If cost per kWh of electricity is the major cost of the CPC process, they should expand to Quebec. It's within the "North America" definition for the IRA subsidy, there's a fair bit of manufacturing and automotive supplier infrastructure nearby, and it's well linked by road, water, and rail.
The detail on forming the tools for the body is good information for all Aptera enthusiasts to hear. Of course, thanks to AOC for bringing this information to the forum. Best information sharing ye on production! This information helps impress on all the complex nature and the time it takes to do some of the work needed to prep for production. Hopefully, will help all not to develop unsupported optimism or uninformed speculation on the production schedule. Also good information on time frame for other parts of the vehicle. Such AOC reporting maintains the AOC forum reputation as the premiere site of all things Aptera presented in an objective manner (Neither Fan Boy or Troll perspective)
Fantastic questions, Steve! Aptera is a fascinating product and story. I can’t wait to see how they alter the public’s idea of personal transportation.
I don't know what the curing temperatures are for these materials, but those dies are a huge mass of steel to bring up to temperature!! I believe the temperature is in the 300 - 400 degree F range somewhere, but Aptera/CPC will have to confirm this for us.
Usually between 150 to 250 degrees Fahrenheit. I have a distant memory of the autoclave’s at Boeing being at 180 degrees. Higher temperatures cure faster
Very interesting to hear about energy needed to stamp out parts and good to hear about Elaphe having other clients, aptera orders not being effected. Thank you, Steve
What I'd like to ask is this: is there any structural strength difference between the old honeycomb design and the mold pressing carbon fiber they're using now?
The in-wheel is a game changer efficient design wise. I see lots of novel possibilities with that. Elaphe must push themselves to more the dates as forward as possible on delivery of their parts.
Hey Steve, thank you so much for these last couple of videos and I think you said there was a third one. I get a really good sense of where Aptera is at and despite the challenges discussed, it gives me real hope that this is going to happen. So, thank you, very helpful and hopeful.
Funny how investors are getting less hopeful and regular people are more hopeful. So many question and healhty skeptics are needed hear. This thing sound more off the shell than anything revolutionary
@user-qg5kf6ld1v Chris Anthony said that about 30% of the components are off the shelf and the other 70% are the "bespoke" (Aptera specific components). How do you get off the shelf from that ?
@@garywozniak7742 wow...what's wrong with y,all? y'all believe everything they're saying? lol. It's called marketing, take your emotions out of it. Stop being a fan.
@@oluayankoya I have a mere $100 bucks at stake here. A refundable $100 bucks at that, not that I'm worried about it. The work at CPC is happening. There is a significant investment from both Aptera and CPC in that endeavor. I've seen the equipment to make the solar panels in one of the factory tour videos. Elaphe Motors is a viable company with commercial orders. Despite your obvious desire for it to happen, Aptera has not met its demise. It still kicking and it is a pretty safe bet that they are at least going to produce a number of production intent vehicled in the next 4 or 6 months for validation and crash testing.
@@oluayankoya Agree! Mostly COTS wherever possible integrated with good engineering. Nothing bleeding or cutting edge when looking at Aptera objectively.
Thanks to both of you for continuing to keep us updated on the progress! Energy cost is a very valid concern for the manufacturing of the panels. Aptera should look into sites in Eastern Washington for potential future manufacturing sites. Power is extremely cheap there, and there's already a new battery manufacturing facility being built in Moses lake
I think this is a critical issue to bring to Aptera. When parking a solar vehicle, you need to know where the sun is to maximize the efficiency. I hope the Ui/UX has a compass. This is the time to ensure that it’s included.
Super informative! Thx. What about the black Aluminum belly? Is that still in the picture, Source in Europe ? We have seen the wraps/ finished on the various Development vehicles. Will the wheel covers we wrap on the PI Production Intent ? Is the nose cone CPC SMC or a colored resin? Talk On !
Thanks Steve. Great interview. These interviews help fill in some of the blanks. I am hopeful that Aptera will pull this off and make into volume production. I have a window of time to purchase my next vehicle and its closing. I'm around 30k on the list and I'm hoping that the call from Aptera that they are ready to build my vehicle comes before that window shuts.
Great stuff Steve! Thanks! One thing I have never understood from Chris is his perspective on ramping up. I think it really depends on what he means when he gets asked about slower startups. He keeps referencing someone telling him the floor technician’s “minds are blown” trying to figure out how to ramp up from 1 car a day, to 1 per hour, to 4 per hour, then to 1 per 12 minutes. I guarantee that this is going to happen anyway. This is standard block and tackle transformation management. There are many factors they will encounter on this road. Fine tuning of automation, experienced skill development through practice, continuous improvement work, etc. This will prevent their 40 vehicle per week vertical start up at launch. I, personally, would be worried about recall exposure if I was trying to ram full production vertically. I would rather go back to their original strategy to start slow locally and ramp up.
Thanks for posting. Always least cost when you manufacture and assemble as much as you can in house… plus keeps supply chain disruptions to a minimum. Charge on!
