Inside a modern T12 style soldering iron element/bit

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  • Опубліковано 2 лют 2025

КОМЕНТАРІ • 94

  • @jamisonlm3
    @jamisonlm3 2 години тому +12

    I have one of those t12 stations that came in the little aluminum enclosure with an oled display. It's been such a great station to solder and desolder with. Before, I only had one of those weller soldering stations with the knob. You know, the orange ones with the power switch right above the knob? These t12 stations blow it out of the water and run circles around it. I'd recommend one of them for anyone getting started with soldering in a heartbeat.

  • @YerUnclePhil
    @YerUnclePhil Годину тому +2

    Thanks for taking something to bits, that I have in my shop, and wondered how it was constructed.
    I don't think I'd even disassemble it if it burnt out. So, thanks again.

  • @chrishartley1210
    @chrishartley1210 12 днів тому +39

    The reason for long lengths of dissimilar wire is because of the way the thermoelectric effect works.
    So for instance, if there were copper wires going right up to the thermocouple with iron and nickel for the actual thermocouple the voltages generated would be for each junction, Cu-Fe, Fe-Ni, Ni-Cu. Everything between the two copper wires cancel each other out because they are at the same temperature, and since Cu-Cu has no dissimilar metals there is no voltage generated.
    It is necessary to take the dissimilar wires away from the heat in order to have a measurable thermoelectric effect.

    • @SeanBZA
      @SeanBZA 3 години тому +3

      Very likely an iron constantan thermocouple, with the iron wire forming the one junction and wire, and the heater and thick nickel alloy wire forming the other half of the junction and the heater. the rings form another junction, but as this is generally colder, the voltages will be much smaller, and probably cancel out to a great degree given the right steel alloy, and then the wires are merely extenders, so long as they are close to room temperature, and the joins are the same temperature, no real issue. the controller might have cold junction compensation, but probably not, relying on the controller board to not exceed 50C by the ADC and simply subtracting an offset from the ADC value for ambient temperature.

    • @JMWexperience
      @JMWexperience 3 години тому

      Thanks for the education!

  • @natthecatgirl
    @natthecatgirl 12 днів тому +20

    I've always wondered what these looked like internally, thanks as always, Clive!

  • @Justin-TPG
    @Justin-TPG Годину тому +1

    Big respect for the Human Resource shout, Clive. Still raving 30 years on!

  • @EatsLikeADuck
    @EatsLikeADuck 10 хвилин тому

    "I'm the one and only dominator..."
    Well there's a blast from my musical past. Haven't thought of that song in...a long time. Thanks Clive!

  • @pepethefrog7193
    @pepethefrog7193 2 години тому +5

    The "thermocouple" is not the blob in the tip, that is just a junction point.
    The thermo effect occurs along the different material wires due to thermal gradient.
    I got a $25 T12 station and i love it. Heats up in 3 sec. Tips go for $3 a pop.

  • @KarldorisLambley
    @KarldorisLambley 2 години тому +5

    this was awfully interesting. thanks. as i like to bore you with what i have been up to, this week i have been getting the hang of using a slide rule, rather than my usual old desk calculator. i was born in '74 so i had never even seen one in the flesh until i got one from ebay (an Aristo scholastic). my goal us to be able to whip it out and perform calculations faster than someone can unlock a smartphone, open the calc app, and do the same thing. i was also so inspired by your ali baba UVC tubes vid i have bought 7 of them and i am driving them with 7447. mosfets, and relays. ultimately i want to get enough to use them with my home made clock (made with ICs, not micro controller). so i get a clock that is too dangerous to look at. thanks for your time BC.

    • @zebo-the-fat
      @zebo-the-fat 2 години тому +2

      Ohh... the evil clock of doom! I like it!

    • @KarldorisLambley
      @KarldorisLambley Годину тому

      @@zebo-the-fat i did consider making an enormous clock in my garden using fluorescent tubes. but the way they flash when struck would make the seconds look rubbish. i love clocks of late. if anyone fancies making a clock, a real clock with no arduino cheating search google for - "A digital quartz clock from scratch" a bloke called Erik van Zijst
      taught me all i needed to know.

  • @paulusthegrey
    @paulusthegrey 2 години тому +3

    The technology has come a long way since the old Weller Magnastat.

