What is really needed is POST code displays on all boards, even budget ones. They cost next to nothing and they were on nearly all motherboards 6 years ago, now they are a "premium feature".
Exactly. Boards that would cost 80-90 three years ago are 150 now. A lot of the "COVID costs" have been made up for by now, yet prices are still sky high. They can add useful features instead of laser-cut covers.
Digi Display, yeah cheap as chips! Also few other things an enthusiast or repetitive builder would emphasize first but in general not to shabby from Jay. Peace Bros / I mean People / I mean what Trump said. Bye Bye Merry Christmas from @phantomtec ☮☮💕💕☮☮
💯% agree 👍 At the very least all boards should have the four EZ Debug LEDs for basic troubleshooting. Although personally I'd prefer to have both the debug LEDs and the post code read out. And I agree with Jay too, all boards should have EZ latches to remove the GPU. Ive seen plenty of MB get ruined from someone trying to press the latch with a screwdriver and slip and stab the board and damage some traces or a capacitor
Yes, seriously! I bought an Asus Strix Z790-H that has the single latch, and it is a PITA to get the DIMMs situated just right...I fight with it everytime I have to reinstall them!
@@amirghotbi2647 It's kind of a mixed bag. I have a ROG Strix Z490-A and a Z690-A and both of them have the shitty single latch -- ASUS seems to be pretty inclined to use the single one. Some generations of the MSI Taichi, however, have double latches, and other have single latches.
Something that has been good over the past few years, is the attached IO shield. No more cutting your fingers to shreds whilst worrying about bending or breaking it when "snapping" it into place.
Tbh i always preferred the non attached IO shield. i always knew when it snapped in right. Now i am always guessing and wondering if its in right or if a metal tab should or should not be on the outside.
I'd rather not have the attached IO shield, its such a marginal gain for normal users and the snap in is much more flexible for those weird case designs. At least compared to the modern trend of the VRAM heat-sinks and the like all attached together into one lump with the IO shield on the motherboard - for instance I've designed but not yet built a mini-ITX case that really doesn't want a full size IO shield when the mini-itx mobo's tend to be much much thinner and have a thinner IO shield standard option. And you can when having fun building weird computers create your own IO openings for just the ports you need etc easier when the whole lot isn't one lump.
no, on the single latch DIMM slot I do not agree when working inside the case they're very problematic because you don't know if the side is fully seated - I've seen people break their DIMMs because of this
I'm on the fence. I have the Dark Hero that has the single sided ones. I have run into what you are describing but I've also triple checked to make sure its latched. But also its nice not have to mess with removing my GPU if I need to reseat RAM. Which has happened before.
Nice video Jay! That being said, as a sysadmin who has installed literal terabytes of ram, I'm gonna have to hard disagree with the single ram latch. The problem with a single latch is you have to ensure the rigid side is fully engaged before latching the ram and the chance of it not seating correctly (and not catching it) are MUCH higher. In a dual latch ram system, the ram has to be properly seated to engage both latches. On servers at least, it will tell you if ram isn't properly seated, but with 8 to 24 sticks a server, dual latches are much quicker/easier to install.
Yep, 100%. I was having ram issues after getting some new sticks. Thought they were dead. Nope, I just didn't seat them all the way in. The only clip was engaged so I thought it was ok, but because it was a single sided one, it actually wasn't.
I have been building PCs since the mid '90s and used both types of ram latch systems. I have never had an issue with a single stick of ram in my life. Then again, I have the basic ability to pay attention to what I am doing.
The PCI-E latch removal push button needs to become standard practice for all boards imo, GPU's are only getting bigger and as a 4090 owner I literally have to stab at my latch with a screwdriver if ever i need to take out my GPU lol, Hopefully this catches on
yup, that latch should be a lot bigger/easier to access. Managed to break mine in my current build with an 7900xtx (pressed down on the latch, apparently not "hard" enough, pulled the GPU a tad too hard to see how vertical mount would work in that case) now I have quick release I guess Luckily the GPU doesn't apply any "sideways" load in my current layout config and everything works fine xD
@jetfire5991 Yeah they just feel so outdated now, they were fine once upon a time with 2 slot cards, but with monster cards like 7900xtx or 4090 etc they are pretty hopeless. When the time comes for my next build will look for a board with the push button release for sure
That's because you insert one side before the other, meaning the DIMM is inserted slightly tilted by necessity. What this naturally leads to, should be obvious. I, too, prefer dual-latch systems, because you can more easily prevent badly or wrongly seated DIMMs that way, precisely because you'll notice the DIMM being inserted lop-sided much more easily.
My old MOBO had one-latch and it gave me a scare when one of my sticks didn't show up in bios. Turned out I had to give it quite a strong push to make it sit properly. Since then I've bought only dual-latch :D
@@MadnerKami I'm sue i've tried both ways i had an asrock, and even though the movable side latched correctly, the fixed side was still eeeever so slightly off
One feature I love and look for when I shop is BIOS Flashback buttons. I had that on my first gen Ryzen Crosshair and it was awesome. New BIOS? Neat, load it onto a flash drive, power down the system, hit the button, and when it boots next you're on the new BIOS. It makes it easy to buy an older board, flash it up to be compatible with new CPUs, and move on with your day. I know it's not a super-physical feature aside from the button, but I love it all the same.
I had an Asus board a long time ago that had an amazing thing that made life easier to put it together. The case button/light cables went to a block with the pins labeled. Then that block matched the board so you could just plug everything in outside of the case, make sure you had the cables in the correct way and then plug everything in as one plug.
Yeah I just built with a Aorus board and it had the lovely little block for the panel connectors. I had a gigabyte G1 years ago that did the same thing. Only boards I have ever seen it on. Last Asus B550 Tuf gaming didn't have it. Love that thing and wish it was standard for all.
I want every motherboard to standardize having pins for motherboard speaker, having debug led, having an on-board power button, and having colored power connectors for front panel etc.
I had an old Asus board that had a convenient plug where you could put all front panel cables and then put it on the board without having to fiddle in the case to match the pins. I wonder why no other board (even Asus) ever had that.
I think it was Paul from Paul's Hardware that demonstrated the easiest way to unlatch components in hard to reach places. Just use a plain old wooden chopstick. Cheap, easily available, and non-conductive.
@@Ian-Omega Easy if the piece is plastic with a ribbed or rough top. Try it with those slippery metal smooth tops and, especially if it's difficult to reach, you are in for nightmare stuff. Even when using a wooden stick, if you slip and knock of some surface mounted tiny components, your motherboard is done. Unless you are good with hot air soldering of SMD components (and could pick up or even find those components that are knocked off) you can throw that motherboard away...
The problem with that is to get the prices back down with the Inflation wont be as low as it used to be but with all of the Inventions they wont come down unless you want a Stripped-down Board with a PCIE the first Version of it and nothing new
That MSI corded "remote control" for BCLK +/-, overclocking, OC retry, reset, power, etc. was actually also included with MSI's 2017 silver-colored Z270 XPower Gaming Titanium, which is still one of my top 10 fave mobos ever released.
Nah for me single sided has always been better, the clearance at the bottom of the slot can be compromised whereas there is generally better clearance at the top in my experience.
what we need are decently priced motherboards that still have the number-code debug LEDs it was common to budget motherboards back then, but they're in premium $500 motherboards these days
One reason you don't see this stuff everywhere is because of patents and IP. Some of it's kinda insane that it can be patented, but some things are actually pretty novel.
The only feature I see as something I need on a MOBO these days that I'm willing to pay extra for is the digital debug code read out. Too bad they basically don't exist on boards below 400-500 dollars these days.
I honestly never liked them anyway. they caused more confusion more than anything. also 90% of the time they show a code that doesnt exist in the manual or online. so good riddance.