Of course it isn't always least cost when "Make (Manufacture) is more or the majority vs. "Buy". Every component or assembly on a bill of materials goes through a Make/Buy Analysis to minimize cost and or maximize productivity (Usually with an integer, linear, or goal programming model) If you look closely, Aptera chose mostly "Buy" very little "Manufacture" This is especially in a capital intensive startup where a lot of capital is needed up front for facilities, equipment, materials to support some level of volume manufacturing.
Thank you Chris and Steve for another inside scoop on Aptera. Every one of these videos gives me a better understanding of some of what it takes to bring our cutting edge vehicle to production. Come to think of it with all its cutting edge technology Aptera should have been called blade, sword, scalpel or knife.
Speaking of Elaphe, are all three wheel motors going to be identical? Tesla uses a different rear motor tuned for high speed cruising for more efficiency. Also, would a smaller & lighter rear motor benefit the ride quality enough to consider? I have been curious how much smoother the dual motor version will ride, and how much they are having to change the suspension between the two. So much unsprung weight on such a light car (autocycle). At least the frame is really rigid...
At least having a different sized tire or wheel on the back was looked at, but after testing by Roush, it was found not to be needed. There will surely be customers who will experiment with this. Having the same wheel/tire/motor combination simplifies things.
I agree it simplifies things, and a different wheel/tire combo would be a pain. I guess they need to leave a little bit of room for future improvements.
Nice to hear that CPC will be in the running to be Europe's construction facility - it's what I had speculated would happen, and nicely keeps my 1400 mile factory collection trip alive, bringing my 250 version back home via the Grossglockner Pass. I'm nowhere near first in line, so still looking to some time after May 2025 (when the Pass is open!)...
@@melvindevries_nl Nice! That'll definitely test the turning circle 😁 👍 I've friends in Karlsruhe who are very interested in Aptera, and taking a slight diversion past their house is part of the plan. A nice stop for a coffee at the top of the Pass should give a great photo op, maybe with all the flags in shot (tourist buses permitting!). Sunshine and regen on the way down!
@@melvindevries_nl Durham, UK, so I've the extra wait for RHD. The journey is already possible with 10-30 minute stops along the way, and should be even easier by the time I try it.
@@examinerian i see, my reservation number is something around 7600 which should give me a years wait after the first Launch Edition is delivered, when do you expect yours?
I would love to see a comparative time table w/ Tesla, in regards to Aptera’s growth. I am not familiar w/ the auto industry build ins/outs, but a comparison to similar transportation start ups it gives a sense of expectations.
Aptera has been doing a much better job relative to the Tesla startup, both in cash management (Tesla came within an hour of bankruptcy on Dec. 24, 2008) and in product development. -Tesla claimed to be shipping production vehicles from February 2008, when Elon took very public delivery of the first one, but the transmissions broke on acceleration - something that wasn't fixed until well into the next year. Tesla built and sold a total of around 2,500 of those first vehicles. Aptera has paid pre-orders for over 45,000 of theirs.
@@shrimptopian3392 "They" did not start in 2004. Aptera Inc. was a joint project with Idealab, who had removed Steve and Chris by 2009, and couldn't make their alternative plan work. They liquidated in 2011. Aptera Corp was a brand new company with a new vehicle that started work in 2019.
Louisiana and New Mexico have the cheapest industrial rates, a bit more than 5 cents/kwh, which is a bit mystifying because they don't have much or any hydropower, which tends to be the least expensive. Washington and Tennessee are a bit more at 6+ cents/kwh.
BMW put their carbon fiber manufacturing in Moses Lake Washington because of all the hydroelectric on the Columbia from BPA. We used to have a lot of Aluminum smelters, but I think they have mostly moved to where the Bauxite is. I would think Louisiana is making power with some fossil fuels, but probably gas to be competitive. New Mexico is pretty close to all the shale gas wells in Oklahoma and Texas that is pretty cheap to produce
I don't know of any place in the states that sells power at 4.5 cents per kilowatt hour. I live in Tulsa Oklahoma that is probably one of the cheapest for power and pay 7.5 cents per kilowatt hour.
Sometimes that last little 5% of a project can create paralysis, And it's where perfectionists fail. I'm not gonna whine if there's a few last-minute self-service recall parts to replace if it means getting my ride a year and a half early. It's not like an appl phone or a tesla where everything is welded or glued shut. It'll be like patching an EA game. lol People will find short-term solutions. The jank things I've done to a TJ to keep it rolling would keep people up at night... This Car if made mainstream will create a large culture of young men who will have hands-on experience working on electric vehicle like we have motor-city hot rod mechanics in their 50's and 60's today. America needs to keep it's traditions of knowing how to fix things alive, for either economic reasons and/or pleasure.
What's involved in putting the CPC body together such that Aptera workers can't be trained to assemble the car shell to save on shipping cost inefficiencies of shipping whole car bodies?
I seem to remember a mention that the body parts are bonded (glued) together. For now it makes sense to let CPC do it. They have the equipment and expertise to do ot. It keeps Aptera assembly process simple. They mentioned the possibility of CPC eventually having a facility in the U.S.
