Also, in fairness to the caps - if you look on the superia box, it looks the same so I think it’s just the “lighting” on the box rather than actual silver caps
No, these are no silver caps on the packaging, it's just reflections that make the caps look lighter. The lighting was different (or the rendering setup, doesn't matter; that doesn't mean that the actual cannisters wouldn't have silver caps). The curves are a much better clue.
The bigger issue here is that if Fuji gave up on C200 that means they are getting out of the film business. I prefer C200 to Gold 200 which is too yellow for my taste ... but more importantly, even for those who prefer Kodak Gold, is that only Fuji can keep Kodak prices in check. The situation will be getting worse and worse until someone new pops up with their own manufacturing of film as well as chemicals. I am worried the most about slide film - basically on 3 options exist with very few ISO variation ... if Fuji's done with film - only 1 option remains!!! T_T
Fuji stopped making any film except instax years ago. They’ve just been selling old stock. That’s why Provia is still currently available and Pro400 is ‘discontinued’ . Pro400 just ran out first.
It’s only a matter of time until the Climate Alarmists come for the film industry. Fuji and Kodak are being proactive, and the film market is shrinking.
Wow. That's just crazy. Kodak raised prices 3 times in 3 years, each time around 20%, explaining that they do this to up their film production capacity - so that more film will be available in the market - and what do they do? They produce consumer film for Fuji, and Kodak consumer film still is almost impossible to buy, as they produce way too little. That's insane... (Fuji C200 btw currently cost 11.95€ PER ROLL in Fujifilm's official "Wonder Photo Shop's" in Spain, which are stores owned by Fujifilm Europe GmbH !!!)
I’m a Japanese living in Japan. For those who wonder, Fujicolor 200 is not sold here. We only have fujicolor 100 and Superia 400 as far as 135 color negative goes.Fuji’s Japanese website does not show fujicolor 200 either. I’m not surprised if this film is made by Kodak.
I'm Hungarian, Fujicolor C200 and Superia 400 is aviable here but not Fujicolor 200 which is the allegedly Kodak stuff. Currently this seems to be an American market thing.
I agree it is strange. But I'm going to offer the counter argument that if the cross selling keeps a more robust total market, that's a good thing for film. For example, if Fujifilm is unable/willing to make an emulsion for a segment but to keep the business happy they need one, go ahead and buy from 'someone'. Similarly, if Kodak can sell through other channels (companies) and keep the lines running, so be it. Yeah, selling through traditionally arch competitors is very odd, but the market is changing.
Well, you may recall that on the b&w side of things, when Acros II was introduced it was made in the UK. Rumors started circulating that Acros II is made by Harman Technologies (Ilford). So maybe the notion that Eastman Kodak would supply Fujifilm isn't all that farfetched.
If fuji doesn't want to make non-instant camera film anymore and have Kodak do color, it would at least be great if they were having Kodak make it per their recipes, like they do with Ilford/Acros100 instead of just doing the Lomography thing and rebranding. Indeed, if Kodak was making Velvia I'd feel a little bit better like it won't disappear.
So Kodak make C200 and Ilford make Acros. That only leaves Superia 400, Provia and Velvia. But would Fuji really keep their production running just to manufacture these 3 films? My hunch is that Fuji closed their film factory years ago and all their film is either old stock kept in frozen storage or they have outsourced all their film production to other companies.
The factory has been shut since COVID hit, they've stated as such at a Tetenal UK Dealer day meeting. The rep for Fuji did state they were still aiming to continue color negative, reversal and black and white film production, so maybe this is just to keep things moving while the factory restart is underway... or they lied.
Kodak Gold 200 (3x135-36) has been backordered for a long time now, I keep calling and it's the same thing over and over again. Makes you think. Why such an unusual delay, when the other stocks can be ordered without much issue? I get the film is cheaper, but I can't help thinking its because they were working with Fuji to shift distribution and were delayed due to repackaging of C200.
I am not a business man, but I wonder if it is advantageous for Kodak to sell the film to Fuji (assuming this theory is true, of course) as they can sell that film all now, and not have to worry about how long will it take to sell and get a return. That gets offloaded to Fuji.
it makes me think a lot now, since Fujifilm always had those colored stripes between perforations that lacks now based on the "new" data sheet. too bad it would be a Gold copypasa...
I don't know if Kodak is still using the silver caps, I just bought some Portra a few weeks ago from my local camera shop and all 5 rolls had the black caps and this was new stock that they had just got in from Kodak.
The charts are more or less pixel perfect identical. Even the text. However, I don't think this necessarily means Fuji is discontinuing C200. C200 is still the one markedet in Europe, so this might be a US thing. And they still make Superia 400 and Fujicolor 100, although the last one is japan only. My guess is that Kodak is making and branding these films themselves in US for Fujifilm for the US market, as they do with Lomography's color negative film. WIth all the situations in the world these days that might be more desireable for Fujifilm US than actually shipping film from Japan to the US.
If Kodak is selling Kodak Gold 200 film to Fuji to package and sell as Fujicolor 200, they are making more profits that way, than by packaging and selling it as Kodak Gold 200 - it's probably that simple.
