2249 The Perfect Hydrogen Car System?
Вставка
- Опубліковано 20 бер 2024
- Join this channel to get access to perks:
/ @thinkingandtinkering
Don't forget to check out my companion channels TnT Omnibus here / @tntomnibus and TnT Talk Time found here / @tnttalktime - Наука та технологія
Rob, can you paint one propeller blade on your demo motor with a white stripe so we can see it spin easier?
Came here to say this very thing - some better contrast would be very welcome
..and how much electricity does it take to smelt that Aluminium?
In fairyland, none of course. In the real world there's a reason most smelters have their own dedicated power plant.
Octopus Energy was selling (paying really) electricity for -3.2p per kWh this morning on its Agile tariff.
BINGO! You see that’s the right question. But let me put a bug in your ear… it’s basically a single use battery stored as a spool of wire. It’s not toxic and won’t go bad over 30 years.
@@TheDrrbc No-one is saying it doesn't work or may have a niche use case. For cars? lol no.
@@j.f.christ8421 IIRC the patent’s apparatus was less than a couple cubic feet in volume, really not that big. Imagine cells the size of a 5 gallon Jerry can weighing about 20kg (10kg Al and 10kg water- all of uniform size that simply slide in and snap in place. One of these could produce enough H2 to drive a small car from Houston to Dallas. 8 of them and you could pull a loaded four horse trailer the same distance. After depleted just split the plastic can, remove the contacts/spindle, and wash out the Al(OH)3 to recycle the everything.
The problem would be getting the infrastructure in place, and that’d be a YUGE problem. While the energy would be less recycling than mining, you’d still need massive electrical generation- maybe 10-100X more than we have now (didn’t bother estimating that). That’s why this isn’t doable.
Rob, I've just read about hydrogen storage via Boron Hydride. They make it like graphene, crush it, add water, and put it in a cell with 2 electrodes. A small current triggers the BH to breakdown, controllably releasing H2. Thanks for the background on the Al-Al underwater spark machine. You should build one! ;-)
You are very good at showing concepts and explaining. This is great. Nevertheless I cannot fully understand your position against EVs. Every day when driving to work, I see lots of electric cars driving around. Few years ago there where no EVs around. Adoption seems to get very fast, even when some people are saying this tecnology is not ready. At no time in history they fixed everything bevore releasing something new. Did they set up gasstations around the globe before selling petrol cars? And please note that a massive industry(mostly from china) is pushing hard to make really cheap mass market EVs. Every new technology emerging needs to compete against this already existing companies
1) The infratructure is not there, and to get itm it will costs enourmous amounts of money, increasing electricity prices
2) just because the emissions are not made 'here' doesn't mean is is 'green' - mining for precious metals is a disaster in itself
3) In the Netherlands, charging infratructure in a mojor city (utrecht) will be disabled between 16h and 21h, in order to spare the distribution system. We're talking single digits percentage EV.
4) EV = centrally managed who gets to drive, and who can not. Alle 'Connected to the cloud'. See what Tesla did with hurricane Irma...
5) energy transport is just way too slow for the amount of transport we need. And we're not even serious about freight transport by EV.
6) With EV, we're converging towards a single point of failure (attack?) energy provider. It is relatively easy to make the grid go down in different EU countries.
7) the more 'green' electric energy we need / produce, the more backup we need for when 'green is not working' - often for extended periods of time, unless we're willing to accept that electricity will be an intermittend thing, and blackouts may occur on a regular basis.
Electric transport is the future, and the right way to go. But we're forcing it upon ourselves without the technology being there. What we need:
a) nuclear fusion
b) battery capacity needs to increase 10 - 50 times per weight
c) independant small production units
d) a redundant net
@@timdenis6788 1) It is. Most people charge at home.
2) The UK grid gets greener every year. If you have a problem with mining then supporting fossil fuel industry seems a bit silly.
3) Have you got a source for that please?
@@jamesbarker7145 1) I live in Belgium. In winter time we are encouraged trough the mdia to 'consume as little as possible' because else the grid will fail. Charging at home makes no sense, because that would mostly mean 'dark hours' after sundown. The majority of "green washed energy" is produced during daytime, while you're either on the road or at another place. Also let's not forget that most people ldon't live in urban aeras with driveway where they can park and charge their EV. Most people are depending on public infratructure.
So there is only 1 real outcome: personal transport will decline in the next few decades. Welcome to 'the free west'...
No problem here in Ireland. Media makes out like there is a problem but majority charge from home. People who do 1,500km a day need to change their job, never mind the car.
@@timdenis6788 Personal car ownership declining would be a great thing, but I'm not as confident on that front as you.
Two thirds of Belgium's electricity is from nuclear and renewables, and growing. This seems to go up at night.
98% of Belgians live in urban areas.
A very interesting take on hydrogen but like all other hydrogen fuels in the transport industry, it has two major drawbacks in that there is no distribution system of any type anywhere and there is nothing that can be repurposed, it must be built from scratch where as the electricity distribution system or grid exists, is well understood and serves mutable markets.
The second is that you spend all that energy producing hydrogen only to use it to make energy to charge a battery or run an electric motor. Charging a battery direct from the generator cuts out that middle man.
Yeah, most people gloss over the "wait, I have to use electricity to make hydrogen so I can make electricity?" bit.
@@j.f.christ8421 There are many interesting takes on hydrogen but they all come down to the same thing for the worlds energy industry, monopoly.
Currently the worlds fuel industry is controlled by a small group of very large companies who are able to do this due to the complexities of extraction, refining and distribution fuel, not the kind of thing one can do on a small scale in the back yard. Hydrogen fits that model and therefore the ability to control the price.
Electricity on the other hand does not, anyone in their back yard can produce electricity with very basic equipment.
At the end of the day it comes down to power and profit.
