If you didn't know who they were and keep the sound down you'd think Mikes been taken into the principles office to explain why he's been upskirting the PE teacher.
Regarding mikes point in the beginning, when I first found RP I was doing super slow eccentrics, like 3-5 seconds. It really helped me get in the groove with how I wanted to preform the exercises and how I felt them best. After about 1-2 years I was able to speed up the reps a little bit while still keeping the same technique. Thinking back, I almost had to relearn technique completely and going super slow helped a ton.
@@SeuOu I’ve learned that the SFR for extremely slow isn’t ideal for me, a nice 1-2 seconds (maybe 3-4 on squats and RDLs) is perfect. Super slow eccentrics just zap me. I can do more volume if I speed it up a little which results in more gains. Just for me personally though if it works for you then great.
Was the same for me. I did super slow technique, to the point it becomes an ego lift on the opposite side. Nothing was happening with those little weights and slow reps. I've sped up with agressive 1 second or less concentric and slow (2-3 seconds) ecentric. Gives me the best pumps and progress has been a lot more noticeable and faster.
Grote fan uit België hier ! Er is een grote gat in de markt wat betreft onderzoek in sport/bodybuilding hier in België. Ik heb lang gezocht naar relevante vervolgopleidingen, maar in BE zijn er niet veel opties. (Momenteel ben ik student geneeskunde, met als doel te specialiseren in revalidatiegeneeskunde). Tijdens het wandelen geniet ik van je podcasts. Het doet mij een plezier om te zien dat je kanaal groeit.
Just out of this new super entertaining podcast episode of eliteFTS x Dr Mike, where he spoke very highly of Menno :D couldn't ask for a better continuation of the day being a follower of both these guys. Can't wait to watch this.
I don’t know what is optimal for lifting, but I have never seen anyone look more ‘complete’ when doing a movement than Jarred Feather. It’s poetry in motion
This is awesome stuff Menno I found your channel through Mike and the videos with you both are my favorite because you take training very seriously and dont jump to assumptions (we know this works or that might work or depends on the situation) and you guys are very detailed with the information, I've been training seriously for 5 years now and I stumbled upon RP around 6 months ago and I didn't even know this community of Sports Science even existed this is awesome. The information you guys put out is honestly next level thank you guys for this.
Great. I just wish Dr. Mike had this nuance in his own stuff. He can feel a bit more cavalier with his takes and recommendations on his own channel, but the nuance always seems to shine most when with other experts. It's gotten to the point I watch his vids more for entertainment, and watch Dr. Milo Wolf or Dr. Pak for more nuance consistently
Yes! I completely agree. There’s a podcast with Paul Carter and Mike from 4 years ago, and the information is nearly identical. Mike has grown slightly in his tendency to elaborate on his specific opinion, but definitely still has a lot to offer in the way of comparison of nuance, especially between experts like this. I want to know the nitty gritty differences and the exact reasons why. Fantastic content nonetheless!
There’s very few people that come close to Dr. Mikhail’s knowledge, understanding, applied knowledge with actual results on the scale that he does it. Hats off Sir ! 🎩👏👏👏🎩
Once I wrapped my head around the fact that rest days or reloads are part of the program- not days off, that flicked a switch in my mind that always keeps me in the mindset of always working toward my goals with no interruption. If someone works for 2 weeks and then takes "rest days" that in their mind is an actual break in training then it can feel like you have lost momentum.
I've enjoyed this back and forth collaboration with Menno and Mike a lot. Quite a few challenging questions of "why do you do it your way and is there any evidence for it?" and just good fun time. Especially because the two have at times very different views on what's the best way. There aren't that many people in my opinion at the top of the evidence based fitness educational content, but including Stronger By Science and MASS people, Menno and Mike definitely are there.
Great collab, Menno and Dr. Mike. As an older lifter my deload is when something in my body not related to lifting breaks, and then I'm forced to stop lifting for a while. This is a different "reactive deload" other than a regression of load or reps. Thanks.
I think more so he just got caught up in progression and business and let's be honest could he have been so successful online if he didn't, maybe not? Though there's plenty of footage of him lifting in early RP days clearly natural and the dude wasn't very aesthetic but god fucking damn was he strong, I don't think it's compensatory , he's married also @@tartantulakid666
He is very short, but in this video the camera angle and him being seated a bit lower makes a big difference. Dr Mike also has a video with Menno where the camera angle favours Mike and they are seated at the same height and the difference in size is significantly less. There is a video that shows how they used camera angles in the filming of the LOTR to create the illusion of characters being much bigger or smaller.