@@garywozniak7742 It seems to me it would really jump start u.s. production to bring over a small team from CPC team along with the necessary equipment to do the body bonding and then train up staff. In the long run, the cost savings would offset any initial expense compared to the large volume of parts you could ship compared to whole car bodies. Perhaps CPC wants to keep the assembly techniques proprietary.
@@zencone I am sure Aptera developed a number of alternative and did some rigorous Tradeoff analysis to select the best alternative or combination of alternatives. I don't think any of us would have all of the information to make a valid assessment of the best approach.
@@johnmalcom9159 Yes John, one would think so. I would have liked to hear Chris' explanation to the asked question. Since we're getting so much more transparency than most start-ups ever let us in on, it's just one more thing I'm curious about. On the face of it, it feels like filling a shipping container with filled helium balloons instead of filling the container with flat balloons to be filled later.
I wander if they are ever going to try and start to vertically integrate like Tesla is doing to get the cost of their vehicles down even more eventually.
Wondering what the cost to repair would be if the Aptera gets into an accident and damages to tub (even slightly). I imagine that the cost to replace the tub would be quite high.
@@n.brucenelson5920 traditional car body is made of many panels stitched together with screws, rivets, or even glue. Unlike the aptera, smashing one panel would require replacing that one panel and not replacing almost all of the car's body
@@Chitown388 Aptera body parts will also be glued together and can be individually replaced using common techniques. Aptera is no different in this regard.
Will they be shipped with the wrap applied? If not, when are they wrapped? Last I heard it took 6 weeks to cross the water. Which port are they coming into and if it’s the East Coast, how’s the trucking cost factor into cost? If fact, shipping seems to weigh heavily into cost at this point. In this day of modern electronic emails, why would you spend money to send someone to Italy just for a sun visor? Hopefully it’s an amazing sun visor and not just something that flips down. 😂
I suspect that at least the first vehicles will be flown over. The shorter time and lower inventory volume in transit makes up for the higher transportation cost.
I would guess that the wrap will be applied in San Diego. The sun visor I saw was more like a fine mesh screen so, if that's what they've decided on, you will be able to see through it.
What I would like to know is can you, Aptera, make the whole Car Narrower than 2.2 metres Wide? In a "Standard" road Lane width of 8' (and maybe narrower), 2.2 metres is over 7'2" leaving
Aptera just needs to get the first two thousand vehicles delivered, then make the next three thousand Launch Editions. Everything else falls into place after that. So, it begins by end of summer 2024 into 2025. Then starts the three year backlog of reservations. I'd like to see how fast these last five hundred Accelerator vehicles sell out after they release a few PI builds for validation. I think people are sleeping on how important these last LE's can be. I wanted a 250 mile, Noir in Vida trim, under $30K Aptera, yet had no desire to wait. For me, It's worth a little more money for a more compelling vehicle to ensure one of the first two-thousand off the line. I joined the program after the deadline was lifted. I'm doing my part to help Aptera drive to production, and look forward to beta testing my ride whenever that opportunity arrives.
The solar should be upgraded soon they will be more flexable aprouching 30 percent effectiveness.in power conversation. I see magnetic field flux conversation improvements of management energy systems.
The European energy costs of production was interesting and lets be honest a self inflicted critical wound forced upon the EU by the US not liking Germany & others formerly close relation with Russian Energy) Thus Nord Stream 2 blown apart for strategic US energy concerns now coming home to bite a US manufacturer Oh boy.....some serious lessons there eh And ironically Germany unfortunately put ALL its energy needs in the 'green' basket was has also come back to bite it. Another lesson
2026 at the earliest if ever at all. Investors are just not interested, $50,000,000 is a drop in the bucket for most investors. Rough times ahead folks. It looks like toyota was right all along
@@oluayankoya"Toyota being right" is a mixed bag. Their push for HFCV's has fallen on its face. Also they seem to be mentioning their 600 mile solid state battery a lot.
The wisest thing that should be on everyone's mind currently should be to invest in different streams of income that doesn't depend on the govt. Especially with the current economic crisis around the world. This is still a good time to invest in gold, silver, and digital currencies (BTC,ETH...)
Seriously. I have been hearing that our economy is collapsing about once a week since the 90's. If our economy has been collapsing then our wealthiest people would be living in hovels or it is collapsing so slow that it wouldn't matter in our lifetime.
Knocking the octovalve as if it is a bad thing shows how he actually doesn't understand engineering, OR he is trying to sucker people who are ignorant. Either way, bad sign for aptera.. do you want your battery to be like a nissan leaf, or like a tesla? The better heat and cooling pumps allow battery management system to maintain pack at optimal temps, maintaining range and extending battery life, allowing operation in hotter or colder conditions. How ignorant would you have to be, to want less control, and capability over management of the most expensive part of the entire EV (the battery) ... shame so few can see this for what it is
@@jamespaul2587 it was implied by his tone, and the fact he even brought it up. The original nissan leaf had no way to manage battery heat and cooling and it suffered greatly because of it. Gamma or one of the prototype units over heated while going up a hill.. they have since shown models that can take on a hill without over heating, but point remains, there is still heat to manage and a less sophisticated but less capable system is detrimental.
