AMD's Gaming Financials Look Ominous... For Console Gaming
Вставка
- Опубліковано 8 тра 2024
- ► Watch the FULL Video: • DF Direct Weekly #161:...
► Support us on Patreon! bit.ly/3jEGjvx
► Digital Foundry UA-cam: / digitalfoundry
► Digital Foundry Merch: store.digitalfoundry.net
► Digital Foundry at Eurogamer: eurogamer.net/digitalfoundry
► Follow on X/Twitter: / digitalfoundry
A world with only Sony is grim enough but I can’t even imagine the hellscape of a world where there is only Nvidia.
Sony is gonna end up doing exactly what Microsoft is doing right now if Microsoft fails the Xbox brand. They will push for absolute control and destroy everything it has stood for the moment it gains monopoly on the gaming business
@@jaredcrane7547 sony has been the best console since ps1 over 28 years ago..
On Prices I agree but Nvidia make stellar graphics cards.
At least Nvidia does cool stuff. Just unfortunately that involves a lot of uncool stuff for consumers too.
Sony will still have Nintendo and PC to compete against not to mention streaming games becoming viable in future which will eliminate the need for consoles altogether
This isn't a game industry issue, this is an economic issue. Every industry is seeing reduction in sales because inflation is leaving ppl in a famine mentality.
Been a gamer since 1979 and have owned every console from then to now, but what we are seeing in the gaming industry is unlike anything we have seen since the crash in the 80s, and it is not just Microsoft. Sony is also feeling it.
Games so expensive to make, so expensive to buy, poor quiality, poor performance....Its the new era crash.
Handhelds are the way to go.too many vendors with crappy games out there
Like many of us has said it’s gonna crash again it’s been on the cards for ages…….
Gpu prices still overpriced
Games bringing nothing new
Games prices gone up and quality gone down!
It’s coming
Same, im 51, started on a zx80 and 81, speccy route. Thing is, the japanese gaming saved the day last time. Greed is killing it this time.
@@Sabre_Wulf1 I agree.
Do they really tho? We're mid-generation and knee deep in inflation. Of course demand is lower. 🤷🏿♂️
Exactly few understand macroeconomics and the impact rising rates have on disposable income.
That's true, but I have a hard time chalking it up to just that. The big players in the industry are taking a dump on their consumer base, that seems to me to be a much bigger issue than just disposable income.
Were barely got anything "Next Gen" in the last 3.5 years to justify the current consoles so for a lot of people to buy into another 5-600 dollar price tag for a mid gen refresh seems unrealistic. I don't think this mid gen refresh is going to see the kind of success the xb1x and ps4pro saw.
A lot of consumers are making the jump to PC over the last few years which further compounds the console sales woes.
Ultimately until we see a steady flow of high impact titles to win back consumer confidence, I see the console market remaining stagnant.
It's like the whole industry is waiting for GTA 6 for "next gen" to finally arrive.
But for the most part the more powerful hardware has been spent on 4K target output & performance modes, even with upscaling tech. It's better, but nothing that makes you think "we haven't seen this before'
And everything's getting so expensive of course people are cutting back on non essentials.
Yeah this is definitely it. I remember going from PS2 to Xbox 360 and being genuinely stunned. That just doesn't happen anymore and probably won't ever again. The less dramatic the leap the less enticing the console becomes. The console manufacturers want to keep the consoles relevant with mid gen refreshes (which also generates sales) but it's really in their interest to let the consoles become obsolete so that the new one's actually have something to offer. Look at everyone clamoring for a switch 2 because the first one isn't powerful enough now. Nintendo knows what they're doing.
I agree about the 'Next Gen' games scarcity but, in my case, boot/load times, performance (*), and responsiveness (*) have improved a lot with my Xbox SX vs. my Xbox One S. I don't care about 4K or HDR because I have a 1080p TV.
(*): As opposed to stuttering and input lag.
i was going to get a basic pc anyway.... when the scalpers got all of the consoles and were charging $1200 i just got a pc with a 3070.(prebuilt because all of the gpu's were gone too)
now i'm building another pc with a 7800x3d/7900xtx. i will be getting the pro when it releases because i don't have a ps5 yet.
@@caliginousmoira8565 PS5 throws most of their games on PC a year after launch anyways. Unless you're dying to play a PlayStation game day 1, there's no point in throwing another $600 at a plastic box when you already have a capable gaming PC. That money is better invested in your rig.
Um, the entire Planet's economy is in a freefall... As much as I love gaming, the issue, is that people have no disposable income... I don't think these guys ever leave their houses to see how bad it actually is out there for average people now...
The spare disposable income is definitely tighter now than I ever remember it being. There just doesn't seem to be enough money to spend on video games and consoles anymore. Everything is rent/mortgages and other cost if living expenses.
The problem is, game prices have skyrocketed. It used to be 50 to 60 euro here for a very long time. Now we're paying 80 to 100 euro. And game quality has taken a nose dive as well.
So many titles ship unfinished on day 1, and needs at least 6 to 8 months of extra work.
@@skycloud4802That's the truth of the matter.
Alex is right; the demand on PC and the demand on console aren't really the same.
We may have some crossover appeal but for the most part we're after different things.
Sound logical
But they have the same components. And with third parties releasing games on PC, and Microsoft releasing games on PC, and Sony now starting to release games on PC, even though console gamers and PC gamers are after different things, we all can find it on the same hardware. All that's missing is Nintendo games.
