The MADNESS of mirror matches in fighting games.
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- Опубліковано 12 лют 2023
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This video talks about mirror matches in fighting games. - Ігри
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Liking, disliking, winning, losing...
In all situations the most important thing in the Mirror Match is to always remember to steal your opponent's tech.
True
Ah the tactic of stealing your opponent’s Tech, ever since around 1000 AD when Su Shi played against his son in Go.
Truly a strategy that stands the test of time.
In Melee , we have the famous "20xx" Fox Mirror match up which is called as "Fox Dittos". Its very meme because of "Final Destination , No Items , Fox Only".
Its a very fun and unique match up when Top players play it , its like back and fourth blow by blow. Its fast pace , ends quickly , and you can tell which Fox is which by the way how they move and how they play.
For some reason, I think that Smash 64 mirror matches are hilarious. Sometimes players will agree to mirror match bad characters such as Luigi just for the memes. Probably the most low-key fighting community.
True low tier mirror matches can be entertaining, kinda like what
@kevingriffith6011 mentioned those matchups are 4-4 because neither player can take full advantage of their character
64 is such an amazing game
I think mortal kombat 11 mirror matchs are may favorite because there also hilarious because of the characters reaction to themselves especially with Johnny
As a May player, I love mirror matches because it doubles the Totsugeki. One does not deny the Totsugeki, but embrace it, for that is the way of the May Main.
Totsugeki!
god the amount of times in mirror may matches when we both just did the same move and then stared at each other for ten seconds
Other mirrors match: aight time to show this chump who’s the better player
May’s mirror match: aight time to see who has better mental fortitude, shenanigans activated
Totsugekiiii!!
Some mirror matches have an interesting quality: Something I've started calling the 4-4 matchup, where a character's own kit contains all the building blocks of a bad matchup for that character. Take Street Fighter 5's Blanka: A lot of your playstyle in a matchup will revolve around if your opponent can punish Light Blanka Ball on block, and the worse matchups for blanka generally don't allow you to L.Ball freely... and one of the characters that can punish L.Ball? Blanka.
Essentially, while the match is technically even neither player can actually take full advantage of their character because their kit has answers for their own matchup-defining tools.
That's interesting, I wonder percentage of mirror matchups are 4-4 vs 5-5
Faust mirror matches are pretty fun since in guilty gear, most characters are horribly equipped to fight there own BS but faust already has to deal with some of his moves turning against him so faust players learn the mirror by playing faust in any other match
When you discussed how mirror matches can be boring, I think you took for granted that the players' skill level would be the same. Even if they're close on that front, most players of the same character will have different ways of approaching the same situation, even different combos maybe, if not separate play styles altogether (though that depends on the Character and the game).
Mimicking moves/combos of the opponent makes the fight more interesting, at least in my experience, it can lead to the players' trying out weird stuff and experiment with their toolkits.
I don't know how much this would apply to simpler games like strive, since I don't play much of them.
I love May mirrors so much because its so dramatic. It becomes instantly apparent who is the better player due to the way may plays, and totsugeki clashes are the funniest thing ever. My favorite has to of been the time me and some other may pretty much did the same string 4 times in a row ending in a totsugeki clash and us getting flown against the other wall it was so dope
Personally as a grappler main I love having mirror matches. Zangief and potemkin mirrors in my experience have generated the most stupid and funny moments but also hype moments. It’s fun
I play Millia in Strive and have been chilling in Celestial for the last year and a half or so, and I genuinely feel the mirror matchup is fun mostly cuz I get to see how I play compared to those around me. I tend to flowchart against even top 10 players, largely cuz even they don't entirely know the matchup, but even lower level Millias tend to call my bullshit out more, or at the very least teach me a new whack ass setup to pull out sometime
As someone who loves uncommon characters like Gigas, G or Clark steel, mirror matches are a rare sight, so I actually enjoy them and try to learn what the other player can offer, or the logic behind that gameplan (No Gigas thou...)
Clark looks like kind of a fiend in XV, you love to see it
Hats of to you for liking Gigas,you are a chad
6:14 I feel that spiritually, I've had so many opponents do the Bullet mirror matchup but honestly i find it cool that so many people have a pocket Bullet and I learned a lot from the matches to.