Or…maybe they are having supply issues BECAUSE they giving their films to other companies. Realistically, they probably had this planned and when supplies became harder to come by, Kodak began to feel the pressure because they are supplying Fuji. They may have a contract where they have to meet a particular amount of film to Fuji therefore they’ve had to tighten up their own supply as a result. Just a thought.
If you look at the film spool, which should be black plastic, it's pictured in the same brighter gray manner as the supposedly silver cap. So it might be just a color thing.
Maybe this deal was signed a while back and Kodak are contractually obliged to supply Fujifilm with Gold and that takes precedence over selling it themselves.
i feel like Kodak is producing Fuji's comsumer film (but it's still fuji's recipe) hence the silver caps. Fuji might having issues starting production again or reramping the production line. So they are filling orders with Gold 200? IDK, that seems strange too. They flat out announced the disconuation of 400H and 160NS, so why not announce XTRA 200? It seems to be a temporary change they made
It's looking more and more like the rumors have been true all along. Fuji stopped making film years ago and are just selling off their remaining stocks. The only "insider" in the business I know has been saying this for years, but I obviously didn'y want to believe it. I really hope Orwo will start making colour film again soon!
Well, Harman ( parent company of Ilford ) manufactures the new Acros 100 II, so no surprises here. What is for sure is that Fuji is packing up their film division in an effort to push their digital zillion mega pixel wonder boxes.
Fuji has shelf space at walmart, drug stores, etc here in the states that Kodak does not in many cases. For Fuji, they get to cash in on their brand recognition and retail space with very little expense. For Kodak (A or R I'm not sure), they get a guaranteed sale of a lot of rolls of film that's likely recurring AND don't have to market or distribute them.... Since Kodak is the only major player in the color market that's committed to the future of film, Kodak is not worried about losing they monopoly with any supply chain issues this may exacerbate..... In other words, it is a simple, sound business decision for both companies.
film photography, day after day are so strange, I search in alibaba I see Vista agfa for sale, but with one condition sell 10,000 roll all together, but outdoor we haven't seen agfa Vista anywhere fresh🙄
I think is the same in portugal. We have well-known brands making the same product but with different packaging. If it's the same ??!!! fuji, doesn't produce but continue to sell and keep the fuji associated to film and don´t have pruduction cost... The kodak also avoids having 100% of the market (I don't think it's not alowed).
I can´t see great difference in color for the cap. New carton vs old carton: same. Only the old film itself shows a more black cap. Look at the black roll in the cap. Same "white". Maybe an illusion caused by light. Just reflexions.
The manufacturing of kodak level color negative film is pretty much impossible if they stop it. This is why i don't understand why Ferrania tries to make a color transparency, they should aim for a color negative. Even a not kodak level color negative could really dominate the markets and keep one factory running, that would be scaled to the needs of amateur's, and not the cinema industry.
Nico seems to be really concerned about Kodak in this video. I think it is important to consider that Kodak Rochester and Kodak Allaris are completely seperate companies. KR is the manufacturer but from KRs point of view, for their photographic film, they only have one large customer I.e KA. From KRs POV it make sense for them to try and find other customers - hence the rebranded , repackaged products. It is obvious that more competition is needed as it would be better for everyone if there is more then one manufacturer. I hope that someone large like Ilford would be willing to try their hand at producing colour negative film.
If this is true I hope c200 remains to some extent that films amazing. But this also suits kodaks monopoly giving the consumer illusion of choice and Kodak not having to fill any gaps in the market in its own catalog from the space created by rivals pulling out. They can just hoover up profits from consumers who have brand loyalty to other companies.
Actually it makes perfect sense if you consider that Kodak has several large machines for spooling 35mm film, only one of which is operating. The machines cannot operate 24 hours because of maintenance needs. To justify starting a second machine, they would have to go from two shifts of production to 5 shifts (three per machine less one shift for maintenance). If taking on Fuji production fills the gap, Kodak will be able to keep up with the Gold and pro film production that has been lacking of late.
This is not a bad thing. Kodak is good film. I took a tour of the plant as a chemical engineering student, they have unbelievable infrastructure to make film. Millions of feet of it. Trust me. If Kodak makes this film, it's good.
Kodak is having supply problems partly because they are branding their Gold as everything under the sun except Gold. The question is the new C200 the same price as Gold. Kodak film is notoriously more expensive than Fuji at least till maybe now. Is this the end of the cheapest C-41 film available?
@@NicosPhotographyShow price gouging is part of the reason film prices are so high. The retailers are taking full advantage of the supply chain issues. I have a copy of the official Kodak pricing from one of kodak's distributors for 2021 and it's nowhere near what the current price is on the retail side. My advice is to get a bulk loader like a Lloyd and a 400 ft can of 250d which you can buy directly from Kodak for about $400 USD and then it comes out to about $4 - $5 a roll of 24exp. ECN-2 film from Kodak is some of the absolute best film out there with insane fine grain and beautiful characteristics. And most importantly, it's important to help others who love film or want to get into film to shoot more film so that all of us who love film can benefit.
