Thank you! Our understanding and appreciation evolves along different phases of our journey to the top of the mountain. In my own there have been many things I was taught that I did not appreciate at the time as much as something else I was obsessed with at the moment. And with time and growth inevitably comes a moment when I say oh my gosh that was the key I was missing all along ha ha. Luckily I have really good memory whether I valued something or not ha ha. So I would add to what you said and say I’m glad UA-cam will keep these videos around so that when the time is right for us to appreciate and benefit from something, it’ll be there! 😃🙏
And this is why I will always choose you as my Shifu. My favorite part was @ 31:12, " You lose your balance, you lose your orientation and then you lose your life." your little smile and laugh, right after you said that, just cracked me up. 🤣
Tai chi and aikido seem like two relatives, that speak the same language but I've slightly different dialects. Like one or two different words, but kindred spirits.
Chen Taichi getting some love! Nice! Great video Chester! (Btw, i think there is a mistake in the text around the 11:30 mark. Just wanted to bring it to your attention)
Oh darn you are right about the typo. Maybe I’ll use UA-cam’s caption edit feature to caption over that ha ha. Thank you for pointing it out! On another note I’m working on reducing confusion on what people will call me. So if you could edit my name in your comment to Shifu Lin or teacher or Shifu, that will help! 😃🙏
Great video. I also think silk reeling refers to the connection you have with the opponents energy flow, hence no resistance, no running away. If you resist, you block the flow and break “the thread” when you restart, when you run away, you break the thread by moving away and snapping the energy connection.
Nice! That's a really good way of looking at it and does totally help you align with the right intention and feeling. What difference has that mindset made for you in your practice? 😃
Chen seems to be more attacking in nature, and not waiting to borrow energy. It seems to create energy that the opponent can get caught up in, even if the opponent doesn't attack first.
Good observation! I think so too that Yang Tai Chi really prefers borrowing energy while the Chen Tai Chi is happy to use their own energy as long as the opponent is unable to stop it. Thanks for pointing that out! 😃🙌
Great demo Sifu, thank youfor doing a long video with extra details in it, always appreciate the long format. So I guess in order to defeat silk-reeling a yang stylist would have to use multiple neijin of the 8 main energies, very cool! Its interesting what you mentioned about the New Road of chen taichi that uses tighter spirals in the latest technology of chen style. But then again Feng Zhiqiyang might have upgraded it further with his hunyuan chen variant style. Have you looked into the practical method of chen style taichi by Hong Junsheng, do you know how this differs from the above chen styles. I've often wondered as there are quite a few chen style variants. I just wondered how would a yang stylist know whether they are using either one of two Neijin or Yi. For example when practicing with my partner I can sometimes use the eyes to perform some techhniques sepcifically Split and Pluck by looking to the up and down corners respectively. Do you know what this indicates Sifu?
Great comment and questions! Yes the New Frame of of Chen Tai Chi has tighter and more spirals. Whereas the Hunyuan of Feng Zhiqiang shows bigger circles that have a more relaxed look. Each master advances a certain quality of the art in a certain direction and it's very interesting, like sport athletes and top chefs! I have looked a bit at Practical Method and I think it is very well named! The movements have a lot of innate fascia manipulation along with the spiraling movements, store release movements of the body power. That makes it easier to apply and have some internal power without getting too esoteric in terminology and teaching. Looking at their videos it looks like a lot of the students are Chinese martial arts college athletes and that method of practical teaching would suit them well. How would you know whether you are using one or two Neijin? If you have intention to move energy (Neijin) or intention (Yi) in more than one direction, then you are doing it! Doing it with your eyes is often times related to manipulation of Yi, but it also plays a role in activating Yin and Yang as we discuss in our Qi Mastery course. What you describe, looking up and down at the corners, is more with Neijin or Yi, and we discuss that too in those courses! What it indicates is that you are moving in a legitimate and advanced direction with your own Tai Chi experience. And that's something to be happy and proud about, isn't it? Thank you for the great question! The long videos are more work to edit. But there is something satisfying about telling a more complete story to paint a picture that does the art justice. So I'm enjoying it too and will make more as much as I can. 😃🙌
@@phoenixmountaintaichi Thanks Sifu. Its good to know I am hopefully moving in the right direction. I think I made some errors in my initial venture as I was mixing training and techniques from different styles of taichi but I understand now I need to stick to one main style until I get expert in at which point I can mix and match, like yourself. The other thing is as you personally have done this art for a very long time, did you notice that you feel your dantien or the tissues around your waist and internal musculature have become more dense and doesit feel kind of restrictive?