Phenomenal video! Highly informative and super helpful as always. Loved the collaboration! Thank you so much for sharing your valuable wisdom and insights with us! I greatly appreciate it. Your advice has been very helpful to me. I really love and admire the work that both you do for us! Two of my favourite individuals in the fitness community. 🙌
the 'endgame' conversation was something else. I find intelligent gear users very interesting to say the least. It's not something I'd ever mess around with but I've learned to respect the endeavor, the careful management of risks. the vegeta/F1 analogies were apt. this is why I wish certain personalities like Sam Sulek and Mitch Hooper would talk more openly about what they're using and why, and the research and evidence that guides their actions. morbid curiosity on my part, but I'm here on this earth the one time, I just want to know all the cool things.
I would never race F1 cars (or drive any car any way besides the safest way possible), but I love watching that content. I wish there were more openness around 'peak performance' chemical manipulation of the body as I find it all terribly interesting. Really enjoy Derek (MPMD) for that stuff. Though I understand the concern about indirectly pushing harmful risk-taking behaviors on the audience. Would be great if we could get past that as a society and just enjoy the 'F1 racers' among us without all needing to do the same.
@@genautelevishn5999 that’s certainly…one of the opinions of all time. I’d love to know the logic path that you took to arrive at that take, what you think the outcome would be if you got your way, and whether you think that most likely outcome matches the outcome you would want.
@@SycoraxPraxidicethe reality is, these people are going to end up cripples later in life, just look at poor Ronnie. For a person on such a dark trajectory, making them a role model for impressionable young people is naive and malicious, let athletes be role models, these robots can have their niche but it shouldn’t be glorified
@@KinGSlayEr-y6v Ronnie's lifting behavior is the reason for his disability, clearly. plenty of examples of other bodybuilders (such as Lee Haney, another 8-time champion) who lifted lighter and more strategically for stimulus-fatigue ratio, who still look healthy and great. Everything is on a spectrum. There is going to be extreme cases of reckless misuse, and there is going to be more scientific risk-management cases of people doing plenty of bloodwork and following diligent protocols to maximize their safety.
@@davorzdralo8000That’s the most incorrect thing ever 😂 Andrew Jacked can do the splits, Mike O’Hearn does behind the head neck presses and pull downs all the time, it is flexibility and mobility because they didn’t start that way and stay that way as they got bigger and bigger.
This was a nice reminder for me of just how good Mike Israetel can be when he's not doing his lowest-common-denominator comedy routine on the RP channel.
i did leg presses yesterday bottom 3/4 after full extension set and did body weight squats after.. yea i gotta go back to gym to pick up my quads after work today
Dr Mike got a good point on the pump. You can get a small pump and I tested it with DB Curls, did 2 sets of 20 reps and got a pump but that's not a best pump of life situation where I can't even move my arms anymore and that's not where muscle growth occurs. Pretty sure studies on that topic that say pumps aren't correlated to growth did that kind of volume and pump level.
5:10 ""...I experimented with many different tempos, and I found that, roughly, they seem to give you, even PERCEPTIVELY, very similar things ... it's just a different way of doing things..."" And that's about it, well put Mike. Some people like complicating exercises, for the sake of it. But complexity for its own sake is for fools... But really, more difficulty has to have more benefits or don't overcomplicate it.
I wish Mike offered more nuanced takes like this on his own channel. He mostly paints things in black and white on the RP channel, such as slow eccentric always better
I'd also check out the playlists from the RP+ lectures, which I guess used to cost money, but got put up for free on youtube. I haven't looked at all of them, but the nutrition for cutting and nutrition for building muscle have a lot of nuance. Each has like 7+ lectures that are each at least a half hour long.
The unfortunate reality is constant nuance doesn’t grow the channel, they tried that for many years. If you know where to look it’s still around tho as others have mentioned
Imagine listening to this convo and knowing nothing about working out. All the “pump” and “growth” talk could really send some teenage male brains to a interesting place lmao
Glad you guys touched on the Physios/chiros It's so infuriating the damage they've done and other health care providers as well They need to be held accountable when they spread so much fear in movement and make it even harder for someone to start their health journey because they are afraid of getting seriously injured... but thats how they make money, making them fearful and dependent on their "treatment".
I haven’t seen this discussed anywhere, but has anyone considered that part of the reason that lengthened partial seem to have a positive effect is that it is maintaining tension on the hardest part of the muscle without giving it any sort of rest? Ultimately when you do full range of motion, there is a moment where the load tension is paused or taken to the easiest point with the least tension on the muscle, giving it even a minimal rest before resuming the hardest part. With lengthened partials, it’s keeping the muscle in a constantly activated state at the peak of strain. Just my personal observation and I was curious if you all see any validity to that.
