Ep. 054 - Ammunition, Demystified with Jeff Siewert
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- Опубліковано 11 січ 2023
- On this episode, Seth and Jayden are joined in the studio by long-time friend and Systems Engineer, Jeff Siewert. Jeff recently retired from the ballistics field where he spent his entire adult life. He authored a book titled, “Ammunition, Demystified The (non) Bubba’s Guide to How Ammo Really Works”. On the show, the guys talk about some of Jeff's interesting stories through his career and Jeff shares some insight on the practices and principles in the small arms field. We hope you enjoy this educational episode!
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I'm amazed that over hundred years ago ballisticians found a cartridge alloy that had the proper elasticity, lubricity and Young's modulus.
This is formal request for a gain twist episode.
Second
I know gain twist is harder to make and little more expensive but if you want more velocity and less pressure and more precision and less recoil then use gain twist
Third
Gain twist please… right vs left as well.
Requesting gain twist as well
These podcasts, internal, external ballistics, sample size and this one have revamped my whole reloading process. Ordering his book today. Keep em coming
Will do! Thanks!
"Nothin funner than dropping pigs" best quote of the podcast. Great one guys!
😀
I'm so glad you guys read the book, so I don't have to! :) It is awesome getting to listen to the stories, and to glean the information from your experiences, so I am grateful for you taking the time to share this with us - with me - because I can't read the way I used to 30 years ago, in college - now I learn better by watching videos like this, so you've made a world of difference for me. Cheers!
Our pleasure!
I purchased Jeff's book just the other day it is in the mail! I had not heard of him until your show. What a fantastic resource for a life long reloader.
Congratulations! You guys are top shelf in the transferring of good information to the masses. Your talks on bullet drag, ballistics internal and external and some of the stuff that your latest guest, Jeff, is outstanding. Keep up the great work and thank you again.
Thanks for watching and the kind words.
I like the content of this particular video, but what I MOST LIKE IT. was the respect for the elder. Thank you for being a good example, guys.
Glad you enjoyed it
Another incredible podcast. The Ammunition Demystified is certainly on my list.
We appreciate you watching!
What a great introduction to a very technical topic! This is not art .. it is SCIENCE (with a dabbling of art mixed in). Thanks for putting together such a great Podcast. Hats off to Jeff Siewert for his depth of knowledge and willingness to share it with all of us!
Glad you enjoyed it!
Wow, thanks guys - Jeff is an incredible wealth of knowledge, really enjoyed this. Of course I am buying the book now..
I watched a video on gun myths about 30 years ago that some guy with a gun shop produced and brush busting bullets was one of the myths. He made a stand that held some small twigs, roughly pencil diameter-ish horizontally and he shot through it with a variety of rifles. He had a target 3 feet in front and 3 feet behind the brush and the rifle was placed in a rest so the bullet would pass through both targets. After aiming the rifle and placing the brush he fired. Even the 50 BMG keyholed completely sideways in only three feet... I don't shoot through branches at game.
The one mistake I made was to load a solid copper bullet with the same charge as the same weight lead core bullet. I did so when they were fairly new, and I didn't search hard enough for data. The solid copper takes a lower charge to get the same pressure. I had to send my gun in to have the bolt repaired as it was over pressured and would no longer extract the empties after three shots.
Book arrived today. Look forward to reading ! Thanks for the heads up !
Enjoyed. I appreciate having discussions with knowledgeable professionals. Great book.
Much appreciated!
Awesome podcast, excellent guest,, I ordered the book. Thanks.
I live near an artillery range. Their big guns use one yellow bag to keep the range short. They have hit one civilian house since I have lived here (1975).
Ten minutes into this EXCELLENT discussion I went to AbeBooks and ordered Mr Siewert's book.
Very educational!
I would be highly interested in hearing a podcast on the .204 ruger, why it was developed and what it brings to the table over other options because there is not a ton of people who have discussed it in length
We plan to do one!
Again what a wonderful podcast. Answers again so many questions but at the same time generates so many more. With your experience in test reloading you folks know so much about powders can you make podcast about powder dynamics?
Just diving in, excited for the show!
Hope you enjoy!
Ordered the e-book. Looking forward to the read.
Just ordered on Amazon can't wait for it to arrive
The most interesting and informative podcast so far from a hands on standpoint but it predicates a question for the trio to answer please for me:
I determine a load for my 6.5PRC using a certain powder and Berger 130VLD Fed 210 primer N165 59.2grains and I eventually obtain a three shot group giving 0.30
I then load another ten
I clean the barrel thoroughly and religiously after every 10shots.
Using this data obtained I then proceed to shoot a fouler after letting the rifle and ammo to adjust to sit outside to adjust to the particular ambient temperature invariably 3-7C at this time of year most mornings.
I then fire off the fouler to warm and foul the barrel then proceed to shoot my next three /three shot groups resulting in a 0 40/0.50/0.30
SD across the nine shots is 8 and the ES was 12
This predicates the question
Are these results a fluke?
Can I assume that combination on that particular day weather conditions prevailing is capable of a consistent at least 0.5" group of three?
