"Hey,guys! Lets create a monster that special summons from the extra deck without restrictions!" "That thing wouldn't be broken?" "Nah, its fine. Its restricted only to Dragons, so it isn't a problematic card "
I think agarpain could be unbanned if they errata'd the effect so that it can only summon guardragon extra deck monsters. Other than the links, the only other extra deck guardragon is almarduke. It would encourage them to expand the archetype and become its own thing instead of just another generic dragon engine.
@@ManoloRibera070 yeah erratas are stupid imo, whats the point of changing a card’s effect so it can come off the list only for it to be unplayable? Just keep it banned then
@@michael47359 they already did. In fact they made 2. Dragulon and crimson dragon. The former cheats out any dragon xyz just by detaching a material, and the latter cheats out any dragon synchro by targeting another synchro of the same level and shuffling crimson dragon back into the extra deck. Ahd like Agarpain, they're both extremely problematic cards for the amount of things they enabled. Overly generic card design breaking the game is an undeniable fact and should be addressed.
If it was limited to only Dark, Pendulums it would actually still work with a lot of DDD Extra Deck monsters as well as Z-Arc himself, so there would at least be some interesting targets
Alternatively they could make it like a choose one of either pendulums OR dark dragons, that way it can try to encompass almost everything Z-Arc related.
A lot of extra deck monsters wouldn't be as powerful if they were just effect monsters in the deck. Since if you don't have it in the hand, you would have to search it out first, or find a card that can summon it from the deck, they would be less viable since they would have to run more cards in their deck to search it or run less cards so they can draw it faster.
While I agree, modern yugioh and Konami sees the extra deck as a toolbox for extra utility and boss monsters, and main deck utility/boss monsters are generally unused unless it combos itself out with crazy consistency. It's unlikely Konami will change to only using the extra deck as utility without boss monsters since the consistency is just so much better with extra deck boss monsters, and they do need to sell cards somehow, but a competitively viable, main deck focused OTHER than dinos would be cool every now and then
@@masterduelzero1795 Konami just loves to print cards to only ban them later for being too powerful. They also love to ban cards that aren't the problem just so they don't have to ban the new card which IS the problem. While yes it's a company and to a company profits are the biggest thing, I don't think they realize how bad it really is. Only super dedicated people are going to drop hundreds of dollars for the best cards and chances are they'll be power crept or worse banned in the near future so why would I drop $300 on cards that i might not be able to use this time next year? That's why I got out of yugioh card play. The high cost of entry was not worth the little fun it brings. Nobody likes dropping triple digits on cards that might be useless soon. Nobody likes losing a duel before you even get your first turn. Nobody likes playing against a board full of negates pretty much losing you on the first turn. Yugioh has turn from a fum back and forth game you rarely won in your first 3 turns to your deck being bad if you can consistently win in your first turn or can't special summon 3 boss monsters first turn. Personally it's not much fun anymore and it's not worth spending a lot of money to get that much fun when a $60 video game is FAAAAR cheaper is offers a lot more potential fun.
@@Aaroncarter95 I agree, that's why I enjoy hearing about the game even though I haven't played in 5 years. Money isn't a huge issue for me now, but grown up me has better things to spend my money on lol
@@josesalgado2796 i keep up with the game and current ban/limits/unbans but until the current obilisk the Tormentor deck that came out the last cards I actually bought were in 2010 when I was still in high school. I got into yugioh again when duel links came out but within a year I was out again cause 1) real life got in the way so I couldn't play much to get gems and 2) I didn't have the money to spend on gems for cards so my decks were quickly outclassed. It just became a smaller, more controllable TCG and from what i hear has only gotten "worse" in the fact it's gotten even more powerful cards than when I left so new players are even worse off than before.
Phantom of Chaos already see amazing amount of meta success and that one you can only use it in your turn and only last until your end phase and you had to banish card you use. god knows why they released starving venom that easily summoned with effect that last permanently that also easy to copy effect.
I'd like a video discussing a full power Dragon Ruler deck list. I took a break from ygo around that era and want to learn more about the supposed best tier 0 deck in history.
Actually, Dragon Rulers were never tier 0! It’s an interesting story: A tier 0 deck means a deck makes up at least 65 percent of topping decks in events (it varies a little tho), and full power Dragon Rulers never became tier zero because full power Spellbook decks were also running around at that time, which was the only actual meta deck that could compete with DRs (in other words, Spellbook of Judgement wasn’t banned yet). Then the banhammer hit and DRs were banned, Judgement was banned, and the entire meta had to shift.
Agarpain banned because, "No Agarpain, no gain." DuelLogs, how about: ●Make it so it's summoned face down if possible and you can't summon anything else during that turn and the following (your opponents) turn. ●Or add a restriction as long as the summoned mon is on the field. Tempest Magician: ●Weaken the burn damage to something like 100 and apply burn to yourself Number 16: Color Ruler - Shock Master : ●Apply its effect to you, doing the same for the other banned cards with that effect #8: Rhongo-Bongo: ●Detach OUs to activate its Raigeki until it has only 4 left. Then it starts the following turn with 3. That would shorten how long it is protected.
Shock Master would still be too broken. You’d just end the combo with it instead. Far from difficult. That said, I feel what Duel Logs suggested for the errata is still in the spirit of the card.
@@buddbrown6858 but we need cards that are unaffected by card effects otherwise boss monsters would be next to useless, we all know about how hilariously easy the god cards are to defeat because of it.
@@EsoiTheGrumpyMawile I disagree. Can't be targeted? Sure. Can't be destroyed? That's fine. Both? All good. But can't be affected by anything at all?? On top of being lazy card design it's just a less interesting game when you can't interact with stuff. If you remove the ways to outmaneuver cards, strategy goes out the window. Then power creep sets in and the only good cards are unaffected by stuff. It's a bad precedent
@@buddbrown6858 If we need to talk power creep here, we need to talk about the special summoning or more importantly how it's abused. It is FAR too easy to bring out powerful monsters with several omni negates with barely any draw backs in the current meta that going second is not only mostly unviable (evenly matched is the only card that I know can counter this crap). On top of that there are unbreakable boards and otk's running rampant across the meta too, this game is generally unbalanced to a fault which is why immune cards are almost needed. Before I end this, immune cards (though not full immunity) really were needed in the early formats just because boss monsters were really easy to kill with spells and traps which made the effort of summoning them kinda pointless really and now we have more cards that get rid of them even easier, it's sad that boss monsters feel like fodder.
@@EsoiTheGrumpyMawile I don't disagree with what you just said, these bosses need protection but being outright unaffected is an issue. It's just substituting one problem for another
I think that Number 86 could be fixed if they added an effect like "You cannot control other face-up monsters" which shuts down effectively the number 75 combo
One thing that makes shockmaster insane is that it's summoning condition is so insanely generic for a 2 turn broad shutdown that isn't once per turn. If it was restricted in any meaningful way maybe it would've had a chance
It does exist, in the form of Judgement of the Pharaoh. But that is basically a gimmicky joke deck card that requires you to have Unity or Yu-Jo Friendship to get the full range of effects.
It’s shorts exist as Vendread Battlelord, which to think people complained it was not exactly like Shock Master. Especially since some Drytron variants used it to stop hand traps.
Shueisha technically made it. For the longest time, they didn’t care to balance the cards because they had no experience in doing so. They just slapped them together to promote non-TCG YGO products and were happy when the cards were a reason said products sold. And Konami couldn’t say no because Shueisha as the rights holder could yank the license away next time contract renewals were up. They communicate better these days at least. Also the rest of the cards mentioned in this video were all Konami’s doing. It’s just that Shock Master was the one exception so I figured I’d say something.
For Shock Master: Special summon one per duel, Effect once per turn and speed spell 2 but only for that one turn, 5 material (fairy-type) and the cost is 3, can’t be used for any material.
@@chasepak7933 all it needed was the once per dual, the other shit makes it unplayable because why would summon something that takes 5 materials to summon, even links are more fair than that
@@sdbzfan1 my reason being is the way it was originally put into. Having a full nullified of any can be abused in a way, and even with the errata, it could possibly be limited, maybe
I say we go full shit-post and require 7 materials; you have to use a Rank-Up-Magic or somehow get an extra link with Level 4 monsters to Xyz summon it. (Rank-Up-Magic Astral Force + Herald of Pure Light)
I've seen it said in a lot of these videos that they can never print more cards that copy graveyard effects because of how clearly broken that effect is (obviously citing Tyrant Neptune and Starving Venom) but I mean, Phantom of Chaos is out here doing just fine. It can clearly be done in a balanced way.