If the current question is at what point, do you take your lengthened partials? perhaps the solution is to take your rep almost to the point full range of motion, but not allow it to go quite very end of what would be considered the lockout or the release of the maximal tension. Thus eliminating the release of maximum tension and theoretical rest. It’s simply might be a matter of not going to the point of full pumpkin squeeze where you’re no longer gaining maximum benefit. Just bringing it up to the point where it hurts and it’s heavy and then controlling the eccentric
I think they did discuss this in a previous video with these two. Somebody correct me if I'm wrong, but I think they said the evidence shows that it's total time under tension, not total time under continuous tension, which is important. They were talking about lockouts and how if you don't lockout you keep the muscle under tension but you fatigue earlier, whereas if you do lockout you will be able to complete more reps and so in the end you spend the same time under tension and there's no difference in gains. So based on that I don't think the benefit of lengthened partials is coming from avoiding rest, but simply from tension on a stretched muscle providing a greater stimulus.
Lengthened partials work because tension on the target muscle in a lengthened position stimulates more hypertrophy than tension in a shortened position. It does not have to do with time under tension or having constant tension, as you suggested. The resistance curve of exercises can differ a lot; some have zero tension in lengthened position, like bicep curls, while others have less tension in shortened position, like bench press. The idea is to choose exercises that put more tension on the muscle when it's lengthened, like dumbbell chest flies are better than cable crossovers. If you're going to do cable crossovers, it might be worth loading the weight so high that the stretched position is difficult and you're not even able to complete a full contraction in full range of motion (lengthened partials). Hope that clears it up!
Slower the reps the lower the weight so you miss out on mechanical tension. But slowing things down with long pauses has helped me connect to muscles I have a hard time connecting with. I like full ROM for overall health, especially for joint health and protection a against sudden impact
Having this weird time on my recommendations ever since Dr Mike hit 1 million subs it's been nothing but podcast Dr Mike appears on and ads for edibles and grinder...
Great talk. I get the fascination with steroids and breaking the bounds of your genetics lottery. I just don't see it mixing well with the rest of my lifestyle. I don't think I would be able to sustain it. I have a question for your next podcast though. Is Dr Mike wider than he is tall? I look forward to your analysis.
Can someone get dr mike to talk about strength and how technique effects what physiological system you're taxing and or utilizing or techniques to maximize the weight of the lift ... within safety .
I always like how people ask if they can swear after they swear. I think even if full range of motion gets you just a little bit more hypotrophy, I don't think. It's worth it because of the possible strength losses you may get
RE: Deloads and stuff. I've had 2 major disk herniations in the last 6 or so years that've caused lots of sciatica pain. Looking back, the year or so leading upto these injuries, i was training with very high frequencies, usually 7 days a week, but spaced out like PPL usually (and basically never deloading). I never had a problem with recovery muscle wise, but now i'm wondering/suspecting that this was responsible for micro trauma in my back that i had no way to detect but eventually led to the injuries. There's probably no way to ever know, maybe i would've been injured no matter what. I'd be keen to hear your thoughts given you've suffered a similar injury. Either way, I'm 38 and have trained most of my adult life like this, so i'm going to prioritize recovery a bit more moving forward.
Yeah especially us specimens who dont feel much fatigue after training 6 hard days a week with no deloads...yes its almost undetectable for us for sure and Micro trauma is a thing.
I'm not Dr Mike, but it is well known that bone stress takes longer to recover than muscle stress. Remodeling bone, which is essentially what the body does when you're loading the spine for heavy squats and such, takes significantly longer than muscle. It's also an independent reason from muscle recovery for taking planned deloads when training with heavy weights and high frequency (even if the deload is something like doing lunges instead of axially loaded squats). I work with a lot of back pain clients and there are obviously many different triggers for those injuries, but your thesis is very reasonable.
