I’d argue SA2, there’s a ton of secret ways to get more points to get an A rank. Unleashed essentially has a no hit policy to getting an A rank on the daytime stages which is fine and I don’t think it’s bad but I like how even though SA2 was linear there are tons of secrets to find that reward creativity and skill
This is perfectly said, excellent job! I am also happy to see some appreciation for 06s ranking, I was VERY surprised how challenging it was to get S ranks. SA2s A Ranking is the best in my opinion because it requires you to be fully engaged and requires all of your attention to get those A ranks no matter the amount of time in the games. Generations on the other hand gives you an S rank for basically just not dying..and takes a lot of the inner satisfaction of getting that S rank due to it being basically a participation trophy, that’s my two cents on it!
@@maymakesart8300 unleashed had harder S ranks and the game doesn't tell you what is needed to get to the next rank. In Adventure 2 it was easy to know what is needed for the next rank. But tbh I like harder S ranks as it gives you a reason to get better at the game.
As someone who's actually gotten all S-ranks for Sonic Colors, I can say that game did it unbelievably well. I think there was only two stages in the entire game that I got an S-rank on my first try, and the rest I had to master with the use of Wisps, speed, and red ring/ring collecting. Sure it was infuriatingly demanding, but it made me super proud to see that sparkly gray S as a reward. When I went back to Generations, I was taken aback by just how simple S-ranks are to achieve in that game, not to mention your ranking gets boosted up a rank simply because of a "perfect bonus", which I thought was so unnecessary. Weirdly enough I think Forces had some challenge to get an S-rank on a handful of stages, but I hated how the lowest rank you could get was a C-rank. I can't really speak my mind with the other games as I never bothered for ranking systems in Sonic games until Colors, though I will say that none of them were a pushover with S-ranks and/or A-ranks, which was a good thing.
One of thing I actually did like in Heroes and Colors, and one of the things I disliked in Generations. SA2 and Unleashed still did this the best. If anyone is curious, try the new Score Generations mod from about a month ago. It’s really a breath of fresh air for the game.
I think Unleashed had the best ranking system. I remember when I was playing Arid sands (Day) I got a E , played the level again a couple of times and got a C. But after a whole month of playing that level over and over, I finally got a S.
@@rosejett144 Yeah and the Day S Ranks were just down right ludicrous and never made it clear what gives you points and what each stage wants you to focus on like Savannah Citadel just cares about enemies and Arid Sands just cares about time which is really stupid.
@@rosejett144 Maybe you're just really good at Unleashed lol. But honestly 100 percenting it made me not like the Day Stages in that version it's like Death by a thousand papercuts with the unresponsive buttons, input delay, broken drift, lag, etc etc. I still like the Night stages tho and everything else about the 360 version tho. Ngl I prefer the Wii version now (which I also 100 percented) I think it has way less issues and is more fun overall.
I 100% agree that a good ranking system gives satisfaction, I love mastering the stages of Sonic Unleashed and then receiving an S rank. The same goes for SA2 and Heroes. Colors is kinda mixed because what gives you S ranks is sitting around getting color bonuses, spamming quick step in QS sections, and getting other bonuses like drift in those sections. I wish it was more based on stage mastery other than spamming what gives you a bonus score
Totally agree on the Colors thing. I always despised the ranking system in that game. Good ranks in a Sonic game shouldn’t require you to drill in a circle for 10 minutes.
Shadow the Hedgehog's ranking system was pretty interesting due to that whole mechanic of Hero and Dark points making you have to think about how you're playing the level if you're going for a specific mission to A Rank it.
@@segaspice4062 We need unleashed ranking system. SA2 is difficult to the point of not being fun. Having atleast a little leg room feels nice instead of needing to be literally frame perfect
@@trymetrix857 i played unleashed for all s ranks and i can say that is a straight up lie, sa2 requires you to be good and unleashed requires you to be a freaking god, i literally loose s ranks on unleashed by being hit once in the stage!