@@jamespaul2587he said "we TRY to limit the number of pumps, we don't want like 8 pumps, we don't want an octovalve, like telsa has.. we want try to keep our cooling system very simple"
No price update Chris? What are you afraid of? Tub tooling is not complete and no firm ETA of when it will be complete but hopes for November. Again all the references to how this is super cars are built but no update to pricing because, well, supercars built this way are not cheap. Are people starting to understand why Aptera is not providing updated price guidance. So they have not even settled the frame and suspension nor the exact work CPC is actually doing. Now CPC is going to ship frame, suspension, body, and glass? They have in effect contracted out nearly all manufacturing of this vehicle which will negate most of the California grants. However isn't it interesting how much Chris doesn't know yet? That implies they are still just winging it. Listening closely it is clear they suffer from a lack of organization. In July Chris stated the battery supplier was not selected and notice how he did not answer the specific battery pack question. They claim solar is done but they have never ever shown off more than one roof panel installed and one loose. Never provided a solar hatch and this is from a group who claimed solar was in production in October 2022 in their own video! Dismissing the octovalve shows lacking in engineering skill they have. However we cannot have our Tesla drinking game if Chris didn't boast about how Aptera is better than Tesla
"No price update Chris? What are you afraid of? " Making the same huge mistake Rivian did. Why don't you understand what a bad move this would be at this stage? Most of the remaining work is a matter of tuning, which will be done with the validation vehicles. This is completely normal. I have witnessed this at both the Ford and GM desert proving grounds in person as a supplier.
@@oluayankoya What is laughable is your failure to do due diligence. If you were to read their SEC report you would see that there are cars in the production plan from the beginning. Go do some research before you spread mis information.
Try to be a better listener, you are interrupting Chris every 5 seconds in your eagerness to show that you're listening. This is an issue specific to Americans, but that's not real listening.
Well it is about 20% lighter the steel so the weight reduction translates to energy savings. It does have a lower carbon footprint than aluminum and Tesla use a lot of Aluminum in its vehickes.
@@n.brucenelson5920 How much more would be "saved" if they weren't made? The world needs a carbon footprint of 0 or less. Aptera's carbon footprint is not 0 or less.
@@bobhilder1469 Tell me you are not really that naiive! Every Aptera on the road will greatly reduce the carbon contribution of what we are doing now. You can't wave a magic wand and make the roles it fills disappear.
Sounds like progress is being made. Thanks for putting this out. Like everyone else, we are really anticipating getting ours.
Very nice work Steve! This is the contents for the long term followers.
I never thought I'm going to dive this deep on a vehicle production.
Same, couple more of these videos and should be able to add certified automotive engineer to my resume 😀
Good questions Steve... thank you for the open communication Chris, it means so much!! Can't wait for part three.
Thanks Steve. You really help keep the buzz alive. and well.
If cost per kWh of electricity is the major cost of the CPC process, they should expand to Quebec. It's within the "North America" definition for the IRA subsidy, there's a fair bit of manufacturing and automotive supplier infrastructure nearby, and it's well linked by road, water, and rail.
@robertkirchner7981 Aptera doesn't qualify for IRA since it is considered a Motorcycle.
The detail on forming the tools for the body is good information for all Aptera enthusiasts to hear. Of course, thanks to AOC for bringing this information to the forum. Best information sharing ye on production! This information helps impress on all the complex nature and the time it takes to do some of the work needed to prep for production. Hopefully, will help all not to develop unsupported optimism or uninformed speculation on the production schedule. Also good information on time frame for other parts of the vehicle. Such AOC reporting maintains the AOC forum reputation as the premiere site of all things Aptera presented in an objective manner (Neither Fan Boy or Troll perspective)
Fantastic questions, Steve! Aptera is a fascinating product and story. I can’t wait to see how they alter the public’s idea of personal transportation.
I don't know what the curing temperatures are for these materials, but those dies are a huge mass of steel to bring up to temperature!! I believe the temperature is in the 300 - 400 degree F range somewhere, but Aptera/CPC will have to confirm this for us.
Usually between 150 to 250 degrees Fahrenheit. I have a distant memory of the autoclave’s at Boeing being at 180 degrees. Higher temperatures cure faster
@@kenmcclow8963 Okay, thanks for the solid feedback. Do you have any idea if the temperature is the same for both materials?
Very interesting to hear about energy needed to stamp out parts and good to hear about Elaphe having other clients, aptera orders not being effected. Thank you, Steve
What I'd like to ask is this: is there any structural strength difference between the old honeycomb design and the mold pressing carbon fiber they're using now?
Chery Automotive invested. Cool to think that a supplier thinks that Aptera is a good investment.
The suppliers have been paid, they have invested zero.
Thanks. The audio blip irritated me haha
Excellent with abundant details!
