Do not apologize for ranting. Ranting is a GOOD thing. This is Game Show Garbage after all (I refuse to call it by "that" current name). One problem with your vid is that your sound pitch is low when you are talking, but the sound effects and music cues is loud pitch. You'll need to fix that in the future.
I saw just about every episode of The MGHS Hour when they first aired. First of all, the theme music is INCIDENTAL music, NOT theme music. Seeing Gene again was great. The panel selection was often not great. You are correct in that Leonard would have also been great on the 1973-82 version. If Peter Marshall had been chosen to host, MGHS Hour would have been at least enjoyable in a nostalgic vein. Great video as always!!
@@jasonbeard4713 I always thought that had this aired as a Sunday night at ten pm weekly show, it would have been successful. "Bloopers" specials did well on NBC in that time slot. But it would have needed Peter to do it, and they would have had to change Hollywood Squares to be more like the original with bluffs and earned wins. I loved it in 1983-84 as an after school show, but watching it again after it came out of mothballs, I found some of the panelists to be awful. Fred Travelena, Michael Winslow, and Edie McClurg were obnoxious. It was good to see George Gobel and Phillis Diller, and of course Charles. I always wished they could have gotten Brett and Richard to have appeared too. With Brett, Richard, Charles, Rose Marie and George Gobel, it would have been a great week.
Someone said somewhere on one of the MGHS videos that it was intended to be just a filler until "Santa Barbara" was ready to go. I'd never read that outside of UA-cam comments, but it does seem to make sense. They had to come up with a fairly complicated mystery story about who killed Channing Capwell, that it would make sense they needed some time to do the writing, casting, and so on.
YES! It was so bad that the only major highlight of that show was the infamous “$50 DAMN DOLLARS” episode where a team of women won the game with just…you guessed it 50 DAMN DOLLARS. J.D. Roth was ribbing them all throughout the very end of that episode that he even got the audience to join in unison.
@@williambone7724 - For seeing hot babes in leather pants that you rarely see on other shows? Yes. But for the poor man's Hot Potato gameplay? You must enjoy "There's Something About Miriam" if you enjoy Sex Wars.
NBC replaced MGHS Hour with the soap opera "Santa Barbara" starting in July 1984. Goodson wanted to do an hour-long Match Game, but NBC wanted him to combine Match Game with Hollywood Squares. Goodson wanted one host, but NBC insisted on two hosts, which is how we got Gene Rayburn and Jon Bauman co-hosting. MGHS Hour was doomed because the network and the producer were not on the same page about what the show should be.
NBC deserves blame even more! Did they really think they could trust Mark Goodson in running a Merrill Heater game show? If you are going to do two game shows as one by separate companies, then get the OWNERS OF THE OTHER GAME SHOW to produce THEIR SHOW ONLY instead!
Eubanks was a little overrated. He was so-so on Card Sharks. He probably would have been good for Match Game though over Ross Shafer and Michael Burger.
@@juicyfartsofjimcornette1154 Agreed. I liked Jim Perry way more on Card Sharks. Bob was good at light hearted comedic game shows like Newlywed Game. Those fit his snarky sense of humor much more than more serious quiz shows.
Not a Goodson - Todman show but what was the name of the stupid Battle of the Sexes game show from the early 2000's that had two hosts who hated each other and the contestants had to come up with answers ala 'Hot Potato' but without the potato?
Dick Martin did a better job with Mindreaders in office run-thrus than on the air. When he got into the studio he became a deer in the headlights. He was awkward and seemed a little disoriented. The concept behind Mindreaders was devised by Goodson himself. The problem was that nobody on staff had the guts to tell the big boss that his format sucked. He found out the hard way as the show was cancelled before finishing its original 26-week commitment. Note that Goodson's most successful shows were conceived by people other than Mark Goodson. It doesn't stand to reason that a high-profile show like Family Feud would be recorded on used tape stock as that expense was borne by the production company which owned the tapes and all of the content on them.
In introducing Password All-Stars, you mentioned replacing celeb+contestant with just celebs. There was an interesting experiment that went the other way. For six weeks in 1979, the $20,000 Pyramid became Junior Partner Pyramid, where a child and an adult relative, usually a parent, played together. Not only was the game play not as good as what they normally had, but it was awkward to see a child frustrated with the parent's play. The broader issue with having teams that knew each other was illustrated at least once in a surviving episode, when a parent made reference to a family member.
I knew Mindreaders was gonna be #1, but Buzzr did air the pilot as part of their "Lost & Found" block. As for The Better Sex, even though I never heard the theme song, I would rather listen to Olivia Rodrigo (even though she is very talented) than that. MGHSH: Yeah, hit or miss, save for theme, set and Gene Rayburn. What's Going On? and Number Please- I didn't see it. And Password All-Stars, is another case of "If it ain't broke, don't fix it." I'm glad it didn't tarnish the show as a whole with every other version that came after this version. I'm surprised Trivia Trap is on the list, it was actually good, but i think it was the format change that did it in. And as for Card Sharks 2001, yeah, less said about that show the better.
I'm glad you brought up Buzzr airing the Mindreaders pilot, just because it builds on the discussion of Dick Martin's hosting in the video - I felt, watching that pilot, that it was very obvious Dick was drunk while doing it. Not that I blame him, but that was probably a bad sign for the show right from the gate.