I feel like you were on the losing side of the debate (Sorry), but this was one of your best arguments/points in that debate: "Sonic Colors you have the option just complete it fast and get a shit rank and have the ego of 'hey, I got a fast time' *or* you can have the ego of 'hey, I beat this level and I mastered it with all the level gimmicks and all the wisps.' You can do that. You can have all sides. Sonic Generations only has one side, and that is time. Sonic Colors has everything." And unrelated to that, a ranking mod for SA1 would be interesting. (If there isn't one already) Enjoyed the video, Matt.
The rank system in Sonic Generations 3DS is different, and it is challenging You didn't metion it, but Sonic Advance 3 have one of the best ranking systems too, it only requires speed, but you REALLY need to know the levels and master it to be the fastest and get all the shortcuts, and learn to use the characters in the best way
Advance 3 ALSO makes the team system is super cool and can use your team to beat the level, like sunset hill act 2 or 3 theirs a big wall that covers most of the stage BUT if your knuckles you can climb over it to get an amazing time.
4:52 Episode Shadow actually had a difficult ranking system which required you to be perfect at the levels in order to get it. Getting the S rank in Virtual Reality was insanely fun and challenging. Kinda wish the whole game was like that :|
Important video! And yes I hard agree, S ranks are very important as an indicator that you have properly experienced all there is to experience, in terms of all the design choices the developers prepared for players. Aspects like not getting hit, not being too slow, killing enough enemies, not hitting civilians (Black knight) and more of each level section!! Btw I think Black knight has a fantastic ranking system if you want to check deeper into that! It has an honorable knight parameter where you don't attack the backs of enemies, and dont harm civilians, and ofc giving rings to civilians and such
In my personal opinion, the individual value of each rank is as follows: E rank: Pathetic. D rank: Needs improvement. C rank: Well done. You tried. B rank: Good, but not great. A rank: Great job. S rank: Perfection!
sonic unleashed ranking system was the best imo out of the whole series u feel so accomplished when u get an s rank u gotta know the level in and out to get it
You love that one cyberspace from frontiers if only more were that strict with the time, currently replaying Generations on PC because of the hype of Sonic X Shadow Generations & no joke it took me 16 minutes to beat Classic Planet Wisp & still somehow got a B. The most challenging aspect of the entire game so far was the achievement to get through Modern Chemical Plant without ever being submerged in water. It took nearly an hour of attempts, but once I got it, it felt amazing. For replayability & longevity, I hope they add fun achievements in the stages in future games.
In Generations and Forces it was an issue anyway. They just handed out S ranks there. You know there's a problem when you have to try really hard to get a B rank or lower. Great video!
Maybe with the tails save, they could make it to where if you use it, your score lowers, meaning you get a worse rank than what you would if you beat it without using the tails save. I think that would keep some of the challenge with getting S ranks in colors ultimate.
I agree with you. I'm not that hardcore player that always 100% everything and I actually only did this on Riders, Zero Gravity and Adventure DX (from Sonic games), so you might think I'd want to get best ranks just by playing the game, but it honestly feels so bad to get good ranks after being objectively bad. I remember how I sucked at some stage in Forces (I do not remember the details) and almost got offended when I got best rank possible for it, lol At the same time I'd like to point out that the feeling when I struggled with something in these games as a child just to get the worst rank possible is horrible (I freaking sucked at Heroes 😢)
I’ve only recently started to care about S ranks recently and it really helps prolong the games playtime. I’ve put over 30 hours on Sonic Colors trying to complete everything
I recently started replaying generations after all this time. I was surprised I was making so much mistakes, taking things slow and safe, and still getting S rank. The only way I'd get a lower rank was if I died trying to get a tricky red ring on my first try. It's really forgiving and easy to get an S rank, while colors (the original, haven't played the new one) I remember it being at least somewhat hard to get S ranks. I totally agree with you, a ranking system should be hard to master.
I personally am OK with harsh ranking systems, but I prefer it to either be points or time. Not both. I need it to be measurable. I need to be able to understand my progress.
