Calling a nerf on a weapon based on a beta is insane to me. Maybe the devs changed the weapons for a reason? It's obviously worked like that to compensate for the monster's moveset. Similar to Rise, the weapons are faster and stronger because the monsters in that game are also fast and strong. We can't just call for nerfs just because it seemed strong based on a beta.
Nah it's smoothing out *(it's true for all the weapons btw) the moveset as a goal to fight fairly against the monsters they're gonna throw at us later on Edit: * Almost all weapons
@@MultiRv90 But that's exactly the point of the beta? The devs had it tested early to receive feedback from the more general populace and not just QA testers. Is a weapon too strong? Is it too weak? Does this combo work well? Should we change how the combos are bound to the controller? What about the performance settings? That is literally what the beta testing is for, for the devs to get a general feel of what their players want and see how they can implement said feedback into their own vision of the game
I've seen someone say you can change the keybinds through steam itself to make it easier. Wish I had thought of that when I played. That said, I put changed controller keybinds in my survey, I bet many others did too
Yeah seriously, they need to rework how that weapon controls massively, i should NOT be required to do a claw grip every time i want to do a basic combo.
I think this is the only ok-ish buff the weapon got tbh. That and being able to cancel out of helmbreaker is a blessing, and I hope they never go back on that.
@@hiddensinix2767 that's not even remotely what the drawback of helmbreaker was tho. The drawback was the long as shit jump animation on which u cannot do anything about monster attacks. That is still in the game
Not quite, the drawback of previous HB is locking you into the 2-3 second animation. if you missed you still went down to yellow bar and would need to build back to red. It was high risk high reward. They've removed a lot of the risk. LS users can now spam HB and simply cancel if you think you'll miss.
HH shouldve gotten ear plugs in the echo bubble. Considering that its a source of sound, I dont understand how it doesnt reduce the effects of other sources of sound. The only real issue is how the offset lacks any sort of rewards, where every weapon has a follow up, HH has to get its offset again after using it and gets nothing to follow up with after landing it. Other than that its nearly perfect, mwah.
Exactly, I think that's what a lot of people saw when World was announced. QoL and streamlining the game experience are very different than removing every inconvenience. People don't understand what I mean when I say that things like having no access to your storage items DURING a quest is a good thing, there's no commitment in MH games anymore.
@rohan68842 It's a very tired conversation, and for better or worse, this is the accessible direction that's been chosen for the series. Wilds tripling down on the decisions which made MH surge in popularity shouldn't surprise anyone. Thank god emulation has netplay AND comes in 60 fps 😎
@@Minizor27 It truly is tired. There's little you can say to sway someone who views your critique of buffs and streamlining as thinly veiled elitism or a dislike of fun. Like from my perspective I just genuinely have less fun when the game pressures me less than it used to and would enjoy it more with higher tension. But It's super hard to convey that to someone who has an entirely different world view on what makes games fun.
I agree with a good bit of this but this is not a long sword exclusive issue, all of the weapons have had many of their weaknesses smoothed out or removed, hopefully the monsters later on will be more complex to compensate for these changes
@@thicphic7734 as a Main of all weapons I totally agree 💯 but tbh the Executive director already said in an interview that each weapon has skills that help refine each weapon and that balance is a major factor they already thought about I think 🐁 is putting the trap before the cheese lol
@@ramontavaresdacruz2256 it depends on each weapon certain monsters are designed to punish players especially in G-rank/Master Rank for example a Monster punishing you for mounting constantly or an IG that is always in the air!
I'm sorry you feel this way, but it is supremely satisfying to see people who started with World coming up with the same complaints about Wilds that many who started before had about World, after so many years of just being told we were wrong about our complaints.
I read an article on "let people enjoy things" it lists what you're describing as a natural consequence of people actually taking media as part of their identity, so they get insulted when said media is "insulted" (To them at least).
@@inanefabas4402 yeah it's what can happen when society isn't built to encourage community & social engagement. Rather than developing personality around how you interact & care for others you attach it completely to insignificant things like inanimate objects or subjective media. Personally I can empatheticly understand this behaviour due to being rejected by (a bigoted) society; & needing to build self worth & personal values off of anime 😅.
Removing "pain points" from the moveset that leave players vulnerable is something that they've been doing with every weapon, not just Longsword. Like I'm not the biggest fan of some of the changes either, particularly the hyper armor and damage reduction on Spirit Thrust and Spirit Release, but these are universal design philosophy decisions, not Longsword specific decisions. If we don't like it, then we don't like the current direction of the series, not just a specific weapon. Greatsword has how many ways to instantly transition into TTS now? Bow doesn't even need to aim now. Dual Blades has three separate cancel windows out of Blade Dance. Pretty sure Lance got some hyper armor despite already having a shield that lets them block anything and everything. The list just goes on. The changes they made to ISS from Iceborne to Rise were because its original implementation discouraged people from even using the move in the first place, on top of the move just being unreliable. It was less damage than Helm Breaker, messing it up would cost you the resource needed to perform Helm Breaker, and setting it up was just too slow in many cases, so it was almost always a bad option. Rise made the move more reliable, more rewarding, and more cohesive with the rest of Longsword's kit. In terms of punishment, doing pitiful damage on an early counter and being left wide open, or eating shit on a late counter are punishment enough and perfectly in line with how similar options are treated. The cost is your HP bar, in a series of games where monsters can easily chunk players for 80% of their HP, and since Longsword is the counter weapon assigning more cost to its counters is antithetical to the design goals of the weapon.
Most of the pain points removed weren't weaknesses with the weapon, just QoL buffs. Like horn getting more input bypasses (it had two before, now it has others which have their own advantages and disadvantages) and Insect Glaive got focus melee attacks giving easier aimed extracts, but at the cost of the buffs meaning less and now having the gameplay loop of SAED instead of old IG, Hammer had charge level 3 changed to one big hit making damage frontloaded for your main poke damage, and great sword has focus mode aiming, but you still need to time it right. CB even got its savage axe mode limited to focus strikes and now has a longer time to get to SAED, but it seems phials are just naturally focus 3 levels now, and they can charge higher than 5. SWAXE can now roll out of wild swing, but is still requires hyper-aggression and charging the weapon. I didn't play enough of the other weapons in either the beta or previous games to talk about them, but 6 out of the remaining 13 is pretty close to a majority
Maybe I simply haven't explored enough, but greatsword still has only the tackles to skip to TCS, that and TCS was nerfed in favor of making the other slashes before it do more damage
I've always found the appeal of MH to be an inherit weakness that we as hunters possess against monsters. Out-thinking and out-preforming monsters was where the thrill was at, and every attack had to be measured carefully or punished accordingly. Seeing the trend towards more powerful hunters with more power and survivability hampers what I personally enjoy about the series.
I've always found this notion strange, since monster have been getting progressively stronger as well to match that power, yet everyone decides to ignore cause people forget getting better at a game is a thing
@@anormalhumanhopefully8570 You are right, but I think my point still stands. The series used to be more methodical and slow paced, giving the games a very different feel. I didn't say the newer games were bad, just that they appeal to me personally less.
Oh you know its bad when the longsword main says "please nerf longsword" But i get it, to me the most bs thing is that you now have hyper armor on the helmsplitter thrust, hyper armor on spirit release and you can counter while on seikret as well as now being able to foresight cancel attacks.
Still having hyper armor is not necessary a good thing especially when monster do combo heavy hitter. If one hit knock you out then you won't take damage until you get back up but if you have hyper armor then you will eat next and next attacks as well
you in fact do not have hyperarmor during the thrust. I PERSONALLY experienced this lie. You have hyperarmor during the spirit release after helmsplitter, you do NOT have hyperarmor during the thrust.
Insect glaive was the sore spot for me in the beta. I really only got into monster hunter when world came out. I've played limited amounts of other mh games (not rise) so take this as you will but many seem to agree from what I've seen online. Insect glaive is much more grounded now, and requires very difficult inputs to play optimally, encouraging you to hold the focus button very often and also charge attacks while pushing other buttons for the combos. The focus is much more on gaining and spending extracts through charged attacks, rather than staying airborne, mounting monsters, and dashing in and out. It's still a very mobile weapon compared to others, but long air combos are gone, allowing only for a single string of attacks in the air. The infinite combo is gone as well, making even grounded play feel a bit strange. The weapon is still valid but feels like a different weapon and is difficult to play optimally due to all the button holding. Hunting horn, my secondary choice, is even more fun now though. I hope we get L2 spin combos on better horns. It's fun to input melodies fast when making a bubble or breaking a wound, but the multi input 8th note often doubles one of the inputs during the bubble or wound breaking, resulting in an extra note, ruining your combo effect. I'm excited for full release and I hope they consider community concerns about their favorite weapons. Someone not able to enjoy their preferred playstyle could mean that they skip this game.
Good IG gameplay was never aerial in world, the only good part of being in the air was just to instantly do the dive move, being grounded and doing dives was where all the damage was. Rise did make aerial ig do damage but I thought it was obvious that wasn't going to carry over since in 4u and gu it was also just meant for the jump to be for the occasional cheeky dodge and gapclosing
@@808pitfallseed As I got better with IG in world, I did tend to spend much more time on the ground. However, dashing though the sky got me through some of the tougher fights on my first playthrough and is very fun. I know that a lot of the veterans are optimistic about IG in the full game so I trust that they have better insight than I, but the playstyle I've grown accustomed to seems to have changed enough to put HH as my new top spot.
The PVE argument was always a weak one. PVE still needs to be balanced for maximum enjoyment. If one weapon is safer than other options while doing more damage, playing riskier weapons will feel worse as you will no longer feel rewarded for playing them. If other weapons are buffed up to be the same level of power, it risks the game feeling too easy/braindead. People who uses this excuse always conveniently ignore that balancing is a huge reason why these games remain enjoyable. If you were a veteran, you wouldn't have much fun if they kept every fight on the level of a Great Jagras, that's why monsters are balanced to progressively challenge your skills.
Here's a suggestion from a lance main that might not be popular for LS mains, but the point behind it needs to be brought up: how about all of LS's counters only reduces damage rather than making you invincible, maybe counting as a guard and taking that much damage? After all, while I'm happy that we gained perfect guard, we still take damage when doing it, yet it has like a quarter of the active frames compared to LS's counters. How come LS gets easier counters despite it being a fast moving evasion based weapon that gains full invincibility, when the counter specialist's counters are far harder to execute while taking damage doing them, while having almost zero mobility in comparison? Lance have a new counter attack that is only accessible after executing a three attack combo first, then you have to charge it to do decent damage. How come that insanely difficult to execute counter still has lance take damage when LS doesn't? Sorry for the griping, but it's just weird how insanely good and easy LS's counters are despite being a weapon at the highest tier of evasion, and yet the weapon is made even easier to show off with.
ikwym lmao but that's def a lance moveset problem and not a longsword one, it seemed stronger in wilds but idk I never played lance that much to be able to tell..
i found ls to be super effective in wilds beta. i loved it. im sure the game gets harder and monsters will punish the counter flip attack thing at higher ranks. i trust the team at capcom. they know more about the full experience than we do currently. but it is fair to critique this part of the game.
I disagree that it should take damage on counters. I agree that the window is way more lenient than lance. Lance shouldn’t be as punished because of it’s block. It’s hard enough already to be effective with the weapon.
I'm also an exclusive Longsword main, and while I'm not as upset as you, there are definitely things I don't think we needed. I don't mind the additional cancelling between moves, but Spirit Charge seems wholly unnecessary. We already had multiple ways to raise Spirit Level, and Spirit Charge feels like the biggest shortcut of them all. I also dislike getting more hyper armour. If Longsword is the counter weapon (which I love), then lean into the counters. In most games, counters are high risk, high reward, but they're also usually the one defensive trick that kind of playstyle/class has. Hyper armour undermines some of that specialisation (and satisfaction of timing) by letting us tank more stuff recklessly, like a berserker playstyle or something.
@@RoaringTide I don't mind spirit charge but I also see your side of it tbh thing I hated about LS was knocking down a monster and not even having 1 level of spirit charge so you couldn't take advantage of it I'll be interested to see what skills benefit our spirit gauge the directors have stated each weapon has skills that will benefit using different weapons for example lasting power/longing power
I dont think LS should lean to heavily on counters as they can easily become repetitive and make the game kinda boring. And honestly some of the most fun I have had with the weapon is when seemlessly weaving combos and avoiding attacks without having to spam foresight slash to do it. P.S Also the whole counter weapon moteif is slowly turning my favorite weapon into a over the top and obnoxious anime weapon, I mean the mount finisher in wilds literally just makes you Virgil from DMC.
We have no even experienced a quarter of the game. probably not even 10%. people need to stop making such hasty complaints especially when asking for nerfs instead of fixes because it is highly likely that monsters will be harder than they have been previously. which is why they have given us these tools like focus mode and adding a counter, clash, or adept dodge option to almost every single weapon in the game. In the past i may have agreed with Rat. But he is WAY too premature to be talking about anything regarding nerfs and honestly hes a bit of a clown to think this was a good thing to put out there.
@TheCosmicAstro- totally agree 💯 with that wait until the game is out for a month before asking for nerfs it doesn't make sense we haven't even faced Lala Borina who could punish us
@@Pyroxene-W7F It's crazy but my approach to and enjoyment of LS is literally 180 degrees from yours. I think combo management gameplay is way less engaging than learning a monster and being able to foresight/iai their moves with ease. Using both is critical to slaying, but once you have downloaded a monster 100%, the counter gameplay is so much more enjoyable to me than just papercutting it to death while I watch my spirit gauge change colors. Not saying your way is wrong, it's just cool to see someone who enjoys the other side of the coin.
My impression is that the LS went from "too limited in what to do next" into "too many options to choose from"... But be able to keep attacking after last spirit slash is pretty fun ngl.
I LOVE the changes. I always hated how you got locked into sheathing after round slash, it feels so much more fluid and didn’t at all feel cheaty to me. Idk what this guy is on about. Sounds like he is thinking too much into it instead of just having fun
I mean since world the weapon has had more options on what to do next than other weapons. That isn’t an issue. In fact it’s a good thing. The issue is most of the options are good in almost all situations. This means you won’t be punished for making a worse decision. If the decisions you have lack meaning then you lose any sense of achievement when you make any decision as most of them end up with you doing insane amounts of damage regardless. This isn’t the only weapon that has been given more options that has effectively reduced depth. IG also has this issue. At least IG doesn’t make all your decisions good but it makes one option so strong that it makes most of the move set irrelevant.
Some people are saying "But they're removing the limitations from all the weapons", but that just isn't true. Here's a few examples. Switch Axe: -Performing a Wild Morph below the Sword Gauge threshold no longer replenishes a bit of Gauge to put you into Sword Mode. Instead your hunter now abruptly stops after the axe swings and reloads. -Reloading no longer replenishes Sword Gauge at the start of the animation, now requiring the animation to entirely finish. -Using all your Sword Gauge no longer allows you to roll and do an axe morph attack, instead forcing you to perform the standing morph animation. -No directional morphs after a roll anymore -Counter does not work on roars, you take massive chip damage AND STATUS from the attack you counter SnS -Backstep no longer able to be smoothly performed in every direction after a roll -Rising Slash from guard removed, a useful combo starter -Guard/Roll to unsheath now too clunky to be useful -Sheath speed nerfed (???) -The ability to turn your hunter's direction mid-combo has been given to all weapons via Focus Mode Lance is much clunkier now too. Meanwhile LS has had all its limitations straight up removed. Capcom wants to turn it into the ultimate baby's weapon
Is “give ls more counters🥺” something u parrot every day before sleep until you believe it? Because almost every weapon in wilds got a new counter EXCEPT LS So what’s your end goal here?
@@zultar7787 LS's dismounting attack is literally a counter lmao, "except LS" my ass. Said counter also give you a spirit level. Helmbreaker finisher with better motion values than a full TCS, cancellable helmbreaker for free...
Pointing out that a lot of other weapons have hyper armor and safe counters now isnt necessarily a good thing people... You're basically describing homogeneity. Dont get me wrong, I have no doubt that the later monsters will absolutely be designed around this... But if the game is heavy on focusing counters, and the weapons all have a low skill cieling, then theres a risk that fighting these monster with different weapons wont feel as dramatically different from eachother. And weapon variety is one of the core tenants of Monster Hunter, its the feature that sets it so far above its competitors.
@@hakuryu5874he didn't say counters, he said counters and hyper armor while also alluding to general qol changes that everything gets. if your goal with a weapon is to swing swing swing then power through an attack you are describing half the weapons gameplan now. right now most of them are just use the strongest move it has on repeat and the hunt is significantly easier and ends faster than trying to use the whole moveset. it's already homogeneous for most weapons and hopefully not the final version of them
@@petercottantail7850 Are you purely in the field of ideas, or have you actually fought every monster with every weapon in the demo? Because i have, and i disagree.
(for prospective sake, im a lance main) i was with some friends and i talked about the longsword in wilds and how it felt it was too easy to start being effective with it (due to being able to access foresight at any moment). Afther a bit i was thinking that for atleast the foresight slash the hunter would simply still get damage, but for it to be all in recoverable health (red health), which is similar to the valor sheat in generations if i do recall correctly, which would make it similar to lance getting chip damage but still give an option to keep going if the player is good enough trought other means of evasion and allow the player to have to choose wether or not its worth to bring skills that take advantage of the red health (as example recovery speed to let you go into counters more ofthen and strife as in getting power from it) allowing the player to customize and adapt basing on their adversary.
GS mains here. Focus mode aiming removes one major layer of GS intricacy and dumbed it down. sad but unlikely to be removed. It removes part of the satisfaction of making the right prediction of monster moveset and proud of your mastery of the weapon. but not as sad as how tcs feels weak in animation without the hit stop animation and special effects from world.
