Know that the current lead time on parts is 3-5 months Mercedes has zero customer service and will say too bad if you’re without your vehicle for that period of time You have to take your van to 4 dealerships to get issues resolved If you have the service package and they don’t complete a service you’ll have to drive thousands of kilometres to the next dealer to finish it I wouldn’t buy another one
@@outdoorbros_ we’ve had issues with numerous dealerships here -no completing services properly despite having the service package -not honouring the ppm -back ordered parts 3-5months -dealerships tampering with dash cameras - having to go to 4 dealerships for the same issue -being told items aren’t covered on warranty only to discover later that’s what caused our issues -loaner vehicles not being available -being told it’s 6-8 weeks wait to make an appointment at dealership When speaking to mercedes Canada their response is they’re short staffed and there’s nothing they can do about it so too bad
MPG....its a burning question, but also a math one. I run a 170 4x4 at about 10k lbs. Yup she is heavy. Roof rack, lights and lots of goodies inside. I get on average 16 mpg. I have 275 tires. Here is the important part. I rarely hit 70 mph. I know the 144's are comfy and drive like a car (but they don't stop that quick) and they have the aerodynamics of a small house. Far too often people complain about mpg, and then reveal they are going 70 plus mph. It's a van, not a car, it's a heavy large thing, not a low light vehicle. If you go to the breakers yards, there are a lot of Sprinters totalled because of.....front end damage. Driving too fast, driving to close (tempting as your field of view is so good) but they cannot stop in time. It's a van; used for deliveries in cities, stop and go, slow transport of materials. Here you are with your family and bikes humming down the freeway at over 70 mph. Enuff said. So to get great mpg, cruise control, max 60-63 on the dial (65-66 actual with larger tires) keep the revs at 2k or close for cruising. Manually shift if she struggles. Eliminate un-needed weight. Every pound counts. But please go slow, its cheaper, see the countryside, not a blur...and be safe. Your wife and kids will thank you.
Great points. I don’t recall if it made it into the video, but I’m fully aware that it isn’t the most aerodynamic vehicle on the road and the accessories don’t help. I’ve noticed a increase in gas mileage simply from a tire rotation- every little bit counts. Stay safe out there.
Spot-on! The point of taking a holiday is to step back from the stress and hustle of work, so when vacationing in the 9K lb van, drive it like you're stepping away from the stress of hustle-bustle...slow down. Stopping quickly in rush-hour traffic, bumper-to-bumper can be very scary and shocking.
Mind you the mpg noted on the dash is not necessarily the actual mpg if you have bigger wheels. Unless the clocks have been recalibrated it will show less mpg with bigger wheels. Best way to check is to fill it up full and do a 100 mile trip. (100miles on GPS, not the clocks as they will be out and show less mileage as well)
We had a 2wd 170” MB and opted to go shorter and AWD for our self build out. The build out our first wasn’t our first rodeo as we have owned several VW Westfailias, a Pleasureway MB and we like the easier parking of a 19’6” van over a 23’ van. We have had a Ford Transit AWD for a bit over 2 years and are happy with our Euro style design that no one had on this side of the water in 2020. A garage and E/W full time bed (with a small slide instead of flairs) were on the must have along with all the usual comfort items. Our van would be closest to a Storyteller van but we were not forced to have a number of options that didn’t meet our needs or that we didn’t want. 2 years in and we don’t want to change a thing on the basic build; we only want to upgrade our bed mattress, so the design is perfect for us.
If you want to know what your vehicle burns in fuel under various conditions, get a ScanGauge2. It plugs into your OBD2 port. Program the display to show Gallons Per Hour. Find a nice long section of flat freeway and run at various speeds, take notes. My truck is most efficient at 55 mph. When I run at 70 mph I'm burning $15 more fuel per hour than at 55 MPH. For a 6 hour trip I'll save 90 minutes drive time by going 70 MPH but I'll spend $80 to $90 more in fuel. The choice is yours!
Great video. My wife and I are at a similar stage of ownership both in terms of mileage and time owned. I'll confirm that: 1) The longer van is easy to drive, maneuver, and use. In paritcular, our Ford Transit 148" Extended length maintains the wheelbase of a truck, but has the extra overhang - we park in grocery strore parking lots with ease by backing the van onto a perimeter parking spot. We also wanted the shorter length for the reasons your described, but if given the chance again would stick with the longer van again. 2) We have the RWD Ford Transit and have crossed Canada in the winter, been up to winter Norway and driven through a Bulgarian winter. We have a limited slip differential, and chains. I would share that in my experience, we didn't need 4WD. When we needed chains, I still would have put them on if we had 4WD because of the sheer slipperiness of the ice below the tires. 3) We started as well with 20MPG and now with the full weight of 9,000lbs we average 14MPG. As for the value - I agree- once you get into it it changes your life! We are so happy to have the van in our lives. I enjoyed your perspective and clear communication. Cheers and happy travels!
Two wheel drive with a locking differential and chains. Unless you are traveling on those roads that mandate 4wheel drive/4wheel drive with chains then buy the 4wheel drive. I remember traveling in California and running into police roadblocks that would not less you pass unless you had four wheel drive and/or chains. Great video.
Good tips, but I’m not paying someone $100k-$200k (not including price of van), when I can do the exact same work for $25k-$35k. A power supply from one company was $25k before labor! I priced out the same exact components for $6k.
