Is Rudy Gobert valuable in the playoffs??
Вставка
- Опубліковано 3 жов 2024
- Does Rudy Gobert's defense lose all its value in the playoffs? Is he to blame for Utah's playoff struggles? This detailed film breakdown & scouting report analyzes how the Jazz center played during his 2022 series against Luka Doncic, Jalen Brunson and the Dallas Mavericks, while incorporating analytics & stats to assess his impact in the postseason versus the regular season.
2020 Gobert profile: • Does Rudy Gobert's def...
Support at Patreon: / thinkingbasketball
Book: www.amazon.com...
Podcast: player.fm/seri... or at www.stitcher.c...
Website: www.backpicks.com
Twitter: @elgee35
Ben Taylor is the author of Thinking Basketball, a Nylon Calculus contributor, creator of the Backpicks Top 40 series & host of the Thinking Basketball podcast.
Stats courtesy:
www.pbpstats.com @bballport
www.basketball...
stats.nba.com
-----
Footage in this video is owned by the NBA and its partners. It is intended for critique and education.
Music by Alter Ego (Lost)
#ThinkingBasketball - Спорт
![[UA] NAVI проти G2 Esports | Blast Premier Fall Final](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/QWlIm4FGESQ/mqdefault.jpg)
moral seems to be: if you’re the only one trying on defence you’re the only one looking bad on defence
Fact
You couldn’t have said any better
You're so right.
SINCE FOREVER
i like my fences I don't want to defence
I think many people are mistaking playoff teams exploiting the Jazz’s over reliance on Gobert for defense with teams exploiting Gobert himself.
Exactly. And even then, they lose because of their offense not their defense
well-said
thats a BINGO!
@@raviatm You just say bingo.
@@paksta 😭😭😭
Ben Taylor, the only man that provides evidence for his takes instead of blaming all of the Jazz's shortcomings on Gobert.
I've been a Gobert defender since the bubble, he is so undervalued and underappreciated that's sad at this point, you put him in any team that already has a great perimeter core and suddenly you have a contender, imagine him on the Mavs, that has already a great core, and could use another roll man to pair with Luka that also would be in the DPOY convo.
@@pedroaugustocosta2533 fax
It's indeed been clear that Gobert deserves credit, lots of it. Sadly he's a problem on offense, and that just exasperates even more the terrible and ever-bleeding defensive situation of Mitchell (who's often a burden on offense too, with that shot-making, shot-selection and playmaking) and the other perimeter players not defending a lick of anything.
but there's still no excuse for the drop coverage that gobert plays on 3-point Legends like Steph Curry & other Shooters of the like. some kind of hedge has to be in order and corrected next season when they get in the playoffs. he just can't expect the backcourt player to fight around the screen while he chills in the paint and watches and open practice shot go up
Ultimately a terrible defensive lineup - small aging PG + small never lateral quick or strong SG + slow aging SF... They are so not meta right now. If it's not for Rudy they won't be in the playoffs.
Ben so infuriated with Bogdanovic's defense that he refuses to call his name and just say "This defender" twice
As a mavs fan, Utah’s rotations were terrible and there were so many times where Rudy would just completely deter players from even attempting shots around the rim. Also Utahs perimeter defenders are terrible
Utah should’ve stayed out at the deadline. They ruined their chemistry.
@@bearswin4 it's not their fault that Rudy Gobert is giving people a 10 foot cushion to get easy and open 3s, mid range jumpers, floaters, and everything else. Not everyone is Alex Caruso, Marcus Smart, or Jrue Holiday. It takes a ton of energy to continually run around screens and the least Rudy could do is step up sometimes. As for the perimeter defenders AS A TEAM they need to learn how to stunt and recover
They actually started to figure out how to defend that 5 out , just took em to late lol
@@RecapRico Rudy can step up and defend well. The problem is that once he does that, you're basically giving away points at the rim.
@@grahamjl766 Nick is clueless clown
A 7 foot 2 center is not supposed to move the way Rudy does. He's an unbelievable athlete with tremendous defensive instincts that has wasted his prime on a team full of guys that don't care about defense. I'm hoping he can finally play on a team where is defense can be put on full display.
This off season is gonna be really interesting for the jazz. There are so many interesting fits for Gobert
LMAOOOo man idk about that how many clips have we seen of Rudy getting his ankles took lmaoooo
@@GurtonBuster07 Every good defender gets made to look like an idiot. If you don't have a highlight where somebody made you look stupid on defense, you aren't trying hard enough on that end.
He'll love playing in boston
@@SgtHolton As someone who mainly plays on the physical defensive end of things in P.E class i completely agree with this.
Gobert is literally the last line of defense. Everytime he gets scored on it’s because somebody else didn’t do their job. Put him on the Celtics and see how astronomically different he performs.
As a celtics fan, Gobert is actually one of my favorite players because of his unique playstyle. I always wanted the dude on my team because I knew he would be a perfect fit. Fortunately, we didn't have to trade for Gobert because of Timelord.
Last and only, he plays with traffic cones on defense.
@@suedetree970 as a raps fan I wish we had him on the team.
@@suedetree970 You know basketball sir.As a Mavs fan too i want him so bad.He is a nightmare at the paint for the opponents.
@@tj5180 yup the raptors really need a center
Thank you! This whole series all we were hearing was "They're abusing Gobert" when in fact Dallas was abusing the fact that the rest of the Utah defense is TERRIBLE. He's the kind of big whose value grows exponentially when the wings and guard can actually keep up but in Utah you have Mitchell playing heroball, Clarkson who's asleep at the wheel and Conley who looks like he was taken by the Monstars. That can't work and at this point I feel like a trade is in RUDY's best interest.
I was also super happy to find this video. However, I would love it for the Jazz to keep him. I understand how a trade my be best for Rudy (which, if that happens, I'll get a Gobert jersey for the new team and cheer for them), but I'm hoping that the Jazz will instead let Mitchell go, let Snyder go, get a defensive-minded coach and get back to instilling a system and style of play that prioritizes defense. If that happens, it could still be good for Rudy to stay in Utah.