This was great to listen to. I think more has been said and demonstrated in this video than any other material publicly. Both styles have their different emphasis but it's still amazing that it also stems from similar principles.
Thank you! The crazy thing is while watching and editing it I'm thinking "oh I forgot to mention ____ and I forgot to explain ___!" So I'm glad you and everyone are enjoying and benefitting from it. The reality is that there is just so much wisdom and technology in Tai Chi. It would be silly to think I can cover it fully in one video right? The good news is there is plenty more to present and share ha ha. Stay tuned and enjoy! 😃🙌
One of the aspects of returning incoming force we’ve (my brothers and I) have been exploring is treating the point of contact as a sphere that rotates instantly upon contact. Consequently the force cannot find the recipient’s center and returns back to the issuer. I believe the spiraling phenomenon does so in a vectorized manner - ie the spiraling is a rotating point/micro-sphere that moves through space. Would this be a good way to think about it?
Yes that's a fantastic way to think about it! You and your brothers have a perceptive and discerning mind! This concept of rotating spheres that interact with the opponent is used mechanically as well as energetically and intentionally. You see the mechanical aspect of it early on in the video, and the energetic aspect of it in how I describe some of the Yang style methods of dealing with Silk Reeling later in the video. It's quite impressive that you figured it out on your own. What inspired you, or motivated you to explore in this direction? 😃
@ we’ve been studying temple style tai chi for a good part of 3 decades now. After a while we find that all the stylistic/methodological differences etc just disappear. As far as the sphere thing is concerned, my teacher told me about it (he learned it from Master Waysun Liao).
Great video, learned a lot about Yang style! Couple questions/comments: Where do you see Wu（ 吳）style in this? The part where you mentioned the early Yang style reminded me of what i experienced in Wu style, very small spirals. Second comment, regarding Feng and his Hunyuan style, interesting info about the noncorporeal qigong, I hadn't heard that before. What do you make of the xinyi influence? Afterall he did call what he developed 陈氏心意混元太极拳。When I see video of Feng doing the forms, the expansion/contraction often looks like the Dai style piquan that one of my teachers taught. Thanks again!
I agree with your observation about master Feng Zhiqiang’s Tai Chi. I have not heard him say or write anything regarding extracorporeal Qi, it’s just my observation that he has the look of someone whose awareness extends into the space and Qi around himself in a way that is uncommon to see. When you look at his history, it’s very interesting and paints a picture of how his own Tai Chi evolved. Feng first studied under Hu Yaozhen (one finger defeats all under heaven/father of modern Qigong). After teaching Feng his Xinyi, he recommended Feng to study with his friend Chen Fake. At the time, Chen Fake and Hu Yaozhen were among the very best martial artists in Beijing. Hu also studied Daoist internal alchemy, quite possibly through lineages he was introduced to by his Xinyi teacher Peng Tingjun (who also studied Daoist internal alchemy). If Feng included Neijin into his Hunyuan Tai Chi, the Daoist internal alchemy Yaozhen practiced is one of the most likely sources. While Hu Yaozhen’s famous 1 finger demo could be done with Qi or Neijin, the caliber of people he demonstrated it on suggests Neijin as a possible source of his particular Jin. Peng Tingjun was also remarkable because he is among a small group of masters that were recognized by the lineage holders of Wang Fuyuan as having attained Xingyi’s Hua stage of Jin. So the Xinyi that Feng was exposed to is one of an exceptionally high caliber. So we can see there was a lot of interaction between Feng and other masters at the pinnacle of their art. What an amazing time it must have been to study and collaborate with these masters! Thank you for the great question and discussion opportunity! What does all of this make you consider now regarding his Tai Chi, or anyone else’s? 😃🙏
Yes I think the silk reeling in Chen Tai Chi shares a lot of similarities to the spirals of Bagua especially in Cheng Style Baguazhang. Some differences you might notice is that Bagua prioritizes footwork mobility more than Chen style, while Chen style prioritizes the amount of power that is generated on a solid stance. Both are really beautiful uses of Silk Reeling though, are they not? 😃🙏
Yes they are. Chen is maybe more battlefield formation oriented and Baguazhang more bodyguard protecting agains groups of attackers? Thanks for your insightfull answers. 🙏
hmm for this topic i have one question. i hear that zhobao, wuhao, and sun styles are different from chen and from yang and wu. if you can also explain and demonstrate how they are, like in this video, it'd be very appreciated :)
Old six roads, very interesting. Sifu, I wonder what you would do to a counter to the elbow lock by the same technique? I seem to get easily caught in that, meaning just as one is about to apply twisting force on the elbow or just above it, your partner grips your extended arm and rolls their wrist on the other hand to grab you. They then extend the your hand that was grabbing their wrist and apply the elbow throw or lock on your arm..! Like a horizontal figure 8.
