I know you are poking fun, but you're 100% correct...ridiculous to think that you spend $10k+ on a bike then need to go spend another $5k in suspension alone to get it to handle well.
@blakesinclair488 it's not, but we have 2 yams, 2 Hondas and a ktm all 2022+ and the WP stuff is so much far off the kyb and showa stuff. I've put a fair amount of money into the WP and the front end is still nowhere near the kyb in compliance and traction. 2k for a kyb spring conversion on the most expensive bike on the market just to get it to handle confidently is a big chunk of coin.
I don't understand why people think Yamaha KYB is so good. I've ridden a bunch of them 06-24 and there's nothing special about them. Anything that is set up for you will be better, no question.
RaceTech Spring Conversion is about $600 and makes a Huge difference w/o any other changes, and hen a revalve if you like. I’m sure this is better but 600 vs 6000…
Serious racers only,--------------------with money. Some race teams too I am sure. I am 61 years old now and into this sport (still ride) since 1976. I feel so sorry for this generation on fantasy leagues and video games because they can't afford a bike or have a place to ride. It was pretty easy for any rural kid in the 70's through the mid 80's, with a low paying part time job, before most land got locked up.
I know from Mt. bike front suspension testing in the 90's, that if the front wheel can stay on the ground in those little choppy bumps, steering and control is greatly increased. Ross at Enzo is a sharp guy. When that generation is gone,---I fear there will not be many to replace those great thinkers. I know MXA is already gone. :)
Hate to be the grammar policeman..but the term is ...damping. Dampening is either to moisten something with a liquid or to diminish someone's feelings of joy or excitement. It;s a common mistake.
You missed his error when he spoke about the coatings on the forks. He said it reduces friction. Uhhh, no, Jeff. The coatings reduce STICTION. THAT is actually the proper term for it. (That's another common mistake.)
@@marvelaturraz5405 Nope, "stiction" means how much force it takes to start moving a seal from a static position and starting from it's natural setting. For this example, your bike is on the ground and you apply the front brake and push down on the handlebars. How much force it takes to start moving. Friction can not be had until something moves. The seal causes stiction. The movement causes friction. I would think the slick coating would reduce both.
Words mean something, and it is important to know what they mean. Luke down here, does not understand that yet. Politics is a great example (many words/phrases we use that have no objective definition, and mean something a bit different in all our minds.), of conversations we have that are "unintelligible", because we don't know exactly what the other is saying. In politics, it keeps us confused and divided. Pretty evil.
As a plus 50 A Vet rider I like the air forks on my Husky very much if you spend some time setting them up for your riding style they work well . And for the long vet moto's the local tracks give us ( 4 laps ) ill stick with my air forks.
135 lbs to 165 lbs? No wonder why my suspension was always so soft. :) Jeff was talking about not having to change spring rates, which is about every 30 lbs typically.
Awsome. The WP Air Forks is all that has turned me from a KTM OR GASGAS 150cc and a 300cc. With a good KYB Enzo, spring fork conversion changes the narrative. Had me looking at TM's 144cc and 300cc because lets face it if you pay the extra $1000 for a TM to come with their own custom rear suspension combined with having KYB spring forks already the TM'S come with the best suspension out of everything else. Problem is TM bikes are so damn expensive
The difference is only marketing, if we are buying china made junk. There are still some people who make good stuff that works, with plenty of time and money into development in complicated product. They are made with brains. If you made a product like that with your time and energy,---how would you sell it? When we make good stuff that people want to buy with our free enterprise, we all win, and communism loses.
Why would a air for of this development be cheaper than a SSS spring fork? Steel springs don't cost much more than air and spring forks use less parts.
I would like to see a list of what constitutes A kit please. I have from Enzo; fork springs for my specific weight, revalve & Enzo custom spring tubes. My KX450 has OEM lower DLC coating however I have no upper tube kashima. My shock spring for my weight and revalve. I have no shock body kashima or shaft coating. As for difference, I can count approximately 15 times where my suspension has saved me from breaking my ankles or crashing from over jumping landing in the flats off big jumps. Entry into corners with breaking bumps is night and day difference (plush and wheel tracking). Zero rear end side swap in fast speed bumps/ruts. I’ve literally thanked Ross from Enzo in my head countless times as it’s been a game changer for me. I’ve had other shop suspension work prior to Enzo however not the same experience with respect to performance gains. I’m 60, 178lbs back off pack b or front pack c rider.