The most amusing thing about this is Xbox saying they want a 'steam like' service.....
Not a CHANCE they'll ever compete as they're a publicly traded corporate entity, meaning they have shareholders there to ruin everything...
Steam don't have that problem 😅
Man shareholders are the worst. We should have laws here that make investing a more “take it or leave it” approach. The fact that people with no industry experience can dictate where the industry goes is crazy. Imagine owning a bakery but you don’t know how to bake and then telling the head baker to change the recipes.
Why would I need new hardware if most of the newer games suck? People are happy enough with the good old games.
New games bad, old games good
Are you just going to keep playing old games over and over again?
@@hihihi1q23 that would get….. OLD mawhahaha
Yet, they still receiving decent to very well in reviews.
@@hihihi1q23i mean i personally have a huge backlog of old games which will keep me busy for 2-3 years at least lol
Movie revenue is down. Gaming revenue is down, retail revenue is down. Sales of new vehicles are down. Sales of motorcycles and recreational vehicles are down. I know each of these companies are scrambling to make up sales and projections, but the fact is the economy, nut just US but also the rest of the civilized world. It's the same in the UK, all of Europe, and Australia. I know these things. I do not know about Japan, other than NTDOY is down as well...its not a gaming issue, its an economy issue. People just don't have the money to spend on games, cars, motorcycles, movies, etc., when electricity is up 30%, food is up 40% etc etc. It's a crazy time for AAA budgets to be at their highest point ever. Not sure what I would do if I was a decision maker in any of these industries. People just do not have the liquidable cash on hand to spend on recreation like they did 4-5 years ago.
Japan is in a recession.
And the more AI takes people's jobs. there will be an ever shrinking pool of customers if everyone's out of work
To answer your question, yes Japan is also in free fall. More to the point China is beyond freefall and has basically gone critical mass at this point. They have so many different country ending events going on simultaneously that each individually could collapse their entire empire, and they have no way to solve a single one
I've been playing on the PS4 Pro because I anticipated the PS5 Pro, and I was right. PS5 Pro is a day one buy for me, and I have a large list of PS5 only games I'll be picking up at a nice discount. Probably Helldivers 2 and Stellar Blade to start.
I just bought and soft modded a ps2 and am having much more fun now than I was with ps4/ps5. Everything is just different now and weird.
Agreed and you're lucky you've got a modded PS2
Big reason retro handhelds are also selling so well. A lot of people tired of the BS of the last 2 gens
I got a PS2 too, but I can't agree on that.
Everything is just too old for me, I wish PS5 had backwards compatibility like Xbox, cause I'd love to play those games with decent resolution on my TV.
Or maybe I just need to buy an old TV, cause I remember this console looking great on them...
@@559925 I depends on everyone for sure. For me retro gaming has a place, but I prefer modern games and remakes or remasters. Playeing Yakuza Kiwami, FC24, Tales of Vesperia, and for retro Pokemon Crystal and Metroid Zero Mission. I never buy full price or new games anymore. Not worth it to me.
Agreed. I like modern games still, but the best thing I ever did was set up a retro gaming area. So much fun to reminisce about a better time in the world. 90s and early 00s really might've been the peak.
damnit that's bad, we absolutely NEED them, one company cannot have the monopoly
AMD is doing fine with Client (Ryzen) and Data Center (EPYC / Instinct). Last quarter even Nvidia reported no growth in their gaming business. It's all about AI Servers and AI compute now.
@@EarthB00 as a company, sure, but if they see flops in their GPU segment, they might not invest as much into the R&D
That's all well and good, but if you don't buy the damn console or it's games, then I don't want to hear that shit. Only people who own the console and it's games need to be making that remark.
@@HTHAMMACK1i buy from both worlds, but I fail to see your point anyway
1 company to rule us all and into darkness bind us🤣
I'm still playing a PS4 because there aren't enough exclusive games at the PS5 price tag (Americans forget the price INCREASED everywhere else). And it looks like any major price cut just isn't happening because they can't make the consoles cheaper, or so DF has implied. At this point, I'm hoping they cut the price to what it originally launched at. There are so many last-gen games that are heavily discounted now and still some current-gen titles that play acceptably well on last-gen. I think Sony and MS are in for a rude awakening when Nintendo launches their new hardware. At this point, I'll probably just pick up a Switch 2 instead.
Rich is spot on that people are still playing old games. They haven’t seen a compelling reason to upgrade at all. This generation of consoles is the 20 series for NVIDIA. There was no reason to leave Pascal
Exactly this is the main issue.
That’s why I don’t give a damn about Switch getting a new version. So much good stuff in the catalogue to go through still.
@@ilbroducciore i heard about switch 2 being confirmed and was like "cool let me know in 5 years when another zelda is out, until then a nice new steam deck sounds way more appealing"
No point half the new games are usually broke at launch and cost 100$ your waiting 6 month for fixes
Yep, there's nothing really appealing about the current consoles, be it hardware itself or the lackluster games that are being released on them. As such and with the last gen consoles still being catered for and with a lot of those gamers still playing on less demanding but well established games (especially the big hitting online games like Fortnite, Destiny 2 ect), then there's simply not enough incentive for those console gamers to even bother upgrading to a current gen console.
Even on PC a simular situation applies, where fewer and fewer gamers are bothering to upgrade. This is due either to being held back by having a limited budget and the current sky high prices of GPU's or again them simply feeling theres absolutely no need to. Since likewise they too are also mostly playing on the same or simular less demanding titles, where an older GPU/CPU is more than sufficient.