@@phoenixmountaintaichi It's the split. I realize your using the double spiral but even so @ 17.24 and repeated at 20.47. He can grab your 'about to extend arm' at the wrist with his free hand. And at the other end, your back hand, he can relax his own wrist, circle it in the direction you are twisting his arm but a little bit faster to get under your wrist, take control and reverse spin, then do split with your back arm. Does that make sense..? But I suppose if you've already got split in this spiral fashion it may be technically too late. Your partner would have to momentarily jam your attempt to spiral his forearm or upper arm by momentarily absorbing your force by lowering his own elbow. Using An and Lu..?
So much "cognitive" multitasking needed with Yang skool. I have ended up doing just 1st Road mostly because of the unfamiliarity.😓 Also 4/6 is still unavailable.😏
Haha 4 is done filming and in the editing process! Regarding multi tasking, practice at just the intention level until that is completely automatic. That will be of good benefit without letting thoughts jump in to interfere when trying to incorporate too much. 😃🙏
I hope viewers appreciate the quality of information you provide for free. I'm glad it's posted here so this learning will never be lost.
Thank you! Our understanding and appreciation evolves along different phases of our journey to the top of the mountain. In my own there have been many things I was taught that I did not appreciate at the time as much as something else I was obsessed with at the moment. And with time and growth inevitably comes a moment when I say oh my gosh that was the key I was missing all along ha ha. Luckily I have really good memory whether I valued something or not ha ha. So I would add to what you said and say I’m glad UA-cam will keep these videos around so that when the time is right for us to appreciate and benefit from something, it’ll be there! 😃🙏
And this is why I will always choose you as my Shifu. My favorite part was @ 31:12, " You lose your balance, you lose your orientation and then you lose your life." your little smile and laugh, right after you said that, just cracked me up. 🤣
Aikido uses the misdirection of the movement the same way so that the mind is confused in which direction you are being moved. Great video. 👍
Oh yes Aikido shows really elegant use of that! Thanks for pointing it out! 😃🙏
Tai chi and aikido seem like two relatives, that speak the same language but I've slightly different dialects. Like one or two different words, but kindred spirits.
Chen Taichi getting some love! Nice! Great video Chester!
(Btw, i think there is a mistake in the text around the 11:30 mark. Just wanted to bring it to your attention)
Oh darn you are right about the typo. Maybe I’ll use UA-cam’s caption edit feature to caption over that ha ha. Thank you for pointing it out!
On another note I’m working on reducing confusion on what people will call me. So if you could edit my name in your comment to Shifu Lin or teacher or Shifu, that will help! 😃🙏
One of your best videos IMO, thanks (I’m a Chen style practitioner)
Great video. I also think silk reeling refers to the connection you have with the opponents energy flow, hence no resistance, no running away. If you resist, you block the flow and break “the thread” when you restart, when you run away, you break the thread by moving away and snapping the energy connection.
Nice! That's a really good way of looking at it and does totally help you align with the right intention and feeling. What difference has that mindset made for you in your practice? 😃
Chen seems to be more attacking in nature, and not waiting to borrow energy. It seems to create energy that the opponent can get caught up in, even if the opponent doesn't attack first.
Good observation! I think so too that Yang Tai Chi really prefers borrowing energy while the Chen Tai Chi is happy to use their own energy as long as the opponent is unable to stop it. Thanks for pointing that out! 😃🙌
Not true. Old Yang style has these concepts as well.
An amazing lesson. Thx Sifu.🙏
Thank you for your kind comment! 😃🙏
Great demo Sifu, thank youfor doing a long video with extra details in it, always appreciate the long format.
So I guess in order to defeat silk-reeling a yang stylist would have to use multiple neijin of the 8 main energies, very cool!
Its interesting what you mentioned about the New Road of chen taichi that uses tighter spirals in the latest technology of chen style. But then again Feng Zhiqiyang might have upgraded it further with his hunyuan chen variant style.