I weight luft pretty hard every single day with a split routine. I haven't tried taking a rest dau or two. But my muscles, some are resting while others are working. If I took a few days off a week, would I be likely to gain body fat? Or would I just get stronger/be able to lift heavier? Would my hypertrophy come faster?
pump for pumps sake is essential, increases volume, stretches fascia, gives room for muscle to grow, betters bloodflow, and probably unknown benefits. Just go for pump and you cant go wrong. My arms did not grow until I focused on maximum pump and immediately they started growing. Lengthened partials gives insane pump
@@bjorneriksson6480 increases volume of what? (We know it's not muscle), stretching the fascia does nothing too, what do you mean by "gives room to grow". That's just broscience Bs dude Some of the most muscular dudes ever never trained for with regards to pump (Brian Shaw for example)
I always got super lazy and unmotivated after deload (I never skipped workouts when I didn't have to but my approach to workouts wasn't on point). that's when I stopped to do proactive deloads and started to do reactive deloads. I am lifting for like 16 years and since I changed this approach I started to have super fun with training again. Also I stopped my paralysis with analysis lol
@@edwisongogo6326 there was a period of time a number of years ago where the prevailing idea of a deload was essentially a near complete break... A lot of people were convinced of that by the talking heads
Im not sure about the pump thesis; in climbing one tries to avoid a pump as much as possible (bc then its over). the pump mostly happens with movements in mid range, one can also see how a climber is stretching (similar to lenth partial) to avoid or handle the pump.
Well, in climbing the goal is the opposite of bodybuilding. In climbing you are trying to avoid fatigue so you can climb more - in hypertrophy training you are actively looking for as much fatigue as you can recover and grow from. Fatigue and metabolite accumulation is one of your primary mechanisms for growth. As for mid range being where climbers get the most pump - that tends to be a difference in the sport vs bodybuilding as well. A climber at end range of motion is mostly using the minimum effort necessary to maintain position on the wall. This means relying as much as possible on tendons as well as minimizing muscle use. The lifter is using a maximum amount of effort and often actively contracting against the stretch. A climber uses the most energy in their mid range because they can't rely on static support to hold that.
I believe the pump is nothing more than just psychological. I don’t believe the pump grows the muscle itself, but I do believe the pump feeling adds to your overall wellbeing which pushes you more in the gym.
Omg its legolas and gimli.
.?
😂
Nobody tosses a dwarf!
*gimli
Lmao
If you didn't know who they were and keep the sound down you'd think Mikes been taken into the principles office to explain why he's been upskirting the PE teacher.
Lol😂
😂it’s sick it’s piss!
😂😂😂😂
But he's explaining the whole time why it's both reasonable and nuanced that he gave her a go😅
This is making me laugh so hard hahahahaha
Batista and Rey Mysterio back together again
😂😂
😂😂
More like Chris Bennoit and Triple H
Which is which?
Regarding mikes point in the beginning, when I first found RP I was doing super slow eccentrics, like 3-5 seconds. It really helped me get in the groove with how I wanted to preform the exercises and how I felt them best. After about 1-2 years I was able to speed up the reps a little bit while still keeping the same technique. Thinking back, I almost had to relearn technique completely and going super slow helped a ton.
Yup. It also makes cheating really hard and super easy to track where you're at and to see if you're progressing properly.
Yeah, I still use a pretty slow rep tempo myself, maybe 4-5 seconds total on average. I just love how it feels, physically and psychologically
@@SeuOu I’ve learned that the SFR for extremely slow isn’t ideal for me, a nice 1-2 seconds (maybe 3-4 on squats and RDLs) is perfect. Super slow eccentrics just zap me. I can do more volume if I speed it up a little which results in more gains. Just for me personally though if it works for you then great.
The same happened to me
Was the same for me. I did super slow technique, to the point it becomes an ego lift on the opposite side. Nothing was happening with those little weights and slow reps. I've sped up with agressive 1 second or less concentric and slow (2-3 seconds) ecentric. Gives me the best pumps and progress has been a lot more noticeable and faster.
Grote fan uit België hier ! Er is een grote gat in de markt wat betreft onderzoek in sport/bodybuilding hier in België. Ik heb lang gezocht naar relevante vervolgopleidingen, maar in BE zijn er niet veel opties. (Momenteel ben ik student geneeskunde, met als doel te specialiseren in revalidatiegeneeskunde). Tijdens het wandelen geniet ik van je podcasts. Het doet mij een plezier om te zien dat je kanaal groeit.
Is belgium a real country?
Unexpected answer on tempo since every training session from Mike is, “slow, slow, SLOW GODDAMNIT!!”
I thought of this as well, I guess it's for our entertainment and to bully the guests
“Milk it”
He said they over emphasize certain techniques to promote the viewer to try controlling the weight. If you use a slow tempo there’s no way to cheat
He later mentioned that they emphasize slow tempo more for very advanced PED using athletes. That’s like 90% of their channel guests.
😂😂😂
I loved the questions. They were so detailed and practical, not just the general topics we've heard so many times already. Thank you
And yet they speak about nothing new. They both disagree and yet both have grown a sta dard amount of muscle.
Hands down one of the most educational and helpful conversations about the topic. Post on RP too!!