And in that situation I can completely understand thier stance. If your older system/hardware is still good enough for the games that you mostly play on and it's still being supported, then why would you even bother in upgrading it?
It also, doesn't help with us being in the middle of a worldwide economic downturn. Where affording basic items like food and paying off the bills matters far more, than buying an expensive luxury item like a new console, a new video card or even another poorly made generic or re-hashed AAA game for $70.
I guarantee unless things drastically change and change pretty quickly in the videi game industry, then there's going to be another major gaming crash, happening very soon. The writing about it's arrival has been on the wall for quite a while, now.
What’s funny is we need more games like hifi rush and wi like titles that constrict themselves to imaginative design and descent budgets that people appreciate and afford without the over done grind.
Consoles are going through a very tough phase I think. It’s still got a lot of players but I feel like consoles peaked in their traditional format, and it may be a bumpy ride to figure out what the future of consoles/gaming looks like. It is interesting that a lot of the major franchises are typically getting quite old now. Some still have big appeal, Zelda does well, Grand Theft Auto is obvious, but some things like Halo seem to have lost big traction. I’m approaching 40 and remember when most of the big franchises came out, but do younger gamers care about them? I keep up to date with the news but I don’t actually play that many games at all these days. Games are probably getting too complicated and too costly, and when they only end up releasing one or two big franchise titles over many years there’s a real lack of hype.
F2P and Live Service changed the landscape and users simply aren't needing to move to new hardware very often. Like as it stands over 60% of played time in gaming is on titles that are 6+ years old like Faortnite, GTA Online, Roblox, LoL etc. and only 8% of time played is on new games. Next year we will likely see consoles sales do much better then this year due to GTA6 but that really feels like the first game your average consumer has needed to upgrade for.
The future of consoles seems to be the switch/steam deck. Portable computers with docks for tv use. And honestly im fine with that.
@@thefilmdirector1 Between that and streaming yes. I hate to admit it because I can't stand streaming, but in another 5 to 10 years it'll be so good most average people won't be able to tell what's playing native vs streaming.
@@SpartanArmy117 Data caps are a thing, and will be for a very long time. Plus I only 750GB a month, after that my internet drops to down to 1mbps.
@@DeadPhoenix86DP Streaming for a month probably doesn't even equate to what downloading a single modern game does. I think that's irrelevant.
It's the perfect storm of circumstance:
- pandemic-induced supply issues compounded by scaplers at the launch of new consoles, delaying the time people get their hands on them
- lacklusture, often buggy games, and not enough of them.
- lack of disposable income, meaning people hold on to older hardware and games
- consoles now 3.5 years old meaning they're not exactly cutting-edge, yet prices haven't meaningfully dropped
- cross-gen continuing even now, meaning less incentive to move over.
We almost need a major crash and either a new player to enter the scene with something fun and different or for xbox/playstation to meaningfully differentiate and innovate
I've always thought that PlayStation and Xbox have been trying to push consoles very far, too soon. And they end up selling the consoles themselves at a loss.
Game development ends up being way more expensive while taking too long.
PS4 Pro and Xbox One X tried to push 4k too early. And current consoles still struggle on that
I feel like there’s a decent resurgence in retro gaming as well, a lot of people I know have went back to collections physical copies and consoles from older generation. PS1/PS2, PS3, 360, Super Nintendo, etc. I feel like a lot of people are burnt out on modern gaming
And people laughed when we said we are gonna have another video game crash!
Game prices gone up but quality has gone down massively.
Gpu prices still poor considering previous generations.
With all this power we are still playing games we played 10
Year ago!
It’s coming…..
What you are seeing now is the crash. You aren't going to a get 1982-level crash again, the industry is too mature and videogames are too much of a cultural phenomenon now.
@@zaidabraham7310 it’s obviously not going to be like the first one but it’s gonna get worse before it gets better
Greed is destroying the game industry, it's never enough.
"Greed" is what built the industry. It's why we enjoy expensive AAA games on technologically advanced hardware. These things come at a cost.
@@bobbobbins4877 we would NOT have what we have now if we settled , you keep what you have and let pthers choose to upgrade itf they wish
99% of the game industry is just trying to get paid fair value for their labor and creativity. Programmers even take a big pay cut to work on games because it's supposedly "more fun" than databases and web apps. These large companies operate at a scale of income and losses that you can't even fathom. It's not greedy for them to try to make a billion dollars one year, when some years they lose a billion dollars. As long as there's competition, the market will dictate what is fair. Greed has nothing to do with it.
Don't for DEI, that cost is flowing well into the trillion number now.
@@bobbobbins4877 Good for you if you can enjoy this "AAA" crap, personally i dive deeper and deeper into retro gaming.
The scalping issue with the PS5 launch turned me off so much that I went PC. Never going back to console.
Unfortunately scalpers and crypto miners also ruined pc gaming, with the sky high priced graphics cards and poor availability.
@@skycloud4802 definitely but i could find a used GPU even if it did cost more than normal, PS5 was just impossible to find for years. I didn't think it was worth the money.
@richied5294 Where do you live if I may ask?
I've moved between Europe and Australia and had PS5 since day one and was able to buy another 2 for normal price in normal store when i wanted. All my mates have one and never had problem finding one immediately.