A $1 PC speaker tells you the same information. Adding them now causes quite a lot of complexity with TPM, hence why it is only on the more expensive boards
Something I never tought about before, but once I had, now it's a mandatory thing for me is, built-in IO shields. It completely removes one of the most annoying parts of a PC build. Besides completely forgetting it and then have to remove the entire system just for putting it back, you can also bend the little stubs, cut yourself etc...
Had chinese buffet for dinner, im currently at a dead stop in the middle of a 5 lane interstate because of a crash, I live 1 hour away and my guts are bubblin like a bath bomb
Storage at the top makes sense as there is dedicated lanes from the CPU specifically for PCIe 5.0 drives. It is only the additional M.2 slots below the 16x PCIe 5.0 slot that will start to nerf the graphics lanes. Often leveraging some of those high speed M.2 slots will bring the graphics slot down to 8x lanes. The rest are generally PCIe 4.0 and come from the south bridge. I'm still waiting for a good AM5 workstation motherboard with a massive PCIe 5.0 switch that'll interface with the CPU at 24x lanes PCIe 5.0 and then provide two full16x slots and several M.2. While there would be a bottleneck with the uplink at PCIe 5.0 speeds, it wouldn't matter as much with PCIe 4.0 devices which video cards and most storage is at still. (I know this statement will be date in like a month.) Another feature I'd love to see on enthusiast boards that is a requirement for servers is IPMI with the ability to alter the BIOS remotely. A lot of time spend just trouble shooting an issue on consumer boards is straight forward on servers as there is secondary embedded system watching the primary that'll just tell you on a nice webpage what is wrong. Other features like overclocking control or RGB lighting control through the IPMI and not need a bloatware application running on the primary system. Another little neat trick that some IPMI chips can do or work in conjunction with is an embedded router. Stuff like running a Pi-hole on the IPMI could be offloaded from the main system. Other little features that I'd like to see is the inclusion of network based audio protocols like Dante or AVB on board. Yes, there are software solutions for these but hardware implementations generally are superior, especially when a bug like Meltdown/Spectre can wreck things. Or a heterogenous architecture like Alder Lake/Raptor Lake/Arrow Lake. I'd also be nice to get a chip on motherboards that'd be able to do real audio mixing with USB audio devices. Again, software solutions exist but are lacking and tend to expose lots of weird quirks in hardware.
Have you looked into the wrx80e/wrx90e boards? Their expensive AF but have those things you'd be looking for. I'm running a 13900k on a mediocre Asus z690 TUF Gaming and I'm thinking the next build I do if it does start degrading is gonna be threadripper based... I had an X99 i7 5820k build and it was nice having extra PCIE lanes
@@empedance1933 The problem with trx50/wrx90 is that they're paired with high end Threadripper processors. They are fine chips but man are they expensive on top of the higher prices for motherboards. Last time AMD did Threadripper, they were essentially all limited releases without an upgrade path. They also don't have any V-cache models in the Threadripper line up. There are Epyc chips with V-cache but I have yet to hear of anyone using a SP6 part inside of a TRX50/WRX90 board (they use the same base pin layout). I do feel that there is a space where a maker could produces a good workstation/highend consumer board that fills the gap between normal AM5 and those TRX50/WRX90 boards. Ideally AMD would adapt their IO chip used in Epyc by disabling the memory controllers and Infinity Fabric links and just sell it as a smart PCIe switch or an uber south bridge chip. Yields on that chip likely do have a supply of units that have good PCIe controllers but have a bad memory controller unit, so do the binning thing and recover them in this market segment. 128 PCIe 5.0 + 8 PCIe 3.0 lanes would be reduced down into a 104 PCIe 5.0 + 8 PCIe 3.0 configuration which is plenty for six 16x PCIe 5.0 slots and tones of motherboard IO. I'd be cheaper than the outrageously stupidly expensive Broadcom PCIe switches.
My favorite feature that I first saw on the Aorus Xtreme X570 was the motherboard cables all coming out the side instead of being on the front like on most boards. Have the same with my Crosshair VIII Extreme as well. Just makes cable management a breeze.
My old MSI X570 had that, and my new ASRock X870 didn't. I was struggling to think of why it was such a pain in the ass this time around until I looked in my old case and saw the USB-C and USB panel connectors plugged in through the side!
We need better front headers connectors. Connecting PWLED and PWRESET etc is still a pain. At one-point MSI actually had color coded front connectors. The case manufacturers needs to come up with better designs also. That part of building a PC is still pretty challenging. Some of us have to go in there with a magnifying glass lol
Gigabyte had color coded connectors and a special free tool included with the motherboards that you insert the cables then then altogether slot them into the headers.
I am very surprised more companies arent copying the o11d evo Mine just has one connecter which has all the audio/led/power in one premade connector which easily plugs in to the mobo. So good
@@UA-camhandle9001 because not all mobo manufacturers use the same pin outs I've had mobo's that used reversed polarity + /- instead of -/+ and also mobo's that had the wires connecting across the pins instead of side by side so : instead of . .
Toolless is why I love my ASROCK Z790 RIPTIDE Wifi Board, and the fact that it has 5 m.2 Drives, for 220 bucks was a good deal. So Gewd. Works great with the i9 13900k as well.
the pcie button release is top tier. GPU's have gotten so big trying to unlatch a pcie x16 slot can be quite a pain specially if you have a big air cooler or a tight space case
having a seperate screw or twisty thing to hold the drive down from the cover is so much better than a combined screw that both holds andsecures the cover but having a tool less release lever for anything and everything is just so satisfying even with the risk of them getting knocked and poping off so having a secure screw thats "optional" but is in place for shipping is the way I would like to see things go in the future I also want to see more corner plugs for stuff, so I dont need to bend cables round and edge, just give me a prebuilt corner adjuster or what ever they are called so I dont have cable mess
The ASU’s pull out at the front for GPU is great, on a test bench you may not see it. Quite the same but in a case you always screw the GPU in to the case so it is very much like the single RAM toggle you like. With it being spring loaded on the ASU’s ProArt Z790 at least you never need to go near the MB, you can pus in straight and pull out from the side away from the toggle.
I like to have the latches on both sides as it indicates that both sides are correctly and fully installed with an audible as satisfying click. You don't get that when it's only on one side. Then again, it's not rocket science.
I have a x870e Taichi motherbother in the Y70 case and i tell you having those extra features places to work with on the board and physical features are great along with a case with plenty of space. The board also just looks really clean.
My favorite feature isn't one thats usually built onto boards but do sometimes come with them and thats the cheap 2 wire speakers for motherboards that don't have the code screen. Even if the board doesn't come with one they're a dime a dozen and make any problems easy to diagnose.
It used to be that a lot of motherboards had a small piezoelectric beeper on the motherboard that took care of diagnostic beeps. Simple, cheap and nowhere to be found today. Instead I remember people talking about how much they liked that computers now always are quiet without any disgusting beep during POST. That beep is so useful, but apparently a lot of people just hate it to the degree that MB manufacturers now just skip installing that beeper. Back then the speaker was often a thing you got with the case. All you had to do was wire it to the MB and you could hear the beep codes. The two digit POST code displays are even better, and for a few years they were found on all but the very cheapest motherboards. And now they are some kind of luxury items that are only on motherboards costing way too much.
@@blahorgaslisk7763 that must be before my time. My first PC years ago was a cheap shit one and the mobo had an installable beep speaker. Came in handy immediately when I failed to seat the ram properly. Kept it around ever since. Even recently it helped me figure out my cpu was dying. On amazon they can be picked up for like a buck a piece or less if you buy in a pack. Even if you dont like hearing it, its for sure always worth keeping one around.
@@blahorgaslisk7763 And that's why I'd settle for a standard pinout from the board and let me plug in my own 7 segment display. I already d it with the motherboard speaker.
2 things Jay: 1. That remote is great for someone who needs to hide computer (for example to have them secure from children) and you start it and put pilot back. 2. PCI-E latches - I recently installed GPU in MSI board who had an extended release latch towards CPU slot - you could press it with GPU installed easily. A release button is superior option but used in mine board is simply cheaper..
so happy they are going back to both latches on ram, the sound is so satisfying. imo. the NVMe slothes: once you put it in your only going to change it out when it fail. so go 4tb or higher. set it and forget it.