@ I got priced out of motocross, lol I had alot of fun from 95-2005, I am 48 years old and never miss a sx/ national glad to hear you are still lining up big guy 👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼🫶🏼🫶🏼🫶🏼
It’s not really fair to compare an air fork vs A kit suspension. And while they’re KYB components, they’re not like the stock KYB on the Yamaha. I can say that after riding the newest AER forks vs stock Yamaha KYB forks back to back, the AER forks are amazingly good. Let’s not forget that Star Yamaha was racing a KYB air fork.
Racetech springs for 500-$800 is all 95% of riders need / nobody but the pros and rich guys can tell what 5-6g in suspension does…..suspension setup for riders weight is worth the money all day before any other mods
Air forks vs. Spring forks? I genuinely want everyone to chime in here. For the KTM group bikes, would you ever choose the air forks over spring forks if you could pick what came stock? I’m not talking ‘it depends on who tunes them/bring back two strokes’ type of answers. Just a tally of yes/no to air or spring forks. Eg: Air forks - no. Air forks - no. Air forks - no. Air forks - no. Air forks - no. Air forks - no. Air forks - no. Air forks - no. Air forks - no. Air forks - no. Air forks - no. Air forks - no. Air forks - no. Air forks - no. Air forks - no. Etc…
Imagine the strain it puts on the axle, on the triple clamps... having 2 tubes doing differents things.... To me, this is a nonsense, and a recipe for disaster.....
Most people are way over 165lbs. I’m 220 in my bday suit. I’m a very slender fellow also. 31 inch waist and 6’1” Everyone I ride with and some are very high level are heavy. I’m not.
Put 10cc synthetic 5/40 motor oil in your air pressure valve and don’t use fork oil in your left side non damping fork. Use motor oil synthetic 5/40 it is more slippery . On the damping side (right side) you must use fork oil . Try this trick before you put in spring kit.
This video is almost un watchable due to the shitty background track.Is that really necessary? What are you trying to convey here, information or that your hip.
Shop A-Kit on MX Locker: mxlocker.com/shop/curated/a-kit-suspension
Shop WeBig on MX Locker: mxlocker.com/profile/webigmoto
How about this. Get a YZ250F or YZ450F with KYB suspension. Save some money. 😆
Stock wp sucks.
I know you are poking fun, but you're 100% correct...ridiculous to think that you spend $10k+ on a bike then need to go spend another $5k in suspension alone to get it to handle well.
Because every bike is different for everybody and a Yamaha isn't the answer to all genius
@blakesinclair488 it's not, but we have 2 yams, 2 Hondas and a ktm all 2022+ and the WP stuff is so much far off the kyb and showa stuff. I've put a fair amount of money into the WP and the front end is still nowhere near the kyb in compliance and traction. 2k for a kyb spring conversion on the most expensive bike on the market just to get it to handle confidently is a big chunk of coin.
I don't understand why people think Yamaha KYB is so good. I've ridden a bunch of them 06-24 and there's nothing special about them. Anything that is set up for you will be better, no question.
RaceTech Spring Conversion is about $600 and makes a Huge difference w/o any other changes, and hen a revalve if you like. I’m sure this is better but 600 vs 6000…
Serious racers only,--------------------with money. Some race teams too I am sure.
I am 61 years old now and into this sport (still ride) since 1976. I feel so sorry for this generation on fantasy leagues and video games because they can't afford a bike or have a place to ride. It was pretty easy for any rural kid in the 70's through the mid 80's, with a low paying part time job, before most land got locked up.
Rode Enzo a kit on a stark.
Biggest take away…there was no bottom it seemed like. Just super confident inspiring.
Nah, you're just too slow to find the bottom (me too)
@@DanArnets1492 Gain weight. Good for traction. :)
so basically this is an Enzo commercial. I'll take it .