Just out of this new super entertaining podcast episode of eliteFTS x Dr Mike, where he spoke very highly of Menno :D couldn't ask for a better continuation of the day being a follower of both these guys. Can't wait to watch this.
Would love to see a bit more input on Menno's end for those who may be newer to his content, but hearing Mike is always a blessing. Love these guys.
I don’t know what is optimal for lifting, but I have never seen anyone look more ‘complete’ when doing a movement than Jarred Feather. It’s poetry in motion
Also Mike walks the walk..see him ,every rep is EXACTLY the same!
@@RestLess-MinDJareds form is better ngl
*IPBB Pro Jared Feather
@@JohnpdfWhile true, Dr. Mike's are also excellent. Jared's just a literal demigod lmao.
This video just pulls out the best of Mike thanks a lot
Wow, amazing Podcast. Thank you Menno and Mike.
Thanks for the video Menno. Big fan of both of you and its great to hear each of your perspectives
Kudos for the respect between you two.
This is awesome stuff Menno I found your channel through Mike and the videos with you both are my favorite because you take training very seriously and dont jump to assumptions (we know this works or that might work or depends on the situation) and you guys are very detailed with the information, I've been training seriously for 5 years now and I stumbled upon RP around 6 months ago and I didn't even know this community of Sports Science even existed this is awesome.
The information you guys put out is honestly next level thank you guys for this.
Great. I just wish Dr. Mike had this nuance in his own stuff. He can feel a bit more cavalier with his takes and recommendations on his own channel, but the nuance always seems to shine most when with other experts. It's gotten to the point I watch his vids more for entertainment, and watch Dr. Milo Wolf or Dr. Pak for more nuance consistently
Wolf is king
Yes! I completely agree. There’s a podcast with Paul Carter and Mike from 4 years ago, and the information is nearly identical. Mike has grown slightly in his tendency to elaborate on his specific opinion, but definitely still has a lot to offer in the way of comparison of nuance, especially between experts like this. I want to know the nitty gritty differences and the exact reasons why. Fantastic content nonetheless!
I 100% agree, he contradicts himself a lot just to criticize other people’s training.
He does have this nuance, in his videos where he's reading from a powerpoint which are ironically his best and his least popular videos
Such a gem! Thank you, guys!
What a great conversation. Thank you
I find it fascinating how nuanced Mike can be about things like the pump.
Great interview. Thanks Menno and Mike!
Loved this, thank you. Made for a great listen on my lunch break.
I can’t tell you how much I love that Mike n Menno are legit friends ❤️ I was introduced to Menno by Jeff Nippard and have been following him since
There’s very few people that come close to Dr. Mikhail’s knowledge, understanding, applied knowledge with actual results on the scale that he does it. Hats off Sir ! 🎩👏👏👏🎩
Once I wrapped my head around the fact that rest days or reloads are part of the program- not days off, that flicked a switch in my mind that always keeps me in the mindset of always working toward my goals with no interruption. If someone works for 2 weeks and then takes "rest days" that in their mind is an actual break in training then it can feel like you have lost momentum.
Props to Dr. Mike, he was on point!
I've enjoyed this back and forth collaboration with Menno and Mike a lot. Quite a few challenging questions of "why do you do it your way and is there any evidence for it?" and just good fun time. Especially because the two have at times very different views on what's the best way. There aren't that many people in my opinion at the top of the evidence based fitness educational content, but including Stronger By Science and MASS people, Menno and Mike definitely are there.
finally, a person that puts the record straight on the pain vs mechanics debate!
Great collab, Menno and Dr. Mike. As an older lifter my deload is when something in my body not related to lifting breaks, and then I'm forced to stop lifting for a while. This is a different "reactive deload" other than a regression of load or reps. Thanks.
Absolutely f’ing loved this. 💪🏽
This was good. I have been watching both of you for a while.
Great conversation, thanks!
De enige twee mannen in de industrie waar ik naar luister
Today I found out Dr Mike is a jacked hobbit.
We been known that... The part about being a hobbit, not him being jacked
😂😂😂
I think more so he just got caught up in progression and business and let's be honest could he have been so successful online if he didn't, maybe not? Though there's plenty of footage of him lifting in early RP days clearly natural and the dude wasn't very aesthetic but god fucking damn was he strong, I don't think it's compensatory , he's married also @@tartantulakid666
@@tartantulakid666 so what explains Mike O'hearn? He's tall and handsome, so what's his excuse?
He is very short, but in this video the camera angle and him being seated a bit lower makes a big difference. Dr Mike also has a video with Menno where the camera angle favours Mike and they are seated at the same height and the difference in size is significantly less. There is a video that shows how they used camera angles in the filming of the LOTR to create the illusion of characters being much bigger or smaller.