Somehow the Phantom of Chaos effect actually insulates itself from the broken stuff really well, not being able to deal combat damage, banishing the target and also copying the target's attack value is really good card design considering how long ago it was printed. After that, the fact that it's only level 4 has been pure luck for keeping it out of trouble, a Phantom of Chaos Nightingale can still burn for 2000 (before level changing trickery) but it banishing the Nightingale means you can't just make 4 copies despite it not having a hard once per turn.
The Wind Witch fusion monster also copies effects in the grave but it is difficult to bring out turn 1 as you need to make a level 7 synchro as fusion material beforehand. It could become broken later though.
@@randomprofile5853 They’ve made more rituals monsters recently than pendulums, I’m pretty sure. Or at least it feels like it. My guess is that since pendulums are naturally overly wordy, they’re inherently more complex of a card type than any other so they’re difficult to design properly. Remember that most players are casual and many of those are turned off by seeing multiple paragraphs on a card.
@@MrZer093 I wouldn't call them complex, because they are fairly basic, most comments come from ex-players who still think they are "broken" and "complex". In OCG I think that Pendulums are actually rogue & people enjoy them, plus next year is Arc V's 5th anniversary since it ended so I wouldn't be suprised if they would make more Pendulum support & archetypes.
Love this video so chill even I'm not playing Yu-Gi-Oh competitively and not playing for 8 years due to in our country this game isn't popular but I love watching this video I feel very relax.☺️
@@sully571 the computer plays competitively for some reason… and it’s near impossible to find a random person to play “casual” with…. Hell even casual uses the same bullcrap that the competitive players use.
@@falconrvn7018 I play a 60 card nostalgia deck (buster blader, heroes, black luster soldier, abc, utopia) and I rape the computer all the time, I'm also 50% wins on ranked with the same deck, if you want I'll show you my replays. Yugioh is extremely reasonable I promise you.
@@sully571 What?!? Goddamn… are your for real!!?… tbh that’s the best thing I’ve heard from a random person… I mean for yu-gi-oh stuff… in a while .. lol….. yeah I’d love to see it.
@@jimthekidd a quick effect being better is not really relevant here since shock Master can effect the opponent's turn out of the box anyway. On TOP of that, he can also be used to shut down spell or trap cards if you run into a deck that focuses on them (Sky Strikers, for example), which makes it more flexible.
@@Mernom maybe I forgot to add. People like there's not other cards that lock out spells/traps. They also try an act like yugioh as a whole isn't shutting off a part of the game for the opponent. All these other negates, unaffected monsters, backrow that floodgates. God forbid we bring back another monster that floodgates as if there isn't many many many many others. Difference is this one has a few outs and nowadays really would be fine at 1. People seem to forget how hard shock master loses to backrow if they call monster eldlich would eat it alive. Altergiest would laugh at it. An they would have to call monster because of nib that's 4 of 5 summons already. Meaning they are even more susceptible to backrow.
Tempest magician was seeing fairly decent success as a backup option in endymion magicians because with Mythical Beast Jackal king getting 2 counters per spell, getting the required counters to ftk was super easy.
Just wanted to say thanks to this channel. Helped me back into YGO 2 years ago by explaining competitive cards and effects etc, couldn't be more grateful for helping get back into the hobby
I made a Pendulum Magician deck that has Zarc as part of it's strategy. But it takes so long that I either win or was defeated before I could get everything in the graveyard to pull off the summon
Here are two ideas for number 86: 1- The summoning condition are two or more (up to five) “Heroic” monsters 2- You cannot have any other monsters on the field, except “heroic” monster So heroics get to keep their boss monster and we don’t have to deal with an annoying floodgate effect being in every deck
I liked the higher detail, but I get that some of them are pretty simple to understand. You're good at explaining things and it's cool to listen to while I'm eating breakfast/lunch or cooking. Many of the cards bring me back to the old days of the game as well haha.
On the topic of fixing Supreme King Starving Venom, an easy errata would just be adding a OPT clause and “your opponent takes no damage from card effects for the rest of the turn”. Still allows some crazy interactions, but the card was clearly designed with those in mind.
Rhongomyniad is one of those cards that probably should stay banned, since there’s no easy way to fix its inherently broken effect. Removing one of its effects entirely is not something Konami would do, since they don’t like outright removing effects from cards to errata them
Rhongo and Tempest suffer from not being future proff as Rhongo would be difficult to summon with more than 3 materials consistently and Tempest relying on spell counters sucks but thanks to other cards they can cheat their effects pretty easily and consistently so its sad to see
@@sdbzfan1 Rhongo wasn’t supposed to be easy to summon. It just happens to work with Gossip Shadow. I think one way to fix it would be to just make it HARDER to summon. How about “this card cannot be summoned using an Xyz monster as one of its materials” that way it keeps its original effect but it can’t be used with Gossip Shadow, the actual problem card. Tempest has the same problem. It wasn’t supposed to be easy to add tons of spell counters to her, because when she first debuted, spell counters were still a crummy mechanic. The real problem was Selene, she just happens to work with her. Like DuelLogs said, the fix is simple, just add a cap to her effect damage to make it hard to FTK with her, and a hard once per turn so that players don’t try to get clever and simply summon more copies of Tempest. That would fix it.
@@brianaguilar8283 i would say rhongo should have its 1 and 3 effect swaped since if its emune to card effects the moment it is summon then number 75 cant add materials to it, and if that doesnt work, just make it so it cant have materials added to it artificially either by spell cards, trap cards or monster effects
There’s a simple fix, just make it’s materials exclusively Heroic monsters. That card is still powerful in its own deck, but it can’t be splashed into a Warrior deck that isn’t Heroics.
Random fact, but I found out today that Tempest Magician’s effects are slightly different across the OCG and TCG. Here in the TCG, Tempest Magician “discards” cards in your hand, but in the OCG she only “sends cards in your hand to the GY.” Since in the OCG she only sends cards into the graveyard and doesn’t discard, it wouldn’t trigger the effects of Danger! and Fabled cards, so it seems she is slightly weaker over there.
@@Kefkaownsall To be fair, the fact that her effect required spell counters made her a balanced card until the new Endymion cards got released ten years after her.
With number 86, you could probably fix it by capping the materials to 5, then making it detach TWO materials each turn. That way it wouldn't be able to keep the floodgate for more than 1 turn, and in two turns it would be useless. Might still be a bit strong even with that though...
Alternatively, as a quick effect during the main phase, you detach up to 5 material to gain the corresponding effects. It would STILL be overpowered in they fact that 1 turn of summoning shutdown is more than enough to win a game, as proven by some decks that tech in Heat Wave, but it would have more counterplay since the opponent could use turn priority to Kaiju it immediately before it ever gets a chance to activate his effects, or you can set a floodgate like Threatening Roar to survive another turn, as well as some form of backrow-based negates to stop your opponent from dropping another one.
I was going through your playlists so I can be up to date with the Why it's Banned series before watching this one and I never would've suspected you were a vocaloid fan.
@@ΆρηςΟικονόμου-χ1σ we’re still in dark times for pendulums. Electrumite may not come back but maybe my bro astrograph can comeback to at least help, now that’s wishful thinking
Currently revisiting this playlist to learn new MasterDuel tech. I’ve definitely been hit with that number 86 Rongo combo play a couple times on the ladder
IMO Konami should change Rhongomyniads effect to "your opponent cannot normal or special summon summon monsters on your side of the field." That would still be a powerful effect but nowhere near as BS.
3:11 I was one of two people who played Crusadia Guardragon at YCS Chicago 2019. Hot RDA Abyss was my choice over Crystal Wing not because of the ability to pick any card on the field. It's that Hot RDA Abyss does not have to respond directly to chains, unlike Crystal Wing, which has to respond in chain to a monster Also the Tenyi counter trap has a waking-esque effect that summons a non-effect monster from the extra deck, meaning Blue Eyes Ultimate Dragon
(17:50) When I was creating a fanmade Zombie archetype based on famous or iconic Number monsters (long story short: it was a pun based on the idea of an innumerable zombie hoard), I found just doubling the required number of materials for each of Rhongomyniad's effects went quite some distance to keep his effects in check. Another funny idea though is if you give Rhongomyniad out-right protection against targeting effects (i.e. "Cannot be targeted for effects"), Gossip Shadow would be unable to target him - and I find the concept of balancing a card by buffing it more pretty darn hilarious. (Sorry for third comment, figured since they were separate trails of thought I'd post them as separate comments)
For reference on how doubling the required number of materials on Rhongomyniad would still keep those effects accessible, Six Samurai turbo can easily go into Gossip Shadow with 5 Level 3 monsters and still have room to make Rhongomyniad after, which would - for example - take a 2 material Rhongomyniad to 8 materials. You can also further that with cards like Overlay Regen (though they would have to be used on Gossip Shadow, since Rhongomyniad becomes unaffected by other cards at 3+ materials).