I like the little rubber caps for the fan headers on a ROG Strix board. I've snagged my sleeve on those headers many times, so those rubber caps come in handy.
One sided lock in RAM slot is very help full as I struggle sometimes to re-seat the ram like I need to ensure that both lock clicks at the same time. When they do not boot issues happen.
Jay the biggest problem with the board Mfg’s is that the fancier options for drive hold downs are typically ONLY on the pricier boards. I would love to have a $500+ motherboard for my H1v1, but my wallet can’t handle that strain!!
I just built a new system with a AsRock X870E Taichi board, and I have been extremely happy with it. The tooless M.2 Slots are great, and not having to screw down the drives was a huge plus.
It took way too long for the front end connectors for your case to finally make the connectors one singular plug instead of having to study the manual in order to get it right.
I adore the holder for the front panel out that you can click all those tiny single pin wires into instead of needing to play operation and placing them correctly on the right pins
@Warhorse469 Oh, the actual MSI board that actually caught fire for me was all just in my head? Good thing we have you to set the record straight for everyone! Shut up.
One thing you didn't mention, which was part of the reason I went MSI, is MSI moving the EPS12V cables over to the right side of the board on all their new boards. The MSI Unify-X definitely doesn't have all PCIe 5.0 M.2 drive slots only 2 of them are. The Z890 Carbon also has a quick release for the large M.2 heatsink.
So here are my personal choices for features that Some motherbaords should have IMO... and yes these are obviously my personal choices that aren't for everyone... POST Code display, Toolless releases, TWO RAM SLOTS, 2x16 pcie & 2x1 (or 2x4), No RGB headers lol, 90 degree connectors on the side, Atlteast A start/reset button, don't need SATA ports anymore except maybe one for a blueray player (I prefer blueray over streaming, yes I'm that guy). That's about it, If I remember something else I'll edit my comment.
Why tf would I want 2 RAM slots when I can have 4? Not like they affect RAM much untill you go for some crazy OC. In fact, 2 DDR4 3200 RAM sticks (not even from a kit, just same model) on a 4 slot ASRock B450M Pro4 with a mere 1st gen R5 1600 were perfectly stable at 3600 and even were booting and passing AIDA RAM test at 3866 (sadly weren't as stable, was showing an error or two after 2 hour stress test).
@@ОсликИа-я2ы Answering your comments are a waste of time, because you clearly didn't understand mine. Nevermind that what I stated was my personal opinion. Do you understand what that even means? Didn't think so. I doubt you even own modern hardware that uses DDR5.
In my new build from this month my ASUS board has a small button to the right of the GPU that clicks the catch down for easy removal. It also has the M.2 spin latches, which I had never seen before. I personally still like the screw on covers compared to alternatives atm. ASUS gets a lot of hate for their latest issues (rightfully so), but I love them for builds and have used them as my primary brand for over a decade.
I've used several Asus boards in the days of AM2-AM3+/FM2+ - and all had problems. Like F2A55-M with weird no post behavior until you turn of and back on PSU switch a few times or M5A88-V Evo with it's VRM frying itself (literally, with burned marks on PCB) on a stock FX-4100 and dual channel getting disabled when setting RAM to speed over 1600 MT/s. You know what boards didn't have all those problems? ASRock and Gigabyte. MSI - haven't tried them.
Went to visit an old military friend after 6 years. Man is literally my best friend...had to doordash food everyday because there no utensils in the kitchen for me to have gone and bought groceries, and now, on the last night here, at 8:30pm and after 3 days of literally lounging around doing norhing, he says "im beat, im going to go to bed"....im not sitting in a couchless, tv-less living room watching this video just trying to keep my cool. Thanks for keeping me level Jay.
Another good video. I'm gong to have to agree with some of the other commenters in that I prefer the two RAM latches; the single latch design is so much harder to align. I also really like the new PCI release where you pull from the front. That side is locked in with the screws mounting it to the case so when you pull the screws, you can just lift the card out. The diagonally opposed lock points provide all the security you would need unless your PC is in a very volatile situation. Anyway, that's a nice set of mother boards you have to play with!
Jay's right about the release toggle for PCI-e. I have to use a plastic spudger just to push it down because of the m.2 cover and just the size of the card making it difficult to reach with my fingers.
At 11:14, you're actually pulling it wrong, It's on the front end you take it out as it shows on the box. You pull it out at the side and not possible if it's in the case installed. There's no force to take it out. I have the Maximus Z890 Hero too and i tried couple of times, really easy!
So Glad that you did this Jay, I was looking at a possible motherboard purchase and was liking every thing I was finding when I came across the fact that the cover to the M.2 drives also held down the M.2 drive as well, I knew right away that I did not want that and it killed any further consideration of that board, I did not find time to explore further, but hoped that it was not going to become a trend and wondered if it was going to become a standard, hoping not.
The PCIE Latch release is such a welcome feature. My Asus TUF X570 gave me a lot of pain trying to unlatch my GPU everytime I had to touch my motherboard. I almost reached a point where I wanted to take a tool in there to break it open. I'll definitely be looking for PCIE latch tools for my next board.
my fave accessory on mobo's that are about 5+ years old now, is the USB-C connector... except on mine. even though the mobo and the case were both the same 'generation' the case comes with the USB-C connector to plug into the mobo, but the mobo doesn't have that. short of having to prematurely upgrade my mobo for another higher-spec one, I have to use a PCI-E accessory card for it to give it any use.
it helps to read the manual instead of trying to push on pull things on motherboards :P. Quick release PCIE slot is nice. Single side dim clip is nice but I have had issues in the past. Best feature I think is having a flat connector on your atx connector. (as in horizontal.)
I think my water-proof Asrock that had top of the line VRMs and an OLED diag screen cost me $200-300. Another feature I’d like to see come back is my X58 RoG board had a dip switches for each PCIe lane and that would kill the power to the lane. The reason it was important is for troubleshooting. It’s difficult to pull a water-cooled graphics card out just to troubleshoot something. It also took way to long for boards to start including PWM on every spot.
Single latch DIMM slots have been around since DDR2, they're not used on all boards because it's very much a personal preference thing. Lots of people prefer the dual latch.
My favorite feature, not seen on many MBs, is a 90 degree 24pin MB connector, Some cases can't fit it but to me, it's much better that an unsightly 180 cable.
I find it funny how I found this video right after building a new PC with that exact same z790 board and learned about that new m.2 latch this weekend.
I like having the quick release for the PCIE and the m.2. I also like the little clip that Asus has for the FP connectors you can just slot them in to the connector then attach it to the pins on the board. The remote is interesting from a testing stand point, not sure how useful it would be for those of us who are just building a pc.
X870E MAG carbon has the toolless cover for the bottom NVMe as well. My favorite feature on my new MAG X870E is that the code LED can show CPU temp once the host is booted. It really does feed my OCD. :D
I am so glad to hear somebody say something about the GPU latch problem. I've busted two of them stubbornly trying to get out a GPU without uninstalling everything around it first. I was worried that it was just me lol
As someone with severe Neuropathy, these have been god sends to me. Also love the front I/O header adapters, m.2 still needs work in my humble opinion.
A tip to release the GPU without a GPU quick release is to use a bicycle tyre lever to reach the latch. These are normally made of hard plastic and are long enough to reach.
That remote would be great for PC builds inside of one of those glass top desk cases where you can't access anything inside without lifting the top off (along with anything else that's sitting on your desk at that point.)