@@Arasael23 USA. I had a maxed out 100 member ps party group for years and seen all my PS friends on waiting lists for months before anyone got lucky and I had no patience for all that. Pc had my curiosity for a little while so that was the push I needed. Now I can't get back into fps games with a controller, feels like I'm wearing mittens LoL
@@skycloud4802I got a PS5 because and an Xbox because building new 4k PCs got too expensive and I needed 2 for my wife and me. I used ro be PC and switch only before this gen.
Look the problem is no one has any money. And in short order, all of our bills gotten much higher while our disposable income went down relative to the increase. It's hard to afford gaming right now. On top of that there's kind of a similar problem to the film industry where everyone 's focusing on trying to get this big sure thing money maker. Those aren't usually a thing. Sorry to tell you.
I teach digital arts and digital design. So I get a lot of students that are interested in tech and gaming etc. I think there are a few factors: the first is the economics. Most families don't have as much expendable income as they did 5 years ago. I believe the second factor is mobile phones. Most students are sucked into their phones. Most young people are on social media more than anything else. Their current hobbies are more often to watch other people have hobbies than to have them themselves. There's more kids watching streamers and influencers then playing games themselves. And of those that do have games a lot of them are on mobile or on a switch or on a PS4 or on a Nintendo Wii. There's a lot of last Gen gaming happening or mobile gaming happening. The final Factor that I observe is that many young people haven't played any of the big Sony games. They haven't even heard of the big Xbox games. And well they might be big fans of the old Nintendo properties, there just aren't that many new games that are getting people excited. I literally never hear about young people talking up the next new game. If there's any hype at all it's in the PC space and it's a very niche audience. Not a lot of young people have a good enough PC to be an enthusiast for PC gaming. But honestly that's where most of the gamers of this generation seem to play. I would say that the typical gamer of this upcoming generation has either a Nintendo switch and a PC or they have a Wii or a PS4. That's it. Beyond that we almost never hear of PS5 or Xbox Series consoles being in people's homes. At least the ones that I talk to.
For my part I have my PC (RTX 3070) connected to an LG C3 and RTX video HDR and Super Resolution makes watching things on you tube and "other" sites a fantastic experience. Not to mention DLSS and RTX HDR for games. I almost pulled the trigger on selling my card and buying RX 7800 XT when it was at $470 but I thought about the feature set on Nvidia cards and decided to wait and see what Intel has up it's sleeve and what kind of value the RTX 50 series will provide. In terms of the PC space AMD still needs to step up their game considerably although they do admittedly provide much better value for money in terms of raster and memory.
How's power consumption
I hope you guys revisit the switch 2 leaked specs.
I wanna how this will go.
20-30 years from now, we will be reminiscing such good gaming times with DF at the old folks home.
How goes those handhelds.
I think MS is happy to do a console for GP platform. Just not the direct sale store or dedicated OS since there's a significant upkeep cost there with little sales for them.
Are we looking at other late seventies early eighties video game meltdown.. a few reasons I can only think of... Are lead times for games are now 6 to 7 years... That used to be two console generations in the 80s and 90s
There are more issues than this, but for me it's the lack of console ONLY exclusives. Since Sony's and Microsoft's (earlier than Sony) major franchises are coming to PC, I see less and less of a reason to buy consoles. It might look good when a game like Helldivers 2 are making a huge profits on PC, but imagine the loss of current and future console sales they are missing out on. And forcing people to sign up for a PSN account just to get more people into the Eco-system, doesn't seem to work out too well.
Exclusivity hitting console hard. Most gamers already moved to either mobile or PC gaming. Console gamers are a dying bread
Mobile is the biggest but console gaming is still bigger than PC gamming in terms of revenue.
@@007GoldenLion no, it's mobile > PC > console. Check visual capitalist for reference
Mobile will destroy everything, because the majority of gamers are extremely mentally backward and spend tons of money and time on shit multiplayer games.
*Consoles are dying*
Give it a rest mate. We hear this every single generation. Stop hating. Consoles will always be around whether you like it or not.
@@eytbitsPS income was 28billon with 7billon profit, Valve revenue was 13 billon in 2022
PC would be bigger if hw sales really were for gaming but most GPU buyers use it for AI
Retro gaming on the other hand is seeing a massive surge in popularity... My take on this is that the middle-aged gamers that have been around since day 1, are deserting the console space as they no longer have the time to spend on increasingly grind-focussed games, and, instead, have pivoted towards the golden days of 'pick up and play' arcade gaming. I am definitely one of those people choosing this path, namely spending my money on a arcade cabinet setup whilst my PS5 sits there and gathers dust...
How many good next gen only games are there on PS5? People need a reason to upgrade, there hasn't been a lot of reasons so far.
I'm still driving my 2010 Toyota Matrix, 150 000 miles and going strong
I can’t believe that a version of Talia principle 2 couldn’t be released for x1x like the first one.smh.
(Ex R* dev here) One thing I noticed that’s more troubling for the entire industry is, my kids are drawn more to games on iPads vs Nintendo/Xbox/Sony. I have an amazing game collection, but they are simply not attracting them.
Apple will become the next gaming giant.
Especially if they keep porting AAA games onto their hardware.
Apple will simply dissolve everyone else in 10 years.
How old are they?
I would gladly buy AMD again if they made FSR as good as DLSS.
No price cuts for consoles or pc gpu’s may have something to do with it. Crumbling economy isn’t helping either.
After being repeatedly sidelined at the annual Game Awards event, perhaps now the moment has finally arrived for indie developers to shine. Case in point, big corporations are shredding talent and cancelling big budget projects over the past year. The big wigs can't simply throw money at problems anymore.