The Sonic Rush trilogy had good ranking systems too, don't forget those. Those really pushed me to my limits and forced me to get good lol. In the case of 1 and Rush Adventure, it was all about doing tons of tricks, blazing through the level, and getting tons of rings, and if you don't do one of those well enough, you get an A Rank instead. In the case of Colors DS, you mainly get S Ranks by clearing the stages fast, but you WILL NOT get an S Rank on your first go. It was all about using the Wisps to your advantage, and using those to go faster. I also thought Episode Shadow had a good ranking system, Virtual Reality is infamous for the VERY strict S Rank requirement
Damn I always thought that I was the only to get mad at the forces and gens super easy S ranks Sometimes getting the strategies and training the level can be pretty frustrating, but when you se the shining S (or pink/red A) the satisfaction is great, then you see that wasn't that hard to get it, and now you're not just better at the game but you feel that Oh, and nice video :^)
I just like getting better times on my runs. Like getting the minus times is super satisfying in generations. And getting the A ranks in adventure 1 is also fun then improving that time still bring me back to that game.
Tbf sonic forces ranking system wasn't that bad. The game was just so easy that u were guaranteed an s rank. If u have 0 rings at the end of the stage you won't get the s rank, it's just that the game is so easy that u won't actually have the challenge of not losing ur rings.
uh no the video game’s design is structured partly by the ranking system. if it’s the game’s problem,, then it is the fault of the ranking system by default
Really good topic to discuss. I really liked the ranking system of every Sonic game up until Generations. It actually feels like it was going to have a better one but at the last second they toned it down. Even Generations 3DS has a better one.
The main issue I see with Sonic Adventure 2's ranking system is that you have to know what you've gotta go out of your way to do, and it's a lot more cryptic feeling than how Sonic Colors handled that. If you haven't memorized where certain things are, you're basically stuck no matter how hard you play the level... and Metal Harbor is actually a good example of what looks like bad ranking design, with the short tunnel section with absurd bonuses that could significantly boost your rank if you A) get lucky or B) have somehow memorized the movements you need to make in this incredibly slippery section.
I liked sonic rush's ranking system. You had to earn a certain amount of points to get an S. Just being fast isn't enough, you have to do tricks, defeat enemies and be stylish overall kinda like SA2's but a little toned down. I don't consider that a bad thing though
I definitely agree with you, but I also think there should be a slightly better balance. I think Sega is trying to make the S ranks super easy so everyone can enjoy getting them, because other games it was so difficult. But the way it is now makes ranks pointless. I would prefer things closer to the level of sa2, but maybe just a tad less difficult. I don’t want to take the challenge away from the people who love perfecting and completing the most difficult challenges, but it would be nice if I didn’t have to be a god at the game to get the highest rank also. The funny thing is despite that, the easy S ranks in Generations is one of the least annoying issues I have with the game. While I do like Generations, there are so many things that make it a frustrating experience. But I’m not gonna get into that.
I think generations’ ranking system was perfectly fine, but unleashed (HD), SA2, heroes & colours definitely had better ranking systems though. Also sonic games replay-ability wise are more than just their ranking systems & generations’ is no exception cause it still has great replay value in the form of the hard mode bosses, extra missions, the Red star rings for unlockables etc.
There is one thing Sonic Forces doesn't get enough credits personally. You said that Sonic can do like the relics in Crash Bandicoot, and make you have to complete the stage super fast. Well, while Sonic Forces has pretty easy S ranks, the time trial missions are exactly that. They make you complete the stage as fast as possible, and beat the time. And even as soon as Ghost Town, those missions are very hard in my opinion. You need to perfect your run, and not lose time. Of course not every stages have those missions, while every stages have a S rank, but at least there is some mastery of the stage required in the game, and is in my opinion the best part about Sonic Forces.
300th Also I would like to see a video where you beat sonic with your feet. No hands. That would make for interesting content. How would it go. It must be an easy Sonic game but not too easy. A game that is mostly casual. If you beat it try harder Sonic games.