The toggling gpu slot latch is better than the spring loaded design. With the spring loaded, you only have one hand free to pull the gpu out unless you have a helper. I was under the impression that the single latch ram slots were made out of cheapness, not out of better design. With the single latch, you put the ram in at a slight angle and roll it in. Pressing it straight down is better IMO, even though it can be a little tricky to get both sides to click at the same time.
m.2 cover originated in the mSATA protective shields in rugged applications from 2009... now those weren't ornamental OR heat spreader designs... which appear to have originated with EGlobal (or predecessor co) in 2013. The "single latch" ram slot dates back to SIMM, sadly. They weren't very reliable. There have also been single-clip SIMM plates where there was one latch opposite the connector slot flat against the mainboard/riserboard in laptops (and still are quite a few with sodimms)
For fans Jay, I highly recommend taking a look at InWin's Neptune series. They are designed with radiators in mind, even on full speed they're not obnoxiously loud, and they're not stupidly overpriced like Corsair & other fans seem to be these days. Thermalright has even cheaper fans (like I got a 3 pack of 120mm fans for $13 kinda cheap) that also move a lot of air while not being super loud, but the InWin ones are made with radiators in mind/directed airflow. Q-Release or whatever the hell Asus calls it is actually really nice, because you screw in the end to the case that it comes out of for that kind of release. I love it on the X870E-E Strix board I have (not withstanding it's M.2 disappearing issue it has on the -2 & -3 slots). It only has 1 quick-release M.2 slot, but that's the primary one.
My favorite motherboard feature is the ability to flash the BIOS without having to have a CPU, RAM, or GPU in their respective sockets. Just the 24 volt rail from the PSU, a properly formatted USB drive with the latest BIOS, and that's it. On the downside, that means there's a whole secret CPU, RAM, and closed source OS being run on the motherboard to make all of that magic happen potentially doing who knows what once you connect the board to a network. On the plus side, if the board bricks from the BIOS update or just doesn't power up at all (i.e. it is DOA), then you haven't installed anything on it and can just RMA it for a new, working board.
The M.2 latch on Asus boards is really nice. I hate the small screws boards used. The quick release for the GPU is nice. What I really want are test bench cables/buttons pre-installed (clear CMOS, power, reset). Why just have pins? Larger fonts for sockets on the board. You need a magnifying glass to see the ones on Asus boards. Double USB sockets on the back plate (instead of 6...12) or include a USB hub. Definitely always include a post speaker/screen for issues. Most older boards had a speaker with post codes and new boards have that missing.
My 2020 ASUS ROG Maximus X11 Wouldn't boot last month 1.75 hrs with tech support no help was in process of getting info to send in board and there is a small button next to where the power button connects and it switched to backup bios when I pushed it. Saved me.
One thing I noticed a while ago, working in the computer repair industry, At some point in time motherboard manufacturers decided to move the PCI-e singer sided releases on the under side of the GPU. Where as originally they were neared the RAM slots. No idea why they moved them to the other side making it impossible to release the GPU with fingers.
I've actually used screwdrivers to unlock GPUs so yeah: Those "remote latches" are great for removing GPUs indeed. The rest is just a bonus. After years of having just one or two M.2 slots it's also nice to just see more of those on recent boards. And I'd love to see more of them in laptops, too.
the only reason i would use a board that expensive/good looking would be for astetic and nothing more but i cant argue boards are looking so lush now compared to 20 years ago, i do light overclocking but nothing near what they can provide, i do love the remote one though that is a great idea IMO, especialy say if a friend has the same board and dosnt have it, its like a OB2 reader for PC :D
I’d love to have a simple cable to plug in for the lights and buttons on the case. I hate having to put the tiny jumper-sized cables on for power led, etc.
I used to have to use a long handled Philips driver to depress the GPU lock because there was so little space between my noctua nh-d15 and my 2080ti. Glad they're finally figuring that out
Yup, have to use a screwdriver to release my GFX, but only because of the big aircooler blocking all the space, not even the M2 cooler. Danger is to slip of and hit the motherboard with the screwdriver tip, can do harm, but all still working fine, i live with it ^^
What is really needed is POST code displays on all boards, even budget ones.
They cost next to nothing and they were on nearly all motherboards 6 years ago, now they are a "premium feature".
Exactly. Boards that would cost 80-90 three years ago are 150 now. A lot of the "COVID costs" have been made up for by now, yet prices are still sky high. They can add useful features instead of laser-cut covers.
Digi Display, yeah cheap as chips! Also few other things an enthusiast or repetitive builder
would emphasize first but in general not to shabby from Jay. Peace Bros / I mean People
/ I mean what Trump said. Bye Bye Merry Christmas from @phantomtec ☮☮💕💕☮☮
i can't stop looking at the post code tho!!! its really getting into my gaming time while i keep looking at that A0
@mewre2062 you should talk to a therapist. A tech therapist..
💯% agree 👍
At the very least all boards should have the four EZ Debug LEDs for basic troubleshooting.
Although personally I'd prefer to have both the debug LEDs and the post code read out.
And I agree with Jay too, all boards should have EZ latches to remove the GPU.
Ive seen plenty of MB get ruined from someone trying to press the latch with a screwdriver and slip and stab the board and damage some traces or a capacitor
Well we're paying what people use to pay for used cars, they should have more QOL features lol.
Amen
Don't give them ideas. Next it will be a subscription service for heatsink cooling or fan curve DLC
@@MattThomson broooo delete your comment brooooo
any company would WRITE DOWN that brooooo hahahahaha
@@MattThomson Leased WiFi chips…. 1k for a Mainboard. 😂. Omg a remote with bios clear? Wth? Just see my kids….
@@MattThomson next thing you know we gotta register it and start paying property tax
I prefer the double RAM latch, btw. The stationary latch is pretty finnicky to me
Agreed. My latest board is an ASUS and I hate the single side latch.
Yes, seriously! I bought an Asus Strix Z790-H that has the single latch, and it is a PITA to get the DIMMs situated just right...I fight with it everytime I have to reinstall them!
I remember they used to be only on cheaper boards
@@amirghotbi2647 It's kind of a mixed bag. I have a ROG Strix Z490-A and a Z690-A and both of them have the shitty single latch -- ASUS seems to be pretty inclined to use the single one. Some generations of the MSI Taichi, however, have double latches, and other have single latches.
yup. seeing him say that about the double latch made me go to the comments.
Something that has been good over the past few years, is the attached IO shield. No more cutting your fingers to shreds whilst worrying about bending or breaking it when "snapping" it into place.
Or just forgetting it until you look at the back of the case.
Tbh i always preferred the non attached IO shield. i always knew when it snapped in right. Now i am always guessing and wondering if its in right or if a metal tab should or should not be on the outside.
@@xsouldriverxIt solves the tab thing. That is super annoying. Love the attached IO shield.
This is also the best for me, only recently got my own, have seen too many usb ports lost due to this
I'd rather not have the attached IO shield, its such a marginal gain for normal users and the snap in is much more flexible for those weird case designs. At least compared to the modern trend of the VRAM heat-sinks and the like all attached together into one lump with the IO shield on the motherboard - for instance I've designed but not yet built a mini-ITX case that really doesn't want a full size IO shield when the mini-itx mobo's tend to be much much thinner and have a thinner IO shield standard option. And you can when having fun building weird computers create your own IO openings for just the ports you need etc easier when the whole lot isn't one lump.
no, on the single latch DIMM slot I do not agree
when working inside the case they're very problematic because you don't know if the side is fully seated - I've seen people break their DIMMs because of this
Yeah I agree, I like the extra confidence of knowing both sides are 100% installed all the way, hearing both clicks
I'm on the fence. I have the Dark Hero that has the single sided ones. I have run into what you are describing but I've also triple checked to make sure its latched. But also its nice not have to mess with removing my GPU if I need to reseat RAM. Which has happened before.
Yeah, I always felt that it was easier to tell if the DIMM was fully seated with the double-ended latches. Single seemed to be more budget.
I have 1 broken on my maximus V formula
Camm2 might make it irrelevant if they start using it on production boards. Might make mini itx and, micro atx boards a little better in some aspects.