The best-most-direct answer I've gotten why SK Starving Venom and Nightingale are unbanned in the OCG is Maxx C so modern players can draw into handtraps and punish FTK decks mid-combo. Maxx C in general pushed the OCG into a mid-game grind, which is why more extenders (Denglong, Tempest) could stay in the game and why Red-Eyes Dragoons was feared even more than in the TCG as an easy indestructible omni negate held insane value.
As a beginner, my first reaction is confusion, because several of these cards are legal in Master Duel. But at least I can understand why they are in the TCG banlist (Rhongo PTSD soon)
My Favorite way to summon Supreme King Dragon Staving Venom is to have no monsters while my opponent has 2, use Odd-Eyes Fusion with Odd-eyes Venom Dragon and 1 other. That way I can use it's effect to copy Odd-eyes Venom Dragon then use the copied effect on the opponent's monster that either has the better effect or higher attack (depends on situation).
For Agarpain, if it were a Link-3 that required 3 materials, that could slow it down a lot. Also, make it either negate the effects of whatever it summons and/or prevent any more special summoning for the rest of the turn.
Since different cards value Spell Counters differently, any card that can use Spell Counters between cards risks being broken like Tempest Magician. (A good analogy is to think of them as different currencies, and Tempest Magician can spend any of them as its currency.) Konami either has to make sure that no card has Spell Counters be low-valued like Selene, or avoid cards like Tempest Magician; the latter is a better solution than the former for future card design.
the fun thing about tempest magician is that cloudians have a trap that does the exact same thing while also have access to spells that can load up the field with fog counters if there are enough monsters present. but just because its so inconsistent no one plays it. so modern spell counter support is what really made it broken
I feel like starving venom could get off the banlist if they have the effect copying be a hard once per turn, since you need 2 copies to copy independent nightingales effect to do the FTK, also I feel like for the tyrant Neptune as well the only reason these two cards are banned is because of independent nightingale, so I feel like if we just ban that card it would fix it IMO
The issue isn't only that Nightingale is a menace to strong copying-other-monters effects, but that it would cause long-term issues when designing cards, to the point that banning the copying monsters becomes an inevitability. Yeah, it's technically the copied cards' fault, but you can't simply ban every future offender and not realize that maybe you're better off without the ones copying them.
They could make Rhongo Myniad gain effects only with "Heroic Challenger" XYZ materials. This way he won't be a problem until Heroic Challengers be a Meta Deck.
17:42 How I would fix *"Number 86: Heroic Champion - Rhongomyniad":* 1) Make that you need to detach 1 Xyz material at the End Phase itself. 2) Make the 4 Xyz materials effect as it floodgates also you from further summonings and not only your opponent (so it became a final boss monster card you summon at the end of your combos). 3) If it's still too op, maybe make its summoning condition as 3 or more level 4 Warrior-type monsters and make it that it can't be summoned in other ways. 4) Drastic measure (panic button): make it that you can't activate other card effects after its summoning for the rest of the turn.
Fun fact about Rhongomyniad. Its 5 material effect can't actually be activated if it has 6 or more materials; as its 1 through 4 material effects all stipulated "[X] or more:" (or "[X]+" on the errata). But the 5th effect can only be activated if it strictly has exactly 5 materials due to lacking that extra "or more"/"+" clause.
I don't play competitively so this is all really interesting to me. I don't keep up with banlists or meta stuff like that so this is a great way to understand why certain cards are banned. I always wondered why dragon link was so broken and now I know. Pretty crazy how busted some of these cards and combos are.
When You are done with the banned cards, can You make a segment about errata'd cards that were on the banlist or were part of their combos? And ask the questions : "What if they had their original effects?" And ""Do they still ser play?"
@@HarveyDangerLurker yes, but it is like a foolish burial on steroids. If You wanted to summon five headed dragon or chimeratech overdragon, it is at least a +5 with the graveyard effects.
@@HarveyDangerLurker I remember my high school friends let me use its original effect since I still had the pre-errata card and didn't even know the effect got changed. Here I am running my 2008 blue-eyes/dragon deck with a few random new cards I managed to get sprinkled in, unable to understand why sending cards to the graveyard is good. At that time I thought using ancient rules or kidmodo dragon to get out a blue-eyes on my first turn was absolutely OP
Ok, did I miss electrumite in a previous video? Because I really want to know why it’s banned. Also, in the case of Rhongominyad and some other cards, they aren’t the problem and the other card is the one that should be fixed or banned. Get rid of Gossip shadow and he’d be good.
Hey DuelLogs huge fan of your content... Id like to propose a video idea of Top 10 Overlooked archetypes with potential such as Ojama for an example or Top 10 decks with more than one archetype like Zombies and Lightsworn for example ! Thanks for the knowledge and information you constantly share with us as well much gratitude...
I remember used Shock Master with the Star Seraph archetype , was so broken because with Star Seraph Scepter you could target one card on the field and destroy it and draw one card and Star Seraph Scepter when is summoned can search one Star Seraph monster from the deck and if you had Star Seraph Sovereignty in your hand you can special summon and draw one card and if you search another Star Seraph Sovereignty through Star Seraph Scepter's effect you can special summon from your hand and draw another card , so you could easily bring out at least 3 monsters on the field and special summon Shock Master and draw 3 cards all in 1 turn .
Honestly,I think Tempest Magician's burn damage could just be significantly reduced and given a hard once per turn,I can't see it not coming back. It won't be completely useless either, seeing as even Gagaga Cowboy saw massive competitive play throughout the years simply by having just a little burn damage to finish off the game.
For Number 16 : Shock Master, adding a gamble effect would make it still as powerful, but inconsistent. (Like, 1-2 = Monster, 3-4 = Spell and 5-6 = Trap.)
One rule change to eliminate most ftks, the player who goes first cannot burn their opponents life points If a monster effect is activated that requires your opponent to take burn damage, it could still be used and the burn effect would resolve however no lp would be deducted (in order for any possible deck to still function and not be unplayable unintentionally) I don’t know why they never thought of this but it would solve a lot of problems and would allow some cards to immediately come off the ban list
This is all my opinion but the The best way to fix Agarpain is to have it as a once per dual (for tournament reasons) and the card that was special summoned leaves the field at the end of the turn it was summoned. The best way to fix Supreme King Dragon Starving Venom is to allow it to only copy Dragon Pendulum monsters and for this turn only when summoned is to gain the attack of the monster and the turn after to copy an effect of a monster once per duel. The best way to fix Tempest Magician is to have her effect to remove counters one 1 card and the effect can only be activated once per 2 turns. The best way to fix Number 16: Shock Master is to have it as a once per turn and detach all materials while keeping it at 3. The best way to fix Number 86: Heroic Champion - Rhongomyniad is removing the unaffected by other cards effect and replace it with either destroy or ban a card on your field and make the 4 materials can't special summon more than 3 monsters and add an effect of if a material isn't removed destroy this card or ban this card but like I said this is all my opinion
Limiting Agarpain to only enabling only that 1 summon for the turn is probably the best way to go about having such an effect tbh, but for added measure it could also only work if 2 additional monsters are pointing to a zone it's also pointing too (requiring 3 monsters to point to the same zone). Locking Starving Venom to only dark pendulums would still leave potential pot holes for future card design, so prevent it from inflicting burn damage for the turn if it's effect is used, and from keeping the effects until the next turn so it doesn't have the ability to benefit so much from gained protections. Tempest should absolutely receive a cap on how much burn damage it can do, say max. 1500, as well as making it a hard once per turn, so it can be used as a sort of game ending alternate win con card, without making it almost completely useless given there are way better spell counter generating cards in the game for it to see play otherwise. Change Shock Master to only negate the first card of what it declares during the opponent's turn as a hard once per turn effect (similar to how the Magician's Hand's/ Spiritual Art Ichirin spell cards work), it then becomes a decent but not overly stupid Xyz monster, there is also the option of allowing the opponent to complete an action, such as discarding a card/paying LP etc... to negate its effect similarly to how cards like the Dark and Light Spiritual arts or Fairy Tail Luna work. I'd argue you could change Rhongomyniad to only having targeting protection and change it's effect of locking summons to destroying (not negating) 1 summoned monster your opponent plays, it has a decent pay off and isn't completely unfair to play against in this state.