Ngl, there shouldn't be a ranking system anymore. Personally I hate it when a game TELLS me when I'm doing good because the GAME thinks it is. I don't care about that at all. It shouldn't be gone completely but it should definitely have its own mode like Time Attack or something. Sonic Lost World actually got that right
I'm currently grinding for A ranks in Sonic Heroes. You forgot to mention that Heroes also has something special for getting every A rank: Super Hard Mode.
Maybe someone else has mentioned it, but the ranking system actually started in SA1, sure they were called "levels" but it was effective the same thing
I think for the ranking system it should be fairly easy to get a B rank, but for A and S you gotta do quite the challenge. If it's too hard it might be discouraging for some players. Imagine playing and feel you did well, but the rank said D or E 😅😅
This is exactly why I like the fact that Colors is getting remastered. That game had the best ranking system of the boost games in my opinion. We haven't had a good ranking system like that since the Adventure days. (I could be wrong tho.)
I agree that the raking system is kinda bad these days and I would love it if they make it better but i still think that it is one of the last things that Sega had to focus on (because they have a lot to fix in the games)
I'm gunna defend generations because of its large priority of best times I feel like generations instead of striving for the S-Rank wants you to improve upon your time
I'd they ever remake/remaster Unleashed, maybe have getting an S-Rank open up the challenge stages for that level, out give your bonus sun and moon medals, or some new medal altogether, all of which can only be used to purchase stuff like cosmetics or remixed songs, and things of that nature.
I think we should go b ack to A ranks like SA1-SA2. But I do agree with everything in this video. (Getting a S rank in generations is hard in my opinion.)
I never liked the ranking system. Even in SA2. I mean yeah, I liked that I got Green Hill Zone when I got all the S Ranks and Emblems but it never really felt like it should be part of the game. And then as you said, yeah they've kinda dumb them down more and more since SA2 so I think the best is just do away with them in general. I think simply keep the whole score aspect and just have your best scores showing so whenever you play, you have something to try and beat each time. That or try to beat the level faster than you did before. The ranking itself never really add anything to the games. Also yes, I like how you mentioned Metal Harbor... the problem is that's the only level in SA2 I think that you have to master to get an S rank. Every other level in the game is super easy to S rank. Many even on the 1st time playing it. The only ones that you would have to "Master" are the hard levels of Rouge and Knuckles as you have to memorize where the shards are but... that's less on skill or mastering and just "I remember where this and this is now rush and get them."
Unleashed Ranking on the Wii I like it a lot and uses the emblems for something more optional. There, the higher the rank, the more emblems you get. The more emblems you get, the more side stuff (cinematics, music, concept art, lives, etc.). How do you get an S rank there? Day stages: Reach the goal under X minutes Night stages: Number of enemies killed required, reach the goal under x minutes, and collect X quantity of rings You'd think it sounds simple, but it is a better way and a simple way to make the rankings, and also hard. Believe me, getting the S ranks in the day stages requires you to know the level perfectly and making almost no mistakes.
yo matt my favorite sonic youtuber, ever u love ur content, and most of ur opinions are true and make sense but some are kinda stupid like, "sonic adventure's level design is perfect, the adventure games should remastered and not remade", but the question im about u is a biggy, can u make a guide for sonic unleashed and how to play the game, for this i need you you actually reply to yes or no because my sister started playing sonic unleashed and her gameplay... is pretty cringe she doesn't boost in that day time stage unless the game tells her too, and on the note time stage she always spams the same XXXX move ( if ur on on ps3, ⬜⬜⬜⬜ ) yet she stills manage to beat me in mortal kombat now i know what ur thinking, " but the game come's with a game manual whats the point of me making a guide" her 3 reasons why, 1 there's no guide of the game on UA-cam for some reason, 2the game manual doesnt even teach u how to play the game it only tell u the plot and basic controls, 3 the game expects u to now how to play the game right. she is one of those gamers that thinks she knows what she is doing even if she does know how to the play game or not, if u r gonna make a guide separate the videos to section in these categories: intro, what is sonic unleashed, why u SHOULD'NT play this game on ps3, hoe to play day time stages, how to play nighttime stages, always have a good eye, leveling up, shops and stores, suvinears, hints, & more, bosses, always take hints even if u do know what to do, dlc levels, when to boost and not to boost, M-speed/d-speed glitch tutorial(u don't have to do this), abilities in the game u probably didn't know ( for ex, u can spin kick by pressing be twice) conclusion, outro. those are the categories i wanna see, yes u have my permission to ad this comment on to ur vid if u want, please help
Should be pointed out that Sonic Generations is a much shorter game than Sonic Colors. It is very possible to get S ranks your first time in some of the stages in Sonic Colors and Unleashed, especially the early stages. But Sonic Generations doesn’t have very far to push the difficult level because it’s so short
Wait, wasn’t the ranking system present in Sonic Adventure 1? Shouldn’t that be considered as the first Sonic game to introduce the ranking system instead of Sonic Adventure 2?