@@horsebee1 All the worlds hydrogen comes from natural gas, so yeah, the oil companies already have a vested interest. Even if electricity was free hydrogen is a dumb idea due to the points in your original post. No-one is stopping hydrogen because no-one wants it.
That said, half of that hydrogen goes into making fertiliser (the rest to refining), hence the current talking point "I know, lets make ammonia and then turn that back into hydrogen" which is an even worse idea for cars. Improving hydrogen production (eg electrolysis) for making fertiliser is worthwhile.
The only reason EV's are starting to appear to not be the solution we thought they were is because the press, backed by oil companies, are throwing everything and the kitchen sink at them at the moment. Oil sales are falling and they are panicking. Global EV sales continue to rise at almost 10% per annum. They are a simple solution, every house has an electricity supply, batteries last much longer than anyone thought and can be recycled at the end of thier life, there are far fewer parts to go wrong and they need less servicing.
They’re almost there - I think the lithium cells are on bit of a dangerous balance between power density and safety… there’s not much you can do if a single cell is defective and fails with a venting flame that cascades, at any time, and no meaningful warning. Quality control is top priority for reputation in that regard, but we should also be pushing for safety, there are quite a few technologies that aren’t susceptible to the kinds of failures we’re seeing today, but aren’t quite as energy dense.
not really - many EV brands and charge networks have tripped over their own toes. EVangelists simply wish it were so - how they tell it... Accept, not everyone is an Asperger-spectrum sufferer, not everyone wishes to drive a frog (3) every day of the week (or a bra strap/singlet- Y) not every whitegood owner purchases Westinghouse, some like LG, others go BYD - but then the experience lets the system down.... "Shoulda bought a Tesla", theys says.(sic - ABC)...
So many lies in one comment: oil production is at ATH and is expected to grow, sales of EVs slowed down since governments reduced subsidies and benefits.
Batteries are better than initially though but it doesn't mean they are good. The owner has to compromise between range and longevity.
They are also not as reliable as initially though. Most reliable are classic hybrids, then ICEs, then electric and plug-in hybrid is last. ICEs are cheaper in service as parts and specialists are widely available.
A lot of things can be rescued from the ICE car after a significant collision, not too much from electric.
My gasoline car is already 25 and is going to work another decade.
Massive uptick in anti EV press lately. I'm sad to see Robert not on board with such a successful and better technology. Very surprising as EVs are better is so many ways.
@@paudieb
"I'm sad to see Robert not on board with such a successful and better technology. Very surprising as EVs are better is so many ways."
If you don't understand why Robert is not on board, you haven't been watching Robert long enough.
Robert is a Chemist by trade, and a true scientific researcher by habit.
Robert has worked extensively in developing battery technology to bring about improvements that are safe.
Roberts position is the result of his KNOWLEDGE and EXPERTISE that is the result of many years of research, development and testing.
Whereas your position, is based on the false and misleading information spoon fed to you by mainstream media.
Why is Robert not on board?
Because he knows that the technology is not quite ready for the masses that all the fake experts claim it is.
Electric Vehicles are a tool, not a need.
Every tool must be used for what it is best suited for.
Electric Vehicles are more expensive than ICEs and people are simply not willing to pay for a vehicle that cannot be used when the temps get down too an below 40°F.
A vehicle that won't take you 30 miles to your job on the coldest days of the year, is not worth the price to the majority of consumers, on the warmest days of the year.
I shared your previous material about this method. One of responders claimed that maximum 10% of energy of reaction can be used to drive wheel.
ICE is able to harvest 30-50% of hydrogen burning energy, so my intuition says that overall figures should be better especially when fuel-cell is used.
Could you prepare episode about efficiency of this solution? How many kWh can be efficiently harvested? How far we can go on kilo/liter of aluminum? How to count it properly?
There is a video right here on UA-cam where a red truck has been converted to run on hydrogen gas it's a couple of years old but amazing." Hydrogen solved" is the name of the video
The inventor disappeared? Uh oh....watch out!!
funny how that always happens with USA or israel around
yeah, wtf? inventor "disappears" then suddenly is ra hell owns patent! lol 🤣 🇿🇦💚🇵🇸 no they gots to go.
@@esahg5421 -- hmm patents expire, they don't disappear - ok some never get released to public - strategic secrets (the inventors not taking a payday are the muppets)..
@@kadmow yup i got a bridge i wanna sell you
Was he a Whistleblower ?
Another great video.
I spent a few weeks playing with a CaO - Aluminum version of this. I bet BMW did the same - you don’t deplete the Ca as you do the Potassium.
Then I spent 3 weeks trying to adapt so that liquid flowed over a gallium-aluminum surface based on another one of your videos.
Thank you again for giving me lots of things to think about.
ive said it prior rob, im a metal fabricator by trade and that design looks like a welder, aluminium wire spool feeding wire into an earthed vat of water/hydroxide mix, the welder (b it mig/spoolgun) will carry the high voltage and pass it down the wire, might have a look on thee classifieds to see if i can't grab an old used unit to test with
It's a baller concept Rob! It would be really awesome to make. If you showed us how we might build this I would literally convert my car to gas so I can use it with hydrogen! I love electric vehicles and They are simple in concept but as you said we just don't have the infrastructure at the moment.
the implosion and explosion if preasures captured in water with valves instead of pistons ?and magneta and coils on brakes?
Just a small point, but there are several different forms of potassium aluminate or sodium aluminate: Reacting aluminium with a solution of potassium hydroxide in water produces the hydrated form, which is KAl(OH)4. This can be converted into the anhydrous form KAlO2 by heating to high temperatures to drive off water - but dissolving it back into water converts it back to the hydrated form.