Nice video Jay! That being said, as a sysadmin who has installed literal terabytes of ram, I'm gonna have to hard disagree with the single ram latch. The problem with a single latch is you have to ensure the rigid side is fully engaged before latching the ram and the chance of it not seating correctly (and not catching it) are MUCH higher. In a dual latch ram system, the ram has to be properly seated to engage both latches. On servers at least, it will tell you if ram isn't properly seated, but with 8 to 24 sticks a server, dual latches are much quicker/easier to install.
Agree about single sided latches. I hate them. Installing memory is harder with them for me
I agree.
Yep, 100%. I was having ram issues after getting some new sticks. Thought they were dead. Nope, I just didn't seat them all the way in. The only clip was engaged so I thought it was ok, but because it was a single sided one, it actually wasn't.
I have been building PCs since the mid '90s and used both types of ram latch systems. I have never had an issue with a single stick of ram in my life. Then again, I have the basic ability to pay attention to what I am doing.
@@paulmartin2348 This was such a helpful and informative comment.
The PCI-E latch removal push button needs to become standard practice for all boards imo, GPU's are only getting bigger and as a 4090 owner I literally have to stab at my latch with a screwdriver if ever i need to take out my GPU lol, Hopefully this catches on
I was so happy when my Asus creator board had this option.
I suggest something like a pencil, the eraser end. You don't want to scratch the mobo with the screwdriver.
@MeeBacon Yeah good point, luckily I don't have to remove it all too much, will definitely go with a pencil from now on lol
yup, that latch should be a lot bigger/easier to access. Managed to break mine in my current build with an 7900xtx (pressed down on the latch, apparently not "hard" enough, pulled the GPU a tad too hard to see how vertical mount would work in that case) now I have quick release I guess
Luckily the GPU doesn't apply any "sideways" load in my current layout config and everything works fine xD
@jetfire5991 Yeah they just feel so outdated now, they were fine once upon a time with 2 slot cards, but with monster cards like 7900xtx or 4090 etc they are pretty hopeless. When the time comes for my next build will look for a board with the push button release for sure
6:09 i feel like the one-latch DIMM boards are more finnicky to get the memory to seat properly than the 2-latch system
That's because you insert one side before the other, meaning the DIMM is inserted slightly tilted by necessity. What this naturally leads to, should be obvious. I, too, prefer dual-latch systems, because you can more easily prevent badly or wrongly seated DIMMs that way, precisely because you'll notice the DIMM being inserted lop-sided much more easily.
My old MOBO had one-latch and it gave me a scare when one of my sticks didn't show up in bios. Turned out I had to give it quite a strong push to make it sit properly.
Since then I've bought only dual-latch :D
totally agree, one-latch DIMM boards are the worst
@@MadnerKami I'm sue i've tried both ways
i had an asrock, and even though the movable side latched correctly, the fixed side was still eeeever so slightly off
One feature I love and look for when I shop is BIOS Flashback buttons. I had that on my first gen Ryzen Crosshair and it was awesome. New BIOS? Neat, load it onto a flash drive, power down the system, hit the button, and when it boots next you're on the new BIOS. It makes it easy to buy an older board, flash it up to be compatible with new CPUs, and move on with your day. I know it's not a super-physical feature aside from the button, but I love it all the same.
I had an Asus board a long time ago that had an amazing thing that made life easier to put it together. The case button/light cables went to a block with the pins labeled. Then that block matched the board so you could just plug everything in outside of the case, make sure you had the cables in the correct way and then plug everything in as one plug.
Yes! It was called the Q-connector (no idea why). Made life a whole lot easier, I wish this were more common!
My newer gigabyte boars has a holder that you slot all the connectors into, and they all plus in as one. It's a z790 auorus
I really wish the power / reset / drive activity pin header was replaced with something else. It's been basically the same for 20+ years.
@@Sygma6 more like 30 years this shitty way to connect Power/reset/hdd/speaker/power LED has been around since early 286 days if not before
Yeah I just built with a Aorus board and it had the lovely little block for the panel connectors. I had a gigabyte G1 years ago that did the same thing. Only boards I have ever seen it on. Last Asus B550 Tuf gaming didn't have it. Love that thing and wish it was standard for all.
I want every motherboard to standardize having pins for motherboard speaker, having debug led, having an on-board power button, and having colored power connectors for front panel etc.
I had an old Asus board that had a convenient plug where you could put all front panel cables and then put it on the board without having to fiddle in the case to match the pins. I wonder why no other board (even Asus) ever had that.
I think it was Paul from Paul's Hardware that demonstrated the easiest way to unlatch components in hard to reach places. Just use a plain old wooden chopstick. Cheap, easily available, and non-conductive.
If you slip you still might do damage to some component on the board.
@@_Jester_perhaps, if you’re not careful
That's the method I've adopted. Works very well IMO.
@@_Jester_So don’t slip?
@@Ian-Omega Easy if the piece is plastic with a ribbed or rough top. Try it with those slippery metal smooth tops and, especially if it's difficult to reach, you are in for nightmare stuff. Even when using a wooden stick, if you slip and knock of some surface mounted tiny components, your motherboard is done. Unless you are good with hot air soldering of SMD components (and could pick up or even find those components that are knocked off) you can throw that motherboard away...
You know an awesome feature I'd love to have on a motherboard?
Cheaper prices.
The problem with that is to get the prices back down with the Inflation wont be as low as it used to be but with all of the Inventions they wont come down unless you want a Stripped-down Board with a PCIE the first Version of it and nothing new
@@RedBeardedJoeUh no not inflation. Tariffs that were lodged back in 2018. It's about to get sooo much worse.
Honestly. Boards have become way too expensive than they ought to be.
@BenyaminLorit perhaps it was a bad idea to let them flee the country.
All they are doing is solving problems they create! They advertise them as features and make it more expensive!
That MSI corded "remote control" for BCLK +/-, overclocking, OC retry, reset, power, etc. was actually also included with MSI's 2017 silver-colored Z270 XPower Gaming Titanium, which is still one of my top 10 fave mobos ever released.
Single sided ram latches are a fucking NIGHTMARE. End up taking WAY longer trying to seat in the ram for me.
not for me man, i break almost every double sided latches cause my fingers are strong and my mind is derp and my lights are not where they should be
Hard to tell if/when the non-latch side is properly seated.
Nah for me single sided has always been better, the clearance at the bottom of the slot can be compromised whereas there is generally better clearance at the top in my experience.
I also hate the single sided ram latches.
Merry Christmas everyone
Merry Christmas to you as well
Merry Xmas!
Merry Christmas!
what we need are decently priced motherboards that still have the number-code debug LEDs
it was common to budget motherboards back then, but they're in premium $500 motherboards these days
the debug leds always sucked. more trouble than helpful.
@@ascissordollynamedgwen9409 especially with ddr5. Is it training for ages or cpu is not seated well? Go figure.
One reason you don't see this stuff everywhere is because of patents and IP. Some of it's kinda insane that it can be patented, but some things are actually pretty novel.
You say tHat untIl you come witH an idea and then it gets used without your permission
The only feature I see as something I need on a MOBO these days that I'm willing to pay extra for is the digital debug code read out. Too bad they basically don't exist on boards below 400-500 dollars these days.
I honestly never liked them anyway. they caused more confusion more than anything. also 90% of the time they show a code that doesnt exist in the manual or online. so good riddance.
A $1 PC speaker tells you the same information. Adding them now causes quite a lot of complexity with TPM, hence why it is only on the more expensive boards
Something I never tought about before, but once I had, now it's a mandatory thing for me is, built-in IO shields. It completely removes one of the most annoying parts of a PC build. Besides completely forgetting it and then have to remove the entire system just for putting it back, you can also bend the little stubs, cut yourself etc...
Had chinese buffet for dinner, im currently at a dead stop in the middle of a 5 lane interstate because of a crash, I live 1 hour away and my guts are bubblin like a bath bomb
Fire in the hole
good luck
I pray you're able to make it to the can quickly.