You know what would fix cards that can copy effects? If they could copy any effect in the GY… specifically copying from your Opponent’s GY. That way it’s requires your Opponent to give you a card that’s useful to copy
On Rongomyniad they could possibly change the 4+ effect to have the cost that requires all its materials and only lasts until the end of the turn. Or they could also make the 4+ effect trigger upon summon and only last until the end of the next turn. That might fix it.
Agarpain could be fixed by just targeting either other Guardragons or World Chalice dragons. It's obvious that they want this effect to work with the over archetype of World Chalice cause lore. Just lock it to be in archetype and it would do wonders to fix it.
Adding a new line to some broken negate cards of "cannot be used/summoned on the first turn of the duel" would go a long way in fixing them. Prevents the whole "not letting the going second player play the game"
Rongo's 4th effect could be changed to Winda's floodgate effect: both players can only special summon once per turn. then, he should have "cannot be destroyed" instead of unaffected so he can still be sent or tributed away by something
Independent nightingale can probably be given an effect that this card's effects can't be used by monsters that don't have the same name as this card So that copying is no longer an issue,skdsv get unbanned and copying the effect will mostly requires something that copies the name like Odd-eyes venom dragon (this monster copies both the name and effect but can only copy from opponent Monsters in the field) to make it "perfectly balanced"
For shockmaster would it being reciprocal make it able to be unbanned. Since that would be powerful but also prevent you from doing new interrupts on their turn unless you have spells or traps. For Rhongo if you restricted its xyz mats to heroic monsters would that help?
Another way to fix Rhongo: bump up its maintenance cost. If it were to lose more material more often, then it wouldn't be completely invincible for too long and there would be a chance for some counterplay. My suggestion would be two materials during each End Phase, though something similar could also work.
another eratta to unban agarpain would be to include agarpain the 2 or more link monsters points to a monster zone. For starving venom another restrictions could be that it must be fusion summoned and you cannot use other effects for the rest of the turn. Tempest can change the needed materials to spellcasters that you can place on them spell counters (yes, there's a spellcaster tuner that you place spell counters on it), also selene can chnage her materials to only spellcasters that you can place spell counters on them. Shock master can have the restriction of hard once per turn instead of soft. Gossip shaddow can have it materials to be exactly 6 (good luck with that) and rongo detach 1 material during the start of each phase.
Please, I wanna try Tempest Magician in my Endymion deck PLEASE Konami xD Also, could you perhaps make a series in the future about the limited cards aswell? I feel like some of them could go to 3 without any problems, idk I'd just like to see a detailed series about it!
One way to fix Rhongomyniad would be to change it's 4+ effect to only prevent normal, not special summoning. That way it's still a major floodgate while being more reasonable.
I've always thought shock master was a perfect example of why the entire game needs to be redone. On paper, shock master has a very balanced effect, but because they've poured all their time and energy into monster effects instead of properly balancing the game shock master was made very overpowered. Honestly, i think it would do the game a lot of good if they basically just scrapped it and started over, or just decided to ban every card released after the gx era since that's when the game started to get really bad.
The heroic champion can be fixed if they made it that you have to detach a number of materials for the selected effect (like detach 3 xyz materials to become immune or detach 5 to lock your opponent from summoning) and the activation is not once per turn just to not ruin the card and also keep the maintenance cost.
#2 there was already a card that could do that, it just banished the card from the graveyard and was super hard to bring out, it also didnt have a limit to targets, so its possible that's why they felt this effect was ok
![Explaining All Banned Extra Deck Monsters in YuGiOh [Part 6]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/uuvDyZed86U/mqdefault.jpg)
![Explaining All Banned Extra Deck Monsters in YuGiOh [Part 6]](/img/tr.png)
"Hey,guys! Lets create a monster that special summons from the extra deck without restrictions!"
"That thing wouldn't be broken?"
"Nah, its fine. Its restricted only to Dragons, so it isn't a problematic card "
But SIR there are so many broken DRAGONS in the game!!
“Dragons huh? You mean that type that we literally piss out support for?”
@@ragnaricstudios5888 "yeah, that one! They only have weak monsters in extra deck, so i will be fine!"
Komoney has such a weird fetish for dragon types.
@@AxisChurchDevotee and warriors, and sometimes spellcasters
Shock master was ridiculous. I remember when it came out, there was a combo where you could get 3 out and lock your opponent out from doing anything.
Yup thanks to Ultimate Offering being at 3, abused a lot in Gadgets and Madolche.
TheDuelLogs: Supreme King Dragon Starving Venom
Me, finding out I own a banned card that I occasionally play: Oh.
I think agarpain could be unbanned if they errata'd the effect so that it can only summon guardragon extra deck monsters. Other than the links, the only other extra deck guardragon is almarduke. It would encourage them to expand the archetype and become its own thing instead of just another generic dragon engine.
Dragon link baby 😁
No erratas
@@ManoloRibera070 yeah erratas are stupid imo, whats the point of changing a card’s effect so it can come off the list only for it to be unplayable? Just keep it banned then
No errata !! Just make a new card. Fkn hate errata.
@@michael47359 they already did. In fact they made 2. Dragulon and crimson dragon. The former cheats out any dragon xyz just by detaching a material, and the latter cheats out any dragon synchro by targeting another synchro of the same level and shuffling crimson dragon back into the extra deck. Ahd like Agarpain, they're both extremely problematic cards for the amount of things they enabled. Overly generic card design breaking the game is an undeniable fact and should be addressed.
Idk why I just love it when DuelLogs says "extra nasty"
Time for Top 10 Cards that are Extra Nasty and then Top 10 Cards that aren’t Half Bad
And Top 10 Cards _that is not that good_
Same it gets me so hard
I love it when he says "but in Duel Links..." specially seeing how many TCG players see Duel Links as "inferior"
If it was limited to only Dark, Pendulums it would actually still work with a lot of DDD Extra Deck monsters as well as Z-Arc himself, so there would at least be some interesting targets
Alternatively they could make it like a choose one of either pendulums OR dark dragons, that way it can try to encompass almost everything Z-Arc related.
As a D/D/D player, i would love this
A lot of extra deck monsters wouldn't be as powerful if they were just effect monsters in the deck. Since if you don't have it in the hand, you would have to search it out first, or find a card that can summon it from the deck, they would be less viable since they would have to run more cards in their deck to search it or run less cards so they can draw it faster.
While I agree, modern yugioh and Konami sees the extra deck as a toolbox for extra utility and boss monsters, and main deck utility/boss monsters are generally unused unless it combos itself out with crazy consistency. It's unlikely Konami will change to only using the extra deck as utility without boss monsters since the consistency is just so much better with extra deck boss monsters, and they do need to sell cards somehow, but a competitively viable, main deck focused OTHER than dinos would be cool every now and then
@@masterduelzero1795 Konami just loves to print cards to only ban them later for being too powerful. They also love to ban cards that aren't the problem just so they don't have to ban the new card which IS the problem. While yes it's a company and to a company profits are the biggest thing, I don't think they realize how bad it really is. Only super dedicated people are going to drop hundreds of dollars for the best cards and chances are they'll be power crept or worse banned in the near future so why would I drop $300 on cards that i might not be able to use this time next year? That's why I got out of yugioh card play. The high cost of entry was not worth the little fun it brings. Nobody likes dropping triple digits on cards that might be useless soon. Nobody likes losing a duel before you even get your first turn. Nobody likes playing against a board full of negates pretty much losing you on the first turn. Yugioh has turn from a fum back and forth game you rarely won in your first 3 turns to your deck being bad if you can consistently win in your first turn or can't special summon 3 boss monsters first turn. Personally it's not much fun anymore and it's not worth spending a lot of money to get that much fun when a $60 video game is FAAAAR cheaper is offers a lot more potential fun.