Tcs has actually been nerfed damage wise and they buffed every other move damage wise other than the tackle. This means they probably realised focus mode made tcs too easy to land. They’re probably trying to rebalance the weapon to make the decision making process more like trying to decide what move would be optimal dps in your opening and not how can I get tcs off in this scenario. What in all fairness is more it’s old identity preworld. I think this was definitely the best option they had with both the even faster monsters of wilds and the addition of focus mode.
The hitstop absence thing is bs, it is only absent if you hit an armored part of the monster, I just checked my clips, and TCS hitstop is present and is enormous when you land a hit on a vulnerable part or a wound, and tbf, I much prefer this type of hitstop.
@soloman8059 It’s not absent but it is reduced from world and any of the pre world games. Also the lack of blood on any non wounded part also isn’t great. That was a problem in world too though.
@@porkwhisperer3050 well, for better or worse I am not sure if they're gonna change those things significantly going forward. But yes, the impact of strikes was much more significant in older titles, I mean, in 4th gen GS charge shook the screen and literally sent waves of dust in the air.
This is very common in games with multiple classes or weapons. The developers feel like they have to constantly make every weapon stronger from one game to another, thus eventually making it overtuned because nothing can perpetually get stronger each installment. Also, not every weapon needs new moves or buffs. One of my more beloved weapons, the charge blade, is fine as is. World's CB was perfect. I wouldn't bat an eye if they didn't buff it or change it at all in the next 10 years. So, most of the changes in the long sword aren't really necessary. World's LS was just fine.
What they should do is just add more moves but not op ones. Increase the complexity and skill ceiling of all the weapons but don’t just add judgement cut to the end of a helmbreaker and give everything hyper armour it’s so dumb
@@joesheridan9451 You can't just add new moves forever. You'd either have to remove old ones or make combos so ridiculously long that you would never finish them.
@@joesheridan9451 That's cool, but also nothing to really do with what I said. Monster Hunter isn't a spectacle fighter like DMC. You can't have a 20 hit combo string with a different attack on each input because no monster in existence is going to A.) stand still long enough or B.) not punish you for just spamming attacks. It is not even remotely the same game so the comparison is pointless.
@@PlusOne2Crit I'm not saying it should be like dmc I'm saying you can use controller inputs in creative ways. I'm not talking about loads of infinite combo's because yeah that wouldn't work in this game, I'm talking mostly about things you could do from neutral. or just options in cobos to reroute it type of thing... Everything I'm talking about they already do anyway. Stuff like perfect rush, saed cancel into aed, backhop from neutral on the sns, power guard... The swaxe's whole moveset lol. I'm just saying they should go even further but with utility moves not always broken op finishing moves
Well said (Also a LS only player since freedom). Just to play devil's advocate though, we have no idea what changes they made to monsters. In fighting games, there are plenty of series that have gone through this same process and characters have had all their weaknesses removed. You were then only asked how you want to play the game, not what weaknesses you want to have. Then weaknesses came from the player, not the character when you failed to master skills your character specialized in. (If you've ever seen like TAS gameplay of SF3, then you'll know that everything can be parried and countered, and that entire gameplay philosophy created one of the greatest fighting games to date.) If the monsters become so fast, deadly and complex that having access to everything, always, is a necessity, then I welcome the change. Truthfully though, I hate that counters from the katana avoid beam explosions and stuff... some stuff should just hit no matter what and the proper defense should be to sheathe and do jump and dive.
Ngl... I actually agree with everything here, especially your iss changes. I always wished it worked like you said where you gain on hit and lose on miss. I just feel like they overstepped with the weapon on a lot of points that just doesn't make it feel the same. Longsword is usually among my most played weapons but during the beta I think I actually use longsword the least out of all of them which is the complete opposite of what I would usually do. I mean I like the spirit release slash, the red gauge changes, and the directional Spirit combos. Other than that, it just doesn't feel as fun anymore...
i feel the same about what they did to hammer , simply giving the weapon a dash and removing half the move set has made an already simple weapon who's only real depth was to manage your placement well to not get hit while in front of the monster and charging into a completely thoughtless bonkstick , sometimes convenience is harmfull to a weapon's gameplay identity
Played hammer as well in the Beta: - never a fan of spinarooney charge mechanic, i find the animation wacky. - dont like the slinger dash, shouldve kept the power charge stance - to me, WorldBorne Hammer is the Perfect Version
@@nextgencombodrop378 agree on the first two points but i do prefer the rise moveset , wirebug moves excluded i feel like a lot of weapons in wilds got cool new stuff but : -hammer lost moves -got its old bread and butter move moved to brutal charge (which does look goofy) -got a dash -of all the moves they could have kept they kept the lamest charged attack as the 3rd charge
I would agree with those points if they were made about world. But it’s wilds. CB doesn’t need the shield charge to perform a UAED, great sword can aim its TCS while performing it, gunlance has two whyvern fires, bow has tracers and so on. This is just the new direction of the game. I’m not that big a fan of it either but I’d rather have this then just world 2.0.
that's a good point. I was in disbelief when I saw you could aim TTS and I'm a GS main. In all fairness though, monster hunter still has a reputation for having clunky combat, even now. they probably want to move away from that and make it play more like a character rpg like DMC or Bayonetta
We finally reached a point where you just fight the monsters instead of fighting the controls at the same time, and of course the vets find a way to complain about that
@@lurakin88 I don't want to fight anything, I want to HUNT them. There's no point in bum rushing a monster and destroying it with your obscenely overtuned weapon. Traps? Consumables? Elemental weaknesses? Food effects? Enviromental interactivity? What's any of that mean? Just press button 'till monster dies
Sadly if these "pain points" being removed for any weapon isn't to your liking then the game will likely not be, Both Ryozo and Yuya talked non stop at every event that they want this game to be less about commitment and loss of control for the player and they wanted the whole game to go by this philosophy, such as grappling resources instead of having to actually gather them and fast travel. This is consistent throughout. I hope you find your joy with the Horn bros.
LMAO, I see you deleted my comment. Not sure why, since I was hardly the worst person to say something here. But I'll reiterate it, albeit much more concisely; you completely ignored what Spirit Gauge actually does now to prove a point that it's worthless, this is misleading when it completely changes the moveset of the weapon like Dual Blade's, "Demon Mode," and I feel like your analysis of it being too easy to charge now along with other buffs is just faulty because it's clearly a deliberate design choice to bring it in line with Dual Blades because they fulfill similar roles. I personally think that the buffs don't change the dynamic at all nor is it braindead because you have new tools and freedom in the moveset, and will say again I feel like you are being just a bit butthurt that they're making your game/main weapon easier when no one is trying to devalue the work you put into it, just ditch the pretentious attitude like these, "solutions," of yours HAVE TO HAPPEN, in order for Wilds' LS to be good. A lot of us LS mains really liked the changes, myself included. Also you haven't considered how other weapons have been buffed as well, (probably because you don't play them...) or realized the changes might be because of those other buffs. My friend is a Greatsword main, and he tells me that with the Focus system he can land TCSes so much more consistently than before, so obviously they removed a lot of pain points on other weapons as well, to make them more consistent with their most damaging attacks. If they left all of the pain points with LS there would have been people complaining that they didn't touch it at all. So really, this feels like a, "damned if you do, damned if don't," situation, imo.
I agree I've always loved the style and maneuverability of Longsword but started to worry about the risk vs reward side of things when Rise made it so the Iai spirit slash could give you a charge instead of taking it away but now things are just getting ridiculous.
This comment section is dumb as hell and missing the point of the video. Balance in PvE games exists to offer variety to all players. If one option outclasses many others (I'm not saying LS outclasses EVERY other weapon, but it certainly is objectively better than Lance, Insect Glaive, and I'm sure a few others right now), then what's the point in using anything else? I've never played Longsword, likely never will because I love Lance too much, but it would be nice to bring all options closer together in power level. Lance needs buffs, yes, but that won't change that THE counter weapon is worse at its niche than Longsword is, which is ridiculous.
@@michaelmcdonald2005 I disagree as a Main of all weapons each weapon is objectively better than the other IG feels like a return to 4 Ultimate Glaive which isn't a bad thing also lance can guard almost every move of Rey Dau so I would say in the right hands each weapon can be outclassing even a LS)
@@drakeshotplaysmy issue with IG is that it feels even slower than 4U and now despite some QOL to gain extracts the process actually feels more interruptive now because you’re incentivised to blow them all on the rising spiral slash. not to mention the absolutely awful controller button mapping. also the IG has no perfect dodge/counter and vaulting puts you at the mercy of poor aerial hitboxes. i don’t want longsword to be bad, i want all the other weapons to get cool and fluid stuff like it
@tombmie I felt that same way as well but I save the rising spinning slash for certain situations it might feel faster on launch but I doubt it will be getting more changes possibly some new skills could help IG and the Kinsect buffs lasting longer or not blow it at all if certain conditions are met the Executive director who plays all weapons confirmed balancing will happen to all weapons withing the weapon skill tree and more
Everyone is overhyping up Longsword meanwhile Bow and Dual Blades can be near invincible, Sword and Sheild has full 360 mobility during attacks, every weapon has a Perfect Block or Counter. And i cant imaging how powerful things like Charge Blade can become with actual builds or Bow amd Dual Blades again when they get Elemental damage There are far more powerful weapons, but Longsword's rep sheet is obscuring those
I have to disagree and say that I think the weapon is in a great place. May be too easy to an experienced player but I think now it's more accessible and hope to see people not cart with it.
I don't deny that limitations help raise the skill ceiling but it's like this. However, much like every single full generation shift this series has seen, weapons become more fluid and mobility increases. This comes with a twofold buff to wyvern moveset and general mobility. e.g; If you take F2's hunting horn and dropped it into IB you'd have a bad time. Putting p3rd's LS into Sunbreak? Bad time Without seeing the actual end game of wyvern design we simply don't have enough information on knowing how the reduction of commitment will end up being necessary. Multiple weapons had this reduction. SnS can perfect block right out of perfect rush (where before rolling was the option). Lance, an already low commitment weapon, gets to perfect block out of every poke. Dual Blades' demon dance, traditionally one the most animation committed attacks in the game, is now tiered into 3 pieces. Even hammer is scooting about whilst holding charge forever. These changes and more when combined with new features such as offset attacks makes it seem as if the game is shifting towards a substantially more reactive playstyle. Which also means that Wyvern patterns also could change. In other words, if the weapons remain static, it could be like flinging AT Nerg into 2nd gen. Without the tools modern hunters have, this would create substantially more friction. Doshaguma, goober that it is, in it's last stand can recover from a flinch directly into another attack. Had things like DB's remained as they were, a player could be hard punished with no counterplay for performing the right action. Where as now a DB user can react as long as they're not on autopilot. There's potentially another side of this. Right now we can stink bomb away packs. But it's not unheard of for them to revisit ideas such as 4's paired monster migrations and/or paired monsters like the Seltas Queen. Traditionally in multi wyvern fights, large amounts of any given moveset gets benched. It's the reason Lance Charge getting so many options as the games progressed HAD to happen for the move to approach anything resembling usability. I don't doubt that they might have overbuffed. But it's something to consider that there might very well be a reason.
Here we go again. Jokes aside, I think I can agree that canceling spirit blade III with foresight slash is a bit much, but I don't really see the problem with the other changes. I'm not sure how practically useful its going to be to infinitely delay your spirit combo with normal attacks because the monster will usually start moving before long. It's an option on downs if you misjudge your spirit gauge I suppose but there are certainly better attacks the player could be doing on downs. Spirit charge has great utility but you're incredibly slow while you charge it, meaning you can't really charge it safely from a distance if your goal is landing the roundslash unless you're waiting for the monster to come to you, but usually that'll entail an incoming attack. It's better suited for larger openings or multiplayer when the monster has less heat on you, or if you want to utilize the downtime of the monster chasing somebody else to charge your gauge if you're not interested in landing the roundslash. It is an exaggeration to say that the gauge doesn't matter because several of the longswords options are contingent on having gauge. Your best defensive utility in foresight slash requires you to have some meter and drains all of it regardless if you exceed the minimum cost of using it. Your spirit combo still drains the meter, helmbreaker needs a minimum of white to even use it. Meter is still important, what's changed is that you have more options on how to build that meter depending on the situation. To put it in a true Jakob-esque analogy, you're still threading the needle, you just have the option on whether you're sewing a sweater or a hat. I'm sure you're against having access to those kinds of options because you like limitations, but at that point we're just talking about preference. If we're going to talk about the new tools and interactions longsword got in Wilds in the context of weapon balance, I think it's important to discuss the practicality and weaknesses of those options as well as their strengths, but this video only focuses on the latter. On that note, I'm not sure if I would call hyperarmoring through Rey Dau's strongest attack with helmbreaker for half of your health to be "safe". You are trading with the monster, for example at 14:40 you play the same clip 4 times of you hyperarmoring Rey Dau's big railgun attack. You spend your gauge on spirit release, miss the attack, and end up eating the railgun for half your health, as opposed to just going for helmbreaker and rolling to the side to conserve your meter and avoid getting hit. In this case you made a trade and lost more than you gained since now you're down two levels of gauge and are at half health. I don't see anything wrong with this interaction, you made a bad trade and got punished for it while gaining nothing when safer and more resource conservative options were available to you. There are certainly situations where the hyperarmor is strong like using helmbreaker on a roar, but it's up to the player to figure out which situations are appropriate to trade with since hyperarmor has its own weaknesses too (multihits come to mind). The quick sheathe argument is very misplaced in this video. This is a video about nerfing the longsword in Wilds, yet you're bringing up how a skill functioned in Rise as part of why longsword should be nerfed in Wilds when we have no idea of the degree special sheathe is affected by quick sheathe in Wilds. It could function to the degree it did in Rise where it was very substantial, it could also function to the degree it did in World where it wasn't very substantial. It's strange to me because your critiques before this point were all at least grounded within Wilds, but here you're just grumbling about a skill interaction in a completely different game instead of how it behaves in Wilds. All that said, I think it's far too early to suggest weapon balance changes when the monster and build selections are as limited as they are in the demo. I don't think its really appropriate to suggest balance changes based on performance against early game monsters in low rank where most options are going to be more applicable and inconsequential due to the numbers and speed of the monsters deliberately being tuned down, as well as their kits being more straightforward and easy to understand in the case of monsters like Chatacabra, Balahara, and Doshaguma since they are designed for the early game.
That's a keen observation you make regarding the hyper armor, especially given the interaction he shows in the video would probably get him carted on late game hunts, or even mid game hunts if he isn't at full health when it happens. It seems so obvious when you point it out, that I'm surprised it didn't occur to him while looking at that footage when he was editing the video.
I think one of the main things about this video though is that it's about weapon design based on other weapons. Longsword, despite being about counters, is originally designed around awareness and momentum. The Longsword was ALWAYS about managing your resources and combo structure since the second generation where it was introduced. Similarly, the Sword and Shield is versatile, Greatsword requires patience, etc. To make my counter-tangent short, what's being suggested here to to reintroduce awareness by forcing the player to actually care about their resources. The reason for the Rise example, like he said, was because it overshadowed the foresight counter, which matters. Invalidating the purpose of prior options to make a weapon easier isn't proper balance. And so far, Wilds seems to only invalidate the commitment other tools had in previous games. I think it's a finely place concern given how it relates to the video, he mentioned an example and said "here's hoping the developers don't do that again." Without losing the identity of the weapon, improvements and adjustments can be made to help strengthen the purpose of a weapon. Gunlance is unwieldy but sturdy, CHOOSING between offense or defense especially now that shelling can act as a sidestep which leads into more combos meanwhile Lance is still about precion and safe pressure by *combining* defense and offense. I wish I had more examples but besides the Horn, I did not get enough hours with Wilds other weapons to strictly say that they retained faithful design or improved the "schtick" of the weapon. Also Rey Dau's strongest move only dealing half your health in that clip is a godsend, notice how he could heal immediately after. Just needed to point out how that would happen if you got hit or even tackled through with the greatsword, bro got hit and healed in the same second. A small aside, but the damage reduction should ABSOLUTELY be adjusted.
1-"I'm not sure if I would call hyperarmoring through Rey Dau's strongest attack with helmbreaker for half of your health to be "safe" It is more safe then others weapon strongest attack + it does not matter he got hit he can just heal he has near infinite healing potions + Rey Dau dont attack after his big attack. 2-"The quick sheathe argument is very misplaced in this video." No its not . This video is for capcom about what he dont want to see in Wilds or what he wants to change and why. It does not matter evev if he sayd something from MH 2 . 3- "I think it's far too early to suggest weapon balance changes " Aganin no its not. Camcom them salfe sayd that beta is here fore feedback. Yes balance is different in beta yes ths were low rank monster and should he made this video absolutly.
@@theredcomet5670 Demo Ray Dau is probobly harder then most base game monsters so no. And diffivulty and balance is importat thrue full game not just endgame. You may have the opposite view but lickily your minority.
To be fair, these changes are not bad in a vacuum. Could be problematic, but I need to see how the new Long Sword interacts with the updated mid-to-late game monsters before I fully judge it.