Have you looked into the practical method of chen style taichi by Hong Junsheng, do you know how this differs from the above chen styles. I've often wondered as there are quite a few chen style variants.
I just wondered how would a yang stylist know whether they are using either one of two Neijin or Yi. For example when practicing with my partner I can sometimes use the eyes to perform some techhniques sepcifically Split and Pluck by looking to the up and down corners respectively. Do you know what this indicates Sifu?
Great comment and questions! Yes the New Frame of of Chen Tai Chi has tighter and more spirals. Whereas the Hunyuan of Feng Zhiqiang shows bigger circles that have a more relaxed look. Each master advances a certain quality of the art in a certain direction and it's very interesting, like sport athletes and top chefs!
I have looked a bit at Practical Method and I think it is very well named! The movements have a lot of innate fascia manipulation along with the spiraling movements, store release movements of the body power. That makes it easier to apply and have some internal power without getting too esoteric in terminology and teaching. Looking at their videos it looks like a lot of the students are Chinese martial arts college athletes and that method of practical teaching would suit them well.
How would you know whether you are using one or two Neijin? If you have intention to move energy (Neijin) or intention (Yi) in more than one direction, then you are doing it! Doing it with your eyes is often times related to manipulation of Yi, but it also plays a role in activating Yin and Yang as we discuss in our Qi Mastery course. What you describe, looking up and down at the corners, is more with Neijin or Yi, and we discuss that too in those courses! What it indicates is that you are moving in a legitimate and advanced direction with your own Tai Chi experience. And that's something to be happy and proud about, isn't it? Thank you for the great question! The long videos are more work to edit. But there is something satisfying about telling a more complete story to paint a picture that does the art justice. So I'm enjoying it too and will make more as much as I can. 😃🙌
@@phoenixmountaintaichi Thanks Sifu. Its good to know I am hopefully moving in the right direction. I think I made some errors in my initial venture as I was mixing training and techniques from different styles of taichi but I understand now I need to stick to one main style until I get expert in at which point I can mix and match, like yourself.
The other thing is as you personally have done this art for a very long time, did you notice that you feel your dantien or the tissues around your waist and internal musculature have become more dense and doesit feel kind of restrictive?
Simply, thank you!
Thank you very much for your support! 😃🙏
This was great to listen to. I think more has been said and demonstrated in this video than any other material publicly. Both styles have their different emphasis but it's still amazing that it also stems from similar principles.
Thank you! The crazy thing is while watching and editing it I'm thinking "oh I forgot to mention ____ and I forgot to explain ___!" So I'm glad you and everyone are enjoying and benefitting from it. The reality is that there is just so much wisdom and technology in Tai Chi. It would be silly to think I can cover it fully in one video right? The good news is there is plenty more to present and share ha ha. Stay tuned and enjoy! 😃🙌
@@phoenixmountaintaichi can't wait to see and hear more about them.
One of the aspects of returning incoming force we’ve (my brothers and I) have been exploring is treating the point of contact as a sphere that rotates instantly upon contact. Consequently the force cannot find the recipient’s center and returns back to the issuer. I believe the spiraling phenomenon does so in a vectorized manner - ie the spiraling is a rotating point/micro-sphere that moves through space. Would this be a good way to think about it?
Yes that's a fantastic way to think about it! You and your brothers have a perceptive and discerning mind! This concept of rotating spheres that interact with the opponent is used mechanically as well as energetically and intentionally. You see the mechanical aspect of it early on in the video, and the energetic aspect of it in how I describe some of the Yang style methods of dealing with Silk Reeling later in the video. It's quite impressive that you figured it out on your own. What inspired you, or motivated you to explore in this direction? 😃
@ we’ve been studying temple style tai chi for a good part of 3 decades now. After a while we find that all the stylistic/methodological differences etc just disappear. As far as the sphere thing is concerned, my teacher told me about it (he learned it from Master Waysun Liao).
@@daosnet Excellent..! Long time no see Daosnet..!! Waysun Laio is kool..!
Great video, learned a lot about Yang style! Couple questions/comments:
Where do you see Wu（ 吳）style in this? The part where you mentioned the early Yang style reminded me of what i experienced in Wu style, very small spirals.
Second comment, regarding Feng and his Hunyuan style, interesting info about the noncorporeal qigong, I hadn't heard that before. What do you make of the xinyi influence? Afterall he did call what he developed 陈氏心意混元太极拳。When I see video of Feng doing the forms, the expansion/contraction often looks like the Dai style piquan that one of my teachers taught. Thanks again!