Shit.
A battle you have. Victory you must achieve!
Storage at the top makes sense as there is dedicated lanes from the CPU specifically for PCIe 5.0 drives. It is only the additional M.2 slots below the 16x PCIe 5.0 slot that will start to nerf the graphics lanes. Often leveraging some of those high speed M.2 slots will bring the graphics slot down to 8x lanes. The rest are generally PCIe 4.0 and come from the south bridge.
I'm still waiting for a good AM5 workstation motherboard with a massive PCIe 5.0 switch that'll interface with the CPU at 24x lanes PCIe 5.0 and then provide two full16x slots and several M.2. While there would be a bottleneck with the uplink at PCIe 5.0 speeds, it wouldn't matter as much with PCIe 4.0 devices which video cards and most storage is at still. (I know this statement will be date in like a month.)
Another feature I'd love to see on enthusiast boards that is a requirement for servers is IPMI with the ability to alter the BIOS remotely. A lot of time spend just trouble shooting an issue on consumer boards is straight forward on servers as there is secondary embedded system watching the primary that'll just tell you on a nice webpage what is wrong. Other features like overclocking control or RGB lighting control through the IPMI and not need a bloatware application running on the primary system. Another little neat trick that some IPMI chips can do or work in conjunction with is an embedded router. Stuff like running a Pi-hole on the IPMI could be offloaded from the main system.
Other little features that I'd like to see is the inclusion of network based audio protocols like Dante or AVB on board. Yes, there are software solutions for these but hardware implementations generally are superior, especially when a bug like Meltdown/Spectre can wreck things. Or a heterogenous architecture like Alder Lake/Raptor Lake/Arrow Lake. I'd also be nice to get a chip on motherboards that'd be able to do real audio mixing with USB audio devices. Again, software solutions exist but are lacking and tend to expose lots of weird quirks in hardware.
Have you looked into the wrx80e/wrx90e boards? Their expensive AF but have those things you'd be looking for. I'm running a 13900k on a mediocre Asus z690 TUF Gaming and I'm thinking the next build I do if it does start degrading is gonna be threadripper based...
I had an X99 i7 5820k build and it was nice having extra PCIE lanes
@@empedance1933 The problem with trx50/wrx90 is that they're paired with high end Threadripper processors. They are fine chips but man are they expensive on top of the higher prices for motherboards. Last time AMD did Threadripper, they were essentially all limited releases without an upgrade path. They also don't have any V-cache models in the Threadripper line up. There are Epyc chips with V-cache but I have yet to hear of anyone using a SP6 part inside of a TRX50/WRX90 board (they use the same base pin layout).
I do feel that there is a space where a maker could produces a good workstation/highend consumer board that fills the gap between normal AM5 and those TRX50/WRX90 boards. Ideally AMD would adapt their IO chip used in Epyc by disabling the memory controllers and Infinity Fabric links and just sell it as a smart PCIe switch or an uber south bridge chip. Yields on that chip likely do have a supply of units that have good PCIe controllers but have a bad memory controller unit, so do the binning thing and recover them in this market segment. 128 PCIe 5.0 + 8 PCIe 3.0 lanes would be reduced down into a 104 PCIe 5.0 + 8 PCIe 3.0 configuration which is plenty for six 16x PCIe 5.0 slots and tones of motherboard IO. I'd be cheaper than the outrageously stupidly expensive Broadcom PCIe switches.
The adapter for the front power reset + power /HD light is a neet feature on some motherboards as they are a painful thing to conect when in the case
9:35 That's straight up a car's trunk/hood release system on a motherboard. That's smooth.
My favorite feature that I first saw on the Aorus Xtreme X570 was the motherboard cables all coming out the side instead of being on the front like on most boards. Have the same with my Crosshair VIII Extreme as well. Just makes cable management a breeze.
My old MSI X570 had that, and my new ASRock X870 didn't.
I was struggling to think of why it was such a pain in the ass this time around until I looked in my old case and saw the USB-C and USB panel connectors plugged in through the side!
1:46 When it comes to electronics, I always listen to both the bad AND good. It helps me make informed decisions.
We need better front headers connectors. Connecting PWLED and PWRESET etc is still a pain. At one-point MSI actually had color coded front connectors. The case manufacturers needs to come up with better designs also. That part of building a PC is still pretty challenging. Some of us have to go in there with a magnifying glass lol
Gigabyte had color coded connectors and a special free tool included with the motherboards that you insert the cables then then altogether slot them into the headers.
Asus also had sonething like that. It was so nice to have small single connector that you use to preconnect then and just connect that & be done.
I really don't understand how the front panel connections isn't just an ATX standard.
I am very surprised more companies arent copying the o11d evo
Mine just has one connecter which has all the audio/led/power in one premade connector which easily plugs in to the mobo. So good
@@UA-camhandle9001 because not all mobo manufacturers use the same pin outs I've had mobo's that used reversed polarity + /- instead of -/+ and also mobo's that had the wires connecting across the pins instead of side by side so : instead of . .
one thing i wish all motherboards would change the RGB pins. make it clip in so it dont fall out from the motherboard.
I know right it's done for fan headers why can't it be done for RGB headers too
Toolless is why I love my ASROCK Z790 RIPTIDE Wifi Board, and the fact that it has 5 m.2 Drives, for 220 bucks was a good deal. So Gewd. Works great with the i9 13900k as well.
the pcie button release is top tier. GPU's have gotten so big trying to unlatch a pcie x16 slot can be quite a pain specially if you have a big air cooler or a tight space case
having a seperate screw or twisty thing to hold the drive down from the cover is so much better than a combined screw that both holds andsecures the cover
but having a tool less release lever for anything and everything is just so satisfying even with the risk of them getting knocked and poping off so having a secure screw thats "optional" but is in place for shipping is the way I would like to see things go in the future
I also want to see more corner plugs for stuff, so I dont need to bend cables round and edge, just give me a prebuilt corner adjuster or what ever they are called so I dont have cable mess
Starts at 1:55
The ASU’s pull out at the front for GPU is great, on a test bench you may not see it. Quite the same but in a case you always screw the GPU in to the case so it is very much like the single RAM toggle you like. With it being spring loaded on the ASU’s ProArt Z790 at least you never need to go near the MB, you can pus in straight and pull out from the side away from the toggle.
I like to have the latches on both sides as it indicates that both sides are correctly and fully installed with an audible as satisfying click. You don't get that when it's only on one side. Then again, it's not rocket science.
I have a x870e Taichi motherbother in the Y70 case and i tell you having those extra features places to work with on the board and physical features are great along with a case with plenty of space. The board also just looks really clean.
What we need is drive slots on the the back so the VC does not need to be removed to do anything with the computer.
You would rather remove the whole motherboard to add/remove/replace drives?
@@UnknownEntity420 No, just open the back hatch to get access to the back of the MB.
The M.2 can be closer to the CPU, less clutter on the component side 👍
Just need the cases to have openings.
My favorite feature isn't one thats usually built onto boards but do sometimes come with them and thats the cheap 2 wire speakers for motherboards that don't have the code screen. Even if the board doesn't come with one they're a dime a dozen and make any problems easy to diagnose.
It used to be that a lot of motherboards had a small piezoelectric beeper on the motherboard that took care of diagnostic beeps. Simple, cheap and nowhere to be found today. Instead I remember people talking about how much they liked that computers now always are quiet without any disgusting beep during POST. That beep is so useful, but apparently a lot of people just hate it to the degree that MB manufacturers now just skip installing that beeper. Back then the speaker was often a thing you got with the case. All you had to do was wire it to the MB and you could hear the beep codes. The two digit POST code displays are even better, and for a few years they were found on all but the very cheapest motherboards. And now they are some kind of luxury items that are only on motherboards costing way too much.