I always love mirror matches. It's always a 50/50 on if we're gonna learn from each other and feel like we're equal rivals, or (what usually happens) we end up in a contest on who can consume the most gallons of glue in a single round. There are in-betweens, too. I've had few but fun moments where we're doing some weird stuff and I go "what, you can do that?!" and it feels great.
reminds me of the times I played Multiversus and had Superman and Batman 1v1 mirror matches, they were fun, and with the perks you could potentially have some fun having two different playstyles of the same character in terms of what moves they like to use and what perks they equip to support their playstyle
the elliana mirror in rivals of aether is legendary, elliana is a character with great movement and space control and ridiculous damage output, and she's also complete combo food, meaning the mirror match is incredibly volatile, if either player gets clipped by literally anything they just get carried into the blastzone and die. She even has a mine which you can stick on the ground or on an opponent and then detonate by shooting it with side b, but an opposing elliana can shoot your own mine to detonate it so you have to take that into account when dropping it, adding a whole new dimension to the mine that only exists in the mirror match.
basically everyone loves the elli mirror, it's a complete mess and hilariously explosive
Man I wish I could find videos on it, that sounds fun as shit.
I love mirror matches. It let's me reinforce what I know works and also see new ways to play the character because even at the highest levels ot set play there are still variations
I don't really mind the mirror. I used to hate it, but as I developed as a player I learned to appreciate mind games and conditioning a bit more. Regardless, I tend to play more technically demanding or mechanically complex characters, so they don't always have the issue of playing copycat with each other, as you might not know how a setup works, or lack the execution to emulate a specific style of pressure or what not. The "I do what you do since you did it" thing really only tends to happen with simple or straightforward characters. Anecdotally, Zato mirrors are fairly fun, since each player often has different setups and neutral structure they prefer typically, given how complex the character is.
The mirror is funny given how much importance some people place on it, citing that whoever wins the mirror is simply the better player. I'm more inclined to agree with the second camp, wherein the mirror is just that, one matchup. You can win the 5-5 matchup, but that doesn't necessarily mean much barring that you're better in the 5-5. Player skills such as reaction, comfort on defense, ability to alternate and adapt offense, composure under pressure, and ability to gather information are all core player skills, and don't get tested in the mirror to the same degree as evaluating someone over the course of a bracket or a career. Some people aren't strong at dealing with their own pressure, but over the course of a bracket, they might be FAR better than someone else at APPLYING said pressure, or vice versa. Food for thought.
I love mirror matches, not only its the definitive proof of what you know about your character and makes you rethink your tactis from the other side, but also its the definitive dick-messuring contest
That last clip of the May mirror makes me want to get Guilty Gear for the sole purpose of playing May against my friends. They know I'm a shitter, and this would just set that in stone.
I main May in Strive and called myself the StrongestFloor8May. I treat every mirror match as a challenge.
meanwhile the potemkin mirror matchup is "he has to get in on you but you have to get in on him"
One of the mirror matches that are chaotic
Found you on twich a long time ago, so glad I checked you out
I’m glad you stayed
Mirror matches are a type of the example of "the better player wins" in its rawest form.
Imo the May mirror match isn't too bad. If anything you're less likely to get away with gimmicks since you both know what's up. It often comes down to who gets better conversions on their stray hits.
The noise though... May players just get used to it ;D
We yearn for the voice, there’s reasons we spam dolphins and it’s accessibility is just one of it
I love youre videos keep it up man!
I’m glad you like them!
Mirror matches taught me so much its crazy
i gotta say I love dittos in melee
for some reason most characters do a really good job at combing themselves (sheik a bit too much so i hate that).
But i also like how expressive dittos can be in melee even when you can combo yourself really hard
You forgot to mention shang tsung in here somewhere 😂much love my brother
I love mirror matches! Playing a mirror match in Tekken 7 is the funniest thing, not only because i don't see a lot of Jin players, but because it's interesting to see how the other player will use his tools compared to how i use mine, also, it's fun to see who is the best in a mirror match, maybe you'll learn something that you never thought it would be possible.