I agree with you on the Match Game -Hollywood Squares Hour, but you have to admit it was fun seeing Gene Rayburn in his element on Match Game, for the final time.
I agree. The version of Match Game used on MGHS Hour would be my favorite version of Match Game if the bastardized Hollywood Squares didn't drag it down.
Now we need the Top 5 BEST Mark Goodson-Bill Todman game shows! I imagine The Price is Right will be number one, as well as Family Feud, Card Sharks, and Match Game being on the list. What do you think, Cyndi?
Orson Bean, Nipsey Russell and Dick Martin are fantastic celebrity contestants. You used the right word when you said that Dick was "LOST". Peter Marshall was a comedy straight man in the Bud Abbott and Dean Martin genre. I rank Better Sex, Mind Readers and Musical Chairs as horrible games that had good guys as hosts.
Dick Martin hosted a syndicated game show called “ The Cheap Show”. It was a comedy game show kind of like 1.98 beauty show. Bearde who was a writer on Laugh-In and the Gong Show produced it. It aired weekly during the 1978-79 season. There’s video of it here on UA-cam. I think Dick was much better in that format than Mindreaders.
Snap Judgment aired on NBC in 1969 as a Password variation that replaced its original format (one member of a celebrity- contestant team wrote clues to mystery words shown in advance on paper before taping for the teammate to guess the mystery word during the game) for the same rules as Password for its final 13 weeks. No episodes are known to exist anywhere. Wiped by NBC and Goodson Todman never bothered to save any episodes on videotape. There should have been a large cash bonus in Trivia Trap if one player selects the right answer from the 4 choices from the first reveal or each member eliminating the wrong answers one by one for a lower cash amount. Reward for knowing the answer at the start. Wasn't that bad.
22:27 my opinion, the reason Nipsey isnt great as a host is because a host is supposed to be a conduit. He's there to put the game and the contestants over. Nipsey doesnt play that role well, he kinda "overshadows" things with his humor. But I've always said I think he would have done well with You Bet Your Life if he ever had the oppurtunity. Let's be honest, that wasnt much of a game and was neant to be an outlet for the host's humor.
There have been many shows where the host is introduced as "the star of" the show. There have been very few where it was true and the show was still good. (Dawson Feud is one of those.)
Ah. You Bet Your Life. The original Weakest Link. Watching for the host and not for it's awful gameplay. Groucho was a great comedian, but an awful game show host. Why he didn't host a talk show is one of those mysteries that baffles me to this day.
Great review and I agree with you--EXCEPT I did like the MINDREADERS set and the audience Jury in the audience--but it needed a real host. Dick always seemed like he was waiting for a offstage cue. Thanks for posting this!
My Thoughts: #5 (What's Going On?): I agree, this show was too ahead of its time. #4 (Match Game Hollywood Squares Hour): At least the theme is a banger, but IMO, this show sucked. #3: (Password All-Stars): Agreed in all forms. THIS KILLED the original Password. Thank God Password Plus and Super Password saved it. #2 (The Better Sex): GOD THAT THEME SONG IS AWFUL. Dishonorable Mentions: Number Please: A pretty meh show to me at least. Trivia Trap: I actually liked this show, somewhat. And the theme is nice. (but that's my opinion) Card Sharks (2001): Let's just not talk about this... #1: (Mindreaders): JUST. NO. BATTLE OF THE SEXES GIMMICKS JUST CAN'T WORK. Again, this is just my opinion. If you liked any of these shows, that's fine.
I tried watching a couple episodes of MG/HS Hour on BUZZR, and I just can't get into it at all. Love the opening song, and could see why it was used on Price is Right for many years. However, the rest of the game is just... meh. The Match Game portion is significantly better than the Hollywood Squares one, but by this point Match Game had lost a lot of the luster that made it so great. It needed a panel of zany celebrities with Gene playing off of them so well. This version more often than not was soap opera stars, as soaps were at the height of their popularity with all the super couples in the mid 80s, and the humor/fun of the 70s version just wasn't there. The Hollywood Squares portion is a huge train wreck. It was a big mistake to give Mark Goodson creative control of a show he never produced. Taking out the bluffs and zingers made it a very boring "either/or" game. Also, not having contestants earn their wins took out a lot of the excitement and drama that made Hollywood Squares so great. Hollywood Squares needed a straight man, which is what made Peter Marshall so good (and Tom Bergeron as well). Bowser was no straight man, and neither was John Davidson, and I think that's why I can't stand either of those versions of Hollywood Squares.
Beat the Clock '79 either way could have been a dishonorable mention, not just for the celebrity version, but just for a broken format. As nothing matters until the shuffleboard game. It was okay otherwise.
Now You See It with Chuck Henry was the worst the revival bombed after only 20 weeks,the second is The Match Game Hollywood Squares Hour was a complete disaster for NBC,Jon Bowser Bauman didn't clicked as host,he went on become a VH1 VJ when it launched in 1985.
The Jack Narz version of NYSI from 1974-75 is so much better. I watched one episode of NYSI-89, and Chuck Henry looked utterly bored in his role as host, like he'd rather be anywhere else on earth but on the set of NYSI.