Seems odd that Kodak is selling its film to competitors, but they may just see this as a sale of another sort. For years they have sold their B&W films to others, which they rebrand as their own films. The key here is that all of those third party resellers are changing higher prices for the same film, or Kodak would cut them off in a corporate heart beat. This diversification gives an appearance of a larger film market than may exist. It also makes the down-stream resellers totally dependent on Kodak to sustain that part of their business. This is all smoke and mirrors, and none of it bodes will for the health of film photo industry as a whole. Remember when Henry Ford said, "You can buy a Model T in any color you want, so long as its black." Think Gold 200. (Which I actually think is a pretty good color film, if sold at a reasonable price.)
It makes sense to question the marketing strategy of Kodak; the company has the goods and a reliable brand name. As NPS has previously asked, why not roll out some name brand boutique offerings aimed at the youth market like lomo does? But Kodak seems to be playing the film market pretty well if they are supplying stock to the companies packaging the “alternative” brands of film and are now possibly taking over the supply chain for the only other mainstream producer of color negative film. That kind of sounds like a win for Kodak, though a loss for users who may prefer the look of Fuji film. Question: When Kodak produces film for its competitors, are they also doing the packaging and distribution?
Is the Fujifilm Acros 2 made by Ilford? 🤔 I guess in light of this it makes sense for Fujifilm to get out of the film market, Fujifilm do not have the Hollywood deal to continue to produce the motion picture film stock, they (Kodak) have the volume to reinvest in the production facilities. I guess for Fujifilm if they are just supplying the consumer market then the volume will not be there for a sustainable product line.
@@johnoofsatchurch Yes I did. It did not have Kodak on it, but I had two rolls with only 19 exposures on them. I received them as a gift. They were not in boxes, so I think someone is bulk rolling film and short changing the amount of exp.
Could you do a research to what’s up with orwo? They had announced new colorfilm for photography and cinematography but I couldn’t find anything about that. No one is talking about it🤷♂️ Edit: I just found a video about that on your channel✌️ they announced it lately for this year. Great news I think, but still wondering why just know one is talking about this announcement.
Respecto a la estrategia de negocio, Kodak Rochester produce y revende para Alaris, que no deja de ser un revendedor usando el mismo nombre (recordemos que la marca Kodak se fraccionó y vendió en la gran “caída” de Kodak, Alaris es solo una de esas partes con un acuerdo de distribución). Que Kodak Rochester fabrique y venda a otras empresas es incluso normal, ya que su negocio es la fabricación y no la distribución.
The caps on the C200 I bought recently were black. This would seem to suggest a different factory from Kodak. I really hope Fuji stays in the business, they're the only force keeping Kodak's prices for color negative film in check. They already have a monopoly on color reversal film, which has made it way too expensive to shoot E-6 like I used to.
Kodak is a brand, and that's virtually their only asset. Obviously, a brand can be monetized on many different products or even services, and licensing is an easy business with no production, logistics and other manufacturing effort involved. So its only smart from a business point of view to stop production all together and just turn Kodak into a licensing business. Color film is probably not the most profitable enterprise under Kodak brand, so why not stopping producing it all together and sell out (or lease) the production capacities and the formulas to other companies, who's core business is to market film? When I may speculate, I'd say, Kodak is removing itself from the film business and in the coming years we will see other film producers coming with clones of Kodak recipes under their own name, and earlier or later Kodak films are history and Kodak's film production branch will be sailing independently or under some different name. Just like Minolta or Olympus have removed themselves from the camera industry for good, or Rollei and Voigtländer are living on just as brands.
Let think about this. Why it is everyone are making the assumption that Kodak is making film for Fujifilm? Fujifilm have discontinued number of colour films in recent years. Therefore, they will still have the abilities to make colour films in their factory! In which case, there is a possibility that Fujifilm are making films for Kodak!
Fujifilm’s rash business decisions to discontinue certain film stocks, cut some film production from their business, and using rebranded film from third party manufacturers(Kodak). Might make sense from a business perspective to save cost and to keep their business afloat. But it’s really gonna backfire for their film division financially and commercially despite them claiming to be “committed to the film business and community ”. Then again why would Fujifilm care if they cut their film division from the business after all they are a corporation if they are making millions with their mirrorless cameras and their other endeavors through the medical and technological field. I don’t want to be doubtful about Fuji’s future but realistically. I wouldn’t be betting that much faith in Fuji film’s commitment towards film production. Instead I would support companies that are transparent towards the film community and are fully committed to the community and to the business of film production.
Está claro que Fuji está abandonando la fotografía analógica (excepto instant). La Neopan Acros II la fabrica Ilford y ahora parece que la nueva 200 la fabrica Kodak. De hecho creo que a Fuji se le acabó lo que tenía en el congelador y ha decidido mantener una película de 200. Recordemos que Fuji tenía una tecnología de color con cuatro capas (la serie Supera), si fuese Fuji quién fabricase, utilizaría esa tecnología. Si esto es así, no me preocupa tanto las estrategias de producción y distribución de Kodak, sino que ya es el último actor en película de color. Cuando Kodak cierre el grifo, podemos olvidarnos del color. Y subidas de precio… preparémonos.
Volkswagen Group makes all of these cars for different kinds of customers: VW, Audi, Skoda, Seat, Porsche, Lamborghini, Bentley, and Ducati. Maybe Kodak will buy Fujifilm's film division.
