Gender Expression and Disability ft. Jessica Kellgren-Fozard [CC]
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- Опубліковано 20 сер 2024
- In this video, I am joined by Jessica Kellgren-Fozard (her wife Claudia and my friend Rachel in the background) to discuss gender presentation, gender roles, and how disabilities can intersect with that; how our disabilities might impact the way we present ourselves. Be sure to check out the second video we did together on her channel!
Jessica's video (Body Image & Disability): • Positively Proving Peo...
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You're So Brave w/ Chase Ross and Aaron Ansuini (Gender, Body Image, Disability): • Video
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CHANNEL DESCRIPTION
Annie Segarra (Annie Elainey) creates mainly first-person videos on introspective topics, social topics, sharing her experiences and thoughts on disability, body image, LGBT topics, gender equality, etc, as well as creative content; a variety of music/artistic media and short films. Annie identifies as a queer disabled (Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome) Latinx woman and uses she and they pronouns.
![Positively Proving People Wrong!!! With Annie Elainey [CC]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/mjo7tlwm2dk/mqdefault.jpg)
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![Disability Misconceptions Tag (EDS) [CC]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/sBSzm9RbXAY/mqdefault.jpg)
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Thank you so much for having me, now let’s film 100 videos when we next see each other because my love for you demands it! ♥️♥️♥️♥️
You guys make the best disabled collabs ever.
Kenzie yes and the they gay which help
You're the one who directed me to this channel in your awesome video about autism. Thanks.
"I have a hot wife and pain killers. What more could I want?" x-D
Also, Annie's laugh is giving me life!
Goofy16girl787 That covers a lot of it for me. Maybe food?And coffee. ☕️
I love the part of this video where it turns into a love letter to JessiClaud.
The Princess and the Scrivener claudicca!
I didn't know Claudia was in the room with you. That makes Jessica's monologue about intertwined souls even more adorable.
Can we have "The straights don't do that" put on a t-shirt?! And then bring out a sequel with "The ableds don't do that"
Max Fisher Or really confuse people with “The straighables don’t do that!” 😁
Lisa TheCatDude YEESSS I'm so here for that!
Oh my God the Straibles xxx
Annie, this is your next shirt campaign.
One thing I thought about when you asked Jessica about whether her style/gender presentation might be an obstacle when sick, is how much I struggle to know how to dress and present myself for doctors’ appointments, or even just in my day-to-day, to try to be taken seriously and believed, and how it feels like that intersects with gender presentation. Do I wear the dress or the more “feminine” clothes that I may prefer or that make me seem more “put together” and risk being not seen as “sick enough” or “disabled enough” to be worthy of help, or do I wear more “neutral” or “tomboyish” or “less feminine” clothes (the ones that are perceived to take less effort) and not fuss about my hair or makeup at all but then risk being seen as not putting in enough effort for my health and “Oh maybe she’s just depressed.” I often find myself trying to dress in such a way that I think will garner the least suspicion or judgment or misunderstanding when I go into the world, and it feels kinda gendered to me.
I’m pretty curious to know what Jessica was thinking about when she said that she had “so much to say” on that topic!
That's a tough one because it can go either way depending on who you are (your intersections, being a person of color, fat, trans, etc), the person you talk to, depending on who your nurses/doctors are, peoples' biases are all very different in regards to this; as you expressed it's tough to decide how to present oneself in preparation for the biases of those in the medical field. Jessica mentioned to me that during a long hospital stay, when she was too ill to present with make-up and curls that she went ignored and neglected by medical staff but when she did have the strength to, she was treated a lot better. In my experience, that has never been the case though, if I'm dressed feminine or put-together in a medical space, I was treated like an exaggerator, dramatic about my symptoms, possibly lying. Unfortunately, there's no one size fits all answer but it really sucks that we even have to consider what prejudices our doctors will have and how to we appease them instead of just presenting authentically and being treated fairly anyway.