The next day little or no wind again I shoot a 0.4 then 0.3 and think I'm good to go and load out 40
I then shoot several deer out to 325yds ok deer size target
What's your take on this please. It took 21 rounds excluding foulers for which I use some very little used old design to get to where I got the 0.30" first group changing powder weight slightly and seating depth backed off from jam
Outstanding! Thank you!
Excellent podcast, as always very interesting and informative presentation, thank you for your time and effort sharing this with us.
Glad you enjoyed it!
This Bubba got this book to see what inside I would like to know, holy crap! This book is great! I might not get all information as some is a little beyond my education, but wow, it will open your eyes to just what you don’t know.
Another informative pod cast. I’ve purchased book for kindle and before reading I re-read the first 100 pages of my Hornady manual. Looking forward to the next podcast
Good stuff
You guys just keep killing it. Great great work!
Thanks so much!
Enjoyed your Erik Cortina talk.
Read Ammunition Demystified on Jayden Quinlan's recommendation. Covers internal and external ballistics very well. The sequence of events before, during and after combustion are detailed. The many aspects of dispersion are explained. The what and how of dynamic and gyroscopic stability are covered. Components are covered. Practical statics and measuring variability are covered. Why error budgets are useful. Included are war stories from actual experience.
Another great episode.
Cool information and very interesting!! when it was mentioned that a five shot group was needed. I wonder how much barrel heating plays into dispersion
Ha, I didn't get through the whole podcast and I stopped, went to Amazon and bought the book. This won't be the last time I watch this podcast either.
Some interesting ideas there. I've always wondered how a hollow projectile would perform with something like a gas check to get it started that then falls away.
Great podcast, just the book I'm looking for.
Thanks for listening
Great interview fellas
Very interesting chat... love these.
@53:00, Jeff talk about barrel ID expanding... but then mentions why is that expansion less at the muscle end vs the chamber...
just a thought... at chamber pressure = higher, space = lowest leading to expansion = highest, as the bullet moves down the barrel, aka the area between case and bullet expands/are of impact grows larger, but with larger space and same volume of gas = reduce pressure = reduced barrel ID/OD expansion.
can be totally off the target here.
Outstanding show. Keep it up dudes
Thanks! Will do!
The brush gun theory derived from having a short compact firearm. Not for shooting through brush, and people took it the wrong way, the rest is history.
Another great pod cast
Thanks for listening
A big question occurred to me when Mr. Siewert said he is having a 30-06 built: Is he using the SAAMI chamber or a "match" chamber? Almost all recent cartridges use a tight-freebore followed by a 1.5° half-angle throat-style chamber. Some people who use custom barrels, even for older cartridges like the 30-06 or even the 280 AI which have a SAAMI chamber without a freebore section.
Great conversation
great technical info.
Amazing content, thank you.
Glad you enjoyed it!
Went right to scamazon and bought a hardcover copy of Jeff's book...... even if I only enjoy it as a read once , I know someday I'll pass it on to someone who will appreciate it like the bible.
Pretty new to reloading. Just out of curiosity since seating or shot weight really don’t matter. What do you guys recommend. Loading max OAL and and near max charge? Love the pod cast. Thanks for sharing all the data
If the brush is right close to the deer it's not bad. b but if u hit brush several yards before the deer the bullet won't hit it probably
Fascinating thank you
Glad you enjoyed it
Great information!
Thanks for watching!
The marketing department bullet design reminds me the story of the Savage .250-3000 cartridge. Charles Newton wanted to develop ammunition with longer, heavier, 100 gr or heavier bullets for the Model 99 leveraction. The marketing department wanted to advertise a 3000 fps cartridge regardless of the utility of the lighter bullets.
First time I ve been able to understand transsonic "change"
Jayden, I see what you mean about this Jeff, he is an ace....'bout my age too.
I will look for his book
Some hints on some interesting stuff expressed there, guess a fella will have to take a look at the book. Probably see a pretty good spike on sales this next month or so.
Absolutly the „right stuff“ 👍🏻. Greetings from Germany
Hello there!
@@hornady watched/listend to all Ballistic Podcasts you put out so far. Several times while commuting. Great wealth of Information. I got my explosives permit for reloading in 88‘ and still you made me raise an eyebrow several times making me rethink my sop‘s.
Your tech Department has an e mail with a video clip from me concerning 120gn .264 CX bullets. Waiting for some input.
Guy's I know everyone an there brother wants to be a long range shooter . Myself I grew out of it. What I'm wanting to know is when are u going to bring back the small bore bullets. 172 25gr hollow point. Berger discontinued there 25gr target bullet sierra is a no go nosler don't make one Speer we been trying to get them on board. Hornady 25gr. 17 cal hollow point was the best why discontinued it
lmao jeff got me, i'm the engineering type who bought his book haha, honestly I'm starting to think shooting is just golf for engineers.
Very informative podcast! As a shooting nerd, I find the ballistic topics very interesting.