Maybe these films are all made in the same factory in China or some other Asian country and if you wish they would make it in Agfa, Ilford or ORWO packing too.
Kodak may not want to be the 9nly color film brand. Kodak has had serious anti-trust issues in the past with the US government. It may not recall those memories fondly.
Obviously if Kodak is making film for Fuji it centers on money. So, there must be a financial incentive for Kodak Rochester to provide film to Fuji (or lomography) for their branding. I suspect that they make MORE money providing film to third parties. It also reduces the amount of film that they make available to Alaris. This means that they can then make even more money by constantly raising prices on Kodak film. They can cite supply pressures and the need for more money for investment in production equipment. Of course, they will not invest that money but continue the same game of playing the outside against the center. This is the way of Regan/Thatcher capitalism. The consumer plays no part. The driving force is the stock value and the investor. We saw the same thing with Boeing and the 737-Max. It was immaterial that they killed hundreds of people as long as the stock prices were kept high. In a much less deadly environment Kodak is playing the same game. Maximize the money for the investor and squeeze as much out of the buyer as possible. Drive up demand, reduce availability (e.g. sell to 3rd parties) and then increase kodak film prices. This will continue. While it seems clear to me what Kodak is doing, it isn't clear what Fuji is doing. They are dumping film producing so I don't see a business advantage for them to market Kodak film as Fuji. It would make more sense to dump all film but their instax stuff. All very interesting situation in the current film environment . One can only hope that Owo color film comes back on the market. Competition is necessary.
Orwo making color film will bank on kodak prices and raise their shit through the roof, much like silberra with their pricy and mediocre film. They wont revolutionize much. Especially seeing they will probaby come out with a single color film that wil probably be the equivalent to a colorplus or gold but for the price of portra. IMO obviously.
@@wtf1992lynx I wish I could say I totally disagree but I think that you are probably correct. I can always hope that competition might help keep prices down. But like you I am pretty cynical about the situation in color film.
Sounds to me like a global conspiracy -- linked to Bill Gates and George Soros!!!! Oh wait -- that's something different! 🙂 At this point I'm desperate for *ANY* "cheap" color consumer film (35mm and 120)!!! "Cheap" being the operative word -- not like Lomography who sell end-run and expired film at crazy prices....
Kodak needs new forward thinking management and I think the only way that will happen is if they sell the film division. I want to see Bill Gates buy it outright for the mental health of all us quivering photographers. COME ON BILL GATES< SAVE US!!!! I think at this point Kodak management has lost their mind..
Fuji has no honor and no respect for the consumers. This episode is a sequel to the Acros II episode (not actually produced by Fuji). As far as I see they are allowing other companies to use names for different emulsions. Just milking the cow... No hate of anything from my side but I'm kind of tired of their cryptic approach.
Fuji cares about nothing other than instax. They claim they discontinue film because there's not enough demand yet the demand has been at its highest in the past several years.
@@loading12342000 At least with Across II, it is very clearly an emulsion closely related to the original, behaving much the same. Fuji's and Kodak's color films are inherently different in how they render colors, so mixing and matching there without any regard for emulsion differences is far worse.
I really hope they're gonna keep Superia 400 alive. It's such a great film, especially for the price and the only alternative to Kodak colors now.
Pushed 2-4 stops, also gives good results.
@@arricammarques1955 I've seen good results at 800.
its my look, I can't live without it!
And now Fuji 400 is made in the USA...
RIP
Also, in fairness to the caps - if you look on the superia box, it looks the same so I think it’s just the “lighting” on the box rather than actual silver caps
I've seen the newest batches of Kodak film back to the black caps too. Don't know if it was a fluke but I think it's just the lighting like you.
Wow I didn't know this news at all.
Thank you for sharing, Nico.
That came out quicker than I thought. I put the word out about the copy and paste last night and people have ran with it.
Cheers Nico.
No, these are no silver caps on the packaging, it's just reflections that make the caps look lighter. The lighting was different (or the rendering setup, doesn't matter; that doesn't mean that the actual cannisters wouldn't have silver caps). The curves are a much better clue.
The bigger issue here is that if Fuji gave up on C200 that means they are getting out of the film business. I prefer C200 to Gold 200 which is too yellow for my taste ... but more importantly, even for those who prefer Kodak Gold, is that only Fuji can keep Kodak prices in check.
The situation will be getting worse and worse until someone new pops up with their own manufacturing of film as well as chemicals. I am worried the most about slide film - basically on 3 options exist with very few ISO variation ... if Fuji's done with film - only 1 option remains!!! T_T
The situation will get really worse when chemicals for home film development will be banned. That's what scares me personally a lot.
Fuji stopped making any film except instax years ago. They’ve just been selling old stock. That’s why Provia is still currently available and Pro400 is ‘discontinued’ . Pro400 just ran out first.
@@barrydoyle7686 that might be the case ... and it looks like Velvia 50 is the next to "run out" because of how easy they gave up on it in the US.
@C.J. Wilkerson I also prefer Ektachrome, but every film has unique color and I like Provia too. Also I shot more Provia than Ektachrome :D
It’s only a matter of time until the Climate Alarmists come for the film industry. Fuji and Kodak are being proactive, and the film market is shrinking.