  • @LegacyMicro
    @LegacyMicro Годину тому +2

    I clicked this straight away.... I hope this will reveal the secrets of my el'cheapo T12.... interesting.... Thanks Clive....

  • @adrian.parano
    @adrian.parano 3 години тому +3

    awesome! good job Clive!

  • @jwrtiger
    @jwrtiger Годину тому

    Thanks Clive, I did a review of the of the Hakko FX951 eight years ago on jwrelectro channel. I had a few people wondering what was in the cartridge. I never opened one up so thanks for investigating the cartridge and solving the mystery.

    • @rksg2003
      @rksg2003 11 хвилин тому

      I have couple of the hakko stations plus a desoldering gun. I love the things. But I came from a welder plug directly into the wall type soldering iron.

  • @el3dprint
    @el3dprint 10 хвилин тому

    Nice. This video prevents me of having to take one down... Thanks!

  • @Lucius4992
    @Lucius4992 Годину тому

    Very interesting. I have been using a cheap T12 station for a while now. I kinda dislike the fact that you have to spend a comparatively lot more when the tip burns out, but the responsiveness and features gives a lot of comfort I have to say.

  • @davidquirk8097
    @davidquirk8097 2 години тому

    And all for £2.50.
    I bought one of the JV100s that you recently showed. A brilliant bit of kit made even better by your 'Forbidden Instruction Manual"
    Thanks Clive.

  • @OregonBeaver
    @OregonBeaver 12 днів тому +2

    Nice, I always wondered how they did that. They work very well. 🙂

  • @frogz
    @frogz 3 години тому +4

    odd teardown but im here for it!

  • @dcallan812
    @dcallan812 12 днів тому +3

    It hard to beat a good Fluke. 2x👍 As an apprentice I spent a while making thermocouples in the 1980s ICI had a huge machine that ad a built in microscope and laser. Very interesting to see all that time ago and the whole process was managed by hand

  • @amorphuc
    @amorphuc 10 днів тому +1

    Very interesting. Thanks Big Clive.

  • @grantrennie
    @grantrennie 9 днів тому +1

    Thanks for the great video Clive 👍

  • @AleksServisMan
    @AleksServisMan Годину тому

    Спасибо, Clive! Всегда хотел узнать, как устроены эти жала. Уж больно интересным мне казалось, что они используют всего два провода и не боятся горячей замены.

  • @frankowalker4662
    @frankowalker4662 2 години тому

    When my 1970's soldering iron stopped working in the late 80's, I took it apart to try and fix. It used a bimetallic switch for the temp sensor. One part of it had snapped so I just got a new iron.

  • @KeritechElectronics
    @KeritechElectronics 2 години тому

    Very interesting! I always thought these tips have the sleeve for common ground, one contact for the heater and another for the thermocouple or resistive sensor. Was I wrong, haha!
    Nice vintage Fluke too.

  • @DouglasK
    @DouglasK 12 днів тому +4

    Very neat! I love my T12 based iron (ShineNow brand via Amazon). I've always been curious about those innards, much appreciated.

    • @afraid2crashrc
      @afraid2crashrc 3 години тому

      I've had the same rig for six years or so. Never had a problem with it, use it all the time!

  • @mrpetit2
    @mrpetit2 2 години тому +1

    0:38 Dominator!!! 😁🤣 Thàt is a looong time ago👍👍👍. Pretty much the beginnings of Dutch hardcore. Those were the days!
    But you were well in your 20's back then. I was still a teen.

  • @ranke
    @ranke 3 години тому +1

    i suspected something similar from the tips we have at work... thanks for cutting trhis open for me :-)

  • @wisher21uk
    @wisher21uk Годину тому

    Very interesting Clive rally enjoyed it many thanks 😊

  • @rickyrico80
    @rickyrico80 16 хвилин тому

    Lol bro just quoted Dominator start to finish 👍🏼🥳

  • @hyperverbal
    @hyperverbal Годину тому

    What a flash back I was perplexed but now I remember there were rubber bumpers ...Gray? I might have one at my Mom's stull, will check soon... One moment please 😊

  • @ciprianwinerElectronicManiac
    @ciprianwinerElectronicManiac 2 години тому +1

    The JBC ones if I remember correctly, they have 3 pins and don't have the thermocouple in series with the heating element, seems more easy for a DIY soldering station.