It's interesting, I agree with pretty much all of this lineup yet there are little tweaks my version would probably have. I think I'd flip Match Game/Hollywood Squares Hour and What's Going On?. Match Game/Hollywood Squares feels like it was closer to realizing its potential of the two - a few format and presentation changes and a better co-host would get the Squares half up to par and fix most of the issues. What's Going On? on the other hand feels like it reaches *too* far for its time. You're right when when you say that it had potential, but since the technology just wasn't there I don't think there was any way it *could* reach that potential. Match Game/Hollywood Squares has a path to its full potential, so I think it deserves to go up a slot. The one show I actually think I'd omit on this list? Of all things, Password All-Stars. If Card Sharks 2001 is considered eligible, I would put it there instead. Password All-Stars was an unnecessary attempt at needlessly complicating things, and it does have the all-celebrity flaw, but I think that in its heart, it's still Password in a way Card Sharks 2001 just *isn't* Card Sharks. The thing is, if I was to truly put together my own version of this list, I'd have to dip into unsold pilots because what I *really* want to put in #3 is one. It's funny, you indirectly touched on it when you mentioned Nipsey Russell as a host - it would be Star Words. That show had an interesting gameplay idea - for a single segment of a larger show. It was way too little to flesh out a full half hour, I remember thinking right away while watching it that the format was fundamentally broken, and - like you said - Nipsey Russell just wasn't right for hosting it. It was just a mess on enough levels that I'd put it on the list. But on the other hand, introducing unsold pilots and counting Card Sharks 2001 as eligible would mean the *other* mid-90s pilots would be eligible, which would within seconds turn this entire list into Mindreaders, The Better Sex, MG2, Card Sharks 1996 and a wild card. Even if I ultimately would disagree with some of the placements I can't argue with your list in the end.
If CS2001 is eligible (as it still used the Mark Goodson branding) I would...actually not be so sure about the previous revivals. All had terrible elements but some redemption as well...I guess Match Game '98 could have been less annoying, not so cheap if possible, and not always taking refuge in the lowest common denominator; Family Feud '99 (the Anderson seasons were the only with MGP branding no?) could have lost the broken format where only the triple round matters; and TTTT2K...I guess really just lose Paula Poundstone. As for Feud and Price '94, neither strike me as particularly awful although they both had baggage.
Mindreaders was unquestionably the weakest show of Mark Goodson’s projects. Dick Martin looked so lost here and had very little to nothing to work with here versus what he was given on his other game show he hosted in “The Cheap Show” where it at least had some humor there even if that series itself felt goofy and not exactly the good kind of goofy.
Mindreaders had two things going for it - Johnny Olsen as announcer, and its awesome disco-inspired theme song. The theme was later reused for a pilot called "The Puzzlers", hosted by Pat Sajak in 1980(?)
While Trivia Trap got a dishonorable mention, I personally think that it should have made the top five. Mainly because of the pacing. The front part of the game (cutting the wrong answers) seemed to drag. And then the $1,000 Trivia Race went into overdrive. I was also a bit perplexed by the bonus round. Also, with the show Number Please, if you listen closely, there was music CONSTANTLY playing in the background, and not at select times.
I actually liked Match Game/Hollywood Squares' format, even if I didn't recognize half the stars on the show. The show refused to bring back Peter Marshall to do the Squares segments, and John Bauman looked so uncomfortable hosting the show and seemingly tried to over-compensate. Gene Rayburn reportedly wasn't impressed with him either. They also supposedly didn't have the "liquid lunches" from the original, which probably didn't help either. 😂 Score Productions later recycled most of the music as Price is Right prize themes, so glass half full, right? Now, Goodson/Todman DID do The Better Sex, which probably should be unforgivable.
Not only that, but like Cyndi said, the ultimate issue was that the celebrity panelists weren't briefed on the questions, which meant no chance to create bluffs, which is where the memorable moments of Hollywood Squares originate. Even Gene on air when he truly didn't know an answer made a comment to the effect of "I don't know, I have to take a Wild guess... which isn't the premise of this game".
I agree. I have felt for a long time that with a more faithful Squares half and a better co-host (not even Marshall, necessarily, just someone better at wrangling celebrities like Bob Eubanks or Bert Convy) Match Game/Hollywood Squares had the potential to be excellent. It just couldn't realize what it could have been with that half holding it back.
My three picks for worst Goodson-Todman shows go to Mindreaders (for such a dull format), Password All-Stars (for switching to all celebs in obviously a desperate attempt at ratings), and What's Going On? (for being overly ambitious with the concept of satellite technology on a game show back in the 50s). With The Better Sex and Match Game-Hollywood Squares, at least there could be some good in them. In TBS' case, Bill Anderson's masterful hosting (which came in handy doing Fandango five years after TBS ended) along with the bluffing concept and in MG-HS' case... well, the Match Game portion and Gene Rayburn's hosting. What Goodson did to the HS portion was unforgivable and Jon Bauman wasn't exactly the right host. They could've had Peter Marshall returning as host...
@Will N If Orion had gotten involved and told Goodson that HS should had played the way Quigley/Hetter Productions did it, it would had lasted a little longer
@@Superlad945 - Tell that to NBC since they were the ones that wanted the Match Game+Hollywood Squares Hour, and were stupid enough not to get Merrill Heatter involved for Squares alone!
@@juicyfartsofjimcornette1154 Scrabble didn't always have man-vs-woman match-ups. They had a few game show weeks where game show hosts would compete against each other, an there were VERY few female game show hosts in the 1980's. In fact, the only two I can think of are Betty White from Just Men! and Leslie Uggams from Fantasy. As for Wink's High Rollers, that show only lasted one season. Hollywood Squares ran from 1966-1981 in its original incarnation.