If you're hearing "they're abusing gobert" maybe you should be listening to smarter people
@@ryanandtricia They don't really need to get a defensive-minded coach they just need to get someone who will hold everyone accountable and Synder will never do that. Just look at the Warriors. A great offensive team but even though their best player Steph Curry is a liability defensively he still holds his own weigh and tries to play within the team. Rudy should be more vocal like Draymond is and start holding the rest of the team accountable for their mistakes if the coach isn't going to do his damn job.
@@RebornKingz yeah but nobody has to hold Steph accountable because he gives 100% effort. Mitchell has to step up cus they go as he goes. If he shows no intensity on defense, why should anyone else? 🤷🏾♂️ like he’s not even a bad defender at this point, he literally doesn’t try.
Well the trade part came true lol
The problem with utah defensively is that they have 4 traffic cones and a DPOY
the problem offensively is that their center doesn't provide much besides rim running
to be fair Gobert is good enough on offense, he doesn't need to do anything else beside rim run and put backs, he still is the nba leader in fg% on 15 ppg, that's great on a team that is already that great on offense, it's just that the Jazz have a DPOY center and 4 terrible defenders in the court at once.
@@pedroaugustocosta2533 no, he doesn't do enough. He is absolutely awful at anything other than open layups and dunks, he'll have trouble scoring in the post over Trae Young
@@pedroaugustocosta2533 he could do more, be it passing, post offense (at least punish small forward and below) and also he has a bit of a problem handling the ball, so while he is leading in fg%, the turnovers don't count towards that, and also the inflated % is thanks to conley and Mitchell as much as gobert
@@ameerdahbour8794 Warriors won a few chips with Zaza and McGee rudy is much better than them offensively and defensively.
Hes doing enough
15 ppg from a center who also anchors your defense is already enough but aside from him defensively who they got? None Bogdanovic & oneale at 3 & 4 is their main problem maybe a more realiable 4 defensively will make them better and they can slide bojan at 3
I was a “gobert hater” for a moment, but then actually started to watch games(past and present). Gobert isn’t a primary perimeter defender(but can somewhat hold his own when needed), therefore him trying to close out on a shooter will get hectic. The jazz have failed in acquiring defensive personnel. This leaves gobert being basically exposed because he now has to essentially guard the perimeter and the paint. Guys like him need perimeter defenders who can hold their own. Unfortunately rudy is being frowned upon and im starting to really dislike it.
I’m not a jazz fan but I’ve ALWAYS hated cop outs. I didn’t understand the Gobert slander when whenever I’ve watched him, he did his job of protecting the rim. In nearly all of these plays, Gobert forced floaters or passes, but everyone was talking about him as though he was getting bodied by Brunson lol.
Honestly rudy’s main problem is on the other end, if the mavs, clips or whatever play small on them, rudy has to give it back to them on the other end. But his lack of any offensive arsenal outside of catching lobs deters even his teammates from giving him the ball
@@riskderic to be fair that is a limitation I can accept for Rudy since his value is more of a defender than an offensive threat who can punish mismatches. So to me the roster goal IDEALLY would be to surround him with other lengthy/athletic defensive positive players and grind it out while having 2-3 playmakers who can buy a bucket in the playoffs. But they way the Jazz built it, is more about shooting to buy a bucket but not being able to stop anyone at the perimeter. Which consequently means they give up more buckets in the long run anyway.
@@t4d0W hes basically a dead weight on offense and has slow feet on defense he's a good defender that has flaws that not only people but his own team seem unwilling to accept.
He won't win anything in Utah
@@Nerevarine420 i mean neither would the rest of the Jazz with how atrocious their perimeter defense is. Gobert can't fix how bad they are on the perimeter.
You could replace Gobert's name with Marcus Camby and basically do the same video about the Nuggets defense when he was in Denver 14-18 years ago. In both scenarios, they over relied on their center to compensate for their porous perimeter defense.
Just Camby wasn't nearly this good.
Camby had nasty habbit of leaving assigments to fish for blocks by overplaying weak side defense for no reason.
Blame 'Patient😷ZERO' Rudy🍧Yogurt for the last two years. ☣️😷☣️
except 14 - 18 years ago, spacing and 3 point shooting in the NBA was comparatively nonexistent to today’s NBA
@@etime89 still the same concept. You can't keep funneling it to the big at the post when teams have ways to draw the big man out. Much easier now of course due to spacing and playing two man games to hunt for match ups.
The warning signs were already there. The entire talk last year was how their regular season defense didn't translate to the playoffs, and talking heads put the blame on Gobert instead of their horrible defense on the perimeter. Utah went ahead and fixed the problem by... signing Rudy Gay? Hassan Whitside? Eric Paschall? What?
And we saw what happened this year. Nothing changed, other than the fact that Luka and Brunson were cooking their perimeter defenders instead of Kawhi and PG. And the talking heads still haven't learned!
There's another story to this though, with their ballhandlers having a terrible series both scoring and playmaking-wise. I hope this aspect of the series (how the Mavs defense dealt with the #1 regular season offense) is covered in a future video as well. Love your videos Ben
This comment is great!
As a Luka fan. The mavs supporting cast and coaching schemes are not talked about enough.
I've been aghast (wanted to use the word) at their roster construction.
Two way players, figure it out. Literally every good team is after them, every basketball writer is talking about them.
talkin heads just wanna perpetuate the popular narrative, they aren't interested in facts, only the tv ratings matter to them
Great and underrated comment. I truly wonder how vocal Gobert is behind the scenes in speaking up about better perimeter defense.
@@recoil53 I haven't really paid attention to it until the Jazz playoff woes were a buzzing piece months ago. If the goal was to make a defensive team, the roster makeup is an utter failure for it. The Blazers for years tried with their small back court experiment and pairing that with whatever good defensive wings they could get along with Nurkic and they were still piss poor at defending the perimeter in the playoffs. Jazz wings are also unathletic and not lengthy enough to play the standard help defense stuff too. Then as a coup de grace, Jazz FO solution was to add another stilt at the center (Whiteside), more unathletic wings to try play inside (Gay, Paschall) and another small offensive guard whose a zero on defense (Clarkson).