Also Miller High Life
If you ever make something to sell fair and square,---you will like commercials. At least yours. :)
I know from Mt. bike front suspension testing in the 90's, that if the front wheel can stay on the ground in those little choppy bumps, steering and control is greatly increased.
Ross at Enzo is a sharp guy. When that generation is gone,---I fear there will not be many to replace those great thinkers.
I know MXA is already gone. :)
0:27 “The biggest thing to know about this….” is that you should have gotten a YZF450 with KYB suspension…. 😂
Hate to be the grammar policeman..but the term is ...damping. Dampening is either to moisten something with a liquid or to diminish someone's feelings of joy or excitement. It;s a common mistake.
You’re dampening my joy by being a fkn nerd lol
You missed his error when he spoke about the coatings on the forks. He said it reduces friction. Uhhh, no, Jeff. The coatings reduce STICTION.
THAT is actually the proper term for it. (That's another common mistake.)
@@marvelaturraz5405 Nope, "stiction" means how much force it takes to start moving a seal from a static position and starting from it's natural setting. For this example, your bike is on the ground and you apply the front brake and push down on the handlebars. How much force it takes to start moving. Friction can not be had until something moves. The seal causes stiction. The movement causes friction. I would think the slick coating would reduce both.
Words mean something, and it is important to know what they mean. Luke down here, does not understand that yet. Politics is a great example (many words/phrases we use that have no objective definition, and mean something a bit different in all our minds.), of conversations we have that are "unintelligible", because we don't know exactly what the other is saying. In politics, it keeps us confused and divided. Pretty evil.
As a plus 50 A Vet rider I like the air forks on my Husky very much if you spend some time setting them up for your riding style they work well . And for the long vet moto's the local tracks give us ( 4 laps ) ill stick with my air forks.
Decent setup on WP 6500 or Cone Valves is worth it, the preload function on both is worth it alone and affects hold up
KTM with KYB, rather I will take 2 Yamaha's. Actually that's what I did. 125 for fun and a 450 to race. I love both with stock KYBs
135 lbs to 165 lbs? No wonder why my suspension was always so soft. :)
Jeff was talking about not having to change spring rates, which is about every 30 lbs typically.
Awsome. The WP Air Forks is all that has turned me from a KTM OR GASGAS 150cc and a 300cc. With a good KYB Enzo, spring fork conversion changes the narrative. Had me looking at TM's 144cc and 300cc because lets face it if you pay the extra $1000 for a TM to come with their own custom rear suspension combined with having KYB spring forks already the TM'S come with the best suspension out of everything else. Problem is TM bikes are so damn expensive
You can't even get TMs in the US right now, distribution fell apart a couple years ago.
The difference is marketing you wanna help Enzo get our money 😊
Tell that to my inflatable gf
@ I don’t see the connection but enjoy your cum doll.
Kit suspension does make you faster
@ I’ve had it for WP the conevalves nah. No it did the opposite stock KYB sss system forks all day
The difference is only marketing, if we are buying china made junk. There are still some people who make good stuff that works, with plenty of time and money into development in complicated product. They are made with brains. If you made a product like that with your time and energy,---how would you sell it?
When we make good stuff that people want to buy with our free enterprise, we all win, and communism loses.
That was a great sales pitch.
What’s an emig spec a kit go for on mx locker?
Jeff, where do the guys in the weight range of 250 to 280 fall in? Are we left to ride a XR 650R?
135- 155 only lol
Stiffer springs for that weight,---and probably more rebound damping, (a re-valve may be needed), to handle the stiffer springs.
#47 doing a hell of a job in Washington too
Haha. I love your rider weight range top being 165. I feel I've been fat shamed Jeff at 210 LBS.
Nailed it, SFF air forks are only made because its cheaper. Performance, plushness holdup and feel on decent spring forks is way better!
Why would a air for of this development be cheaper than a SSS spring fork? Steel springs don't cost much more than air and spring forks use less parts.
Ironic, after Juju’s two crashes from front end traction this weekend 😬
Jeff, what the weight increase on the spring forks? Thanks
Jeff ain’t got time to answer comments he’s busy doing fro daddy shit
Usually 3-5lbs
I would like to see a list of what constitutes A kit please.