This build wasn’t nearly that much, but if you can do it for $25k-$35k, I’m envious of your skill set. If I could have done it myself, I think it would have a been a blast.
@@outdoorbros_ I might be being too optimistic. But, considering my 4Runner build has cost me about $30k-35k (I think), I figured it would be around the same price. I did A LOT more to the 4Runner. It's for sure going to be fun, but there will be times when I will wish I paid someone haha. Pricing out new Revels and speaking to builders, it's crazy how much most of them want. The Sprinter was $70-ish, out the door. I am hoping to get it all done for under $110k.
If you have what it takes to do so, then yeah it's awesome if you can. For me, it's like - I dont have the skills - I dont have the tools - I dont have the time - I dont have the motivation - I dont have the space, like a workshop or a garage of my own I'm a software dev, I am good at creating digital things. I can do simple jobs in and around the house, but building a custom van as a total newbie isn't for me.
Caution to DIY conversions. Track and try and keep all that added weight LOW in the vehicle. These are narrow vans, mostly lifted, and just because the payload is what it is, the vans are not designed to carry the max factory payload rating 100% of the time, with the Center of Gravity 3-4-5ft above a stock cargo variant and be safe. Chose lightweight options on materials the higher up you go.
The US versions of the Sprinter get less gas mileage than the UK version for some reason. I get 30-32 mpg in my Sprinter 170 even though it's built out.
Thx for the video, Many years ago I looked at starting a build myself, used to fix cars when I was younger and had no money, the difference between a pro build and normal skills on such a small platform is something most dont think about till it is too late. ..... now looking at an airstream interstate 19 with E1 ( 12Kw battery system , all electric no propane ) , deisel 4x4... ends up like $220K.. but full bathroom and shower , runas aircon / micorwave / induction all from battery .... NO RV park for me! This information was very helpful, thx.
Thanks for this, I'm in the market for something like this. I'm based in Europe and the AlphaVan is a prime candidate. Sure, I could TRY to build the thing myself, but - I dont have the skills - I dont have the tools - I dont have the time - I dont have the motivation - I dont have the space - I do have the money to purchase an already built van So yeah the choice is pretty simple for me. I have a budget of around 300.000-350.000 euros.
I'm a single dude with no pets, so I fit in a SWB Transit just fine. I could certainly fill up a long wheel base van with all my toys and junk. As it is I end up using my bunk for storage in the daytime and throw it all on the floor at night. As far as gas mileage, I've gone out of my way not to have a bunch of crap poking off the top of the van creating wind resistance. Weight is an issue too, but I can only control that so much. Roof racks are superfluous. I can mount solar panels without them. I don't plan on walking around on the roof in a drone video or storing stuff up there. Plus they cost a ton!
Great video, and I think your point about the reasons for why you would buy something like this are valid, it's never going to be economical, but it does give you the ability to perhaps do things you wouldn't ordinarily do.
Thanks! The counter is always that you could do everything we’re doing with a more economical setup- I won’t deny that… but this rig has been perfect for our family.
Great video . I’m building one now , well done explaining the pros and cons . Family of 3 for this build , so pretty much in the same boat with the second row of seats . Cheers ,stay exploring .
Wow. I have a Ford Transit AWD gas version and I get 18 mpg. Same wheelbase. Did my own build as well. Costs a lot more to build than I thought as well. I keep my road bike in the garage. Too afraid of thieves. Great channel. Just found it.
Add Amsoil all in 1 to the fuel, keep the fuel system clean, it help alot with mileage, i add it to every fill up, the cost of the additive negates any fuel savings, bit you'll notice the van will just run better
Great video! Love your video. Very informative, accurate, and well done. Thank you for sharing! I know what you mean about the gas mileage. I build out our Sprinter myself, so the weight it less than yours perhaps. I don't have a roof rack with lights like you have but do have some low profile solar panels. I have a 12v AC, but mine is from Cruse-N-Comfort so it doesn't have the AC unit on the roof, which cuts down on wind resistance a bit. Otherwise I think I have a van similar to yours - a 2020 4x4 Sprinter 144 2500, with Black Rhino Arsenal wheels and LT265/70R17 BFG KO2s. On the highway we're getting a fairly solid 16 MPG. Actually, on our last trip it was about 16.4 MPG on the highway and if you increase that number by 4% due to the larger tire diameter compared to stock, the mileage is right at 17 MPG. City driving is quite a bit worse. If you're running 265/70 BFG KO2s, the speedometer/odometer difference is right at at 4%, so if you go 50 MPH or miles, it's actually 52, and 75 is actually 78, and 100 miles on the odometer would actually be 104 miles traveled. So I'm with you, I am not happy with the mileage, but once adjusted for the tire size, it's a slight bit better. Regarding the 4x4, I don't use it a lot, but it has saved me on several occasions. Just last week due to my stupidity both my rear wheels dropped 12 inches off the edge of a gravel parking area. I found some small logs and such to build up a short, 12 inch long, very steep "ramp" and with the 4 wheel drive I was able to climb out. With my old 2 wheel drive sprinter, first off I would have bottomed out and been sitting on the frame, but even is I wasn't bottomed out, I could have never gotten out of that mess without a wrecker. And, I was in the North Carolina country side so a wrecker would have cost a fortune. I also have used 4x4 quite a bit on very poorly maintained mountain dirt roads and have been happy to have it when needed. I have the 144 and like it for parking, but with my wife and 10 year old son, it is a bit cramped. On balance, instead of the 170 wheel base, which is like 41 inches longer than the 144, I like the shorter 144 for parking, maneuvering, u=turning (turning circle of 144 is 41 feet and for the 170 it's 47 feet) and for us I think the sacrificed interior space trade off is acceptable.
good points and video . a lot of low miles used sprinters out there these days but i need the bike garage sleep over design for my work, so i may have to do it myself. thanks for info.