The other types are made by dissolving solid aluminium oxide into molten potassium hydroxide (or sodium hydroxide), which you might expect to produce the same form of anhydrous potassium aluminate. But not quite - this method produces a less well defined, more amorphous form, containing clusters of oligomeric aluminates. This is somewhat similar to what you get by dissolving silicon dioxide in molten sodium hydroxide - the sodium silicate made this way is also amorphous, with many different oligomeric and polymeric silicates. This is why solutions of sodium silicate (aka water glass) are rather viscous - reacting sodium silicate solutions with dilute acids causes silica gel to precipitate from solution.
Once the public figured out how it works, they would go nuts building their own. And they wouldn't be able to take such a hit.. Everyone would have free energy. Driving around all willy nilly, not on their dime!
They have stopped letting EV's on some ferry crossings, particularly in Asia, apparently. Their behaviour if they catch fire means the ferry operators are thinking it's just too risky.
Source?
@@manup1931 yes, more than one, that I've seen. Don't take my word for the source's existence or integrity, though. I'm sure you'll find them with a few cunningly chosen search terms and you can decide for yourself.
and a Scandinavian ferry service ,we've been told too . A china watching site I catch every now and again ,says they are hiding the epidemic of cheap and nasty battery fires ,mostly scooters
@@gerryjamesedwards1227 I think he meant he wanted you to provide a source to back up your claim. Otherwise your claim is worthless.
Does that also apply to fetteries that are themselves battery-electric?
I saw that video the other day. Back in 2012 going into 2013 I started to build Hydrogen generators for cars, just for a supplement to increase the mileage with the gasoline. It did work, but the computer didn't like that. I'm not really that smart of a guy, I couldn't figure out how to get the computer to work with the hydrogen. I did however get 52 miles per gal on a 1996 Pontiac Bonneville with a 6-cylinder engine, for one run, before the computer stop it. The best gasoline mileage it ever got was 26 MPG. Oh another thing about Hydrogen, make sure to take the catalytic converter off the car, the hydrogen will melt it. Lol!
i have a question about your graphite Drycell. When you plasticized the graphite by making essentially graphitzed plastic plates, did you get any degradation anymore at all from the anode or oxygen evolution side of the cell. Did you find the in that form the graphite held up. Also did you notice a decrease in production over time or no?
i was just thinking about this method. Electrolysis + aluminum foil kh solutions. Can you try to see what makes the solution conductive? Add these two sub-generator systems like a hybrid car you draw from them rather than the h2 tank.
Dear Rob, I'm not understanding the return-loop part that you mentioned briefly after BMW concerning the (spent) aluminum oxide in suspension. If we break off the hydrogen (and spend it, of course--that's the whole point), won't it require an equal amount of energy input (and then the cost of the new constituents) to restore this to a stable metal? Don't we have a diminishing return there? Is that why BMW dropped the project, I wonder--the cost on the back end, in the lab?
try bubbling the HHO gas thru a liquid hydrocarbon, (eg shellite aka light naphtha aka lighter fluid aka Recosol R55, being a clear liquid , this may fool people to believe your bubbler is water filled) should pick up some long chain molecules and burn more slowly, mix the bubbled and unbubbled HHO gases to get the burnrate you want .. eg a cooking flame or an ICE blend or a welding/cutting flame
- bubbling methane through molten tin releases the hydrogen and sequesters elemental carbon.... (methane pyrolysis) - could be done at point of recovery - OR at pipeline terminus' - for ammonia manufacture without releasing the CO2.
There are still interesting things to work on.
Thanks for covering. I remember reading this back in 2010. Very simple and would work.
Glad it was helpful!
British Columbia has pledged $30 mil to build 500 new EV charging stations. 5000 now. 150,000 each. We currently import 20 percent of our electrcity mostly fossil fuel generated. We meed 10 percent more generating capacity in next 6 years to maintain current levels.
Where did the high voltage charge came from? Seems a little like fusion energy, how much goes in before the device passes the break-even point?
The wire feed and voltage could be supplied by a MIG welder with Aluminum - Silicon without welding gas.
The electrical charge is to clear away the oxidation layer so that aluminium can react with the water . Likely also to all occur in a hermetically sealed vessel free of oxygen..
Hey, Robert good show. that is the device I have seen before, the guy that disappeared. That looks very promising and I recall they actually did do a test with it. there is one more that looked very promising it was created by Bob Lazar, yes the UFO guy. After his jet car, he converted a Corvet into a hydrogen car. the interesting part is that he used solar panels to create and store hydrogen in a tank with some other material in it that made it safe to store in the tank. you may want to look into that one. sorry for the lack of information but I looked into it a long time ago. the two of them are very good ones the other one you mentioned I have no knowledge of. Thanks Robert.
Hey Rob, you should try doing a video on how to build one of these! I would watch the hell out of that
Hydrogen is a dead end for cars - just too inefficient compared to BEVs.
Just because electricity suppliers are increasing the cost (actually falling in the UK at present), that doesn't mean electricity isn't extremely cheap to generate. Solar PV panels are less than £150 per kWpeak in the UK. Over 25 years, that kWpeak of panels will generate more than 20MWh of electricity.
What solar panels will generate over the next 25 years is completely irrelevant.
The real reason that electricity prices are increasing, is because a group of idiots are waging a war against coal, oil and natural gas which has resulted in the cost of those fuels increasing and therefore directly increasing the cost of electricity production .
On the other hand, if you can afford to put enough solar panels on your house and produce sufficient energy for your needs and be off grid, go for it. Nomads with their limited use of electricity, have shown that this is feasible. Currently however, this is the only way that solar panels can be utilized to provide sufficient energy as they won't work on a centralized mass scale.
In Michigan, as demand for electricity is rising, the current Gubernatorial administration, is ordering the shutting down of both coal and natural gas electric production plants. Not because there is sufficient solar and wind production, but in spite of the fact that at this time, there is not sufficient solar and wind production in Michigan to replace coal and natural gas plants.
There's a right way to do things, and there is a wrong way to do things. The globalist environmentalist movement, especially in the US; are intentionally choosing to do things the wrong way.