The Game Awards are fixed, based on advertising money and agendas. One of the top-selling AAA games of 2023, a game that a lot of people loved, Hogwarts Legacy, was completely ignored by the Game Awards. That should tell you how fake the awards are.
@@G360LIVEbecause of the laughable “controversy”. Journalists are the ones who vote so this is not surprising. The media, including the gaming media, is full of activists (which also has a bad effect on the industry and creative freedom).
I love how nemesis is catching up with the gaming industry
there to many option for gaming people can play on there cell phone ,tablet, handhelds etc etc
As a PC enthusiast and gamer I struggle to see how Sony and Microsoft's strategy of releasing games cross platform is going to lead to anyone investing in their platforms.. Whats going to be the point in owning a PS or xbox in a few years time when a $250 pc will run everything?
Sony & Microsoft decided they’re releasing major games on PC, which predictably resulted in gamers choosing PC. When you undermine the only reason to invest in your proprietary gaming box, you can’t be surprised when people stop buying it.
I doubt microsoft cares too much as long as people still pay for their game pass. For Sony it's a similar story with the profits from additional game sales. The consoles don't make money anyway. The games do.
I wonder if AI is going to end up being key here. . If utilized correctly, it could certainly help smooth out some of the issues with overpriced budgets, poorly optimized games, and lack of "fresh" ideas.
The videogame market will thrive but the console market will disappear!! Mobile devices and PCs are already surpassing the console market in almost every aspect.
Apple will become the most important gaming platform.
I expect iPhone 16 to bring console games to the front, after the timid push from 15 Pro/ 15 Pro Max.
Everyone is buying or will buy iPhone.
Am actually surprised Microsoft hasn’t pivoted to Xbox OS that can be installed on gaming hardware.
I personally don’t want to PC game.. I’m a casual gamer. I hit button console turns on. I’m in game in 2 minute. I want to lounge out on my bed or couch… and fall asleep with my character walking into the wall.
Microsoft can have the xbox Console Windows edition where companies can build custom boxes that you install xbox Windows version. Opens up a competition market for companies to build a faster, smaller gameing machine that's has the console experience, or you can build a monter gaming pc that has a console experience.
I can't help but speculate that this AMD revenue situation is partially due to what happened to the gaming market during the pandemic. Gaming revenue overall skyrocketed due to people being stuck inside bored, so that sort of points towards people investing in new consoles/PC hardware when they would usually have left it until later (or not invested at all). Perhaps it is the case that a higher percentage of the people likely to buy a current gen games console have already got one at this point.
This is the issue.... so many live in the past and believe gaming and the world today is as it was 10 even 20 years ago.
Things happen in the world or in certain countries.... That have a knock on effect and damage everything, including gaming.
Brexit damaged many industries, Covid damaged many industries, the war in Ukraine, continuing to damage many industries.
It's been one ball ache after another.
Then the cost of living has shot up, the cost of developing anything has shot up..... combine that with games cost more too make now than ever before and it doesn't help, that actual gamer's today are so damn needy and whiny.
If a game focuses on story and game play, but doesn't concentrate on graphics, people moan it looks last gen.
If a game focuses on graphics but the game play isn't as good as it could be, people moan that game play is all important and not graphics.
If a game releases at 30fps, you moan it should be 60fps..... If a game releases at 60fps you moan they should give you the option for 120fps.
If a game is 8 hours long... You moan it is too short, if a game is 80 hours long, you moan it's too big.
If a game launches as a sandbox game, where YOU find your own way and what too do, you moan it's too confusing.
If a game launches and it holds your hand with markers telling you where too go and what too do, that's wrong as well.
You want NEW games, at AAA quality but ya don't want too pay for them, and you want constant DLC monthly and get angry when companies try too sell you in game items because at the end of the day, they are a company and want too MAKE MONEY.
It is getting ridiculous, both developers and gamer's are absolutely screwing up this industry, that is here for a fun relaxing time, yet you people act like what platform you play is a life choice and take gaming so seriously, s##t needs to change and fast.
It's not just the F2P model, many games have content that you used to unlock while playing.Nobody could foresee how this could end up being a financial disaster?.
Especially with 200+Million development budgets, the industry is losing its selling power.
Console gaming has a price problem. The pool of people that want to spend $500 on a console has been satisfied, and the remaining users want a $200 console to connect to their $200 TV set. If Sony wants the PS5 to sell as much as the PS4, they need to cut the price or build a cheaper version of it.
Also, who wants to pay $70 for games? The number of $70 games I've personally purchased is exactly zero. If I really want something I'll buy it when it gets around $50, and otherwise I'll wait a year and get it cheap. I have such a huge backlog that I can play that while I wait. I just started Tales of Arise this week, after finishing Final Fantasy X HD last week.
Then how come the series s isn’t selling? It’s exactly that! It’s always better to buy for cheap, but I don’t think that’s the issue…it’s more that many ppl changed to mobile or PC since it’s become so much easier to set up plus with rising console costs it’s getting closer to pc prices
@@sumomaster5585 About 80% of Microsoft's console sales are the Series S, so it is selling, by Microsoft standards. It's not as popular as the PS5 or Switch because Microsoft doesn't have the mindshare or exclusives.