Wow. That's just crazy. Kodak raised prices 3 times in 3 years, each time around 20%, explaining that they do this to up their film production capacity - so that more film will be available in the market - and what do they do? They produce consumer film for Fuji, and Kodak consumer film still is almost impossible to buy, as they produce way too little. That's insane... (Fuji C200 btw currently cost 11.95€ PER ROLL in Fujifilm's official "Wonder Photo Shop's" in Spain, which are stores owned by Fujifilm Europe GmbH !!!)
You should buy in bulk from Germany instead. Fuji C200 is 6,90€ a roll (36 exp) over here.
Keep up the feed, Nico, as you are a lifeline and insight into what’s going on in the analog world.
The caps on the fuji superia "box" are the same as the caps on the new 200 boxes
I’m a Japanese living in Japan. For those who wonder, Fujicolor 200 is not sold here. We only have fujicolor 100 and Superia 400 as far as 135 color negative goes.Fuji’s Japanese website does not show fujicolor 200 either. I’m not surprised if this film is made by Kodak.
I'm Hungarian, Fujicolor C200 and Superia 400 is aviable here but not Fujicolor 200 which is the allegedly Kodak stuff. Currently this seems to be an American market thing.
I agree it is strange. But I'm going to offer the counter argument that if the cross selling keeps a more robust total market, that's a good thing for film. For example, if Fujifilm is unable/willing to make an emulsion for a segment but to keep the business happy they need one, go ahead and buy from 'someone'. Similarly, if Kodak can sell through other channels (companies) and keep the lines running, so be it. Yeah, selling through traditionally arch competitors is very odd, but the market is changing.
exactly what I thought, makes sense economically, my film heart is bleeding though.
Well, you may recall that on the b&w side of things, when Acros II was introduced it was made in the UK. Rumors started circulating that Acros II is made by Harman Technologies (Ilford). So maybe the notion that Eastman Kodak would supply Fujifilm isn't all that farfetched.
If fuji doesn't want to make non-instant camera film anymore and have Kodak do color, it would at least be great if they were having Kodak make it per their recipes, like they do with Ilford/Acros100 instead of just doing the Lomography thing and rebranding. Indeed, if Kodak was making Velvia I'd feel a little bit better like it won't disappear.
So Kodak make C200 and Ilford make Acros. That only leaves Superia 400, Provia and Velvia. But would Fuji really keep their production running just to manufacture these 3 films? My hunch is that Fuji closed their film factory years ago and all their film is either old stock kept in frozen storage or they have outsourced all their film production to other companies.
The factory has been shut since COVID hit, they've stated as such at a Tetenal UK Dealer day meeting. The rep for Fuji did state they were still aiming to continue color negative, reversal and black and white film production, so maybe this is just to keep things moving while the factory restart is underway... or they lied.
Love a good rant, thank you for sharing.
Kodak Gold 200 (3x135-36) has been backordered for a long time now, I keep calling and it's the same thing over and over again. Makes you think. Why such an unusual delay, when the other stocks can be ordered without much issue? I get the film is cheaper, but I can't help thinking its because they were working with Fuji to shift distribution and were delayed due to repackaging of C200.
I am not a business man, but I wonder if it is advantageous for Kodak to sell the film to Fuji (assuming this theory is true, of course) as they can sell that film all now, and not have to worry about how long will it take to sell and get a return. That gets offloaded to Fuji.
it makes me think a lot now, since Fujifilm always had those colored stripes between perforations that lacks now based on the "new" data sheet. too bad it would be a Gold copypasa...
Fuji will continue to make film as long as Japanese continue to shoot film.
Maybe Fuji pays in time so Kodak Rochester set priorities accordingly.
I don't know if Kodak is still using the silver caps, I just bought some Portra a few weeks ago from my local camera shop and all 5 rolls had the black caps and this was new stock that they had just got in from Kodak.
The charts are more or less pixel perfect identical. Even the text. However, I don't think this necessarily means Fuji is discontinuing C200. C200 is still the one markedet in Europe, so this might be a US thing. And they still make Superia 400 and Fujicolor 100, although the last one is japan only. My guess is that Kodak is making and branding these films themselves in US for Fujifilm for the US market, as they do with Lomography's color negative film. WIth all the situations in the world these days that might be more desireable for Fujifilm US than actually shipping film from Japan to the US.
if u look at both boxes the rolls on both seem silvery but i guess that's just the reflected light/shine effect.
If Kodak is selling Kodak Gold 200 film to Fuji to package and sell as Fujicolor 200, they are making more profits that way, than by packaging and selling it as Kodak Gold 200 - it's probably that simple.
This 200 Fuji has been available in the states for nearly a year maybe more. Did it just got released in EU?
I have 9 rolls of these and they have black canisters .
Don't Harman/Ilford make Acros for Fujifilm? So Kodak making colour isn't really a surprise.
The difference is that acros 2 isn't a rebranded Ilford film
They may be pulling the same with some 400 films. I just developed 2 rolls from disposable cameras, and they both had silver caps.
Or…maybe they are having supply issues BECAUSE they giving their films to other companies. Realistically, they probably had this planned and when supplies became harder to come by, Kodak began to feel the pressure because they are supplying Fuji. They may have a contract where they have to meet a particular amount of film to Fuji therefore they’ve had to tighten up their own supply as a result. Just a thought.