Annie Elainey THIS IS MY LIFE LADIES! New subbie. I have never felt more understood! I'm a good looking woman and therefore I must suffer in silence. I have EDS and 0 pain meds, 0 meds for ANY of my illness. I am an amateur bb so that adds to the, "really, you don't look sick". THANK YOU. I'M GLAD I FOUND YOU!!!
Annie Elainey Exactly! I feel like it ends up being a no-win situation anyway which is so frustrating and makes me feel helpless and powerless. Such a good point, too, about how everyone is likely having to play by a different set of ultimately-no-win “rules.”
The fa'afafine are a third-gender group that have existed in Samoa for hundreds of years. A study found that in extended families with fa'afafine (eg children who had a fa'afafine aunt), children were more likely to be healthy, finish high school, go to uni etc. This was believed to be because fa'afafine don't have children of their own, so they shared their time and money with their nieces and nephews and were available to support the children's parents with childcare and looking after elderly parents and that kind of thing. This gender binary shenanigans makes it harder for everyone 🙄
Precisely.
I forgot to turn on the CCs so whenever Jessica refers to her hot wife, I heard "hot wine" instead and now I'm craving warm cider.
Jess and Claud are an absolutely adorable couple - I think the type of couple we all aspire to be one half of.
They are one of my favorite UA-cam couples. I agree that they are such a cute couple. 🙂
Jessica fan here brought over by the other video. Now I think I'm going to scour Annie's backlog of videos and become just as obsessed as I am with Jess.
i am a trans disabled man and thank you so much for this video. ive been considering making a similar one, but spoons
Oh man I could really get into how the biggest barrier in my transition has been my disabilities, and how I've known I was trans since I was like 14 (when I first got really sick) and have been out to all my friends for like 5-6 years now and STILL at 30 have not been able to get my hands on T because it's so damned inaccessible for me to actually get to an endo.
As my lymph nodes are so sore and swollen (thanks ME/CFS) binding has not really been an option for over a year now, and basically my entire wardrobe consists of handmedown tshirt and sloppy joe material clothes from my mother, which while I am grateful I didn't have to pay for SUPER don't reflect my actual gender expression.
It's like I have this extra disability enforced closet I don't even know how to get out of because I'm stuck living with my super conservative christian parents whom I'm dependent on. It's been super hard on me to see my friends whom I came out to years ago come out to me, and have the luxury of getting on T and are at the point where they're about to book consultations for top surgery while I've been stuck in the same hole the whole goddamn time. And don't get me wrong, I'm super proud of them and every hurdle they've managed to clear and how hard they've had to fight. It just would be nice if I didn't have fight for ANOTHER 16 years before I can get to transition like I want to.
Would you please go to Kovu is a Mythical Unicorn (Kovu Kingsrod) and share your story? He is 16 and transitioning.
That story about the penguins gave me all the feels!!!!! That’s so amazing I love animals!!
Annika Victoria what a cool crossover, a bunch of awesome youtubers in one place ;)
Annie is my gender soulmate, I swear. Relate so hard to the idea of not expecting people to keep up with my gender.
Came here via Jessica, and I'm both gay and living with cEDS. So grateful you guys did this collab, and I now have yet another warrior to watch/commiserate/learn from... Thank you both!
OMG, this was awesome. AND OMG THE FEELS WITH THAT MONOLOGUE. Jessica and Claudia are so lovely! Also, GIVE THE CHILDREN TO THE GAYS. YES PLEASE.
How Jess feels with Claud is how I feel with my partner. I am a demi boy and his is a cis male, I feel like no matter what our genders are we will love each other, be connected and he feels the same way. We are both disabled (mentally and physically) I love this video so much! Hormones are risky for my diabetes and severe mental illnesses so I am highly leaning towards not taking them. Thank you for the discussion!
I am a huge fan of Jessica/Claudia, but I am so glad to now become of a fan of Annie through this video, too!
I can't believe I'm just finding your channels now! Being disabled and part of the LGBTQ+ community is more than alienating in my small town. I am glad to have found you both!
the side eye when delivering 'the straights don't do that' was EPIC - AND a valid point, gotta love a valid socip political point delivered with cutting perfection :)
I was feeling a lot of this today, and appreciate hearing people talking about something that no one else around me experiences! I feel so much less alone whenever I watch these videos.