@@Aaroncarter95 I agree, that's why I enjoy hearing about the game even though I haven't played in 5 years. Money isn't a huge issue for me now, but grown up me has better things to spend my money on lol
@@josesalgado2796 i keep up with the game and current ban/limits/unbans but until the current obilisk the Tormentor deck that came out the last cards I actually bought were in 2010 when I was still in high school. I got into yugioh again when duel links came out but within a year I was out again cause 1) real life got in the way so I couldn't play much to get gems and 2) I didn't have the money to spend on gems for cards so my decks were quickly outclassed. It just became a smaller, more controllable TCG and from what i hear has only gotten "worse" in the fact it's gotten even more powerful cards than when I left so new players are even worse off than before.
@@Aaroncarter95 Tough balance between making an enjoyable game and staying in business. While it's not for us it's still entertaining.
Ngl, 3/5 of this list consists of cards I always wondered why ever existed from the first place
Starving Venom is a real head scratcher frfr
5/5*
Phantom of Chaos already see amazing amount of meta success and that one you can only use it in your turn and only last until your end phase and you had to banish card you use. god knows why they released starving venom that easily summoned with effect that last permanently that also easy to copy effect.
@@coins_png Nah, tbf Starving Venom and Tempest are OP, but I was still able to believe they existed
@@buddbrown6858 starving venom exists for anime purposes
I'd like a video discussing a full power Dragon Ruler deck list. I took a break from ygo around that era and want to learn more about the supposed best tier 0 deck in history.
Actually, Dragon Rulers were never tier 0! It’s an interesting story: A tier 0 deck means a deck makes up at least 65 percent of topping decks in events (it varies a little tho), and full power Dragon Rulers never became tier zero because full power Spellbook decks were also running around at that time, which was the only actual meta deck that could compete with DRs (in other words, Spellbook of Judgement wasn’t banned yet). Then the banhammer hit and DRs were banned, Judgement was banned, and the entire meta had to shift.
Like the PFP
Same....I miss dragon rulers :c
Yea PePe was the best tier 0 since they had to release an emergency ban list just for them.
One of his early videos from this series goes over that Era
Agarpain banned because, "No Agarpain, no gain."
DuelLogs, how about:
●Make it so it's summoned face down if possible and you can't summon anything else during that turn and the following (your opponents) turn.
●Or add a restriction as long as the summoned mon is on the field.
Tempest Magician:
●Weaken the burn damage to something like 100 and apply burn to yourself
Number 16: Color Ruler - Shock Master :
●Apply its effect to you, doing the same for the other banned cards with that effect
#8: Rhongo-Bongo:
●Detach OUs to activate its Raigeki until it has only 4 left. Then it starts the following turn with 3. That would shorten how long it is protected.
Agrapain could also simply negate the effects of the monster, and maybe also put a level restriction on the target?
@@belafeldbusch3397 That can work.
Basically Shock Master would just be very similar to Vendread Battlelord.
Shock Master would still be too broken. You’d just end the combo with it instead. Far from difficult. That said, I feel what Duel Logs suggested for the errata is still in the spirit of the card.
Rongo is so busted that I've lost to it several times without ever even knowing it had a board wipe effect
@Yan Carvalho anti-special summon floodgates and cards that are unaffected shouldn't exist at all yet they put that together in one card 😂
@@buddbrown6858 but we need cards that are unaffected by card effects otherwise boss monsters would be next to useless, we all know about how hilariously easy the god cards are to defeat because of it.
@@EsoiTheGrumpyMawile I disagree. Can't be targeted? Sure. Can't be destroyed? That's fine. Both? All good. But can't be affected by anything at all?? On top of being lazy card design it's just a less interesting game when you can't interact with stuff. If you remove the ways to outmaneuver cards, strategy goes out the window. Then power creep sets in and the only good cards are unaffected by stuff. It's a bad precedent
@@buddbrown6858 If we need to talk power creep here, we need to talk about the special summoning or more importantly how it's abused.
It is FAR too easy to bring out powerful monsters with several omni negates with barely any draw backs in the current meta that going second is not only mostly unviable (evenly matched is the only card that I know can counter this crap).
On top of that there are unbreakable boards and otk's running rampant across the meta too, this game is generally unbalanced to a fault which is why immune cards are almost needed.
Before I end this, immune cards (though not full immunity) really were needed in the early formats just because boss monsters were really easy to kill with spells and traps which made the effort of summoning them kinda pointless really and now we have more cards that get rid of them even easier, it's sad that boss monsters feel like fodder.
@@EsoiTheGrumpyMawile I don't disagree with what you just said, these bosses need protection but being outright unaffected is an issue. It's just substituting one problem for another
I think that Number 86 could be fixed if they added an effect like "You cannot control other face-up monsters" which shuts down effectively the number 75 combo
Or just ban 75
Sales ban
One thing that makes shockmaster insane is that it's summoning condition is so insanely generic for a 2 turn broad shutdown that isn't once per turn. If it was restricted in any meaningful way maybe it would've had a chance
Can't wait for the "Explaining All The Banned/Limited Cards...IN DUEL LINKS" videos. We all know that's going to happen at some point.
We only need one more busted card to sneak under the radar.
Sure why not
“But in Yu-Gi-Oh DUEL Links!” The video
You mean the all of 4 banned cards?
-That Grass Looks Greener
-Invoked Cocytus
-Cyberstein
-Hey Trunade
@@zdelrod829 Call isn't banned. It's at 1
Ah, shock Master. I still wonder why they made this card in the first place. Imagine this card still existed now. Just no.
It does exist, in the form of Judgement of the Pharaoh. But that is basically a gimmicky joke deck card that requires you to have Unity or Yu-Jo Friendship to get the full range of effects.
It’s shorts exist as Vendread Battlelord, which to think people complained it was not exactly like Shock Master. Especially since some Drytron variants used it to stop hand traps.
Shueisha technically made it. For the longest time, they didn’t care to balance the cards because they had no experience in doing so. They just slapped them together to promote non-TCG YGO products and were happy when the cards were a reason said products sold. And Konami couldn’t say no because Shueisha as the rights holder could yank the license away next time contract renewals were up. They communicate better these days at least.
Also the rest of the cards mentioned in this video were all Konami’s doing. It’s just that Shock Master was the one exception so I figured I’d say something.
For Shock Master: Special summon one per duel, Effect once per turn and speed spell 2 but only for that one turn, 5 material (fairy-type) and the cost is 3, can’t be used for any material.
Or... Make it so it affects both players with a hard once per turn, and must be xyz summoned normally
@@simongobbato7758 yes, a hard once per turn. I also forgot about 75
@@chasepak7933 all it needed was the once per dual, the other shit makes it unplayable because why would summon something that takes 5 materials to summon, even links are more fair than that
@@sdbzfan1 my reason being is the way it was originally put into. Having a full nullified of any can be abused in a way, and even with the errata, it could possibly be limited, maybe
I say we go full shit-post and require 7 materials; you have to use a Rank-Up-Magic or somehow get an extra link with Level 4 monsters to Xyz summon it. (Rank-Up-Magic Astral Force + Herald of Pure Light)
I've seen it said in a lot of these videos that they can never print more cards that copy graveyard effects because of how clearly broken that effect is (obviously citing Tyrant Neptune and Starving Venom) but I mean, Phantom of Chaos is out here doing just fine. It can clearly be done in a balanced way.
Somehow the Phantom of Chaos effect actually insulates itself from the broken stuff really well, not being able to deal combat damage, banishing the target and also copying the target's attack value is really good card design considering how long ago it was printed. After that, the fact that it's only level 4 has been pure luck for keeping it out of trouble, a Phantom of Chaos Nightingale can still burn for 2000 (before level changing trickery) but it banishing the Nightingale means you can't just make 4 copies despite it not having a hard once per turn.
The Wind Witch fusion monster also copies effects in the grave but it is difficult to bring out turn 1 as you need to make a level 7 synchro as fusion material beforehand. It could become broken later though.
Technically speaking supreme king dragon could be unbanned if they made it like hundred eye dragon
"since Konami don't really like to design pendulum monster anyway"
Alexa this is so sad play invisible
des-pa-
They did make the Doremichord archetype & a Cyberse Pendulum monster and some generic Pend cards though.
@@randomprofile5853 They’ve made more rituals monsters recently than pendulums, I’m pretty sure. Or at least it feels like it. My guess is that since pendulums are naturally overly wordy, they’re inherently more complex of a card type than any other so they’re difficult to design properly. Remember that most players are casual and many of those are turned off by seeing multiple paragraphs on a card.