Thanks guys.
Some confirmation. Some new stuff.
All useful to know.
Thanks Mike and Menno. Great discussion.
Great material, thank you!
Such a great interview
Phenomenal video! Highly informative and super helpful as always. Loved the collaboration! Thank you so much for sharing your valuable wisdom and insights with us! I greatly appreciate it. Your advice has been very helpful to me. I really love and admire the work that both you do for us! Two of my favourite individuals in the fitness community. 🙌
Just found the video, really glad they get along very well 😄
Great discussion, thank you both.
Love your stuff! Could either of you talk about tendon health or connective tissue strengthening that’s in the research please sometime in the future.
Great video, thank you, Menno!
the 'endgame' conversation was something else. I find intelligent gear users very interesting to say the least. It's not something I'd ever mess around with but I've learned to respect the endeavor, the careful management of risks. the vegeta/F1 analogies were apt. this is why I wish certain personalities like Sam Sulek and Mitch Hooper would talk more openly about what they're using and why, and the research and evidence that guides their actions. morbid curiosity on my part, but I'm here on this earth the one time, I just want to know all the cool things.
I would never race F1 cars (or drive any car any way besides the safest way possible), but I love watching that content. I wish there were more openness around 'peak performance' chemical manipulation of the body as I find it all terribly interesting. Really enjoy Derek (MPMD) for that stuff. Though I understand the concern about indirectly pushing harmful risk-taking behaviors on the audience.
Would be great if we could get past that as a society and just enjoy the 'F1 racers' among us without all needing to do the same.
i don't think you should be allowed to talk and openly confess about possessing and using illegal substances and you should be jailed for it.
@@genautelevishn5999 that’s certainly…one of the opinions of all time.
I’d love to know the logic path that you took to arrive at that take, what you think the outcome would be if you got your way, and whether you think that most likely outcome matches the outcome you would want.
@@SycoraxPraxidicethe reality is, these people are going to end up cripples later in life, just look at poor Ronnie. For a person on such a dark trajectory, making them a role model for impressionable young people is naive and malicious, let athletes be role models, these robots can have their niche but it shouldn’t be glorified
@@KinGSlayEr-y6v Ronnie's lifting behavior is the reason for his disability, clearly. plenty of examples of other bodybuilders (such as Lee Haney, another 8-time champion) who lifted lighter and more strategically for stimulus-fatigue ratio, who still look healthy and great. Everything is on a spectrum. There is going to be extreme cases of reckless misuse, and there is going to be more scientific risk-management cases of people doing plenty of bloodwork and following diligent protocols to maximize their safety.
Good content and formant guys 💯💪
Great collab. Love this!
Top Menno, blijf zo voort doen!
Mike here : "I'm flexible"
Mike there : "I can't press overhead or grab a bar while squatting"
Actually he said he is flexible enough for his other sport (BJJ). You are taking his words out of context.
The reason he can't reach shit is the bulk of his muscles, not flexibility. He could stretch forever but he'll never be able to do those things
@@davorzdralo8000That’s the most incorrect thing ever 😂 Andrew Jacked can do the splits, Mike O’Hearn does behind the head neck presses and pull downs all the time, it is flexibility and mobility because they didn’t start that way and stay that way as they got bigger and bigger.
very very very good podcast.
Oh my friday evening is gonna be bliiiiiiissss watching this episode
This was a nice reminder for me of just how good Mike Israetel can be when he's not doing his lowest-common-denominator comedy routine on the RP channel.
Great video!
i did leg presses yesterday bottom 3/4 after full extension set and did body weight squats after.. yea i gotta go back to gym to pick up my quads after work today
Dr Mike got a good point on the pump. You can get a small pump and I tested it with DB Curls, did 2 sets of 20 reps and got a pump but that's not a best pump of life situation where I can't even move my arms anymore and that's not where muscle growth occurs. Pretty sure studies on that topic that say pumps aren't correlated to growth did that kind of volume and pump level.
Mike is out of this world.
Amazing!!!!!! Confuse me more😢!!
Very interesting podcast, thank you both
5:10
""...I experimented with many different tempos, and I found that, roughly, they seem to give you, even PERCEPTIVELY, very similar things ... it's just a different way of doing things...""
And that's about it, well put Mike. Some people like complicating exercises, for the sake of it. But complexity for its own sake is for fools... But really, more difficulty has to have more benefits or don't overcomplicate it.