Came from Jessica’s Channel, but am now subscribing because you have a fantastic laugh & I can use all the positivity I can get these days! Especially ways to stop hating this body that served me so well for 29yrs of my life, then went OWWWW, & now is in fight or flight mode (really it’s in hiding mode). Things you said in Jessica’s video really resonated, & I look forward to going back in your videos & catching up! Thank you for being awesome! 🤗💜
Just found your channel, loving your content!!! Thank you!
Gay girl with EDS here, really struggling with loving my body as opposed to fighting against it. You're both amazing!!
When you two brought up capitalism I totally died because I was thinking "thanks to capitalism" the entire time you spoke of binaries! I absolutely loved you two talking together, what a dynamic and fascinating conversation!
You’re both so so so so good 😍😭
Excellent video! I'm physically abled so I don't relate to this in the same way as you but I do have a lot of feelings on the way neurodivergence can affect gender identity/presentation. Anecdotally, my autistic and/or ADHD friends tend to be far more likely to be trans, non-binary, and/or gender nonconforming (me being one of them).
Growing up with an undiagnosed neurodevelopmental disorder, I was always weird without trying. Other kids always picked up on me being different, even though I often couldn't figure out how or why. So I ended up thinking "if I can't be normal when I try, why even bother?" and I ended up just doing whatever & often not conforming to social norms. I couldn't relate to the other girls in my class the same way as they related to each other - was that due to neurodivergence, queerness, gender non-conformity? I was never quite sure which, probably some mixture of the two. I often didn't pick up on social norms - feminine things being part of them.
Girls were "supposed" to be quiet, social, good at social norms - my neurodivergent brain was not good at those things! So I always felt alienated from femininity. Embracing gender non-conformity felt like coming home for me - femininity felt weird, wrong, it somehow ended up being a symbol for all the social norms I couldn't conform to as a child. But being gender non-conforming meant I could free myself from many of those things - because gender non-conformity inherently breaks the norms, there aren't conventions to miss or norms to misunderstand, because you get to make up your own norms.
It's very hard for me to tell which parts of my gender non-conformity relate to my gayness, to my neurodivergence, to some innate gender non-conformity I was born with. I don't think it's the kind of thing that is possible to tell - the way my brain works, the people I am attracted to, the way I express myself are all part of me, and they have all influenced me & each other my entire life.
"I'm not from this place..." hahahahaha!
The talk about colonialisation of gender and gender being commodofied under capitalism. Love this video!!!
i've been following you for a while but this is the first time i've actually watched one of your videos(that executive dysfunction though!)and when you said that colonization is the reason for the idea of the gender binary being so prevalent? oh my god, fam. yes.
your content is so important. thank you so so much for making it and putting yourself out there.
Two of my favorite LGBT disabled creators talking about the intersection of LGBT and disability? YES PLEASE.
I was considering beginning to bind, but I occasionally get flare-ups of intertrigo under my breasts, and I don't think binding will help. Since I can't afford top surgery ATM (and Medicaid doesn't cover it unless you can PROVE it's for a medical reason, and even then, they make you jump through all sorts of hoops), I'm just going to start wearing breathable sports bras...
Hello Annie! I just came here from Jessica's channel. I wish I could have seen your presentation. You really hit me upside the head with the notion that a trans person who is disabled may not be able to have all of the surgery they would like. Yikes! A minority within a minority. I will be sharing the heck out of this. My new passion in life is to have more trans kids become trans adults. The suicide rate among trans makes me sick. I follow this darling boy, Kovu Kingsrod, in Norway. He is transitioning. He does not have any physical disabilities and on one else I have come in contact with has.
