SPICY DEBATE w/ Briahna Joy Gray On Cornel West, Biden & Trump!
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- Опубліковано 29 сер 2024
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"The first time I ever really listened to Kyle Kulinski’s show was in the back of a cab last summer. The driver had his phone hooked up through the stereo and was pumping out an episode through the car speakers - loudly, as if looking to convert a captive audience.
“Do you like Kyle Kulinski?”
The driver, Ahmed, was a recent immigrant and apparently a die-hard fan of Secular Talk, the political talk show that Kulinski broadcasts on UA-cam. I told him, yes, in fact. I do like Kulinski, had come across his show several years ago, and, all things considered, he seemed pretty good.
“He understands what we’re up against,” Ahmed said. “Like Bernie.”
But I was surprised to hear Kulinski’s name mentioned in the same breath as Bernie Sanders, particularly with such adoration. Because what I did remember about Kulinski’s show struck me as mostly capital-P “progressive” takes on the news - the left wing of the Netroots crowd more than the democratic socialism Sanders has popularized.
It’s an impression that wasn’t entirely incorrect.
“I have no time for philosophical, airy bullshit,” Kulinski tells me from his home in Westchester, New York. “I don’t want to hear about Lenin. I don’t want to hear about Marx. I just want a super plainspoken, straightforward agenda with a straightforward way of selling it.”
With over 800,000 subscribers and nearly 670 million total views on UA-cam, selling a progressive agenda is clearly something Kulinski knows how to do - even Democracy Now, the long-standing flagship of progressive media, cannot match his reach on the platform. Chapo Trap House can certainly boast a wildly devoted fan base (and a not insignificant degree of media influence), but their audience is roughly half the size of Kulinski’s.
While Secular Talk might be more likely to be looped in with the progressive networks around Air America and Pacifica alums like Sam Seder than the more resolutely socialist world, Kulinski’s fiery rhetoric, razor-sharp class instincts, and knack for withering takedowns sets him apart from his peers. Judging by his rhetoric alone, he’s closer to a Eugene Debs than a Chris Hayes.
But unlike Hayes, Amy Goodman, or his friend Cenk Uygur of The Young Turks - who began airing Secular Talk on his web network seven years ago - the thirty-two-year-old Kulinski is virtually invisible in the mainstream media. Despite his enormous fan base, his show has never once been mentioned in the obligatory trend pieces on “the Millennial Left” pumped out by the prestige media. Nor has Kulinski’s name ever popped up at all in the New York Times, Vox, the New Yorker, New York Magazine, or the Washington Post, despite his leading role in cofounding Justice Democrats, the organization widely credited with sweeping Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez and the rest of “the Squad” to power.
Just last week, his Wikipedia page was deleted. The reason? “There is very simply no [reliable source] coverage of this person,” according to one moderator. In new media, he’s king - the Sean Hannity of the Berniecrat left. In old media, he’s nobody.
I suspect there are a few reasons for that. There is nothing “cool” about Kulinski’s show. (As a friend put it, “‘Welcome to Secular Talk’ sounds like something you’d hear on Egyptian radio.”) His no-nonsense social-democratic politics won’t get him much cred with the Full Communism crowd. He records his show not in Brooklyn or Los Angeles, but in a studio he built himself in his modest Westchester home. His hair is too groomed and his taste in clothes too preppy to qualify as “Dirtbag Left.” Nor has he ever attended an n+1 release party. “Not only have I not attended one,” he says, “I have no idea what that means.”
And yet he’s astonishingly plugged-in for a young man in the suburbs. Wondering how Sanders ended up on the Joe Rogan Experience? Kulinski, a frequent guest on Rogan’s wildly popular show, introduced them. “You make the most sense to me,” Rogan told Kulinski on a recent episode. “You’re a normal person.”
Much like Sanders himself, Kulinski’s show has a massive audience that just doesn’t compute with our media’s understanding of “what the kids want” or even “what the left-wing kids want.”
It’s probably for the best - the very woke and very WASP-ish decorum haunting much of the media world is nowhere to be found in Secular Talk. “Corporate Democrats over-focus on identity as a trick to divert you from the issues that unite us all - class issues,” he said on a recent episode.
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![Race, Class, & Culture with Briahna Joy Gray [S3 Ep.10]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Fo4X8slO6L8/mqdefault.jpg)
Watching Kyle look PISSED for an hour straight was worth the watch lmao.
He's obnoxious and unbearable.
Absolutely! She obliterated Briahna. She might even be a grifter
Kyle is pissed cuz he's realizing that many people on "The Left" are just as ignorant as the Trump cultists.
@@oklol7799no she didn't you simp 🤡🤡😂😂😂😂
Too many words
Interesting to see how Kyle's opinion about Biden has changed in just a few months. It's pretty damning about Biden's chances given just how pro-Biden he is here.
now he's changed back lol. fckn clwn
Great observation... I still don't know how to feel about his Stein endorsement. I don't and don't care to stomach, haha, dozens of his secular talk daily shows, to sift through his mind's change. Is there anywhere you know of that illustrates his reasonings?
Kyle and Brianna really show the Difference between someone who’s comfortable with being wrong vs someone who is deathly afraid of being wrong
So which one is which in your opinion?
@@bruceleeroy8302they’re both afraid of being wrong. Kyle is the one who’s more afraid of being wrong though. You can tell in his extremely emotional responses.
BJG is more comfortable being wrong. That's why she does it all the time.
@@mikejohn8008yeah right. BJG can’t acknowledge one thing Biden did because she can’t admit she was wrong and that her strategy failed.
@@NJames-dh6kz We gave up watching the interview halfway through. Couldn't stand the constant interruptions from Kyle and Krystal who wouldn't allow BJG to finish any point she was trying to make.
(alex jones voice) They're putting stuff in vape pens that make men dye their hair and vote blue no matter who!
Good. I want every man, woman, and child vaping.
Got an ad break @43:00 and that was the perfect spot to put it in cuz that silence was DEAFENING
Brianna's response after that was completely spot on though.
We didn't get an advert 🇬🇧
@@pj3_pastorj3she literally did not respond tho?? She just said "anyways, going back to a different point"
@@Glitch_IIbecause she has no response. She doesn't care about policy, she cares about revolutionary socialism at the expense of everything else
It is hard to respond to 12 different points shouted at you in a 2 minute high-pitched rant. It's a tactic that a lot of liberals use when arguing. It's not a win, it's just lack of respect. Kyle just wanted to scream out his point, he didn't want a response and Bianna didn't acknowledge his sh** behavior with a response. It was a very dignified way to handle it, actually. Put yourself in her shoes, what would you do when so much aggression was directed at you? Would you get emotional in response and escalate or soften your tone and focus on a single issue to keep the conversation moving?@@Glitch_II
“It’s either a conspiracy or he’s an idiot.” Pretty much summarized this for me.
I don’t think K&K realize that a lot of people are DESPERATE. Incremental change is great when you’re worth 40 million dollars.
I don't think you realize that a lot of poor and middle class people benefitted from that incremental change. Sure, it not as much as they were promised, but it's more than ever got in decades. This is a FACT, you cannot argue against this.
You do realize things can also get worse rapidly or incrementally.
Do you not understand thousands of WORKING CLASS people were helped by Biden's partial student loan debt forgiveness and the labor union ruling? This idea that only privileged people benefitted from this policy is complete hogwash.
@@liltonyabc THANK YOU. It's easy to complain about incremental positive change when you turn your brain off to the reality that the alternative is rapid harmful change. There are idiots in the comments strawmanning Kyle as if he's comparing Biden to Lenin! 😬🤦♂️🤡 HE DID NOT SAY THAT! HE SAID BIDEN HAS DELIVERED MORE FOR WORKING CLASS AMERICANS THAN THE LAST FOUR PRESIDENTS! This fact is frying people's brains. As an wise man once said, never let the perfect be the enemy of the good.
How does letting Trump and the rest of the fascists take power again help with any of that?
We need to have uncomfortable conversations like this, it’s the only way.
Only way to what? Nothing productive came out of this.
@@drod8313 yea we found out "vote blue no matter who doesn't do anything beneficial for you" crowd is hopeless in understanding disaffected voters
I think in they end they started to get somewhere, but Kyle's increasingly debate-bro-esque approach to these conversations really slowed down the progress. I'm all for disagreement in discussion, but deliberately antagonizing your guest doesn't do a thing but lower the quality of the conversation.
feelings over facts. thats who Bri is speaking for@@shogreene9215
This wasn’t a conversation it was Krystal and Kyle voter shaming for an hour and a half and revealing what lib conformists they are at heart. Makes me glad I’ve never given them money.
It seems to me that Bri is holding Joe biden to the standards that he campaigned on and Kyle is holding Biden to the perception he had of him when voting was taking place. Not sure if this is the correct analysis but the student loan part of this rubs me this way.
