7 Min Friday: Thumb Release Beginners Issues and how to fix them
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- Опубліковано 29 вер 2024
- Here are a few things I saw with beginners. I hope it is helpful for some of you. Keep in mind, it is just my way to deal with it, there are sure more ways to do.
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Armin Hirmer
Malta Archery
100 Triq Annibale Preca
Lija LJA 1915
Malta
I've been shooting horse bow diligently for over a year. Even though I've gotten better I still couldn't account for some of the inconsistencies in my release and I've racked my brain and body trying to remedy it. You fixed my problem in 7 minutes. Vielen dank Armin!
Love your channel, you deffinetley deserve a bigger audience! Thank you for your videos!
better the right audience :D thank you for watching
Ich versuche seit einiger Zeit Daumentechnik.. und ich finde es toll .. nur ich hab extreme Probleme beim zielen.. hat mir da jemand einen Tipp
Don’t aim. I did enough videos to follow ;)
As a Korean guy, I have been learning the thumb draw techniques from Korean bow masters on UA-cam, but you have addressed all the questions I have had for a long time. I am surprised that no one else has addressed these issues as clearly, directly and simply as you have. Thank you Sir.
thank you
I'm brand new to archery and have just discovered your channel. I really appreciate your knowledge and your videos are really easy to watch.
Thanks! This helped! Much Respect!
Me too
The biggest problem I have is when I release I bruise my thumb. I don't know whether its my draw weight or technique
I just started trying the thumb release with my horse bow and it is so much better. However, since I'm so new at this my thumb hurts and I have to switch back for a few shots. This video is so helpful, thanks!
Excellent video to be able to continue fixing the release. Thank you Mr. Armin for taking your valuable time and teaching us with such determination.🎯✌
Always a good idea to come back to some older videos, specially when I have some bad days with constant bad shooting and want to correct my style or check what I might do wrong. This one - again - made me realize what the problem was with my release: tried a thumb draw with my middle finger locking my thumb while the index finger was pointing out, resting on the arrow for support. My middle finger was loose, pointing downwards and was crossing the string and my wrist wasn't straight. So yeah, thanks again, as usual 👍
Just wanted to say thanks for all your videos. Especially thanks for videos introducing me to the thumb draw.
I had surgery for long term nerve damage to my draw arm about 5 years ago, the doctor cut from palm of my hand up to almost my shoulder joint in an attempt to find and redirect some nerves.
Supposedly the surgery was to help with the nerve damage by putting the nerve in a new position but still, 5 years after the surgery I can still not draw a bow in any Western style without the substantial discomfort of feeling like I'm being electrically shocked from elbow to fingers....
Then, I saw one of your videos and tried to draw my 90 pound long bow with thumb draw a few times... Suprise, no pain at all!
I have been hooked on thumb draw and your channel ever since.
I just received my first Turkish Bow in 45# Today... with no thumb ring, I still have no problem pulling and holding a thumb draw!
I am very happy to have found your channel and it has not only allowed me to reopen my hobby of archery but also opened up a whole new aspect of it as well.
Thanks again, much appreciated.
dont you have pain without ring or guard? i just draw 35# horsebow with bare thumb and its hurt
I just can't get rid of the bend in my wrist. I don't feel the tention in it, but it's always bent. I feel like if I lower my elbow more I will loose the strength in my draw. I know what the problem is, but it feels impossible to correct. So annoying 😂
I really appreciate all your videos it's like having a personal trainer.
it seems like the orientation of the feathers doesn't matter? I am used to compound bow where you always point the odd color out.
In this way of shooting not does not matter, at least for me
Hahahaha, Ive nearly been doing it All Wrong!
Great pointers, a Refresher Course.
Thanks Armi.
@Armin Hirmer. I just got a mongolian bow to learn how to shoot traditionally. It is a light draw bow to learn form as your video taught. Thanks for this video on how to troubleshoot thumb release.
I’m learning so much from you man. No fluff. Just pure technique.
You’re awesome. Cheers.
Armin, when i shoot from the right side arrows always go to the right, not straight, please can you explain me what should I do with the bow hand to get tue arrows ro travel straight?
Start very short distance just look with both eyes to the target and adapt
Thanks for the information I appreciate you sharing
Very informative, I still need a lot of practice but I’m learning thank you.
You are the Mr Myagi of archery for me So much great explain and nice.
Wax on wax off :) merci
Your best and most important video on this channel, and the best and complete one there is on UA-cam about thumb release.
Your talent to teach is a gift.
I just got a 35#@28 AF Tatar Bow. I bought 29” arrows and 32” arrows. I was shooting the 29” arrows with Mediterranean draw very well.