What’s up, E? Thank you. I think we’ll see more VS30 models hit the used market soon. Tons of folks bought them in hopes of working remote forever and that dream seems to be fading.
Look up Shafer Trail in Utah, my Sienna made it up and down on it stock, fully loaded w/ passengers and bikes, with no problems, all the peeps in Wranglers / 4 runners were looking at me funny 😂 thats why I only got the 2W drive Gas model 4 cylinder, so far more than capable w/ great mileage to boot 🤙🏼
As someone who constantly drives a rotation of all of them for work. My favorite is still the Promaster, although none are perfect. The Promaster is by FAR the best in weather and has the best power, also in mud and dirt. Id say the Ford is the least reliable but its close. The stock brakes on the Promaster suck. The Mercedes are nice but obviously much more expensive in general and to fix.
The one thing I wish I knew was engine performance. I sprung for the 170wb 3500XD dually for the increased towing capacity. The "euro sized" v6 diesel is just way to underpowered to tow anything, let alone anything close to the 7500 max tow weight. Even on hills not towing anything, the speedo ticks backwards struggling to keep up with the flow of traffic. I wish I knew this, I might have gone for a flatbed camper on a ram cummins 4500/5500.
There seem to be some unrealistic people chiming in here, so to this vid I will add that for any vehicle, bicycle, or other mechanical device, consumers are faced with a simple reality: Learn how to service the item yourself or get ready to pay someone else to do it for you. If you find yourself in a difficult situation with limited options for outside intervention (help), then be prepared to pay dearly for help if you are unable or unwilling to handle it yourself. This applies to anything in the adult universe. It requires an honest conversation with oneself: Can I and/or am I willing to do this difficult task or am I willing to pay whatever it takes to HIRE someone else to do it for me??? If you cannot pay to play, then do not jump in over your head, stay on the porch. Yes, we own a really well decked out 4WD Sprinter, and can confirm that they are flat-out expensive, but they are totally worth it and heads-and-heels above any other competitors. Ours is simple, yet highly functional, so it is not extravagant, definitely not complicated, and not a replacement for staying home, but it solves basic needs really well and therefore fits the bill for our camping and adventuring. Our experience is that when something needs to be added to or fixed on a Sprinter, the costs come as multiples of $500, period. Trying to cheap out on other options means you will be cutting corners that you will sooner or later regret. We are in a West Coast region that receives tons of snow when we go up to the mountains to ski, so the 4WD is a no-brainer for us. We use it multiple times/year for skiing and again in the summer on pretty difficult off-highway dirt roads and trails for remote camping. We average, around town (the worst possible mileage ) about 14.7mpg and about 15mpg on the road. Ours has a safari roof rack setup with solar panels and solar shower tanks, a side ladder, and big AT tires -- it has everything working against decent gas-mileage. It weighs in at close to 9K lbs and still hauls and tows like there is nothing else there, so I find that the wind is the real enemy. If you want better mileage then get rid of any and all exterior crap, go as sleek as possible. Hope this helps.
Awesome stuff. Waiting for my 2023 Transit. Could be 2024. But in meantime looking forward to your "off season" thoughts. Currently evaluating my comfort with taking a week off the bike, incorporating weights, cross training, etc. Still trying to stomach "losing fitness" but I know it is inevitable and appropriate if I want to have the same energy for 2023 gravel/race season. Also, book reco Endure was great. The mind is pretty powerful. Definitely deployed some strategies on those longer sustained climbs that give me fits. Best.
Thanks Kalli! Did ford re-do the 2023 Transit? I remember reading something special about the new model. I hear ya on losing fitness- I wish I could keep my summer pace all year long.
@@outdoorbros_ Yes I believe so. I don't know the specifics but it is basically a version with pre-installed options that cater to the conversion crowd.
My friend told me to get a gasoline engine, easy to find fuel. So i am considering the Transit Trail as well. Don't get great mileage with gas but come out even in dollars.
Vans seem like a great compromise for camping/traveling, but I do not love what the trend has done to many outdoor rec areas. So many massive parking lots which used to be open forest service lands… all for #vanlife to flourish. Sedona is the first one that comes to mind. Magical places are forever gone & you can now happily camp in what looks like a wal-mart parking lot with 100 of your closest pals, no off-leash pups, everyone parked in a row of other vans. Bummer.
I know this vid is 8 months old but if anything the problem hasn’t gotten any better…FINDING CERTIFIED TECHS! Who would of ever thought that if you’re traveling in rural parts of America, you’d be very hard pressed to find someone who’s actually certified to work on your rig…BIG DEAL BREAKER HERE, unless I always planned to be around big cities or towns.
You forgot to mention that Sprinters at around 90,000 miles require insanely expensive repairs due to all of the smog garbage they put on those diesels.
My co-worker own a Ford Raptor just did his annual service that cost him $2,300 and that's not a repair, nothing is cheap now unless you do it yourself will save.
@@rudeman1914 Right, everything is expensive now and impossible to work on yourself. But I was referring to the emission systems on Sprinter diesels that are particularly bad once they get some mikes on them. Actually, some say it’s all US diesels post 2005ish.