1:02 "It's counter don't activate on the fly" I heard this while I play GU with Valor LS and I have to pause the game to stop laughing. XD EDIT : Thank ya'll for the opinion about Valor LS folks, It's nice to see a comment that isn't outright hostile. Which is rare after World become mega hit and it's all about META or Kick. XD Now for my opinion about Wild's LS. I love it as it is As much as I love Adapt/Valor counter in GU, I BARELY do counter in other game outside of that. I'm prefer to just add Evade Extender/Window and just roll around doing Sprit Combo over and over. Just keep up Red Gauge and go brrrr. Ya know like 3U days. It's not until GEN and GENU that LS becoming more of counter weapon. So this change in LS allowed me to be hyper aggressive while consistently dish out DMG as others who use counter playstyle. And it's still stay in LS main appeals, which to my opinion is "risk VS reward". Overreliance of anything can spell big red quest failed. There are now more way play LS than to just keep spamming counter, you now can being mobile with all direction Sprit Combo too. Which is encourage people who doesn't like to use counter to use it. Coz after all, people has different kind of what is "fun" to them. So to me, more options is good. Also, as someone who ACTUALLY fall asleep mid hunt using helicopter. I too love the LG's change. YA'LL SEE WHAT KIND OF STUFF PEOPLE PULLED OFF WITH THAT?!! THAT SHIT'S WILD!!!
valor parry is the hardest parry in monster hunter. It has same parry frames as regular iai slash at like 3 frames in 60 fps but you have to use it all the time
the problem with this comparison is that gu is much more demanding than world rise or wilds, so these advantages aren't just changes to make the game braindead, you still die if you don't pay attention to the monster and know your kit. basically what im saying is that the weapons can be broken but the problem is only noticable when the monsters arent threatening you.
to anyone who thinks "its just a pve game, why does it matter?", if something is outright better, more people will use it, especially in an age where youtube and meta are at the forefront of everyone's mind. the population of longsword players in pubs already dwarfs every other weapon type. if this longsword favouritism keeps going, monster hunter is going to become stale and 99% of players will be using the same weapon.
EDITED FOR BETTER ACCURACY- it's NOT outright better. the best Rey Dau kill times i have found are still nearly half a minute faster than the fastest Longsword kill time. The weapons with faster kill times I've seen have been HBG, GS, BOW, CB and GL. SNS and SWAX are extremely close behind, a couple of seconds. HM and IG a little further behind before the rest start reaching 30 second+ slower times. my point is- you are objectively wrong, but also it's beta. people are likely not experimenting with the less popular weapons for speedrun kills so their kill times are worse- so you're probably even more wrong than you think you are.
@@mrcrowe1848it blows my mind how much hate the longsword gets all the time when it has never been the fastest ttk weapon. The ranged weapons have always been hilariously overpowered, GS has always been the king of DPS, and yes LS keeps getting shit on for being the newbie weapon. It's ok for one weapon to be super safe and easy to play for new players. It's like people getting mad at Elden Ring for making magic overpowered and demanding it be nerfed because you can one shot bosses with a proper magic build. If you don't like it, you don't have to play it. The weapon might be braindead to you, but maybe a 40 year old dad wants to play MH after a long day of work and doesn't have 5000 hours to master a weapon.
TBH, I don't think any of this makes it worse or more braindead; I think it's the opposite, honestly. Is it OP? Yea, but it always felt OP to me, even before Wilds. The reason I think it makes it more complex is because there's more things to explore, more things to learn, and more ways to optimize, even if some of them are new ways and some of them are just straight up better than the old ways. The only things I agree and think the developers should take a step back on are being able to do foresight right after roundslash, and the 2nd thing is the hyper armor that Spirit Release Slash and Spirit Thrust have shouldn't be a thing or it should be less so that we have to time it perfectly and can't avoid multihit moves with it.
The longsword hate is the single worst thing about the MH community, it's not even in the top 5 weapons but because it's easier than other weapons people go haywire calling for nerfs.. During a beta..
@@blazeedge1631 Yes but dont you think there is a clear bias against longsword? i have been playing this game for many years now and no other weapons gets such hate in the community. if we look at the 3 most common reasons people complain about LS; 1. People think its to strong. I can easily list 5 weapons that are stronger; GS,DB,SnS,Heavybowgun,Bow and there is more thats just the most obvious once. (which is totally fine) 2.People say LS is to easy for how strong it is. I'd say that SnS and DB are on a similar difficulty as LS and they outperform it without a doubt, also having easier weapons in the game is a good choice by the devs given there is so many different weapons and playstyles it helps people to easier get into the series and Monster Hunter growing benefits us all the company will invest more time into the game the more profit it turns im always happy seeing new players enjoy their time. 3. People complain about the flinching of LS, and yes that can be annoying especially in the older games but the entirety of LS flinch gets negated by a single level of flinch free which since Monster hunter Rise has become very very easy to fit into your slot being a level1 deco. besides, every weapon flinches some way more than LS. to support my 1st and even partly 2nd point id like to point at 2 speedruns by Heavybowgun specifically in Monster hunter world on one of the most difficult Monsters, Alatreon. You can easily look it up they litreally took 31seconds to beat it. 31. seconds. and you may say okay thats cheated and they glitched it or something, their other run takes 2minutes and 6seconds. not a single weapon i've mentioned here can even remotely keep up with that dps output not even close, the monster genuinely doesn't even get to move it just gets perma flinched by the insane output of damage yet nobody would ever make such a video about Heavybowgun its only LS that is a problem when its somewhat upper midtier in survivability and damage, its absolutely hilarious how the entire community denies this bias with all this options layed out.
I’m pretty on the fence about my main weapon these days too. The devs are doing wonderful things with the ip in terms of atmosphere and presentation but I’m starting to wish I knew a bit about how they craft the identity of each weapon specifically so I can understand why they’ve done certain things. There are instances of brilliance where weapon move set design is concerned and largely it comes off deliberate in the design but for the first time, in wilds, I think I came across what seems like indecisiveness followed by what looks like having never resolved that indecisiveness but rather just kind of swept it under the rug. I still need to get my hands on the actual game and literally spend around 10 or even 20 hours of muscle memory building to be absolutely sure of anything but ultimately, I’m happy to see this kind of video! Respectful and productive discourse like this video should have a good effect if the devs see it. Really hope they do
we've only fought four early game monsters, new move-sets on weapon are likely balanced around future tougher enemies. long sword was very strong in the beta but maybe not so much in the full game. time will tell, cant wait to find out. too soon to call for nerfs or buffs though 😁
@@effthree7227 its perfectly fine to feedback for nerfs. That’s the whole point of the bloody beta. Why even have 14 weapons in the game when one weapon can do literally everything sans fire projectiles Not every weapon has gained the same degree of buffs, hell some are a lot worse than what they were only a generation ago
@@PowerfulSkeleton Nothing is about the core moveset is subject to change this late into development. Right now they're probably polishing the very end of the game and working on performance
I agree with most of this. I still think longsword gets the harshest criticism while other weapons that have an equally unbalanced risk/reward get to slip by. Almost every criticism of the LS there is, another weapon can do something similar or with even higher reward with lower to zero risk and it’s ok because it’s not the LS. There is definitely some extra popularity when bashing the LS.
Yes, but that is a consequence of its popularity, and the criticism comes from LS users as well, such as this video, of course it will result in a higher frequency of criticism, i dont want my weapon to be braindead spam to win and with such a high floor of what it can do that someone that picks it for 2 hunts is as effective as someone that plays it almost exclusively
sword and shield has more damage and more Iframes when doing the backstep and nobody talks about how busted it is because it's not a popular weapon, longsword hate comes mostly from people that just like to hate on what is mainstream just to be different, and people that are insecure about their own weapon because they see a beginner having a fun time instead of a harsh experience like they had before or still have lmao. LS def gets the most blind hate out of all the weapons just because it's a fan favorite. While still being the most popular weapon more than 80% of the playerbase doesn't play LS so the majority just hate for no reason.
@@yagopagliara8837 Yes people hate on LS, that is the price to pay for being popular, haters gonna hate or envy the weapon it is what it is, but you cant unironically put SnS higher than LS, the reach is trash, the damage is not really that high and to keep up with others you have to spam PR and cancel the finisher to restart, the commitment mid PR is also super high, equivalent to SPH but without the safety of the jump after the hit, now i'll give you that most people sleep on SnS but there is a reason why, it is not that good of a weapon all things considered, + LS trips others in MP, the hate is not all without its reasons
@@italoviturino6386 I personally think SnS is even more braindead than the LS. I used to be a SnS main in world. I've switched to the LS now because I play a bunch of weapons and change my main one often. SnS gameplay is literally spamming backstep and doing the strongest flurry move out of it, the dps is INSANE, and now that you can cancel that mid combo it's even more braindead cause most of the time you can stay under the legs of the monster without any real threat just doing crazy damage, and even if you can't backstep you can still block with an absolute MONSTER of a shield. Like I've said before in this comment section, I don't think all weapons are being dumbed down, it may seem like it, but I just think they are adapting to a new flow of the game and the harder monsters in the endgame will have to make us push the weapons to it's limits. Capcom imo almost never misses with movesets and weapons so I really trust that they are doing this for a good reason. Also the tripping is very annoying but I don't think it's still that bad.
Started playing mh in 2009 with freedom Unite. Always been a LS main. When iai counter came in worlds, I was 🤯. Now in wilds, more 🤯. I am all about the new change.
Wilds weapon design theory seems really weird, like you said about how people perceive Longsword being depthless and easy to survive with becoming more and more true, other weapons like Lance have had their identity crumpled, becoming extremely clunky and weird to use - these are both things that were not true previously, but they were widely SAID, often by people who don't play the weapons. Why does MHWilds weapon design seem to revolve around widely believed community /rumors/ of what a weapon's identity is, and not what they actually were in the previous games?
Not super toned down, it's similar if not even safer to play, and has less commitment for all of your attacks, except the special sheathe which is slower but that might change when we have access to quick sheathe. Basically Wilds removed all punishment for doing a helm breaker or spirit blade combo at the wrong time, those things aren't in Rise. And with the spirit charge you don't even need to land your counters or go through the full spirit blade attack you can just level up gauge for free. Rise had the sakura slash but there was a trade off with a very long 36 second cool down. You have to remember nearly every weapon was super powerful in Rise so everything is toned down but the longsword least so
Sadly there isn't much of a chance for this or any of the other things that make monster hunter separate from the other games in the series getting reimplemented. I love World and classic games, I think Rise is okay but I se myself placing Wilds below the games I have played. I guess I'll just play the old games and see if anyone will ever make a game that has the commitment, strategy, and immersive elements of previous games.
I wasn't able to try out all the weapons in the beta, but from what I saw, almost all of them received substantial buffs. Both directly and indirectly (thanks to focus mode). It probably means that the monster balance will be pretty aggressive, and I don't mind that at all.
Thats the big if right there. I am right with you. IF the monsters are buffed up to help mitigate the big increase in player power (especially with regard movement with focus and offset attacks and wound bursts etc) then this game could be the best MH yet. My only gripe is the lack of hit stop in some weapons and some weak sounding weapon hit effects that I hope they improve before release. My switch axe aint feeling nearly meaty enough for me other than that one big new move it has. lol.
This isn't even remotely true. Switch Axe and Charge Blade arguably got nerfed compared to World and Rise; Hammer is mostly a side grade imo and have you see what Lance players have been saying?
@@meathir4921 as I said, I only had time to briefly try out my favorite weapons, SA and CB are not among them. Personally I think this version of the lance is very smooth and fun to use (and is indirectly buffed by the existence of clashes and lure pods). Unfortunately, the new hammer combos didn't convince me much.
In Wilds, all weapons, without exception, are braindead. Some, like the Greatsword, LS, CB, and bow, do more damage than others, but the idea is the same. You can redirect a TCS 180° if you feel like it, or cancel the offset rising attack charge just by rolling!!! 😭 I don't care if people make fun of LS mains because, in the end, no weapon in the game now really has much commitment. Literally, the only problem here is the community looking for pathetic excuses to believe they’re better hunters than others just because they use a different weapon, when deep down, they’re all the same!!!
Dev here. We noted some of your key talking points. Truthfully speaking. We’re not going to change much upon the release of the title. Between world and rise. We’ve gathered a lot of key data to bring about a balanced gameplay experience for both veterans and casuals. Both parties should be able to have fun and fortunately long sword is a fan favorite. So we wanted more of the casual playerbase to be able and pick it up to have fun just like most other weapons. That being said. We have some special secrets planned for the endgame that will punish some of these changes so don’t expect the hyperarmor to save you every time! You thought we would add these changes without adding a caveat? (;
Damn I’m a hammer player and I thought the weapon changes they made were bangers. Hammer now just has a bigger bang attack and new ways of transitioning into charge and golf swing. Didn’t know they fucked up other weapons like this
@@RIP_ZYZZ1738 but this whole video is saying he isn't having fun. And I can guarantee you there are other longsword mains out there who also aren't having fun either.
The only bit I disagree with is actually giving Helmbreaker hyper armor PERIOD. We just went two full games of Helmbreaker spam being the default playstyle for Longsword, which in many ways rendered the entire idea of building Spirit Levels completely meaningless. It's so easy to build gauge with Foresight Slash alone, and once you hit red, you're Helmbreaker Gaming. For the most part you will spend little-to-no time actually attacking in red gauge. You look for the opportunity to spend it immediately, then wait for the chance to Foresight to get back to red. Rinse and repeat. My proposal would be this: Helm Breaker and Spirit Release slash should be just as risky as pulling off a full SAED. Remove the ability to sheath mid-air to cancel the attack, and remove all hyper armor from both moves. This should be for big openings only. My reasoning? Because they have done so much to incentivize you to STAY in red gauge! The new Crimson Slash combos are extremely fluid and have crazy mobility, on top of the Spirit meter being infinite. They should slightly buff the damage output of those attacks to encourage you to build to red gauge, and stay there for more than 2 whole seconds. Helmbreaker and Spirit Release are flashy and fun, but I'm honestly pretty burnt out on Foresight --> Helmbreaker --> Foresight --> etc..
A beautiful communist slogan. My family in the 1970s and 1980s had to get up at 3 a.m. to stand in very long lines in Poland to buy milk, meat, water which were sold in limited quantities and still on ration cards. Every citizen was limited in how much food they could buy, plus there was a limited assortment. People were buying jeans pants for their entire monthly paycheck. Today, communism has been gone in Poland since almost the early 1990s. Don't tell me about limiting things and how cool it is to be creative. Games exist to be fun, not to be a work. Not to be real world. If something is too strong then make it harder for yourself instead of changing the game for everyone who doesn't necessarily share your point of view. You can always cover your eyes or play on a dance mat. There are options. Just be creative, don't make others adjust to you.
@@NocnaGlizda communist slogan? it was a game designer who coined that term lol. in game design, limitations allow you to be creative in how you solve problems. if you don't want to solve problems ie gameplay, why play games instead of watch movies?
@@NocnaGlizdapolish people eat piss fish. Pizza was made by fucking peasants, carbonara was made from ww2 rations, garlic bread also made by peasants. Unchecked freedom leads to everyone doing the dame thing as humans are very average the creative stuff comes from people who were already creative due to limitations as limitations make people try to differentiate. Look at music for example its all very similar now that we have autotune and electronic instruments
Reasonable complaints, nevertheless the game will go gold in 2 months so nothing will change :( If the team wanted limitations, then they would have disabled chaining another special sheath after an ISS. Kept it like in Iceborne where after an ISS you were the most vulnerable, you couldn't do anything until the animation ended. Its all because they made Spirit Release Slash your strongest move now so you need to get back 2 levels to red insted of one. That inevitably alters the weapons loop. Thats why they made the focus strike gain a spirit level, which is in itself questionable. Every hunt opening is gonna be: sneak attack, hold R2 charge to get to white- ISS the roar 2 yellow -ISS to red- HB-SRS-ISS chain until back to red and repeat. They better not mess up Quick sheath.
you wont be able to sneak attack into charged spirit slash if you want to ISS the roar. you'll have to sneak attack and then time ISS or foresight slash with the roar, the charge takes too long. aside from that. Nothing will change but thats GOOD. nothing should change and nothing needs to change especially with how LITTLE we know about the game right now. Calling for nerfs this early before experiencing even 10% of the game and what it has to offers with gear, monsters and who knows what else is nothing but foolish. They have always given the player more fun things, buffs, QoL, etc, in every new main monster hunter game, but the monsters have always come up to meet the hunter. Theres no reason to believe this game will be any different. the changes on the majority of the weapons feel amazing, if people dont like weapons feeling good to play then they can go back to world or play insect glaive or gimp themselves however they want. You can make the game as hard as you want it to be by yourself. People cant make the devs give them back their QoL that was taken away because some guy on youtube complained.
@@TheCosmicAstro- "you wont be able to sneak attack into charged spirit slash if you want to ISS the roar. you'll have to sneak attack and then time ISS or foresight slash with the roar, the charge takes too long” Did you actually play the weapon in the beta? You can absolutely charge to white before the roar. Go watch some speedruns.
@LizdardKing86 i played the weapon quite a lot actually. The roar comes out fast. Maybe it's super tight timing. I could be wrong but from my experience it did not feel long enough between sneak attack and roar to get all 3 of those attacks in. Nonetheless the rest of my comment was the more important part anyway.
@@TheCosmicAstro-he literally does a sneak attack into spirit charge into holding a FSS in the video. you can go watch people like peppo to see them do the same thing with ISS instead if you want
In my opinion, I was personally disappointed by MHWilds. In the demo, at least. All of the marketing and fans saying, "It's like World but with rise spiced in there," was honestly just completely false. This game felt like MHRise jacked up even higher in terms of speed, commitment, and preparation which is all but gone in Wilds. (At least how it felt with the demo). Add onto this other things I did not like, such as removal of hitstun on nearly all weapons... I was very sad. I don't think I am going to enjoy this game so much, which is upsetting because I love every other monster hunter game. But this game... didn't feel like monster hunter anymore? Like they took everything out, early. It's just my opinion, though.
I don't think cancelling your Helmbreaker is that big of an issue, all things considered. The problem is that spirit levels are handed to you for free and you get hyper armor on helmbreaker with a nearly unmissable follow-up with also hyper armor. Gross
Except they inarguably gave Insect Glaive more weaknesses lmao Don't you love when they remove a chunk of your weapon's mobility and refuse to give it any counters? Keep in mind that literally EVERY melee weapon now has a counter except the IG Imagine they forced Longsword users into red bar before they could use Special Sheathe lmao. If they gave Longsword the IG treatment that could be reality
@ IG definitely got a rough rework. The bad controls are bad enough on their own. I’m a CB main but I also play a lot of longsword and too many weaknesses/not enough weakness can both feel shitty/boring. But also tying IG’s moveset to all 3 buffs is pretty awful.