@@harleyn3089this is a massive lie. 80% are not Xbox series s. More like 20%
@@possiblyunmatched1323 I don't want to create a debate but it's been said in this very same podcast series S has sold more than series x, so a minimum of 50%+ of Xbox sales have been S
The PS4 wasn't $200 it was $300.
Like wise $70 for a game is still below inflation costs for a game.
They need to do what Nintendo does, which is innovate within a known franchise rather than have to release a whole new game every time not knowing if it will sell.
AMD needs to invest in feature parity with Nvidia, not just deploying a feature that checks a similar box. FSR2 looks way worse than DLSS2, AMD frame generation is way behind on support, the cards don't support ray tracing well, and even noise canceling is shoddy. When you add it all up AMD's ~15% discounts just aren't worth it, and users go for the platform with support. And I write this as a 7900XTX owner.
They don't have the money to do that, plus it isn't worth the money. They need to double down on partnerships and focus on AI chips and APU's as major revenue sources. They should also stop making consumer GPU's. This would balance their revenue and succeed in leaving gamers with the choice that they want, Nvidia.
Sorry but after being told for years by the mainstream media that pc gaming was dying ill find it pretty hilarious if consoles die out instead
PCs are trash. Everyone sells everything new (unlike consoles who sell hardware at a loss) at a profit and you cannot go on forever milking the dumb people who bought brand-new $1000 GPUs and decide to sell them after 1-2 years out of boredom.
The middle class is dying.
People are getting poorer, the rich are getting richer and expect impossible profit margins.
Im curious when the next crash will come
With the advance of Apple Silicon and Snapdragon X, the costs of development for AAA hardware, and the prioritizing GPU productin to the AI industry it honestly wouldn't surprise me if the gaming industry moves major titles to tablets and phones in the next 10 years or so. We could be seeing the end of console and PC gaming (as we know it). Phones/tablets, steam deck-like handhelds, docking stations for TVs. That's the future I think.
Would tablet users pay 70 dollars for games?
@@sumomaster5585Nope.
No chance. The mobile market will always be miles behind dedicated PC hardware. Even lower to mid range stuff that includes consoles, never mind the high end. Yes the mobile gaming market is worth more than the PC and console market combined but that audience is far different to your typical console or pc player. It's like saying the average cheap family car market is far bigger than the sports car market so we don't need sports cars. High end mobile tech isn't exactly cheap either. A 1k PC would massively outperform a 1k mobile device. Same for a €500 console vs a 500 mobile. Especially when those consoles are sold at close to cost price.
Gaming world is changing fo sho....
For the worse.
I see people praising handhelds as console replacements but, in my case, it doesn't appeal to me to play (or to watch movies, for instance) on a small screen with tiny speakers (or headphones) instead of a Home Theater (and a couch+Big TV is far better than a chair+Monitor, by the way).
I dont like the massive budgets and excessive lead times which they tackle by abusing their staff into "crunch" time. Forget this. I'll go backwards not £70/game forward.
Imagine: an Xbox event where Spencer Invites Gabe on stage saying they love what Valve has been doing with the deck and they're looking forward to opening up the Xbox to side load steam. Interesting times.
Why? You need Phil's blessing to go PC?
I bought a used AMD RX6700 XT as it offered better price / performance the current 7000 series in my £1000 PC. Progress has slowed. Affordable raytracing could make me upgrade .
Switch is doing just fine lol
Oh wait, that’s Nvidia lol
Switch is for kids lmao
I think it's more of a game thing more than anything.
@@Im-ugly-AF spoken like a clueless kid 😂
The switch is just fantastic, love mine❤
Less money and less time for me. I used to buy way more games Stellar Blade is the last game I've bought at launch since Ragnarok.
Hardware upgrades are very small incremental changes make me less likely to buy any new hardware
Sorry boys, but cross gen still looks pretty viable wth the sheer dearth of quality new experiences this gen.
I am honestly enjoying collecting ps4 titles at the moment, not just from a quantity metric, but also the sheer diversity of games available.
And they're cheap.
And often physical.
Not happy with this gen, the abandonment of physical, the stressing of live service and microtransactions, lack of titles.
No thanks.
Nintendo Switch with Nintendo Switch 2 ready to launch: 😆🍿
The problem which I have said time and time again is shareholders, if a product is broken or not finished they don’t care release it, they want their investment back, if gta 6 released now it would sell millions of copies, the demand is always there it’s the end product that is suffering because of shareholders. Microsoft don’t give a stuff about the console space that’s why they bought king, they know mobile gaming will supply fill any shortfall in revenue. Shareholders are poisoning the gaming space.
where is john lately?
MS should sell Xbox to Amazon or Apple with a profit share option to account for the billions spent. Corporate heads at MS are trying to cut costs all around. This looking more and more like a Sega situation.
The utter Apple monopoly is underway.
They will liquify their competition and become a solid gaming platform.
The Xbox brand is pretty much worthless now. No way Amazon or Apple would pay anything for it. Their own names are much stronger.
This is probably related to the decline of childbirth worldwide, less new people to get into it overall.
Specially in the more developed countries which is where most of the consumers who can afford gaming are anyway.
(At least the non Jack Sparrow version, if you know what I mean 🏴☠️)
No matter the platform, it must have good games to survive and be successful. The only thing I've seen on the Microsoft Series X is a bunch of old titles with higher framerates. There is hardly any 1st party support, new AAA titles or fresh Intellectual Properties. Microsoft's focus was on everything but the most important factor for a gaming console which is GREAT GAMES!