If you look at the film spool, which should be black plastic, it's pictured in the same brighter gray manner as the supposedly silver cap. So it might be just a color thing.
Maybe this deal was signed a while back and Kodak are contractually obliged to supply Fujifilm with Gold and that takes precedence over selling it themselves.
OK I thought I was the only one that noticed this thank you.
Is there a worry over Kodak's color film and whether or not it will be still produced? I got some mixed feelings from this video
i feel like Kodak is producing Fuji's comsumer film (but it's still fuji's recipe) hence the silver caps. Fuji might having issues starting production again or reramping the production line. So they are filling orders with Gold 200? IDK, that seems strange too. They flat out announced the disconuation of 400H and 160NS, so why not announce XTRA 200? It seems to be a temporary change they made
If so much money can be made with 35mm film why aren't there more companies?
You can not buy Fuji 200 in Japan for year. I always I didn’t understand why there don’t sale it here.
Last spring C200 cost about 4 francs, half a year later it was 7
It's looking more and more like the rumors have been true all along. Fuji stopped making film years ago and are just selling off their remaining stocks. The only "insider" in the business I know has been saying this for years, but I obviously didn'y want to believe it.
I really hope Orwo will start making colour film again soon!
Okay, but the caps look the exact same on the box of the Superia.
Fuji Acros II -> Ilford B&W?
Fuji C200 -> Kodak Gold 200?
Perhaps the bottleneck at Kodak is in confectioning not coating. Meanwhile Fuji don't coat anymore but have some capacity to package.
This notion I like, as far as being realistic.
Well, Harman ( parent company of Ilford ) manufactures the new Acros 100 II, so no surprises here. What is for sure is that Fuji is packing up their film division in an effort to push their digital zillion mega pixel wonder boxes.
Niiiiice shirt!
Fuji has shelf space at walmart, drug stores, etc here in the states that Kodak does not in many cases. For Fuji, they get to cash in on their brand recognition and retail space with very little expense. For Kodak (A or R I'm not sure), they get a guaranteed sale of a lot of rolls of film that's likely recurring AND don't have to market or distribute them.... Since Kodak is the only major player in the color market that's committed to the future of film, Kodak is not worried about losing they monopoly with any supply chain issues this may exacerbate..... In other words, it is a simple, sound business decision for both companies.
film photography, day after day are so strange, I search in alibaba I see Vista agfa for sale, but with one condition sell 10,000 roll all together, but outdoor we haven't seen agfa Vista anywhere fresh🙄
I think is the same in portugal. We have well-known brands making the same product but with different packaging. If it's the same ??!!! fuji, doesn't produce but continue to sell and keep the fuji associated to film and don´t have pruduction cost... The kodak also avoids having 100% of the market (I don't think it's not alowed).
I miss the old Superia 200
I can´t see great difference in color for the cap. New carton vs old carton: same. Only the old film itself shows a more black cap. Look at the black roll in the cap. Same "white". Maybe an illusion caused by light. Just reflexions.
The manufacturing of kodak level color negative film is pretty much impossible if they stop it.
This is why i don't understand why Ferrania tries to make a color transparency, they should aim for a color negative. Even a not kodak level color negative could really dominate the markets and keep one factory running, that would be scaled to the needs of amateur's, and not the cinema industry.
I guess we'll know for sure if the new boxes say made in the USA
I can only assure one thing from this info, c41 stock is still gonna be painful to procure
Oh well I'll stick to bw for film for quite a while
Nico seems to be really concerned about Kodak in this video. I think it is important to consider that Kodak Rochester and Kodak Allaris are completely seperate companies.
KR is the manufacturer but from KRs point of view, for their photographic film, they only have one large customer I.e KA. From KRs POV it make sense for them to try and find other customers - hence the rebranded , repackaged products.
It is obvious that more competition is needed as it would be better for everyone if there is more then one manufacturer. I hope that someone large like Ilford would be willing to try their hand at producing colour negative film.
If this is true I hope c200 remains to some extent that films amazing. But this also suits kodaks monopoly giving the consumer illusion of choice and Kodak not having to fill any gaps in the market in its own catalog from the space created by rivals pulling out. They can just hoover up profits from consumers who have brand loyalty to other companies.
Actually it makes perfect sense if you consider that Kodak has several large machines for spooling 35mm film, only one of which is operating. The machines cannot operate 24 hours because of maintenance needs. To justify starting a second machine, they would have to go from two shifts of production to 5 shifts (three per machine less one shift for maintenance). If taking on Fuji production fills the gap, Kodak will be able to keep up with the Gold and pro film production that has been lacking of late.
This is not a bad thing. Kodak is good film. I took a tour of the plant as a chemical engineering student, they have unbelievable infrastructure to make film. Millions of feet of it. Trust me. If Kodak makes this film, it's good.
Kodak is having supply problems partly because they are branding their Gold as everything under the sun except Gold.
The question is the new C200 the same price as Gold. Kodak film is notoriously more expensive than Fuji at least till maybe now. Is this the end of the cheapest C-41 film available?