Those MPG's are insane. We have a 2wd Sprinter from, that is fully loaded from OSV and we always get 20-22mpg and that is going over the high passes here in Colorado. This is after 60k miles of driving. The change in tires would make a huge difference but then it is the 4wd and higher stance that kills it. Tough choice between 2wd and 4wd.
I drive a fully equiped Sprinter van here in Europe but to be quote honest I have a gas (Diesel) milage of around 17 miles per gallon. What size of tyres did you mount? I drive 245/75R16 BFG KO2 and have a pop up roof ...
Holly Smokes, I thought 27/mpg on average is low, as I've spoken with fellow camper travelers in Europe that they average 30-33mpg and that's Imperial gallons, still... you have a Bad-ass conversion and most of the time not every time is about..... smiles/gallons! :D
Your roof rack is causing a lot of drag because it's too far forward and disturbing the air flow. You should not install anything further forward than the stock Mercedes roof rails. Also, peak fuel economy is obtained at about 90kmh (56mph). On the highway I get 8l/100km (29mpg) at 90kmh, but that drops to 13l/100km (18mpg) if I travel at 110kmh (68mph). Mine is 2wd 4 cylinder manual. Never been stuck but do carry snow chains just in case.
So glad I found your channel. Been loving the bike content and am looking at a van in the next couple years. Question: did you explore Transits before buying a van or just went straight for the Sprinter? I see pros and cons to both vans.
What’s up, John? The transit wasn’t a consideration, simply because my builder was only doing sprinters at the time. I also liked that the sprinters held their value really well, especially the diesel 4x4 models- there wasn’t a ton of resale data on transits when we were shopping.
I am of the year of 19 & 64, endeavoring to be a centurion or beyond. God willing! A bucket is rather small vessel for a world so full of wonderful opportunities, experiences and adventures to be had. Living is where it's at. Filling a bucket should be saved for your water.
There's about $100,000 in profit in these builds. Sure, if you have an extra $100,000 laying around why not have a company build it but you are buying at full retail and the minute you take the keys you are losing $40,000. Build it yourself and have instant equity. Hire a plumber and electrician then a cabinet maker and do some work yourself. No different than building your own home.
@@toddcoble1485 I meant $100,000 difference between a self build and a company building it for you with the same parts. There is labour, overhead and taxes that they pay out of the difference.
170 yeah than you wont be able to park anywhere and be even more limited on off road trails and worse gas mileage on the 170 than you will wish you had the 144 back
What else should I have known before I bought this? Questions on the build? Drop me a comment below.
Know that the current lead time on parts is 3-5 months
Mercedes has zero customer service and will say too bad if you’re without your vehicle for that period of time
You have to take your van to 4 dealerships to get issues resolved
If you have the service package and they don’t complete a service you’ll have to drive thousands of kilometres to the next dealer to finish it
I wouldn’t buy another one
@@Jsuttar ouch, that sounds brutal. I’ll keep my fingers crossed that I don’t have similar issues.
@@outdoorbros_ we’ve had issues with numerous dealerships here
-no completing services properly despite having the service package
-not honouring the ppm
-back ordered parts 3-5months
-dealerships tampering with dash cameras
- having to go to 4 dealerships for the same issue
-being told items aren’t covered on warranty only to discover later that’s what caused our issues
-loaner vehicles not being available
-being told it’s 6-8 weeks wait to make an appointment at dealership
When speaking to mercedes Canada their response is they’re short staffed and there’s nothing they can do about it so too bad
@@Jsuttar that’s terrible!
how do you deal with crosswind assist? I have a 170wb
MPG....its a burning question, but also a math one. I run a 170 4x4 at about 10k lbs. Yup she is heavy. Roof rack, lights and lots of goodies inside. I get on average 16 mpg. I have 275 tires. Here is the important part. I rarely hit 70 mph. I know the 144's are comfy and drive like a car (but they don't stop that quick) and they have the aerodynamics of a small house. Far too often people complain about mpg, and then reveal they are going 70 plus mph. It's a van, not a car, it's a heavy large thing, not a low light vehicle. If you go to the breakers yards, there are a lot of Sprinters totalled because of.....front end damage. Driving too fast, driving to close (tempting as your field of view is so good) but they cannot stop in time. It's a van; used for deliveries in cities, stop and go, slow transport of materials. Here you are with your family and bikes humming down the freeway at over 70 mph. Enuff said. So to get great mpg, cruise control, max 60-63 on the dial (65-66 actual with larger tires) keep the revs at 2k or close for cruising. Manually shift if she struggles. Eliminate un-needed weight. Every pound counts. But please go slow, its cheaper, see the countryside, not a blur...and be safe. Your wife and kids will thank you.
Great points. I don’t recall if it made it into the video, but I’m fully aware that it isn’t the most aerodynamic vehicle on the road and the accessories don’t help. I’ve noticed a increase in gas mileage simply from a tire rotation- every little bit counts. Stay safe out there.
Spot-on! The point of taking a holiday is to step back from the stress and hustle of work, so when vacationing in the 9K lb van, drive it like you're stepping away from the stress of hustle-bustle...slow down. Stopping quickly in rush-hour traffic, bumper-to-bumper can be very scary and shocking.