  • @joshuabest100
    @joshuabest100 2 години тому

    Thanks now i know how it works i tore down the handle and only noticed 3 wires thinking maybe it had a 3 wire setup but measuring i realised it had no temp sensor now i know why

  • @gregorythomas333
    @gregorythomas333 12 днів тому

    Pretty neat design...very different than I imagined they would be
    The Vise of Knowledge...haven't heard that device in quite some time :)

  • @Produkt_R
    @Produkt_R Годину тому

    I use mine quite regularly

  • @AlexandruVoda
    @AlexandruVoda 2 години тому

    So the thermocouple is in series with heating element. Always wondered how these tips manage both heating and sensing with just two contacts.

  • @barrieshepherd7694
    @barrieshepherd7694 12 днів тому +6

    Thanks Clive, I had always wondered and had, wrongly, assumed that there were three connections using the apparently unconnected outer as a return path.

  • @jeroenontour
    @jeroenontour 3 години тому

    The most common thermocouple is the K-type. The metals used are Nickel-Chromium / Nickel-Alumel. The measured voltage can be as high as 55 mV DC for a temperature of 1370 °C. The highest voltage i ever has seen was 70 mV for a J-type thermocouple.

  • @snakezdewiggle6084
    @snakezdewiggle6084 3 години тому

    No point reinventing the wheel, right.!
    Thanks Clive.👍😉

  • @A--Abbas
    @A--Abbas 3 години тому

    Big thank you Clive for super useful video, I use T12 irons everywhere in different formats from station version to portable cordless ones and was tempted more than once to venture into the tip. Useful indeed to learn about the tip construction & design, I wonder how is that actually put together on a production line from automation way?? Nice one and please keep them coming.

  • @twocvbloke
    @twocvbloke 2 години тому

    It's fun to think it's essentially a tip-ring-sleeve type of setup akin to what started off as telephony connections, though this one is more ring-ring-sleeve, someone left the tip in for more than a minute... :P

  • @JoseSilveira-newhandleforYT
    @JoseSilveira-newhandleforYT 52 хвилини тому

    Very interesting! Too bad you had to destroy one in the autopsy. You are probably right - it must be some derivative of the type C thermocouple, that is good for very high temperatures, even though the soldering iron tip would be perfectly served by a type K.

  • @feynthefallen
    @feynthefallen 47 хвилин тому

    I knew it was hollow. The reason I knew is because I know you can actually change these without waiting for them to cool down on most irons, because only the tip really gets terribly hot.

  • @jmargarson
    @jmargarson 12 днів тому +3

    Probably a type J, iron/constantan thermocouple going by the magnetic attraction.

    • @bigclivedotcom
      @bigclivedotcom  12 днів тому +2

      Keep in mind that the iron containing wire was not part of the thermocouple. I'd guess it may have been nickel based.

  • @noggin73
    @noggin73 10 днів тому +2

    I wonder if TS100/TS101 tips are the same? They look very similar only shorter.

    • @bigclivedotcom
      @bigclivedotcom  10 днів тому +2

      I think it's the same style.

    • @lukahierl9857
      @lukahierl9857 2 години тому

      JBC T245 may be interesting becsuse they are more compact. I am using genuine Tips in an aliexpress station and it works great. A big chisel tip makes quick work of XT90 connectors with 6mm2 cable.

  • @me.ko.i1279
    @me.ko.i1279 3 години тому

    Nice video idea

  •  2 години тому

    I just ordered a Sugon T61 (400W) that uses JBC C210 cartridges with one handle or it can use C245 or C470 cartridges from the same different handle. I happen to have a T26 that consumes C210 and possibly might work with the generic C115 handle (will experiment). Note: there are a newer series of JBC cartridges ending in "E" for "long life" supposedly containing more iron. The problem though is their product numbering system is inconsistent so it's a pain to find similar shaped tips across different product lines, even E to not-E.

  • @Conservator.
    @Conservator. 2 години тому

    Probably less amusing as analysis of some other articles with various usages but I’m sure this video will be more interesting.
    I like both kind of videos equally though. 😁

  • @DiggerD-w6r
    @DiggerD-w6r 2 години тому +1

    I'm still old school.