The in-wheel is a game changer efficient design wise. I see lots of novel possibilities with that. Elaphe must push themselves to more the dates as forward as possible on delivery of their parts.
Hey Steve, thank you so much for these last couple of videos and I think you said there was a third one. I get a really good sense of where Aptera is at and despite the challenges discussed, it gives me real hope that this is going to happen. So, thank you, very helpful and hopeful.
Funny how investors are getting less hopeful and regular people are more hopeful. So many question and healhty skeptics are needed hear. This thing sound more off the shell than anything revolutionary
@user-qg5kf6ld1v Chris Anthony said that about 30% of the components are off the shelf and the other 70% are the "bespoke" (Aptera specific components). How do you get off the shelf from that ?
@@garywozniak7742 wow...what's wrong with y,all? y'all believe everything they're saying? lol. It's called marketing, take your emotions out of it. Stop being a fan.
@@oluayankoya I have a mere $100 bucks at stake here. A refundable $100 bucks at that, not that I'm worried about it. The work at CPC is happening. There is a significant investment from both Aptera and CPC in that endeavor.
I've seen the equipment to make the solar panels in one of the factory tour videos. Elaphe Motors is a viable company with commercial orders.
Despite your obvious desire for it to happen, Aptera has not met its demise. It still kicking and it is a pretty safe bet that they are at least going to produce a number of production intent vehicled in the next 4 or 6 months for validation and crash testing.
@@oluayankoya Agree! Mostly COTS wherever possible integrated with good engineering. Nothing bleeding or cutting edge when looking at Aptera objectively.
well done very informative
Thanks Steve for this interview. You two covered so many good questions about where Aptera is, and what is ahead for the near future. 🚗🌞
Thanks to both of you for continuing to keep us updated on the progress!
Energy cost is a very valid concern for the manufacturing of the panels.
Aptera should look into sites in Eastern Washington for potential future manufacturing sites. Power is extremely cheap there, and there's already a new battery manufacturing facility being built in Moses lake
at 8:18 you asked if the battery pack was done but he didn't get a chance to answer. Is that completed or still in development?
I think this is a critical issue to bring to Aptera. When parking a solar vehicle, you need to know where the sun is to maximize the efficiency.
I hope the Ui/UX has a compass. This is the time to ensure that it’s included.
Super informative! Thx. What about the black Aluminum belly? Is that still in the picture, Source in Europe ? We have seen the wraps/ finished on the various Development vehicles. Will the wheel covers we wrap on the PI Production Intent ? Is the nose cone CPC SMC or a colored resin? Talk On !
These are great. Thanks, Steve!
Thanks Steve. Great interview. These interviews help fill in some of the blanks. I am hopeful that Aptera will pull this off and make into volume production. I have a window of time to purchase my next vehicle and its closing. I'm around 30k on the list and I'm hoping that the call from Aptera that they are ready to build my vehicle comes before that window shuts.
Can't wait for more of the company to move to the states, that was the highlight for me.
Great stuff Steve! Thanks! One thing I have never understood from Chris is his perspective on ramping up. I think it really depends on what he means when he gets asked about slower startups. He keeps referencing someone telling him the floor technician’s “minds are blown” trying to figure out how to ramp up from 1 car a day, to 1 per hour, to 4 per hour, then to 1 per 12 minutes. I guarantee that this is going to happen anyway. This is standard block and tackle transformation management. There are many factors they will encounter on this road. Fine tuning of automation, experienced skill development through practice, continuous improvement work, etc. This will prevent their 40 vehicle per week vertical start up at launch. I, personally, would be worried about recall exposure if I was trying to ram full production vertically. I would rather go back to their original strategy to start slow locally and ramp up.
Excellent questions and well structured interview. Thank you Steve.
Thanks for posting.
Always least cost when you manufacture and assemble as much as you can in house… plus keeps supply chain disruptions to a minimum.
Charge on!
Of course it isn't always least cost when "Make (Manufacture) is more or the majority vs. "Buy". Every component or assembly on a bill of materials goes through a Make/Buy Analysis to minimize cost and or maximize productivity (Usually with an integer, linear, or goal programming model) If you look closely, Aptera chose mostly "Buy" very little "Manufacture" This is especially in a capital intensive startup where a lot of capital is needed up front for facilities, equipment, materials to support some level of volume manufacturing.
Thank you Chris and Steve for another inside scoop on Aptera. Every one of these videos gives me a better understanding of some of what it takes to bring our cutting edge vehicle to production. Come to think of it with all its cutting edge technology Aptera should have been called blade, sword, scalpel or knife.
Definitely come to Slovenia to vacations. And when you do, ping me, I'll guide you around :)
Speaking of Elaphe, are all three wheel motors going to be identical? Tesla uses a different rear motor tuned for high speed cruising for more efficiency. Also, would a smaller & lighter rear motor benefit the ride quality enough to consider? I have been curious how much smoother the dual motor version will ride, and how much they are having to change the suspension between the two. So much unsprung weight on such a light car (autocycle). At least the frame is really rigid...