Mind you the mpg noted on the dash is not necessarily the actual mpg if you have bigger wheels. Unless the clocks have been recalibrated it will show less mpg with bigger wheels. Best way to check is to fill it up full and do a 100 mile trip. (100miles on GPS, not the clocks as they will be out and show less mileage as well)
We had a 2wd 170” MB and opted to go shorter and AWD for our self build out. The build out our first wasn’t our first rodeo as we have owned several VW Westfailias, a Pleasureway MB and we like the easier parking of a 19’6” van over a 23’ van. We have had a Ford Transit AWD for a bit over 2 years and are happy with our Euro style design that no one had on this side of the water in 2020. A garage and E/W full time bed (with a small slide instead of flairs) were on the must have along with all the usual comfort items. Our van would be closest to a Storyteller van but we were not forced to have a number of options that didn’t meet our needs or that we didn’t want. 2 years in and we don’t want to change a thing on the basic build; we only want to upgrade our bed mattress, so the design is perfect for us.
I love it- sounds like an awesome build!
If you want to know what your vehicle burns in fuel under various conditions, get a ScanGauge2. It plugs into your OBD2 port. Program the display to show Gallons Per Hour. Find a nice long section of flat freeway and run at various speeds, take notes. My truck is most efficient at 55 mph. When I run at 70 mph I'm burning $15 more fuel per hour than at 55 MPH. For a 6 hour trip I'll save 90 minutes drive time by going 70 MPH but I'll spend $80 to $90 more in fuel. The choice is yours!
Great video. My wife and I are at a similar stage of ownership both in terms of mileage and time owned.
I'll confirm that:
1) The longer van is easy to drive, maneuver, and use. In paritcular, our Ford Transit 148" Extended length maintains the wheelbase of a truck, but has the extra overhang - we park in grocery strore parking lots with ease by backing the van onto a perimeter parking spot. We also wanted the shorter length for the reasons your described, but if given the chance again would stick with the longer van again.
2) We have the RWD Ford Transit and have crossed Canada in the winter, been up to winter Norway and driven through a Bulgarian winter. We have a limited slip differential, and chains. I would share that in my experience, we didn't need 4WD. When we needed chains, I still would have put them on if we had 4WD because of the sheer slipperiness of the ice below the tires.
3) We started as well with 20MPG and now with the full weight of 9,000lbs we average 14MPG.
As for the value - I agree- once you get into it it changes your life! We are so happy to have the van in our lives.
I enjoyed your perspective and clear communication. Cheers and happy travels!
Thanks Brian! Great insights and sounds like your family is enjoying the Transit- stoked for ya!
Two wheel drive with a locking differential and chains. Unless you are traveling on those roads that mandate 4wheel drive/4wheel drive with chains then buy the 4wheel drive. I remember traveling in California and running into police roadblocks that would not less you pass unless you had four wheel drive and/or chains. Great video.
Thanks! Yeah, happens regularly out here. 4WD + chains are usually required, unlike a lot of other areas.
Good tips, but I’m not paying someone $100k-$200k (not including price of van), when I can do the exact same work for $25k-$35k. A power supply from one company was $25k before labor! I priced out the same exact components for $6k.
This build wasn’t nearly that much, but if you can do it for $25k-$35k, I’m envious of your skill set. If I could have done it myself, I think it would have a been a blast.
@@outdoorbros_ I might be being too optimistic. But, considering my 4Runner build has cost me about $30k-35k (I think), I figured it would be around the same price. I did A LOT more to the 4Runner. It's for sure going to be fun, but there will be times when I will wish I paid someone haha. Pricing out new Revels and speaking to builders, it's crazy how much most of them want. The Sprinter was $70-ish, out the door. I am hoping to get it all done for under $110k.
If you have what it takes to do so, then yeah it's awesome if you can. For me, it's like
- I dont have the skills
- I dont have the tools
- I dont have the time
- I dont have the motivation
- I dont have the space, like a workshop or a garage of my own
I'm a software dev, I am good at creating digital things. I can do simple jobs in and around the house, but building a custom van as a total newbie isn't for me.
Caution to DIY conversions. Track and try and keep all that added weight LOW in the vehicle. These are narrow vans, mostly lifted, and just because the payload is what it is, the vans are not designed to carry the max factory payload rating 100% of the time, with the Center of Gravity 3-4-5ft above a stock cargo variant and be safe.
Chose lightweight options on materials the higher up you go.
Great points!
Thank you. Almost all van builders miss this most important consideration.
The US versions of the Sprinter get less gas mileage than the UK version for some reason. I get 30-32 mpg in my Sprinter 170 even though it's built out.
First! Love the content man, simple, short and sweet!
Thx for the video, Many years ago I looked at starting a build myself, used to fix cars when I was younger and had no money, the difference between a pro build and normal skills on such a small platform is something most dont think about till it is too late. .....
now looking at an airstream interstate 19 with E1 ( 12Kw battery system , all electric no propane ) , deisel 4x4... ends up like $220K.. but full bathroom and shower , runas aircon / micorwave / induction all from battery .... NO RV park for me!
This information was very helpful, thx.
Thanks for this, I'm in the market for something like this. I'm based in Europe and the AlphaVan is a prime candidate. Sure, I could TRY to build the thing myself, but
- I dont have the skills
- I dont have the tools
- I dont have the time
- I dont have the motivation
- I dont have the space
- I do have the money to purchase an already built van
So yeah the choice is pretty simple for me. I have a budget of around 300.000-350.000 euros.
Yosemite in the snow is probably the most scenic, stunningly gorgeous places in California…. 😎🍻
Totally agree- it's top 10 in the world, imo.