@@scotttovey It's far from irrelevant. It demonstrates that electricity from solar PV panels is available at less than £0.01 per kWh (inflation free) over 25 years. Even after 25 years, the panels will still be able to output greater than 85% of their rated power.
@@VinoVeritas_ What good will that do for the millions of people that are not in a position to use solar? or even to charge at home? If you can, and it works for you, great, but there are many for whom that is just not possible.
@@scotttovey I'm sure it has nothing to do with increasing profits 😂 "British Gas has announced an increase in profits for 2023, reaching £750 million, a tenfold rise from the previous year's earnings of £72 million."
@@Nite-owl Who's not in the position to use solar?
One has to be suspicious (when potentially good ideas and working models suddenly disappear), that other commercial interests may have shut it down.
Great vid, as always. There are many "hydrogen tanks" out there: alcohol, gasoline, ammonia. Could concentrated sunlight be used to break hydrogen away from these carriers? (I don't have a lab)
If I could use this system to power my '67 Buick and actually make it AFFORDABLE to drive, I would build this TOMORROW!
Besides there being almost no fueling stations in NA .. the cost of refueling these vehicles is outrageous!! I will stick with my ICE car for now, but see my next vehicle being an EV ..
I made my kids some hydrogen balloons a few months ago. I didn't think about the electrons. I should have . Thanks.
Thanks mate, this is really interesting. I think that aluminium is quite energy-intensive to extract from the ore and so perhaps the net cost calculation is not that favourable. But we do have an awful lot of aluminium waste and this could be a great way to recycle that into energy plus aluminium oxide which can be further recycled into aluminium metal. The fact that it produces electricity and hydrogen without CO2 is really good.
- scrap aluminium is much less energy intensive to re-melt into productive metal than to have to refine the oxides... (catch 22 what is the energy worth? vs the metal - where is the energy origins, location and source?)
@@kadmowYes, good points. I guess knowing the actual figures will help as then we just need arithmetic to work it out. Since bauxite is still being mined, I guess that not all the waste aluminium is being remelted to metal, or perhaps the demand for aluminium metal is increasing. We get nothing for free.
But one thing that is attractive about using aluminium to produce H2 and energy is that it is solid and portable. Cost is not the only factor; sometimes convenience is also important.
you can use zinc instead hot zinc reacts with water(steam) making zinc oxide and hydrogen gas.
so if your arcing the zinc it should react with the water... zinc oxide can be use to make zinc metal at home.
How does the energy balance of all that compare to charging a battery?
it's hard to beat 90+%
Zinc-zinc oxide cycle is around 40% efficient that's using the sun... using arcing 62-98% with electrolysis of sodium zincate not sure could be around 20-90%@@garysmith5025
it's hard to beat 90+% zinc-zinc oxide cycle is about 40% efficient that's using the sun but using arcing(62-98%) with electrolysis of sodium zincate not sure could be around 20-90%...i read that sodium zincate as ionic-activator improved the efficiency of water electrolysis. @@garysmith5025
As long as you're looking into Hydrogen, would you at some point look into H²S? It's a byproduct of collecting Biogas, and usually it's scrubbed using Steel Wool in home biogas systems.
Hydrogen Sulfide molecularly is a lot like water, but the bonds are weeker. I was looking into it, it will decompose into H² and elemental Sulfur with light, heat, or electricity, and not so much of either, especially with a catalyst present.
This gas is present in Natural Gas as well, so there's the potential to collect significant quantities of hydrogen while also cleaning up pollution.
I'll need to reread if it's with the catalyst or not, but one paper I read said it would decompose at under 100° f, it would also photo decompose, and it would decompose with electricity. I was working on a design that would basically Make a solar thermal processing unit.
I forgot the chemical, but there's an organic fluid that works as a solvent, the biogas would bubble through the solvent and then the solvent would flow through a photothermal reactor, that's basically just a glass tube with the back painted black so that The sun would shine through the solution, heat it up, and the combination of heat and light would work together to decompose hydrogen sulfide.
After that, you have both upgraded biogas and hydrogen. They could even be bottled and used together, but you definitely need to take the sulfur out to keep tanks and engines from corroding.
Ammonia (NH3) also seems to make sense with on demand conversion to Hydrogen and Ammonia being far less combustible than Hydrogen. Ammonia is already transported and the pressure vessels for storage and transport wouldn’t to handle pressures greater than maybe 10Bar.
Perhaps the bigger issue might be the increased demand for Natural gas to make Ammonia
great beginners guide
Always liked this method of producing hydrogen. I found that it also requires very pure water. If there is any chlorine for example, chlorine gas is produced and thats never good lol. I'd say use sodium hydroxide instead of potassium hydroxide. That way, there is no potassium to separate from the aluminum.
Good stuff 👍
Totally agree with Robert 😅😅
There's only a few problems with hydrogen and they stem with cost.
Making it, moving it, storing it, supplying it and finally using it just finish it off.
EVs may not be the solution, but i can charge mine at home whilst I'm sleeping ready to do 200+ miles the following day.
The average uk person does 20 miles per less a day.
Given electricity at 15p a kwh and 3 miles per kwh it works out very cheap.
I think there are now five hydrogen charging places left in the UK, so i can only see it being a very long uphill struggle for hydrogen to compete.
I live in the same town as Francois's house and scootered past his house (whichever it is) several times there's a very nice view there of Cape Town especially at sunset, as it is on a hill overlooking the Cape Flats across which is the promontorious peninsula. The adress though on the patent can't be resolved as there is an adjacent neighbourhood and a main street there witht the same name so that Google maps won't give a specific location. I'm so pestilential I'd walk up there and ask at some stage, lol. it also looks like he tried to patent it alreay in 1980 when I was 9 months and a day old. It obviously doesn't seem that he intended to have the patent abandoned, but had an arduous battle in getting through to anyone. a kilogram of aluminium? hell, soon there won't be any earth left. I think its gone nowhere as that is a hell of a lot of aluminium
What happened to your ev mini conversion?