The end of cheap C-41 has been a while ago. We have mid and high level. But if it means film will continue it will be price Im willing to pay.
@@NicosPhotographyShow price gouging is part of the reason film prices are so high. The retailers are taking full advantage of the supply chain issues.
I have a copy of the official Kodak pricing from one of kodak's distributors for 2021 and it's nowhere near what the current price is on the retail side.
My advice is to get a bulk loader like a Lloyd and a 400 ft can of 250d which you can buy directly from Kodak for about $400 USD and then it comes out to about $4 - $5 a roll of 24exp.
ECN-2 film from Kodak is some of the absolute best film out there with insane fine grain and beautiful characteristics.
And most importantly, it's important to help others who love film or want to get into film to shoot more film so that all of us who love film can benefit.
Seems odd that Kodak is selling its film to competitors, but they may just see this as a sale of another sort. For years they have sold their B&W films to others, which they rebrand as their own films.
The key here is that all of those third party resellers are changing higher prices for the same film, or Kodak would cut them off in a corporate heart beat. This diversification gives an appearance of a larger film market than may exist. It also makes the down-stream resellers totally dependent on Kodak to sustain that part of their business. This is all smoke and mirrors, and none of it bodes will for the health of film photo industry as a whole. Remember when Henry Ford said, "You can buy a Model T in any color you want, so long as its black." Think Gold 200. (Which I actually think is a pretty good color film, if sold at a reasonable price.)
It makes sense to question the marketing strategy of Kodak; the company has the goods and a reliable brand name. As NPS has previously asked, why not roll out some name brand boutique offerings aimed at the youth market like lomo does? But Kodak seems to be playing the film market pretty well if they are supplying stock to the companies packaging the “alternative” brands of film and are now possibly taking over the supply chain for the only other mainstream producer of color negative film. That kind of sounds like a win for Kodak, though a loss for users who may prefer the look of Fuji film.
Question: When Kodak produces film for its competitors, are they also doing the packaging and distribution?
Is the Fujifilm Acros 2 made by Ilford? 🤔 I guess in light of this it makes sense for Fujifilm to get out of the film market, Fujifilm do not have the Hollywood deal to continue to produce the motion picture film stock, they (Kodak) have the volume to reinvest in the production facilities.
I guess for Fujifilm if they are just supplying the consumer market then the volume will not be there for a sustainable product line.
I just got back my negatives of Fujicolor 200 from the Darkroom. The negatives have Kodak printed on them.
Sorry I got my shipments mixed up. I have not sent the Fujicolor in yet. I will report back when I get that roll back.
Get the roll back Yet
@@johnoofsatchurch Yes I did. It did not have Kodak on it, but I had two rolls with only 19 exposures on them. I received them as a gift. They were not in boxes, so I think someone is bulk rolling film and short changing the amount of exp.
Could you do a research to what’s up with orwo? They had announced new colorfilm for photography and cinematography but I couldn’t find anything about that. No one is talking about it🤷♂️
Edit: I just found a video about that on your channel✌️ they announced it lately for this year. Great news I think, but still wondering why just know one is talking about this announcement.
They are saying it will be color for cinematography, they havent mentioned any C-41 film. It will be ECN-2. They did mention 135 film in b&w.
Maybe its the opposite and fuji was providing kodak the film in the past
Respecto a la estrategia de negocio, Kodak Rochester produce y revende para Alaris, que no deja de ser un revendedor usando el mismo nombre (recordemos que la marca Kodak se fraccionó y vendió en la gran “caída” de Kodak, Alaris es solo una de esas partes con un acuerdo de distribución).
Que Kodak Rochester fabrique y venda a otras empresas es incluso normal, ya que su negocio es la fabricación y no la distribución.
I pray they dont discontinue Provia. To me its like Kodachrome
Stock up!!
The caps on the C200 I bought recently were black. This would seem to suggest a different factory from Kodak. I really hope Fuji stays in the business, they're the only force keeping Kodak's prices for color negative film in check. They already have a monopoly on color reversal film, which has made it way too expensive to shoot E-6 like I used to.
Kodak is a brand, and that's virtually their only asset. Obviously, a brand can be monetized on many different products or even services, and licensing is an easy business with no production, logistics and other manufacturing effort involved. So its only smart from a business point of view to stop production all together and just turn Kodak into a licensing business. Color film is probably not the most profitable enterprise under Kodak brand, so why not stopping producing it all together and sell out (or lease) the production capacities and the formulas to other companies, who's core business is to market film?
When I may speculate, I'd say, Kodak is removing itself from the film business and in the coming years we will see other film producers coming with clones of Kodak recipes under their own name, and earlier or later Kodak films are history and Kodak's film production branch will be sailing independently or under some different name. Just like Minolta or Olympus have removed themselves from the camera industry for good, or Rollei and Voigtländer are living on just as brands.
Let think about this. Why it is everyone are making the assumption that Kodak is making film for Fujifilm? Fujifilm have discontinued number of colour films in recent years. Therefore, they will still have the abilities to make colour films in their factory! In which case, there is a possibility that Fujifilm are making films for Kodak!
Fujifilm’s rash business decisions to discontinue certain film stocks, cut some film production from their business, and using rebranded film from third party manufacturers(Kodak).