She's holding him to a literally impossible standard. Nothing Joe Biden does will ever be good enough for Briahna because she's just a grifter.
Like, it should instantly disqualify you if you can't seriously answer that Joe Biden is a million times better than Trump as a leftist. Or if you answer that you expected him to do all these good things he's done, only to immediately contradict yourself by going "actually I didn't think he'd do anything". Or if you are literally given mountains of evidence of good the democrats have done as opposed to the republicans, and you just ignore all of that to continue hammering on the student loan part.
She couldn't care less about Joe Biden's actual material outcomes, as was made blatantly obvious in this entire discussion.
Not only that, but Kyle is assessing whether things have been improved or not since he took office where as BJG flat out doesn’t care about that. Kyle and krystal brought up 800 things he did right but BJG talked about student debt the entire time. Lost all respect for her. She’s just pandering to her base and trying to pass herself off as the REAL leftist
That's part of it in some parts. Playlist this to revist. None of us have it all certainly and perfectly figured out completely but this is part of the path to victory (these nuance-developing exchanges)
Has there ever been a president that's upheld everything they promised on the campaign trail in like the last century?
It'd be one thing if Biden completely ignored the student loan issue, but he's actually trying to get something done about it even if it doesn't go all the way. Using that as a reason to not vote for him over a Republican in 2024 just seems very nit-pickish.
The problem is, in our current system, holding politicians to our own personal standards in a first past the post system is stupid and unstrategic. What is the point of only voting for someone when they meet your own arbitrary set of standards? No politician can ever truly keep all their campaign promises or live up to anyone's golden set of standards, even someone like Bernie Sanders, who supports the Democratic party.
Now if we're talking primaries and the local level there's something to be said there but when it comes to the president, I'm not taking any chances, democracy is too important to risk trying to get a third party to 5 percent. I would rather Democrats win and let the status quo continue than let Republicans win and push back legislation and years of civil rights back a century.
Thank you for sharing this whole exchange.
These are the hard conversations we need. I have loved this, more please. Thank you!
it's messy, but at least we all know why all 3 of them are advocating for what they do.
@@craigrobb8197 but idealism gets in their own way. All but 2 state green officials in history got there on the shoulder of democrats. Democrats banished the republican to the shadow realm and people were fine with pushing forward to the green party. More democrats getting in office would lead to getting more green in office.
Briana is insufferable. She is so dumb that she thinks that green party will have candidates in the future will guarantee all the promises they made. She is the dumbest person I have seen because that is the dumbest expectation of Green Party candidates. Briana is a diversity student. So I am not surprised how silly her thinking is
@@ThisIsMyHandle333 But sometimes the f around and find out motto has worked. F with the people enough and it's time for a revolution. I don't see that happening though. Especially with global warming that will eventually do everyone in.
I concluded from this conversation that Gray is a paid shill for conservatives.
As long time fans of Krystal and Kyle... Did not like this exchange. It feels like they brought her on to tell her she's wrong and then interrupter when she tries to defend herself. I see in the comments a lot of people enjoyed this debate but all it did was make me have serious doubts about the direction and motivation of two people I've really come to respect and rely on for information.
33:00 “Say what I wan to you to say Briana, say the thing that I’m saying while I put words into your mouth”!!!
She is wrong. She’s a disingenuous grifter
Briahna, please stop with the theatrics. He asked you a direct question that you talked around. You’re not a victim.
This is the kind of shit I like to watch! Haven't watched Krystal Kyle and friends for a while because frankly it was boring me, but this right here is 3 people ROBUSTLY and VIGOROUSLY debating in good faith, there's no pulling punches and I'm really getting to see each of you challenged. Also I like that this can all happen, while still having a high level of regard and love for each other, it HAS to be this way, otherwise it gets personal and stupid. KUDOS GUYS! GREAT CONTENT!
They will probably never talk to brie brie again.
@GH0STUN1T no...they totally love & respect her
...as they should.
@@DENGODFREY I'm dumb put the /s 🤣 brie ahould flame them but she won't cuz she's literally the best of us.
If you think that their other episodes were boring, then you don’t care about actual policy & all you wanna see is people argue.
@@terriej123 I watch breaking points almost everyday, among other shows like Briahnas bad faith podcast, Kyle’s secular talk, as well as right wing leaning shows like PBD to get perspective, so maybe you shouldn’t assume things about people after one damn comment. Now be gone!
Honestly the long form content is really informative and engaging. Love this.
Gotta do long form to really start to understand. Reading books is the best thing you can do to get real depth of information
Cornell West said it best in his debate with Dore, talking about white supremacy and LGBT rights is not utilitarian, it comes from lived experience and is a matter of civil rights.
"talking about white supremacy and LGBT rights is not utilitarian"
Wtf does that even mean?
"Lived experience" means anecdotal experience, which means absolutely nothing. It means you're a narcissist who believes their own personal experiences and biases should come before anything else, including objective, material reality.
"and is a matter of civil rights."
Which civil rights are blacks denied today?
@cockoffgewgle4993 lived experience means objective, material documented reality for those who are suffering through it, like the very real police brutality. That is not anecdotal, you are the one anecdotal bringing you own experience up front over other people's.
Blacks? Blacks? Gtfo before you start with the "one drop" shit. That someone of your low standing could call someone else a "narcissist" is neither objective nor a reality, but ironic when you don't even understand what utilitarian means but you think you know people circumstances better than them, which is quite literally textbook narcissism.
The thing is there's WAY more important issues than those two. If you don't put class consciousness over identity politics i see you as deeply unserious.
@@aaronmcconkey1062 those are equally serious issues to people who live through racism, sexism, homophobia, etc everyday of their lives. youre definitely white lol
@@aaronmcconkey1062They aren’t solely identity politics. Civil rights are a matter of life and death in this country as well as going hand in hand with class consciousness ie intersectionality.
“Who do you think is more likely to get us in ww3? I definitely think it’s Trump”
I don’t think that’s aging well
Trump would've picked different side in ww2.
I hate the fact that Biden is funding Israel. Trump said he would give Israel even more money and weapons.
Trump wouldn’t have pushed us closer to ww3 if he was in his second term rn?
This is the type of left in-fighting we actually do need. Thank you guys for being so passionate, fighting for the same goals and expressing your differences with intricate nuance. ❤
Absolutely
@@davidmolina7543 thanks David
LOL. Only one person on that screen is left. Americans are so gullible.
If you believe climate change or nuclear war are the 2 existential threats to human life on earth you will vote Cornel/ Green. A vote for Biden is a vote for endless war and the Willow Project. Holy beep Obama laid the most pipeline and f'ing with Russia & China is INSANE. If you're trying to 'save the planet' you aren't voting D or R. Bri's correct, C&K come off as fancy botoxed libs here...
Kyle is a DNC shill here....
This is probably the best debate that I've seen on Krystal, Kyle and friends since you guys started this podcast love, and I need more of this.
It was fire!
This is the exact argument that I have with the Lesser of Two Evils voting mindset.
I agree 100% with Brianna: "When does it end?"
There will always be another "Trump," and as we go along the years doing the same thing, Ranked Choice Voting will not happen, Real People Power through unions and other means will not happen, student loan debt cancellation (most likely) will not happen, universal health insurance aka M4A will not happen ...
By getting Greens to the threshold for federal funding, they get more recognition. That will affect local elections as well. Then that sets the stage for meaningful local change (i.e. union support and the like).
Federally, Greens start ramping up and embarrassing the two parties. Meanwhile, more local change. Then Greens become even more viable to the point of winning.
Once Greens finally win (federally after 3 cycles?), through both local efforts and federally we get Ranked Choice Voting.
So I disagree with Kyle on this one, because voting Democrat for Lesser of Two Evils will NEVER lead to eventually getting RCV.
100%, they are mostly kissing each others asses… overall I think there content has gone down since there initial engagement.
I really appreciate how Kyle recognizes the stakes and meaningful gains to be made by voting Biden in the general and not throwing our votes away. He did well by not entertaining Brianha's fantasies that would destroy our progress.
@@w0ody16both sides get entrenched and squander many valuable opportunities. Morons like you, for example, who line up behind Biden no matter what, just gives the bad actors the power to do the same undemocratic BS all over again. Let me remind you too, that over the years, we have gotten so bad that the dem nominee is basically George bush and very unlike Bernie. So your long term project gets derailed because idiots lack long-term visions. “The NLRB…bla bla” well that same nlrb is going to get hammered by the next administration. Just wait and see and in 2028 you can line up for Hillary or newsom
@@w0ody16Protest votes are dumb in concept.
Dems will never allow ranked choice
Dems and Republicns, two cheeks of the same arse.