Sodium reaction cells have been around for more than 70 years already.
Just feed a super fine supply of sodium gently into water, and you get the voltage and the hydrogen.
IDK about for cars per se, but I definitely think hydrogen as chemical storage of electric power will probably out last the cycling of a battery to the point of better efficiency =, there are a lot of numbers to do for that, some of which are unknown, but as long as you use metal sponge storage, you can storage a lot of hydrogen very purely and very stably. Chemically produced hydrogen is a way to go for certain quick charge routes I bet, but personally I think a tank exchange strategy would be fine.
Is 7.5p per kwh(and just over 1ppm) not cheap to run? Most electricity suppliers offer an EV tariff.
We're still waiting for your 'make the hydrogen in microwave using plastics' video😂❤
Interesting take on the production of hydrogen there. Only last night I was watching a documentary where hydrogen was produced by mixing hydrated zinc and hydrochloric acid. I reckon this method seems a lot less dangerous! However, I wonder if these methods are any better than simply putting electrodes into water?
i still think the best way to use hydrogen is al fuel replacement
in combustion engines
- Iceland, Norway and BC (big geothermal and hydro resources) needs to vastly increase their Aluminium /Zinc / Magnezium smelting - there is plenty of bauxite to mine still (make the recycling back channels extremely robust - to ensure success).
Tried that way back in the 1970's. Hydrogen doesn't always burn clean.
I think diesel/gas electric is a lot more practical. In many cases you get double the fuel mileage, with the added benefit of short range full electric. You can then also use your vehicle to power your home if the power is out - or a hundred other things that require electricity. If you haven't seen them yet, check out Edison Motors in Canada. They've built a diesel/electric logging truck.
danke
How can the aluminum oxide be turned back into aluminum metal? Does this process use more energy than you can get from the hydrogen cell? Would be worth a look and very interesting.
By way of a termite reaction (reduction) one can change iron oxide into metallic iron. It's reduced by using Metallica aluminum.
Not exactly your question, but the same principle applies.
Yes, there are many methods to revert back and I think some of them could work similar to a battery or metal smelting. Fuel cells aren't 100% efficient (current commercially avaiable cars are around 40%), so yes. A regular car is less than 20% efficient by the way.
Of course it uses more energy, or it would be a endless energy source. No, hydrogen as a fuel is really dumb outside of certain processes, etc. Certainly it's not really a good solution for cars. Batteries get cheaper and safer and longer lasting and faster to charge, by the year... It's good enough for most cases now, and it will be way better and solve almost all cases soon. The roundtrip over hydrogen is very wasteful and costly in all sorts of ways, which is mostly not worth it. "White hydrogen" and "green hydrogen" is useful for steel making, or very special cases, but not for cars, or normal trucks. Possibly for extreme long haul. Generally, the teething problems of the EVs will be solved, and in a few years almost all new car sales will be EVs, regardless of laws. They will simply be better, faster, less service, and cheaper to run.
@@verylongtrainThanks for the generic spam.
BMW is working on Hydrogen fuel cell vehicles (HFCV) . If I remember right they were supposed to release one this year or early 2025. But hydrogen powered vehicles are a lot more complicated than these patents would have you believe. That's why BMW has been working on it for decades.
Robbert, WHY has no one used water to produce an oxygenated hydrogen fuel to produce internal combustion???? it should only take a miniscule amount to equal the BTU of gasoline. OR , am I dreaming ?
They did, way back in the 1970's.
check out the Francisco Pacheco hydrogen generator...
In short: first someone should build a working prototype car, then settig up "aluminium" fueling stations, than building factories and scaling up for mass production. After this we can talk if this is an alternative to EV tech available now
One way RedOx reactions using reactive metals - still requires "renewable metal refining/production" to "make a difference" compared to the status quo... (....Al-Air redox too, Zinc,Magnesium..)
Solid metals are ideal long term energy storage - on demand hydrogen has merit despite the low efficiency of thermal engines. (Offset by the high cost of PEM stacks and large energy capacity batteries - to date)
- even Thomas Edison realised all of this, in the end the means of distribution of raw energy - electrons - long distances win over a complex logistical system involving trucks and manpower (it wasn't Just an AC/DC war, it was a "rights fight" - for the right to print money / raise capital..
Why is it that we couldn't use HHO generator's? It uses stainless steel instead of aluminum. It can be ran off the cars battery, the car charges the battery, you can easily separate the oxygen off it and just release it into the air, the hydrogen can be pumped/stored in tanks to run the car. The solution to run the HHO generator can use easy to buy/find products and easily replaceable stainless steel. Heat produced would be the only thing that you would have to worry about but I'm sure that could be an easy fix as well.
- Correct, yes, a HHO generator (that works) consumes/erodes, the material it is made of - SS. (There is no free energy despite ?? claims) BUT yet it does not run perpetually in isolation - but as ai intermediate energy store of otherwise surplus electricity. - ?? The claims of HHO acting as a gasoline combustion enhancer ?? similar to LPG injecting diesel engines - the LPG is cheaper than the diesel (per MJ) and promotes improved combustion (? less particulates - now we inject ad-blue instead.) , but as an energetic primemover HHO production consumes more energy than it liberates - them's the thermodynamic obstacles.
HHO is the dumbest idea ever. Just use the battery to run an electric motor instead.
Nice video. I like the idea that domestic hydrogen could be used to reduce gas consumption (if introduced at the point of combustion due to hydrogen rendering pipes brittle) meaning the current burners wouldn't need much adjustment.
How would you make the hydrogen?
@@jamesbarker7145 Magic, like all other solutions. Meanwhile the electricity required to make the hydrogen would be more than sufficient to replace the gas stove with an electric one.