@@MrZer093 I wouldn't call them complex, because they are fairly basic, most comments come from ex-players who still think they are "broken" and "complex". In OCG I think that Pendulums are actually rogue & people enjoy them, plus next year is Arc V's 5th anniversary since it ended so I wouldn't be suprised if they would make more Pendulum support & archetypes.
Odd-Eyes Vortex Dragon was the go-to monster for pendulums with Agarpain. I miss those days
Well agarpain really lives up to its name "pain"
"This world shall know pain" Lmao
@@Yami_Duelist
"My pain... IS STILL FAR GREATER THAN YOURS!!!"
It Agarpain(s) me to say I got this joke from its effect text. No Agarpain, no gain.
Love this video so chill even I'm not playing Yu-Gi-Oh competitively and not playing for 8 years due to in our country this game isn't popular but I love watching this video I feel very relax.☺️
I recommend playing online on yugioh nexus for free, you can play against the computer
@@sully571 the computer plays competitively for some reason… and it’s near impossible to find a random person to play “casual” with…. Hell even casual uses the same bullcrap that the competitive players use.
@@falconrvn7018 I play a 60 card nostalgia deck (buster blader, heroes, black luster soldier, abc, utopia) and I rape the computer all the time, I'm also 50% wins on ranked with the same deck, if you want I'll show you my replays. Yugioh is extremely reasonable I promise you.
@@sully571 What?!? Goddamn… are your for real!!?… tbh that’s the best thing I’ve heard from a random person… I mean for yu-gi-oh stuff… in a while .. lol….. yeah I’d love to see it.
@@falconrvn7018 also the other fun thing, I play single copies of every card apart from 3 blue eyes and 2 polymerization
Realizing that Shock Master effect is actually stronger than VFD is...
Shocking
Cocks gun take that pun back
It's not though. Vfd is a quick effect and it's a big body so it typically will stay around
@@jimthekidd a quick effect being better is not really relevant here since shock Master can effect the opponent's turn out of the box anyway.
On TOP of that, he can also be used to shut down spell or trap cards if you run into a deck that focuses on them (Sky Strikers, for example), which makes it more flexible.
@@Mernom maybe I forgot to add. People like there's not other cards that lock out spells/traps. They also try an act like yugioh as a whole isn't shutting off a part of the game for the opponent. All these other negates, unaffected monsters, backrow that floodgates. God forbid we bring back another monster that floodgates as if there isn't many many many many others. Difference is this one has a few outs and nowadays really would be fine at 1. People seem to forget how hard shock master loses to backrow if they call monster eldlich would eat it alive. Altergiest would laugh at it. An they would have to call monster because of nib that's 4 of 5 summons already. Meaning they are even more susceptible to backrow.
@@jimthekidd 2300 is more than enough when your opponent is not playing Yugioh
Tempest magician was seeing fairly decent success as a backup option in endymion magicians because with Mythical Beast Jackal king getting 2 counters per spell, getting the required counters to ftk was super easy.
Just wanted to say thanks to this channel. Helped me back into YGO 2 years ago by explaining competitive cards and effects etc, couldn't be more grateful for helping get back into the hobby
Zarc: so you can ban my venom counter part, but not me? I have protection, 4k atk, and can nuke the opponent’s field at the start.
Z-ARC doesn't really tend to be used for FTK's, not only that, he's definitely way harder to get out than Starving Venom..
Zarc is much more difficult to pull out and cant be cheated out
Z-ARC dies to a big turtle
I made a Pendulum Magician deck that has Zarc as part of it's strategy. But it takes so long that I either win or was defeated before I could get everything in the graveyard to pull off the summon
@@popstarchamp big fax, the only time i lost to a Z-Arc centric deck was when i was playing a deck full of slow burn spells and no monsters
Here are two ideas for number 86:
1- The summoning condition are two or more (up to five) “Heroic” monsters
2- You cannot have any other monsters on the field, except “heroic” monster
So heroics get to keep their boss monster and we don’t have to deal with an annoying floodgate effect being in every deck
I liked the higher detail, but I get that some of them are pretty simple to understand.
You're good at explaining things and it's cool to listen to while I'm eating breakfast/lunch or cooking. Many of the cards bring me back to the old days of the game as well haha.
On the topic of fixing Supreme King Starving Venom, an easy errata would just be adding a OPT clause and “your opponent takes no damage from card effects for the rest of the turn”. Still allows some crazy interactions, but the card was clearly designed with those in mind.
Rhongomyniad is one of those cards that probably should stay banned, since there’s no easy way to fix its inherently broken effect. Removing one of its effects entirely is not something Konami would do, since they don’t like outright removing effects from cards to errata them
Rhongo and Tempest suffer from not being future proff as Rhongo would be difficult to summon with more than 3 materials consistently and Tempest relying on spell counters sucks but thanks to other cards they can cheat their effects pretty easily and consistently so its sad to see
@@sdbzfan1 Rhongo wasn’t supposed to be easy to summon. It just happens to work with Gossip Shadow. I think one way to fix it would be to just make it HARDER to summon. How about “this card cannot be summoned using an Xyz monster as one of its materials” that way it keeps its original effect but it can’t be used with Gossip Shadow, the actual problem card.
Tempest has the same problem. It wasn’t supposed to be easy to add tons of spell counters to her, because when she first debuted, spell counters were still a crummy mechanic. The real problem was Selene, she just happens to work with her. Like DuelLogs said, the fix is simple, just add a cap to her effect damage to make it hard to FTK with her, and a hard once per turn so that players don’t try to get clever and simply summon more copies of Tempest. That would fix it.
@@brianaguilar8283 i would say rhongo should have its 1 and 3 effect swaped since if its emune to card effects the moment it is summon then number 75 cant add materials to it, and if that doesnt work, just make it so it cant have materials added to it artificially either by spell cards, trap cards or monster effects
@@sdbzfan1 that also works, and it’s not technically removing any of its effects.
There’s a simple fix, just make it’s materials exclusively Heroic monsters. That card is still powerful in its own deck, but it can’t be splashed into a Warrior deck that isn’t Heroics.
Random fact, but I found out today that Tempest Magician’s effects are slightly different across the OCG and TCG.
Here in the TCG, Tempest Magician “discards” cards in your hand, but in the OCG she only “sends cards in your hand to the GY.”
Since in the OCG she only sends cards into the graveyard and doesn’t discard, it wouldn’t trigger the effects of Danger! and Fabled cards, so it seems she is slightly weaker over there.
Guess they thought that would balance. It didn't.
@@Kefkaownsall To be fair, the fact that her effect required spell counters made her a balanced card until the new Endymion cards got released ten years after her.
@@3flax554 I meant pre emptively banning. I mean forget Selene mr5 was already potentially gonna cause issues
You mean it's like Gandora X?
With number 86, you could probably fix it by capping the materials to 5, then making it detach TWO materials each turn. That way it wouldn't be able to keep the floodgate for more than 1 turn, and in two turns it would be useless. Might still be a bit strong even with that though...
Alternatively, as a quick effect during the main phase, you detach up to 5 material to gain the corresponding effects. It would STILL be overpowered in they fact that 1 turn of summoning shutdown is more than enough to win a game, as proven by some decks that tech in Heat Wave, but it would have more counterplay since the opponent could use turn priority to Kaiju it immediately before it ever gets a chance to activate his effects, or you can set a floodgate like Threatening Roar to survive another turn, as well as some form of backrow-based negates to stop your opponent from dropping another one.
@@joanaguayoplanell4912 yeah if it was a quick effect it would be fired off in the standby phase
I was going through your playlists so I can be up to date with the Why it's Banned series before watching this one and I never would've suspected you were a vocaloid fan.
As a zarc pendulum magician player we hate those fricken birds
So many cards banned in that era…..
@@johnathanlemus5584 dark times
@@ΆρηςΟικονόμου-χ1σ we’re still in dark times for pendulums. Electrumite may not come back but maybe my bro astrograph can comeback to at least help, now that’s wishful thinking
@@johnathanlemus5584 man if astrograph does t come but I am gonna start a riot in the Konami headcourters
Imagine a card going from being able to cheat an easy negate to cheating a non-effect 4.5k beatstick
Fist of the unrivaled tenyi
Currently revisiting this playlist to learn new MasterDuel tech. I’ve definitely been hit with that number 86 Rongo combo play a couple times on the ladder
Wait, Rongo is free in master duel?