Nor will the republicans stop kidding yourself. dems are more likely to vote for it
@@israelc5320lies republicans actually believe in freedom, democrats want to take Trump off the ballot so people can’t even vote for him while claiming he will lose to Biden
You will never have a viable third party candidate in your lifetime. Get over yourselves
@@israelc5320 No one would change the rules of a game that they are winning.
41:00 to 43:00 had me dead😂
Then after that brilliant list of accomplishments that helped people Bri went back to her loans for her Harvard law degree that has gotten her paid six figures/year, as if she truly struggles with paying it the way a single parent does. She looks at that loan repayment and thinks "I could've gotten another pair of designer high heels or my hair done by a top stylist for this money!" Truly a devout socialist. 🙄😏
Kyle had too many “Red Bulls” before the debate
Also he’s a slimeball
@@semiprolific774He’s right for calling out her virtue signaling nonsense who is simply too privileged to understand how much of a difference Biden vs Trump is. She graduated from Harvard yet complains about student loan debt 😂
I love Kyle so much. When he gets wound up he just goes and goes. Lol.
Thank you Bri.
For what? Being a 🤡?
@moazamkhan the clown here is you.
@@moazamkhan where's your Ukraine flag emoji, shitlib?
@@moazamkhanfor being a real person
GOD BRIEEE REALLY PUTS MY FEELINGS INTO WORDS SO WELL
That's all she does, she exploits emotional attitudes so she doesn't have to support any solutions.
@@jakublutek9361 your comment seems a bit emotional
@@EnviousNV_ of course it is,. she 's incredibly harmful
@@jakublutek9361 to the duopoly yes
@@jakublutek9361pointing out that the Dems are super corrupt and only throwing out tiny morsels of decent policy, while screaming look at how corrupt and scary the other guys are so no you can't have healthcare and we will continue spending trillions on the MIC to kill millions worldwide, is honest. The Green Party is our only option to prevent climate collapse and the best choice to avoid nuclear war, but we can't have nice sane things because you refuse to choose to vote for a party that won't take corporate bribes as the world literally burns.
This is a really perfect encapsulation of the great divide in the left right now, I'm grateful this debate happened 💝
What left? DEMINEM and Ball are corporate dems.
the divide between those who are comfortable sacrificing people in the short term for very unlikely long term gain,
and those who don't want a facist to take over their government.
@@elbownio5820 Hilarious narrative.
@@elbownio5820😂😂😂😂 what a hilarious take.
@@fox1actual well isnt it nice to be able to be so naive and think that everything or nothing all the time?
*This is one interestingly frustrating debate I've ever watched.*
It's because BJG is a manipulative grifter, she doesn't operate on the same level as honest people
I don't follow BJG so maybe I am just missing context from other things she has said, but listening to this, I get the sense that Kyle is frustrated with an entire community of people on the left who have made criticisms about his commentary, some of which may be fair and some of which aren't, and is expecting BJG to argue as if she is the one who is responsible for all of those criticisms, rather than from her own point of view. Krystal's questions seem more targeted on what BJG actually believes, but Kyle says in multiple points during the debate, "people on the left have said," "people on the left do this," etc. as a challenge to BJG's points. I'm sympathetic to his frustration because I'm sure he faces unfair critiques often, but unless there is some context I'm not understanding, his anger seems misplaced here.
@@kellyriddell5014 nah, his frustrations are with Briahna being dishonest here, I honestly don’t think Kyle cares about what people think of his prescriptions, he has the conviction to keep being right.
It’s pretty clear to anyone who is being impartial that Briahna was being dishonest, and I think both Krystal and Kyle have probably soured on her, though they aren’t the type to have ‘beefs’
@@archerbluth can you point out specifically where she was dishonest? Genuinely curious.
@@uninstaller2860 can you point out specifics in this interview where she is being a manipulative grifter?
Bring Chris Hedges on to sit with Bri🙂
😂 🤘🏼
That's bringing nunchucks when everyone else has chopsticks.
Yes, total annihilation.
@@slipstreammonkeythere's a reason he would never do that..
Yeah this was really good. Kyle can get a little overbearing in a conversation with someone he disagrees with and it shows, he kinda stepped over Krystal and Brianna a bit. Plus it seemed so hard to get them to understand that she's not voting for biden because he's dishonest, regardless of the good things he's managed to do. Why was that so hard?
Because her reasons for not voting Biden are based on vibes rather than actual facts on what a republican presidency means
Because she is dishonest and you basically toss away your vote by not voting the main republican or Democrat.
You are not for him cause he is dishonest? That's the thing that upsets you the most? None of you peolle will ever get far anywhere
@@TJ-zs1pl you are embarassing yourself
To me Kyle seemed pretty bla in this convo, no substance at all.
“I expected nothing from Joe Biden”
Biden is better than Obama- Kyle 😂smh
This is a medium that Kyle really needs to work on if his goal is to actually persuade people to his side. He has no patience that someone disagrees with him. That works great on a solo show, where he's screaming into in an echo chamber. But, it does nothing to advance his message to people who don't already agree with him. He could be a greater ally to the causes he pushes, if he learned patience, and better rhetorical methods.
Tk be fair, not many people have patience for bri
Not true. It is okay to show emotion towards assholes
She was debating around his points the whole time then she gets angry when he starts to put her down.
@mesmorrow that's called a debate. Kyle is too sensitive to actually debate without melting down its embarrassing really.
@@makaveliandcheese It's not honest debating when all she is doing is debating around his points instead of picking them apart, she acted so entitled and provoked yet Kyle is the one that has to answer her points.
The idea that making things worse leads to things getting better is pure nonsense. When past progress is dismantled the ruts in the road only get deeper.
Accelerationism is a bourgeois ideology. Champagne socialists won't be affected by dismantled progressive gains, but the working class will.
The Great Depression gave us the New Deal.
@@credmanwhat did the Great Recession get us?
@@BionikleFG First black president.
@@credman who was completely insufficient
BJG hit it on the head with the people of lower economic standing just not caring because either way, we don't feel like our lives change one bit under either. I'd rather make uncomfortable waves to push those in power to enact change if they want to KEEP their power.
I think one thing that everyone on this left sphere of the political spectrum should do is come up with a plan to take over yeh Democratic Party. Like I understand what Bri is saying but Kyle and Krystal are right in saying that there has been more progress from putting pressure from within. I think the way it’s been done isn’t aggressive enough. That’s why getting third party individuals to forcefully push themselves into office through the Democratic Party is out best chance of getting stuff done. Preform a fucking coup on democratic leadership.
💯
That’s how you end up with a conservative Supreme Court because we don’t have rank choice voting
I think I understand what you're trying to convey, but I disagree. I grew up dirt poor and believe me all of these "little" things that people don't "feel" like change their lives, matter deeply. Free school lunch, for example, is a game changer. No one should be satisfied with the status-quo, but we also shouldn't dismiss real progress so flippantly.
@@tadem3886 acualy pushing a right wing pos like Hilary is how you ended up with a conservative sc
Kyle buddy, you're coming off as smug and insufferable as Bill Maher here.
If I wanted to set up a dictatorship, I would set up a two party system where I controlled both parties on the issues I care about while letting them disagree on issues I don't to create the illusion of choice.
It’s almost as if you’re a conspiracy theorist
@@aaronhrynyk it’s not a conspiracy theorist if it’s true. A lot of the big donors on the Republican side are also big donors on the democrat side as well. And they pull funding from candidates they dislike. That’s just literally true you can look up who funds each of these politicians
@@Therealkingk909 The funniest bit is the Dems calling themselves the left while the Biden campaign was the highest corporate funded campaign in history by BILLIONS of dollars.
@@Therealkingk909but it's not a dictatorship, it's not one person controlling all of that. It's a soft oligarchy
If you wanted to set up a dictatorship, vote Republican.
37:55 This part is genuinely scary. I don't think BJG is willing to confront the exterminationist policies on tbe right. Accelerationism often means more suffering than what the status quo offers.
It honestly feels super selfish because BJG won't be affected nearly as badly as the working-class and minority populations who would be thrashed by another GOP presidency. BJG will be affected but survive; the GOP has my spouse on a list of degerates they want gone.
Stop lying
Some yes some no (in working class).
I think a counter-point some would argue might be that the entrapment and suffering over a longer term could be greater if we self-restrict to the current paradigm.
Few and far in between but some in that class are fed up with voting out of fear. All 3 raise good points in this video. We need more exchanges like this and to continue chewing on them!
Exterminationist? What? I’m no fan of Trump but he was President for 4 years, no one was exterminated.
Also, every demographic except middle class and above white people are swinging towards the right, not against, even the vote share of LGBT people doubled for Trump in 2020.