@@petercolbeysgameshowmania7176 - And based off of that response, *not all versions of Hollywood Squares was man versus woman!* I'm sure you know who I'm talking about.
Can't wait for the worst format changes. Oh heck I'll make some predictions/suggestions: - ANYTHING with Celebrity added to the title... (and somehow I think I named the #1 answer ;-)) (extra discredit to Celebrity Bullseye for also adding best 2/3 main games, so we have to deal longer with a watered-down format per episode, and no bonus game in sight sometimes!) - Play the Percentages solo format, only Geoff saved it. That and at least Barry-Enright didn't make that into Celebrity Play the Percentages. - Hollywood Squares catches Millionaire fever and changes the endgame. - Bullseye/Bankroll - $400 wins the Feud - YMMV, but Password Plus goes to $500 wins (I didn't dislike it, but can see how a potential non-Alphabetics-having episode could bore some people) - Based on Cyndi's comments here...the car game is added to Card Sharks? (again didn't mind, but A. cut time out of the show. For that matter, adding the audience polls did the same somewhat too. B. you could win big in the Money Cards but still feel like a loser) - The ever-changing Sale of the Century bonus game. Losing the shopping end game kind of bit into the buying prizes gimmick of the show, and we lost the feel of risk in every front game to see whether or not the champion would go to the next plateau of prizes. And don't get me started how out of place the Winner's Big Money Game was.
I would hardly call whatever they did after the Speed Round "bonus games" since YOU CAN'T ACTUALLY LOSE in them. The Winner's Big Money Game was for the better.
Although I admit to its weaknesses, I am still pretty much the MG/HS defender. But I'll add another annoyance... The show being an NBC infomercial, essentially. Aside from choices of celebrities because of this, there were LOTS of questions that referenced their shows. The #1 answer in the Super Match was an NBC title, more often than not, to the point where an uneducated person might ask if they were rigged. And don't get me started on the Mr. Smith megapush of 83.
I know there isn't much love for The Better Sex theme, but it's jazzy and you can clap along to it. The MGHS theme might be as good a game show theme as I've heard. I wonder if there was ever a thought to recycle it for Card Sharks '86 like the original used the old Double Dare theme
As for Dick Martin's participation, he was more in his element with 1978's "The Cheap Show", which was played largely for laughs. But with Mindreaders, he can't host straight.
Match Game- Hollywood Squares Hour may have been a trainwreck, but that theme song fucking slaps. Damn good TPIR cue.
Pat Bullard was horrible in Card Sharks!
Sadly, I hate unfunny and annoying Bruce Forsythe even more on Play Your Cards Right!
Do not apologize for ranting. Ranting is a GOOD thing. This is Game Show Garbage after all (I refuse to call it by "that" current name).
One problem with your vid is that your sound pitch is low when you are talking, but the sound effects and music cues is loud pitch. You'll need to fix that in the future.
I can name a "battle of the sexes" game show that worked. It was a little number called "Hollywood Squares". Men play X, and women play O.
Bud Collyer doing 2-3 shows at once. Truly a job...FOR SUPERMAN!
Santa Barbara was the show that replaced Match Game-Hollywood Squares Hour when it was cancelled.
I saw just about every episode of The MGHS Hour when they first aired. First of all, the theme music is INCIDENTAL music, NOT theme music. Seeing Gene again was great. The panel selection was often not great. You are correct in that Leonard would have also been great on the 1973-82 version. If Peter Marshall had been chosen to host, MGHS Hour would have been at least enjoyable in a nostalgic vein. Great video as always!!
@@jasonbeard4713 - "First of all, the theme music is INCIDENTAL music, NOT theme music."
*What difference does that make!?!*
@@jasonbeard4713 I always thought that had this aired as a Sunday night at ten pm weekly show, it would have been successful. "Bloopers" specials did well on NBC in that time slot. But it would have needed Peter to do it, and they would have had to change Hollywood Squares to be more like the original with bluffs and earned wins. I loved it in 1983-84 as an after school show, but watching it again after it came out of mothballs, I found some of the panelists to be awful. Fred Travelena, Michael Winslow, and Edie McClurg were obnoxious. It was good to see George Gobel and Phillis Diller, and of course Charles. I always wished they could have gotten Brett and Richard to have appeared too. With Brett, Richard, Charles, Rose Marie and George Gobel, it would have been a great week.
Someone said somewhere on one of the MGHS videos that it was intended to be just a filler until "Santa Barbara" was ready to go. I'd never read that outside of UA-cam comments, but it does seem to make sense. They had to come up with a fairly complicated mystery story about who killed Channing Capwell, that it would make sense they needed some time to do the writing, casting, and so on.
@gildersleevefan67 I agree. Goodson missed this opportunity. One of his few failures.
Actually, "Number Please" replaced "Beat the Clock" on ABC, so Bud was still doing two shows simultaneously.
A Worst format changes video in the future?
I feel _Debt_ & Syndicated _Millionaire_ will be mentioned.
Cyndi, I can add another battle of the sexes show that stunk. "Sex Wars" with JD Roth & Jennifer Cole.