Lives + Old ranking system as a hardmode would give older fans what they want and still appeal to the younger fans or casuals who aren't as good at the game.
What pisses me off with unleashed's ranking system is that the game doesn't reward you for getting all S ranks while getting them is extremely hard. If there was a reward then there wouldn't be any complaints imo.
Sonic Adventure 2 is the only Sonic game I was able to 100% only once. I did it on GameCube a very long time ago but when I got it for PC and Xbox 360, I didn't have what it takes to do it all over again. Every other Sonic game I can 100% on a new platform, but SA2? Forget about it.
my friend played sonic unleashed and he was sad because he got a D rank(He has never played sonic before) I said to him that I know an easier game(sonic generations) HE PLAYED MODERN GREEN HILL ZONE AND GOT AN S RANK..... LIKE WTF plz I really want a better ranking system
They made the ranking systems easier in future Sonic titles. SA2 ranking system had a perfect balance when it comes to increasing points same applies to Sonic Heroes. The last Sonic game with good ranking System is Sonic Colors.
I agree with everything you said, except for Colors. The game itself is fine and all, but the ranking system is one of my least favorites. The reason for that is simply because of the wisps. Even if the ranking system in Colors is based on skill, I wouldn’t know that because I’ve perfected many of the levels and I would still get an A or B. The reason for that is because I’d always ignore the wisps, which, for me anyway, were huge pace breakers. However, they were crucial for getting S ranks because of the amount of points they gave. So essentially, they wanted you to speed through the stages with minimal error while also stopping your progress by forcing you to screw around as a wisp to get a lot more points. And that killed it for me.
Frankly, I believe ranking systems shouldn't exist because it forces the player to play the game in only one way, the way the devs decided is the "right way" to play it instead of letting players do things their own way. You could add score and clear time leaderbords to the game to incentivise players challenging each other, making the player feel like they failed for not replicating a series of actions the devellopers decided is the correct way to play the game takes away the player's agency completely.
not really, gameplay grading scoring system was a great addition to video game where it added replay value to the game, sometimes it can reward player with unlockable stuff. Metal Gear games have a lot of this. Gran Turismo also rewarded player with rank.
Generations Ranking don’t even bother me anymore cause there’s a mission in a every zine of the game which is about chasing a ghost opponent of Sonic and the S ranks for those missions are actually somewhat of challenging.
i don't like the ranking system. it does not feel like a congratulation for skilful play, the ranking system is almost always more like active discouragement for not playing the game in a certain way.
Unleashed had it good, but maybe it was a little too hard. However, I think it's the best one, then with Adventure 2 following, then Rush.
Nah Sonic colours is the best
I’d argue SA2, there’s a ton of secret ways to get more points to get an A rank. Unleashed essentially has a no hit policy to getting an A rank on the daytime stages which is fine and I don’t think it’s bad but I like how even though SA2 was linear there are tons of secrets to find that reward creativity and skill
Just no lol SA2 is worse than both unleashed and colours
Unleashed had a good system but it was a bit uneven. It's actually harder NOT to get an S on Jungle Joyride day.