Also, what are you talking about with accelerationism? Maybe I’m misunderstanding the term but I’m thinking in the tech sense of accelerating towards superintelligent AI.
You're delusional if you don't think Republicans want to get rid of transgender people.@@adrianf7732
TRUE
I agree with Bri on the "when does it stop" But we all have to agree that the time we are trying to build a 3rd party, we have to agree that that time the Far Right will continue to pack the courts, the Supreme Court and gerrymander, and strip away rights and make it so rigged that we could be looking at a full blown fascist state, and theres no guarantee the 3rd party infrastructure would even be built or stable even to take power in the future state of the country. I personally don't like the odds, and find it easier to highjack the Democratic Party, but that's my opinion.
Except hijacking the Democratic Party isn’t ever going to happen. Bernie, the most popular politician in the country BY FAR tried it twice. We wanted to push Biden Left but all that happened is that Biden pushed Bernie and AOC to the right. The odds aren’t good for a Green Party but that’s why we need to make them better. So many people giving up on this fight before it’s even began
Sometimes you have to go down, to gain momentum towards the apex…
But this is a situation which is beyond my purview.😊
I know in Michigan the democrats supported a trump style republican in the primary b/c they thought they were more likely to win against him. They care about Democracy second to getting power themselves. They've cheated Bernie and Green party candidates in other elections. So while I get your point, Dem's do stifle democracy as well. Just a little more politely so we're okay with it.
Yeah, that seems about right. I've gotten about 2/3 through and so far feeling frustrated. Not because this isn't a quality debate. It is! Just that the situation is so tough. I hear Brianna say that the failures to meet campaign promises are unforgivable. But for me, who I vote or campaign for is not about who I forgive: it's a strategic thing
The duopoly fuels the far right. I think its reasonable to say tank choice is number 1 priority
Kyle is always “the only one”, no one has ever do the the things Kyle has done
😂🤣💯
Narcissists usually do
To be fair he is the main lefty channel besides Vaush that has given Biden any credit for the good things he's actually done. I mean I am NOT a Biden stan but he's done objectively good things. Also he and Cenk also took the initiative to start a lefty tea party: now that ended up mostly failing but it was at least it was an honest attempt and they DID help get some people elected that are more left than most Dems( not their fault that they betrayed us kinda) He also helped boost Marianne's campaign too. Like I'm not tryna ride his dick too hard cuz he is a stubborn motherfucker about certain things
Yeah, while I ultimately agreed with his perspective, he felt like he was incredibly mad before the debate had ever started.
@@higglyjuff possibly had a chip on his shoulder about constantly being accused of being a DNC shill or that he's "establishment" now or that he's compromised or some shit. So maybe he was a little more defensive and stuff. But it was cool that towards the end he was like "hey we've been disagreeing the whole time lets try to find some common ground"
Kyle, you kind of lack self-awareness. You interrupt your guest constantly but then you tell her you haven't been able to get a word in. She's the one that's never able to finish a point.
He will never change, legitimately a child.
Even when he is just talking with Krystal, he flips out and shouts over her. Now we are just applying that to other lefties.
She talked more than Krystal and Kyle combined might want to pipe down and rewatch
@@jgg6932 Only the dumbest among us feel the need to condescend as you just did. Good luck addressing your bias, as I'm sure you will.
I'm starting to think that all of Bri's fans are ( unts.
If they would have focused specifically on "What is the minimal progress that we consider as enough for a president?" This would have been more interesting.
None if we are talking about a president from the political duopoly set rn. That's Brianna whole point
@@tayeelshaikh9228 The duopoly is all we have until ranked choice voting. Advocating for 3rd parties is delusional right now.
Maybe but Brianna was operating in bad faith. There is no progress that would win her over and she can barely admit that and she will only obfuscate from that fact.
@@dlboss77How do you expect to get rank choice voting - by continuing to vote for 2 parties that have zero interest/incentive to change the electoral process in such ways?
@thebrocialist8300 How did New York City get ranked-choice voting? Get it through a ballot-measure or something and build confidence across the country. There won't be a revolution tomorrow, most people are checked out of politics. It sucks, but things have to happen slowly and positively over time. The purpose of us radicals should be to push and pressure Democrats in our direction.
Your strategy by advocating for third parties is just ceding power to Republicans. There's no way a third-party candidate getting 5% doesn't jeopardize the election.
Why does kyle always get so loud and defensive when someone challenges him on anything?
Idk you should ask Bri that was her demeanor the whole interview, Kyle was being smug too but she was down right disrespectful multiple times
@@h00dielogic42Did you even watch the debate? Bri was mild mannered the entire 45 mins
@@h00dielogic42bri only got like that around the halfway mark in response to Kyle. She was restraining herself to a degree that most people wouldn't
@@CinCee-She was definitely a little cunt a couple of times lmao “mild mannered” Okay.
`@@CinCee- If you call that mild mannered then it makes sense people don't like her.
Overall this was a good debate. I liked that they forced Bri to articulate many of her actual views which I feel like don't get specified enough on her own shows. At the same time, it was enlightening to hear Krystal articulate at the end her own acknowledgement of her selective coverage of Dems in the past and the shift she's made to be more fair while also acknowledging on some level that they are still not doing enough for people. Kyle is still a rabid attack dog and needs to learn to reel it in when trying to persuade people. Bri did a great job explaining to them how a large section of us feel re: a potential vote for Biden and why principally it's really hard to drag ourselves to that place in the face of his middling efforts to actually do the things he campaigned on that are achievable and within his power.
Great Summary
Rabid attack dog 😂😂.. but ya he was really annoying even tho I agree with him
I love this summary. Very objective and not dripping with bias. Thank you 🙏🏾
Would preferred if she talked more about her own views instead of summarizing how 3rd party voters feel. I think most people watching already know and it would have been more interesting to hear from someone who is more radical and doesn't care if Trump wins.
Also Kyle was too much and should have let her speak more
If you aren't voting for Biden, you aren't smart
Every time Bri tries to counter something on the fly, you both shout her down. It's obnoxious.
What's obnoxious are the ten min diatribes they let bjt do
You're delusional, they repeatedly let each other finish their arguments/sentences.
"Voting for incremental change is privilege " is such a dishonest argument. Asking countless people to endure the pain of Republican rule for some pie in the sky greater good: that's privilege.
Absolutely correct
You can't get anything other than incremental change without massive grassroots movement. Otherwise it's like trying to enforce populism top-down
Those that say this nonsense are the exact people that MLK jr warned about. The "white moderate" that wants to keep ORDER (status quo) over Justice (change).
Don't fool yourself you would have given this same BS argument to MLK jr doing the Civil Rights fight. Because people like you were saying he should "WAIT" for some "convenient future" because things are "changing slowly" (AKA INCREMENTALISM).
@@joek3639 Congratulations you agree with being the exact person MLK jr warned about is far worse for bringing change than the conservatives (Republicans).
Seriously! It's sooo asinine to hear
Kyle, your debate strategy here is completely disingenuous and obnoxious. Framing from "I expected nothing" is completely irrelevant, and BJG made a mistake by letting you frame things in that way. What you expected is wildly irrelevant to how someone votes.
I will be following her. She seems to have alot more sense than Kyle and Krystal. Biden gets credit for tweaks, but meat cost 2.5x higher, eggs, gas, homes, you name it. When you aren’t a millionaire and married to another millionaire, there are a lot of other priorities to judge a president over than unions
What do you believe Biden should be doing about the cost of goods?
@@TheSpartan3669tax the rich 90%
Frankly the most consequential area a POTUS has control over is foreign policy. Trump would capitulate to putin in the name of fostering "peace" and alienate the US from it's allies old and new (both of which are needed to counter China). Meanwhile Biden understands the importance of doing exactly the opposite of that.
100%
I think blaming inflation on Biden is misdirected. Not only is it corporate greed, Trump tax cuts put more money in circulation because less was being taken out with taxation which increases inflationary pressures.
I think Briahna made really good points and I don’t think she warranted kyle’s aggy responses. They’re all passionate so I get why it got heated, but is what she’s saying that unreasonable?? I’m not convinced it is.
That's what happens when you can't answer a yes or no answer it happened on the Charlie's Kirk debate she didn't do her homework
I'm pretty much in alignment with BJG's views, even more so in that direction. I like how passionate she is about these things, although I think she should be careful about getting too emotional. It doesn't help when you're debating an issue.
Obfuscating simple questions into long and often irrelevant monologues about how Briahna "actually talks to poor people" and whatnot seems like it could get frustrating. She also came across pretty condescending at times.
We are voting for Cornel West and we will continue to take it to the streets. The two party system is rotten to the core.
Free Palestine!!!
I'm a libertarian and I'm voting for Dr. West because taking down the duopoly is priority #1. I live in a deep red state and the electoral votes are going to the R candidate no matter what. My 3rd party vote spoils nothing because that's not how it works. It could help build a 3rd party though.