I'm a single dude with no pets, so I fit in a SWB Transit just fine.
I could certainly fill up a long wheel base van with all my toys and junk. As it is I end up using my bunk for storage in the daytime and throw it all on the floor at night.
As far as gas mileage, I've gone out of my way not to have a bunch of crap poking off the top of the van creating wind resistance.
Weight is an issue too, but I can only control that so much. Roof racks are superfluous. I can mount solar panels without them. I don't plan on walking around on the roof in a drone video or storing stuff up there. Plus they cost a ton!
Nice!
Great video, and I think your point about the reasons for why you would buy something like this are valid, it's never going to be economical, but it does give you the ability to perhaps do things you wouldn't ordinarily do.
Thanks! The counter is always that you could do everything we’re doing with a more economical setup- I won’t deny that… but this rig has been perfect for our family.
Great video . I’m building one now , well done explaining the pros and cons . Family of 3 for this build , so pretty much in the same boat with the second row of seats . Cheers ,stay exploring .
Wow. I have a Ford Transit AWD gas version and I get 18 mpg. Same wheelbase. Did my own build as well. Costs a lot more to build than I thought as well. I keep my road bike in the garage. Too afraid of thieves. Great channel. Just found it.
I was surprised when I looked at some of the DIY options- it wasn’t that inexpensive. Even the adventure wagon kit was pricey.
Really? what engine did you get with your Transit?
Add Amsoil all in 1 to the fuel, keep the fuel system clean, it help alot with mileage, i add it to every fill up, the cost of the additive negates any fuel savings, bit you'll notice the van will just run better
Great video! Love your video. Very informative, accurate, and well done. Thank you for sharing! I know what you mean about the gas mileage. I build out our Sprinter myself, so the weight it less than yours perhaps. I don't have a roof rack with lights like you have but do have some low profile solar panels. I have a 12v AC, but mine is from Cruse-N-Comfort so it doesn't have the AC unit on the roof, which cuts down on wind resistance a bit. Otherwise I think I have a van similar to yours - a 2020 4x4 Sprinter 144 2500, with Black Rhino Arsenal wheels and LT265/70R17 BFG KO2s. On the highway we're getting a fairly solid 16 MPG. Actually, on our last trip it was about 16.4 MPG on the highway and if you increase that number by 4% due to the larger tire diameter compared to stock, the mileage is right at 17 MPG. City driving is quite a bit worse. If you're running 265/70 BFG KO2s, the speedometer/odometer difference is right at at 4%, so if you go 50 MPH or miles, it's actually 52, and 75 is actually 78, and 100 miles on the odometer would actually be 104 miles traveled. So I'm with you, I am not happy with the mileage, but once adjusted for the tire size, it's a slight bit better. Regarding the 4x4, I don't use it a lot, but it has saved me on several occasions. Just last week due to my stupidity both my rear wheels dropped 12 inches off the edge of a gravel parking area. I found some small logs and such to build up a short, 12 inch long, very steep "ramp" and with the 4 wheel drive I was able to climb out. With my old 2 wheel drive sprinter, first off I would have bottomed out and been sitting on the frame, but even is I wasn't bottomed out, I could have never gotten out of that mess without a wrecker. And, I was in the North Carolina country side so a wrecker would have cost a fortune. I also have used 4x4 quite a bit on very poorly maintained mountain dirt roads and have been happy to have it when needed. I have the 144 and like it for parking, but with my wife and 10 year old son, it is a bit cramped. On balance, instead of the 170 wheel base, which is like 41 inches longer than the 144, I like the shorter 144 for parking, maneuvering, u=turning (turning circle of 144 is 41 feet and for the 170 it's 47 feet) and for us I think the sacrificed interior space trade off is acceptable.
Wow, way to break down the math on that mileage- such great points! Sounds like you're really enjoying the Sprinter to the max.
This is exactly right - the mileage hit is not as bad as you think if you switched to larger tires.
I always thought the SNL "Californians" skits were exaggerated. Your Cali accent is wild, I didn't know people actually talked like that.
He doesn't sound like a "Californian" to me, and I'm born and bred in southern California. That's his own accent.
@@nunyabeezwacks1408 People often don't recognize their own accents or think they don't have one. It takes outside ears.
He's well spoken and accent free. Not sure what you're hearing.
good points and video . a lot of low miles used sprinters out there these days but i need the bike garage sleep over design for my work, so i may have to do it myself. thanks for info.
What’s up, E? Thank you. I think we’ll see more VS30 models hit the used market soon. Tons of folks bought them in hopes of working remote forever and that dream seems to be fading.
Sprinter now following the Transit with AWD, no more 4WD. The 'van to have' now is the Transit Trail 2023.
I kind of like the 4WD system in ours- I was bummed to hear it was going away. Oh well.
It'll be available in 2025 and cost $80k+.
Transit trail Hahaha. Yeah don't think so
Look up Shafer Trail in Utah, my Sienna made it up and down on it stock, fully loaded w/ passengers and bikes, with no problems, all the peeps in Wranglers / 4 runners were looking at me funny 😂 thats why I only got the 2W drive Gas model 4 cylinder, so far more than capable w/ great mileage to boot 🤙🏼
No doubt… you can do tons in a normal van with 2WD.
the sprinter is better looking than transit and promaster.
I think most would agree. If only the price was a little lower..
The pro master is butt ugly
But do you prefer esthetics over how it performs?