@@shay_3859 You can even explain why it's horrible. Just it's "SA2 ranking is horrible" which is a load of BS.
This is perfectly said, excellent job! I am also happy to see some appreciation for 06s ranking, I was VERY surprised how challenging it was to get S ranks. SA2s A Ranking is the best in my opinion because it requires you to be fully engaged and requires all of your attention to get those A ranks no matter the amount of time in the games. Generations on the other hand gives you an S rank for basically just not dying..and takes a lot of the inner satisfaction of getting that S rank due to it being basically a participation trophy, that’s my two cents on it!
Hey its the guy who doesnt accept opinions on sonic 4
But man it’s really hard to get A rank on SA2
I just hope they make the ranking system in sonic rangers like sonic adventure 2
SA2 ranking is a bit too strict for my tastes tbh. I'd rather Unleashed system
Or sonic colors ranking system
Have the ranks like gens
@@cakelayer WTF?!!! NEVER!!!
I WANT HARD S RANKS
@@maymakesart8300 unleashed had harder S ranks and the game doesn't tell you what is needed to get to the next rank. In Adventure 2 it was easy to know what is needed for the next rank. But tbh I like harder S ranks as it gives you a reason to get better at the game.
As someone who's actually gotten all S-ranks for Sonic Colors, I can say that game did it unbelievably well. I think there was only two stages in the entire game that I got an S-rank on my first try, and the rest I had to master with the use of Wisps, speed, and red ring/ring collecting. Sure it was infuriatingly demanding, but it made me super proud to see that sparkly gray S as a reward.
When I went back to Generations, I was taken aback by just how simple S-ranks are to achieve in that game, not to mention your ranking gets boosted up a rank simply because of a "perfect bonus", which I thought was so unnecessary.
Weirdly enough I think Forces had some challenge to get an S-rank on a handful of stages, but I hated how the lowest rank you could get was a C-rank.
I can't really speak my mind with the other games as I never bothered for ranking systems in Sonic games until Colors, though I will say that none of them were a pushover with S-ranks and/or A-ranks, which was a good thing.
One of thing I actually did like in Heroes and Colors, and one of the things I disliked in Generations. SA2 and Unleashed still did this the best. If anyone is curious, try the new Score Generations mod from about a month ago. It’s really a breath of fresh air for the game.
what is it called
Unleashed's ranks was dogshit lmao
@@rosejett144 git gud
@@rosejett144 Get good at the game
@@rosejett144 How?
Knew this would be coming as soon as the TailsChannel debate happened last week.
Not surprised I figured that that might be the very case. Lol
I think Unleashed had the best ranking system. I remember when I was playing Arid sands (Day) I got a E , played the level again a couple of times and got a C. But after a whole month of playing that level over and over, I finally got a S.
It really didn't, with Werehog you farm grabs and easy S ranks.
@@rosejett144 Yeah and the Day S Ranks were just down right ludicrous and never made it clear what gives you points and what each stage wants you to focus on like Savannah Citadel just cares about enemies and Arid Sands just cares about time which is really stupid.
@@nikolepsysyndrome7538 Day stages were pretty consistent in my experience.
@@rosejett144 Maybe you're just really good at Unleashed lol. But honestly 100 percenting it made me not like the Day Stages in that version it's like Death by a thousand papercuts with the unresponsive buttons, input delay, broken drift, lag, etc etc. I still like the Night stages tho and everything else about the 360 version tho. Ngl I prefer the Wii version now (which I also 100 percented) I think it has way less issues and is more fun overall.
@@nikolepsysyndrome7538 Yeah for me with Unleashed, the littke shit just adds up.
I 100% agree that a good ranking system gives satisfaction, I love mastering the stages of Sonic Unleashed and then receiving an S rank. The same goes for SA2 and Heroes. Colors is kinda mixed because what gives you S ranks is sitting around getting color bonuses, spamming quick step in QS sections, and getting other bonuses like drift in those sections. I wish it was more based on stage mastery other than spamming what gives you a bonus score
Totally agree on the Colors thing. I always despised the ranking system in that game. Good ranks in a Sonic game shouldn’t require you to drill in a circle for 10 minutes.