Great vid
For sure after trying to pause at the bottom I'm feeling and making more sore my muscles with the same weight than before i like
I wish Mike offered more nuanced takes like this on his own channel. He mostly paints things in black and white on the RP channel, such as slow eccentric always better
I'd also check out the playlists from the RP+ lectures, which I guess used to cost money, but got put up for free on youtube. I haven't looked at all of them, but the nutrition for cutting and nutrition for building muscle have a lot of nuance. Each has like 7+ lectures that are each at least a half hour long.
100%
He does go through the nuance, albeit rarely.
It's because it's general advice. He's gonna save most of the nuanced stuff for his Lambo savings account.
The unfortunate reality is constant nuance doesn’t grow the channel, they tried that for many years. If you know where to look it’s still around tho as others have mentioned
Two biggest brains in bodybuilding? Sign me up
Imagine listening to this convo and knowing nothing about working out. All the “pump” and “growth” talk could really send some teenage male brains to a interesting place lmao
"Is it ok if I swear?" "Fuck you too Menno, I'm doctor mike." Lmao
Glad you guys touched on the Physios/chiros
It's so infuriating the damage they've done and other health care providers as well
They need to be held accountable when they spread so much fear in movement and make it even harder for someone to start their health journey because they are afraid of getting seriously injured... but thats how they make money, making them fearful and dependent on their "treatment".
I haven’t seen this discussed anywhere, but has anyone considered that part of the reason that lengthened partial seem to have a positive effect is that it is maintaining tension on the hardest part of the muscle without giving it any sort of rest? Ultimately when you do full range of motion, there is a moment where the load tension is paused or taken to the easiest point with the least tension on the muscle, giving it even a minimal rest before resuming the hardest part. With lengthened partials, it’s keeping the muscle in a constantly activated state at the peak of strain. Just my personal observation and I was curious if you all see any validity to that.
If the current question is at what point, do you take your lengthened partials? perhaps the solution is to take your rep almost to the point full range of motion, but not allow it to go quite very end of what would be considered the lockout or the release of the maximal tension. Thus eliminating the release of maximum tension and theoretical rest. It’s simply might be a matter of not going to the point of full pumpkin squeeze where you’re no longer gaining maximum benefit. Just bringing it up to the point where it hurts and it’s heavy and then controlling the eccentric
I think they did discuss this in a previous video with these two. Somebody correct me if I'm wrong, but I think they said the evidence shows that it's total time under tension, not total time under continuous tension, which is important. They were talking about lockouts and how if you don't lockout you keep the muscle under tension but you fatigue earlier, whereas if you do lockout you will be able to complete more reps and so in the end you spend the same time under tension and there's no difference in gains. So based on that I don't think the benefit of lengthened partials is coming from avoiding rest, but simply from tension on a stretched muscle providing a greater stimulus.
Lengthened partials work because tension on the target muscle in a lengthened position stimulates more hypertrophy than tension in a shortened position. It does not have to do with time under tension or having constant tension, as you suggested. The resistance curve of exercises can differ a lot; some have zero tension in lengthened position, like bicep curls, while others have less tension in shortened position, like bench press. The idea is to choose exercises that put more tension on the muscle when it's lengthened, like dumbbell chest flies are better than cable crossovers. If you're going to do cable crossovers, it might be worth loading the weight so high that the stretched position is difficult and you're not even able to complete a full contraction in full range of motion (lengthened partials). Hope that clears it up!
Science level 9000
Bro just questioned each and everything which was worshipped by RP fans for years and won!
Dr. Mike, where would you say you rank amongst the top 5 straightest men of all time?
Mike took edibles before the video for sure 😂
Dr Mike is not just your boy...he's THE boy!
This looks like Joe Rogan invited Steve Rogers to a podcast
Slower the reps the lower the weight so you miss out on mechanical tension. But slowing things down with long pauses has helped me connect to muscles I have a hard time connecting with.
I like full ROM for overall health, especially for joint health and protection a against sudden impact
Having this weird time on my recommendations ever since Dr Mike hit 1 million subs it's been nothing but podcast Dr Mike appears on and ads for edibles and grinder...
good one!
Brilliant!
Dr Mike is the best
Great talk. I get the fascination with steroids and breaking the bounds of your genetics lottery. I just don't see it mixing well with the rest of my lifestyle. I don't think I would be able to sustain it.
I have a question for your next podcast though. Is Dr Mike wider than he is tall? I look forward to your analysis.
I loved it. Fucking great.
I have never heard the word pump used so many times in such a short time
Simple rule, just get into the habit of doubling the eccentric versus your concentric. 2 to 1, 4 to 2, 6 to 3, whatever.