At least having a different sized tire or wheel on the back was looked at, but after testing by Roush, it was found not to be needed. There will surely be customers who will experiment with this. Having the same wheel/tire/motor combination simplifies things.
I agree it simplifies things, and a different wheel/tire combo would be a pain. I guess they need to leave a little bit of room for future improvements.
Nice to hear that CPC will be in the running to be Europe's construction facility - it's what I had speculated would happen, and nicely keeps my 1400 mile factory collection trip alive, bringing my 250 version back home via the Grossglockner Pass. I'm nowhere near first in line, so still looking to some time after May 2025 (when the Pass is open!)...
That sounds like I'd love to do too, I need to bring it to The Netherlands and driving through the mountains, and also Stelvio Pass works for me.
@@melvindevries_nl Nice! That'll definitely test the turning circle 😁 👍
I've friends in Karlsruhe who are very interested in Aptera, and taking a slight diversion past their house is part of the plan. A nice stop for a coffee at the top of the Pass should give a great photo op, maybe with all the flags in shot (tourist buses permitting!). Sunshine and regen on the way down!
@@examinerian where do you need to go to?
@@melvindevries_nl Durham, UK, so I've the extra wait for RHD. The journey is already possible with 10-30 minute stops along the way, and should be even easier by the time I try it.
@@examinerian i see, my reservation number is something around 7600 which should give me a years wait after the first Launch Edition is delivered, when do you expect yours?
Thanks Guys!
I would love to see a comparative time table w/ Tesla, in regards to Aptera’s growth. I am not familiar w/ the auto industry build ins/outs, but a comparison to similar transportation start ups it gives a sense of expectations.
Aptera has been doing a much better job relative to the Tesla startup, both in cash management (Tesla came within an hour of bankruptcy on Dec. 24, 2008) and in product development. -Tesla claimed to be shipping production vehicles from February 2008, when Elon took very public delivery of the first one, but the transmissions broke on acceleration - something that wasn't fixed until well into the next year.
Tesla built and sold a total of around 2,500 of those first vehicles. Aptera has paid pre-orders for over 45,000 of theirs.
@@n.brucenelson5920 This was very helpful. Thx
no one should compare this with a tesla or prius (not even in the same planet). At best compare it to lightyear zero or Ev1 or Vinfast
@@shrimptopian3392 "They" did not start in 2004. Aptera Inc. was a joint project with Idealab, who had removed Steve and Chris by 2009, and couldn't make their alternative plan work. They liquidated in 2011.
Aptera Corp was a brand new company with a new vehicle that started work in 2019.
@@shrimptopian3392Aptera launched in late 2019.
Maybe Aptera should consider Ohio for molding the parts in the future. I just locked in 4.8 cents a kw/h!
So Tennessee with 10 cent electricity could be a US manufacturing site?
Louisiana and New Mexico have the cheapest industrial rates, a bit more than 5 cents/kwh, which is a bit mystifying because they don't have much or any hydropower, which tends to be the least expensive. Washington and Tennessee are a bit more at 6+ cents/kwh.
BMW put their carbon fiber manufacturing in Moses Lake Washington because of all the hydroelectric on the Columbia from BPA. We used to have a lot of Aluminum smelters, but I think they have mostly moved to where the Bauxite is.
I would think Louisiana is making power with some fossil fuels, but probably gas to be competitive. New Mexico is pretty close to all the shale gas wells in Oklahoma and Texas that is pretty cheap to produce
Quebec has cheap, green electricity.
I don't know of any place in the states that sells power at 4.5 cents per kilowatt hour. I live in Tulsa Oklahoma that is probably one of the cheapest for power and pay 7.5 cents per kilowatt hour.
Sometimes that last little 5% of a project can create paralysis, And it's where perfectionists fail. I'm not gonna whine if there's a few last-minute self-service recall parts to replace if it means getting my ride a year and a half early. It's not like an appl phone or a tesla where everything is welded or glued shut. It'll be like patching an EA game. lol People will find short-term solutions. The jank things I've done to a TJ to keep it rolling would keep people up at night...
This Car if made mainstream will create a large culture of young men who will have hands-on experience working on electric vehicle like we have motor-city hot rod mechanics in their 50's and 60's today. America needs to keep it's traditions of knowing how to fix things alive, for either economic reasons and/or pleasure.
What's involved in putting the CPC body together such that Aptera workers can't be trained to assemble the car shell to save on shipping cost inefficiencies of shipping whole car bodies?
I seem to remember a mention that the body parts are bonded (glued) together. For now it makes sense to let CPC do it. They have the equipment and expertise to do ot. It keeps Aptera assembly process simple. They mentioned the possibility of CPC eventually having a facility in the U.S.
@@garywozniak7742 It seems to me it would really jump start u.s. production to bring over a small team from CPC team along with the necessary equipment to do the body bonding and then train up staff. In the long run, the cost savings would offset any initial expense compared to the large volume of parts you could ship compared to whole car bodies. Perhaps CPC wants to keep the assembly techniques proprietary.