I find TV sports media(most) can't not be watch as much basketball to know enough. How can they with their schedule and covering just bout every sport. They have to be watching at most "producer notes" and repeating whatever narrative sales at best.
This is why i am thankful for channels like yours.
Their defensive strategy for the past few playoff runs have essentially been “let’s hang Rudy out to dry and hope he bails us out.” They have no perimeter defenders who can stay in front of anyone and Rudy has to slide over off of a 3pt shooter almost every possesion
Frfr I just want to say sorry Rudy
People too often criticize players when the real issue is fit. It's so clear how good Rudy is at defense and when he inevitably gets traded to a team with good wings defenders people will see how great he is.
Dude, i've seen rumors on him going to the warriors lately, can you imagine that?!!! Elite perimeter defenders plus Rudy.
@@musikomago8120 Warriors would be a great fit, Celtics too even Dallas
He could contend and fit on any of those teams
Warriors would probably be the best fit but he would need a pay cut
Rudy's fine as long as he doesn't play against any other 7 footer that can shoot threes, like Giannis, KD, Embiid, KAT, Joker, Kristaps, AD. You know, on second thought, Rudy sucks on offense.
Wow. Going from 10th to 28th defensively on the shoulders of a single player is probably the most singularly defensive impact that I've ever seen a player have. People really shouldn't be blaming Gobert for the Jazz's defensive problems. Their perimeter players don't rotate at all. That being said. Gobert's free throw shooting is a liability and hurt his team down the stretch.
A few years ago on the Timberwolves, their starting 5 was worse in NBA recorded history in defensive rating. If you switched KAT with they were like top 10.
@@keyproblems7590 Wow. That's insane. KAT is an enigmatic player. He's got so many great aspects to his game. At the same time, he is a hole on defense and turns the ball over on double teams way too often. Kat is the polar opposite of Gobert. If Gobert was a particle of matter, Kat is his anti-matter.
if their perimeter defenders were better they could have him zone around the paint so yeah this is true
Great point - on the other side, he's under-utilised. I watched France play the US and it was hard to not think Gobert could be doing some more damage offensively with the Jazz.
Nah. Watch some footage of his offensive game. He has really bad hands and isn't really capable of consistently putting the ball in the basket unless it is an open lay up, dunk, or lob. He doesn't pass well when doubled, and swarming defenders often make him fumble the ball away. Gobert is a defensive plus, but on offense he is best utilized by setting screens, rebounding, and being the recipient of the occasional lob.
@@PunishedLasagna I agree. I think he should be getting more lobs etc, particularly when so many teams these days play small.
I used to think Gobert sucked but I've seen the light. Get half decent POA defenders and he's the perfect anchor. He has 3 DPOY'S for a reason
He is the most overrated defender of the decade. How only blocks occasional shots close the rim...but he is always exposed in rotation and allows a lot of hustle points
@@mcmerry2846 Spoken like someone who didn't watch the video
@@mcmerry2846 L
Look at how Milwaukee's defense works - the one with Lopez.
Lopez is also a drop defender. But everybody else is at least an average defender. For Coach Bud's first 2 years that gave 2 60+ win seasons. (Last season they experimented with other coverages and this year Lopez was out until the last few weeks). Only great shooting specialists like Kyle Korver and Brynn Forbes have gotten regular minutes, but only in the regular season.
Look at most finals teams. Mostly good to great defenders, at least when they want to be.
The GM failed Gobert and the Jazz. That's why everybody is looking for '3 and D'
As a Jazz fan, it's basically Gobert and O'Neale (Mitchell is okay, not great) and everyone else is a massive liability.
It sucks when you know you need defense and all they keep adding are outside shooters.
I'm a Mavs fan, and it felt DAMN GOOD to send home and implode a D Wade team, but I felt so bad for Gobert. His teammates left him hanging play after play after play. Wide open 3 after open 3. He deserves to go to a team with fierce perimeter defenders so he can shine doing what he does best. And a coach who can make adjustments and won't leave him out to dry too. A coach that can help teach him something on offense.
People talk about Mitchell possibly wanting to leave for good reason, but nobody should want a trade more than Rudy. I'd like him on the Mavs, but not for 200 mil gtfoh
First time I hear a Rudy to Dallas but honestly it fits very well. Powell is nice, but Gobert would definitly be an upgrade.
still salty after d wade dogged that team in 06? ☠☠☠ lmao
@@tehemister042 still salty after 2011?
To me his worth every penny. 28th in defense to first.
The Clippers would love to have him. He'd be a perfect with surrounded by elite wings
I do think it's a lot about an irony of his defensive impact being one of the prominent reasons why perimeter defense isn't as important, while perimeter defense is also the main reason that his impact doesn't translate to the playoffs. Regardless of fault.
The playoffs is all about exploiting any weakness your opponent’s defense has.
Gobert is a liability
The fault is the GMs. He saw a defense that works in the regular season, because in the regular season teams aren't game planning for each opponent.
He's so good at offense that other than Royce, they are all offense only players.
How was Rudy Gay supposed to help with that as a small ball center? The issue is not enough defense all around.
Kind of, but not entirely. If a team goes 5 out on offense and the defensive team has multiple perimeter defensive liabilities, almost no defensive player of any size is going to be able to make up for that. At that point for a center, it's more about being able to do enough stuff on offense to punish teams for going small; nobody would expect Giannis or Embiid or Jokic to cover the entire court on defense either, but obviously those guys are going to feast against a team that tried to cover them with no rim protector on the court.
@@nolang1 Your offense affects your defense that's why in a Giannis or Embiid example we'd never see it to this extent.
People often don't acknowledge it when it's common sense the other way around. Draymond's offense isn't as valuable when he's not a center and Rudy's defense isn't as valuable because you can always go small against him.
I would love to see gobert on a new team with a better defensive identity so everyone could see just how good he really is
@@rmelo2382 for a top ten defender of al time
@@rmelo2382 gobert
@@rmelo2382 no yea
@@TimeLordinc he barely top 10 today let alone top 10 all time .