@@jamesbarker7145 with the processes outlined in the video. Or maybe solar-powered water electrolysis. Though its current inefficiency reduces ROI, so does adding battery storage costs.
@@daveh6356 so you’d need various chemicals delivering to your house? Why not just use electricity?
@@jamesbarker7145 can the price or availability of grid-electricity ever be trusted again? & why would people pay for energy that nature provides for free & conversion devices reduce total, ongoing costs? The video outlines the use of chemicals for hydrogen production - that's kind of the point.
Clean energy shouldn't just be for the affluent 'eco-concerned' & replacing gas appliances with electric ones costs a lot of money as does thermal or electro-chemical storage. For mainstream adoption, interim steps are necessary & hydrogen storage may be a solution.
"disappeared"
Well, with all the aluminium oxide you could start making synthetic rubies as a side husle😁
You are best❤️🙂
The process of making aluminum metal is fairly electrically intensive, I wonder how the full cycle numbers stack up?
They don't. It takes about 17kWh to make a kilo of aluminium. Aluminium-air batteries exist, and a 1kg battery will produce about 1.5kWh of power. Efficiency is below 10%
Compare that to a typical lithium battery which is over 95% efficient. (Lithium batteries are really really good stores of electricity.)
@@j.f.christ8421 - and where does the energy for your Lithium battery originate, nice if oit is from the sun, wind or hydro (Same for smelting Al - though carbon electrodes do evolve CO2 - solar efficiency is fairly low after conversion, transport and storage - maybe a little above 10% - worst case with modern tech - NB plants are very energy inefficient, but they do simply "exist" independent of humanities industry..)
@@kadmow Y'know you need to mine the aluminium as well? Also lithium batteries don't have the problem of shipping them back for recycling when they're flat.
This "but but but" argument works both ways. Aluminum-air batteries have been around for a long time, no different to this idea. They're gone nowhere (for good reasons) as well.
I was thinking of repurposing my wind turbines to make hydrogen, then using it later to heat the shed.
Maybe a sand battery is better for heating purposes. Hydrogen is a huge problem to store safely and effectively.
ok back to the bench. need some help doing this with gallium and aluminum instead. with small amounts im making enormous gas pressures. i was expecting alot of heat but can speed up the process by adding heat. very cool in garage.
Since they're having a hard time storing excess power, instead of dumping it they could produce hydrogen and oxygen from it. I really like the EV motors but I don't know why they aren't run off a (insert fuel of choice) generator instead of seats placed on a 1 ton battery pack. Probably over 50% of the battery is used dragging the battery around!
Now if some one were to get the machine to work with aluminium cans instead of a strip of aluminium. Then all you would have to do is go to the nearest dumpster, pull out a bunch of aluminium cans, chuck them in to the cars "tank" and carry on with your journey.. I guess that is going to need someone with a lot of time for research.
Had the same thought, maybe a use for all those Bud light cans that no one wants.
Sodium hydroxide is catalytic according the Canadians for this reaction. Aka not consumed❤
That doesn't make sense, since the hydrogen is coming from the hydroxide... so, not catalytic. The sodium hydroxide and aluminum are converted to sodium tetrahydroxoaluminate and hydrogen.
Saw this done in Back to the future film🤣🤣
@@chrisbingham3289 - banana peels...
oh, the humanity...
😆
Hydrogen is a component of water tho so combusting it is a really bad idea in general. That's why that guys patent isn't getting picked up. We can't go around combusting Hydrogen.
That is sn interesting idea, to keep the hydrogen locked in solid/liquid form, to be produced/released on demand in the vehicle via some sort of modular power cartridge you presumably would swap out at a station. You said it's relatively easy to restore the Aluminum hydroxide solution back to metal. Is that a procedure you can demonstrate? The main cause for environmental problems is human failure to heed the lesson of nature, that requires closed loop cycles. We often use the imaginary human concept of economics as an excuse to not complete the loop and recycle our waste products, because we're addicted to the delusion of getting something for nothing forever without consequence. It is that mindset which drives false innovation of new tech that uses and discards rather than uses and recycles, recharges, reuses. Chemical reactions like this offer possible paths forward, whereby a refueling station may be able to recharge it's own waste into reusable hydrogen cells using locally generated wind/solar/water/lunar power generation tech, with local grid battery storage systems capturing excess production to be released during high demand and/or underproduction.
They are a solution for sure. They are the solution for anyone that always wanted an electric car. The fact that politicians are trying to mandate dates for electric only sales is rediculous or hilarious depending on your personality and level of common sense. In no way can the grid support what they want to do.
Fact. Insurance is still a little higher than other cars but not much. Maintenance is way down and you save a load of money on oil, filters and fuel. I think as soon as they start making electric hybrids you will see more people get on board simply because the infrastructure isn't there in all areas.
An electric hybrid is an electric car with full 200-400 mile range but it's got a little gas burner to charge the batteries at a rate high enough to keep them going in case of vandalized charging station or no charging station.
Plug in gas hybrids just don't have enough range and the engines are still too big.
If we could just produce hydrogen on demand enough to power a car it would be the cleanest most powerful most abundant resource in the world!
You ain't seen nothing yet😊. Hydrogen will get stupid expensive when demand steps up (Basic economics) and 10,000 psi tanks in a crash or general leaks equals ...kabooom 💥 Happy days.
Can't wait till the 900 watt Solar Aptera comes out.
I disagre, its the execution of Ev's that are the problem because money, Tesla want to sell expensive luxury cars that need huge battery packs that need huge energy to charge, make Ev's smaller with a sub 30kw pack and suddenly most home solar systems can practically charge them then all their current problems are solved. It amazes me almost nobody talks about this as the obvious solution. Look at the current Byd Seagul, its already about 12 grand and would serve 90% the needs of most people. If governments subsidised a similar car/solar and storage to cost the same as buying a regular car we would see mass adoption very quickly.
most apparatus's like that has to be examined a lot to make it as flawless as possible and easy to use before it makes it to the market for the consumer to use
Hydrogen combustion cars and Hydrogen cars are not the same. A Hydrogen car is actually an electric car.