I have from Enzo; fork springs for my specific weight, revalve & Enzo custom spring tubes. My KX450 has OEM lower DLC coating however I have no upper tube kashima.
My shock spring for my weight and revalve. I have no shock body kashima or shaft coating.
As for difference, I can count approximately 15 times where my suspension has saved me from breaking my ankles or crashing from over jumping landing in the flats off big jumps. Entry into corners with breaking bumps is night and day difference (plush and wheel tracking). Zero rear end side swap in fast speed bumps/ruts. I’ve literally thanked Ross from Enzo in my head countless times as it’s been a game changer for me. I’ve had other shop suspension work prior to Enzo however not the same experience with respect to performance gains. I’m 60, 178lbs back off pack b or front pack c rider.
Sounds like you love tour suspension! Thats an A Kit dog…work hard train harder
@ well that’s good to know...thanks! I’ve asked people before and couldn’t get a detailed answer. It cost me 1.2K not 5-9K I hear mentioned.
@ I got priced out of motocross, lol I had alot of fun from 95-2005, I am 48 years old and never miss a sx/ national glad to hear you are still lining up big guy 👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼🫶🏼🫶🏼🫶🏼
Big big discussion for 20 years or more.
It’s not really fair to compare an air fork vs A kit suspension. And while they’re KYB components, they’re not like the stock KYB on the Yamaha. I can say that after riding the newest AER forks vs stock Yamaha KYB forks back to back, the AER forks are amazingly good. Let’s not forget that Star Yamaha was racing a KYB air fork.
Racetech springs for 500-$800 is all 95% of riders need / nobody but the pros and rich guys can tell what 5-6g in suspension does…..suspension setup for riders weight is worth the money all day before any other mods
Nice
Air forks vs. Spring forks?
I genuinely want everyone to chime in here.
For the KTM group bikes, would you ever choose the air forks over spring forks if you could pick what came stock?
I’m not talking ‘it depends on who tunes them/bring back two strokes’ type of answers.
Just a tally of yes/no to air or spring forks.
Eg:
Air forks - no.
Air forks - no.
Air forks - no.
Air forks - no.
Air forks - no.
Air forks - no.
Air forks - no.
Air forks - no.
Air forks - no.
Air forks - no.
Air forks - no.
Air forks - no.
Air forks - no.
Air forks - no.
Air forks - no.
Etc…
Imagine the strain it puts on the axle, on the triple clamps... having 2 tubes doing differents things....
To me, this is a nonsense, and a recipe for disaster.....
You can have 2 kinda stock bikes or one really good bike.
Lets see some lap times! For 6 grand I’d expect a major difference in my times.
Coming soon!
You may not even be faster but they’re a lot more forgiving and safer to ride.
Most people are way over 165lbs. I’m 220 in my bday suit. I’m a very slender fellow also. 31 inch waist and 6’1” Everyone I ride with and some are very high level are heavy. I’m not.
Almost zero useful technical information: "I don't know what it does different, or how it's different..."
Hate if yall want boys, if I had Emigs connections and cash I would without a doubt have me a set of these if factory connection couldn’t hook me up
Put 10cc synthetic 5/40 motor oil in your air pressure valve and don’t use fork oil in your left side non damping fork. Use motor oil synthetic 5/40 it is more slippery . On the damping side (right side) you must use fork oil . Try this trick before you put in spring kit.
But crashing builds character, and worse suspension will cause you to learn something...
lol it would be nice to drop more on suspension than the damn bike and it’s not six grand double that at least lol
Tbh 98% of us would be just fine with stock suspension let alone a fkn A-kit lol
emiG ktm man ricky triumph jeremy kawi
yeah... thats not a-kit. maybe b kit.
Commercial
Air Forks eeewwwwww lol
If you don’t understand how to set up a bike or suspension, this is all irrelevant.
I don’t know why Husky doesn’t just ditch the air fork on all of their big bikes… I like the spring forks on my TX300 25
Oh it's just a commercial
This video is almost un watchable due to the shitty background track.Is that really necessary? What are you trying to convey here, information or that your hip.