@@rmelo2382 In defense ???? He top 2 right now
Props to Gobert for playing defense right in spite of the situation in Utah. A more selfish player might just stay home on some of these help situations just to save face.
rudy dnt cheat
What more can he do anyway? His main job is to guard the paint but that gets harder to do when the perimeter defenders simply bounce off screens and can't rotate effectively
@@ja4309 He's constantly, rebounding, running across the court, and putting maximum effort despite not touching the ball and his teammates lazy defense. A lot of players would have given up running and calling for the ball. This guy deserves more competitive teammates.
REAL PROFESSIONAL
@@radicalmatamune Its funny that some people think Whiteside would be a 'better' answer. Its like these guys don't remember watching Whiteside playing his latter years with the Heat where he was getting his big money and starter minutes. His laziness and lack of laser focus is why Riley been looking to dump him off but no team was wiling to bite.
Thank you! I'm a Jazz fan and almost want to see him go to another team with decent wings to show what he can really do.
Thank you. I hope Simmons and Russillo watch this video. I cannot believe how ridiculous some of their takes on Gobert have been.
I get it now. Watching him every night as a wolves fan, I get it. The guys is otherworldy.
“mf you can’t fn guard me” 😭
I think some of his teammates are not disciplined enough on perimeter defense, as they expect Rudy to save them if they get beat. I feel like it's a real life thing, as I sometimes fell asleep on d (irl) if my I knew my center was a good defender and would be willing to help on drives
So true
For sure, Donovan even said this exact thing in the game 3 post-game conference. There was a question about Rudy coming out of the game when the Jazz made their run, and Donovan said: "When we went small, it forced us to have to kinda shift in as a group, and I think that was a great mental place for us to be in." Later, "You kinda fall into, uh, letting him like, alright, you know he's gonna be back there so when he's not there, you turn it on, you gotta do it."
Even the greatest defenders can't defend against 5 players by themselves. The Jazz need to either improve their perimeter defense or else this core of Mitchell and Gobert simply isn't gonna work. Add onto the fact that Mitchell seems to still hold a grudge against Rudy and that is visibly affecting their on-court chemistry, it seems inevitable that one of them has to go this offseason
Gobert is great in defense no matter what the situation is, the thing that make him look bad is that he hasnt have a teammate that is good on defense, what nba teams are doing during playoffs is that they are like they attack gobert and then suddenly they will kick the ball out for 3 and the shoot is open gobert will try to contest it that will move the ball to the nxt player or sometimes they make him a perimeter defensive player, gobert is so good at defense that he make his teammates look good at defense and his teammate are so bad at defense they make gobert look bad at defense
The only good permieter defenders the jazz have is Daniel house and Royale o Neal
Does anyone make this argument for Embiid? The 76ers defense is also horrible if u watch games. Harden, Maxey, Milton, and Niang get busted on the perimeter and in rotations. U can’t just magically have 8 good perimeter defenders in the NBA. They’re hard to come by! Gobert has to develop an offense or he isn’t worth a max. Put him on the Bucks over Lopez and they’d literally get worse 100% guaranteed
@@WalterFlanagin Before you go too hard on the virtual fellation of Embiid you might want to look up the name "Matisse Thybulle".
And despite all his many, many flaws Ben Simmons was (is?) a great perimeter defender, which also helped Embiid look good in their years together.
No "5" could ever look good on the Jazz, and that's the entire point of this video.
@
Walter Flanagin Embiid not nearly the defender Gobert is. Also he has solid defenders on his team. And a Much better team all around..
The stats in this video show he's nowhere near as great though.
When you have guards like Mitchell and Conley playing turnstile defense it's not fair to blame Rudy..
So it's not Gobert, it's that the rest of the team's terrible D can be schemed. Surprised after all this time they aren't able to do it in the regular season?
most teams don’t have the personnel to run 5 out sets without severely impacting their defense/rebounding, and the teams that do don’t usually run those sets in the regular season, until maybe the 4th quarter of a tight game.
It's not that they aren't able to. They just choose not to put in the effort when they're restricting minutes for their starters or jet lagged.
In the regular season teams don't game plan for a specific opponent's weaknesses.
Also average and worse teams usually can't do a five out.
Look, in Milwaukee's first 2 years under Coach Bud, also a drop coverage. Both times 60+ wins, then booted out of the playoffs.
Third year more defensive flexibility.
Playoffs target a specific weaknesses. Is your team built to plug that hole or attack the other team so much that they have to change their line up?
I get that, but if you can make a change everyone knows and improve your team by 15 points and take a DPOY off the floor at key moments, it seems negligent not to.
If it was a case of a new phenomenon, sure, but this is something teams have 5 blueprints for already.
Jazz either need to blow it up or trade Gobert, because he's either stopping them go up in the draft or stopping them go all in on offense like an 80s nuggets team. They just have to pick one.
If they are happy being a low playoff seed and first round out, I guess they can hold until Gobert or Spida want out.
@@blackjacktrial The worse part with the end sentence is that its the opposite of the Stockton/Malone Jazz. Stock/Malone was good enough to get to the playoffs and outside of the apparent WCF winner, they were going to give opposing teams hell. Gobert/Mitch moving forward is just a disappointing series of sequels unless you are a deluded Jazz fan who loves to get their heart broken from bad movies. Hell I thought the Jazz would have a shot against the Mavs without Doncic. Mavs defensively held out better and kept the series even until Doncic came back to take over. Something Gobert/Mitch themselves couldn't do in the series.
His teammates keep setting him up for failure. The guy cannot be in the paint AND at the 3PT line at the same time. They don’t even make an effort to switch, it’s essentially Gobert or bust.
I know this was focused on the defensive end, but I do think it’s fair to be critical of Gobert’s offensive limitations and how that enables teams to go small with no fear of being punished. Even DeAndre Ayton who has CP3 i admit, is able to seal on switches and find easy baskets against smaller lineups. Gobert still looks awkward with clunky footwork, struggles catching the ball, and doesn’t have great touch around the rim. Couple that with below average free throw shooting and you see why teams are comfortable downsizing against them. If he could dominate the low post and offensive glass teams wouldn’t be able to do this to them.