Sometimes you just need to have a "Doh!" moment!!! :) Cheers!
btw: Jessica; how amazing about the penguins. I'm sure you've seen the Morgan Freeman-voiced documentary on Penguins and they show all of the eggs or chicks that lose a parent dying. NO MENTION of homosexual couples that adopt the chick or save the egg! Thanks for that wonderful info! btw: We milked cows and the cows would jump each other.
In the 50s’
Jessica was just born
“Ohmygod she’s disgaybled”
“We need to send her to the future to save her life”
*doctor pulls a time machine out of nowhere*
“Alright let’s go”
I'm fangirling so hard right now; you two are huge favourites of mine and aaaahhhh 💜💝💜💝
Wow, thank you both for articulating something I’ve always struggled to- the way my disability puts barriers like lack of energy or health and safety between me and my ideal gender expression. I’ve never heard anyone talk about this before. And thank you for doing so while making me laugh so much!
this is what my heart needed
this is the first time i've gotten to hear someone else talk about binding/surgery etc and it not being an option because of their disability and it made my lil eyes tear up so much because I spiral about it everyday and feel so dang ALONE
I could watch you two talking for hours and hours 😍
Really nice video!
Fantastic video, it was a pleasure to see you two collab and the subject was very interesting ! :D
Taking my pills in the morning is essential - I just end up paying in bed hallucinating and feeling rubbish if it gets to the afternoon and I haven't. Everything else is less essential. If I am ill and my pills aren't really working, for example, I may need to arrange to be able to go to the loo without going to the loo (using a bottle), and that is manageable - more manageable than going without my medication. I feel like basic self-care, like brushing my teeth and having a shower, let alone being dressed in clean clothes and out of bed for most of the day, is quite high up the list. If I can manage to be out of bed, showered, dressed, in clean clothes, with clean teeth, in the morning, that is a good day, and I'm likely to manage productive things, but it is rare to go a whole week where that happens every day.
Grooming myself beyond the basics to be acceptable in public, is not that high up my list of priorities TBH. It certainly doesn't feel essential, compared to other things.
This is amazing, thanks for letting us listen to this incredibly interesting conversation.
Also: penguins ❤️❤️❤️
I love #disgaybled. I may use that a time or two as my actual identity. It doesn’t really cover my genderfluidy trans-ness though. 😁. Also #givechildrentothegays lol that’s one of the best things I’ve ever heard. Just don’t give them to me because I’m not particularly paternal or maternal or anything in between. 😁🤘🏽
I started tearing up when Jessica started talking about the fact that she and Claudia are soulmates and I'm just like...
THIS IS PURE SUGAR HOW DO I COOOPE?
I WANT A RELATIONSHIP LIKE THAT! I wanna find my soulmate.
Claudica is just... The cutest c:
I am 100% here for gay penguin facts
I love what Jessica said about souls. That is exactly what I believe. I wonder now if gender dysphoria is related? Maybe someone did not fully live their past life in that gender? hm.
These videos are amazing!!! I love seeing you two together!! You make me feel like a real human that’s not broken (the only other disabled people I know are severely physically disabled, and I have multiple invisible illnesses, so I feel alone alot. Not to say your illnesses are invisible, but they are more than I’m used to ya know?? ) thank you all so much!!!
Congrats on becoming a UA-cam NextUp member!
I didn't know my body could make a sound that high pitched 😂 that was so sweet, cute, and heartwarming. I am so touched by their love for each other.
That maned lioness is my new favorite animal. 🦁💗 What an awesome video. I hope you two can make more videos together in the future! 👏
Mellow Dee her name is Mmamoriri and she is AMAZING, beloved by all the female lions, respected by the male lions, plays multiple gender roles. Amazing! When I found out about her years ago I was like... "Same."
Hello person scrolling threw the comments
I want to let you know you are beautiful. No matter you size shape gender romantic attraction illness skin or anything else I’m here to let you know you are beautiful, if people call that disability lazy let them know there wrong we have a ability there is only. One thing that defines our self i struggle with autism adhd anxiety here and there and a bit of depression, please I’m here to let everyone know everyone is equally
I'm just like Jessica for me makeup is part of my daily routine, just like brushing my teeth and is an activity I enjoy so much. I don't feel I'm to femme I'm kind of a tomboy in the way I dress but gosh makeup I love so much.