@@zencone I am sure Aptera developed a number of alternative and did some rigorous Tradeoff analysis to select the best alternative or combination of alternatives. I don't think any of us would have all of the information to make a valid assessment of the best approach.
@@johnmalcom9159 Yes John, one would think so. I would have liked to hear Chris' explanation to the asked question. Since we're getting so much more transparency than most start-ups ever let us in on, it's just one more thing I'm curious about. On the face of it, it feels like filling a shipping container with filled helium balloons instead of filling the container with flat balloons to be filled later.
Agreed. A little puzzling to me as well
I wander if they are ever going to try and start to vertically integrate like Tesla is doing to get the cost of their vehicles down even more eventually.
Wondering what the cost to repair would be if the Aptera gets into an accident and damages to tub (even slightly). I imagine that the cost to replace the tub would be quite high.
Of course that isn't different from any vehicle on the road.
@@n.brucenelson5920 traditional car body is made of many panels stitched together with screws, rivets, or even glue. Unlike the aptera, smashing one panel would require replacing that one panel and not replacing almost all of the car's body
@@Chitown388 Aptera body parts will also be glued together and can be individually replaced using common techniques. Aptera is no different in this regard.
@@n.brucenelson5920 Aptera has 6 body panels. That's it!
Will they be shipped with the wrap applied? If not, when are they wrapped? Last I heard it took 6 weeks to cross the water. Which port are they coming into and if it’s the East Coast, how’s the trucking cost factor into cost? If fact, shipping seems to weigh heavily into cost at this point. In this day of modern electronic emails, why would you spend money to send someone to Italy just for a sun visor? Hopefully it’s an amazing sun visor and not just something that flips down. 😂
I suspect that at least the first vehicles will be flown over. The shorter time and lower inventory volume in transit makes up for the higher transportation cost.
I would guess that the wrap will be applied in San Diego. The sun visor I saw was more like a fine mesh screen so, if that's what they've decided on, you will be able to see through it.
16 to a hi-cube is quite a bit more than I would have guessed.
Defunked!! I thought Steve just outright said “Lordstown and Lightyear are just fucked” loll
Defunct*
What I would like to know is can you, Aptera, make the whole Car Narrower than 2.2 metres Wide? In a "Standard" road Lane width of 8' (and maybe narrower), 2.2 metres is over 7'2" leaving
Aptera just needs to get the first two thousand vehicles delivered, then make the next three thousand Launch Editions. Everything else falls into place after that. So, it begins by end of summer 2024 into 2025. Then starts the three year backlog of reservations. I'd like to see how fast these last five hundred Accelerator vehicles sell out after they release a few PI builds for validation. I think people are sleeping on how important these last LE's can be. I wanted a 250 mile, Noir in Vida trim, under $30K Aptera, yet had no desire to wait. For me, It's worth a little more money for a more compelling vehicle to ensure one of the first two-thousand off the line. I joined the program after the deadline was lifted. I'm doing my part to help Aptera drive to production, and look forward to beta testing my ride whenever that opportunity arrives.
Will it ever be built?
The solar should be upgraded soon they will be more flexable aprouching 30 percent effectiveness.in power conversation. I see magnetic field flux conversation improvements of management energy systems.
Conversion?
Looking like 2025 at best for mine but I can wait.
Steve looks like a Martian with the headset space....it is giving me a good giggle...
Slovenia is beautiful for sure. But if Tesla can profitably make vehicles in california then Aptera should be able to eventually. Hopefully
Good luck to everyone. My thinking is, it shouldn’t be called aptera, it should be called asymptote.
Hope you all have a product to buy soon.
You're right. They are always approaching production but never getting there.
👍
So Chris is saying I'm buying a tub...i can live with that. LOL
Let’s call the bunk the boot.
I also like Europe’s name for the bonnet.🌿
The European energy costs of production was interesting and lets be honest a self inflicted critical wound forced upon the EU by the US not liking Germany & others formerly close relation with Russian Energy) Thus Nord Stream 2 blown apart for strategic US energy concerns now coming home to bite a US manufacturer
Oh boy.....some serious lessons there eh
And ironically Germany unfortunately put ALL its energy needs in the 'green' basket was has also come back to bite it. Another lesson
The lesson should be that we are all connected. Ignoring green energy for the sake of profit over people has come back to bite us big time.
In other words, late 2024 delivery. But that's OK to ensure a sturdy, reliable, safe vehicle.
2026 at the earliest if ever at all. Investors are just not interested, $50,000,000 is a drop in the bucket for most investors. Rough times ahead folks. It looks like toyota was right all along
@@oluayankoya"Toyota being right" is a mixed bag. Their push for HFCV's has fallen on its face. Also they seem to be mentioning their 600 mile solid state battery a lot.
@@shrimptopian3392 Wow, a way out in left field speculation with absolutely no supporting logic
@@shrimptopian3392 Ya I think we all heard you the first 40 times you said that. Take a breath.
@@shrimptopian3392 Why?
Please, Please Don't let the Aptera become another Maserati/Chrysler or Cadillac Allante abortion! So Says a Former Facel Vega Owner...