At the same time you should also criticize his teammates plus their gene offensive system. Sure gobert might not be the best player offensively but he has to be the most underutilized player in the NBA. Jazz were literally the 2nd team in NBA in 3pt attempts and 25th in total fg attempts, meaning their scoring purely comes from 3s. If you watch the other high 3pt teams they have big men who shoot a lot as well like Kat (T wolves are first). And just by watching the games you'll see gobert just running up and down for a bozo like Mitchell to shoot a bad 3. Most of gobert's points literally come from putbacks or rebounds. I agree that he isn't a good pick n roll player but with the center position currently having shorter players and not great defenders just by giving him the ball in the low post he could draw fouls or score some pretty easy by baskets. And no player can improve his game if he doesn't get the ball. I just think he needs to go to another team
@@stratosm3154 don’t agree, you can’t blame Rudy’s teammates for his lack of ability on offense. He sucks on the offensive end and there is no way around that. Why would you invest offensive possessions with someone who is just not going to score? Thats bad coaching. That’s like giving Ben Wallace the ball on the post. Rudy is one of the worst if not the worst post bigs in the league, if you don’t believe me go look up his shooting percentages beyond 5ft. He has been in the league far too long to have 0 ability. Shooting 3s is the better option unfortunately
Well said. I think Gobert can be used as an amazing weapon on a good team. But with 4 others weak defenders around him he struggles against the small ball lineup.
Goberts hands aren't great but also most of his teammates, especially Donovan, give him last resort passes. Ingles pick and roll success with Gobert showed that Rudy's hands can be fine when there's a good passer on the other end.
Completely agree, Thinking Basketball is my favorite source of basketball analysis, but I'm disappointed this video completely ignores offence. Rudy's defense is not the problem. The problem is his lack of offence and what that allows opposing teams to get away with.
I think the playoff metrics aren't good for measuring Gobert for the exact bizarre nature of how the Jazz got to the playoffs in the first place that you mentioned. Teams this bad in terms of defensive schemes and single player impact don't usually make the playoffs, so we don't have good data on them. I think Gobert would be really good in the post season with a team like the Pelicans or the Celtics that already have very energetic defensive guards like Herb or Smart that can negate Goberts weakness when paired with the right defensive scheme. I also think the huge shrink between Rudy's regular season and playoff on/off performance has to do with his opponents simple abusing his teammates' terrible defense with good schemes rather than Gobert himself actually failing or underperforming.
I mean, maybe the post-season is just a better representation of how much he actually lifts a defense by himself since teams can actually gameplan to take advantage of it.
That is still a big impact, but not the massive difference that makes him look like the slam dunk best defender of the tracking era by far that the regular season data shows us.
" Teams this bad in terms of defensive schemes and single player impact don't usually make the playoffs"
In this modern era they could. Keep in mind there are some ways a defense can win in the regular season and take advantage of certain play styles that entails. Things change in the post season because defensive intensity is amped and match ups are MUCH more prevalent in a 7 game series. Which could pick apart obvious flaws that were well hidden on defense in the regular season given the personnel.
Shoutout to Rudy Gobert for never giving up and still putting in effort defensively even when it was clear half his teammates weren't going to bother.
What gets me mad is that every time when the opposing team his tons of 3s on Utah it’s when Utah has a lead, meaning there defense worked, they no longer need to gamble on defense and just guard shooters instead of them leaving them open every possession.
They remind of the bucks, but the difference is that they adjust, the jazz in the other hand…
I think the difference is the bucs have good perimeter defenders, like Holiday and Middleton as well as Gannis/Lopez while the Jazz have surrounded Gobert with traffic cones.
Bucks don't adjust..only Miami and Golden State adjust
@@mcmerry2846 dramatically yes I agree shoot the way the Bucks adjust is just deciding to guard shooters.
Which isn’t that much of a adjustment you can argue that’s not even the coach saying that this is the players deciding too.
Although I hope you didn’t quite literally mean only the heat and warriors adjust
@@charlesfowler4308 do the 76ers also have great perimeter defenders? Do the Nuggets? Why does no one have to make these arguments about team defense for Embiid or Jokic
@@WalterFlanagin Currently Danny Green, Tyrese Maxey, Matisse Thybulle. Previously Ben Simmons, Jimmy butler, and Robert Covington.
This is the best basketball channel on YT!
If you only knew how much I learn from you, Mr. Taylor! Thank you, sir.
Pundits are not analysts. You shouldn’t look for anything more then talking head entertainment with ESPN personalities. Thank god for channels like these.
Nick Wright understands about as much as his brother Tom Green does.
What's especially annoying about the Gobert criticism is that his value shows up just as much when you watch the tape as when you look at numbers, yet his detractors cry about analytics they don't understand. When people say he looks bad on tape, what they're really meaning is that he looks bad on the highlight package they watched. They did not watch tape.
Remember a few years ago when 'shot deterrence' became a topic at Sloan? That is, there's value in affecting shots but there's also value in preventing shots from taking place. There is no greater shot deterrer in the NBA than Rudy Gobert and that extends to the playoffs. In this video you only captured a few of them, but if you rewatch the Mavs or Clippers series, you can find so, so many instances where Brunson or Jackson drive into the paint and then are forced to pass out because they don't want to challenge Gobert. Those plays don't show up on the stat sheet because no shot was attempted and there's no block, but it's essentially each team wasting 10+ seconds of their shot clock and then needing to reset for a low quality 3.
I don't understand the Jazz's scheme in the second halves of playoffs. They're capable of playing defense on a string in the regular season, and that's what we expect the best defenses to do. One guy helps, another guy covers the helper's man, another guy covers that helper's man, etc. But for some reason the Jazz stop doing it at the end of games.
You can go by analytics and you can go by tape and see the effect Gobert has. If you just go by highlight videos, you're probably an idiot and you're missing the full picture.
Thank you for this video, absolutely spot on. Who knows what’s next for this Jazz roster, but Gobert will be great whatever team he’s on next season. Facts
"Gobert's Defense is easy to exploit in the playoffs"
is a line said only by Game Highlights Fans.
No one in their right mind thinks RG is a liability. He is one of the most impactful players in the league, and every single advanced Metric proves that.
Is he not maximizing his value with more offense? Yes, it can be said. That's an argument.