I agree with your observation about master Feng Zhiqiang’s Tai Chi. I have not heard him say or write anything regarding extracorporeal Qi, it’s just my observation that he has the look of someone whose awareness extends into the space and Qi around himself in a way that is uncommon to see.
When you look at his history, it’s very interesting and paints a picture of how his own Tai Chi evolved.
Feng first studied under Hu Yaozhen (one finger defeats all under heaven/father of modern Qigong). After teaching Feng his Xinyi, he recommended Feng to study with his friend Chen Fake. At the time, Chen Fake and Hu Yaozhen were among the very best martial artists in Beijing. Hu also studied Daoist internal alchemy, quite possibly through lineages he was introduced to by his Xinyi teacher Peng Tingjun (who also studied Daoist internal alchemy). If Feng included Neijin into his Hunyuan Tai Chi, the Daoist internal alchemy Yaozhen practiced is one of the most likely sources. While Hu Yaozhen’s famous 1 finger demo could be done with Qi or Neijin, the caliber of people he demonstrated it on suggests Neijin as a possible source of his particular Jin.
Peng Tingjun was also remarkable because he is among a small group of masters that were recognized by the lineage holders of Wang Fuyuan as having attained Xingyi’s Hua stage of Jin. So the Xinyi that Feng was exposed to is one of an exceptionally high caliber.
So we can see there was a lot of interaction between Feng and other masters at the pinnacle of their art. What an amazing time it must have been to study and collaborate with these masters! Thank you for the great question and discussion opportunity! What does all of this make you consider now regarding his Tai Chi, or anyone else’s? 😃🙏
Very interesting compairison! So Chen is more spiraling making it more compairable to Baguazhang? Or is that another way of using the spirals?
Yes I think the silk reeling in Chen Tai Chi shares a lot of similarities to the spirals of Bagua especially in Cheng Style Baguazhang. Some differences you might notice is that Bagua prioritizes footwork mobility more than Chen style, while Chen style prioritizes the amount of power that is generated on a solid stance. Both are really beautiful uses of Silk Reeling though, are they not? 😃🙏
Yes they are. Chen is maybe more battlefield formation oriented and Baguazhang more bodyguard protecting agains groups of attackers? Thanks for your insightfull answers. 🙏
@@jeroenkv5034yes I think your hypothesis is very good and probable! Different type of battles call for different applications. 😃🙏
It seems that certain vocalizations may assist the technique and may help prevent damage to organs.
Yes certain vocalization has exactly that effect! How have you found it to be impactful for you? 😃🙏
hmm for this topic i have one question. i hear that zhobao, wuhao, and sun styles are different from chen and from yang and wu. if you can also explain and demonstrate how they are, like in this video, it'd be very appreciated :)
Old six roads, very interesting. Sifu, I wonder what you would do to a counter to the elbow lock by the same technique? I seem to get easily caught in that, meaning just as one is about to apply twisting force on the elbow or just above it, your partner grips your extended arm and rolls their wrist on the other hand to grab you. They then extend the your hand that was grabbing their wrist and apply the elbow throw or lock on your arm..! Like a horizontal figure 8.
Can you give me a time stamp of which elbow lock to ultimately counter? I just want to make sure we talk about the same one ha ha
@@phoenixmountaintaichi It's the split. I realize your using the double spiral but even so @ 17.24 and repeated at 20.47. He can grab your 'about to extend arm' at the wrist with his free hand. And at the other end, your back hand, he can relax his own wrist, circle it in the direction you are twisting his arm but a little bit faster to get under your wrist, take control and reverse spin, then do split with your back arm. Does that make sense..? But I suppose if you've already got split in this spiral fashion it may be technically too late. Your partner would have to momentarily jam your attempt to spiral his forearm or upper arm by momentarily absorbing your force by lowering his own elbow. Using An and Lu..?
Hao !
Xiexie! 😃🙏
So much "cognitive" multitasking needed with Yang skool. I have ended up doing just 1st Road mostly because of the unfamiliarity.😓
Also 4/6 is still unavailable.😏
Haha 4 is done filming and in the editing process! Regarding multi tasking, practice at just the intention level until that is completely automatic. That will be of good benefit without letting thoughts jump in to interfere when trying to incorporate too much. 😃🙏
@@phoenixmountaintaichi Looking forward to it as well as the Striking and Grappling video courses.