The more i hear the less confident i am, i feel i've lost my investment
You are likely to be pleasantly surprised.
@@n.brucenelson5920 i really hope so, i am an investor. Pleasent surprises are not the norm in this or most industries...its very rare
mycelium?
The wisest thing that should be on everyone's mind currently should be to invest in different streams of income that doesn't depend on the govt. Especially with the current economic crisis around the world. This is still a good time to invest in gold, silver, and digital currencies (BTC,ETH...)
HOW !! I know it's possible I would appreciate if you show me how to go about it.
Wow, I'm just shocked you mentioned expert Mrs Laura Jennifer, I thought I'm the only one trading with her.
Seriously. I have been hearing that our economy is collapsing about once a week since the 90's. If our economy has been collapsing then our wealthiest people would be living in hovels or it is collapsing so slow that it wouldn't matter in our lifetime.
Trading with an expert is the best strategy for newbies and busy investors who have little or no time to monitor trade.
Nice, i just Googled her information, and everything about her is quite courageous and impressive
Knocking the octovalve as if it is a bad thing shows how he actually doesn't understand engineering, OR he is trying to sucker people who are ignorant. Either way, bad sign for aptera.. do you want your battery to be like a nissan leaf, or like a tesla? The better heat and cooling pumps allow battery management system to maintain pack at optimal temps, maintaining range and extending battery life, allowing operation in hotter or colder conditions. How ignorant would you have to be, to want less control, and capability over management of the most expensive part of the entire EV (the battery) ... shame so few can see this for what it is
He didn't say it was a bad thing, the cooling requirements for Aptera will be much lower and they don't require such a complex system
@@jamespaul2587 it was implied by his tone, and the fact he even brought it up. The original nissan leaf had no way to manage battery heat and cooling and it suffered greatly because of it. Gamma or one of the prototype units over heated while going up a hill.. they have since shown models that can take on a hill without over heating, but point remains, there is still heat to manage and a less sophisticated but less capable system is detrimental.
@@jamespaul2587he said "we TRY to limit the number of pumps, we don't want like 8 pumps, we don't want an octovalve, like telsa has.. we want try to keep our cooling system very simple"
No price update Chris? What are you afraid of?
Tub tooling is not complete and no firm ETA of when it will be complete but hopes for November. Again all the references to how this is super cars are built but no update to pricing because, well, supercars built this way are not cheap. Are people starting to understand why Aptera is not providing updated price guidance.
So they have not even settled the frame and suspension nor the exact work CPC is actually doing. Now CPC is going to ship frame, suspension, body, and glass? They have in effect contracted out nearly all manufacturing of this vehicle which will negate most of the California grants. However isn't it interesting how much Chris doesn't know yet? That implies they are still just winging it. Listening closely it is clear they suffer from a lack of organization.
In July Chris stated the battery supplier was not selected and notice how he did not answer the specific battery pack question. They claim solar is done but they have never ever shown off more than one roof panel installed and one loose. Never provided a solar hatch and this is from a group who claimed solar was in production in October 2022 in their own video!
Dismissing the octovalve shows lacking in engineering skill they have. However we cannot have our Tesla drinking game if Chris didn't boast about how Aptera is better than Tesla
"winging it" is the perfect phrase. You can not hope to design and develop a car with only 3 prototypes!
"No price update Chris? What are you afraid of? "
Making the same huge mistake Rivian did. Why don't you understand what a bad move this would be at this stage?
Most of the remaining work is a matter of tuning, which will be done with the validation vehicles. This is completely normal. I have witnessed this at both the Ford and GM desert proving grounds in person as a supplier.
@@n.brucenelson5920 compare aptera to Rivian is laughable. Rivian is a car company aptera is not
@@oluayankoya What is laughable is your failure to do due diligence. If you were to read their SEC report you would see that there are cars in the production plan from the beginning. Go do some research before you spread mis information.
@@AdrianWalker247 Of course there are more than three prototypes, which is something you should know if you are making comments on it.
Try to be a better listener, you are interrupting Chris every 5 seconds in your eagerness to show that you're listening. This is an issue specific to Americans, but that's not real listening.
1st
Slava Ukraine
Sounds like making of the Aptera will leave a gigantic footprint of the carbon variety.
Well it is about 20% lighter the steel so the weight reduction translates to energy savings. It does have a lower carbon footprint than aluminum and Tesla use a lot of Aluminum in its vehickes.
@@garywozniak7742 Sure but a smaller carbon footprint is still a carbon footprint. The world needs 0 or less carbon footprints.
@@bobhilder1469 Each Aptera will save an average of 14,000 lbs of carbon per year of operation..
@@n.brucenelson5920 How much more would be "saved" if they weren't made? The world needs a carbon footprint of 0 or less. Aptera's carbon footprint is not 0 or less.
@@bobhilder1469 Tell me you are not really that naiive! Every Aptera on the road will greatly reduce the carbon contribution of what we are doing now. You can't wave a magic wand and make the roles it fills disappear.