  • @nomusicrc
    @nomusicrc 20 хвилин тому

    I always wondered how these worked

  • @carlubambi5541
    @carlubambi5541 3 години тому +1

    Over complicated but because its so handy and disposable .you can pick up a bunch for a reasonal price .I still have my Ungar low voltage soldering station .The cartridge heating elements are expensive and so are the tips .But its still working after 35 years .the white rubber cable is starting to get attacked from ozone .Going to look around on eBay for a replacement in better shape

  • @un2mensch
    @un2mensch 2 години тому

    Thanks for the pill flashback ear-worm, big Clive. Now walking back from Sainsbury's with my gurn face on

  • @4lecsg
    @4lecsg Годину тому

    I have a bunch of these, but one of them starts to 'puff' some weird smelling offgas when it gets hot. I wonder what's up with that.

  • @MrZetor
    @MrZetor Годину тому

    Great work, again! Was the thermocouple at the base of the round part of the blade tip (and not further inside the blade tip)?
    I'd like to weld or solder a wide piece of copper into the tip of one of these dirt-cheap T12 elements to make a tip that can desolder big ICs.

  • @goodun2974
    @goodun2974 16 хвилин тому

    Clive, if youhad heated the wires with your mini blowtorch, the color of the flame might have told you what the metal is. Iron produces a golden or orange flame; nickel is green, as is copper. Not sure what color nichrome is....and PS, nickel is magnetic but nichrome is not.

  • @angeldelvax7219
    @angeldelvax7219 3 години тому

    Interesting indeed! I was wondering about these thermocouples. Recently tried to use ADJ fogger electronics in a Martin fogger to get at least one of them working again, and didn't know if the thermocouple would give off the same voltage. Still haven't checked if this is universal or not. The electronics worked, so it wasn't that important at the time.
    Is there a universal combination used for these things? And if so, is the voltage purely temperature driven, or does size / shape of the metals in the thermocouple make a difference too?

  • @triodehexode
    @triodehexode 2 години тому

    Are these similar to Metcals we used them 27 years ago for a subcontract for Motorola when they had their plant at Livingston. They insisted we used them £450 in the late 90s £15 a tip they were great. Think RF heated them.

  • @KuntalGhosh
    @KuntalGhosh 3 години тому

    I always thought they are using 3 connection pointa and the long metal part is the ground and one of the upper ring is the coil and other the temperature sensor.. like a trs headphone jack where the s is just a common ground..

  • @ThunderBassistJay
    @ThunderBassistJay 3 години тому

    It's not the junction generating the voltage. Over each wire a voltage will be present, proportional to the temperature gradient along the length. Because the wires are of different alloys, these voltages will be different. As the wires are in contact with each other at the hot junction, this voltage difference will be present on the cold side of the wires. 😉🤓

  • @terrym1065
    @terrym1065 2 години тому +1

    Too bad they can't be repaired. I've had several brand new ones that were faulty, never worked or even recognized by the solder station. Too costly or time consuming to return to seller, just toss and buy again. Thanks Clive.

  • @kevgermany
    @kevgermany 2 години тому

    Is the thermocouple simply the dissimilar wires to the heating element?

  • @smalcolmbrown
    @smalcolmbrown Годину тому

    Thanks :) Are you sure it is thermocouple? Nichrome and a copper wire is a thermocouple but not a good one. If you measure the voltage across the heater element which is Nichrome resistance wire then the voltage is proportional to the temperature. You can then use Pulse Width Modulation and a PID controller to control the temperature. The opamp is then amplifying the difference in resistance. The diode is to take advantage of the diode conduction curve. So that you use high gain for a small amount of change whilst the 24 volt Heater is in operation.

  • @markfergerson2145
    @markfergerson2145 2 години тому

    “If we take a look at the tip… (pregnant pause). Yeah, I’m sure that sounded better in your head but we will let it pass.
    20-20 hindsight thoughts: t
    To get a better idea of the thermocouple voltage, use another temperature controlled iron to heat the tip instead of a propane torch.
    Place the tip in ice water and see what the meter reads.
    I wouldn’t be surprised if the strongly magnetic wire was some variation of nichrome which itself is not magnetic.
    By the way- I have a relatively ancient Fluke 20 which is still going strong. Fluke rules for a reason.

  • @FunningRast
    @FunningRast 54 хвилини тому

    Anyone have any recommendations for a soldering iron for a beginner?