As someone who constantly drives a rotation of all of them for work. My favorite is still the Promaster, although none are perfect. The Promaster is by FAR the best in weather and has the best power, also in mud and dirt. Id say the Ford is the least reliable but its close. The stock brakes on the Promaster suck. The Mercedes are nice but obviously much more expensive in general and to fix.
As of today which one of these four ( Mercedes, Promaster, Ford or Noom ) would you go with ?
Pros, cons in 2024 ?
Thanks in advance !
The one thing I wish I knew was engine performance. I sprung for the 170wb 3500XD dually for the increased towing capacity. The "euro sized" v6 diesel is just way to underpowered to tow anything, let alone anything close to the 7500 max tow weight. Even on hills not towing anything, the speedo ticks backwards struggling to keep up with the flow of traffic. I wish I knew this, I might have gone for a flatbed camper on a ram cummins 4500/5500.
There seem to be some unrealistic people chiming in here, so to this vid I will add that for any vehicle, bicycle, or other mechanical device, consumers are faced with a simple reality: Learn how to service the item yourself or get ready to pay someone else to do it for you. If you find yourself in a difficult situation with limited options for outside intervention (help), then be prepared to pay dearly for help if you are unable or unwilling to handle it yourself. This applies to anything in the adult universe. It requires an honest conversation with oneself: Can I and/or am I willing to do this difficult task or am I willing to pay whatever it takes to HIRE someone else to do it for me??? If you cannot pay to play, then do not jump in over your head, stay on the porch.
Yes, we own a really well decked out 4WD Sprinter, and can confirm that they are flat-out expensive, but they are totally worth it and heads-and-heels above any other competitors. Ours is simple, yet highly functional, so it is not extravagant, definitely not complicated, and not a replacement for staying home, but it solves basic needs really well and therefore fits the bill for our camping and adventuring. Our experience is that when something needs to be added to or fixed on a Sprinter, the costs come as multiples of $500, period. Trying to cheap out on other options means you will be cutting corners that you will sooner or later regret.
We are in a West Coast region that receives tons of snow when we go up to the mountains to ski, so the 4WD is a no-brainer for us. We use it multiple times/year for skiing and again in the summer on pretty difficult off-highway dirt roads and trails for remote camping. We average, around town (the worst possible mileage ) about 14.7mpg and about 15mpg on the road. Ours has a safari roof rack setup with solar panels and solar shower tanks, a side ladder, and big AT tires -- it has everything working against decent gas-mileage. It weighs in at close to 9K lbs and still hauls and tows like there is nothing else there, so I find that the wind is the real enemy. If you want better mileage then get rid of any and all exterior crap, go as sleek as possible.
Hope this helps.
Awesome stuff. Waiting for my 2023 Transit. Could be 2024. But in meantime looking forward to your "off season" thoughts. Currently evaluating my comfort with taking a week off the bike, incorporating weights, cross training, etc. Still trying to stomach "losing fitness" but I know it is inevitable and appropriate if I want to have the same energy for 2023 gravel/race season. Also, book reco Endure was great. The mind is pretty powerful. Definitely deployed some strategies on those longer sustained climbs that give me fits. Best.
Thanks Kalli! Did ford re-do the 2023 Transit? I remember reading something special about the new model.
I hear ya on losing fitness- I wish I could keep my summer pace all year long.
@@outdoorbros_ Yes I believe so. I don't know the specifics but it is basically a version with pre-installed options that cater to the conversion crowd.
My friend told me to get a gasoline engine, easy to find fuel. So i am considering the Transit Trail as well. Don't get great mileage with gas but come out even in dollars.
@@AZRockRunner With the trail now an option I wonder if I should change my order from the original transit? Would probably go backwards in the que?
@@MrTrikai Lots of cancelation i heard.
Great job as always, easy to watch
Thanks Conrad!
Vans seem like a great compromise for camping/traveling, but I do not love what the trend has done to many outdoor rec areas. So many massive parking lots which used to be open forest service lands… all for #vanlife to flourish. Sedona is the first one that comes to mind. Magical places are forever gone & you can now happily camp in what looks like a wal-mart parking lot with 100 of your closest pals, no off-leash pups, everyone parked in a row of other vans. Bummer.
I know this vid is 8 months old but if anything the problem hasn’t gotten any better…FINDING CERTIFIED TECHS! Who would of ever thought that if you’re traveling in rural parts of America, you’d be very hard pressed to find someone who’s actually certified to work on your rig…BIG DEAL BREAKER HERE, unless I always planned to be around big cities or towns.
Ahhh, that would be frustrating. I’m in a super densely populated area so we’ve had tons of dealers nearby. What’s your next best option? Transit?
@outdoorbros_ I guess a transit would be but I would never trust a ford powertrain...nor a dodge (kia) one either.
also a dad/cyclist here... a similar van and build would be ideal. do you mind sharing a rough estimate of the price?
You forgot to mention that Sprinters at around 90,000 miles require insanely expensive repairs due to all of the smog garbage they put on those diesels.
I’m sure I will when I do a video at 100k miles.
My co-worker own a Ford Raptor just did his annual service that cost him $2,300 and that's not a repair, nothing is cheap now unless you do it yourself will save.
@@rudeman1914 Right, everything is expensive now and impossible to work on yourself. But I was referring to the emission systems on Sprinter diesels that are particularly bad once they get some mikes on them. Actually, some say it’s all US diesels post 2005ish.