It was bad, really really bad. I did a written induction on it years ago. Here's the link to that: www.gameshowgarbage.com/ind251_sexwars.html
YES! It was so bad that the only major highlight of that show was the infamous “$50 DAMN DOLLARS” episode where a team of women won the game with just…you guessed it 50 DAMN DOLLARS. J.D. Roth was ribbing them all throughout the very end of that episode that he even got the audience to join in unison.
Strip Poker was even worse which also had Jennifer Coles in it.
Actually, Sex Wars was pretty good!
@@williambone7724 - For seeing hot babes in leather pants that you rarely see on other shows? Yes. But for the poor man's Hot Potato gameplay? You must enjoy "There's Something About Miriam" if you enjoy Sex Wars.
When you discuss the worst format changes I hope you at least mention Final 4 Forced Firemaking on Survivor.
NBC replaced MGHS Hour with the soap opera "Santa Barbara" starting in July 1984.
Goodson wanted to do an hour-long Match Game, but NBC wanted him to combine Match Game with Hollywood Squares. Goodson wanted one host, but NBC insisted on two hosts, which is how we got Gene Rayburn and Jon Bauman co-hosting. MGHS Hour was doomed because the network and the producer were not on the same page about what the show should be.
NBC deserves blame even more! Did they really think they could trust Mark Goodson in running a Merrill Heater game show? If you are going to do two game shows as one by separate companies, then get the OWNERS OF THE OTHER GAME SHOW to produce THEIR SHOW ONLY instead!
Trivia Trap totally sucked! Bob Eubanks is no quizmaster!
Eubanks was a little overrated. He was so-so on Card Sharks. He probably would have been good for Match Game though over Ross Shafer and Michael Burger.
@@juicyfartsofjimcornette1154 Agreed. I liked Jim Perry way more on Card Sharks. Bob was good at light hearted comedic game shows like Newlywed Game. Those fit his snarky sense of humor much more than more serious quiz shows.
Not a Goodson - Todman show but what was the name of the stupid Battle of the Sexes game show from the early 2000's that had two hosts who hated each other and the contestants had to come up with answers ala 'Hot Potato' but without the potato?
Sex Wars was the show. It was pretty bad.
Now it WOULD be funny if someone tossed a potato at those involved with that!
The jump the shark moment for J.D. Roth. Makes Bill Cullen hosting The Joker's Wild not too bad now, doesn't it?
Dick Martin did a better job with Mindreaders in office run-thrus than on the air. When he got into the studio he became a deer in the headlights. He was awkward and seemed a little disoriented.
The concept behind Mindreaders was devised by Goodson himself. The problem was that nobody on staff had the guts to tell the big boss that his format sucked. He found out the hard way as the show was cancelled before finishing its original 26-week commitment. Note that Goodson's most successful shows were conceived by people other than Mark Goodson.
It doesn't stand to reason that a high-profile show like Family Feud would be recorded on used tape stock as that expense was borne by the production company which owned the tapes and all of the content on them.
TRIVIA TRAP WAS ON ABC FROM 1984 TO 1985 IT WAS REPLACED ALL STAR BLITZ.
In introducing Password All-Stars, you mentioned replacing celeb+contestant with just celebs. There was an interesting experiment that went the other way. For six weeks in 1979, the $20,000 Pyramid became Junior Partner Pyramid, where a child and an adult relative, usually a parent, played together. Not only was the game play not as good as what they normally had, but it was awkward to see a child frustrated with the parent's play. The broader issue with having teams that knew each other was illustrated at least once in a surviving episode, when a parent made reference to a family member.
I knew Mindreaders was gonna be #1, but Buzzr did air the pilot as part of their "Lost & Found" block.
As for The Better Sex, even though I never heard the theme song, I would rather listen to Olivia Rodrigo (even though she is very talented) than that.
MGHSH: Yeah, hit or miss, save for theme, set and Gene Rayburn.
What's Going On? and Number Please- I didn't see it.
And Password All-Stars, is another case of "If it ain't broke, don't fix it." I'm glad it didn't tarnish the show as a whole with every other version that came after this version.
I'm surprised Trivia Trap is on the list, it was actually good, but i think it was the format change that did it in. And as for Card Sharks 2001, yeah, less said about that show the better.
It's why I said that I'm saving a longer rant on that for a Worst Format Changes list.
I'm glad you brought up Buzzr airing the Mindreaders pilot, just because it builds on the discussion of Dick Martin's hosting in the video - I felt, watching that pilot, that it was very obvious Dick was drunk while doing it. Not that I blame him, but that was probably a bad sign for the show right from the gate.
Actually, "What's Going On?" could have been a hit had it premiered in the spring or summer, and over a better-healed network like CBS or NBC.
I agree with you on the Match Game -Hollywood Squares Hour, but you have to admit it was fun seeing Gene Rayburn in his element on Match Game, for the final time.
Peter Marshall knew that the MGHSH was going to suck due to the Hollywood Squares format. Plus there was no secret square.
I agree. The version of Match Game used on MGHS Hour would be my favorite version of Match Game if the bastardized Hollywood Squares didn't drag it down.
@@LittleRockElevators - How do you know this?
@@brycelandon6387 - You can thank NBC for trusting Mark Goodson to do no wrong, instead of getting Merrill Heater to produce Squares alone.
Now we need the Top 5 BEST Mark Goodson-Bill Todman game shows! I imagine The Price is Right will be number one, as well as Family Feud, Card Sharks, and Match Game being on the list. What do you think, Cyndi?