I've been playing since freedom unite (GS main), and I think the wilds beta made me turn into a doomer. I've never bounced off a MH so bad than with this beta. I felt absolutely nothing while playing, I did not get my usual MH feel. To top it all, they completely butchered GS with focus mode, turning it into a boring, braindead and unsatisfying weapon. Who needs positioning, precision, monster and weapon knowledge, when you can do 180 turns mid swing ? WTF CAPCOM. Everything feels so safe and guaranteed in this game, you can cancel/block out of almost everything, you can always adjust with focus mode without any drawback. What is going on. That's not my monster hunter.
Yepp, just my thoughts. Games are losing depth and becoming one dimesnional laser shows. But the mass will say: "Doing cool moves is fun". It is so helplessly superficial...
@@criterion9801 I'm so mad man. It kinda feels like a betrayal. "Hey guys, you know that combat you loved for 15+ years ? Yeah so we just decided to kill it so more people can play the game, sorry ! The game is not for you anymore".
this is normal in game communities nowadays, people are extremely hostile to opinions of games, maybe because they base their personality around them or just general internet saltiness. in the helldivers community, you get ostracized for saying anything
Man, I'm completely onboard with your thoughts. I couldn't ever play the LS, never found the right time to use the r2 combo to go up the levels and in this beta a could easily beat Rey Dau just holding r2 and helm breaking, no counters needed
i generally agree with your takes but with the many different changes and quality of life updates on all the other weapons got, i doubt they are gonna nerf LS. nerf hyper armour on thrust, and im fine with everything else
Funny enough I stopped playing Rise because it was so easy. It was stupid easy. Now even more stuff has been smoothed out to the point where it just feels less, but still too much ease. I don't mind having more options & combos. But the weight of your choices in those combos need to have purpose. We aren't playing DMC. This is MH is basically how I would explain it
As a LS main from MHW, the biggest issues I see are being able to do Forsight Slash from any move and being able to keep your place in the Spirit Slash combo by merely doing random attacks. The other things you described such as fluidity of moveset after the final Spirit Roundslash and Spirit Charge are great QoL (plus Spirit Charge looks cool AF).
You are right about balance in PvE games. Specially ones where you have to grind for stuff. I'm fine with playing a weapon that is in the middle of the pack, but it's the worst feeling whenever the weapon that you have the most fun with is so much worse than the top tiers that you get the feeling that you're wasting your time by not playing a better weapon. Like I don't even main lance, but I think it's unfair that LS have access to so much quality of life and damage, while still having one the best defensive capabilities. Meanwhile, lance has to deal with it's clunkyness and extremely subpar damage just because it has a shield. As if holding block is all that you need to be EFFECTIVE with the weapon. I just wish they wouldn't focus solely on nerfing the top tier weapons, but also, buffing the lower tier ones. Great video as always!
I don't understand how people keep missing the point of balancing. If it doesn't matter then why can't we kill every monster in one hit. Challenging gameplay can be it's own reward.
Because even though the weapon is easier and more counter based now, you still have to perform with it and at least put some hours to master it's gameplay, as it is with any other weapon. People always like to pretend that their weapon is super complex when most of the weapons in this game are super easy to pick up, understand, and you can master the gameplay in a few days. I like the point about challenging gameplay but I don't think the weapon needs to have a bunch of flaws for the gameplay to be challenging. You can still have challenge with a weapon that has a safe moveset... The longsword in rise is even more safe than in wilds and go try fighting hazard zinogre or primal malzeno and see if you have an easy time.
Hes in the minority and apparently isnt saying its too strong, just that the extra freedom you now have with the weapon makes it less interesting to use to him. but most people are happy for all of the weapon buffs. Except for the 1 weapon that actually got mostly nerfed lol. Wilds is going to almost certainly have much harder monsters this time around so the buffs are most likely in line with this new difficulty. adding a longsword style counter attack to SWAXE is insanely strong. can be activated from neutral as well. Its awesome. its the best swaxe has ever felt. But if these people had their way theyd delete that too. Thankfully capcom listens to almost no-one so we dont have much to worry about.
@@kokujo5288 nice try but no lol. Welcome back. Longsword has had the counters for a long time and is balanced around that. Is a quick weapon, good rolls, Sheathes quickly. Sword mode in swaxe is super slow, bad rolls, sheathes slowly. The counter GREATLY makes up for these downsides. Youre comparing nerfing something a weapon has basically always had vs something brand new that makes up for a weapons previous downside. These are not comparable. Try again. I already gave you a nice, simple reply even commending the idea IF I agreed Longsword was too strong. Which logically, it isnt, until we can actually play the full game to know for sure. This goes for all weapons. For now let's just be happy the majority of weapons got fun additions and QoL and instead of being foolishly premature with nerfs, let's talk about things like performance and hoping they don't make end-game an RNG grindfest of nightmares again.
@@TheCosmicAstro- Do you hear yourself right now. You are advocating the downside of a weapon because "it needed it" yet will defend LS when it didn't need alot of what it got.
Yup, i can echo this as a greatsword main. Most of the weapons' difficulty came from having to carefully position yourself in order to hit the monsters, while having to find small openings to get your charges in. In Wilds however this is essentially completely removed. The ability to just...redirect your weapon anywhere is a nice bonus for most weapons but for GS it completely removes the skill floor and CONCIDERABLY lowers the skill ceiling. Oh and on a side note, not getting a SINGLE new move is INSANE to me.
@@ShikiRyougi05 Yes, same thing for perfect guard/clashes on GS. Some moves gained properties. The fact you keep your charge level through a successful shoulder tackle is already a huge buff. I don't think GS needed it, even less so with focus mode.
@Rytom i'm not trying to imply that GS seems weak, quite the opposite to me it appears extremely strong BUUUT i just wanted something new for the sake of being new lol, maybe rise spoiled me too much with all the cool things GS has there.
Longsword was never overpowered, even in base Rise it was outperformed by every ranged weapon, but y'all act like they just don't exist. It's not difficult to check DPS calcs and speedrun averages, Longsword is consistently mid. Lance was stronger in Sunbreak.
@@DogiTheWallcrusher Me when I spread misinformation on the internet. People have always complained about Longsword dealing too much damage, and then Capcom nerfed several MVs and its Spirit Gauge multipliers for Sunbreak. Let's keep the goalposts firmly in place.
balance in pve should be considered to put as many players as possible on the same field if 2 players like one weapon each, one weapon is op and the other is mediocre the monsters will cause disproportionate experiences between players, one will say the game is too hard and the other will say the opposite. besides, players have preferences and tastes, they shouldnt be punished because they didnt like a bowgun or the fav. weapon of the developers absolutely advocate for adeguate nerfs and buffs between weapons starting from long sword nerfs also i heard swaxe didnt manage to keep up as much, not high enough MV
as a HH player who's barely touched LS in the past, let me see if I understand the changes correctly: You can counter at practically any time, your strongest attack has both hyper-armor AND can be canceled out of, and interacting with the spirit gauge at all is now a minor, optional optimization instead of a core part of the moveset. And this is on what has been in recent games THE most popular weapon. Have I got that right? Because honestly it sounds like cheating lol.
Things like this makes me think that ever since Ryozo Tsujimoto became the series director, Monster Hunter changes always spiralled to this direction, he is a very unique marketing genius that his main concern always been maximizing the profits this IP did and claims it in every famitsu and game journalism interview in japan, he is more interested in the profitmaking than the game's identity. However he also knows how to force changes and still leave game making to the development teams, who know the best the feel of the game to make it more in tune with the series vision, a thing normal marketing focused executives don't do in videogames. Every change he's been a part with alongside his sideprojects always had one goal, expand it's audience and potential customers and he plays this careful game of always taking desitions as a series director of siding to what will make more money to what is right for the series and for the current consumers. Gameplay and weapon balance is one of the many desitions he pushes the game to make it more accessible to players which he knowingly know veterans will dislike but will complain for a while and tjen tolerate it at the benefit that it will attract even more players that didn't try or refunded the game and won't play it in the first place because "combat is too clunky" type negative reviews are taken as a feedback, for us is a "git gud" or "this game ain't for you". For Ryozo this is lost profit and here we have the changes. There is a lot, lot, lot more changes to the series behind the game making but this is one of many, i can tell the more and more westernized feel, ambience and narrative getting closer to AAA games with each gen, with Wilds being the current closest, their focus on graphics and less care for gameplay performance because console players care less about things and is a more profitable market that complains less about this things. And the deviation to off brand projects like, the Stories off shoot for the younger audiences and pokemon fans to attract them to main series, portable games for the mobile market, AR projects and even that awful movie, the series director been behind all this for only one purpose. Maximizing profit, and if our interest don't align or leverage against his profits he won't move a finger and ignore us, but that's just the way things are ever he became the series director.
World sold 25 million+ and longsword is top 3 most popular weapon, it's not going to get nerfed. I don't even mind it, these games are 300 hour+ investments, I'll take anything that makes the game more fun to play and they aren't scared to add insanely strong monsters anyway. Longsword has always been broken as shit. Skill claimers can cope however they want and yeah optimal longsword play where you counter everything takes skill but its a speedrun weapon for a reason.
Honestly biggest worry for me is that i feel like the game is becoming too easy. With tools like focus mode you dont actually even need to know your weapon to be good at it. Maybe its cuz im not a new comer but i hope the game can bring some challenge Not to mention the qol red flash when your about to cart. It's nice but makes you need to pay attention to the monster less
I appreciate the desire for complex decision making, but don't you think the whole game is moving in a more high speed reaction based direction from past entries? More aggressive monsters with quicker attacks, aim mode allowing players to redirect moves they'd have to plan seconds in advance to land in the past, no need for monster tracking- feels like they want the game overall to feel a bit less deliberate.
Your hitting some nails on some heads here my friend. Its that very direction that is dividing people. Its a bit like older souls games vs newer ones. Compare elden ring to dark souls 1 in terms of combat pacing or even dark souls 3 to 1.
That's exactly the problem. Players get buffed for "convenience", monsters get stronger to compensate so the game can still have challenge, and the whole flow of combat becomes sped up and less deliberate. Which is not a good thing in Monster Hunter's case.
@@JF-vz1ju i still feel it was very deliberate personally. its just a faster pace which i also enjoy. its a sweet spot between world and rise. i just played some master rank espinas in rise and was realizing how much FASTER EVERY ANIMATION is in rise compared to wilds beta. we will see as time progresses.
yes!! the whole series is leaning towards a more fast paced reaction based playstyle, while in old games sometimes it felt like you were playing a turn based rpg. It's not good or bad, it's just different and fits the flow of the game better
Gunlance guy here. I don't have anything in particular to say about the video: I think that there's a very good reason why Long Sword is the de-facto most played weapon type, and I wish other weapon types had more work done into making them as refined and/or rewarding to use. Gunlance forever
Finally he understands what us old gen hunters are talking about regarding intentionality of combat. EVERYTHING is getting so fast that it's all about reaction now, not plan/prep. I was really skeptical about many other changes but oh man was I wrong. Wounds are an incredible system for dynamic objectives and feed wonderfully into the focus attack punish against signature moves. Offset attacks are such a nuanced way to bring counters to World's grounded combat. Calling it now. Game of a generation.
These are such pointless complaints. You have zero information besides a beta with altered everything. You fought 3 different creatures, 2 jokes, and 1 challenge with set equipment and determined weapon needs to change because you dont like it. You assumed most players are advanced players like you, when most could barely get past World base monsters without online help. You have zero understanding of the devs' intentions or purpose, yet somehow think the weapon needs to be nerfed? Im impressed but not surprised. This is the same exact complaing that ppl had about Worlds changes from older games.
Yet you presume to make the opposite assumptions based on the same info. Your input amounts to "stop talking about things". Next time, if you have absolutely nothing to add to a conversation, you can simply not post.
The man made an in depth video, showcasing exactly what had changed, and how, and you're going to just completely ignore it all because he has "zero understanding of the devs' intentions or purpose." Their intentions, or purpose, do not matter to the point he made. The weapon, to him, has a minimal amount of risk for the reward you get out of it. He doesn't like that. That's it. That's the video. The devs can say whatever they want about WHY they did it but it's not going to change how he feels. As another commenter noted here, you are making the reverse assumptions with the same understanding of what the game is going to be like. If what they said is pointless then so is what you wasted your time typing.
Limitations are good.
Calling a nerf on a weapon based on a beta is insane to me. Maybe the devs changed the weapons for a reason? It's obviously worked like that to compensate for the monster's moveset.
Similar to Rise, the weapons are faster and stronger because the monsters in that game are also fast and strong.
We can't just call for nerfs just because it seemed strong based on a beta.
@@ratatoskr6324 dork
Bringing Hit stops back is a start.
Nah it's smoothing out *(it's true for all the weapons btw) the moveset as a goal to fight fairly against the monsters they're gonna throw at us later on
Edit: * Almost all weapons
@@MultiRv90 But that's exactly the point of the beta? The devs had it tested early to receive feedback from the more general populace and not just QA testers. Is a weapon too strong? Is it too weak? Does this combo work well? Should we change how the combos are bound to the controller? What about the performance settings? That is literally what the beta testing is for, for the devs to get a general feel of what their players want and see how they can implement said feedback into their own vision of the game
Meanwhile, glaive bros growing another set of hands just to be able to play optimally.
And losing more moves each game
I've seen someone say you can change the keybinds through steam itself to make it easier. Wish I had thought of that when I played.
That said, I put changed controller keybinds in my survey, I bet many others did too
Yeah seriously, they need to rework how that weapon controls massively, i should NOT be required to do a claw grip every time i want to do a basic combo.
@MrGshinobi Yeah, changing the circle to trigger or something would already make it a lot easier
Why the hell would they get rid of earplugs?
I wonder if he saw that LS gets a counter when dismount attacking off a Seikret
well now you know
That shit was sick. Did it once by accident
I think this is the only ok-ish buff the weapon got tbh. That and being able to cancel out of helmbreaker is a blessing, and I hope they never go back on that.
@@RED_XLR peoples main issue is the helmbreaker cancel though, theyve removed every drawback to the longswords most powerful moves
@@hiddensinix2767 that's not even remotely what the drawback of helmbreaker was tho. The drawback was the long as shit jump animation on which u cannot do anything about monster attacks. That is still in the game
Not quite, the drawback of previous HB is locking you into the 2-3 second animation. if you missed you still went down to yellow bar and would need to build back to red. It was high risk high reward. They've removed a lot of the risk. LS users can now spam HB and simply cancel if you think you'll miss.
So you are migrating to hunting horn. We welcome you with open arms Ratatoskr. Doot doot.
God, hunting horn feels SO GOOD in wilds! I was really disappointed in the changes in rise for it even though I loved the breakdancing move 😂.
@@WhetWilliesame bro I am glad hunting horn is back to it's roots
HH shouldve gotten ear plugs in the echo bubble. Considering that its a source of sound, I dont understand how it doesnt reduce the effects of other sources of sound. The only real issue is how the offset lacks any sort of rewards, where every weapon has a follow up, HH has to get its offset again after using it and gets nothing to follow up with after landing it. Other than that its nearly perfect, mwah.
We love y'all HH users, the only problem is that there's not enough of you 😔
@@benkai9921 you, can be one! Join us, doot doot!
It's funny seeing this reaction to their design philosophy, when it's very in-tune to how others felt when jumping from 4th to 5th gen.
Exactly, I think that's what a lot of people saw when World was announced. QoL and streamlining the game experience are very different than removing every inconvenience. People don't understand what I mean when I say that things like having no access to your storage items DURING a quest is a good thing, there's no commitment in MH games anymore.
@rohan68842 It's a very tired conversation, and for better or worse, this is the accessible direction that's been chosen for the series. Wilds tripling down on the decisions which made MH surge in popularity shouldn't surprise anyone.
Thank god emulation has netplay AND comes in 60 fps 😎
exactly LOL
@@Minizor27 It truly is tired. There's little you can say to sway someone who views your critique of buffs and streamlining as thinly veiled elitism or a dislike of fun.
Like from my perspective I just genuinely have less fun when the game pressures me less than it used to and would enjoy it more with higher tension. But It's super hard to convey that to someone who has an entirely different world view on what makes games fun.
@@Minizor27 What I'd give to be able to run 4U in HD and 60 fps
I agree with a good bit of this but this is not a long sword exclusive issue, all of the weapons have had many of their weaknesses smoothed out or removed, hopefully the monsters later on will be more complex to compensate for these changes
Also my thought process.
Saddly the monsters being more complex can't compensate for weapons being simpler.
@@thicphic7734 as a Main of all weapons I totally agree 💯 but tbh the Executive director already said in an interview that each weapon has skills that help refine each weapon and that balance is a major factor they already thought about I think 🐁 is putting the trap before the cheese lol
@@ramontavaresdacruz2256 it depends on each weapon certain monsters are designed to punish players especially in G-rank/Master Rank for example a Monster punishing you for mounting constantly or an IG that is always in the air!
Increased difficulty in a monster hunter game? Fat chance.
I'm sorry you feel this way, but it is supremely satisfying to see people who started with World coming up with the same complaints about Wilds that many who started before had about World, after so many years of just being told we were wrong about our complaints.
I agree with you man the quality of life of every weapon since unite have been hugely improved and makes the game more fun to play
Yeah when we were "gate keeping" and "overreacting".
I think the true take is that you’re all wrong and evolution is good for games to reach bigger audiences.
@@RIP_ZYZZ1738I think the true take is that you like to consume soulless slop.
@@Mr.House38 Soulless? Slop? Sounds like a whole bunch of rage and you’ll continue to buy the newest game. 😂
Reading comments of unhinged people who feel like you insulted their personality, is amazing.
I read an article on "let people enjoy things" it lists what you're describing as a natural consequence of people actually taking media as part of their identity, so they get insulted when said media is "insulted" (To them at least).