Tekken has so many moves I feel like there's always something new to learn in that game
@@typhoonbh there is, there was this time i was fighting against a Kazuya (i play with ALL the Mishimas), and he did a move i never saw before, and the move is actually good. Even if it's not a mirror match, you'll learn a something new every time you find a different player. Love fighting games :)
Port Priority :O
indeed :O
Everytime I hear da dolphin in your vids a part of me withers away little by little
That dolphin looks too happy smashing into people
Normally I don’t spam attacks but This Day I had a May mirror match , my opponent told me to not use The anchor and we both end up using dolphins only , I lost because he was a spamming God but I wasn’t mad because I was laughing The whole Match XD
May mirror match is loads of fun!
Strive Potemikin vs Potemkin is the best matchup. Nothing works the way it's supposed to and the dumber you go, the better you do.
True
Axl mirror match is insane tbh. I always learn new tech.
5:30 ayy who's that.
jk, but Snake mains use to argue with me that he was completely balanced, and I would just show them this clip that I made. PM 3.6 was good times.
That video was well done btw, I enjoyed it
I hate when I pick a character someone else picked and they act like they have exclusive rights to play that character. Whenever this happens I say things like “if you’re so concerned you can always play SF2: world warrior.” Or “oh, my bad, you have exclusive rights to play this character?”
I love the ramlethal mirror match just because of round start s
I absolutely love Ragna/Sol/Narukami mirrors. DP clashing is why I keep on living
When swordmasters happened for broken edge the final 4 were all barbarian players but all played differently which came across more due to the game being vr
I like mirror matches because they're a good knowledge check. It reminds me of that copypasta from the Sonic OVA: "You might know everything I'm going to do, but that's not going to help you, since I know everything you're going to do! Strange, isn't it?"
As for the May mirror match, here's your answer: I have japanese VAs on for laughs with May, english for serious fights
There are some crazy may players out there. When I encounter them, I see how they play and go from there. If they play like a crackhead I’m like bet and copy them
May in Strive is just totsugeki spam, but a mirror match in Xrd is more like: OH NOOOOOOO! THE BEACH BALL KILLED ME!
"Mirror matches are weird"
Super Smash Bros Brawl pulling it's Meta Knight only tournament:
TBH, I dooo think it comes down to character selection, because a diverse moveset makes the mirror match a blast to watch.
Two Yoshimitsus in Tekken 7? Pure bliss to watch. AND very fun to play.
I main zato in strive so run into very few mirror matches. I always do enjoy them tho because it forces both players to tighten up their gameplay, there's this moment that always happens where you realize that your opponent knows your fake strings and you have to start thinking more. It can happen vs other players but I feel like nobody knows how zato works besides other zato players lol. Also the character is complex enough that both players probably know different tech and strings which is fun seeing what the other player has worked on.
You forgot to mention Palette Swap differences which has been an issue as recently as KoF15 (Terry) and even ended up making left/right Cloud being stronger. Glad to see port priority being mentioned though.
These are all accidents but the Terry example is probably the only one to be banned for tournaments.
May mirror match is just a modernised Adon mirror match. (I thought Adon was worse but Totsugeki is too strong 🐬)
Great video as usual man gj may I ask what do you use to edit your content?
After effects and Premire pro
@@typhoonbh aight thanks man keep up the great quality
Also, while not a true mirror, archetype based mirrors, like shoto vs shoto, zoner vs zoner, etc.
Cuz even tho theyre not identical, the chars may have similar moves n playstyle, which ive seen people love n hate for the same reasons as mirrors
mirror matchups (or dittos) are a lot of fun for me, especially in 2d fighting games, some of my fav are sol in strive, ragna in bbcf and necoarc in melty, granted i dont play most of these games i live for the stupidity of these matches
As a faust main i love mirrors they are the reason i live and also the reason i play this game. then as a testament main i also love mirrors becouse seeing grave reaper clash and our 6p makes me smile every day. and now i want to main may
I've gotten so use to mey that I don't notes it anymore
I love your Videos🥰
Thank you!
lets go!
I always joked that im the only person loves most mirrors/dittos, because i think theyre funny....or i make fun of people by saying that no one actually wants a fair fight
speaking as a guy who averages gold/plat in most games he plays, mirror matches against people in your elo are incredibly frustrating for often times it just depends on who gets the first hit and its all down hill from their if they know how to keep a lead. But against people who are way better then you, I actually enjoy them for I often find them using tech and tricks that I never even considered and it can be pretty eye opening.