@@blahorgaslisk7763 that must be before my time. My first PC years ago was a cheap shit one and the mobo had an installable beep speaker. Came in handy immediately when I failed to seat the ram properly. Kept it around ever since. Even recently it helped me figure out my cpu was dying. On amazon they can be picked up for like a buck a piece or less if you buy in a pack. Even if you dont like hearing it, its for sure always worth keeping one around.
@@blahorgaslisk7763 And that's why I'd settle for a standard pinout from the board and let me plug in my own 7 segment display. I already d it with the motherboard speaker.
shame that each of these neat features increase the boards price for like 200 dollars lol, itd be so damn cool to have them for regular boards
2 things Jay:
1. That remote is great for someone who needs to hide computer (for example to have them secure from children) and you start it and put pilot back.
2. PCI-E latches - I recently installed GPU in MSI board who had an extended release latch towards CPU slot - you could press it with GPU installed easily. A release button is superior option but used in mine board is simply cheaper..
now the 1,3k godlike msi board doesnt seem that pricey, the gimicks are worth it!*
Got it preordered it Nov.11th to go with the Ryzen 7 9800X3D.
@@sporadicentertainment9253 And you will never use any of the features or capabilities. A cheap board would make no difference in most builds.
I know you are being sarcastic, but outside of a workstation board, I can never imagine a board over $500 ever being worth it.
For 1.3K i will buy the RTX 5080
@@JayztwocentsLol my motherboard cost almost 600$ and it's not a workstation build ,it's the gigabyte auros master x z790 eatx motherboard
so happy they are going back to both latches on ram, the sound is so satisfying. imo. the NVMe slothes: once you put it in your only going to change it out when it fail. so go 4tb or higher. set it and forget it.
I'm fed up with overpriced motherboards.
Switch to Mac
@@jmatt98Why? So the whole computer can be more expensive for no reason?
I like the little rubber caps for the fan headers on a ROG Strix board. I've snagged my sleeve on those headers many times, so those rubber caps come in handy.
The best motherboard feature would be a 34 pin header for my floppy drive so I don't need an adapter.
WHO would still be using those?
@@SvenOppenhaeuser more like "why would someone still be using those?"
You can buy an USB one. I also have one.
The push button for the x16 slot is great!! Also the toolless m.2 hold down is great no more tiny ass screws!!!
I busted off the video card latch with a screwdriver, and I am very careful and usually do not break things building a PC.
One sided lock in RAM slot is very help full as I struggle sometimes to re-seat the ram like I need to ensure that both lock clicks at the same time. When they do not boot issues happen.
Jay the biggest problem with the board Mfg’s is that the fancier options for drive hold downs are typically ONLY on the pricier boards. I would love to have a $500+ motherboard for my H1v1, but my wallet can’t handle that strain!!
Theres literally no reason they cant exist on the lower end boards. Ill keep pushing them
@@Jayztwocents yes there's one reason. They want to upsell you to a more expensive mb🤷
I just built a new system with a AsRock X870E Taichi board, and I have been extremely happy with it. The tooless M.2 Slots are great, and not having to screw down the drives was a huge plus.
I wonder how long it will be before they come up with a better method for plugging in fan and power plugs. Those small pins are a pain in the butt.
It took way too long for the front end connectors for your case to finally make the connectors one singular plug instead of having to study the manual in order to get it right.
Used to be molex four pin connectors… be careful what you wish for
I adore the holder for the front panel out that you can click all those tiny single pin wires into instead of needing to play operation and placing them correctly on the right pins
After my last experience with an MSI motherboard, I would just be happy if it just didn't catch fire when first powered on.
This never happened stop spreading lies that was Asus, not MSI
@Warhorse469 Oh, the actual MSI board that actually caught fire for me was all just in my head? Good thing we have you to set the record straight for everyone! Shut up.
One thing you didn't mention, which was part of the reason I went MSI, is MSI moving the EPS12V cables over to the right side of the board on all their new boards.
The MSI Unify-X definitely doesn't have all PCIe 5.0 M.2 drive slots only 2 of them are. The Z890 Carbon also has a quick release for the large M.2 heatsink.
Pretty much no board this gen can have all M.2 be PCIE 5. You only have enough lanes for two of them, if you aren't sharing lanes.
So here are my personal choices for features that Some motherbaords should have IMO... and yes these are obviously my personal choices that aren't for everyone...
POST Code display, Toolless releases, TWO RAM SLOTS, 2x16 pcie & 2x1 (or 2x4), No RGB headers lol, 90 degree connectors on the side, Atlteast A start/reset button, don't need SATA ports anymore except maybe one for a blueray player (I prefer blueray over streaming, yes I'm that guy).
That's about it, If I remember something else I'll edit my comment.
Why tf would I want 2 RAM slots when I can have 4? Not like they affect RAM much untill you go for some crazy OC.
In fact, 2 DDR4 3200 RAM sticks (not even from a kit, just same model) on a 4 slot ASRock B450M Pro4 with a mere 1st gen R5 1600 were perfectly stable at 3600 and even were booting and passing AIDA RAM test at 3866 (sadly weren't as stable, was showing an error or two after 2 hour stress test).
Although reading past that and seing bs like "no RGB headers" and "no SATA ports" tells me I've wasted effort on a person who won't understand anyway.
@@ОсликИа-я2ы Answering your comments are a waste of time, because you clearly didn't understand mine. Nevermind that what I stated was my personal opinion. Do you understand what that even means?
Didn't think so. I doubt you even own modern hardware that uses DDR5.
In my new build from this month my ASUS board has a small button to the right of the GPU that clicks the catch down for easy removal. It also has the M.2 spin latches, which I had never seen before. I personally still like the screw on covers compared to alternatives atm.
ASUS gets a lot of hate for their latest issues (rightfully so), but I love them for builds and have used them as my primary brand for over a decade.
I've used several Asus boards in the days of AM2-AM3+/FM2+ - and all had problems. Like F2A55-M with weird no post behavior until you turn of and back on PSU switch a few times or M5A88-V Evo with it's VRM frying itself (literally, with burned marks on PCB) on a stock FX-4100 and dual channel getting disabled when setting RAM to speed over 1600 MT/s. You know what boards didn't have all those problems? ASRock and Gigabyte. MSI - haven't tried them.
Basically that's the main reason I will never buy Asus regardless of their current public image.
Went to visit an old military friend after 6 years. Man is literally my best friend...had to doordash food everyday because there no utensils in the kitchen for me to have gone and bought groceries, and now, on the last night here, at 8:30pm and after 3 days of literally lounging around doing norhing, he says "im beat, im going to go to bed"....im not sitting in a couchless, tv-less living room watching this video just trying to keep my cool. Thanks for keeping me level Jay.
Merry xmas from Europe everyone
Another good video. I'm gong to have to agree with some of the other commenters in that I prefer the two RAM latches; the single latch design is so much harder to align. I also really like the new PCI release where you pull from the front. That side is locked in with the screws mounting it to the case so when you pull the screws, you can just lift the card out. The diagonally opposed lock points provide all the security you would need unless your PC is in a very volatile situation.
Anyway, that's a nice set of mother boards you have to play with!
1st merry christmas
eyoo I think you got it based on the oldest comment that isn't spam.
2nd Merry Christmas
Happy Yuletide!
I'm getting the MSI MPG X870E CARBON WIFI for my second build, it has lots of those EZ features on it to help stop me breaking stuff :)
as someone building their first oc this generation I appreciate these tips. Please post more when they come to mind
Jay's right about the release toggle for PCI-e. I have to use a plastic spudger just to push it down because of the m.2 cover and just the size of the card making it difficult to reach with my fingers.
It is so refreshing hearing these types of videos!!! It is almost circa 1999. Honestly I LOVE IT!
Favorite physical feature is definitely toolless install/Uninstall features. They are satisfying and just make sense.
At 11:14, you're actually pulling it wrong, It's on the front end you take it out as it shows on the box. You pull it out at the side and not possible if it's in the case installed. There's no force to take it out. I have the Maximus Z890 Hero too and i tried couple of times, really easy!