This seems to be a very pervasive attitude nowadays to shut down all and every kind of discussion. I see it everywhere @@inanefabas4402
@@inanefabas4402 yeah it's what can happen when society isn't built to encourage community & social engagement. Rather than developing personality around how you interact & care for others you attach it completely to insignificant things like inanimate objects or subjective media.
Personally I can empatheticly understand this behaviour due to being rejected by (a bigoted) society; & needing to build self worth & personal values off of anime 😅.
Least unhinged long sword users smashing their keyboard fuming lmao
Long Sword users don't use any other weapon, it's like it's part of their DNA. Of course they get insulted when someone criticizes it 😂
Removing "pain points" from the moveset that leave players vulnerable is something that they've been doing with every weapon, not just Longsword. Like I'm not the biggest fan of some of the changes either, particularly the hyper armor and damage reduction on Spirit Thrust and Spirit Release, but these are universal design philosophy decisions, not Longsword specific decisions. If we don't like it, then we don't like the current direction of the series, not just a specific weapon. Greatsword has how many ways to instantly transition into TTS now? Bow doesn't even need to aim now. Dual Blades has three separate cancel windows out of Blade Dance. Pretty sure Lance got some hyper armor despite already having a shield that lets them block anything and everything. The list just goes on.
The changes they made to ISS from Iceborne to Rise were because its original implementation discouraged people from even using the move in the first place, on top of the move just being unreliable. It was less damage than Helm Breaker, messing it up would cost you the resource needed to perform Helm Breaker, and setting it up was just too slow in many cases, so it was almost always a bad option. Rise made the move more reliable, more rewarding, and more cohesive with the rest of Longsword's kit. In terms of punishment, doing pitiful damage on an early counter and being left wide open, or eating shit on a late counter are punishment enough and perfectly in line with how similar options are treated. The cost is your HP bar, in a series of games where monsters can easily chunk players for 80% of their HP, and since Longsword is the counter weapon assigning more cost to its counters is antithetical to the design goals of the weapon.
100% I agree with this.
Most of the pain points removed weren't weaknesses with the weapon, just QoL buffs. Like horn getting more input bypasses (it had two before, now it has others which have their own advantages and disadvantages) and Insect Glaive got focus melee attacks giving easier aimed extracts, but at the cost of the buffs meaning less and now having the gameplay loop of SAED instead of old IG, Hammer had charge level 3 changed to one big hit making damage frontloaded for your main poke damage, and great sword has focus mode aiming, but you still need to time it right. CB even got its savage axe mode limited to focus strikes and now has a longer time to get to SAED, but it seems phials are just naturally focus 3 levels now, and they can charge higher than 5. SWAXE can now roll out of wild swing, but is still requires hyper-aggression and charging the weapon.
I didn't play enough of the other weapons in either the beta or previous games to talk about them, but 6 out of the remaining 13 is pretty close to a majority
Maybe I simply haven't explored enough, but greatsword still has only the tackles to skip to TCS, that and TCS was nerfed in favor of making the other slashes before it do more damage
@@slayeroffurries1115you have more access to TCS too. iirc after wound/ after counter with offset move.
so I don't mind with dmg nerf.
@@zeronellseros4731 I see. I didn't care about using offset or focus attacks, so it makes sense I didn't realize they transitioned into TCS
I've always found the appeal of MH to be an inherit weakness that we as hunters possess against monsters. Out-thinking and out-preforming monsters was where the thrill was at, and every attack had to be measured carefully or punished accordingly. Seeing the trend towards more powerful hunters with more power and survivability hampers what I personally enjoy about the series.
Unfathomably based comment. I agree.
Monster Hunter is a game of strategy, not reflexes. Like chess
Oh yes, like Skull Merchant from DbD prior to her rework.@@slayeroffurries1115
I've always found this notion strange, since monster have been getting progressively stronger as well to match that power, yet everyone decides to ignore cause people forget getting better at a game is a thing
@@slayeroffurries1115 no it isn't, it's an action rpg first and foremost bruh
@@anormalhumanhopefully8570 You are right, but I think my point still stands. The series used to be more methodical and slow paced, giving the games a very different feel. I didn't say the newer games were bad, just that they appeal to me personally less.
Oh you know its bad when the longsword main says
"please nerf longsword"
But i get it, to me the most bs thing is that you now have hyper armor on the helmsplitter thrust, hyper armor on spirit release and you can counter while on seikret as well as now being able to foresight cancel attacks.
Yeah loud minority
Still having hyper armor is not necessary a good thing especially when monster do combo heavy hitter.
If one hit knock you out then you won't take damage until you get back up
but if you have hyper armor then you will eat next and next attacks as well
you in fact do not have hyperarmor during the thrust. I PERSONALLY experienced this lie. You have hyperarmor during the spirit release after helmsplitter, you do NOT have hyperarmor during the thrust.
@@TheCosmicAstro-Brother, did you even WATCH THE VIDEO. He straight up gives evidence at 10:07. How are you so confident in your words but so wrong.
Hold up. You can counter while on Sekiret???
Insect glaive was the sore spot for me in the beta. I really only got into monster hunter when world came out. I've played limited amounts of other mh games (not rise) so take this as you will but many seem to agree from what I've seen online. Insect glaive is much more grounded now, and requires very difficult inputs to play optimally, encouraging you to hold the focus button very often and also charge attacks while pushing other buttons for the combos. The focus is much more on gaining and spending extracts through charged attacks, rather than staying airborne, mounting monsters, and dashing in and out. It's still a very mobile weapon compared to others, but long air combos are gone, allowing only for a single string of attacks in the air. The infinite combo is gone as well, making even grounded play feel a bit strange. The weapon is still valid but feels like a different weapon and is difficult to play optimally due to all the button holding.
Hunting horn, my secondary choice, is even more fun now though. I hope we get L2 spin combos on better horns. It's fun to input melodies fast when making a bubble or breaking a wound, but the multi input 8th note often doubles one of the inputs during the bubble or wound breaking, resulting in an extra note, ruining your combo effect.
I'm excited for full release and I hope they consider community concerns about their favorite weapons. Someone not able to enjoy their preferred playstyle could mean that they skip this game.
Switch R1 with Circle in the keybinds and problem solved
You can change focus mode to a toggle in the settings.
@@Willow4526no one is having trouble pressing focus mode, that finger has nothing else to do
Good IG gameplay was never aerial in world, the only good part of being in the air was just to instantly do the dive move, being grounded and doing dives was where all the damage was. Rise did make aerial ig do damage but I thought it was obvious that wasn't going to carry over since in 4u and gu it was also just meant for the jump to be for the occasional cheeky dodge and gapclosing
@@808pitfallseed As I got better with IG in world, I did tend to spend much more time on the ground. However, dashing though the sky got me through some of the tougher fights on my first playthrough and is very fun. I know that a lot of the veterans are optimistic about IG in the full game so I trust that they have better insight than I, but the playstyle I've grown accustomed to seems to have changed enough to put HH as my new top spot.
The PVE argument was always a weak one. PVE still needs to be balanced for maximum enjoyment. If one weapon is safer than other options while doing more damage, playing riskier weapons will feel worse as you will no longer feel rewarded for playing them. If other weapons are buffed up to be the same level of power, it risks the game feeling too easy/braindead.
People who uses this excuse always conveniently ignore that balancing is a huge reason why these games remain enjoyable. If you were a veteran, you wouldn't have much fun if they kept every fight on the level of a Great Jagras, that's why monsters are balanced to progressively challenge your skills.
Here's a suggestion from a lance main that might not be popular for LS mains, but the point behind it needs to be brought up: how about all of LS's counters only reduces damage rather than making you invincible, maybe counting as a guard and taking that much damage? After all, while I'm happy that we gained perfect guard, we still take damage when doing it, yet it has like a quarter of the active frames compared to LS's counters.
How come LS gets easier counters despite it being a fast moving evasion based weapon that gains full invincibility, when the counter specialist's counters are far harder to execute while taking damage doing them, while having almost zero mobility in comparison? Lance have a new counter attack that is only accessible after executing a three attack combo first, then you have to charge it to do decent damage. How come that insanely difficult to execute counter still has lance take damage when LS doesn't?
Sorry for the griping, but it's just weird how insanely good and easy LS's counters are despite being a weapon at the highest tier of evasion, and yet the weapon is made even easier to show off with.
I agree conceptually, but the Charge Counter at the end of our poke string is fully invincible when timed correctly
You are completely and utterly correct.
ikwym lmao but that's def a lance moveset problem and not a longsword one, it seemed stronger in wilds but idk I never played lance that much to be able to tell..
i found ls to be super effective in wilds beta. i loved it. im sure the game gets harder and monsters will punish the counter flip attack thing at higher ranks. i trust the team at capcom. they know more about the full experience than we do currently. but it is fair to critique this part of the game.
I disagree that it should take damage on counters.
I agree that the window is way more lenient than lance.
Lance shouldn’t be as punished because of it’s block. It’s hard enough already to be effective with the weapon.
I'm also an exclusive Longsword main, and while I'm not as upset as you, there are definitely things I don't think we needed. I don't mind the additional cancelling between moves, but Spirit Charge seems wholly unnecessary. We already had multiple ways to raise Spirit Level, and Spirit Charge feels like the biggest shortcut of them all. I also dislike getting more hyper armour. If Longsword is the counter weapon (which I love), then lean into the counters. In most games, counters are high risk, high reward, but they're also usually the one defensive trick that kind of playstyle/class has. Hyper armour undermines some of that specialisation (and satisfaction of timing) by letting us tank more stuff recklessly, like a berserker playstyle or something.
@@RoaringTide I don't mind spirit charge but I also see your side of it tbh thing I hated about LS was knocking down a monster and not even having 1 level of spirit charge so you couldn't take advantage of it I'll be interested to see what skills benefit our spirit gauge the directors have stated each weapon has skills that will benefit using different weapons for example lasting power/longing power
I dont think LS should lean to heavily on counters as they can easily become repetitive and make the game kinda boring. And honestly some of the most fun I have had with the weapon is when seemlessly weaving combos and avoiding attacks without having to spam foresight slash to do it. P.S Also the whole counter weapon moteif is slowly turning my favorite weapon into a over the top and obnoxious anime weapon, I mean the mount finisher in wilds literally just makes you Virgil from DMC.
We have no even experienced a quarter of the game. probably not even 10%. people need to stop making such hasty complaints especially when asking for nerfs instead of fixes because it is highly likely that monsters will be harder than they have been previously. which is why they have given us these tools like focus mode and adding a counter, clash, or adept dodge option to almost every single weapon in the game.
In the past i may have agreed with Rat. But he is WAY too premature to be talking about anything regarding nerfs and honestly hes a bit of a clown to think this was a good thing to put out there.
@TheCosmicAstro- totally agree 💯 with that wait until the game is out for a month before asking for nerfs it doesn't make sense we haven't even faced Lala Borina who could punish us
@@Pyroxene-W7F It's crazy but my approach to and enjoyment of LS is literally 180 degrees from yours. I think combo management gameplay is way less engaging than learning a monster and being able to foresight/iai their moves with ease. Using both is critical to slaying, but once you have downloaded a monster 100%, the counter gameplay is so much more enjoyable to me than just papercutting it to death while I watch my spirit gauge change colors.
Not saying your way is wrong, it's just cool to see someone who enjoys the other side of the coin.
My impression is that the LS went from "too limited in what to do next" into "too many options to choose from"... But be able to keep attacking after last spirit slash is pretty fun ngl.
I LOVE the changes. I always hated how you got locked into sheathing after round slash, it feels so much more fluid and didn’t at all feel cheaty to me. Idk what this guy is on about. Sounds like he is thinking too much into it instead of just having fun
I mean since world the weapon has had more options on what to do next than other weapons. That isn’t an issue. In fact it’s a good thing. The issue is most of the options are good in almost all situations. This means you won’t be punished for making a worse decision. If the decisions you have lack meaning then you lose any sense of achievement when you make any decision as most of them end up with you doing insane amounts of damage regardless.
This isn’t the only weapon that has been given more options that has effectively reduced depth. IG also has this issue. At least IG doesn’t make all your decisions good but it makes one option so strong that it makes most of the move set irrelevant.
@@sir_quirkus7206 Some people actually like having adversity. Crazy thought.
@@sir_quirkus7206 yeah, leave the thinking to him.
@@sir_quirkus7206because the weapon is completely brain dead now. These games used to be hard
All these points don't matter because I carted to Rey Dau.
haha
Dam you too? 😂
It's almost like you still need to make deliberate decisions regardless of the weapons new options
i understood that reference.
@@apdragon321Almost. Not quite, though.
Some people are saying "But they're removing the limitations from all the weapons", but that just isn't true. Here's a few examples.
Switch Axe:
-Performing a Wild Morph below the Sword Gauge threshold no longer replenishes a bit of Gauge to put you into Sword Mode. Instead your hunter now abruptly stops after the axe swings and reloads.
-Reloading no longer replenishes Sword Gauge at the start of the animation, now requiring the animation to entirely finish.
-Using all your Sword Gauge no longer allows you to roll and do an axe morph attack, instead forcing you to perform the standing morph animation.
-No directional morphs after a roll anymore
-Counter does not work on roars, you take massive chip damage AND STATUS from the attack you counter
SnS
-Backstep no longer able to be smoothly performed in every direction after a roll
-Rising Slash from guard removed, a useful combo starter
-Guard/Roll to unsheath now too clunky to be useful
-Sheath speed nerfed (???)
-The ability to turn your hunter's direction mid-combo has been given to all weapons via Focus Mode
Lance is much clunkier now too.
Meanwhile LS has had all its limitations straight up removed. Capcom wants to turn it into the ultimate baby's weapon
"Swaxe too fast, slow it down"
"IG too aerial, ground it"
"LS [???🍔????👽???🗿??👹???], give it more counters"
Is “give ls more counters🥺” something u parrot every day before sleep until you believe it?
Because almost every weapon in wilds got a new counter EXCEPT LS
So what’s your end goal here?
@@zultar7787 you can't stop their ignorance, let them cry.
@@zultar7787did it strike a nerve in you? Lmao
git crunked made a great video about these lunatic grifters,
Hopefully it catches on and this miserable unreasonable hate campaign ends
@@zultar7787 LS's dismounting attack is literally a counter lmao, "except LS" my ass. Said counter also give you a spirit level.
Helmbreaker finisher with better motion values than a full TCS, cancellable helmbreaker for free...
Pampering LS must've been very exhausting... Because they brainstormed and gave IG the bare minimum just to finish their shift and head home lol
Pointing out that a lot of other weapons have hyper armor and safe counters now isnt necessarily a good thing people... You're basically describing homogeneity. Dont get me wrong, I have no doubt that the later monsters will absolutely be designed around this... But if the game is heavy on focusing counters, and the weapons all have a low skill cieling, then theres a risk that fighting these monster with different weapons wont feel as dramatically different from eachother. And weapon variety is one of the core tenants of Monster Hunter, its the feature that sets it so far above its competitors.
Other weapons having counters does not threaten weapon variety. Tf are you talking about?
Good point and hopefully as skills get better we do see the difference in weapons but I agree with you
This was one of my issues with Rise. Every weapon is so fast and so many have counters, it got really samey to me
@@hakuryu5874he didn't say counters, he said counters and hyper armor while also alluding to general qol changes that everything gets. if your goal with a weapon is to swing swing swing then power through an attack you are describing half the weapons gameplan now. right now most of them are just use the strongest move it has on repeat and the hunt is significantly easier and ends faster than trying to use the whole moveset. it's already homogeneous for most weapons and hopefully not the final version of them
@@petercottantail7850 Are you purely in the field of ideas, or have you actually fought every monster with every weapon in the demo? Because i have, and i disagree.
(for prospective sake, im a lance main) i was with some friends and i talked about the longsword in wilds and how it felt it was too easy to start being effective with it (due to being able to access foresight at any moment). Afther a bit i was thinking that for atleast the foresight slash the hunter would simply still get damage, but for it to be all in recoverable health (red health), which is similar to the valor sheat in generations if i do recall correctly, which would make it similar to lance getting chip damage but still give an option to keep going if the player is good enough trought other means of evasion and allow the player to have to choose wether or not its worth to bring skills that take advantage of the red health (as example recovery speed to let you go into counters more ofthen and strife as in getting power from it) allowing the player to customize and adapt basing on their adversary.
I love how some peoples response to this is that all weapons should be dumbed down even more wtf is commitment anyways
WHAT THE FUCK IS A COMMITMENT 📯📯🎺🎺🎺🎺🗡🗡🗡🛡🛡🛡🛡🗡 I HAVE NO LONG TERM RELATIONSHIPS 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥😿😿😿😿
I didn't have enough time to pay more than 2 hunts during the obt and I just played LS like I used to, never realised all these buffs exist haha
GS mains here.
Focus mode aiming removes one major layer of GS intricacy and dumbed it down. sad but unlikely to be removed. It removes part of the satisfaction of making the right prediction of monster moveset and proud of your mastery of the weapon. but not as sad as how tcs feels weak in animation without the hit stop animation and special effects from world.
Tcs has actually been nerfed damage wise and they buffed every other move damage wise other than the tackle. This means they probably realised focus mode made tcs too easy to land. They’re probably trying to rebalance the weapon to make the decision making process more like trying to decide what move would be optimal dps in your opening and not how can I get tcs off in this scenario. What in all fairness is more it’s old identity preworld. I think this was definitely the best option they had with both the even faster monsters of wilds and the addition of focus mode.
Based af
The hitstop absence thing is bs, it is only absent if you hit an armored part of the monster, I just checked my clips, and TCS hitstop is present and is enormous when you land a hit on a vulnerable part or a wound, and tbf, I much prefer this type of hitstop.
@soloman8059 It’s not absent but it is reduced from world and any of the pre world games. Also the lack of blood on any non wounded part also isn’t great. That was a problem in world too though.