Those MPG's are insane. We have a 2wd Sprinter from, that is fully loaded from OSV and we always get 20-22mpg and that is going over the high passes here in Colorado. This is after 60k miles of driving. The change in tires would make a huge difference but then it is the 4wd and higher stance that kills it. Tough choice between 2wd and 4wd.
TSD card for diesel, don’t say ‘7 or 8k #, gives us dry weight OEM and put on CAT scale after buildout
Noted.
ATs are super heavy. Go taller stock width street tires and buy rescue boards and snow chains
Always a possibility.
The "144 2500" Is The Perfect Size For Me For My 3X Per Week Travel/Work GetAway
Rad!
Great video. Very informative. Thank you for posting it.
You got it! I’ll do an updated video at some point.
Exactly, 170 with 4x4, the one I bought, because it is not a vehicle to do real off-road.
Got it.
Thanks Bradley!
I drive a fully equiped Sprinter van here in Europe but to be quote honest I have a gas (Diesel) milage of around 17 miles per gallon.
What size of tyres did you mount? I drive 245/75R16 BFG KO2 and have a pop up roof ...
A lot of it probably due to tire size and weight, 275/70/17 BFG K02
Great video and nice van! I have the 2016 sprinter and I'm looking for a roof rack and really like yours who makes the roof rack?
Thank you! This is a VanSpeed roof rack. I think it’s called the Dakar Rack.
Holly Smokes, I thought 27/mpg on average is low, as I've spoken with fellow camper travelers in Europe that they average 30-33mpg and that's Imperial gallons, still... you have a Bad-ass conversion and most of the time not every time is about..... smiles/gallons! :D
as a newby to van life, i fail to understand how you even considered family van for 4 people in a 144'.
What a useful analysis. Thanks
As always, great video! 😃
Thanks Felipe!
Your roof rack is causing a lot of drag because it's too far forward and disturbing the air flow. You should not install anything further forward than the stock Mercedes roof rails.
Also, peak fuel economy is obtained at about 90kmh (56mph). On the highway I get 8l/100km (29mpg) at 90kmh, but that drops to 13l/100km (18mpg) if I travel at 110kmh (68mph).
Mine is 2wd 4 cylinder manual. Never been stuck but do carry snow chains just in case.
Nice! Yeah, I'm conscious of the loss in aerodynamics. Bummer.
incredibly informative.....Thanks for posting
Thanks for the video!
Trade offs on everything!
Thanks! I wish it weren't that way...
So glad I found your channel. Been loving the bike content and am looking at a van in the next couple years. Question: did you explore Transits before buying a van or just went straight for the Sprinter? I see pros and cons to both vans.
What’s up, John? The transit wasn’t a consideration, simply because my builder was only doing sprinters at the time. I also liked that the sprinters held their value really well, especially the diesel 4x4 models- there wasn’t a ton of resale data on transits when we were shopping.
Im honestly blown by the tone and way you drag words out. Blown away.
When you calculated your fuel economy, did you compensate for the larger tire size?
No, just went off of the gauge cluster.
I get 14.5 mpg in my 1 ton truck pulling 10k 20ft RV trailer
Excellent.
Our regret is in choosing the builder. Recreational Van Design, Sacramento. They really didn’t know what they were doing.
Ah, that's terrible. Sorry to hear!
Does a 2WD MB have a limited slip differential?
I’m not sure.
Great and helpful video.
Thanks Craig!
At 3:40 You meant diesel prices and diesel mileage? Thanks for video nice and short.
Thanks!
You added wheels and tires, right after purchasing the van¿🙄
Sounds like 144 RWD is the right choice for a retired couple.
Unless you REALLY need 4WD, RWD should suffice.
My 2WD 2016 mwb gives me 30 mpg average
Amazing!
thank you
You’re welcome.
thanks a lot
P.s., they don’t flex if you really use them off road…
Let me guess, are you a fireman? Kidding…every fireman in So Cal has one of these…
So young, and already with bucket list mentality. 🦨
Too young for that mentality?
I am of the year of 19 & 64, endeavoring to be a centurion or beyond. God willing!
A bucket is rather small vessel for a world so full of wonderful opportunities, experiences and adventures to be had.
Living is where it's at.
Filling a bucket should be saved for your water.
I think a full build RV is worth no more than 90K its 160SF
If you can build a house for 200K it's ridiculous to pay 200K for an RV. Sorry.
I wish you could buy a decent home for $200k in California. But I agree, the amount of money some folks spend on their rigs in hard to fathom.
With std. wheels I have been getting about 16 m.p,g, on a 2021 gas promaster coachman nova at freeway speeds.
Nice!
Tesla is coming out with an ERV
Sounds cool!
I'll stick with my Tacoma ;)
There's about $100,000 in profit in these builds. Sure, if you have an extra $100,000 laying around why not have a company build it but you are buying at full retail and the minute you take the keys you are losing $40,000. Build it yourself and have instant equity. Hire a plumber and electrician then a cabinet maker and do some work yourself. No different than building your own home.
I am a big advocate of DIY builds, but I can say with certainty there isn’t $100k profit in ‘any’ build
@@toddcoble1485 I meant $100,000 difference between a self build and a company building it for you with the same parts.
There is labour, overhead and taxes that they pay out of the difference.
170 yeah than you wont be able to park anywhere and be even more limited on off road trails and worse gas mileage on the 170 than you will wish you had the 144 back
TRUMP 2024 lets do some traveling, lower the gas prices.