But this Rudy gets Exposed idiocy is just that.
The failures are the JAZZ FAILURES...there's 4 other guys out there on the court and 99% of the time "Rudy Gets Beat" its him getting beat on his 2nd or 3rd Switch.
The Gobert Problem is what happens when the media is allowed to run with narratives and fans don’t have the in-depth knowledge to correct for this.
Wild that a guy who’s entire profile is being the last line of defense is criticized for suddenly not being a radically different player. Hes not perfect, but he’s not why the Jazz have underachieved.
He's literally their best player. The current Jazz roster would be a perpetual lottery team without him.
"DPOY bUt hE cAn'T eveN deFeNd aLL poSitiOns"
He's being paid a Supermax solely for his defense and he doesn't impact it anywhere near warranting that check in the playoffs.
@@senpainft6860 I mean, if you replace Gobert with any other DPOY candidate, does the Jazz defense improve meaningfully? Draymond can’t quarterback the defense with these guards being this leaky, same goes for Bam, healthy Kawhi can’t get stops when the other team has two or more star offensive players (or a single star big man), etc. I’m not sure how much more we can ask of Rudy when he has such a big impact on the Jazz defense even during the playoffs.
Wow, that was a great comment
I keep warming up more and more to the idea of bulls trading vuc (and stuff) to utah for gobert. A Lonzo, Lavine, Derozan, pWill, gobert lineup sounds like a great balance of offense/defense. Imagine the genius defense of lonzo and caruso combining with gobert! Would completely negate the poor defenders lavine and derozan. Being close to a top ten defense with VUC, i can only imagine how good it could be w rudy! Great vid
If you have that perspective on Gobert, then it's all coaching fault for their years of failure.
GM and coaching. Who built a team of one way players?
Team management, more like. Coach would be rightfully fired if they played a scheme that did not maximise wins.
Coach did as much as he can. You cannot be serious asking Snyder to manage Gobert and 4 training cones to be a stout defensive team and provide perimeter resistance matching up vs playoff teams.
Imagine you swaped Gobert with Al Horford on the Celtics, that Defense would be legendary. My point being, 35 yo Al Horford can be useful defensively in a good system.
Not worth it Celtics would need to include Robert Williams
@@elijahtaylor648 it's a hypothetical, not a serious trade lol. Like "imagine if these two guys were on the other team" not "imagine if these guys got traded for each other"
@@elijahtaylor648 Not worth it by the C's either, Robert Williams more valuable in the future and will aim DPOY for the next season.
And not to mention that 35 years old Al Horford can attack both to the rim and from perimeter while Gobert just focusing on D.
@@elijahtaylor648 it’s not a trade scenario, it’s a comparison.
@@ibaskoro8803 it’s not a trade scenario. It’s a defensive impact comparison.
I just recently searched up his playoff defensive rating it’s actually better compared to his regular season maybe I searched up the wrong season or maybe your metrics thinking basketball is better.
But I think it says Utah failing to close out series, Rudy not being on the floor at the times, and overall bad communication on defense that hurts them.
Not rudy
yes, and their scheme is to hedge on screens, when they should probably just be switching them. unless rudy is being hunted for the switch, then maybe they should hedge.
@@nlechupa2366 it’s also there rotations and overall effort on defense that hurts them.
The jazz also tends to gamble with shooters and see if they make the shot.
Which sometimes works, that why they be having leads, but that’s when you should stop and just guard regularly, that or have consistent and efficient offense even if value may be worse like feeding Rudy on mismatch’s.
But no they change anything which is there down fall
were you using bball reference?
Mitchell is a fraud
It isn't in the regular season its 101. In the playoffs its 110. Thats considerably worse.
Your comment is just flat out inaccurate.
This video is on point. Utah does not have the defensive guards or wings to be a great defensive team comes play off time. Their defense falling apart but it is not Gobert's fault. He is doing his part. Utah's guards and wings are just not good defensively. That is something the Jazz need to address if they really want to go on a title run.
IMO he's the only reason their defense was respectable. They asked way too much out of him in that series
He's going to half to learn how to be in 2 places, or more like 5 places at once.
Spidah is a fraud
Its not respectable though.
been asking too much out of him for 3-4 years now.
Rudy gave them 12 pts. 15 rebs 0.5 assists 1 block 1 turnover per game in that series. They gave him a $200 million.
you can tell by how he plays hes giving it ALL. for a dude his size its impressive to see
As always, a great video detailing a lot of interesting points the traditional media coverage don't mind talking about. This is what I'd call a real unbiased, objective analysis!
Love your videos Ben, thanks for existing!
In my observation in this issue, there are two main type of media/content creators - 1. those who says Gobert is trash without context; and 2. those who says Gobert is valuable and that Utah's perimeter defense is trash and everything was only funneled to Rudy... However, I find these takes as shallow view...
Then there is "Thinking Basketball"... His breakdown makes everything fine and clear. Thank you Ben! Keep this up!
people see that the jazz's defense is bad in the playoffs and just blame rudy, and not to say he's completely blameless but without him they're easily a bottom 5 defense in the league
You are so right. Sometimes its funny to read the Gobert slander and his limitations. But at the same time the other Jazz players aren't at fault for their limitations on defense that impacts the team defense in a worse way. When was the last time Conley wasn't beat at the perimeter or could fight over a screen? When was Bogy saavy enough to know when to help? ONeale is okay but the Jazz need better to actually execute a legit playoff defense.
This is by far my favourite channel on UA-cam
Thank you! I think my eyes might roll out of my head the next time I hear Gobert is a bad playoff defender. This is the reason so many players can't stand the press, because the vast majority have no clue what they're talking about.
Daaaaamn, what happened with the audio and song quality?!! It's so good this time!!!! 👏👌👌
P.S. I feel pampered with so many defensive videos, thanks!
Imagine Gobert actually with GSW. With Draymond and the other smart BBIQ all around that shit would be a lock for some time.
But he's payed like a superstar he has to be superstar. Not a role player on GSW.