I'm Green and in the exact same situation. Solidarity.
Edited to add that I live in Kansas and I know it's going Red regardless of my vote.
Same (except my state is blue). I'm voting for Cornel and I live in Vermont.
The reality of the situation is that you’re never going to get enough people to vote 3rd party for that party to be enough of a threat to even attempt to take down the duopoly. It will never happen until ranked choice voting is in effect. If you want to take down the duopoly, then you need a leftist tea party that is actually organized, isn’t afraid of hatred from the establishment and the media, doesn’t cancel people because of shit they said a decade or two ago, and doesn’t label a southern guy as a confederate just because a few wrong lyrics in a song that was otherwise correct. The Justice Democrats were supposed to be that but were exactly what we didn’t want. They shamed Cenk uygur because of shit he said when he was young, the elected Justice Democrats cave in to the corporatist Dems repeatedly despite the fact that they have a big enough block to obstruct now, and chastised Oliver Anthony just because he was ignorant on government assistance when they could have said “yeah, government assistance sucks let’s try and help people get off of it by creating more jobs, strengthening unions, implementing free college, implementing Medicare-for-all, raising the minimum wage, and cutting taxes for the poor and middle class and raising taxes on the wealthy.” But instead of that the left is worried about someone saying a word they don’t like.
If you're a Libertarian, I would very strongly discourage you from any further efforts to make any sense of the world around you, for the remainder to your life; nor ought you attempt to influence any decisions whatsoever beyond your own toiletries.
@@hadronoftheseus8829agreed. Libertarians understand the world like a toddler.
Krystal: this is getting a little out of hand, let’s simmer down.
Me: Let Them Fight!
Fight, choose your destiny! Flawless victory
Dude go play mortal kombat if you want bloodsport
I don’t think BJG realizes her positions are actually not popular. Anyone remember when Nina Turner lost to Shontel Brown by 30%? Instead of making excuses for why, understand those positions actually aren’t popular. BJG will end up getting nothing by insisting on all or nothing. Politicians who share her views are not electable, ranked choice voting or not. We had a direct choice Bernie vs Joe in 2020 & saw the result. Same for Nina vs Shontel. I actually agree with Krystal & Kyle it’s time to stop being delusional. BJG actually has no realistic goal in mind.
She is far from being objective and even further from being bright. Journalism is dying
😂 I wonder what Krystal was thinking when Bri told Kyle to sit tight
Probably how she treats him too. LMAO
she was expecting Kyle to act like a grown man instead of her little child.
Kyle lost his virginity on their wedding night.
She probably sent him a DM during the interview telling him to calm down lol
Yeah because she was going to answer the question and Kyle wanted a yes or no answer which is childish. By the way I love all three of these commentators so I’m not trying to do a us vs them dynamic.
I dont think Krystal and Kyle would be so against what Bri's arguments are if it wasnt trump running, because that guy is crazy, he has an actual cult that follows him and believes everything he says.
Yes, everyone is excusing their “principles” away out of a fear for Trump. And fear makes people irrational.
@@veritasagent7727 all us presidents are war crminals trololololololol dont even matter if its democ*** or republc*****
@@veritasagent7727it’s rational to fear Trump he’s an insane cult leader
@@veritasagent7727In this case it isn't irrational 😂 I don't think fear always makes people behave irrationally
@@veritasagent7727 Fear can be healthy though. It can save you. I fear jumping out of a building without safety mechanisms. That is not irrational. It's like pain, it is useful. Have you ever heard stories of people who literally don't feel pain? They don't live long because they hurt their body, unaware of the damage.
Trump is an authoritarian ("I can do whatever I want"), delusional and ineffective (both a blessing and a curse). There is a healthy dose of fear to have him come back based on what he's done and not done (toward solving the society's challenges of a lifetime), and what he said he'd do if he does come back. And he simply can't be trusted on anything other than promoting his own self.
Bruh Brianna makes my head hurt. She doesn’t care about the Republicans winning.
*Dem leadership dont care
Your response is what the system is designed to create. Divide everyone and back them into tight tribal corners where each side thinks that the other is the utmost existential threat there has ever been. Hate the other side! If we were smarter, the poor and working class would rise above culture war nonsense and build a left-right coalition that is set on overtaking the corporate duopoly that currently controls everything.
She hasn't changed a bit in the past 4 years and it says a lot
Dems allowing Biden to run again means they don't care about Republicans winning. Blame DNC more than Brianna. Biden can retire and any random Democrat (other than Harris) could likely beat Trump, especially if they are under 70 years old. But the DNC don't care if Trump wins, they love their fear mongering over actual action.
Vote 3rd party
The Democrat's sole purpose is to take energy and resources from the Left. Period. They made that clear with what they did to Bernie Sanders, they would rather Trump than real progress because ultimately the goal is to consolidate money and power into the elites.
With that as a guide (let's stop pretending that the DNC hasn't been failing on purpose for 40ish years), the logical conclusion to our future is eventual climate catastrophe that will be the pretext to fascism. When that happens and we don't have a movement that has been well funded with trained people, they'll round up the political opposition and the new world order will be impossible to fight against (think of the French underground leading up to the Nazi take over but now they have an algorithm that flags the people who are capable of fighting back).
Therefore, like the Black Panther Party, we need to build a parallel government that ACTUALLY meaningfully delivers material difference for the poor - up to the middle class (people need to know that they aren't expected to be poor forever). Then a commitment from leadership personally to donate all money earned after hitting the average middle class wages to the Panther Party (Panther Party is for lack of a better term that has historical context for a parallel political government). The leadership would commit to a broader set of goals (M4A, anti war foreign policy, trade agreements that are worker centric, etc) that are not negotiable to the duopoly. Continue to use the resources of the PP to hire doctors, educators, lawyers, security and financial services for Party members and the poor. Also use the resources to buy housing/support business and the very last thing is to support electoral politics in so much as boots on the ground or fund raising from outside of the PP (Panther Party)for candidates who have our same stated goals with an explicit understanding that if they end up being traitors (by direct means or omission) we will use our resources to make their lives very uncomfortable (not violence but paid protestors, lawsuits, basically act like a hostile corporation). Anything short of that promotes the false hope that electoral politics can be changed to help the working class. Electoralism's last chance was Bernie Sanders and that failed, the inevitable climate wars are coming. Unless we start organizing now and use our time, $ and souls in pursuit of an organization that is going to support us when the System collapses we will find ourselves without the ability to survive to fight back.
The system works, let's stop supporting it.
Panther Party
Krystal said, Although Biden had horrible record at the Senate(40 years), supported the illegal Iraq war, known for his terrible trade deals and crime policies she still voted for him b/c of labor union.
This is spectacular.
Again, what was the other choice? I feel like the people who bitch like this aren’t actual adults. Life is a series of making the lesser of two undesirable choices.
Yeah she said that, so what? You might be leaving out a bit of important context here, such as despite his abysmal record as a senator, he's actually been relatively decent as a president. Such as the guy he'll likely be up against being a literal treat to democracy.
@@theMosen of course you think that. Enjoy the belief
@@JustTayo people who really think there's no difference between the guy who tried to overturn American democracy when he didn't win vs the most left wing president since LBJ are pretty ridiculous
@@ethanbrandon195 insufferable muppets. Keep holding to 1/6. That’s how you cope with yourselves
This was a very stimulating and necessary conversation
Yes it was. It exposed K and K as shills for the Dem party. Bri made them sound stupid.
I can’t tell if that’s ironic or not. I feel like talking to people who try their very hardest not to quickly answer yes or no questions and THEN elaborate vs just machine gun different talking points and mostly avoid every question is absolutely useless as a discussion
No it’s not. Loser.
💯💯💯
@@lilkitkittu2709it's called contextualization, dear. If I give you a yes or no, you've lost interest in my rationale.
Explaining AND THEN giving you your precious yes or no response gives a slim chance that you (or the perhaps myopic audience you've cultivated) to actually get where I'm coming from rather than strawmaning my yes or no.
Hope that helps.
Kyle slowly morphing into Gen Z’s Bill Maher
Just like Bill Maher, when pointed at the right stuff, it's very satisfying.
This
Definitely, he’s just as insufferable too. It’s a shame because Pre-Biden Presidency he was actually very good.
He is a self-admitted Biden Stan now, even if he has to resort to overselling it
Green Party needs to win some state level campaigns to be seen as serious at the national level.
Well I’m going to vote for them at the federal level in order for them to get matching federal funds. And since I live in a blue state I can easily do that.
As for the Green party Getting more seats at the state and local level. I agree. They need to push harder to get people elected at that level. Granted right choice voting could help them along the way.