Double Dare (Jeopardy! style) would be my number 1.
Orson Bean, Nipsey Russell and Dick Martin are fantastic celebrity contestants. You used the right word when you said that Dick was "LOST". Peter Marshall was a comedy straight man in the Bud Abbott and Dean Martin genre. I rank Better Sex, Mind Readers and Musical Chairs as horrible games that had good guys as hosts.
Dick Martin hosted a syndicated game show called “ The Cheap Show”. It was a comedy game show kind of like 1.98 beauty show. Bearde who was a writer on Laugh-In and the Gong Show produced it. It aired weekly during the 1978-79 season. There’s video of it here on UA-cam. I think Dick was much better in that format than Mindreaders.
Snap Judgment aired on NBC in 1969 as a Password variation that replaced its original format (one member of a celebrity- contestant team wrote clues to mystery words shown in advance on paper before taping for the teammate to guess the mystery word during the game) for the same rules as Password for its final 13 weeks. No episodes are known to exist anywhere. Wiped by NBC and Goodson Todman never bothered to save any episodes on videotape.
There should have been a large cash bonus in Trivia Trap if one player selects the right answer from the 4 choices from the first reveal or each member eliminating the wrong answers one by one for a lower cash amount. Reward for knowing the answer at the start. Wasn't that bad.
22:27 my opinion, the reason Nipsey isnt great as a host is because a host is supposed to be a conduit. He's there to put the game and the contestants over. Nipsey doesnt play that role well, he kinda "overshadows" things with his humor. But I've always said I think he would have done well with You Bet Your Life if he ever had the oppurtunity. Let's be honest, that wasnt much of a game and was neant to be an outlet for the host's humor.
There have been many shows where the host is introduced as "the star of" the show. There have been very few where it was true and the show was still good. (Dawson Feud is one of those.)
Ah. You Bet Your Life. The original Weakest Link. Watching for the host and not for it's awful gameplay.
Groucho was a great comedian, but an awful game show host. Why he didn't host a talk show is one of those mysteries that baffles me to this day.
Great review and I agree with you--EXCEPT I did like the MINDREADERS set and the audience Jury in the audience--but it needed a real host. Dick always seemed like he was waiting for a offstage cue. Thanks for posting this!
Number Please had a very annoying background music with xylophone which became distracting in a few seconds.
It also seemed like they were trying to rip off Concentration with the calling of numbers.
To his credit, Dick Martin was great on The Cheap Show!
My Thoughts:
#5 (What's Going On?): I agree, this show was too ahead of its time.
#4 (Match Game Hollywood Squares Hour): At least the theme is a banger, but IMO, this show sucked.
#3: (Password All-Stars): Agreed in all forms. THIS KILLED the original Password. Thank God Password Plus and Super Password saved it.
#2 (The Better Sex): GOD THAT THEME SONG IS AWFUL.
Dishonorable Mentions:
Number Please: A pretty meh show to me at least.
Trivia Trap: I actually liked this show, somewhat. And the theme is nice. (but that's my opinion)
Card Sharks (2001): Let's just not talk about this...
#1: (Mindreaders): JUST. NO. BATTLE OF THE SEXES GIMMICKS JUST CAN'T WORK.
Again, this is just my opinion. If you liked any of these shows, that's fine.
I tried watching a couple episodes of MG/HS Hour on BUZZR, and I just can't get into it at all. Love the opening song, and could see why it was used on Price is Right for many years. However, the rest of the game is just... meh. The Match Game portion is significantly better than the Hollywood Squares one, but by this point Match Game had lost a lot of the luster that made it so great. It needed a panel of zany celebrities with Gene playing off of them so well. This version more often than not was soap opera stars, as soaps were at the height of their popularity with all the super couples in the mid 80s, and the humor/fun of the 70s version just wasn't there.
The Hollywood Squares portion is a huge train wreck. It was a big mistake to give Mark Goodson creative control of a show he never produced. Taking out the bluffs and zingers made it a very boring "either/or" game. Also, not having contestants earn their wins took out a lot of the excitement and drama that made Hollywood Squares so great. Hollywood Squares needed a straight man, which is what made Peter Marshall so good (and Tom Bergeron as well). Bowser was no straight man, and neither was John Davidson, and I think that's why I can't stand either of those versions of Hollywood Squares.
Would WIN, LOSE OR DRAW count as Battle of the Sexes?
Would all the Hollywood Squares proper count as a battle of the sexes?
(I mean, Mr. X vs. Ms. Circle)
Yes, except for Bowzer for obvious reasons.
Santa barbaba replaced it. I looked it up
Beat the Clock '79 either way could have been a dishonorable mention, not just for the celebrity version, but just for a broken format. As nothing matters until the shuffleboard game. It was okay otherwise.
Wasn't it Super Password, and Santa Barbara that replaced Match Game/Hollywood Squares?
SANTA BARBARA replaced MG/HS, SUPER PASSWORD replaced DIFF'RENT STROKES reruns when the show went into syndication.
Now You See It with Chuck Henry was the worst the revival bombed after only 20 weeks,the second is The Match Game Hollywood Squares Hour was a complete disaster for NBC,Jon Bowser Bauman didn't clicked as host,he went on become a VH1 VJ when it launched in 1985.