It’s not just gaming though, the whole world economy is reeling from cost of living and high interest rates. It’s cyclical though, it’ll be back in a couple of years,
I hope AMD gets some traction in the AI GPU market. Then they may have enough spare cash to be willing to stick at the gaming GPU market. If not, I can't see them carrying on with gaming GPUs. They need a huge investment in ray tracing and upscaling to make themselves super competitive. And the business case probably isn't strong.
They are actually making bank in chips for compute and AI. As a whole, AMD did very well. It is in gaming where they flopped.
Opposite to you though, I dont think is a good idea to pull money from the BU that is actually making money to finance a another broken BU.
My advice as Client Exec in the I.T industry, would be to sell that unit...maybe Intel? or even MS.
@@fernandomartinez4486 AMD is nowhere in AI. Their server CPUs are doing well, but they are basically zero re AI GPUs. And I didn't say it was a good idea to invest in gaming GPUs. On the contrary I said the business case for doing that isn't strong. But if they were doing business in AI GPUs like Nvidia is, then it would be a pretty small gamble to make.
probably why they aren't doing an XTX type this gen when it comes.
The tech used for AI gpu's has many applications in the gaming space and the prosumer space on PC. Look at how Nvidia has harnessed the power of the tensor cores that are used for AI. They have a lot of applications in games and even more so in the prosumer software space. Combined with the RT cores they have seen massive uplifts in many workloads like the 3d rendering space while also offering the best upscaling and ray tracing experience in games. AMD doesn't take the prosumer space serious enough. If they ever truly want to compete with Nvidia then this is an area they need to prioritize. Not just at a hardware level either. They need to work closely with the big creative software companies to implement and optimize for their hardware like Nvidia does. They have the money to do this now and they don't have to make it from scratch like Nvidia did. The likes of the 7900xt and xtx would have sold significantly better if they were up to scratch with the features and software support of Nvidia. Putting all that Vram on there was pointless from a purely gaming perspective but for AI and prosumer workloads it would have been amazing.
@@flat6crocThey are in AI. Read their financial report (I did). Not everything is gaming AI and seems thats what you defaulted to when replying to me.
I repeat, they are making bank in Compute and AI chips. That's the division that is actually growing, alongside Data centers and Embedded services.
I have a 4090 and my pc is getting dust while I enjoy the my ps5. What games are on pc I bought the best video card for what exactly where are the games ? Not just that games like dragon's dogma released in such pitiful state pc gaming has become a joke.
Cyberpunk, alan wake, something with mods, re8🤷♂️
@@alexprost7505 Really cyberpunk which I played since 2020 this is what you pc guys only do play old games and call yourself pc master race. Not just that there is no game to fully take advantage of 4090 show good graphics but now we getting 5090 like the is so lame and nobody calls this bs out .
Probably means a price hike for next gen
Next gen is a fake concept. A "console" concept. "Gens" don't exist.
If they charge 800-1000 I'm out !
Because no one can afford that.
AMD ought to make APUs for consumers at reasonable prices that can form the basis of competition with consoles. Steam OS or Chimera OS on an APU comparable to the XBSX or PS5, or even the XBSS, would be pretty appealing IMO as an alternative to console gaming.
The problem is you can't BUILD an APU like that to be BOTH socketable in a standard motherboard, AND affordable. Part of the thing that makes consoles work from an ENGINEERING perspective is how tightly integrated they are. So either they would have to sell you a weaker system in terms of a socketed APU but a fairly standardized motherboard, or you're buying the whole thing from them, which is an SoC, NOT an APU, and it's _still_ going to be more than a console because they're not making money on the back end like a Microsoft, Sony, Nintendo, or even Valve.
I'd be more than happy to shell out a bit more for an APU that can compete with consoles, given the advantages of PC over consoles I think the additional costs are worth it, and I think a lot of other people would too -- but of course, "a bit more" has its limits.
@@blast_processing6577 "A bit more" if AMD is doing the whole thing is not going to be a little amount. If they're only doing the board and the SOC attached to it, then you run into a DIFFERENT problem, because what you're essentially asking for is a laptop mainboard minus a screen and a keyboard, but still a very obviously not standard form factor with non-standard cooling requirements and I KNOW you've seen how expensive a gaming laptop is.
"a laptop mainboard minus a screen and keyboard"
I've honestly wanted that for some of the NVidia mobile GPUs paired with Intel CPUs I've seen on laptops.
There's finite amount of people, and they don't want to own every gaming thing.
I think tech makers behind the spreadsheet just don't see, that they are heading to that wall.
Western philistines exists to consume.
I don't know why games take so long to make nowadays. Mass Effect 1, 2, and 3 are some of the best games and came a few years apart AC Origins and Odyssey were ground-breaking and Odyssey was stupefying in scope and launched 1 year apart.
Usually games like Starfield that take too long are usually not worth the wait. I think when the vision is clear and the team is tight knit, you can release an incredible game in a fraction of the time that it would take another team.
This should have been a golden era in gaming similar to X360 and PS3.
Aa much as I love the Mass Effect Series. There are a lot of aspects of 2 and 3 that could have used several more months of baking.
They should come-out with a Super Ryzen chip for the new Xbox Handheld . Say hello to John L. wherever he is. ✌️
Luckily gaming is at its most inclusive...plus no crunch...yay
No more cheap APUs for consoles.
There is only so much time and money that anyone with a life can spend on gaming. I used to game a lot when I was young but now that I am older, married and have a career, gaming has taken a back seat.