@@runman624 Yeah, same for Calamities and Union Carrier. Among many, many cards that should be banned. Master Duel is wild.
I loved when you showed how broken zoodiac broadbull was. The example was explain and i'd love to see more of that.
IMO Konami should change Rhongomyniads effect to "your opponent cannot normal or special summon summon monsters on your side of the field." That would still be a powerful effect but nowhere near as BS.
If I had a dollar every time DuelLogs said Supreme King Dragon Starving Venom in its place in the top, I'd be rich.
3:11
I was one of two people who played Crusadia Guardragon at YCS Chicago 2019. Hot RDA Abyss was my choice over Crystal Wing not because of the ability to pick any card on the field. It's that Hot RDA Abyss does not have to respond directly to chains, unlike Crystal Wing, which has to respond in chain to a monster
Also the Tenyi counter trap has a waking-esque effect that summons a non-effect monster from the extra deck, meaning Blue Eyes Ultimate Dragon
I've done the tempest magician otk with the regular Endymion deck long before the new support (and consistently)
(17:50) When I was creating a fanmade Zombie archetype based on famous or iconic Number monsters (long story short: it was a pun based on the idea of an innumerable zombie hoard), I found just doubling the required number of materials for each of Rhongomyniad's effects went quite some distance to keep his effects in check.
Another funny idea though is if you give Rhongomyniad out-right protection against targeting effects (i.e. "Cannot be targeted for effects"), Gossip Shadow would be unable to target him - and I find the concept of balancing a card by buffing it more pretty darn hilarious.
(Sorry for third comment, figured since they were separate trails of thought I'd post them as separate comments)
For reference on how doubling the required number of materials on Rhongomyniad would still keep those effects accessible, Six Samurai turbo can easily go into Gossip Shadow with 5 Level 3 monsters and still have room to make Rhongomyniad after, which would - for example - take a 2 material Rhongomyniad to 8 materials.
You can also further that with cards like Overlay Regen (though they would have to be used on Gossip Shadow, since Rhongomyniad becomes unaffected by other cards at 3+ materials).
The best-most-direct answer I've gotten why SK Starving Venom and Nightingale are unbanned in the OCG is Maxx C so modern players can draw into handtraps and punish FTK decks mid-combo. Maxx C in general pushed the OCG into a mid-game grind, which is why more extenders (Denglong, Tempest) could stay in the game and why Red-Eyes Dragoons was feared even more than in the TCG as an easy indestructible omni negate held insane value.
Cool info
Neat list video! I like that you're handle more cards per video now! Thanks for uploading!
As a beginner, my first reaction is confusion, because several of these cards are legal in Master Duel. But at least I can understand why they are in the TCG banlist (Rhongo PTSD soon)
Rhongo shouldn't be banned
As someone who's been watching yugioh recently but not playing, these sorta lists are pretty good to catch up
I like how you said Number 86's full name EVERY. SINGLE. TIME.
Definitely like the detailed videos more. Better than here is a card. It was op. Here's another it was also op. Context is great.
My Favorite way to summon Supreme King Dragon Staving Venom is to have no monsters while my opponent has 2, use Odd-Eyes Fusion with Odd-eyes Venom Dragon and 1 other. That way I can use it's effect to copy Odd-eyes Venom Dragon then use the copied effect on the opponent's monster that either has the better effect or higher attack (depends on situation).
For Rhongo, maybe give it the restriction so that it can only be summoned using Heroic monsters?
Those poor Heroics lost their boss monster.
Or ban Gossip Shadow as it has an effect that can break future link monsters by stacking material on anything.
How did rhongo even get printed. Like with the new card, numbers eveil, it’s just like how did these cards get printed?
*RhongoBongo laughing in Master Duel*
For Agarpain, if it were a Link-3 that required 3 materials, that could slow it down a lot. Also, make it either negate the effects of whatever it summons and/or prevent any more special summoning for the rest of the turn.
might need both of those things cuz with the way dragon link has evolved, making it requiring one more dragon isn't making a difference
dragon link can easily put three dragons on the field without losing advantage
Since different cards value Spell Counters differently, any card that can use Spell Counters between cards risks being broken like Tempest Magician. (A good analogy is to think of them as different currencies, and Tempest Magician can spend any of them as its currency.) Konami either has to make sure that no card has Spell Counters be low-valued like Selene, or avoid cards like Tempest Magician; the latter is a better solution than the former for future card design.
Best Yu-Gi-Oh UA-camr! Love your Voice!
#86 decks suck to play against so much, like they aren’t big enough to otk so you either scoop or pass one or two turn
Definitely enjoying the more cards per video when it's cards like this but do go into detail on more difficult cards to explain if you want
An idea for unbanning supreme king venom is making only work on the opponent's GY. Then it would be more of a niche counter or mirror match card
That was probably the intended use for it
the fun thing about tempest magician is that cloudians have a trap that does the exact same thing while also have access to spells that can load up the field with fog counters if there are enough monsters present. but just because its so inconsistent no one plays it. so modern spell counter support is what really made it broken
I feel like starving venom could get off the banlist if they have the effect copying be a hard once per turn, since you need 2 copies to copy independent nightingales effect to do the FTK, also I feel like for the tyrant Neptune as well the only reason these two cards are banned is because of independent nightingale, so I feel like if we just ban that card it would fix it IMO
The issue isn't only that Nightingale is a menace to strong copying-other-monters effects, but that it would cause long-term issues when designing cards, to the point that banning the copying monsters becomes an inevitability. Yeah, it's technically the copied cards' fault, but you can't simply ban every future offender and not realize that maybe you're better off without the ones copying them.
They should make the effect copying like hundred eye dragon
Oh that’s why there are still band thanks for sharing this for the understanding of these cards.
They could make Rhongo Myniad gain effects only with "Heroic Challenger" XYZ materials. This way he won't be a problem until Heroic Challengers be a Meta Deck.
17:42 How I would fix *"Number 86: Heroic Champion - Rhongomyniad":*
1) Make that you need to detach 1 Xyz material at the End Phase itself.
2) Make the 4 Xyz materials effect as it floodgates also you from further summonings and not only your opponent (so it became a final boss monster card you summon at the end of your combos).
3) If it's still too op, maybe make its summoning condition as 3 or more level 4 Warrior-type monsters and make it that it can't be summoned in other ways.
4) Drastic measure (panic button): make it that you can't activate other card effects after its summoning for the rest of the turn.
Please do a top 10 cards that are banned in the TCG but are not banned in the OCG.
Also try to explain why they are not banned in the OCG.
Fun fact about Rhongomyniad. Its 5 material effect can't actually be activated if it has 6 or more materials; as its 1 through 4 material effects all stipulated "[X] or more:" (or "[X]+" on the errata). But the 5th effect can only be activated if it strictly has exactly 5 materials due to lacking that extra "or more"/"+" clause.
I don't play competitively so this is all really interesting to me. I don't keep up with banlists or meta stuff like that so this is a great way to understand why certain cards are banned. I always wondered why dragon link was so broken and now I know. Pretty crazy how busted some of these cards and combos are.
When You are done with the banned cards, can You make a segment about errata'd cards that were on the banlist or were part of their combos?
And ask the questions : "What if they had their original effects?" And ""Do they still ser play?"
Poor Future Fusion, they did you dirty.
@@HarveyDangerLurker yes, but it is like a foolish burial on steroids. If You wanted to summon five headed dragon or chimeratech overdragon, it is at least a +5 with the graveyard effects.
Future Fusion still can be used to... fuse. Like it was intended to.
@@mateusrp1994 , Me and most people used it as a Painful Choice. If Future Fusion actually went through as intended we wouldn't know what to do.
@@HarveyDangerLurker I remember my high school friends let me use its original effect since I still had the pre-errata card and didn't even know the effect got changed. Here I am running my 2008 blue-eyes/dragon deck with a few random new cards I managed to get sprinkled in, unable to understand why sending cards to the graveyard is good. At that time I thought using ancient rules or kidmodo dragon to get out a blue-eyes on my first turn was absolutely OP
Ok, did I miss electrumite in a previous video? Because I really want to know why it’s banned. Also, in the case of Rhongominyad and some other cards, they aren’t the problem and the other card is the one that should be fixed or banned. Get rid of Gossip shadow and he’d be good.
Rhongo was slowly getting stronger, as getting a full board was getting easier. Plus, his effects are timeless, so they don't lose to power creep.
For Tempest Magician; would lowering the burn damage to 100 be another fix for it or no?