Did him dirty with the two different chairs
That was great, wonderful interview. very Professional...
whats the difference between Science based and Evidence based???
There's some serious out angling going on here
Can someone get dr mike to talk about strength and how technique effects what physiological system you're taxing and or utilizing or techniques to maximize the weight of the lift ... within safety .
I always like how people ask if they can swear after they swear. I think even if full range of motion gets you just a little bit more hypotrophy, I don't think.
It's worth it because of the possible strength losses you may get
Blinking is thinking eh Mikey!
That was dope
RE: Deloads and stuff. I've had 2 major disk herniations in the last 6 or so years that've caused lots of sciatica pain. Looking back, the year or so leading upto these injuries, i was training with very high frequencies, usually 7 days a week, but spaced out like PPL usually (and basically never deloading). I never had a problem with recovery muscle wise, but now i'm wondering/suspecting that this was responsible for micro trauma in my back that i had no way to detect but eventually led to the injuries. There's probably no way to ever know, maybe i would've been injured no matter what. I'd be keen to hear your thoughts given you've suffered a similar injury. Either way, I'm 38 and have trained most of my adult life like this, so i'm going to prioritize recovery a bit more moving forward.
Yeah especially us specimens who dont feel much fatigue after training 6 hard days a week with no deloads...yes its almost undetectable for us for sure and Micro trauma is a thing.
I'm not Dr Mike, but it is well known that bone stress takes longer to recover than muscle stress. Remodeling bone, which is essentially what the body does when you're loading the spine for heavy squats and such, takes significantly longer than muscle. It's also an independent reason from muscle recovery for taking planned deloads when training with heavy weights and high frequency (even if the deload is something like doing lunges instead of axially loaded squats). I work with a lot of back pain clients and there are obviously many different triggers for those injuries, but your thesis is very reasonable.
I weight luft pretty hard every single day with a split routine. I haven't tried taking a rest dau or two. But my muscles, some are resting while others are working. If I took a few days off a week, would I be likely to gain body fat? Or would I just get stronger/be able to lift heavier? Would my hypertrophy come faster?
The pump is at least a proxy for work "volume, proximity to failure" but with some common sense pump for pump sake is not a goal.
pump for pumps sake is essential, increases volume, stretches fascia, gives room for muscle to grow, betters bloodflow, and probably unknown benefits. Just go for pump and you cant go wrong. My arms did not grow until I focused on maximum pump and immediately they started growing. Lengthened partials gives insane pump
@@bjorneriksson6480 increases volume of what? (We know it's not muscle), stretching the fascia does nothing too, what do you mean by "gives room to grow". That's just broscience Bs dude
Some of the most muscular dudes ever never trained for with regards to pump (Brian Shaw for example)
@@mrt1430you were going well there until your example.
Would you agree that as your muscles grow it gets way easier to get them pumped?
Dr mike goated
I always got super lazy and unmotivated after deload (I never skipped workouts when I didn't have to but my approach to workouts wasn't on point). that's when I stopped to do proactive deloads and started to do reactive deloads. I am lifting for like 16 years and since I changed this approach I started to have super fun with training again. Also I stopped my paralysis with analysis lol
Deliberate Non active deloads are dumb... why did u do them to begin with?
@@edwisongogo6326 there was a period of time a number of years ago where the prevailing idea of a deload was essentially a near complete break... A lot of people were convinced of that by the talking heads
Im not sure about the pump thesis; in climbing one tries to avoid a pump as much as possible (bc then its over). the pump mostly happens with movements in mid range, one can also see how a climber is stretching (similar to lenth partial) to avoid or handle the pump.
Well, in climbing the goal is the opposite of bodybuilding. In climbing you are trying to avoid fatigue so you can climb more - in hypertrophy training you are actively looking for as much fatigue as you can recover and grow from. Fatigue and metabolite accumulation is one of your primary mechanisms for growth. As for mid range being where climbers get the most pump - that tends to be a difference in the sport vs bodybuilding as well. A climber at end range of motion is mostly using the minimum effort necessary to maintain position on the wall. This means relying as much as possible on tendons as well as minimizing muscle use. The lifter is using a maximum amount of effort and often actively contracting against the stretch. A climber uses the most energy in their mid range because they can't rely on static support to hold that.
Can you talk about slow cadences and real benefits??
A good way to determine animal intelligence is the head to body size ratio
I have a follow up question. Does Menno response to comments?
But what about training the fast twitch muscles from being explosive 🧨??
I believe the pump is nothing more than just psychological. I don’t believe the pump grows the muscle itself, but I do believe the pump feeling adds to your overall wellbeing which pushes you more in the gym.