I love mirror matches because I play characters that I enjoy playing against (set play, mid-range, and normal zoners).
bralwhalla player here (plaform fighter)
so brawlhalla both fixes and makes worst
so each legend has 2 weapons, that 2 can be either of 13 weapons,a legend dont have the same combination,the only difference between the same weapons of legends is their signatures and theirs stats, their normals(lights) and recoverys are the exact same
so brawlhalla have like a true mirror and "half" mirror, since the cassidy hammer still have alot of same moves of bodvar hammer, the difference being their attack speed, damage and signatures
so even if have have 2 different legends but with same weapons, alot of time they just keep spamming the same combo starter, but hey we can thrown the weapon always and grab your second weapon, changing the playstyle, so even if have bodvar vs bodvar, you can still try to play sword while the other one play hammer, but yes alot of weapons mirror become a fishing minigame to hit the combo starter light or a strong light, the best part while you hit those combo starters,your opponent will probably doge the best next attack to doge, since he probably knows which attacks you gonna use next, so doge reads becomes way more important that already is
I enjoy mirror matches when it's a really simple character without many gimmicks. I come from Smash and for me I always enjoy running Flacon, Gannon, and DK for that reason. In Strive I play Ky so I enjoy that mu because it's a pretty no frills even test of fundies, same with Ryu in SF
As a Millia player I don’t want to get mixed by my own mix cuz I don’t even know how to deal with it
i don'
t mind them unless with my main in any game, then a win feels great because you got proof your good on your character but on the other hand if you loose you feel bad because its like you'r not good enough on your main
"how do may players deal with hearing totsugeki all day"
its a feature, not a bug.
the only explanation is that their ears have evolved overtime to adapt to the sounds
ok let’s honest here, no one would hate on a faust mirror matches with multiple items in the screen cuz that stuff is hilarious to watch
In Tekken, seeing Bob or any DLC mirror match is frowned upon , but Bryan ? Everyone gets hype , so sometimes a character does matter
I love mirror matches just because I almost always learn something new about my character. Its always fun especially since I tend to play harder or less popular characters like Greninja in smash and Sora or Laura for SFV. Guilty Gear Mei mirror matches were funny but definitely understand how it can be annoying hearing totsugeki all day
the grappler mirror match has entire microbiomes of mindgames and bullshit
I don't typically like mirror matches unless I'm new to the game/character I'm playing, to see what I can learn from my opponent. Outside of that only very specific characters I find fun in a mirror, the rest make it feel a bit annoying or boring
So in mirror/ditto matches, is it funnier when identical moves klank and do nothing, or when they both connect and do their jank
I like mirror matches, especially in ranked modes. It's always stressful and fun!
May main here. We are all absolute gremlins, so hearing TOTSUGEKIIII gives us energy. Double the TOTSUGEKIIII, double the energy. 👍
Yoshimitsu mirror matches in Tekken 7 and Soul Calibur are always so hilarious. It’s like watching two mad scientists trying to out-goofy the other person.
Mirror matches to me are fun for a party game atmosphere. I'm a casual fighting game player and one of the characters that I have the best execution with is ryu. I can teach Ryu to someone more casual than me, and its like rock paper scissors mixed with Rock em Sockem robots. Casual easy fun like uno cards.
Killer Bee mains greeting each other with their native language:
⬅️➡️A2
Potemkin mirror spaming Potemkin Buster is amazing
Indeed
I've only had may mirrors on floor 10, you don't see them that often in celestial but anyway it's fun lots of totsugeki.
Whats the outro music
Mirror matches are pretty dope if the character is a fast glass cannon.
i think mirror matches are super fun to watch
SCOTT PILGRIM I LOVE IT
same
"More importantly, what does that sound like?"
My man has never seen a Jam mirror in Xrd lol
Joke's aside I'd imagine the may mirror ends up much like Jam and you're just kind of immune haha. Everyone else gets to suffer
May is like that annoying cousin at the family party all the elders think is "cute" and won't let her hang around them but will force you and your friends to baby sit the entire night.