@@porkwhisperer3050 well, for better or worse I am not sure if they're gonna change those things significantly going forward. But yes, the impact of strikes was much more significant in older titles, I mean, in 4th gen GS charge shook the screen and literally sent waves of dust in the air.
This is very common in games with multiple classes or weapons. The developers feel like they have to constantly make every weapon stronger from one game to another, thus eventually making it overtuned because nothing can perpetually get stronger each installment. Also, not every weapon needs new moves or buffs. One of my more beloved weapons, the charge blade, is fine as is. World's CB was perfect. I wouldn't bat an eye if they didn't buff it or change it at all in the next 10 years. So, most of the changes in the long sword aren't really necessary. World's LS was just fine.
What they should do is just add more moves but not op ones. Increase the complexity and skill ceiling of all the weapons but don’t just add judgement cut to the end of a helmbreaker and give everything hyper armour it’s so dumb
@@joesheridan9451 You can't just add new moves forever. You'd either have to remove old ones or make combos so ridiculously long that you would never finish them.
@@PlusOne2Crit Not sure I agree. Games like DMC taught me there are a hell of a lot of things you can do with a controller if you get creative.
@@joesheridan9451 That's cool, but also nothing to really do with what I said.
Monster Hunter isn't a spectacle fighter like DMC. You can't have a 20 hit combo string with a different attack on each input because no monster in existence is going to A.) stand still long enough or B.) not punish you for just spamming attacks.
It is not even remotely the same game so the comparison is pointless.
@@PlusOne2Crit I'm not saying it should be like dmc I'm saying you can use controller inputs in creative ways. I'm not talking about loads of infinite combo's because yeah that wouldn't work in this game, I'm talking mostly about things you could do from neutral. or just options in cobos to reroute it type of thing...
Everything I'm talking about they already do anyway. Stuff like perfect rush, saed cancel into aed, backhop from neutral on the sns, power guard... The swaxe's whole moveset lol. I'm just saying they should go even further but with utility moves not always broken op finishing moves
Well said (Also a LS only player since freedom). Just to play devil's advocate though, we have no idea what changes they made to monsters. In fighting games, there are plenty of series that have gone through this same process and characters have had all their weaknesses removed. You were then only asked how you want to play the game, not what weaknesses you want to have. Then weaknesses came from the player, not the character when you failed to master skills your character specialized in. (If you've ever seen like TAS gameplay of SF3, then you'll know that everything can be parried and countered, and that entire gameplay philosophy created one of the greatest fighting games to date.)
If the monsters become so fast, deadly and complex that having access to everything, always, is a necessity, then I welcome the change.
Truthfully though, I hate that counters from the katana avoid beam explosions and stuff... some stuff should just hit no matter what and the proper defense should be to sheathe and do jump and dive.
Ngl... I actually agree with everything here, especially your iss changes. I always wished it worked like you said where you gain on hit and lose on miss.
I just feel like they overstepped with the weapon on a lot of points that just doesn't make it feel the same. Longsword is usually among my most played weapons but during the beta I think I actually use longsword the least out of all of them which is the complete opposite of what I would usually do. I mean I like the spirit release slash, the red gauge changes, and the directional Spirit combos. Other than that, it just doesn't feel as fun anymore...
Literally caught this at 1 minute. Legendary
i feel the same about what they did to hammer , simply giving the weapon a dash and removing half the move set has made an already simple weapon who's only real depth was to manage your placement well to not get hit while in front of the monster and charging into a completely thoughtless bonkstick , sometimes convenience is harmfull to a weapon's gameplay identity
Played hammer as well in the Beta:
- never a fan of spinarooney charge mechanic, i find the animation wacky.
- dont like the slinger dash, shouldve kept the power charge stance
- to me, WorldBorne Hammer is the Perfect Version
@@nextgencombodrop378 agree on the first two points but i do prefer the rise moveset , wirebug moves excluded
i feel like a lot of weapons in wilds got cool new stuff but :
-hammer lost moves
-got its old bread and butter move moved to brutal charge (which does look goofy)
-got a dash
-of all the moves they could have kept they kept the lamest charged attack as the 3rd charge
I would agree with those points if they were made about world. But it’s wilds. CB doesn’t need the shield charge to perform a UAED, great sword can aim its TCS while performing it, gunlance has two whyvern fires, bow has tracers and so on. This is just the new direction of the game. I’m not that big a fan of it either but I’d rather have this then just world 2.0.
that's a good point. I was in disbelief when I saw you could aim TTS and I'm a GS main.
In all fairness though, monster hunter still has a reputation for having clunky combat, even now. they probably want to move away from that and make it play more like a character rpg like DMC or Bayonetta
We finally reached a point where you just fight the monsters instead of fighting the controls at the same time, and of course the vets find a way to complain about that
@@lurakin88 they suffered so they think everyone else should suffer too like they did
@@lurakin88 I don't want to fight anything, I want to HUNT them. There's no point in bum rushing a monster and destroying it with your obscenely overtuned weapon.
Traps? Consumables? Elemental weaknesses? Food effects? Enviromental interactivity? What's any of that mean?
Just press button 'till monster dies
@@WatsonDynamite I didn't suffer then, I was having good fun
Sadly if these "pain points" being removed for any weapon isn't to your liking then the game will likely not be, Both Ryozo and Yuya talked non stop at every event that they want this game to be less about commitment and loss of control for the player and they wanted the whole game to go by this philosophy, such as grappling resources instead of having to actually gather them and fast travel. This is consistent throughout. I hope you find your joy with the Horn bros.
LMAO, I see you deleted my comment. Not sure why, since I was hardly the worst person to say something here. But I'll reiterate it, albeit much more concisely; you completely ignored what Spirit Gauge actually does now to prove a point that it's worthless, this is misleading when it completely changes the moveset of the weapon like Dual Blade's, "Demon Mode," and I feel like your analysis of it being too easy to charge now along with other buffs is just faulty because it's clearly a deliberate design choice to bring it in line with Dual Blades because they fulfill similar roles. I personally think that the buffs don't change the dynamic at all nor is it braindead because you have new tools and freedom in the moveset, and will say again I feel like you are being just a bit butthurt that they're making your game/main weapon easier when no one is trying to devalue the work you put into it, just ditch the pretentious attitude like these, "solutions," of yours HAVE TO HAPPEN, in order for Wilds' LS to be good. A lot of us LS mains really liked the changes, myself included.
Also you haven't considered how other weapons have been buffed as well, (probably because you don't play them...) or realized the changes might be because of those other buffs. My friend is a Greatsword main, and he tells me that with the Focus system he can land TCSes so much more consistently than before, so obviously they removed a lot of pain points on other weapons as well, to make them more consistent with their most damaging attacks. If they left all of the pain points with LS there would have been people complaining that they didn't touch it at all. So really, this feels like a, "damned if you do, damned if don't," situation, imo.
I agree
I've always loved the style and maneuverability of Longsword but started to worry about the risk vs reward side of things when Rise made it so the Iai spirit slash could give you a charge instead of taking it away but now things are just getting ridiculous.
Oh boy, they’re mad about the longsword? NOBODY let them use bow please. If this makes them genuinely angry the bow will destroy their brains😭😭😭😭
Monster hunter fans are starting to talk like dark souls fans
This comment section is dumb as hell and missing the point of the video. Balance in PvE games exists to offer variety to all players. If one option outclasses many others (I'm not saying LS outclasses EVERY other weapon, but it certainly is objectively better than Lance, Insect Glaive, and I'm sure a few others right now), then what's the point in using anything else? I've never played Longsword, likely never will because I love Lance too much, but it would be nice to bring all options closer together in power level. Lance needs buffs, yes, but that won't change that THE counter weapon is worse at its niche than Longsword is, which is ridiculous.
@@michaelmcdonald2005 I disagree as a Main of all weapons each weapon is objectively better than the other IG feels like a return to 4 Ultimate Glaive which isn't a bad thing also lance can guard almost every move of Rey Dau so I would say in the right hands each weapon can be outclassing even a LS)
well, to be fair the other weapons are easier to use.
@@drakeshotplaysmy issue with IG is that it feels even slower than 4U and now despite some QOL to gain extracts the process actually feels more interruptive now because you’re incentivised to blow them all on the rising spiral slash. not to mention the absolutely awful controller button mapping. also the IG has no perfect dodge/counter and vaulting puts you at the mercy of poor aerial hitboxes. i don’t want longsword to be bad, i want all the other weapons to get cool and fluid stuff like it
@tombmie I felt that same way as well but I save the rising spinning slash for certain situations it might feel faster on launch but I doubt it will be getting more changes possibly some new skills could help IG and the Kinsect buffs lasting longer or not blow it at all if certain conditions are met the Executive director who plays all weapons confirmed balancing will happen to all weapons withing the weapon skill tree and more
Lance is THE block weapon, not the counter weapon. Countering is just one thing it can do.
The long sword should be buffed, make it more in line with Vergil from DMC5. It’s time to rise to godhood
Everyone is overhyping up Longsword meanwhile Bow and Dual Blades can be near invincible, Sword and Sheild has full 360 mobility during attacks, every weapon has a Perfect Block or Counter. And i cant imaging how powerful things like Charge Blade can become with actual builds or Bow amd Dual Blades again when they get Elemental damage
There are far more powerful weapons, but Longsword's rep sheet is obscuring those
People love to criticise the LS when no one complains about how powerful the Biw guns are in these games.
IG have no perfect block or perfect counter, as far as I know.
@@Nayeem8546 never made sense why people hate on LS so much when the bowguns and bow straight up dominate speedruns and DPS.
@@annguyenhoang1720Yep, IG is a big letdown…
@@czarnylfernando17 it still requires skill to foresight slash
All counters or perfect dodges require skill
its funny people that people rag on longsword when heavy bowgun and bow are as strong if not stronger in almost every entry of monster hunter
I have to disagree and say that I think the weapon is in a great place. May be too easy to an experienced player but I think now it's more accessible and hope to see people not cart with it.
I don't deny that limitations help raise the skill ceiling but it's like this.
However, much like every single full generation shift this series has seen, weapons become more fluid and mobility increases. This comes with a twofold buff to wyvern moveset and general mobility.
e.g; If you take F2's hunting horn and dropped it into IB you'd have a bad time.
Putting p3rd's LS into Sunbreak? Bad time
Without seeing the actual end game of wyvern design we simply don't have enough information on knowing how the reduction of commitment will end up being necessary. Multiple weapons had this reduction. SnS can perfect block right out of perfect rush (where before rolling was the option).
Lance, an already low commitment weapon, gets to perfect block out of every poke.
Dual Blades' demon dance, traditionally one the most animation committed attacks in the game, is now tiered into 3 pieces.
Even hammer is scooting about whilst holding charge forever.
These changes and more when combined with new features such as offset attacks makes it seem as if the game is shifting towards a substantially more reactive playstyle. Which also means that Wyvern patterns also could change. In other words, if the weapons remain static, it could be like flinging AT Nerg into 2nd gen. Without the tools modern hunters have, this would create substantially more friction.
Doshaguma, goober that it is, in it's last stand can recover from a flinch directly into another attack. Had things like DB's remained as they were, a player could be hard punished with no counterplay for performing the right action. Where as now a DB user can react as long as they're not on autopilot.
There's potentially another side of this. Right now we can stink bomb away packs. But it's not unheard of for them to revisit ideas such as 4's paired monster migrations and/or paired monsters like the Seltas Queen.
Traditionally in multi wyvern fights, large amounts of any given moveset gets benched. It's the reason Lance Charge getting so many options as the games progressed HAD to happen for the move to approach anything resembling usability.
I don't doubt that they might have overbuffed. But it's something to consider that there might very well be a reason.
I fully expect the master rank end game monsters to be insane to the point of making Fatalis and Alatreon look like baby mode.
Not everything is about the end game and for a long and large roster that's quite boring if 80% of it is brain dead mode
Nah, not having to mandatory doing special sheath after a round slash feels so good compared to both World and Rise, it's bloody amazing 😂
Another gen another needless complaint. Love that cycle
Here we go again.
Jokes aside, I think I can agree that canceling spirit blade III with foresight slash is a bit much, but I don't really see the problem with the other changes. I'm not sure how practically useful its going to be to infinitely delay your spirit combo with normal attacks because the monster will usually start moving before long. It's an option on downs if you misjudge your spirit gauge I suppose but there are certainly better attacks the player could be doing on downs.
Spirit charge has great utility but you're incredibly slow while you charge it, meaning you can't really charge it safely from a distance if your goal is landing the roundslash unless you're waiting for the monster to come to you, but usually that'll entail an incoming attack. It's better suited for larger openings or multiplayer when the monster has less heat on you, or if you want to utilize the downtime of the monster chasing somebody else to charge your gauge if you're not interested in landing the roundslash. It is an exaggeration to say that the gauge doesn't matter because several of the longswords options are contingent on having gauge. Your best defensive utility in foresight slash requires you to have some meter and drains all of it regardless if you exceed the minimum cost of using it. Your spirit combo still drains the meter, helmbreaker needs a minimum of white to even use it. Meter is still important, what's changed is that you have more options on how to build that meter depending on the situation. To put it in a true Jakob-esque analogy, you're still threading the needle, you just have the option on whether you're sewing a sweater or a hat. I'm sure you're against having access to those kinds of options because you like limitations, but at that point we're just talking about preference. If we're going to talk about the new tools and interactions longsword got in Wilds in the context of weapon balance, I think it's important to discuss the practicality and weaknesses of those options as well as their strengths, but this video only focuses on the latter.
On that note, I'm not sure if I would call hyperarmoring through Rey Dau's strongest attack with helmbreaker for half of your health to be "safe". You are trading with the monster, for example at 14:40 you play the same clip 4 times of you hyperarmoring Rey Dau's big railgun attack. You spend your gauge on spirit release, miss the attack, and end up eating the railgun for half your health, as opposed to just going for helmbreaker and rolling to the side to conserve your meter and avoid getting hit. In this case you made a trade and lost more than you gained since now you're down two levels of gauge and are at half health. I don't see anything wrong with this interaction, you made a bad trade and got punished for it while gaining nothing when safer and more resource conservative options were available to you. There are certainly situations where the hyperarmor is strong like using helmbreaker on a roar, but it's up to the player to figure out which situations are appropriate to trade with since hyperarmor has its own weaknesses too (multihits come to mind).
The quick sheathe argument is very misplaced in this video. This is a video about nerfing the longsword in Wilds, yet you're bringing up how a skill functioned in Rise as part of why longsword should be nerfed in Wilds when we have no idea of the degree special sheathe is affected by quick sheathe in Wilds. It could function to the degree it did in Rise where it was very substantial, it could also function to the degree it did in World where it wasn't very substantial. It's strange to me because your critiques before this point were all at least grounded within Wilds, but here you're just grumbling about a skill interaction in a completely different game instead of how it behaves in Wilds.
All that said, I think it's far too early to suggest weapon balance changes when the monster and build selections are as limited as they are in the demo. I don't think its really appropriate to suggest balance changes based on performance against early game monsters in low rank where most options are going to be more applicable and inconsequential due to the numbers and speed of the monsters deliberately being tuned down, as well as their kits being more straightforward and easy to understand in the case of monsters like Chatacabra, Balahara, and Doshaguma since they are designed for the early game.
That's a keen observation you make regarding the hyper armor, especially given the interaction he shows in the video would probably get him carted on late game hunts, or even mid game hunts if he isn't at full health when it happens. It seems so obvious when you point it out, that I'm surprised it didn't occur to him while looking at that footage when he was editing the video.
based take
I think one of the main things about this video though is that it's about weapon design based on other weapons. Longsword, despite being about counters, is originally designed around awareness and momentum.
The Longsword was ALWAYS about managing your resources and combo structure since the second generation where it was introduced. Similarly, the Sword and Shield is versatile, Greatsword requires patience, etc.
To make my counter-tangent short, what's being suggested here to to reintroduce awareness by forcing the player to actually care about their resources. The reason for the Rise example, like he said, was because it overshadowed the foresight counter, which matters. Invalidating the purpose of prior options to make a weapon easier isn't proper balance. And so far, Wilds seems to only invalidate the commitment other tools had in previous games. I think it's a finely place concern given how it relates to the video, he mentioned an example and said "here's hoping the developers don't do that again."
Without losing the identity of the weapon, improvements and adjustments can be made to help strengthen the purpose of a weapon. Gunlance is unwieldy but sturdy, CHOOSING between offense or defense especially now that shelling can act as a sidestep which leads into more combos meanwhile Lance is still about precion and safe pressure by *combining* defense and offense. I wish I had more examples but besides the Horn, I did not get enough hours with Wilds other weapons to strictly say that they retained faithful design or improved the "schtick" of the weapon.
Also Rey Dau's strongest move only dealing half your health in that clip is a godsend, notice how he could heal immediately after. Just needed to point out how that would happen if you got hit or even tackled through with the greatsword, bro got hit and healed in the same second. A small aside, but the damage reduction should ABSOLUTELY be adjusted.
1-"I'm not sure if I would call hyperarmoring through Rey Dau's strongest attack with helmbreaker for half of your health to be "safe" It is more safe then others weapon strongest attack + it does not matter he got hit he can just heal he has near infinite healing potions + Rey Dau dont attack after his big attack.
2-"The quick sheathe argument is very misplaced in this video." No its not . This video is for capcom about what he dont want to see in Wilds or what he wants to change and why. It does not matter evev if he sayd something from MH 2 .
3- "I think it's far too early to suggest weapon balance changes " Aganin no its not. Camcom them salfe sayd that beta is here fore feedback. Yes balance is different in beta yes ths were low rank monster and should he made this video absolutly.
@@theredcomet5670 Demo Ray Dau is probobly harder then most base game monsters so no. And diffivulty and balance is importat thrue full game not just endgame. You may have the opposite view but lickily your minority.