We should start naming vehicle classes by their on vehicle energy source.
Diesel combustion
Gas/petrol combustion
Hydrogen combustion
Propane combustion
Hydrogen electric
Lithium Electric
- so you need(ed) to edit the OC as "hydrogen fuel cell cars are not the same as hydrogen combustion cars" or vice versa - that is self evident in the name, though both react the hydrogen with oxygen to release energy... lol.
@kadmow it would be even more accurate to call them Hydrogen PEM vehicles, because a fuel cell is actually just a container of fuel. All vehicles with fuel have fuel cells.
Saw a Tesla Y this week amongst other traffic. It was wobbling. I can't remember the last time I saw a vehicle wobbling.
Hydrogen 36$/Kg🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♀️🤦♀️
Robert is way off on EVs. I own an EV over 3 years now and love it. Done all my own repairs on every fossil car I've owned and hands down, BEV for the win. Minimal servicing. Cheap to run.
EV tariff rate is 2 hrs 2am to 4am at around 10c per kWh
We've a 58kWh battery and we get about 380km for our driving style.
The 2 hrs boost rate gets us 14kWh (7 per hour) which easily does our daily commute. It means all our charging is on the boost rate.
So 58 x 0.10 €5.80 full charge.
That's 0.0153 or 1.5 cent per km.
No Timing belts or oil changes or oil filters of fan belts, no plugs, No heater plugs, No carbon filters, no engine air filters. Combustion engine has 2000 moving parts. BEV has only 20. Go figure.
ALL of the world's existing industrial hydrogen demand/supply needs to the cleaned up first BEFORE we start considering new applications for hydrogen like transportation.
The current black/brown hydrogen production is one of the largest sources of human atmospheric carbon emissions.
Sure we can make hydrogen with cleaner chemical processes, electrolysis with green electricity, electrolysis with nuclear electricity, and even mine natural deposits. All these are better than how it is being made now.
But ALL production needs to be moved to these sources THEN we can see if hydrogen makes sense for transportation.
Though as it is currently, it is used so inefficiently in transportation it just does not compare to bEV. It is 10x better to just plug the electricity into the EV than to use it to make hydrogen, ship & store the hydrogen, get the hydrogen into the car, then turn it into miles driven.
Sadly bEV's are still the best thing we have for transportation, even though they are not perfect. Still the most economical and lowest emissions way to drive a mile is in a bEV. Hydrogen cars are decades away from being close to comparable, of they ever make it.
If you do not think a bEV is good enough, today your only option is to stop driving.
Dont cry for me ford cortina
The lock picking lawyer used Gallium to destroy a padlock made from aluminium and showed how Gallium mixed with the aluminium can produce hydrogen and that the Gallium can be retreived afterwards. [593] Gallium vs. Titalium - Abus Padlock Meets a Gruesome End
Thats the thing about creating opposing fuels ...The creators disappear!
...before the people they've scammed figure it out!
You are going about it the wrong way.
First is that charging an EV is more convenient than having to fill up with fuel and you can make your own electricity which makes the cost of electricity irrelevant. But with regards to your idea of aluminium to naked hydrogen, there is a much simpler way.
You use an aluminium air battery which already exist. You can get 1600km on one charge. It is also much simpler than your proposed option because it takes water and aluminium as input and the "waste" is aluminium hydroxide which is disolved in the water and can easily be drained for recovering the aluminium. The problem is that you need to keep adding aluminium and draining the aluminium hydroxide and that is much less convenient and practical than just plugging the car to a power point.
I UNDOUBTEDLY hate electric cars.
Not that I'm super fond of hydrogen either.
that foil has hardly any alu in it is more tin-foil
It's typically around 96 to 98% Aluminum and rest other metals for a little extra strength.
@@justinw1765 than its Not food save !
alu is toxic (specialy at cooking temps)
U can store cold food in it
but Never heat-up food in those containers
@@lunytrickz That is kind of a yes and no. Aluminum metal does not exist in nature, and for a reason. It is very reactive, especially with air/oxygen. All aluminum metal has a thin layer of reacted, non metal aluminum on it, called aluminum oxide. Aluminium oxide is very inert and non reactive. It's also very hard and tough stuff.
The problem with aluminum comes in exposing it to extreme pH conditions, whether acidic or alkaline. When it touches strongly acidic or alkaline substances, especially in combo with heat, then yes, the aluminum oxide layer can break down some and some aluminum metal ions can leach directly, and yes, that form of aluminum is toxic.
Aluminum can be used with low acidity and low alkalinity foods with not much issue, especially with cold storage, like wrapping up a sandwich. If there is any question or worry, just put a little parchment paper between the food and the foil. Problem solved.
Don't ever cook things like tomato sauce or lemon based stuff, in non coated aluminum cookware--that is a recipe for too much Al exposure.
Anodized Al is fairly safe for most conditions, because the aluminum oxide layer is MUCH thicker than the natural layer that forms on all aluminum metal that is exposed to air.
lol, "tin foil" is mostly pure aluminium.... lol.
just look it up, I have never seen "real tin foil" in any kitchen supplier.
@@kadmow Out of curiosity I decided to "look it up", and the comments (apart from @lunytrickz) are correct. Typical aluminium foil is about 99% pure Al, has a bit of silicon & iron added. I'm not overly surpassed by that, "pure" metals tend not to be all that useful.
Tin foil is still around for some reason, although not much since WII. I've never seen any. It also tended to contain a bit of lead, so I think I'll stick with the aluminium "tin foil" despite @lunytrickz thinking it'll give me a bad case of the Alzheimer's or something.