I agree. I'm in a blue state. Voting Marianne in the primary. Maybe West in general. But I have that luxury. Definitely think Dem voters need to take primaries more serious and vote in real progressives.
They are never going to be serious. What don’t you crackpots get. If you want to create a movement. Run in the dnc. Eventually, there will be change. Change will not happen in a 3rd party.
Lol
@@houseflan2505 i tried telling people this is exactly how id vote but they scoffed at me and said west wont even get 5%.
id get it if i was in a swing state then id def be going by the mantra vote blue no matter who but id think biden is more than likely gonna get a second term because the Rs are only running on reactionary nonsense with no real solutions other than lower rich people's taxes and deregulate everything to the point of a non functioning government so corporations can act like they're the saviors.
Kyle and Krystal spent the entire time trying to pigeonhole Bri and convince her to vote Biden.
No they’re telling her to not spend most of her time giving the wrong impression to people who passively consume just her content that democrats are just as bad if not worse than republicans solely because they agree with her on some things but won’t go with nuclear options
This kind of thinking is endemic of younger people who are intellectually lazy to the point where they’d rather burn the whole place down because they didn’t get everything they wanted after one March
No they repeatedly asked her how does NOT voting for biden (should it come to that) advance the lefts goals? Krystal asked her flat out multiple times And she couldn’t plainly answer here’s how 1) 2)3). She just kept saying how bad the democrats are which obviously all leftists agree.
No. They didn't.
Kyle buddy, I love you man but you gotta learn to hold your cool. Losing your composure on camera makes you look weak, you gotta hold it together and fight with finesse. I know it's not easy when you're passionate but it is essential in debating.
He’s always been this way. Remember his debate with Hassan a few years back? Yikes that got uncomfortable.
How long ago did he debate Hasan? I'm gonna look for it. But too be fair Hasan can't hold it together either and gets super emotional during debates.
You guys can't speak on debates if you never Experience it on their level
@@spawnkiller4762 Lol What is that supposed to mean? Are you insinuating we have never debated before?
I’m a gov teacher in the south. Almost all my students are poor and working class. Lots of black students as well. These kids and their family’s see no difference in dems & Rs. In fact something I always here was “Trump gave my family two big checks”. My point being the people that slim and his wife are not in touch with or talk to the people they claim to care about.
It's the same here in the Midwest. People see no difference between administrations because their lives get continuously harder every year. K & K don't understand ”regular people", I guess. I even watched this a couple more times and that's what I keep landing on
If you lived in a blue state you would see the difference. Schools have better funding, free meal programs, stronger teachers unions, students not forced to have become teen parents, students not attacked for being LGBT.
@@hegelbotAre those the result of Biden's administration or local/state government?
This was a 2 on 1 and they STILL lost lol
Pass me whatever you're smoking.
@@MiniatureMashUp lol my opinion.. BUT it was a 2 on 1.. CANT deny that .. also bri made extremely valid points (why didn’t Biden sign student loan forgiveness thru an executive order.. pointing out the fact that people who will vote for Dr.West would NEVER vote for Biden, etc)..
I’m sympathetic to bris argument but trump made racial tensions in the country too violent … can we also recognize bris skill in debate ?
Aye, Briahna is lit. I'm going to follow her going forward. I had no idea this sista was out here carrying big 🔫's💪🏾
Bri is the truth.
Brie is incredible and so is Sabby, better than these clowns, and I love Krystal but she be slackin along with her son.
She’s great, definitely a fighter.
So dumb
Bri is a very smart lawyer.
If you had debates like this every week, I just might have to dig deep under the seat cushions of my couch to support you on Substack. Kudos to all of you, and Texas sized blessings for making this available for all of us😎
This guy has no debates….he’s showing u debates from another channel in a grifty dishonest way. Don’t give this scumbag your money
Virgil Texas ? Lol
@@ganaed9954Discrace, Must not be a born TEXAN. No Born TEXAN would vote for scum bag progressives.
This was the best political discussions I’ve listened to in so long
It sucks to say, but these conversations are always better when there are a range of left-wing voices, rather than when there are right-wingers involved. Every point is not immediately straw-manned and religion is not instantaneously used as a weapon (or even spoken about, thankfully) Nobody waved a flag or made blithe, faux patriotic statements, or socially retarded ones for that matter😄and it was all the better for it.
She's a Republican, not a radical.
@@annaclarafenyo8185smooth brain response of the day
@@annaclarafenyo8185 People who don't vote for republicans are republican now? Lmao
Personally I disagree. Gray is a frustrating grifter and frankly uninteresting to listen to.
I am glad they are discussing all this .. bc it comes back over and over.
Both Krystal & Kyle and Brianha made good points. US politics is, in some way, a vicious circle of one step ahead and two steps back. Congress is locked in discord and apathy. The reason right and left are so far apart is that we cannot agree on what is fact anymore. It is tearing America apart and is quite dangerous for the future of the nation.
I really wanted to give Brianha the benefit of the doubt, but she lost this debate because while she's very smart and her heart is in the right place, she doesn't understand the fact that the US electorate is comprised of poorly educated normie voters who outnumber left wingers. We must get these voters on our side in order to win, and Biden is the means to do it. And yes, while they agree with populist left policy like Medicare for all, it all depends on the *framing.* It's clear from Briahna's arguments that she is passionately committed to the left's ideology and endgame. However, she is naive to how politics works on a practical level. She's arguing in favor systemic change and revolutionary progress, which will never win over normies because the language scares them. The truth is that Biden got the ball rolling further than any president of the modern era because he pitched incremental progress in a way that gained massive popular support. I don't mean this condescendingly, she just has room to grow wiser to realpolitik. I admire her zeal, but we need normies who don't see themselves as leftist on our side in order to get these goals accomplished. She refuses to accept that reality. And then she made it personal, which you should never do in a policy debate, when she claimed she being disrespected by Kyle and Krystal. Give me a damn break, they were responding to her POINTS with constructive criticism, NOT HER PERSONALLY!
Except for them, there's no poverty in the house or Senate....
Kyle if Biden stood on his head, yet still failed, it's a promise not kept....
Blame the corrupted two party system that created a Donald Trump???
We don't have 5 more decades to get free college...
That's how they play off of each other, Republicans get radical, so Dems give them everything they want, taking more away from the people...
Both positions have are valid. Im a bit disappointed that this debate became this heated when really both of these arguments have their merits. K&k are not DNC shills and want deal with the real current state of political affairs. Briahna wants to vote for the person who shares her views regardless of consequence. Both can be true.
It got heated because K&K tried to force Brianna to agree that Biden has done a good job.
100%. Should have been a discussion rather than a debate.
@@ilcyclista1My exact view. They ended up just talking past each other. Their views are far too close to be talked about in this way if the goal is understanding.
The difference for me is that BJG´s position knowingly makes the risk of Trump getting back into office worse. It was one thing to make that argument in 2016, but I think that after seeing what Trump really is, no reasonable person can make the argument that risking a repeat of Trump is acceptable. The chance that Trump´s re-election will lead to some of the positive changes she was talking about is minimal (almost non-existent), whereas the chance that it will lead to another attempted coup is pretty much 100%. Hitler didn´t succeed the first time, either.
Another point that I didn´t see brought up is just how much the result affects the rest of the world. The US is still the world´s superpower with a massive nuclear arsenal and a nearly unstoppable army. If it becomes a fascist police state, the consequences for the human race as a whole could be disastrous. Compared to that, I just don´t see what exactly it is that BJG is fighting for here. I respect her opinion and understand her reasons, but with all due respect, I think she is very wrong on this.
I really think it was Kyle's fault. He has a big ego and feels the need to shout people down and make petty comments. It sours the mood for everyone involved in the discussion.
So what I hear from Krystal and Kyle is vote blue no matter who....
Yes, but they want to make it sound edgy and cool to fit with their brand of online populism. They aren't like the limousine liberals in DC, they are still "outsiders" lmao
They have been pushing vote blue no matter who since 2016 lol
Crystal seems to think my vote for West means I would have voted for Joe in the 1st place.
Yep just let trump walk right in again
Cool we’ll look your way when we start a war with Mexico
@@Xphysiquebetter than rewarding the dems bad behavior. They will always use the better of the evil argument until it stops working. Is Joe even less evil? He has us on the brink of war with Russia. And food is 35% more expensive.
You are not a serious person
@@BionikleFG in what way?
If Biden doesn’t debate many voters aren’t going to come out.
who actually watches the debates?
I watch debates. I am in a Blue State. I will not vote for Biden if he refuses to debate.
@@hschsc1300 Many millions of people, consistently...
Trump isn't debating, either.
If it comes down to Trump v. Biden, then voters will have to make a choice.
Ms. Gray thinks there is no difference between the two. I think she is looking at the world through ideological blinders.