My favorite feature is the POST code displays on the board. It makes it so much easier to diagnose problems.
The single side latch almost got me. I switched to AM5 last month and when I was installing the ram I was a bit confused lol
So Glad that you did this Jay, I was looking at a possible motherboard purchase and was liking every thing I was finding when I came across the fact that the cover to the M.2 drives also held down the M.2 drive as well, I knew right away that I did not want that and it killed any further consideration of that board, I did not find time to explore further, but hoped that it was not going to become a trend and wondered if it was going to become a standard, hoping not.
The PCIE Latch release is such a welcome feature. My Asus TUF X570 gave me a lot of pain trying to unlatch my GPU everytime I had to touch my motherboard. I almost reached a point where I wanted to take a tool in there to break it open.
I'll definitely be looking for PCIE latch tools for my next board.
i appreciate the boards that offset the nvme placement to make them reachable under larger cpu coolers.
my fave accessory on mobo's that are about 5+ years old now, is the USB-C connector... except on mine. even though the mobo and the case were both the same 'generation' the case comes with the USB-C connector to plug into the mobo, but the mobo doesn't have that. short of having to prematurely upgrade my mobo for another higher-spec one, I have to use a PCI-E accessory card for it to give it any use.
it helps to read the manual instead of trying to push on pull things on motherboards :P. Quick release PCIE slot is nice. Single side dim clip is nice but I have had issues in the past. Best feature I think is having a flat connector on your atx connector. (as in horizontal.)
I think my water-proof Asrock that had top of the line VRMs and an OLED diag screen cost me $200-300.
Another feature I’d like to see come back is my X58 RoG board had a dip switches for each PCIe lane and that would kill the power to the lane.
The reason it was important is for troubleshooting. It’s difficult to pull a water-cooled graphics card out just to troubleshoot something.
It also took way to long for boards to start including PWM on every spot.
Single latch DIMM slots have been around since DDR2, they're not used on all boards because it's very much a personal preference thing. Lots of people prefer the dual latch.
My favorite feature, not seen on many MBs, is a 90 degree 24pin MB connector, Some cases can't fit it but to me, it's much better that an unsightly 180 cable.
I have a msi board and i do love the pre lock ins for the m.2 slots you showed in the beginning.
I find it funny how I found this video right after building a new PC with that exact same z790 board and learned about that new m.2 latch this weekend.
I like having the quick release for the PCIE and the m.2. I also like the little clip that Asus has for the FP connectors you can just slot them in to the connector then attach it to the pins on the board. The remote is interesting from a testing stand point, not sure how useful it would be for those of us who are just building a pc.
X870E MAG carbon has the toolless cover for the bottom NVMe as well. My favorite feature on my new MAG X870E is that the code LED can show CPU temp once the host is booted. It really does feed my OCD. :D
I am so glad to hear somebody say something about the GPU latch problem. I've busted two of them stubbornly trying to get out a GPU without uninstalling everything around it first. I was worried that it was just me lol
As someone with severe Neuropathy, these have been god sends to me. Also love the front I/O header adapters, m.2 still needs work in my humble opinion.
I used to cut off the latch back in the AGP and early PCI-E days when it was a little tab you bent. Videocards were much lighter back then though.
My Gigabyte Aorus Elite X870E has fully toolless M.2 and covers, 3 PCIe GEN5 and 1 PCIE GEN4, and a POST code read out. I love it!
A tip to release the GPU without a GPU quick release is to use a bicycle tyre lever to reach the latch. These are normally made of hard plastic and are long enough to reach.
That remote would be great for PC builds inside of one of those glass top desk cases where you can't access anything inside without lifting the top off (along with anything else that's sitting on your desk at that point.)
You can use Birchwood Aluminum Black to touchup black anodized parts and it looks great.
The toggling gpu slot latch is better than the spring loaded design. With the spring loaded, you only have one hand free to pull the gpu out unless you have a helper.
I was under the impression that the single latch ram slots were made out of cheapness, not out of better design. With the single latch, you put the ram in at a slight angle and roll it in. Pressing it straight down is better IMO, even though it can be a little tricky to get both sides to click at the same time.
m.2 cover originated in the mSATA protective shields in rugged applications from 2009... now those weren't ornamental OR heat spreader designs... which appear to have originated with EGlobal (or predecessor co) in 2013.
The "single latch" ram slot dates back to SIMM, sadly. They weren't very reliable. There have also been single-clip SIMM plates where there was one latch opposite the connector slot flat against the mainboard/riserboard in laptops (and still are quite a few with sodimms)
For fans Jay, I highly recommend taking a look at InWin's Neptune series. They are designed with radiators in mind, even on full speed they're not obnoxiously loud, and they're not stupidly overpriced like Corsair & other fans seem to be these days. Thermalright has even cheaper fans (like I got a 3 pack of 120mm fans for $13 kinda cheap) that also move a lot of air while not being super loud, but the InWin ones are made with radiators in mind/directed airflow.
Q-Release or whatever the hell Asus calls it is actually really nice, because you screw in the end to the case that it comes out of for that kind of release. I love it on the X870E-E Strix board I have (not withstanding it's M.2 disappearing issue it has on the -2 & -3 slots). It only has 1 quick-release M.2 slot, but that's the primary one.
My favorite motherboard feature is the ability to flash the BIOS without having to have a CPU, RAM, or GPU in their respective sockets. Just the 24 volt rail from the PSU, a properly formatted USB drive with the latest BIOS, and that's it. On the downside, that means there's a whole secret CPU, RAM, and closed source OS being run on the motherboard to make all of that magic happen potentially doing who knows what once you connect the board to a network. On the plus side, if the board bricks from the BIOS update or just doesn't power up at all (i.e. it is DOA), then you haven't installed anything on it and can just RMA it for a new, working board.
The M.2 latch on Asus boards is really nice. I hate the small screws boards used. The quick release for the GPU is nice. What I really want are test bench cables/buttons pre-installed (clear CMOS, power, reset). Why just have pins? Larger fonts for sockets on the board. You need a magnifying glass to see the ones on Asus boards. Double USB sockets on the back plate (instead of 6...12) or include a USB hub. Definitely always include a post speaker/screen for issues. Most older boards had a speaker with post codes and new boards have that missing.
My 2020 ASUS ROG Maximus X11 Wouldn't boot last month 1.75 hrs with tech support no help was in process of getting info to send in board and there is a small button next to where the power button connects and it switched to backup bios when I pushed it. Saved me.
One thing I noticed a while ago, working in the computer repair industry, At some point in time motherboard manufacturers decided to move the PCI-e singer sided releases on the under side of the GPU. Where as originally they were neared the RAM slots. No idea why they moved them to the other side making it impossible to release the GPU with fingers.
Nice to see innovation on the premiums boards that could trickle down to the more budgets boards
I've actually used screwdrivers to unlock GPUs so yeah: Those "remote latches" are great for removing GPUs indeed. The rest is just a bonus. After years of having just one or two M.2 slots it's also nice to just see more of those on recent boards. And I'd love to see more of them in laptops, too.
I really enjoyed the comparison and close shots to see the details. Thanks!
the only reason i would use a board that expensive/good looking would be for astetic and nothing more but i cant argue boards are looking so lush now compared to 20 years ago, i do light overclocking but nothing near what they can provide, i do love the remote one though that is a great idea IMO, especialy say if a friend has the same board and dosnt have it, its like a OB2 reader for PC :D
I’d love to have a simple cable to plug in for the lights and buttons on the case. I hate having to put the tiny jumper-sized cables on for power led, etc.
I used to have to use a long handled Philips driver to depress the GPU lock because there was so little space between my noctua nh-d15 and my 2080ti. Glad they're finally figuring that out
Yup, have to use a screwdriver to release my GFX, but only because of the big aircooler blocking all the space, not even the M2 cooler.
Danger is to slip of and hit the motherboard with the screwdriver tip, can do harm, but all still working fine, i live with it ^^