Yeah that would work too
Hey DuelLogs huge fan of your content... Id like to propose a video idea of Top 10 Overlooked archetypes with potential such as Ojama for an example or Top 10 decks with more than one archetype like Zombies and Lightsworn for example ! Thanks for the knowledge and information you constantly share with us as well much gratitude...
I think a video explaining the Divine Wind FTK, aka the infamous deck where they hit everything but the actual issue, including banning Stratos.
I remember used Shock Master with the Star Seraph archetype , was so broken because with Star Seraph Scepter you could target one card on the field and destroy it and draw one card and Star Seraph Scepter when is summoned can search one Star Seraph monster from the deck and if you had Star Seraph Sovereignty in your hand you can special summon and draw one card and if you search another Star Seraph Sovereignty through Star Seraph Scepter's effect you can special summon from your hand and draw another card , so you could easily bring out at least 3 monsters on the field and special summon Shock Master and draw 3 cards all in 1 turn .
I think if Tempest Magician only lost its own spell counters, it'd be fine, as then you'd have to find ways to put spell counters onto it.
Honestly,I think Tempest Magician's burn damage could just be significantly reduced and given a hard once per turn,I can't see it not coming back. It won't be completely useless either, seeing as even Gagaga Cowboy saw massive competitive play throughout the years simply by having just a little burn damage to finish off the game.
For Number 16 : Shock Master, adding a gamble effect would make it still as powerful, but inconsistent. (Like, 1-2 = Monster, 3-4 = Spell and 5-6 = Trap.)
Why is number 86 unbanned in ocg? Even with maxx c at 3 and many hand traps, getting out 86 can win the maxx c challenge.
One rule change to eliminate most ftks, the player who goes first cannot burn their opponents life points
If a monster effect is activated that requires your opponent to take burn damage, it could still be used and the burn effect would resolve however no lp would be deducted (in order for any possible deck to still function and not be unplayable unintentionally)
I don’t know why they never thought of this but it would solve a lot of problems and would allow some cards to immediately come off the ban list
This is all my opinion but the The best way to fix Agarpain is to have it as a once per dual (for tournament reasons) and the card that was special summoned leaves the field at the end of the turn it was summoned. The best way to fix Supreme King Dragon Starving Venom is to allow it to only copy Dragon Pendulum monsters and for this turn only when summoned is to gain the attack of the monster and the turn after to copy an effect of a monster once per duel. The best way to fix Tempest Magician is to have her effect to remove counters one 1 card and the effect can only be activated once per 2 turns. The best way to fix Number 16: Shock Master is to have it as a once per turn and detach all materials while keeping it at 3. The best way to fix Number 86: Heroic Champion - Rhongomyniad is removing the unaffected by other cards effect and replace it with either destroy or ban a card on your field and make the 4 materials can't special summon more than 3 monsters and add an effect of if a material isn't removed destroy this card or ban this card but like I said this is all my opinion
Limiting Agarpain to only enabling only that 1 summon for the turn is probably the best way to go about having such an effect tbh, but for added measure it could also only work if 2 additional monsters are pointing to a zone it's also pointing too (requiring 3 monsters to point to the same zone).
Locking Starving Venom to only dark pendulums would still leave potential pot holes for future card design, so prevent it from inflicting burn damage for the turn if it's effect is used, and from keeping the effects until the next turn so it doesn't have the ability to benefit so much from gained protections.
Tempest should absolutely receive a cap on how much burn damage it can do, say max. 1500, as well as making it a hard once per turn, so it can be used as a sort of game ending alternate win con card, without making it almost completely useless given there are way better spell counter generating cards in the game for it to see play otherwise.
Change Shock Master to only negate the first card of what it declares during the opponent's turn as a hard once per turn effect (similar to how the Magician's Hand's/ Spiritual Art Ichirin spell cards work), it then becomes a decent but not overly stupid Xyz monster, there is also the option of allowing the opponent to complete an action, such as discarding a card/paying LP etc... to negate its effect similarly to how cards like the Dark and Light Spiritual arts or Fairy Tail Luna work.
I'd argue you could change Rhongomyniad to only having targeting protection and change it's effect of locking summons to destroying (not negating) 1 summoned monster your opponent plays, it has a decent pay off and isn't completely unfair to play against in this state.
You know what would fix cards that can copy effects? If they could copy any effect in the GY… specifically copying from your Opponent’s GY. That way it’s requires your Opponent to give you a card that’s useful to copy
I think that was the intended purpose of the card
@@ragnaricstudios5888 yeah but they didn't think that players would abuse would copy their own cards
I still have my Number 86 secret rare from World Superstars. It's insane how OP it is and Starving Venom, it's just broken.
On Rongomyniad they could possibly change the 4+ effect to have the cost that requires all its materials and only lasts until the end of the turn.
Or they could also make the 4+ effect trigger upon summon and only last until the end of the next turn.
That might fix it.
Agarpain could be fixed by just targeting either other Guardragons or World Chalice dragons. It's obvious that they want this effect to work with the over archetype of World Chalice cause lore. Just lock it to be in archetype and it would do wonders to fix it.
Adding a new line to some broken negate cards of "cannot be used/summoned on the first turn of the duel" would go a long way in fixing them. Prevents the whole "not letting the going second player play the game"
That heroic champion xyz can be fixed by making the materials require heroic champions only instead of generic warriors
Rongo's 4th effect could be changed to Winda's floodgate effect: both players can only special summon once per turn. then, he should have "cannot be destroyed" instead of unaffected so he can still be sent or tributed away by something
been waiting for this episode
_ahem_
UNLOCK THE SHOCK 2021
Independent nightingale can probably be given an effect that this card's effects can't be used by monsters that don't have the same name as this card
So that copying is no longer an issue,skdsv get unbanned and copying the effect will mostly requires something that copies the name like Odd-eyes venom dragon (this monster copies both the name and effect but can only copy from opponent Monsters in the field) to make it "perfectly balanced"
For shockmaster would it being reciprocal make it able to be unbanned. Since that would be powerful but also prevent you from doing new interrupts on their turn unless you have spells or traps.
For Rhongo if you restricted its xyz mats to heroic monsters would that help?
Yup Rhongo is too generic. It was the most played of it archetype
Another way to fix Rhongo: bump up its maintenance cost. If it were to lose more material more often, then it wouldn't be completely invincible for too long and there would be a chance for some counterplay. My suggestion would be two materials during each End Phase, though something similar could also work.
Top 10 cards which got banned/limited the fastest.
Monsters like these are the reason I try to fit solemn judgement into almost all My decks
another eratta to unban agarpain would be to include agarpain the 2 or more link monsters points to a monster zone. For starving venom another restrictions could be that it must be fusion summoned and you cannot use other effects for the rest of the turn. Tempest can change the needed materials to spellcasters that you can place on them spell counters (yes, there's a spellcaster tuner that you place spell counters on it), also selene can chnage her materials to only spellcasters that you can place spell counters on them. Shock master can have the restriction of hard once per turn instead of soft. Gossip shaddow can have it materials to be exactly 6 (good luck with that) and rongo detach 1 material during the start of each phase.
Please, I wanna try Tempest Magician in my Endymion deck PLEASE Konami xD
Also, could you perhaps make a series in the future about the limited cards aswell? I feel like some of them could go to 3 without any problems, idk I'd just like to see a detailed series about it!
One way to fix Rhongomyniad would be to change it's 4+ effect to only prevent normal, not special summoning. That way it's still a major floodgate while being more reasonable.
I've always thought shock master was a perfect example of why the entire game needs to be redone. On paper, shock master has a very balanced effect, but because they've poured all their time and energy into monster effects instead of properly balancing the game shock master was made very overpowered. Honestly, i think it would do the game a lot of good if they basically just scrapped it and started over, or just decided to ban every card released after the gx era since that's when the game started to get really bad.
Nostalgia glasses for the last part
this video gave me 2018 war flashbacks
The heroic champion can be fixed if they made it that you have to detach a number of materials for the selected effect (like detach 3 xyz materials to become immune or detach 5 to lock your opponent from summoning) and the activation is not once per turn just to not ruin the card and also keep the maintenance cost.
Are we gonna get a 5 hour movie when this series is finished?
ah, Shock Master what a day when its still up
#2 there was already a card that could do that, it just banished the card from the graveyard and was super hard to bring out, it also didnt have a limit to targets, so its possible that's why they felt this effect was ok