Might make sense from a business perspective to save cost and to keep their business afloat.
But it’s really gonna backfire for their film division financially and commercially despite them claiming to be “committed to the film business and community ”.
Then again why would Fujifilm care if they cut their film division from the business after all they are a corporation if they are making millions with their mirrorless cameras and their other endeavors through the medical and technological field. I don’t want to be doubtful about Fuji’s future but realistically.
I wouldn’t be betting that much faith in Fuji film’s commitment towards film production. Instead I would support companies that are transparent towards the film community and are fully committed to the community and to the business of film production.
Está claro que Fuji está abandonando la fotografía analógica (excepto instant). La Neopan Acros II la fabrica Ilford y ahora parece que la nueva 200 la fabrica Kodak. De hecho creo que a Fuji se le acabó lo que tenía en el congelador y ha decidido mantener una película de 200. Recordemos que Fuji tenía una tecnología de color con cuatro capas (la serie Supera), si fuese Fuji quién fabricase, utilizaría esa tecnología.
Si esto es así, no me preocupa tanto las estrategias de producción y distribución de Kodak, sino que ya es el último actor en película de color. Cuando Kodak cierre el grifo, podemos olvidarnos del color. Y subidas de precio… preparémonos.
ORWO where are you when we need you most
Volkswagen Group makes all of these cars for different kinds of customers: VW, Audi, Skoda, Seat, Porsche, Lamborghini, Bentley, and Ducati. Maybe Kodak will buy Fujifilm's film division.
Maybe these films are all made in the same factory in China or some other Asian country and if you wish they would make it in Agfa, Ilford or ORWO packing too.
And if Kodak is not doing their film anymore… 🤯
Just bought a load of C200 😳
As long as it’s made 😂
As long as someone is making color, I guess.
@@NicosPhotographyShow got any news about ferrania color?
Kodak may not want to be the 9nly color film brand. Kodak has had serious anti-trust issues in the past with the US government. It may not recall those memories fondly.
And c200 is very close to the price of gold 200 so it's probably true!!
Fujicolor 200, not C200 is gold 200.
Es ist wild.
Ja sehr komisch
Obviously if Kodak is making film for Fuji it centers on money. So, there must be a financial incentive for Kodak Rochester to provide film to Fuji (or lomography) for their branding. I suspect that they make MORE money providing film to third parties. It also reduces the amount of film that they make available to Alaris. This means that they can then make even more money by constantly raising prices on Kodak film. They can cite supply pressures and the need for more money for investment in production equipment. Of course, they will not invest that money but continue the same game of playing the outside against the center. This is the way of Regan/Thatcher capitalism. The consumer plays no part. The driving force is the stock value and the investor. We saw the same thing with Boeing and the 737-Max. It was immaterial that they killed hundreds of people as long as the stock prices were kept high. In a much less deadly environment Kodak is playing the same game. Maximize the money for the investor and squeeze as much out of the buyer as possible. Drive up demand, reduce availability (e.g. sell to 3rd parties) and then increase kodak film prices. This will continue. While it seems clear to me what Kodak is doing, it isn't clear what Fuji is doing. They are dumping film producing so I don't see a business advantage for them to market Kodak film as Fuji. It would make more sense to dump all film but their instax stuff. All very interesting situation in the current film environment . One can only hope that Owo color film comes back on the market. Competition is necessary.
Orwo making color film will bank on kodak prices and raise their shit through the roof, much like silberra with their pricy and mediocre film. They wont revolutionize much. Especially seeing they will probaby come out with a single color film that wil probably be the equivalent to a colorplus or gold but for the price of portra. IMO obviously.
@@wtf1992lynx I wish I could say I totally disagree but I think that you are probably correct. I can always hope that competition might help keep prices down. But like you I am pretty cynical about the situation in color film.
This is scary AF…
Sounds to me like a global conspiracy -- linked to Bill Gates and George Soros!!!! Oh wait -- that's something different! 🙂 At this point I'm desperate for *ANY* "cheap" color consumer film (35mm and 120)!!! "Cheap" being the operative word -- not like Lomography who sell end-run and expired film at crazy prices....
DRAMA!
Kodak needs new forward thinking management and I think the only way that will happen is if they sell the film division. I want to see Bill Gates buy it outright for the mental health of all us quivering photographers. COME ON BILL GATES< SAVE US!!!! I think at this point Kodak management has lost their mind..
Face it. Fuji is going out of film, only instax will be produced.
I got no love for anything Fuji anymore they let medias die dismantle machinery without any explanation or regard to their consumers
Fuji has no honor and no respect for the consumers. This episode is a sequel to the Acros II episode (not actually produced by Fuji). As far as I see they are allowing other companies to use names for different emulsions. Just milking the cow...
No hate of anything from my side but I'm kind of tired of their cryptic approach.
Fuji cares about nothing other than instax. They claim they discontinue film because there's not enough demand yet the demand has been at its highest in the past several years.
@@loading12342000 At least with Across II, it is very clearly an emulsion closely related to the original, behaving much the same. Fuji's and Kodak's color films are inherently different in how they render colors, so mixing and matching there without any regard for emulsion differences is far worse.