To be fair, these changes are not bad in a vacuum.
Could be problematic, but I need to see how the new Long Sword interacts with the updated mid-to-late game monsters before I fully judge it.
Silly squirrel, PvE balance is for Godefroy
Haha best comment 🤌
Ok so why dont make all weapons one hit kills i mean what is balance pfff not important
1:02 "It's counter don't activate on the fly"
I heard this while I play GU with Valor LS and I have to pause the game to stop laughing. XD
EDIT : Thank ya'll for the opinion about Valor LS folks, It's nice to see a comment that isn't outright hostile. Which is rare after World become mega hit and it's all about META or Kick. XD
Now for my opinion about Wild's LS. I love it as it is
As much as I love Adapt/Valor counter in GU, I BARELY do counter in other game outside of that.
I'm prefer to just add Evade Extender/Window and just roll around doing Sprit Combo over and over. Just keep up Red Gauge and go brrrr. Ya know like 3U days.
It's not until GEN and GENU that LS becoming more of counter weapon.
So this change in LS allowed me to be hyper aggressive while consistently dish out DMG as others who use counter playstyle.
And it's still stay in LS main appeals, which to my opinion is "risk VS reward". Overreliance of anything can spell big red quest failed.
There are now more way play LS than to just keep spamming counter, you now can being mobile with all direction Sprit Combo too.
Which is encourage people who doesn't like to use counter to use it. Coz after all, people has different kind of what is "fun" to them.
So to me, more options is good.
Also, as someone who ACTUALLY fall asleep mid hunt using helicopter. I too love the LG's change.
YA'LL SEE WHAT KIND OF STUFF PEOPLE PULLED OFF WITH THAT?!! THAT SHIT'S WILD!!!
Tbf that counter had way more strict timing
But yea, it is basically instant
Valor eats stam and health, and Valor mode LS' counter is actually surprisingly hard to land
valor parry is the hardest parry in monster hunter. It has same parry frames as regular iai slash at like 3 frames in 60 fps but you have to use it all the time
the problem with this comparison is that gu is much more demanding than world rise or wilds, so these advantages aren't just changes to make the game braindead, you still die if you don't pay attention to the monster and know your kit. basically what im saying is that the weapons can be broken but the problem is only noticable when the monsters arent threatening you.
to anyone who thinks "its just a pve game, why does it matter?", if something is outright better, more people will use it, especially in an age where youtube and meta are at the forefront of everyone's mind. the population of longsword players in pubs already dwarfs every other weapon type. if this longsword favouritism keeps going, monster hunter is going to become stale and 99% of players will be using the same weapon.
EDITED FOR BETTER ACCURACY-
it's NOT outright better.
the best Rey Dau kill times i have found are still nearly half a minute faster than the fastest Longsword kill time. The weapons with faster kill times I've seen have been HBG, GS, BOW, CB and GL. SNS and SWAX are extremely close behind, a couple of seconds. HM and IG a little further behind before the rest start reaching 30 second+ slower times.
my point is- you are objectively wrong, but also it's beta. people are likely not experimenting with the less popular weapons for speedrun kills so their kill times are worse- so you're probably even more wrong than you think you are.
@@mrcrowe1848it blows my mind how much hate the longsword gets all the time when it has never been the fastest ttk weapon.
The ranged weapons have always been hilariously overpowered, GS has always been the king of DPS, and yes LS keeps getting shit on for being the newbie weapon.
It's ok for one weapon to be super safe and easy to play for new players.
It's like people getting mad at Elden Ring for making magic overpowered and demanding it be nerfed because you can one shot bosses with a proper magic build.
If you don't like it, you don't have to play it. The weapon might be braindead to you, but maybe a 40 year old dad wants to play MH after a long day of work and doesn't have 5000 hours to master a weapon.
I Krok Thrasher Approve this message.
TBH, I don't think any of this makes it worse or more braindead; I think it's the opposite, honestly. Is it OP? Yea, but it always felt OP to me, even before Wilds. The reason I think it makes it more complex is because there's more things to explore, more things to learn, and more ways to optimize, even if some of them are new ways and some of them are just straight up better than the old ways.
The only things I agree and think the developers should take a step back on are being able to do foresight right after roundslash, and the 2nd thing is the hyper armor that Spirit Release Slash and Spirit Thrust have shouldn't be a thing or it should be less so that we have to time it perfectly and can't avoid multihit moves with it.
The longsword hate is the single worst thing about the MH community, it's not even in the top 5 weapons but because it's easier than other weapons people go haywire calling for nerfs.. During a beta..
That's the literal point of a beta, to gather feedback.
@@blazeedge1631 Yes but dont you think there is a clear bias against longsword? i have been playing this game for many years now and no other weapons gets such hate in the community. if we look at the 3 most common reasons people complain about LS;
1. People think its to strong. I can easily list 5 weapons that are stronger; GS,DB,SnS,Heavybowgun,Bow and there is more thats just the most obvious once. (which is totally fine)
2.People say LS is to easy for how strong it is. I'd say that SnS and DB are on a similar difficulty as LS and they outperform it without a doubt, also having easier weapons in the game is a good choice by the devs given there is so many different weapons and playstyles it helps people to easier get into the series and Monster Hunter growing benefits us all the company will invest more time into the game the more profit it turns im always happy seeing new players enjoy their time.
3. People complain about the flinching of LS, and yes that can be annoying especially in the older games but the entirety of LS flinch gets negated by a single level of flinch free which since Monster hunter Rise has become very very easy to fit into your slot being a level1 deco. besides, every weapon flinches some way more than LS.
to support my 1st and even partly 2nd point id like to point at 2 speedruns by Heavybowgun specifically in Monster hunter world on one of the most difficult Monsters, Alatreon.
You can easily look it up they litreally took 31seconds to beat it. 31. seconds. and you may say okay thats cheated and they glitched it or something, their other run takes 2minutes and 6seconds.
not a single weapon i've mentioned here can even remotely keep up with that dps output not even close, the monster genuinely doesn't even get to move it just gets perma flinched by the insane output of damage yet nobody would ever make such a video about Heavybowgun its only LS that is a problem when its somewhat upper midtier in survivability and damage, its absolutely hilarious how the entire community denies this bias with all this options layed out.
I’m pretty on the fence about my main weapon these days too. The devs are doing wonderful things with the ip in terms of atmosphere and presentation but I’m starting to wish I knew a bit about how they craft the identity of each weapon specifically so I can understand why they’ve done certain things. There are instances of brilliance where weapon move set design is concerned and largely it comes off deliberate in the design but for the first time, in wilds, I think I came across what seems like indecisiveness followed by what looks like having never resolved that indecisiveness but rather just kind of swept it under the rug. I still need to get my hands on the actual game and literally spend around 10 or even 20 hours of muscle memory building to be absolutely sure of anything but ultimately, I’m happy to see this kind of video! Respectful and productive discourse like this video should have a good effect if the devs see it. Really hope they do
You can go into spirit charge from fade slash directly without having to spirit slash 1
I just want an oversized, aerial boomerang
BASED
bring magnet spike back!!
we've only fought four early game monsters, new move-sets on weapon are likely balanced around future tougher enemies. long sword was very strong in the beta but maybe not so much in the full game. time will tell, cant wait to find out. too soon to call for nerfs or buffs though 😁
Is the right time when the game is out, and nothing about the core movesets is going to be subject to change any more?
I agree, I think the monsters will be pretty difficult if they’re giving us all the advantages. At least that’s what I’m hoping 😅
Contrarian content creator gets clicks by complaining about fun.
@@effthree7227 its perfectly fine to feedback for nerfs. That’s the whole point of the bloody beta. Why even have 14 weapons in the game when one weapon can do literally everything sans fire projectiles
Not every weapon has gained the same degree of buffs, hell some are a lot worse than what they were only a generation ago
@@PowerfulSkeleton Nothing is about the core moveset is subject to change this late into development. Right now they're probably polishing the very end of the game and working on performance
I agree with most of this. I still think longsword gets the harshest criticism while other weapons that have an equally unbalanced risk/reward get to slip by.
Almost every criticism of the LS there is, another weapon can do something similar or with even higher reward with lower to zero risk and it’s ok because it’s not the LS.
There is definitely some extra popularity when bashing the LS.
Right? It's the standard go-to: lol nerf that op weeb shit.
It's annoying
Yes, but that is a consequence of its popularity, and the criticism comes from LS users as well, such as this video, of course it will result in a higher frequency of criticism, i dont want my weapon to be braindead spam to win and with such a high floor of what it can do that someone that picks it for 2 hunts is as effective as someone that plays it almost exclusively
sword and shield has more damage and more Iframes when doing the backstep and nobody talks about how busted it is because it's not a popular weapon, longsword hate comes mostly from people that just like to hate on what is mainstream just to be different, and people that are insecure about their own weapon because they see a beginner having a fun time instead of a harsh experience like they had before or still have lmao. LS def gets the most blind hate out of all the weapons just because it's a fan favorite. While still being the most popular weapon more than 80% of the playerbase doesn't play LS so the majority just hate for no reason.
@@yagopagliara8837 Yes people hate on LS, that is the price to pay for being popular, haters gonna hate or envy the weapon it is what it is, but you cant unironically put SnS higher than LS, the reach is trash, the damage is not really that high and to keep up with others you have to spam PR and cancel the finisher to restart, the commitment mid PR is also super high, equivalent to SPH but without the safety of the jump after the hit, now i'll give you that most people sleep on SnS but there is a reason why, it is not that good of a weapon all things considered, + LS trips others in MP, the hate is not all without its reasons
@@italoviturino6386 I personally think SnS is even more braindead than the LS. I used to be a SnS main in world. I've switched to the LS now because I play a bunch of weapons and change my main one often.
SnS gameplay is literally spamming backstep and doing the strongest flurry move out of it, the dps is INSANE, and now that you can cancel that mid combo it's even more braindead cause most of the time you can stay under the legs of the monster without any real threat just doing crazy damage, and even if you can't backstep you can still block with an absolute MONSTER of a shield.
Like I've said before in this comment section, I don't think all weapons are being dumbed down, it may seem like it, but I just think they are adapting to a new flow of the game and the harder monsters in the endgame will have to make us push the weapons to it's limits.
Capcom imo almost never misses with movesets and weapons so I really trust that they are doing this for a good reason. Also the tripping is very annoying but I don't think it's still that bad.
Started playing mh in 2009 with freedom Unite. Always been a LS main. When iai counter came in worlds, I was 🤯. Now in wilds, more 🤯. I am all about the new change.
Wilds weapon design theory seems really weird, like you said about how people perceive Longsword being depthless and easy to survive with becoming more and more true, other weapons like Lance have had their identity crumpled, becoming extremely clunky and weird to use - these are both things that were not true previously, but they were widely SAID, often by people who don't play the weapons. Why does MHWilds weapon design seem to revolve around widely believed community /rumors/ of what a weapon's identity is, and not what they actually were in the previous games?
the funniest part about this is that Ls is actually super toned down compared to rise like rise Ls is stupidly safe
the other thing is it seems like they want Ls to be what is basically easy mode for the game
Not super toned down, it's similar if not even safer to play, and has less commitment for all of your attacks, except the special sheathe which is slower but that might change when we have access to quick sheathe. Basically Wilds removed all punishment for doing a helm breaker or spirit blade combo at the wrong time, those things aren't in Rise. And with the spirit charge you don't even need to land your counters or go through the full spirit blade attack you can just level up gauge for free. Rise had the sakura slash but there was a trade off with a very long 36 second cool down. You have to remember nearly every weapon was super powerful in Rise so everything is toned down but the longsword least so
Rise is an entirely different game
@@terincemiller1824when i invited people to play mh i always has said LD is the safe weapon
That's sns. @@TaydolfSwifter
Sadly there isn't much of a chance for this or any of the other things that make monster hunter separate from the other games in the series getting reimplemented. I love World and classic games, I think Rise is okay but I se myself placing Wilds below the games I have played. I guess I'll just play the old games and see if anyone will ever make a game that has the commitment, strategy, and immersive elements of previous games.
I wasn't able to try out all the weapons in the beta, but from what I saw, almost all of them received substantial buffs. Both directly and indirectly (thanks to focus mode). It probably means that the monster balance will be pretty aggressive, and I don't mind that at all.
Thats the big if right there. I am right with you. IF the monsters are buffed up to help mitigate the big increase in player power (especially with regard movement with focus and offset attacks and wound bursts etc) then this game could be the best MH yet. My only gripe is the lack of hit stop in some weapons and some weak sounding weapon hit effects that I hope they improve before release. My switch axe aint feeling nearly meaty enough for me other than that one big new move it has. lol.
This isn't even remotely true. Switch Axe and Charge Blade arguably got nerfed compared to World and Rise; Hammer is mostly a side grade imo and have you see what Lance players have been saying?
@@meathir4921 as I said, I only had time to briefly try out my favorite weapons, SA and CB are not among them. Personally I think this version of the lance is very smooth and fun to use (and is indirectly buffed by the existence of clashes and lure pods). Unfortunately, the new hammer combos didn't convince me much.
@@Terron29 No MH has ever been a walk in the park, I want to trust that they know what they are doing.
@manuelferrari6685 agreed. Lets hope 🙂
In Wilds, all weapons, without exception, are braindead.
Some, like the Greatsword, LS, CB, and bow, do more damage than others, but the idea is the same. You can redirect a TCS 180° if you feel like it, or cancel the offset rising attack charge just by rolling!!! 😭
I don't care if people make fun of LS mains because, in the end, no weapon in the game now really has much commitment. Literally, the only problem here is the community looking for pathetic excuses to believe they’re better hunters than others just because they use a different weapon, when deep down, they’re all the same!!!
Dev here. We noted some of your key talking points. Truthfully speaking. We’re not going to change much upon the release of the title. Between world and rise. We’ve gathered a lot of key data to bring about a balanced gameplay experience for both veterans and casuals. Both parties should be able to have fun and fortunately long sword is a fan favorite. So we wanted more of the casual playerbase to be able and pick it up to have fun just like most other weapons. That being said. We have some special secrets planned for the endgame that will punish some of these changes so don’t expect the hyperarmor to save you every time! You thought we would add these changes without adding a caveat? (;
Damn I’m a hammer player and I thought the weapon changes they made were bangers. Hammer now just has a bigger bang attack and new ways of transitioning into charge and golf swing. Didn’t know they fucked up other weapons like this
if they nerf LS as you described, non LS players will hate it anyway.
Atleast less LS mains will hate it
Right. Might as well leave it powerful and let Longsword mains have fun
@@RIP_ZYZZ1738 but this whole video is saying he isn't having fun. And I can guarantee you there are other longsword mains out there who also aren't having fun either.
@ Very blanket statement. There’s people who would be dissatisfied with heaven. Some input is effectively worthless
Thats not what we need, we need the weapon to be less cheap. Wilds LS is literally as cheap as free.
I am a CB main, CB felt pretty good in the demo, by the end of the demo i tried out LS, I felt invincible.
The only bit I disagree with is actually giving Helmbreaker hyper armor PERIOD. We just went two full games of Helmbreaker spam being the default playstyle for Longsword, which in many ways rendered the entire idea of building Spirit Levels completely meaningless. It's so easy to build gauge with Foresight Slash alone, and once you hit red, you're Helmbreaker Gaming. For the most part you will spend little-to-no time actually attacking in red gauge. You look for the opportunity to spend it immediately, then wait for the chance to Foresight to get back to red. Rinse and repeat.
My proposal would be this: Helm Breaker and Spirit Release slash should be just as risky as pulling off a full SAED. Remove the ability to sheath mid-air to cancel the attack, and remove all hyper armor from both moves. This should be for big openings only. My reasoning? Because they have done so much to incentivize you to STAY in red gauge! The new Crimson Slash combos are extremely fluid and have crazy mobility, on top of the Spirit meter being infinite. They should slightly buff the damage output of those attacks to encourage you to build to red gauge, and stay there for more than 2 whole seconds. Helmbreaker and Spirit Release are flashy and fun, but I'm honestly pretty burnt out on Foresight --> Helmbreaker --> Foresight --> etc..
Please nerf Longsword
Please buff Switch Axe ;-;
Limitation breeds creativity.
A beautiful communist slogan.
My family in the 1970s and 1980s had to get up at 3 a.m. to stand in very long lines in Poland to buy milk, meat, water which were sold in limited quantities and still on ration cards. Every citizen was limited in how much food they could buy, plus there was a limited assortment. People were buying jeans pants for their entire monthly paycheck. Today, communism has been gone in Poland since almost the early 1990s. Don't tell me about limiting things and how cool it is to be creative. Games exist to be fun, not to be a work. Not to be real world. If something is too strong then make it harder for yourself instead of changing the game for everyone who doesn't necessarily share your point of view.
You can always cover your eyes or play on a dance mat. There are options. Just be creative, don't make others adjust to you.
@@NocnaGlizda communist slogan? it was a game designer who coined that term lol. in game design, limitations allow you to be creative in how you solve problems. if you don't want to solve problems ie gameplay, why play games instead of watch movies?
@@NocnaGlizdapolish people eat piss fish. Pizza was made by fucking peasants, carbonara was made from ww2 rations, garlic bread also made by peasants. Unchecked freedom leads to everyone doing the dame thing as humans are very average the creative stuff comes from people who were already creative due to limitations as limitations make people try to differentiate. Look at music for example its all very similar now that we have autotune and electronic instruments
@@kyeda
Objectively untrue.
Freedom is slavery.
@@NocnaGlizda You're out of your meds, if you compare limitation to communism, as Fellow pole, please, stop.
Reasonable complaints, nevertheless the game will go gold in 2 months so nothing will change :(
If the team wanted limitations, then they would have disabled chaining another special sheath after an ISS. Kept it like in Iceborne where after an ISS you were the most vulnerable, you couldn't do anything until the animation ended.