I'm just a working guy. I can't afford the luxury of an ideology.
I need people to debate. I'm not voting for anyone otherwise.
*I'm favoured, $60k every weeks! I can now give back to the local community and also support God’s work and church. ❤️❤️❤️all thanks to Mrs Mary Margaret Schimweg for her services*
How did you do it? Do explain please
My family have been into series of sufferings lately
Who is ur mentor please help me
As a beginner investor you need to have a mentor to keep you accountable. I’m guided by Mrs Mary Margaret Schimweg
Wow...I know her too she is a licensed broker and a FINRA agent she is popular in
US and Canada she is really amazing woman with good skills and experience.
FINRA AGENT YOU SAID, OKAY SHE MUST BE TRUSTED ACROSS THE STATES🇺🇲
I think Kyle got a bit triggered at a few points 😂 I appreciate Bri’s argument and it’s definitely something Kyle needs to think about.
Kyle gets very excited. He’s still learning how to do interviews. He always talked about how he wasn’t very good at them and he joined this show so he could learn to do better in a format like this.
Kyle is accustomed to talking on his own without anyone else. That’s been his show for years. I am glad he is expanding and willing to engage in more conversations.
Bri was definitely triggered at multiple points as well. I swear half the time the left is more sharp with our infighting than we are at fighting the other side and these are two progressives taking hot jabs - then you have the Third Way corporatists punching at either left perspective. The Conservatives have their own infighting as well but the infighting seems way mroe prevalent and vicious on the left. I can't blame anyone - a lot of people are struggling and bitter and we don't have all the time in the world.
Because he knows they are essentially saying vote blue no matter who and what that does to their credibility on the Left.
@@angelbunny101For over 13 years before KK&F his show has been him rambling in a room by himself, so I agree, in time he will do much better.=)
He has clearly thought about it and discussed it and countered it repeatedly.
I love all three of these women all made great points here
😂 the old lady with the gray hair was a bit annoying
I agree, also being rude at times for no reason@@olivasreuben69
when you're so focused on trying to insult someone that you accidentally do a sexism
@@abnormality00women aren't as logical as men
@@abnormality00how did they do a sexism?
I love Kyle debating, but he definitely comes off like he's had too much coke or Adderall lol. Briahna held her ground well. She created a fan here.
Kyle has strong female hysterical energy
He’s been open about his adderall abuse, not that we can’t notice
Were you swayed by the arguments she actually gave or her tone/aesthetic while giving them?
@@masterchief9291 The content of her character and her views. Biden is the true fascist in the race between Trump and Joe. He is pro censorship and pro world war 3 and arrests peaceful protestors, dissidents and even political COMMENTATORS (see: Owen Shrouyer case) or even for MEMES (see: douglas mackey case) It’s trump 2024 because hes the only anti war candidate besides cornel west
@@masterchief9291both she 💯
BJG saying she doesn’t care if Biden won over Trump 🤡
Vote 3rd party
The Democrat's sole purpose is to take energy and resources from the Left. Period. They made that clear with what they did to Bernie Sanders, they would rather Trump than real progress because ultimately the goal is to consolidate money and power into the elites.
With that as a guide (let's stop pretending that the DNC hasn't been failing on purpose for 40ish years), the logical conclusion to our future is eventual climate catastrophe that will be the pretext to fascism. When that happens and we don't have a movement that has been well funded with trained people, they'll round up the political opposition and the new world order will be impossible to fight against (think of the French underground leading up to the Nazi take over but now they have an algorithm that flags the people who are capable of fighting back).
Therefore, like the Black Panther Party, we need to build a parallel government that ACTUALLY meaningfully delivers material difference for the poor - up to the middle class (people need to know that they aren't expected to be poor forever). Then a commitment from leadership personally to donate all money earned after hitting the average middle class wages to the Panther Party (Panther Party is for lack of a better term that has historical context for a parallel political government). The leadership would commit to a broader set of goals (M4A, anti war foreign policy, trade agreements that are worker centric, etc) that are not negotiable to the duopoly. Continue to use the resources of the PP to hire doctors, educators, lawyers, security and financial services for Party members and the poor. Also use the resources to buy housing/support business and the very last thing is to support electoral politics in so much as boots on the ground or fund raising from outside of the PP (Panther Party)for candidates who have our same stated goals with an explicit understanding that if they end up being traitors (by direct means or omission) we will use our resources to make their lives very uncomfortable (not violence but paid protestors, lawsuits, basically act like a hostile corporation). Anything short of that promotes the false hope that electoral politics can be changed to help the working class. Electoralism's last chance was Bernie Sanders and that failed, the inevitable climate wars are coming. Unless we start organizing now and use our time, $ and souls in pursuit of an organization that is going to support us when the System collapses we will find ourselves without the ability to survive to fight back.
The system works, let's stop supporting it.
Panther Party
And I haven't forgotten about her "No OnE cArEs AbOuT tHe SuPrEmE cOuRt" deleted tweet.
Me too
I think black folks aren’t as afraid of Trump as white folks. We’ve seen the worst. Welcome to the real world. Good or bad, America will always get what she deserves.
@@synchronium24 oooooh, that's such an amazing gotcha!!!!! A nefarious tweet, you should consider starting a podcast yourself.
Ranked choice voting DOES make third party candidates more viable, but getting that in enough places to make a difference requires initiatives/ballot measures and referendums on the laws restricting those. Doing that requires working within the system and applying pressure over a long period of time, i.e. not something you want to hear if you're an accelerationist and are on the left because you want retribution.
Again the climate disaster is close approaching we DONT have the fucking time. Try something different
This is a shitty argument. Stop playing game theory & just vote for the better candidate regardless of party
No, it only hurts Republicans, it will never help 3rd party. Look at the results.
So the question is, is voting democrat without any asks, going to get you to get ranked choice voting? That is by supporting a party that opposes it
@@davidl5119 The only thing that will get you ranked choice voting is campaigning for a ballot measure in your state that makes elections ranked choice. Maine has done this, so has Alaska.
The most important votes you cast are most likely not on the presidential ballot. People don't understand this at all.
Jesus Brianna was super dishonest here, it was extremely frustrating
Never directly answering any of their points
LOL, not a fan but Bri destroyed these two children
Yeah because most of the questions she got were on the order of "why are you hitting yourself".
😮 She DESTROYED them 😅 Ben Shapiro was not here 🤖
If being as dismissive as a flat earther is "destroying" then, I agree. How noble of her to advocate for a spoiler candidate when she won't be affected by the progressive policy that will affect 95% being stripped away from the working class. Bri is the 1%, so healthcare, NLRB, tax reform will not dictate her quality of life significantly. She talks about politics for a living while living in her insulated bubble. @@BRunner12
Her answer was 'yes we're going the right way but we're going in circles, we need to get off this track... Basically
Jesus, Kyle was just so smug and dismissive of legitimate arguments from Bri on student debt, pretty gross seeing how he and Krystal are just "Vote Blue no matter who" now. Jeez.
Bri has some really bad takes though. Voting third party just because you can't get everything you want from the dems is idiotic considering the circumstances.
Nice strawman, @@jackeagleeye3453
Lmao, what legitimate arguments? They were all overtly braindead.
love you guys, but let briahna fully flesh out her point before jumping on it
Girl talked most of the segment wym
They are scared black people are leaving the democrat plantation they finally realize they are being scammed 😅
@@israelc5320
true
Kyle was kind of subdued.
He had a tendency to jump in before Briahna finished her point. That's what I was talking about. But after she spoke, he didn't say as much.
@@marlonbrando33
weird take, maybe you are a conservative troll or something
@@AWildBard that’s exactly what I am, loved the video glad to see a black woman isn’t falling for the vote for Biden because Trump is so much worse bs
I like this guest , first time seeing her.
Bri completely dragged these two
2 on one too, shows how good she is.
Nah Briahna said she was an accelerationist and didn't care whether Trump or Biden won. I can't take her serious.
That's because there's no difference between them for a lot of people. You really want to believe that half the country didn't vote for Biden because they couldn't see that he was clearly better? Clearly Biden is not better for half the country but OK.
@@georgewmitchell the fact that can equivocate Biden to Trump or the republican party let's me know that I can't take you seriously as well.
@@Branchez17 Half of voters don't think Biden was better. Do you ever wonder why that is, or do you just claim them to all not be that serious?
@georgewmitchell nah just uninformed and can be moved over through a multitude of ways one of which is to improve their material conditions and I can admit that Biden and democrats can and should do more. Now you on the other hand has had some information (I'm assuming you watched the video) and still had such a bad take. That's why I can't take you seriously.
@@georgewmitchell There is a clear difference between Trump and Biden. Trump gave us this disastrous Supreme Court.
Swing state here: I’m voting third party. You can’t guilt trip me into voting for lesser of two evils any longer.