When I tried doing thumb draw with 32” arrows they fly horribly. At first I thought it was the arrows. Then I tried the longer arrows with a Med draw and they shot very nicely.
What are some things I am possibly doing incorrectly? I’ve never shot thumb draw before.
Can have different reasons, mostly it is because of not clean release
Armin Hirmer, thanks for the reply. I figured that might be the issue. I watched 2 of your clean thumb release videos yesterday. Will try working on that next time I go out.
This is great, Wish i had found this video years back when i tried thumb release but gave up. Your video makes it so clear. Thank you
Much to do for me :)! Thank you Armin!
At 3.10, is he saying you can use forefinger to push on the string or no? Trying to save my thumb which is perpetually numb at the moment.
Thank you so much Armin for this and all your videos...I'm not new to trad bows at all yet am to my new love "horse bows".. been having a problem on thumb draw yet after this video I've found out where all my problems were.. thank you...also coming from shooting 55# plus recurves I purchased a 30# Tatar bow for learning thumb draw and it sure has improved my abilities.
is it just me, or does he shoot with the middle feather against the bow kind of often?
THAT'S EXACTELY WHAT I AM LOOKING AT THE COMMENTS!!! 😅😅😅
Thank you Armin, I’m a beginner to traditional archery. I have a compound bow that is so heavy to draw I gave it up . I’m 6’2” and after watching most of your reviews, I’m considering getting the long version of the Manchu Yarha from Ali bow. It looks like a great place to start. Thank you for your videos, I have learned so much from you already, and can’t wait to get back into archery 🏹 🙏
Enjoy :)
Nice video Mr Armin. I believe the way you approach and explain archery’s topics is excellent ! thank you for the time and your effort
If I try the thumb draw with a 20lb bow, it hurts too much, making it impossible. There is an article called "Step-by-step: The thumb draw" from the website bow-international, where they say the following:
"The main mistake made by those trying the thumb draw for the first time is to grip the thumb with the index finger. As soon as you start to pull the string, this grip means that all the weight of the bow is going through the thumbnail and often being held by the knuckle of the thumb. This hurts and can lead to injury."
"Instead, first curl the little-, ring- and middle fingers up as though making a fist. You should now be making an “L” with your index finger and thumb. Next, with the index finger still extended, curl the thumb around the string. The string should not sit in the bend of the thumb but on the phalanx, where you put the tape (photo 1, previous page). Now press the tip of the thumb into the side of the knuckle of the middle finger (see photo 2). This is where the strength of the thumb lock comes from: the muscles at the base of the thumb press the thumb into the middle finger, rather than the index finger pushing against the nail."
If I do this bow-international technique, it is even worse.
Could anyone clarify the exact string position on the thumb, the pressure point?
OK what happens when you are cursed with short fingers and smallish square hands and no matter how hard and how long you try ..your fingers will not lock 69 with the thumb overlapping the middle finger and the middle phalanx of the index finger over the thumb nail ?
Can you please answer me this it's driving me crazy
I was taught to align the arrow such that the feather never points towards the bow shaft. I noticed that you dont seem to care about this. Does it not matter? I can imagine a deflection effect, especially with plastic feathers?
Does not matter the way I shoot with feathers. If you use plastic vanes you need to care
@@ArminHirmer Thank you so much! Through your channel I recently discovered archery (only knew minimal basics and close to zero training before). I ordered a snake rolan and I am going to learn thrumb draw along your videos. Thank you for the great material and the superb explanations, you are fantastic!
I waa recommended to your channel and now i can see why. You're very informative. I've just started shooting horse bow and I'm having two issues I'm not sure how to fix.
First issue is if I don't use a thumb guard, when I release, my thumb starts to hurt pretty bad I assume from all the pressure being shoved to the tip of my thumb. Is there a way to fix this or do you just get used to it?
Second issue is even with feather fletchings and heat shrink on the tip of my fletching I'm still cutting up my hand pretty badly. I've noticed that sometimes when I release, the fletchings don't seem to touch my hand at all and those actually tend to be my more accurate shots, I just have not the slightest clue what I'm doing differently on those shots to make it release differently. I don't really want to shoot with a glove or thumb guard because I to feel what I'm touching/doing, so I guess my second question is how can I release without shredding my hand?
I’ve been experimenting with using only my middle finger to cover the thumb and that lets my index finger more easily nock the arrow and stays above the arrow helping to keep the arrow on the thumb rest.