EV and the mining of cobalt in kongo is the most despicable thing to ever happen to mankind ... the fact that it's allowed in the way it is makes me hang my head in shame ... 6 million displaced people making our tech future 😔 kids working is disgusting 😔 how can we come so far with our morals but yet we let other parts of the world slip into such despair ... our tech shouldn't be made like this✌️🙏
- There are dispicable activities the world over - Charles Taylor's blood diamonds, Volcano Sulphur - virtual slavery, Indian children making dung patties or bricks, children in "artisan" mines - the world over ( "TIA- nobody cares" - from the activist movie "Blood Diamonds" - or they would REALLY do something )- -there are a whole lot of evils in this world and they aren't limited to the Congolese slave markets. (hyperbole is fun to mock)
LFP batteries are cobalt free, though Glencore mines cobalt in Australia - Tsingshan Group also in Indonesia as well - so not all Co is African "blood incorporated".
Take a chat to the Taliban in Afghanistan if you want another insight to evil.
0:45 Charging an electric car is only a problem for city dwellers. Everyone with a house and a car port, has no such problems. Just stop listening to devious people and the supposed problems of ending our usage of piston driven cars will just vanish.
This is still far more complicated than the Air Car ( Wikipedia)
I've been feeling sad lately, but why? Because it has become boring, everything revolves around banal and obvious things, as well as their thoughtless repetition. At the same time, even more obvious things are completely ignored. If I say that there is a device that emits electrical energy, and along the way also decomposes water, consuming only water. You will say that this is not possible and only on the basis that someone told you this, and you unconditionally believed it. Meanwhile, such a device was demonstrated visually in Korea and, in essence, this device is much simpler and more effective than you demonstrated in your video.
Everything said in the first 45 seconds was utter rubbish. Electricity prices are falling, not rising. Maintenance costs are much lower for EVs than ICE. Depreciation is no greater for EVs. Insurance costs are only slightly higher and reflect the typically higher performance of EVs. Charging infrastructure is perfectly adequate for the number of EVs currently on the road and rollout is accelerating, I have only waited once in 5 years to use a charger and that was no more than 2 minutes. Japan only "hates" EVs simply because their beloved Toyota has made some very bad decisions and is in real danger.
Robert is wrong about EVs. I've driven an electric car for the last 6 years. It's cheap to maintain and costs around $US 10 to charge at home, enough to drive 400kms. (+ RUCs) The cost to insure is about the same as an equivalently priced petrol car.
Lucky you. Do bare in mind that there are other areas that are not the U.S. though. Certainly in the UK we've been seeing a few insurance companies even refusing point blank to insure EV's. The depreciation of most EV's over here is simply staggering, and the charging network is just not mature enough. Not to mention the fact that it takes upwards of an hour even on fast chargers to fully charge an EV and not everyone has the facility to charge at home either, nor do we have very many places that either have the ability, or are prepared to service EV's. As far as is concerned over here, they're not the panacea that was first expected.
Have you considered that an equivalent petrol car is just as over priced. Ask a person living on minimum wage if either is cheap? Our believes is programmed and that is the basis for our realities.
Sure, there are outliers in every statistical field but you'll find the vast majority of EV owners have an experience similar to mine, here in New Zealand. Sadly Robert is parroting misinformation curated by certain vested interests.@@Nite-owl
But Robert wasn't talking about sociology. He was repeating misinformation about the costs associated with EVs.@@raymondglad5593
@@chrissscottt I can't speak for Robert, but from my own personal experience, EV's are just not practical. They turn a 3 hour car drive into a 4 hour car drive due to the need to charge on the way, whereas I can do it in 3 in my diesel with half a tank that took me less than 5 minutes to fill. I'm also not in a position to charge at home, so that's out, and therefore means I'd be at the mercy of being charged exponentially more for the power. For anyone that never goes further than say 40% of their vehicles range, and can charge at home, I think they're ideal. But for people that prefer the freedom of being able to jump in and drive as far as they want/need, they're simply no use. Certainly in the UK, I can drive to see my son 3 hours away for around £40 worth of fuel, it would cost me probably close to at least DOUBLE that in an EV. Your energy costs in New Zealand in 2022 were roughly the equivalent of £0.15. In 2024 UK at an EV charging station, we're looking at £0.45 at a minimum, up to £0.85 depending on the vendor. It's ridiculously overpriced here ! Bare in mind that the population of London is greater than the population of the whole of New Zealand, we're a pretty big outlier 😂
Any ice car can RUN ON HYDROGEN
EV also extremely dangerous in many ways
My hho cell is better and reachable power
I NEVER ONCE thought that electric cars were the answer to ANYTHING.
So you don't think at all?
EVs are 80 times less likely to spontaneously combust according to global data currently available. Where I live I use solar generated power to charge my EV. Public charging infrastructure is creasing quite rapidly and is way cheaper than petrol or diesel.
- depends by what spontaneously means... (spellcheck the "creasing" word..)
Public charging "way cheaper" than a primary fuel source - is an uneconomical state of affairs , likely to change. (electricity in bulk is a value added product largely - or still up to 50% in many developed markets - derived from burning something) Daytime peak renewables aren't the annual average.. Yes my home solar setup is very nice, but even with that, the electricity power grid access-charges are intruding day by day to claw back their profits (even though I export 75% of the power I generate and only import a pittance from the grid)...
Most ICE car fires occur whilst under way (maintenance problems) - many as a secondary effect of criminal activity or electrical faults.
Many EV fires are indeed "spontaneous" and occur in storage or charging whilst garaged..
I have driven vehicles for 30 years, none have erupted into a fireball (despite gasoline in most of them, propane and diesel in others) - though I have seen a few car fires and explosions (other people's) I did have an electrical fault once which burnt the wiring harness - The presence of electricity is the most common denominator in "spontaneous" car fires ICE OR ELECTRIC.
the biggest issue wiith cars is that they're cars. the main solution to the car problem is to stop unnecessary car use, hand in hand with eliminating burning of fossil fuels.