You should read up on Republican's Project 2025 plan. Maybe it will change your mind.
Red MAGA runs on the GOP being the lesser evil. Blue MAGA runs on the Dems being the lesser evil. Both parties prioritize corporations, lobbies, and endless wars and don't give a care about Americans. Voting for lesser evils accomplishes nothing. You live in the United States, right? You should know.
I'm unsubscribing. You guys were gaslighting BJG.
“Vote blue no matter what” brought to you by Krystal and Kulinski
I like to refer to them as the Balls.
Definitely two left nuts!✌️
always and forever 🫡
If these debates keep coming Krystal Kyle & Friends might be my new favorite show.
Cut the middle man, watch bad faith, it’s my favorite
Agreed
@@SlimFadi I'll check it out but I'm a huge Kyle stan so I'll probably always prefer this one lol
Yeah I like their recent pivot into debating.
@CosmicMapping naw brie is hands down the best the left has and no one realizes it.
Why is there no discussion of universal health care? Isn't that the number one most important issue for Kyle, given what happened to his father? Does voting for Joe Biden advance the cause?
Dems in a safe state should vote Green to get the Green party to the 5% threshold.
Voting for Joe Biden does advance the cause because if we have another Republican victory we have to waste another four years advocating against them instead of pushing towards universal healthcare.
And either voting for Trump or helping him get elected is going to help the cause how?
The damage to this country that trump did and will unleash (openly declares on his 2025 website) will ensure nobody and their grandchildren can ever get Universal heath Care.
One side believes in destroying democracy, the other doesn't.
I mean, you'd think openly conducting an insurrection of the Capitol would open people's eyes to the danger of Trump, but here we are again splitting hairs as if the two options are even in the same ball park... Jeez!
@tommyliu7020 except no one knows how safe any given state is and that would make it less safe.
Because there is nothing to discuss, they both agree it is as good thing.
Voting for Biden will maintain the current (healthcare) system, which is better than having a republican win who will actively destroy the current (healthcare) system and replace it with nothing. The latter leads to millions more people suffering needlessly, therefor the former is preferred.
Bri: Did he not promise to cancel all student debt???
Kyle: that I'm not sure about
Bri: HE LITERALLY DID
Kyle: Wasn't it 10,000?
Bri. Oh..yeah
She did say 10,000 initially, but she got lost in the sauce for a bit
@ 19:22 she literally says that and you just straw manned her argument like a straight up chode.
Kulinski: Biden can cancel student debt with an executive order.
(paraphrasing) Progressive should give Biden credit for doing the Heroes Act. For appealing in courts. He's doing the Higher Education Act like we wanted. And bringing up the FACTS that the Heroes act would fail is "conspiracy".
Bri: (Paraphrasing) Scholars said that the Heroes Act would fail. So Biden using it either makes him incompetent or an idiot. He could cancel student debt with the Higher Education Act.
Kulinski is LYING. Biden is not using the Higher Education Act. How do we know this? Becaue the executive order Kuliski says Biden CAN DO authority comes from the Higher Education Act. So if he was using it there would be an executive order.
So yeah focusing on BJG making a mistake, one she had initially said correctly. Then corrected when she realized she misspoke is a disingenuous position to take. While ignoring Kulinski gaslighting and lying.
I wish they had brought up health care/ social safety net and climate change as these are my priorities. I'd like to have someone far better than Biden to vote for but if it comes down to Biden or Trump I know republicans are horrible on the issues I care most about.
Biden is no different than Trump on your core issues.
@@areaunderthecurve9918 that's a lie and you know it
As long as dems rig primaries, i’ll never vote for their preferred candidate
Willow project anyone? Also, the Biden administration is expanding Trump’s Medicare privatization scheme that is forcing hundreds of thousands of seniors onto for-profit health plans.@@shelovinthecrew
@shelovinthecrew no they are correct. Biden expanded drilling sold Medicare to private insurance broke a strike and kicked everyone off unemployment during a pandemic. Everything he passed was crumbs at best and hid many evil things in these bills.
Kyle, you're arguing your personal expectations vs the reality and she is arguing what he promised plus what he should be doing vs what he has done.... You're argument is terrible. (edit Oh she caught it... good.
Excellent point.
lmao what?? Kyle read out and actually has sources on all the incredible bills he passed meanwhile bri is just pissy her favourite candidate lost. she literally couldn't give a shit if a literal fascist takes over
Kyle's expectation was what the left in general felt about his candidacy. Don't pretend like you thought Biden was some revolutionary
And you really don't want to talk about terrible arguments when the whole idea of voting third part is based on the premise that you know you'll lose
@@tobysmith2081 I never said I agreed with third party voting, i said that Kyle's arguments were bad. Her argument is the stronger argument. Honestly, I'm not as impressed with what Biden has accomplished... Biden's accomplishments are only "good" when compared with what people expected of him. there was a low bar, he didn't meet it and is getting a pass, because no one expected anything. Biden didn't even get the bare minimum of what he said he would do. giveaways to corporations mostly, a little bit of environmental stuff that he basically destroyed with the Willow oil drilling project in Alaska. Even with low expectations Biden barely fought at all, he didn't take his arguments to the people. In my honest opinion Biden just happened to be there when things happened because his negotiation skills are crap. That isn't an endorsement of third party voting, that's just acknowledging the arguments against are weak. I didn't vote for Biden I voted against Trump but I'm tired of voting for the lesser evil because the democrats want to run zombie candidates.
I found myself agreeing with Briahna more
But "everybody is shutting me down"
Lady... You've been talking for 40 minutes straight.
We are LEGALLY RESPONSIBLE FOR PROTECTING UKRAINE!
We TOOK THIER NUCLEAR WEAPONS!
Briahna is right.
No she's not.
Best debate I’ve seen in a long time. Please do more of these!
I gotta say here that Briahna has a valid view that is obscured by the leading brand of 'rationalism' that pervades the independent 'left'.
...Good for her!
I really think this is the classical discusion entre social democrats and revolutionary leftists, with the difference that, in this case, the revolucionaries are too afraid of doing a revolution.
Because most of them know how that turned out in the past. Meanwhile, the Nordic countries are enjoying the best living standards in the world, while the "revolutionaries" continue to larp. I'm sorry, but history has proven the social democrats were right
??? You and I got different text books, and I was raised Mormon conservative. It was the Soviet Union that was instrumental in creating tanks quickly in volume to defeat nazi Germany so much so that even the social democracies learned from the planned obsolescence of the Soviet tanks. And no, I'm not an ML.
Revolutionaries don't enact change immediately from a presidential election. This is insane grifting by BJG and cornel west supporters. Revolutions are born of a working class, bottom up, class conscious movement. You cannot get change all of a sudden at the top level without building from the bottom. RCV is a priority. State seats are a priority. Unions becoming powerful again is a priority. Labor militancy is a priority. You see this in any country that has undergone revolutionary working class change. FDR was elected after/during the insane explosion of the labor movement, as well as the rise of socialism/Marxism worldwide. There is no comparable movement today that could actually get cw or a third party win at the presidential level right now. Class consciousness in the USA is virtually nonexistent but growing extremely quickly, especially with bidens nlrb enabling unions to grow again.
Kyle ending the podcast on the most eloquent note. LMAO
Claaaassic Kyle 😂
Kyle comes off as a hysterical woman
If you want to see hysterical woman look at Marjorie Green or Kari Lake. Kyle is about as reasonable and rational as they come.@@Backhand77
Briahna Joy Gray is very tough. her debate with Chomsky was also very good.
“If you are more afraid of electing Trump then the Democratic Party is you are never going to be able to exert any leverage on them at all”
Fffuuuuuuuuu 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
Briahna w the heat
Fascism means no more fair elections, no more left wing movement of any kind.
41:00 Vaush would be proud of you, Kyle
eugh, dont say that
@@MoonatikYT you a “Vaush Bad” lefty or something?
@@jcleaverchamberlinjr you say that like its a bad thing
@@MoonatikYT Not necessarily a bad thing, if you don’t like him you don’t like him. Just explain why
Vaush is king cuck
Kyle is coming off as an asshole and I listen to his stuff fairly regularly.
This is how dismissive he always is when he talks to people who advocate anything to his left, espescially regarding 3rd parties.
once you understand the mechanisms of this election system, such as the "first to 51%", then you'll realize that he's right to dismiss 3rd parties as transformational, because the duoploy has rigged the game. IDK how much more clear this can be stated.
@adamkern3548 he got burned by Bernie twice, lost trusted friends over online bullshit, and Justice Democrats failed. This is logically where I'd expect a broken, disillusioned idealist to end up.
Having your ass pegged by Krystal pre-show is tough physically and mentally on a dude. Have some sympathy.