Always held the arrow with the thumb grip never had a problem with accuracy or penetration
Been shooting for 6plus years now and according to this video i am doing it right but i still keep getting blood bruises and then skin peeling not on the inside of the thumb but the outside on thumb knuckle. Can't figure out why 😂 maybe i curl too much idk. Nomatter what ring i use. Anyone else has that issue too or am i just that special?
currently I'm shooting modern recurve bow and I'm good at it, but I want to try the traditional bow shooting. Should I be too cautious? cause it looks a lot harder.
Thanks coach.. i am your faraway student.. From indonesia
Mr Hirmer. Can You add a film with correct an incorrect thumb release with zoom in slow motion? It would be verry helpful.
Hey Armin, you said to have the string in the groove of the thumb. Is the pressure actually placed directly on the joint or is it on the bone very close to the joint? I just started and used a thumb ring that I think is too tight. My thumb ended up a bit swollen and I'm still a little numb near my finger tip. I was shooting a 20# Tatar bow from alibow so nothing extreme. When I shoot again I think I'll try without the ring for a while but I want to make sure I get it right
Easy if I see you, but hard to pravtice myself. But thanks.
It's not to late for you Armin, with some practice , you could get good at this.
What a pretty necklace you have on today. 😂
Don't talk to much because if you real go show your skill in tournament
If talk all can talk
Went do all goes wrong
Lol
Really nice video Armin, very clear explanations... and last but not least, beautiful image due to your (new?) camera.
new but used :D
Why is it that u explain stuff better than books that I have read. I mean the way u explain stuff is totally incredible. Your a true master
Thank you
Your channel is excellent and I love it. Happy new sub here.
Sir great respect to you and a lot of thanks for the tips
But i have a question here
Is it okay to shoot using the thumb without wearing the thumbring (zihgir)?
I do most of the time :)
@@ArminHirmer oh great!
So what should I do when thumb starts hurting (almost after 30~40 shots)?
@@HamzaAbid-kh1sr less poundage bow, use some tape around your finger. your thumb needs time to get used to. when you overdo it in the beginning, its not working :)
This is a super informative channel. Do you perhaps own any Kassai bows or maybe have an opinion on them? I'm thinking of purchasing one
my first fibreglass horsebow was a Kassai. Never shot another one of him since then
Kassai bows aren't realy good they are realy slow. If you want a hungarian made bow buy from Grózer Csaba or Szabó Pál.
I know nothing about archery but what is the metal thing he wears around his neck?
Please can you do a video on how to teach beginners about aiming with thumb draw?
Thanks for this great video. Which bow are you using there please?
thank you. short turkish bow by Alibow
So glad I came across this video, I have plates on both sides of my forearm, and unable to turn my hand properly for three finger pull, but was unaware of the thumb pull, ....yes I'm very new to the sport, I thought I was going to have to learn with my non dominant side, thanks for this video and the others, they have been very helpful.
Привіт, сподобалось! 🖖🤘💪✌️🇺🇦
Rewatching this while thinking about something. I recently only discovered that how you shoot depends on how much you press the arrow to the bow. Something I was unaware of previously. 😁
Great video! I still force my release back and that's awful. Reason: lack of frequent practice and heavier poundages of my bows, thus 'struggling'. Started with 40lbs many years ago and still didn't correct my release. Would be also good for beginners to know they should start with lighter bow than 40lbs because difficult to correct imperfections later, also it should be done with coach . Cheers Armin and thank you for the tips!
Armin....I have been watching many Buhtan archery videos recently and have noticed something odd. Although I shoot with a Mediterranean release I have always accepted that right handed Asiatic style archers shoot with a thumb release with the arrow is on the right side of the bow...but I have noticed that many Butanes archers while using right hand thumb release are shooting off the left side of the bow. These archers are fantastically accurate over long distance but what is your take on this??
not only Buthan, even in Mongolia:
ua-cam.com/video/JvBTh9kddbI/v-deo.html
my kind of take on this :D
@@ArminHirmer Thanks for that..I missed that video. My guess is that they are adopting a partial western style so that they can sight closer to the arrow.
Thank you I have been trying to learn how to the draw ,I was pinching the string instead of rapping my finger around my thum thank you for showing me Mark
Very informational. Thank you
Nice, very useful.
Thumb release changed my life.
Great video, i really like your new camera, its much better quality than before :) these videos are great help, but I have one problem while trying thumb release. I never know where to “put“ my bow hand, how to “aim“ basically (hope it makes any sence).
makes sense. I did a video about how to start thumb release, there I explain it - more or less. maybe it helps. Thanks for watching
Thank you for another excellent video, Armin!