This is huge and I hope it spreads a lot more over the week. It's very important to show that a defensive anchor and a defensive glue guy are two different situations. This says a lot about the coaching staff too, that they're not noticing this. If they ship Gobert instead of fixing the roster, whoever takes him better ask for a draft pick or two because those will be guaranteed lottery picks.
Can we all agree that we all knew what the Jazz wanted with that lineup of theirs? ONE Defense minded player and everyone else offense minded. Why are we even surprised if they suck in perimeter defense? The Jazz designed their lineup that way, it's their fault it always fails in the playoffs lol
That's the GM and coach. Easy to scheme around one guy.
Jazz’s problem is everyone on their team can only play one end of the floor and is extreme,y disgusting on the other end
Nah, blame the foreign guy
@@riskderic
Problem is RUDY SUCKS ON OFFENCE.
According to some at least...
When the coach says "ANYONE guarded by Donovan has a green light",you SUCK at defence!!!
Love how you started the video with a “hot take” from sports media, then proceeded to refute their sensationalism with film and reason.
Gobert should be upset with being the scapegoat of all of Utah's shortcomings as a team. After this season Utah needs to rebuild their roster because they've had 3 straight TERRIBLE playoff exits and they've been absurdly over dependent on Gobert to make them look better than they really are. Won't be surprised if Utah has a fire sale this offseason.
Thank you for being the only sane person not blaming Rudy for his team mates not being able to stay in front of anyone
He can provide certain things, and can do so on an elite level. Opponents in the playoffs just adjust and stop attacking the paint. It's not his fault the rest of the team does not guard the perimiter effectively.
Finally! Someone talking about the facts! Jazz wing players doesn't play defense, it was only Gobert who plays defense yet they blame him for every loss
Gobert if he was on the mavs would be really good because of their wings
U are probably my favorite basketball UA-camr and you are very knowledgeable and entertaining.
If youve never gotten cooked then it means you arent playing defence, I think this really fits with the Jazz. We see gobert on highlights getting destroyed by luka and brunson but rarely any other jazz players
A huge thank you !!!!!!!!!
I am fed up about people bashing him and not seeing the lack of defense of the others team mate or maybe they never played basket ball well that s what I am thinking
I would like to see him with two better forwards or one small forward and point guard or second guard that actually are good in defense and able to read the game the same way he does that would drastically change things for the team
He deserve a better team or better team players PERIOD
Man I totally sympathized with Gobert. When I'm playing at my gym and we have those competitive 5v5 games, and my teammates just leave everything on defence to me, I lose my shit. And I'm not even an NBA player or super tall guard. I have no clue how Rudy keeps his cool when these guys play like they're just practice cones funneling players to the rim. Speaks a lot about how good of a teammate he is.
You are right. But hell, hes getting paid over 200 mil that's enough to keep your cool to a degree. That being said I've seen him call out Mitchell and get upset at him when he ball hogs and wont pass Rudy the ball INTENTIONALLY. Mitchell is NOT a professional. And yes, I definitely feel you on the pickup basketball playing defense and yet the other 4 guys on your team just want the glory on offense. What I do is just grab the rebound and run right by them straight to the rack or shoot the 3. And I'll keep doing it until they get the point. Play defense and pass the ball or this will continue. Win or lose I dont care. I've seen big men in my adult league literally walk off the court and grab their bag and go home in the middle of a game due to ball hog teammates. Such selfish people in the country. Rudy is a foreigner that's another reason why hes more professional.
Great video. Would've loved to see a breakdown of Gobert on offense though. Especially considering his lack of offensive scoring despite the high number of switches onto guards he gets.
Rudy Gobert will fit nicely on the Mavericks imo
Warriors? xd
Nice backup for luka
If he could put up 15-20 points a night, on top of his defense, he'd be an all-time great.
@@CheckUnderYou he averages 15 points per game already lol
Great insight, channels like yours have brought me back into loving the sport where normal sports things like espn have always disappointed
There has been very unfair times for Gobert. Im not a fan of his, but the easy narrative surrounding him is nearly cruel - and a great proof that 99% of the NBA "specialists" on the TV are trash, just say the easy talk.
The Utah's perimeter defense is absolutely shit. None of their defenders can even STAY IN FRONT of their matchups. It makes things almost impossible to Rudy, because he is always needing to cover all the defensive court.
I'm pretty happy that we have analists like you, wich try to go beyond the obvious when it comes to read the game. Amazing!
The worse part is that the TV analysts just parrot it because its easier to 'see' it and as much as the casual fans don't want to, they still do because they aren't really seeing the game that way. They aren't seeing the missed help rotations from Bogy and their flat footed wings. They aren't seeing Mitchell, Conley and Clarkson become NY subway turnstiles and they get passed on by bigger ball handlers. They just see the end part where Rudy is always the last line of defense and thus the scapegoat to the defensive breakdown.
Please release as much contnt as prossible my guy. So good as always
You can't expect the centre to be on all sides of the court. Shaq wouldn't be guarding a three, Joel doesn't guard the three. They mostly stay in the post while the other 4 are switching.
I love the subtle slander on Nick Wright at the beginning.
This is exactly how the mavs planned it. Attacking their guards and causing gobert to rotate with that 5 out set.
in game 6, he gave his team a chance to win after an exceptional defensive stop on Luka, only for it to be rendered moot by a Conley travel and Bojan bricking a wide open game-winner. just painful to watch.
The problem is the guards lazy defense of just funneling everything to gobert but in playoff gobert isnt in the middle he guarding the corner so if he help the corner is open if not the lane is open
Born and raised in Utah. Not easy being a Jazz fan because it’s always like this - a few good pieces but there’s always an achilles heel that becomes our undoing.
Well we now get to see Gobert somewhere else that clearly puts a lot of value in having him so we’ll see ho he does with the wolves
At the very least it's easy to see when someone doesn't actually know basketball: if someone goes and says that Gobert is the biggest hole in the Jazz defense, you know they didn't watched the game nor know a fig of basketball (like most media analysts).
Every time you point out simple strategic deficiencies the jazz have, they quit or just say you're using ''numbers''.
