with Azerbaijan.
Those Kanak people sound a bit, you know, xenophobic.
You mean anticolonialist
@jen_sen8508 then they should ban Turks. They copy every European tactic. Should be fair no?
You can only be xenophobic against Humans lol. Snaileaters are Not human
Dont they know replacement migration is a conspiracy theory
@@Istrianprincess Nope, xenophobic.
The Kanaks are more than justyfied to want independence, just look at what happened to Corsica after the frenchies moved on the island.
They've voted no three times
Irish territory once more 😎
What about the geckos!?!?
China will eat them all...
France should embrace this and just take only the ethnic French people off the island and let the Kanaks tribe deport to the rest migrants back to their various ethnic homelands. This might even set a standard to help get rid of the troublesome Muslims squatting in mainland France. This is why many news organizations are hesitant to discuss the issue of New Caledonia too much; and when they do, they try to "sugar" their words away from Kanak ethnic supremacy and focus on the narrative of colonialism.
I don't necessarily agree with the solution but yeah, the hypocrisy is clear to see.
Fun.
They deserve independence from France.
Good video but I will not accept that Europeans "discovered" New Caledonia as there were already native Kanak people who inhabited these islands long before the arrival of these latter day European arrivals. Europeans did not discover New Caledonia, Kanaks did!
Kanaks should take heart and learn from the Algerians and Vietnamese & others around the world who were colonised by the French and other Europeans but eventually freed themselves from French & other Western colonial rule and gained complete independence. Fight, fight, fight and fight somemore regardless of the cost and how long it will take to free yourselves from French colonial rule and become masters of your own land and to decide your own national and ethnic destiny.
Hey, thanks for the comment and I'm glad you liked the video! Oh, I think there’s a bit of a misunderstanding here. The phrasing “first discovered by Europeans“ means the first time New Caledonia was discovered by Europeans, not the first time it was ever discovered. Plus, we refer to the Kanak as the archipelago’s indigenous people. That all being said, we go more into New Caledonia’s history prior to the arrival of Europeans in a separate video (which is linked in the description), including the Lapita culture, etc.
Can France keep France? Is the better question.
Free Kanaky
I don't like France but in this I'm pro France specially after Azerbaijan got it self involved
Nifty
It wasn't first "discovered" by europeans. People were already there.
Hey, I think there’s a bit of a misunderstanding here. The phrasing “first discovered by Europeans“ means the first time New Caledonia was discovered by Europeans, not the first time it was ever discovered. We go more into New Caledonia’s history prior to the arrival of Europeans in a separate video (which is linked in the description), including the Lapita culture, etc.
Im convinced the Azerbaijan government is trolling in the most anti-human way
Its wild how some countries are allowed to do this in 2024. I guess colonialism isnt that easy to get rid of, but Im sure if you replace the name France with China and the West's view on this matter would change completely.
It's not like France just now got it in their possession. How do you think most countries were created in the first place?
But WHY has Kanak's voted to reject the Independence 2 times in a row? Do they don't want independence from France? Or is it lack of trust on local government?
Simply put: the majority of NC, both non-Kanaks and Kanaks alike don’t want independence for they benefit greatly from France through economic support, incentives and exclusivity through European markets. However a small group of “Melanesian Socialists” AKA Tribal Communists are not having it and are throwing their toys out the pram and destroying the lives of the rest of NC through arson and violence. Because that is exactly what communists do: make others as miserable as themselves so that they are equal.
The French inmigrants outnumber the native population.
People are human beings and that means there are more to life than separatism. Cut France out the equation and the economy, education system and financial sector goes down the drain and don’t even get me started alienating quarters of the population.
Because the refered _"Kanak"_ are french genocider stacking their _"claim"_ as Kanada and Amerika already have done.
Perhaps the indigenous people want some rights, or are you painting this as it hear and now, not how people have been treated
What rights would that be?
The only one I can find is the right to disproportionate representation and when they got that it didn’t turn out well. Every citizen should be equal regardless of race, background or ancestry.
@@erikthomsen4768 ok, i don't see it the colonial way, but that equality you feel should exist, does not, definitely not for the oppressed, but they must be getting what they deserve? It is not OK to plunder from people under the guise of "we are making your life better, more like ours" with no consideration that perhaps wanting their own culture matters, that is the sovereignty that is so quickly forgotten, especially when you have a strong belief that your way is best, but thank you for your narrow selfish perspective
@@WASHINGinAZ I won’t try to justify colonialism. I am not that stupid.
What I am saying is that I can’t any rights denied to the indigenous people.
In fact it would seem they are over represented in every election because a large number of citizens can’t vote because of the 30 year rule. This disproportionately affects non-indigenous people.
They already have rights???
Just give them a binding independence or province referendum in which all the parties agree to abide by the vote of the majority.
Puerto Rico needs such a referendum to get out of its centuries long colonial status one in which the status quo isn't an option because it really isn't.