Can I ask what a good poundage to start thumb release is? I currently use a 35lb bow, is it a good idea to start with this poundage?
I would go with max 30#
bro if you can find "kepaze" bows, use them. they're for teaching the tecnique.
@@b..3543 oh woops, well I have already ordered a Manchu bow with 37# at 35" so it is much lighter drawing at 30", but I guess it has the benefit of being able to shoot long draw Manchu arrows when I am ready!
@@BibtheChib yeah it should be ideal i guess. after you learn technique, you can always order heavier bows
Thank you for your insight. I have the worst thumb draw release you've ever seen. I believe this lesson will help
You are truly a great instructor. You teach simplistically and precisely. Always short videos that go a long way in education
Thank you
Where do I find that type of bow being used here? Does it have a name?
Snake recurve
@@ArminHirmer thank you. Do you have an affiliate page or a website for purchasing equipment?
No I have not :) if you want you can ask info@malta-archery.com. They sell them as set with matching arrows :)
Mbah Wi mudun kopit ilang
If you want an even cleaner release ;) Do not use the index finger to hold the lock closed.
Instead the strength of the lock should come from pressing the tip of the thumb onto the knuckle of the clenched middle finger. The index finger then simply sits on the already formed lock with no tension.
The rest of your info is good tho :)
That's how I personally shoot :)
Great video - thank you!
Thanks for the video! Great pointers.
Hi. I'm from salta Argentina. Sorry My inglish. I have a prana ninja bow. Nothing fancy. but i try a thung reléase. But a got an acciden a few years ago and hurt My finger. When i try de reléase mi finger don't suport it. May ve i'm doing somsing Rong o it's note for mi and hay have to continúe whit 3 fingers. Thanks for the videos i lern a Lot
You can try Slavic release ;)
I just shoot with two fingers. Index finger and middle finger. Its that bad? I have no idea about any of this technique since Ive pretty much just started learning by shooting.
Whatever works for you Tomi
Big thanks to your channel: your videos inspired me to try out thumb draw. After more than one year of shooting mediterranean feels fun and refreshing. And a bit painful, for now :)
Dont quite get it: why rotate right wrist upon release?
Hehe thank you
unfortunately i never got to experience shooting with a mongolian bow style bow and thumb release , but i would like to ask how does the aiming work here (for example a 20 meters target) . since you draw the bow beyond your eye and don't Anchor it next to your chin. do you still use the tip of the arrow?
I never use the tip of the arrow. I just look with both eyes at the target and align everything accordingly
This is probably more help than anything else for me
Wow thank you very much
My thumb hurts to the extent that I am unable to thumb draw. How to fix this issue?
start as usual with low poundage, so your thumb has time to get used to it. and maybe use some protection or a ring
my thumb ring moves downwards when reloading, and have to reset on and on. Is there any clue to avoid that?
Might be a bit too loose, put a this strip of leather through it
Like a guitar pick
Which bow is this one?
its been a years since ive started thumb release, i watched this video so many time just to keep on track what to do what not
Good boy :)
Thank you.
Very helpful!
Hi Armin, firstly thank you for your very informative videos.
I watched two other videos you did on thumb release and I notice there are at least a couple of slightly different methods.
For example one of the methods is that you lock your thumb against the clenched middle finger and another method is to have the index finger lock the thumb or the index and middle finger lock the thumb.
Is there a difference in how clean the release is depending on how you lock the thumb release?
I'm still new to the thumb release method and at the moment I find it a bit difficult to lock my thumb against the middle finger and somehow the string hits my index finger upon release even though its resting on my thumb and not crossed over.
Somehow, for me the release seems smoother when I lock with my index finger or both index and middle fingers.
Pleased to hear your advice and thank you in advance.
Depends which ring you shoot. Deep hook needs mostly the index around the thumb, shallow hook and Manchu rings don't. I prefer to have the thumb pressed on the side.of the middle finger and gently hook with index
@@ArminHirmer Thank you for the feedback Armin, much appreciated 🙂
Thanks alot for your info.... iam gonna start practicing with this guidance....👍👍👍
Thank you sir
Hi Armin, I've recently bought a Mongolian horsemans bow, about 58" long and 29" arrows. It still has the string for packing and transit on and wondered how to string a bow by watching videos like yours. That's how I found you and have seen a couple so far but will watch your channel from now on because the way you teach makes it very easy to follow. I'm right handed but have always held the bow in my right hand. I have tried with the left hand but find it awkward. I also would fist fight south paw, could this be why I shoot arrows left handed? Thanks again for your patience in showing us beginners how to be an archer correctly.