Its all because they made Spirit Release Slash your strongest move now so you need to get back 2 levels to red insted of one. That inevitably alters the weapons loop. Thats why they made the focus strike gain a spirit level, which is in itself questionable.
Every hunt opening is gonna be: sneak attack, hold R2 charge to get to white- ISS the roar 2 yellow -ISS to red- HB-SRS-ISS chain until back to red and repeat.
They better not mess up Quick sheath.
you wont be able to sneak attack into charged spirit slash if you want to ISS the roar. you'll have to sneak attack and then time ISS or foresight slash with the roar, the charge takes too long.
aside from that.
Nothing will change but thats GOOD. nothing should change and nothing needs to change especially with how LITTLE we know about the game right now. Calling for nerfs this early before experiencing even 10% of the game and what it has to offers with gear, monsters and who knows what else is nothing but foolish.
They have always given the player more fun things, buffs, QoL, etc, in every new main monster hunter game, but the monsters have always come up to meet the hunter.
Theres no reason to believe this game will be any different. the changes on the majority of the weapons feel amazing, if people dont like weapons feeling good to play then they can go back to world or play insect glaive or gimp themselves however they want. You can make the game as hard as you want it to be by yourself. People cant make the devs give them back their QoL that was taken away because some guy on youtube complained.
@@TheCosmicAstro- "you wont be able to sneak attack into charged spirit slash if you want to ISS the roar. you'll have to sneak attack and then time ISS or foresight slash with the roar, the charge takes too long”
Did you actually play the weapon in the beta? You can absolutely charge to white before the roar. Go watch some speedruns.
@LizdardKing86 i played the weapon quite a lot actually. The roar comes out fast.
Maybe it's super tight timing. I could be wrong but from my experience it did not feel long enough between sneak attack and roar to get all 3 of those attacks in.
Nonetheless the rest of my comment was the more important part anyway.
@@TheCosmicAstro-he literally does a sneak attack into spirit charge into holding a FSS in the video. you can go watch people like peppo to see them do the same thing with ISS instead if you want
In my opinion, I was personally disappointed by MHWilds. In the demo, at least. All of the marketing and fans saying, "It's like World but with rise spiced in there," was honestly just completely false. This game felt like MHRise jacked up even higher in terms of speed, commitment, and preparation which is all but gone in Wilds. (At least how it felt with the demo). Add onto this other things I did not like, such as removal of hitstun on nearly all weapons... I was very sad.
I don't think I am going to enjoy this game so much, which is upsetting because I love every other monster hunter game. But this game... didn't feel like monster hunter anymore? Like they took everything out, early. It's just my opinion, though.
I don't think cancelling your Helmbreaker is that big of an issue, all things considered. The problem is that spirit levels are handed to you for free and you get hyper armor on helmbreaker with a nearly unmissable follow-up with also hyper armor. Gross
It’s so sad to see how many comments don’t understand the problem with removing every single weakness from a weapon.
Except they inarguably gave Insect Glaive more weaknesses lmao
Don't you love when they remove a chunk of your weapon's mobility and refuse to give it any counters?
Keep in mind that literally EVERY melee weapon now has a counter except the IG
Imagine they forced Longsword users into red bar before they could use Special Sheathe lmao. If they gave Longsword the IG treatment that could be reality
@ IG definitely got a rough rework. The bad controls are bad enough on their own. I’m a CB main but I also play a lot of longsword and too many weaknesses/not enough weakness can both feel shitty/boring. But also tying IG’s moveset to all 3 buffs is pretty awful.
I've been playing since freedom unite (GS main), and I think the wilds beta made me turn into a doomer.
I've never bounced off a MH so bad than with this beta. I felt absolutely nothing while playing, I did not get my usual MH feel.
To top it all, they completely butchered GS with focus mode, turning it into a boring, braindead and unsatisfying weapon.
Who needs positioning, precision, monster and weapon knowledge, when you can do 180 turns mid swing ? WTF CAPCOM.
Everything feels so safe and guaranteed in this game, you can cancel/block out of almost everything, you can always adjust with focus mode without any drawback. What is going on. That's not my monster hunter.
Yepp, just my thoughts. Games are losing depth and becoming one dimesnional laser shows. But the mass will say: "Doing cool moves is fun". It is so helplessly superficial...
@@criterion9801 I'm so mad man. It kinda feels like a betrayal. "Hey guys, you know that combat you loved for 15+ years ? Yeah so we just decided to kill it so more people can play the game, sorry ! The game is not for you anymore".
This comment section makes me want to step into the nearest intersection, how is it so braindead
This community is quite submissive to anything Capcom throws at them. I've never seen anything like it before.
People who disagree = braindead. Insufferable elitsits.
This community is quite aggressive to any difference in opinion thrown at them. I've never seen anything like it before.
We are all too dumb to realize how stuck up we all are
this is normal in game communities nowadays, people are extremely hostile to opinions of games, maybe because they base their personality around them or just general internet saltiness. in the helldivers community, you get ostracized for saying anything
Man, I'm completely onboard with your thoughts. I couldn't ever play the LS, never found the right time to use the r2 combo to go up the levels and in this beta a could easily beat Rey Dau just holding r2 and helm breaking, no counters needed
i generally agree with your takes but with the many different changes and quality of life updates on all the other weapons got, i doubt they are gonna nerf LS. nerf hyper armour on thrust, and im fine with everything else
I wonder if they will change any gameplay this close to release. I would expect mostly bug fixes until release comes
Funny enough I stopped playing Rise because it was so easy. It was stupid easy. Now even more stuff has been smoothed out to the point where it just feels less, but still too much ease. I don't mind having more options & combos. But the weight of your choices in those combos need to have purpose. We aren't playing DMC. This is MH is basically how I would explain it
As i said once, Rise felt not like Monster hunter but Monster fighter
@@diamsterTry Sunbreak's Risen Shagaru Magala and Primordial Malzeno
I also stopped for the same reason. On top of that, being forced to play that tower defense mode was so annoying.
you must not have played sunbreak. the base game is the tutorial.
Thats also why i stoped playing Worldborne.
I started with 3U
I think you can make the same argument about almost every weapon in mh wilds. For instance focus mode makes greatswords so much less "skill" to use
Sadly I have to agree, every weapon has so many tools it takes effort to suck at the game
I wanna point out that your palamute being named Repede is awesome. I have one named that too. Tales of Vesperia love!
As a LS main from MHW, the biggest issues I see are being able to do Forsight Slash from any move and being able to keep your place in the Spirit Slash combo by merely doing random attacks. The other things you described such as fluidity of moveset after the final Spirit Roundslash and Spirit Charge are great QoL (plus Spirit Charge looks cool AF).
You are right about balance in PvE games. Specially ones where you have to grind for stuff.
I'm fine with playing a weapon that is in the middle of the pack, but it's the worst feeling whenever the weapon that you have the most fun with is so much worse than the top tiers that you get the feeling that you're wasting your time by not playing a better weapon.
Like I don't even main lance, but I think it's unfair that LS have access to so much quality of life and damage, while still having one the best defensive capabilities.
Meanwhile, lance has to deal with it's clunkyness and extremely subpar damage just because it has a shield. As if holding block is all that you need to be EFFECTIVE with the weapon.
I just wish they wouldn't focus solely on nerfing the top tier weapons, but also, buffing the lower tier ones.
Great video as always!
I don't understand how people keep missing the point of balancing.
If it doesn't matter then why can't we kill every monster in one hit.
Challenging gameplay can be it's own reward.
Because even though the weapon is easier and more counter based now, you still have to perform with it and at least put some hours to master it's gameplay, as it is with any other weapon. People always like to pretend that their weapon is super complex when most of the weapons in this game are super easy to pick up, understand, and you can master the gameplay in a few days.
I like the point about challenging gameplay but I don't think the weapon needs to have a bunch of flaws for the gameplay to be challenging. You can still have challenge with a weapon that has a safe moveset... The longsword in rise is even more safe than in wilds and go try fighting hazard zinogre or primal malzeno and see if you have an easy time.
@@yagopagliara8837 so i need to get to end game before starting having fun?
WHOA!!!! Rata complaining that LS is TOO Strong?!? I never thought I would see the day!
He's not the only one. Most LS mains are, even the speed runners like Peppo lol
Hes in the minority and apparently isnt saying its too strong, just that the extra freedom you now have with the weapon makes it less interesting to use to him.
but most people are happy for all of the weapon buffs. Except for the 1 weapon that actually got mostly nerfed lol.
Wilds is going to almost certainly have much harder monsters this time around so the buffs are most likely in line with this new difficulty.
adding a longsword style counter attack to SWAXE is insanely strong. can be activated from neutral as well. Its awesome. its the best swaxe has ever felt. But if these people had their way theyd delete that too.
Thankfully capcom listens to almost no-one so we dont have much to worry about.
@@TheCosmicAstro-Wow SA counter is so strong that it takes chip damage! Just like the LS... wait
@@kokujo5288 nice try but no lol. Welcome back.
Longsword has had the counters for a long time and is balanced around that. Is a quick weapon, good rolls, Sheathes quickly.
Sword mode in swaxe is super slow, bad rolls, sheathes slowly.
The counter GREATLY makes up for these downsides.
Youre comparing nerfing something a weapon has basically always had vs something brand new that makes up for a weapons previous downside.
These are not comparable. Try again.
I already gave you a nice, simple reply even commending the idea IF I agreed Longsword was too strong. Which logically, it isnt, until we can actually play the full game to know for sure. This goes for all weapons.
For now let's just be happy the majority of weapons got fun additions and QoL and instead of being foolishly premature with nerfs, let's talk about things like performance and hoping they don't make end-game an RNG grindfest of nightmares again.
@@TheCosmicAstro- Do you hear yourself right now. You are advocating the downside of a weapon because "it needed it" yet will defend LS when it didn't need alot of what it got.
He basically says remember when you level past 30 in dd2 everything starts feeling easy, that.
Yup, i can echo this as a greatsword main. Most of the weapons' difficulty came from having to carefully position yourself in order to hit the monsters, while having to find small openings to get your charges in. In Wilds however this is essentially completely removed. The ability to just...redirect your weapon anywhere is a nice bonus for most weapons but for GS it completely removes the skill floor and CONCIDERABLY lowers the skill ceiling.
Oh and on a side note, not getting a SINGLE new move is INSANE to me.
We technically got the counter. And the focus mode, that completely kills the fun of GS. Great job capcom.
@Rytom No because that's literally a move from Gen 1 just with an additional property lmao
@@ShikiRyougi05 Yes, same thing for perfect guard/clashes on GS. Some moves gained properties. The fact you keep your charge level through a successful shoulder tackle is already a huge buff. I don't think GS needed it, even less so with focus mode.
@Rytom i'm not trying to imply that GS seems weak, quite the opposite to me it appears extremely strong BUUUT i just wanted something new for the sake of being new lol, maybe rise spoiled me too much with all the cool things GS has there.
@@ShikiRyougi05 Sure, I get what you mean.
Longsword is approaching Tonfa levels of busted.
Longsword was never overpowered, even in base Rise it was outperformed by every ranged weapon, but y'all act like they just don't exist. It's not difficult to check DPS calcs and speedrun averages, Longsword is consistently mid. Lance was stronger in Sunbreak.
@@synysterdawn8913 Nobody is talking about DPS.
@@DogiTheWallcrusher Me when I spread misinformation on the internet. People have always complained about Longsword dealing too much damage, and then Capcom nerfed several MVs and its Spirit Gauge multipliers for Sunbreak. Let's keep the goalposts firmly in place.
@@synysterdawn8913 dude you're crossing your internet debate lines.
balance in pve should be considered to put as many players as possible on the same field
if 2 players like one weapon each, one weapon is op and the other is mediocre
the monsters will cause disproportionate experiences between players, one will say the game is too hard and the other will say the opposite.
besides, players have preferences and tastes, they shouldnt be punished because they didnt like a bowgun or the fav. weapon of the developers
absolutely advocate for adeguate nerfs and buffs between weapons
starting from long sword nerfs
also i heard swaxe didnt manage to keep up as much, not high enough MV
as a HH player who's barely touched LS in the past, let me see if I understand the changes correctly: You can counter at practically any time, your strongest attack has both hyper-armor AND can be canceled out of, and interacting with the spirit gauge at all is now a minor, optional optimization instead of a core part of the moveset. And this is on what has been in recent games THE most popular weapon. Have I got that right? Because honestly it sounds like cheating lol.
Things like this makes me think that ever since Ryozo Tsujimoto became the series director, Monster Hunter changes always spiralled to this direction, he is a very unique marketing genius that his main concern always been maximizing the profits this IP did and claims it in every famitsu and game journalism interview in japan, he is more interested in the profitmaking than the game's identity. However he also knows how to force changes and still leave game making to the development teams, who know the best the feel of the game to make it more in tune with the series vision, a thing normal marketing focused executives don't do in videogames.
Every change he's been a part with alongside his sideprojects always had one goal, expand it's audience and potential customers and he plays this careful game of always taking desitions as a series director of siding to what will make more money to what is right for the series and for the current consumers. Gameplay and weapon balance is one of the many desitions he pushes the game to make it more accessible to players which he knowingly know veterans will dislike but will complain for a while and tjen tolerate it at the benefit that it will attract even more players that didn't try or refunded the game and won't play it in the first place because "combat is too clunky" type negative reviews are taken as a feedback, for us is a "git gud" or "this game ain't for you". For Ryozo this is lost profit and here we have the changes.
There is a lot, lot, lot more changes to the series behind the game making but this is one of many, i can tell the more and more westernized feel, ambience and narrative getting closer to AAA games with each gen, with Wilds being the current closest, their focus on graphics and less care for gameplay performance because console players care less about things and is a more profitable market that complains less about this things. And the deviation to off brand projects like, the Stories off shoot for the younger audiences and pokemon fans to attract them to main series, portable games for the mobile market, AR projects and even that awful movie, the series director been behind all this for only one purpose. Maximizing profit, and if our interest don't align or leverage against his profits he won't move a finger and ignore us, but that's just the way things are ever he became the series director.
World sold 25 million+ and longsword is top 3 most popular weapon, it's not going to get nerfed.
I don't even mind it, these games are 300 hour+ investments, I'll take anything that makes the game more fun to play and they aren't scared to add insanely strong monsters anyway. Longsword has always been broken as shit. Skill claimers can cope however they want and yeah optimal longsword play where you counter everything takes skill but its a speedrun weapon for a reason.
Honestly biggest worry for me is that i feel like the game is becoming too easy. With tools like focus mode you dont actually even need to know your weapon to be good at it. Maybe its cuz im not a new comer but i hope the game can bring some challenge
Not to mention the qol red flash when your about to cart. It's nice but makes you need to pay attention to the monster less
I appreciate the desire for complex decision making, but don't you think the whole game is moving in a more high speed reaction based direction from past entries? More aggressive monsters with quicker attacks, aim mode allowing players to redirect moves they'd have to plan seconds in advance to land in the past, no need for monster tracking- feels like they want the game overall to feel a bit less deliberate.
Your hitting some nails on some heads here my friend. Its that very direction that is dividing people. Its a bit like older souls games vs newer ones. Compare elden ring to dark souls 1 in terms of combat pacing or even dark souls 3 to 1.
That's exactly the problem. Players get buffed for "convenience", monsters get stronger to compensate so the game can still have challenge, and the whole flow of combat becomes sped up and less deliberate.
Which is not a good thing in Monster Hunter's case.
@@JF-vz1ju i still feel it was very deliberate personally. its just a faster pace which i also enjoy. its a sweet spot between world and rise. i just played some master rank espinas in rise and was realizing how much FASTER EVERY ANIMATION is in rise compared to wilds beta. we will see as time progresses.
yes!! the whole series is leaning towards a more fast paced reaction based playstyle, while in old games sometimes it felt like you were playing a turn based rpg. It's not good or bad, it's just different and fits the flow of the game better
@@JF-vz1ju why do you think it's not a good thing? I'd like to know your opinion.
Meanwhile ranged weapons being op in liturally every MH and no one complains about it.
they don't exist
hey bro, you forget your medicine today
Gunlance guy here. I don't have anything in particular to say about the video: I think that there's a very good reason why Long Sword is the de-facto most played weapon type, and I wish other weapon types had more work done into making them as refined and/or rewarding to use.
Gunlance forever
Finally he understands what us old gen hunters are talking about regarding intentionality of combat. EVERYTHING is getting so fast that it's all about reaction now, not plan/prep.
I was really skeptical about many other changes but oh man was I wrong. Wounds are an incredible system for dynamic objectives and feed wonderfully into the focus attack punish against signature moves. Offset attacks are such a nuanced way to bring counters to World's grounded combat.
Calling it now. Game of a generation.
These are such pointless complaints.
You have zero information besides a beta with altered everything. You fought 3 different creatures, 2 jokes, and 1 challenge with set equipment and determined weapon needs to change because you dont like it. You assumed most players are advanced players like you, when most could barely get past World base monsters without online help.
You have zero understanding of the devs' intentions or purpose, yet somehow think the weapon needs to be nerfed?
Im impressed but not surprised. This is the same exact complaing that ppl had about Worlds changes from older games.
Only comment here I absolutely agree with.
Only non neckbeard take fr
Yet you presume to make the opposite assumptions based on the same info. Your input amounts to "stop talking about things".
Next time, if you have absolutely nothing to add to a conversation, you can simply not post.
The man made an in depth video, showcasing exactly what had changed, and how, and you're going to just completely ignore it all because he has "zero understanding of the devs' intentions or purpose."
Their intentions, or purpose, do not matter to the point he made. The weapon, to him, has a minimal amount of risk for the reward you get out of it. He doesn't like that.
That's it. That's the video. The devs can say whatever they want about WHY they did it but it's not going to change how he feels.
As another commenter noted here, you are making the reverse assumptions with the same understanding of what the game is going to be like. If what they said is pointless then so is what you wasted your time typing.
100%