Adoption involves a bit more than filling a form out, regardless of gender, sex, or sexuality.
One of my favourite collabs ever thank you to you both. Love the humour and fun but also discussing important topics
'This millennium's working out very well for me...' I laughed so hard at this.
yeah. Transfem, recently realized that I may or may not have EDS (my rheum thinks it's classical, but isn't confident actually diagnosing me with more than "hypermobility syndrome"), and by far my biggest worry is, what if this messes with my chances of bottom surgery? I ... honestly don't know what I'd do if it proved to be a non-option. Fortunately I've heard case reports of people with EDS doing fine with bottom surgery, so the science seems to be on my side, but it's still way at the top of my anxieties.
"just give the children to the gays"
You heard it here first
"The straights don't do that"
💙💕DISGAYBLED💕💙
Hello, I came here from Jessica's channel, and I REALLY FELL IN LOVE with this video, this theme is SO important... I'm Brazilian and I would like to add captions in Portuguese, but I am not finding the option for collaboration, so, I want to ask you how can I make this translation.
Thank you so much! Hmm, the contributions button should be on but here is the link as well ua-cam.com/users/timedtext_video?v=Au1svE1bE8A&ref=share
Annie Elainey oh, thank you! I'll upload a translation as soon as I can! 💖
So many great points! I never knew that about penguins! I knew there was a reason they were my favorite 😂
Ive been waiting for these beautiful people to colab. You two are my favorite UA-camrs and I’m so sad I couldn’t go to vidcon. I’m in the middle of filming some videos.
i laughed so much along with you guys and loved every bit of this video!! thank you for blessing me with #disgaybled. such brilliance!
IT'S CAPITALISM, HONEY!
I absolutely love this!!
Disabilities and parenting!! That's also a good question! And for me, the other parts of it, sort of aspects of gender dysphoria and executive function and sensory difficulties and relationship difficulties all mix up to feed into my parenting and caring and domestic things, and it is really hard to seperate them. And hard to know what's comfortable for me, what is me, what is mental health, moveable feast to explore and consume and moveable foul to move past. Especially with experiencing a degree of fluidity but that doesn't always match what I'm able to wear because of my clothes washing routines. It's possible to be a pretty femme slob.
Tag yourself I'm Rachel
Yes. Needed this. So exciting!!!
Love this! I follow both your channels anyway (another queer spoony/ disgaybled here). My partner hadn’t seen Annie’s videos before though and really engaged with it. Our gender expression is pretty similar to the Jessica/Claudia combo though she’s possibly slightly less feminine than Claudia eg never any makeup.
Although same sex relationships are pretty common we think it’s unusual to have same gender relationships. I mean something more nuanced than the idea that someone is the husband and the other the wife. Either there’s a graduated spectrum or several genders, and from observation most people don’t fancy someone of the same gender. I’m technically bisexual but I tend to be attracted to creative men and strong/nerdy women - the middle of the gender spectrum (probably no wider than saying you fancy men, which is quite different from the bisexual stereotype of being omnisexual or it being about the specific individual). I find that there’s a lot of confusion about how people discuss gender. It can be very useful in discussion to separate the physical anatomy of male/intersex/female from the cultural/performative aspects of the masculine-feminine gender spectrum (or gender categories like low femme, high femme). I’m definitely cisgender and was a high femme toddler so I have no insight into the transgender experience, but I feel like society could progress if people were accepted whatever their gender expression without there being (external) pressure for gender to match physical anatomy.
Also, since what people argue for about gender/sexuality is often what’s ‘natural’. Does this mean adoption agencies should ONLY recruit ‘the gays’?! 😉😆
I'm a heterosexual male who lives with cp and who also has a positive body image. I know this b/c people tell me I should have confidence and it doesn't mean anything to me. I know I have enough confidence without being arrogant. I recognize the fact that people with low and negative body image will try to pull you down with them. I see this all the time. Especially when it comes to women. When I ask out a woman she will act like I committed a crime or the impartible sin. I see this a lot too. I realized that if a woman has a negative self-body image she will not react positively to a person living with cp - and that is ok. I seek a heterosexual human woman with a positive self-body image so she will be able to handle her friends asking her questions about me and sometimes mocking her b/c of me.