    • @goodun2974
      @goodun2974 27 хвилин тому

      What type of electronics will you be building or repairing, and will you be doing this for hours at a time or just soldering a few parts or connectors here and there?

    • @FunningRast
      @FunningRast 14 хвилин тому

      @ I’d like to be able to get to the point that I could repair old electronics that aren’t worth the cost of someone else repairing instead of tossing them. But really I just want to work on getting the basics and build from there. There’s so many options it’s a bit overwhelming.

  • @jkobain
    @jkobain 2 години тому +3

    Some intelligent battery mods for puffin' some viscous liquids don't even rely on bimetallic thermal couple: they measure voltage drop across the heater and, knowing its base resistance, material and thermal coefficient curve, infer its temperature.
    It is one of the reasons why people migrated from nickel-chromium to alloys with more significant thermal drift.

  • @kev2020-z9s
    @kev2020-z9s 3 години тому +1

    METCAL Soldering use only two connections that includes the ground widely used in at the top end of electronic industry Computing Devices (Hastings) 1995 now part of General Dynamic. They were used in the surface mount department wiring department used the good old weller irons

    • @ciprianwinerElectronicManiac
      @ciprianwinerElectronicManiac 2 години тому +1

      Metcalf tips are self regulating and use an RF frequency to drive them, very complex stuff.

  • @MarkMLl_uk
    @MarkMLl_uk Годину тому

    Ah yes that /is/ interesting: a thermocouple and heater in series.

  • @jeremiahbullfrog9288
    @jeremiahbullfrog9288 43 хвилини тому

    What's the point of one of the wires being steel?

  • @jeffdayman8183
    @jeffdayman8183 20 хвилин тому

    Could it be hacked to help vapourize woofle-resistant fluids for enabling wooflage? 8^) Interesting teardown. Won't need a new iron anytime soon but nice to see how they're made. Cheers!

  • @10lauset
    @10lauset 3 години тому

    Cheers from COLD (-25C) Edmonton Alberta Canada. 🥶🥶🥶

  • @rocketman221projects
    @rocketman221projects Годину тому

    Was that a genuine Hakko tip or a clone?

  • @lazy_termite
    @lazy_termite 3 години тому

    is fluke that good tho? there are a lot of advantages for an organization, but if you buy it for yourself, not so much. I'd rather pick another brand

    • @bigclivedotcom
      @bigclivedotcom  3 години тому +2

      Fluke has the advantage of ticking the safety officers box with minimal effort on their part, and getting them off your back.

    • @ctbrahmstedt
      @ctbrahmstedt 2 години тому

      As AvE might put it, when you're squeezed down a mineshaft trying to diagnose a failure, do you ever want to ask yourself, "is this the problem, or is my meter broken?" You're kind of buying trust in a quality product - that it won't break when you drop it 6 feet, that banana jacks *likely* won't fail and give you a bad reading, etc. They're just as accurate as a $10 multimeter, but when I grab my Fluke, I just know that I'm not going to have issues with it. Look how old Clive's meter is. I betcha a $10 meter wouldn't last as long as that one.

  • @Conservator.
    @Conservator. 2 години тому

    2:18 Fubar!

  • @billdoodson4232
    @billdoodson4232 2 години тому

    Well, here was me thinking they would be mineral insulated, a bit like MICC.

  • @SirBoden
    @SirBoden 2 години тому

    Greetings everyone,
    I hope you’re having a lovely day
    Yours truly, Boden.

  • @phonotical
    @phonotical 2 години тому

    I like a grounded tip, but nobody should ever be using one of these on live circuitry

    • @goodun2974
      @goodun2974 31 хвилина тому

      Reports from UA-cam videos are thst the Ksger and Aixun T12 type stations leak high voltage, 100 volts AC or thereabouts, from the tip into whatever components you're soldering. These cheap T12 soldering stations have switching supplies, don't utilize a power transformer, and the tips aren't earth-grounded. Auxun keeps upgrading the firmware but hasn't solved the issue. Buyer beware.....

  • @chrisprobert6
    @chrisprobert6 54 хвилини тому

    Haha shit, torx twelve was what I thought. For me screwdriver...
    Gaud I'm too old!!!

  • @die.slow36
    @die.slow36 Годину тому

    Cool. I was going to take apart my kids fathers and blame the cat😊