It seems French arrogance is at play here
There are many inaccurate and simplified statements in this video. I understand that you can't cover all the historical information in one video however you may want to check the census information for the Kanak population because I am sure the the Melanesian and Wallisian people do not like to be included in that population Although they do want some autonomy from France they also know and respect who actually built the country. It is all well and good to want independence and I don't necessarily disagree but the Kanaks aren't the ones pouring thousands and millions of francs into the economy to support the social welfare that the kanaks are demanding. If, like many Metros and other nationalities, you are willing to relocate your family and/or build your business and life in New Caledonia and therefore contributing not only to the economy but the betterment of the society BUT not allowed to have a say in how your tax dollars are spent then that's another form of inequality. I am of New Caledonian descent and although no living there presently, I still have my family and many friends there. Our families and many others of "Les acien familles" poured their lives into building it and it's industries from the very tip of Belep and Koumac to the South. Not just the European settlers but they worked alongside and with the Kanaks, Javaese, Algerians and many more that came to establish it to what it was. We are proud of what our ancestors built and although we can't turn back time at least they all respected each other and worked together to build their nation. The younger generation like many other countries, have forgotten how to work to build a better society instead of blaming the past for their mistakes.
Azerbaijan and the BAKU initiative group is getting the younger generation to incite the violence and if you had been to Noumea prior and spoken to the Kanaks, Melanesian and Wallis community that are worth speaking to you would know the real story. Did you also know that many of these young "rebels" are not even residents of New Caledonia. Many were there after a nearby conference and stayed on visiting and they were the ones that are pushing for much of this violence. They don't care because it's not their home. No one is trashing and burning Lifou, Mare or Ouvea.
Like I said it's a complex story the New Caledonian one and you have made many good points but for me hearing the real stories from my family both white and indigenous it's sad when people publish inaccurate information.. Many of the Australian media even with the supposedly "expert" journalists still report one version of the story :(
Independence
Colonialism in the 21st century 😢Sad
The terrorist republic of Azerbaijan has a lot of audacity to stoke division, when they don't have democracy or protected civil and political rights for their own subjects, let alone the indigenous Armenians of Nagorno-Karabakh that they ethnically cleansed.
you have no idea about azerbaijan
armenia invading azerbaijan everybody (of course they are christians they can do it😊)
when azerbaijan get their lands back (what !? terrorists they are muslims they are stealing lands😡)
I don't see the problem. They had 3 referendums and voted 3 times to stay with France.
If France leaves it would turn into the next Haiti
Na China is going to muscle in and take the nickle (and the geckos)
So
New Caledonia was not discovered.
?
@@sefhammer6276 you can’t “discover” land where people were already living. The word “discover” justifies colonialism and imperialism and suggests no one was there and that the colonizers are the rightful owners. Kanaky is occupied territory!
same with the north and south america
@@bisoafuayaa74 He said by Europeans as in first time they knew about the islands discoverd. not first to discover was Europeans no?
@@bisoafuayaa74New Caledonia was discovered.
I will always support democracy. Do not allow genocide
Thank you for supporting France. We will not stand watching the Kanaks commit acts of genocide against the non-Kanaks should they become independent.
More election interference than the US! Wow what an episode. 👏👏👏
It's interesting to see a non-European anti-immigrant movement based upon fear of racial and cultural replacement.
While I do understand where the Kanak are coming from, I don't think separatism is a good idea. Like it or not, being a French territory gives them far more political stability than they would have otherwise. I'm not saying that independence means they end up like Haiti, but it would make it more likely.
Also kinda funny that Azerbaijan is trying to support anti-French revolution in the south pacific.
Haiti is from French interference still. Look at most somoa. Nice and peaceful
I have read that indigenous residents of New Caledonia are resisting French legislation that would result in their losing the identity. This is kind of ironic since Europe is resisting inflluence of Muslim culture.
Because muslim culture is harmful and disgusting
In what world are they resisting? All of the Muslim world is literally dominated by European or more accurately US culture. On top of that immigrants copy the culture and everything of their home country WAY faster than those who stay behind, even in a place as much into preserving old cultures and regional minorities as Europe
Maybe stop getting your views on reality from social media headlines. Just because you see somthing more often on your phone doesn’t mean that reality matches that. It just means those stories are good clickbait and popular.
Surely you aren’t equating Kanak culture with European culture.
Will Kanak switch to Chinese help....NEW CALEDONIA should change its name..??
No country should remain under the control of colonial powers. France should leave New Caledonia now.
The Europeans did not discover new ccaledonia. Shame on you
They're better off with France than an independent country. France is rich and powerful. Being a French colony they can have good štandard of living.
A referendum should be held where only the natives can vote. The colonizers shouldn't vote. Imagine if Nigeria invaded France and sent 120 millions Nigerians and then said let's vote and the Nigerians vote to change the culture, language and control the resources. This is exactly what France is doing in new Caledonia.
Have you heard of immigration since 2012 into Europe. If we go by your rules, only native Europeans can vote in those elections, literally 90% of all POC in Europe would have their voting rights taken away. Democracy means everybody with citizenship in the country should be able to vote in local and national elections, thinking otherwise is a slippery slope towards racial nationalism and we saw how that went during the 30-40s.
if these nigerians were born in france then they should have the same right to vote as the "native" french
Yeah, fuck that.
Colonized Islands deserve ti have their independence if they choose to.
The immigrants that came to Europe didn't have the same motives for migration that the colonizing countries have, no african comes to Europe with the purpose of controlling Belgium or something.
The colonizers of these islands came and changed the ethnic composition of the island with the exact purpose of mantaing political and economic power over the natives.