I love Mirror matches. When I play 3rd strike and I see someone pick Twelve I’m like :0 “ay yo me too” and pick also Twelve with the C.O.P.Y special
A rare twelve main
Mirror matches in Smash are cool for me if its a character I know well because already know whats up
The bit with the kefla mirror was a planned setup because that was offline Wanted (a koth eu series) which was an exhibition not a tournament
I know I just wanted to show an example because sometimes people do the same moves and clash (obviously not to that extent)
you're the sunnyv2 of the fgc
I mean I guess but I haven’t made any downfall videos
Jack-o mirrors
"If you use the same move the whole match then it will be boring even from the viewers perspective"
I think the opposite is true for mirror matchups.
I generally play glass cannon/mid tier so i dont get that many, but i always have something to learn from someone good, and often enough the best kind of rounds are the one where both players go "fuck it, monkeh".
Ultimately the only difference between a top 8 being the same character in something like pokemon and top 8 in guilty gear or smash bros is spectacle alone. Two good fox or falcon players are some of the most meme worthy games you can get while in pokemon all that matters is who can get their win condition first and any real difference between team compositions would be too technical for the average viewe. the same time what made bayonetta mirrors in smash 4 unfun is just how antithetical she was to smash as a whole(including jigglypuff and kirby trolls as even if they were defensive they at least had to deal and react accordingly being slower lightweight floaties and all)
I think the archetype has a lot to do with it too. A glass cannon mirror match will be entertaining because of the high damage output and big combos but two projectile zoners poking each other with fireballs can be boring to watch.
May players hearing that have absolutely nothing on the true horror that was Jam mirrors.
TOTSUGEKI 🐬
I mean 0:42 was deliberate it's also not totally uncommon for pre-fight rituals like this among other games.
true
I like the mirror matches, just because the klank mechanic make them funnier
That can be funny, but it’s also funny when 2 identical hit at the same time and don’t klank
Smash ultimate is my only fighting game, but inkling roller during the mirror match, if both players hit it, both get buried, being funny initially and then the player who gets out first having advantage
As a uncommon legend player in like 2 years of playing Reno i've have found about 5 people playing it on ranked
Hello fellow reno enjoyer
Mirror matches are really just a test of skill and knowledge.
Does anyone happen to have the name of the song in the very beginning?
It’s called digital baptism
@@typhoonbh Thank you very kindly ❤️
May mirrors are amazing. You should be able to deal with may bs since you know the character. also get voice is part of the reason I love her lol
And then you have matchups like the Faust mirror match where your strengths go out the window because your strengths dont work on your own character :)
Punch Planet gameplay yay
That game is criminally underrated
@@typhoonbh I only play it just a few times in a year, but I love it!
Here is proposition on material
Do about nontoxic taunting and how it ironicly can turn into more toxic than actual taunting
I explain what i mean...i played a heck of a time team fortress 2...here everyone taunting every time because it's funny and those taunts are great and badass
Now...first time when i was annoyed by "non toxic taunts" was Brawlhalla...disrespectfull dancing wasn't what was my problem...peoples just thinks sometimes that it's better because you doing it activly and it's not a taunt so he ain't toxic here
But in reality you watching regular animation insteed of funny/badass taunt...taunts can be funny, can serve as...well...taunt and they can add extra umf when for example it's kill taunt or brawlhalla air taung...something like i did it...i still got airdash non used and i escaped and turned situation on my win so let me do a trick or doing pose of happynes insteed of wasting time durring landing
But worsts...ares aftherroung combos...you want just go to another round but enemy is combosing you...one thing if he just wanna kept momentum or land full combo like to not ending in middle...but dudes who are flexing how the can string their combos are wors because they are wasting your time and you see littely what was seen all the round insteed of this funny unique animation when you can't do heck...This isn't killer instinct where you got narrator screaming ULTRAAAAAAAA COMBOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Where it happens automaticly...to bad because this is real i'm good and you will see that now and even be rewarded for it but it happens automaticly...unless they are slidly unique to this what was in match...fatalitys are serving this role kinda
I hope that just mayby in futhure ultra combos will back as a specials where you need do it but you get more flexible and unique combos so there still is potential to shine...something like current function of instinct but slightly limited