Once again, Thank you Mr. Armin for another great video! ...I'm going to pick up my old horsebow and practice thumb draw.
Hi @Armin, I find it easier to anticipate my arrow when I do Mediterranean draw then using thumb release. I have to confess that I prefer gap aiming technique with Mediterranean draw. Is there a similar technique to aim when using thumb release technique rather than just point and shoot, because the "instinct" method is very inconsistent? Using kathra is fun, but also inconsistent. Please help. Thanks in advance.
Hello, Armin, great videos! I love your channel!
One question about thumb release:
My name is André and I'm an amateur archer, I've only practiced kyudo for some months while I was in Japan. Now I have a Turkish bow and, to be honest, since the only way I learned to release was the one I was taught in Japan, I am using it now.
The question is that I had two teachers who taught me different methods of releasing an arrow: one was like you were saying, just letting the string go and the other was to actually release the arrow using the left arm, the arm holding the bow, by pushing the bow towards the target and then making the string naturally release from the fingers holding the string.
As far as I could tell from your other videos, the Turkish - or Arabic - name of that movement is KHATRA.
Is that correct?
I think that I can get much more accuracy by using the khatra, releasing the string by moving the left arm (I'm right handed) instead of just let the string go. Intellectually, just letting string go would sound more natural, but, for some reason that I still do not understand well physically, using khatra is way more accurate!
Could you be so kind and make a video about those different techniques together, comparing pros and cons?
Thank you so much in advance!
Cheers from Brazil!
Un grand merci Armin pour cette video très utile pour moi 🙏😊🙏
Meilleurs voeux pour 2019!!!🍾💥🌞🍰🏹
Richard
My number one problem is im having trouble finding a place for my thumb that's comfortable/ gives the strength during draw safely so I don't bump or active the release.... ive heard wrap your thumb around middle finger until ready to loose... is that a standard for thumb release users? Bit im talking line sear release.. like stan perfex
Thumb draw is painful but the results are worth it.
@@joshskoflic8391 I was asking more about placement on a hand held thumb release like for a compound bow.. I used to always get alittle nervous im gonna tap it and loose the arrow by accident while drawing/ anchoring. I've gotten more comfortable with it and have a good position to hold it now. Still working at it though.
I did about 2 months ago (2 months after my comment) pick up a freddy archery black shadow. That's why I was watching this channel I wanted to get a "horse bow" and learn about it. And I tried a leather sort of thumb protector and I tried a brass one but it was way way too big and I had to wrap thin leather around it to get it to fit. And it just I dunno, didn't like that one. The leather ones alittle better but almost more uncomfortable than a bare thumb. I got a three finger glove and have been doing a slavic sort of middle and ring under arrow thumb on left index on right sort of claw like.. the glove works nicely for that or Mediterranean. I ordered a vermil ring but they take awhile to get, but I sent the dude pictures of my thumb with caliper on it so he could see my measurements and he told me what size to get. Looking forward to getting it! Then I'm gonna start working on thumb shooting much more. It is definitely tricky, I've got the khatra down mostly but still perfecting the timing and still haven't started applying string twist to my thumb ring releaseafter armin talking about it countless times lol. Thank's so much to this channel.
Thanks for the encouragement though. I appreciate it. I've found the archery community to be full of cool, supportive people. Take care.
Thanks for your videos and demonstrations. I'm new to Archery and have just started learning about thumb release! Very different from what I'm used to.. Your videos are very helpful and encouraging :) keep up the Great work !
Proper techniques equals best result another great video. You are my first bow and arrow 🏹 teacher.
Thanks sir
Great video. I'm going to give thumb release a try. Thanks!
So I started shooting thumb ring about a month and a half ago - and I've gotten to a point where it is comfortable to draw and release without any discomfort. BUT - over the last weekend I was shooting and upon release the plastic knock on my arrow broke (basically causing a dry fire) - at first I thought it was just because the arrow was old but then it happened on my other bow with a new set of arrows about 20 minutes later. I've never had a knock just break upon release (the arrow only went about 2 feet) and I'm curious if this is something that could be caused by a bad release. Have you ever seen this happen?
plastic nocks sometimes break, maybe you pressed with your index finger to hard on the side of the arrow?
@@ArminHirmer Maybe - It would definitely make sense that I was applying too much force in one direction or the other - next time I'm gonna try to focus more on a relaxed release that moves straight back. I'm probably waving my hand all over and not realizing it like you described ha.
this is really helpful.
Thanks
Thank you Sir - You have a beautiful way of transmitting your knowledge and I am grateful to you for sharing the wisdom of your experience - much love 🌞
Nice DoF