I have heds. And when i first tried on my binder, I dislocated my rib over a over the same day. Now my binder is loose and doesn’t hurt anymore 😌
This is the best video ever
I feel 100% female, but I dress more like Claudia than like Jessica. I guess feminine might be a different thing?
Jess and Claud are TOO cute, god.
This video is adorable on so many levels.
Penguins are awesome, I've always thought this. The fact that they have gay penguins and adoption makes them even more awesome.
Oh my goodness! Thank you guys so much for the collaborations, I was so happy to see two of the humans who make me the happiest when I'm online, together in one place!
I'm like you Annie with hair and makeup based on what you said about it being work. I don't like wearing makeup or fussing with my hair so I basically wear it in a ponytail all the time because I have to fuss with it to wear it down. And I like jeans and t-shirts, so I don't buy feminine clothes because they don't fit me well and I'm constantly tugging on them which makes me uncomfortable. My friends and coworkers have always been like "Well it's not that bad to do makeup." And I'm sitting here going "Id rather sleep....that's extra work."
This is so freaking great, omfg!
Jessica and Claud, do you know the fan fiction called The Sidhe? It exists as a published book (not fan fiction) as well, and in it the concept of intertwined souls gets captured so beautifully, your monologue about it instantly reminded me of it.
through discovering channels like yours over the past two years and through my own research into What the Hell my Body is Doing, some type of EDS is seeming more and more like a reasonable explanation for my weird ass combination of symptoms, but I have. no idea what to do next with this. I've tried going to the doctor a handful of times without this knowledge and I've gotten orthotics and the advice to "try new diets" in answer, and I'm only freshly 18 with barely enough knowledge to schedule a doctors appointment. I'm just scared of not being taken seriously when my pain literally keeps me up at night
I really loved this video 💖
Jessica is so lovely omg 😍
Annie Elainey vi que pertences grupo de youtubers Miami me gustaria reunirme con ustedes. Cuando es la proxima reunion. Saludos lamonamelba Vivo en Broward
Looooooveeee 💖😭💖
Very fascinating video (:
I don't know if it's depends of the type of EDS someone has but binding help me a lot with my chest pain and keep my ribs in place (I have hEDS)
Spoonie Timelordy Nice! I have classical and a lot of sensory processing and sensitivity to pressure, though it will vary from person to person :)
This was awesome!
Also, penguins are the best 🐧🐧🐧🐧
I don’t like having to put on makeup, but I don’t feel comfortable without it 🤷♀️ it’s a chore to me
Love ur videos..gb
cool video really interesting. I am Autistic a believed I was bi for some time, I still wonder sometimes, but I am not sure if I am just getting confused with all of the emotions and chemicals rushing about my brain.
so sweet ♥️♥️♥️♥️
Omg I love penguins even more now.
I think we are all dying inside along with Rachel :'(
“Im very gay and very disabled@
The Body Image & Disability link in the description doesn't work.
Fixed it! Thank you!!
Anyone else here October 2020? Haven't seen Jessica recently (I'm not subscribed) - how is she? Annie is hilarious here all-ready-4-bed in her pyjamas' top - nice ladies
Wowww my two favs!!! #disgaybled fam
*it’s capitalism honey!*
Hi reamber me its me laila
#disgaybled
OK I loved these videos but it bothers me (and I don't think it was intentionally meant this way) that you talked about femininity like it has to mean doing your hair and makeup. People can see themselves as very feminine and not look a certain way, ya know?
Definitely! There are so many ways to express feminity, just so happens that these are how Jessica and I, personally find that we express or present femininity and it's a common way to do so in our cultures. I do agree with you! Femininity is not at all isolated to these presentations :)