Regarding ideas for future podcast topics, perhaps some discussion of the development of some of the heavy hitters would be interesting. Specifically, the 375 & 416 Rugers, and the breathing of new life into some of nitro express cartridges, and the influence of Craig Boddington on the same. Maybe get ole Craig on the show!
I realize these cartridges are more specialized and lack the broad appeal, but personally I think listeners would find a big bore discussion interesting.
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Great Podcast 👀
Appreciate it!
👨🔬 I have some Powder Questions: 1.) Doesn't increased surface area, by the shape of the powder, increase the consistency of complete combustion? 2.) Aren't Ball Powders, because they have less surface area, not as reliable in providing as high of velocities because of incomplete combustion? 3.) If you were to used the principles of Geology, by using multiple sized balls for filling the pore spaces within the case (A Powder Compaction Method), you could fit more ball powder into the case - as to increase bullet velocities! 4.) Then, if you found the right "combustion combination" - between the little balls and big balls of powder - you could increase bullet velocities and accuracy! But, still do so, without overpressurizing the case! 5.) Isn't their a way to increase the surface area of Ball Powder "Like Shapes" (like pollution control equipment ceramic balls or those used in a catalytic cracker of a refinery) and using this "multi-size powder compaction method" - to increase both bullet velocity and accuracy - through better combustion methods? 6.) Or, improve powder combustion with the use of origami, for improved powder shapes and better combustion within the cartridge case? Your Thoughts? 🕵️♂️
I'm wondering why do 22LR have 1x16 twist? Is it related to velocity? VS a 22 center fire that have 1x9 10 11 or 12 twist
Most commonly used 22 centerfire bullets are heavier than most commonly used 22lr bullets. That's a big reason for difference in twist rates. Velocity? Not sure about that.
🙏🏼
How about a podcast on TAP ammo?
Does increasing twist rate increase recoil? This is a thought experiment I've been toying with, but can't full explain. I figured this would be a good place to find some people to sound board.
I think am thinking there is more recoil because the bullet would gain rotational energy. That increase in energy would ultimately result in more recoil. What i can't explain is how the physics would convert recoil into rotation??
Does nosler, swift , and Barnes have podcasts?
Ya know, I ordered textbooks a couple weeks ago. I could have slipped this one in…
🧐 I Have A Bullet Question: First, regarding the "Accuracy" of Lead Core Bullets vs. Monolithic Solid Copper Bullets! Jeff mentioned the expansion that takes place from within a lead core bullet (lead, of course, is more malleable, because it is softer) as it driven down the barrel! Does that changing of the shape of the bullet, in the way it expands, stabalize the bullet by changing the center of mass? Or, is it because lead is still denser than copper and it helps to stabilize the bullet better - due to the center of gravity of the bullet (because lead is denser than copper) ensuring that the center of mass of a shorter bullet prohibits as much wobble of the front of the bullet from happening? 🤔 Your thoughts? 🤷♂️
👨🏫 From a "physics standpoint", it only stands to reason that the farther away that the nose is from the center of mass of the bullet - once it starts to wobble - the harder it is to stabalize it! It is like the use if a Fulcrum - a "mechanical advantage" is gained by a longer one - so, it is easier to displace the load as the length of the fulcrum increases! Also, if the bullet expands - after hitting the lands - in a vertical direction and changing the shape of the bullet in the x-axis direction, then the harder it is to create a wobble on the tip of the bullet, as the bullet leaves the muzzle! Think of snow shoes - the wider the shoe, the easier it is to displace the weight (downward force sideways, in the opposite direction), by increasing the surface area! 🤔
I was worth watching just to hear someone say out loud that the 10-shot load development is absurd!
We are no different then our ancient ancestors, we are still throwing rocks. The difference is our rocks are much fancier.
Only 5 shots into an inch and you’re happy!? Only in America baby’s. 😂❤
Any chance of getting a regular FMJ projectile in 6.5mm for a more economical reloading option?
They have a 123 fmj that is sold through midsouth shooters supply it is an over run bullet
@@phillipbrandenburg2105 Thank you
I hope they take time out to answer my questions as this is the third time I’ve posted
"Isn't a bullet jusr a hunk of metal?" Only a woman would say that lol.
My response to that would be - "Isn't a house just four walls with a roof over it? Then why do we need an interior decorator?"
Thanks for another great podcast guys.
A bullet is a mechanically propelled rock...
Perhaps a call-in segment for people who do not like to type or people with in-depth technical questions
Thank you for the idea, John! In the meantime, feel free to give our Tech guys a call. They will gladly help with any questions & discussion - 1-800-338-3220
Duplex loads are not new. Elmer Keith was doing that before WW2. Gain twist has been around for a century. I agree with "inherent accuracy of a cartridge" as being fairy dust mythology. A bullet does not care or know what cartridge pushed it out the barrel. To say that a particular Cartridge generates a more accurate special kind of 60,000 PSI is basically a nonsensical Believe.
🙂 Justin, when that beard starts getting gray, you can always shave it off! 👩🦲 Hopefully they aren't working you to hard and I'm not making it any "grayer"? 🤷♂️ Good podcast! 👍 It also appears that I have a New Book to Buy! 👨🏫