The Jack Narz version of NYSI from 1974-75 is so much better. I watched one episode of NYSI-89, and Chuck Henry looked utterly bored in his role as host, like he'd rather be anywhere else on earth but on the set of NYSI.
It's interesting, I agree with pretty much all of this lineup yet there are little tweaks my version would probably have.
I think I'd flip Match Game/Hollywood Squares Hour and What's Going On?. Match Game/Hollywood Squares feels like it was closer to realizing its potential of the two - a few format and presentation changes and a better co-host would get the Squares half up to par and fix most of the issues. What's Going On? on the other hand feels like it reaches *too* far for its time. You're right when when you say that it had potential, but since the technology just wasn't there I don't think there was any way it *could* reach that potential. Match Game/Hollywood Squares has a path to its full potential, so I think it deserves to go up a slot.
The one show I actually think I'd omit on this list? Of all things, Password All-Stars. If Card Sharks 2001 is considered eligible, I would put it there instead. Password All-Stars was an unnecessary attempt at needlessly complicating things, and it does have the all-celebrity flaw, but I think that in its heart, it's still Password in a way Card Sharks 2001 just *isn't* Card Sharks.
The thing is, if I was to truly put together my own version of this list, I'd have to dip into unsold pilots because what I *really* want to put in #3 is one. It's funny, you indirectly touched on it when you mentioned Nipsey Russell as a host - it would be Star Words. That show had an interesting gameplay idea - for a single segment of a larger show. It was way too little to flesh out a full half hour, I remember thinking right away while watching it that the format was fundamentally broken, and - like you said - Nipsey Russell just wasn't right for hosting it. It was just a mess on enough levels that I'd put it on the list.
But on the other hand, introducing unsold pilots and counting Card Sharks 2001 as eligible would mean the *other* mid-90s pilots would be eligible, which would within seconds turn this entire list into Mindreaders, The Better Sex, MG2, Card Sharks 1996 and a wild card. Even if I ultimately would disagree with some of the placements I can't argue with your list in the end.
If CS2001 is eligible (as it still used the Mark Goodson branding) I would...actually not be so sure about the previous revivals. All had terrible elements but some redemption as well...I guess Match Game '98 could have been less annoying, not so cheap if possible, and not always taking refuge in the lowest common denominator; Family Feud '99 (the Anderson seasons were the only with MGP branding no?) could have lost the broken format where only the triple round matters; and TTTT2K...I guess really just lose Paula Poundstone.
As for Feud and Price '94, neither strike me as particularly awful although they both had baggage.
Mindreaders was unquestionably the weakest show of Mark Goodson’s projects. Dick Martin looked so lost here and had very little to nothing to work with here versus what he was given on his other game show he hosted in “The Cheap Show” where it at least had some humor there even if that series itself felt goofy and not exactly the good kind of goofy.
Mindreaders had two things going for it - Johnny Olsen as announcer, and its awesome disco-inspired theme song. The theme was later reused for a pilot called "The Puzzlers", hosted by Pat Sajak in 1980(?)
@@brycelandon6387 And one of the few G-T shows that Jack Narz either announced or sub-announced.
You can blame NBC for that mess as usual.
I agree with you on Mindreaders. Dick Martin was a dick on this show!
Santa Barbara replaced MG-HS in 1984.
While Trivia Trap got a dishonorable mention, I personally think that it should have made the top five. Mainly because of the pacing. The front part of the game (cutting the wrong answers) seemed to drag. And then the $1,000 Trivia Race went into overdrive. I was also a bit perplexed by the bonus round.
Also, with the show Number Please, if you listen closely, there was music CONSTANTLY playing in the background, and not at select times.
I thought the "cut the wrong answers" round was the best part of the game. Once they got rid of that, the show was even more boring.
@@jhillst to me they should've kept the first format. Seeing this format carried on to the pricing game gas money on the price is right.
@@jhillst Not to mention the new Trivia Trap Round was confusing as hell, especially for a first time viewer.
@@LittleRockElevatorsbut before that there was Danger Price
@@ricknibert6417 you're right.
8:40 Santa Barbara
On the Best List, I have a guess for what I think Number 1 is going to be, because it's my favorite Goodson/Todman created game show.
I actually liked Match Game/Hollywood Squares' format, even if I didn't recognize half the stars on the show. The show refused to bring back Peter Marshall to do the Squares segments, and John Bauman looked so uncomfortable hosting the show and seemingly tried to over-compensate. Gene Rayburn reportedly wasn't impressed with him either. They also supposedly didn't have the "liquid lunches" from the original, which probably didn't help either. 😂 Score Productions later recycled most of the music as Price is Right prize themes, so glass half full, right?
Now, Goodson/Todman DID do The Better Sex, which probably should be unforgivable.
Not only that, but like Cyndi said, the ultimate issue was that the celebrity panelists weren't briefed on the questions, which meant no chance to create bluffs, which is where the memorable moments of Hollywood Squares originate. Even Gene on air when he truly didn't know an answer made a comment to the effect of "I don't know, I have to take a Wild guess... which isn't the premise of this game".
@@ElFuego35 True indeed. They weren't even given jokes ahead of time, which the original series tended to do.
I agree. I have felt for a long time that with a more faithful Squares half and a better co-host (not even Marshall, necessarily, just someone better at wrangling celebrities like Bob Eubanks or Bert Convy) Match Game/Hollywood Squares had the potential to be excellent. It just couldn't realize what it could have been with that half holding it back.