Fam, saying the Jazz can't make a single rotation is not using numbers lmao
Hell they can't even keep Brunson or Dinwiddie in front of them for two seconds lmao
@@dask7428 THISSSS. Its a simple matter of size matchups. Neither tiny ass Conley (6'0 175) or Mitchell (6'1 210?) are keeping out those two bigger playmakers (Brunson is 190 PHYSICAL and Dinwiddie is 6'5 205) at the perimeter. I watched the Celtics/Nets series and whenever I saw Marcus Smart (6'3 220) get a 1v1 matchup vs Kyrie (6'2 190?) he wasn't trying to shoot it over him. He was running at him and PAST him to the basket.
I've always said it's the Jazz defensive scheme and guards that make Rudy look bad.
People really expecting Gobert to be like Murasakibara who covers the half court from Kuroko No Basuke. Damn
How are they all so bad at recovering? It’s kind of amazing
New Thinking Basketball masterclass.
I’ve cited your other Rudy Gobert video countless times in arguments about his defensive impact in the playoffs.
I watched the Jazz a lot because Juwan Morgan is a friend of mine. The defense the Jazz ran left Rudy in bad spots all the time
Who’s here after the Wolves traded for him?
Gobert is the most overhated player in the league rn. The Utah Jazz's defense was exposed not because Gobert wasn't good enough, but because Gobert's greatness covered up the glaring flaws. When the 4 other dudes out on the court with you all fail to do their jobs, one guy can only do so much. It's like people expect him to be literally everywhere at once.
Sounds more like a coaching issue, the roster is obviously talented. They just need a coach to guide them in the right direction when things aren't going good
Yeah, and Donovan Mitchell also needs to start playing some fucking defense
This really changed my point of view on Rudy's defense, nice video.
For all the discourse about Rudy's defense, I feel like his offensive deficiencies are what actually impact Utah. His inability to consistently attack switches, or really do anything at a high level outside of the paint besides set screens, is a pretty big detriment especially if their perimeter players aren't hitting.
His offense does hurt but he is the only defensive minded person on the Jazz and if Utah would learn to play good help defense and rotate then they could hide is deficiencies
THIS. You're comment should get pinned.
I don't think it's his fault either... I mean, when you're not receiving the ball enough you're not going to score.
Because of Donovan Mitchell and all the shooters in Utah...
If they couldn't made the offensive adjustments trying to get involved Gobert on offense, who's the fault for that?
@@JulioLeonFandinho Nah Goberts always had butter hands.
Hard disagree.
Rudy does his role well offensively. The Jazz has an all-star and other sub-all stars that fill the role of primary ball handler, Rudy doesn't need to have these iso skills. He's very efficient at rim-finishing and thats awesome value-add.
Its a weird nitpick to go after Rudy's offense when hes consistently playing at DPOY levels. Its just unreasonable to expect a player to be perfect at all aspects of the game. Its like saying Jokic or Curry needs to become a monster defender because they lack defensive impact. They already add so much value on offense and their defense isn't even a massive issue. Same thing applies to Rudy. He has a solid value add on offense because of screen setting and efficient rim finishing but the lion's share of his effort goes to his defense.
There's an bias towards offensive-oriented players because its easier to quantify their impact; points, TS etc. Defensive metrics are not as accurate so defensive-slanted players tend to get overshadowed; like what you did just now.
4:04 gotta love that screen
Jazz defensive downfall is just a combination of the opposing team being smart enough to play small to take Gobert away from the paint, Donovan and Bogdan getting blown by on literally every play, and poor defensive rotations after someone has to bump down to guard the blow by/roll man.
It makes me angry how bad defense Donovan Mitchell was playing and people blamimg Gobert
The jazz perimeter player can't stay in front of their man it's as simple as that
Chicago would be a perfect fit for Rudy defensively. When healthy, Lonzo and Caruso are 2 of the best point-of-attack defenders in the game. Drop coverage wouldn't as big of a problem with guards adept at fighting through screens.
In conclusion, much like the MVP award, DPoY comes down to the rest of the team's relative ineffectiveness, which won't go far in the post-season and lead to the superficial conclusion that said player is the one at fault and not the rest of the team.
never seen a guy who gets supermax money get defended this much in the comment section. This video gives context tho so well done
Easy, because people predicate supermax money with PPG averages that's it, they think Defense is something "extra" and not a half of the game.
THANK YOU!!! Gobert isn't Utah's problem. if Gobert was in Powell's position we would be talking about him a lot differently. When it comes to his DPOY status, it's a fault on the NBA. The NBA has an issue of how different the game is between regular season and the playoffs. Rim protection wins regular season games, but point of attack defense wins playoff games.
Thank you for posting this. Without good penetration defense, there is nothing any shot blocker can do. We saw it last year with KP (and everyone unfairly blaming him for Dallas' Defensive woes) and this year with Gobert. You can't have a sieve at the perimeter and then end up blaming the big man who is just trying to prevent everything from being a layup. It is not the coach's fault, it is certainly not Gobert's fault; it is the diva guards and wings who refuse to play defense. Case in point, see the impact of Reggie Bullock + DFS together on the Mavs' defense.
As a Nuggets fan, this video kind of gets at what I've seen with the Jazz repeatedly. Rudy is not the problem. He's a great defender. But there's not another positive defender on their roster and he can't put out all the fires. The Jazz make this worse because they never let him punish switches in the post against small guys, which hurts their offense when teams go small as well.
Holy that move by Brunson at 7:30 was lethal
To me the biggest problem that Utah has defensively is that it is not versatile nor does it change. They play the same coverages that they do in the regular season when they get to the playoffs. At that point, the other team is focused on picking apart that set of coverages and Utah does not change. The PR problem that Gobert has is that he is the face of Utah's defense. So, he takes the blame for it. What I can't tell from the outside is if it is a personnel issue (they can't do anything else) or a coaching issue (they won't do anything else). But I think the Warriors exposed this in the last couple of weeks in the regular season. Putting Gobert in the P&R with Klay when he is on and staying in drop coverage in Klay's own words is "stupid". Have to try something else.
I notice that Quin Snyder and Mike Budenholzer seem inflexible in the sets. So they go eliminated in the playoffs in spite of great regular season teams.
But Coach Bud adapted after 2 seasons and won a ring.