I still watch these video/movies when driving, doing chores or when out for a walk but I cannot game since it is an interactive medium.
Suits oversold the potential of gaming to investors and now the industry is paying the price and needs to correct. I mean, my primary gaming medium is a 1tb series S and I am very content with it. We need consoles like the series S and handhelds to widen the market for games. Let PC please the enthusiasts.
I built a good PC a year ago and haven’t played a game in 6 months. Everything runs like crap and is kinda boring. I’ve bought some newer releases and honestly haven’t even booted the game up yet. Not to mention the newer consoles are sub 1080p/30fps. I couldn’t tell you any games that are dropping for the rest of this year and I’ve been a die hard gamer for over 30 years. Sad times.
Try getting 1 million on Robotron 2084, exhilarating !! (Twin sticks on a proper Cab preferably)
You just suck at picking out games, there are tons of great games out there. You're problem probably is you still think like a console gamer and only wanna play triple gay I mean tripla a games. So many great games are not and never will be on console so you'll need to think differently to find these games. Or you can start by asking some PC gamers what they're playing, you're an adult I figure so go out and figure it out.
I personally don’t have any problem if MS published more titles as multiple platform titles. The play anywhere idea is fine with me.
Looks like consoles have peaked.
They did, there was a time when Consoles were more powerful than PCs when it came to gaming. Then they became a little weaker but a massive bargain for the price. Now they're pretty much on par on the price but much more restricted than a PC. No real reason to own one anymore, unfortunately.
@@SpartanArmy117 Bang on point regarding then and now!
They peaked 20 years ago.
@@DeadPhoenix86DP
Yeah, everyone's still chasing PS2 numbers.
Well sony, first time i have ever, i. 50 years of gaming, seen the price of the a console rrp raised, let alone raised 3 years in to its life cycle. Drop the hardware and software prices, you will get sales.
(You probably dont even know this happened if your living in USA, but it was raised in uk, europe, scandinavia and japan).
Steam games on xbox would be fire,finally vr on xbox,with pregrafic settings for xbox steam
Well, everything in the whole economy is down, not a shocker.
Hadn't gamed for 10 years, bought the newest X Box when it came out, very few good games and almost zero next-gen games, they sold me a pup, so I sold it two months ago, don't miss it, the end.
Console gaming is being csnnsbalised by mobile gaming.
Furthermore some of the most popular titles like minecraft, cod and roblox don't require the latest hardware. This makes upgrading from previous gen less of a priority.
Things are going to get insanely expensive if Sony and Nvidia are all thats left.
I am buying a PS5 Pro, cause I got too much money, but why is Sony even thinking about releasing new hardware when most are playing older games.
Buy a PC
What is your job? Share some tips for a brokie here 😂
@sumomaster5585 Really not much to share. I am 50 years old, nearly 30 year career, house paid off, little debt, ready to retire, invest well, pension, 401k, savings. If I were to share anything it would be don't live beyond your means, don't have a bunch of kids you can't support and no matter what career you go into save more than you spend. That worked for me.
PCs becoming more and more affordable as well as being the best long term platform is what’s happening. Along with no more true exclusivity with consoles, there’s no reason to not go PC if you can afford it to play all those games and more on a 1k PC
Either you play 4K HDR at maximum settings or you go to a console.
PCs have a lot of issues, Microsoft is not made for Gaming.
There will only be the switch left, if Microsoft and Sony keep fucking up
That is really bad news. But I have felt that this generation has been really underwhelming. I bought a series X and then sold it after Halo Infinite as Halo Infinite was not great and there was no other good xbox exclusives coming. I kept the PS5 and as many games had free PS5 upgrades I bought the PS4 boxed copy and played both versions. I struggled to tell the difference between the PS4 and PS5 versions. Even PS5 only games seem to be the last gen engines with little or no improvements to physics, destructability and AI. Some games like Starfield have all the AI and daily schedules removed from their NPCs making them shop dummies that hardly move. The xbox series x Starfield gameworld feels less alive than the xbox 360 skyrim gameworld. Personally I think GTA 6 will re-ignite the console market and finally give people a real reason to buy a new console. Consoles are media players and now the media you like can take 7 years to make.
No mention of switch? Plug and play in 10 mins. Plus their games are better as in just pure fun. Also they are not closing studios and have been busting out new software one every 45 days. Yes a lot are remakes but that's because they are just filling out the rest of year till we get the new one next year. Just look at mario kart. Over 60millioj units sold and it's a 10 plus year old game and looks better then any other "aaa" game out there.
Their games are mostly trash.
It’s like mobile but slightly more refined.
The fact that companies expect for there to be Constant growth even after their main audience has already bought one or more of their products, is sad and sick.
It's a sign that they aren't prepared for healthy spending habits in society and depend on addicted consumers constantly buying more and reaching new audiences to stay afloat. No wonder why so many companies unnecessarily fail.
They should be prepared for plateaus and drops once consoles have sold millions. When it comes to PC, AM4 is just so good that people have no need to upgrade, even with new GPUs (which is how producfs SHOULD be made) and it happens to fall alongside an economic slump lol. What did they expect?
Yeah they time between big game releases is too long. If it takes 10 years to make a sequel then the franchise becomes irrelevant
All of these breakout hit games that have come out the last 2 years haven’t been games made for a “modern audience”. That’s a fact. Stellar Blade was a huge success despite that as well.
There is no such thing as the “modern audience”.