About the music ...yes! This is true!
I am now wondering...did NBC have a hand in making Bauman host, Ala Dick Martin? I forget the story.
My three picks for worst Goodson-Todman shows go to Mindreaders (for such a dull format), Password All-Stars (for switching to all celebs in obviously a desperate attempt at ratings), and What's Going On? (for being overly ambitious with the concept of satellite technology on a game show back in the 50s).
With The Better Sex and Match Game-Hollywood Squares, at least there could be some good in them. In TBS' case, Bill Anderson's masterful hosting (which came in handy doing Fandango five years after TBS ended) along with the bluffing concept and in MG-HS' case... well, the Match Game portion and Gene Rayburn's hosting. What Goodson did to the HS portion was unforgivable and Jon Bauman wasn't exactly the right host. They could've had Peter Marshall returning as host...
@Will N If Orion had gotten involved and told Goodson that HS should had played the way Quigley/Hetter Productions did it, it would had lasted a little longer
@Will N True. Marshall was a better fit than Bowser
@@Superlad945 - Tell that to NBC since they were the ones that wanted the Match Game+Hollywood Squares Hour, and were stupid enough not to get Merrill Heatter involved for Squares alone!
@@Superlad945 YES! God bless you, RODDDDD…. Roddy!
20:03 "Name me one show that had a battle-of-the-sexes gimmick that actually did good."
*HOLLYWOOD SQUARES.*
How about the Wink Martindale era of High Rollers? Also, the main game (but not the Head-to-Head Sprint obviously) on Scrabble had it too.
@@juicyfartsofjimcornette1154 Scrabble didn't always have man-vs-woman match-ups. They had a few game show weeks where game show hosts would compete against each other, an there were VERY few female game show hosts in the 1980's. In fact, the only two I can think of are Betty White from Just Men! and Leslie Uggams from Fantasy. As for Wink's High Rollers, that show only lasted one season. Hollywood Squares ran from 1966-1981 in its original incarnation.
@@petercolbeysgameshowmania7176 - And based off of that response, *not all versions of Hollywood Squares was man versus woman!*
I'm sure you know who I'm talking about.
@@juicyfartsofjimcornette1154 I… don’t.
@@juicyfartsofjimcornette1154 Match Game-Hollywood Squares Hour?
How about a Game Show Garbage about Click! with Ryan Secrest
The short answer is no. The long answer is hell no.
@@GameShowGumbo - You a Click! fan or something?
Might want to block Alvin Hylton. It's a troll, and a spammer, with terrible grammar to boot.
Which early format to CS2001 was this?
@Will N I'll make an exception just so I can find out what Cyndi meant ;-)
Can't wait for the worst format changes. Oh heck I'll make some predictions/suggestions:
- ANYTHING with Celebrity added to the title... (and somehow I think I named the #1 answer ;-))
(extra discredit to Celebrity Bullseye for also adding best 2/3 main games, so we have to deal longer with a watered-down format per episode, and no bonus game in sight sometimes!)
- Play the Percentages solo format, only Geoff saved it. That and at least Barry-Enright didn't make that into Celebrity Play the Percentages.
- Hollywood Squares catches Millionaire fever and changes the endgame.
- Bullseye/Bankroll
- $400 wins the Feud
- YMMV, but Password Plus goes to $500 wins (I didn't dislike it, but can see how a potential non-Alphabetics-having episode could bore some people)
- Based on Cyndi's comments here...the car game is added to Card Sharks? (again didn't mind, but A. cut time out of the show. For that matter, adding the audience polls did the same somewhat too. B. you could win big in the Money Cards but still feel like a loser)
- The ever-changing Sale of the Century bonus game. Losing the shopping end game kind of bit into the buying prizes gimmick of the show, and we lost the feel of risk in every front game to see whether or not the champion would go to the next plateau of prizes. And don't get me started how out of place the Winner's Big Money Game was.
I would hardly call whatever they did after the Speed Round "bonus games" since YOU CAN'T ACTUALLY LOSE in them. The Winner's Big Money Game was for the better.
Although I admit to its weaknesses, I am still pretty much the MG/HS defender. But I'll add another annoyance...
The show being an NBC infomercial, essentially. Aside from choices of celebrities because of this, there were LOTS of questions that referenced their shows. The #1 answer in the Super Match was an NBC title, more often than not, to the point where an uneducated person might ask if they were rigged.
And don't get me started on the Mr. Smith megapush of 83.
I know there isn't much love for The Better Sex theme, but it's jazzy and you can clap along to it. The MGHS theme might be as good a game show theme as I've heard. I wonder if there was ever a thought to recycle it for Card Sharks '86 like the original used the old Double Dare theme
Sex Wars and The Game of LIFE have worse theme songs than the annoying scatting of The Better Sex.
Mindreaders was really bad.
As for Dick Martin's participation, he was more in his element with 1978's "The Cheap Show", which was played largely for laughs. But with Mindreaders, he can't host straight.
So many It Was A Thing On TV connections...
I blame Chico
The All Star Blitz and Better Sex theme songs have nothing on how awful the Magnificent Marble Machine’s theme song is!
Sex Wars and The Game of LIFE are still worse.
Better Sex wasn't that bad.
Better than Sex Wars, that's for sure.