Shadow the Hedgehog's ranking system was pretty interesting due to that whole mechanic of Hero and Dark points making you have to think about how you're playing the level if you're going for a specific mission to A Rank it.
If you're opponent's only defense for Sonic Generations being better in terms of ranking is "Who cares?", then he already lost, lol.
He destroyed me pretty hard on other points.
I prefer it over Unleashed
@@Sydney_Angelyt Unleashed is still the GOAT IMHO.
@@Sydney_Angelyt nah, generations is too easy in ranking, atleast you need skill to get a good rank in unleashed
@@raptorzeraora2632Yeah sure, if you call asking for perfection “skill”.
We need a ranking system that is a middle-ground between SA2 and Unleashed's ranking system.
No we need a flat-out SA2 ranking system just so Sonic Fans will feel pain again. No longer will fake youtubers act like Professionals.
@@segaspice4062 Ok
@@segaspice4062 We need unleashed ranking system. SA2 is difficult to the point of not being fun. Having atleast a little leg room feels nice instead of needing to be literally frame perfect
@@trymetrix857 i played unleashed for all s ranks and i can say that is a straight up lie, sa2 requires you to be good and unleashed requires you to be a freaking god, i literally loose s ranks on unleashed by being hit once in the stage!
@@ElenStar3343 Facts
I love how in Unleashed if you get an E rank the music starts to go out of tune and Sonic gets depressed
But exoparagramgamer said that s ranking Xbox 360 and ps3 version the chunan dlc is utter torment.
I feel like you were on the losing side of the debate (Sorry), but this was one of your best arguments/points in that debate:
"Sonic Colors you have the option just complete it fast and get a shit rank and have the ego of 'hey, I got a fast time' *or* you can have the ego of 'hey, I beat this level and I mastered it with all the level gimmicks and all the wisps.' You can do that. You can have all sides. Sonic Generations only has one side, and that is time. Sonic Colors has everything."
And unrelated to that, a ranking mod for SA1 would be interesting. (If there isn't one already)
Enjoyed the video, Matt.
The rank system in Sonic Generations 3DS is different, and it is challenging
You didn't metion it, but Sonic Advance 3 have one of the best ranking systems too, it only requires speed, but you REALLY need to know the levels and master it to be the fastest and get all the shortcuts, and learn to use the characters in the best way
One of the reasons why I loved Generations on the 3DS so much was because of the ranking system. Those S Ranks meant something
Advance 3 ALSO makes the team system is super cool and can use your team to beat the level, like sunset hill act 2 or 3 theirs a big wall that covers most of the stage BUT if your knuckles you can climb over it to get an amazing time.
Yeah thats why the 3ds version has a better ranking system
Becuase I went back to emerald coast on the 3ds version I had a B rank I played the lvl and I got an S rank for it was rewarding
@@cowgaming7186 the handheld games are so good and underrated
4:52 Episode Shadow actually had a difficult ranking system which required you to be perfect at the levels in order to get it. Getting the S rank in Virtual Reality was insanely fun and challenging. Kinda wish the whole game was like that :|
Important video! And yes I hard agree, S ranks are very important as an indicator that you have properly experienced all there is to experience, in terms of all the design choices the developers prepared for players. Aspects like not getting hit, not being too slow, killing enough enemies, not hitting civilians (Black knight) and more of each level section!! Btw I think Black knight has a fantastic ranking system if you want to check deeper into that! It has an honorable knight parameter where you don't attack the backs of enemies, and dont harm civilians, and ofc giving rings to civilians and such
In my personal opinion, the individual value of each rank is as follows:
E rank: Pathetic.
D rank: Needs improvement.
C rank: Well done. You tried.
B rank: Good, but not great.
A rank: Great job.
S rank: Perfection!
sonic unleashed ranking system was the best imo out of the whole series u feel so accomplished when u get an s rank u gotta know the level in and out to get it
You love that one cyberspace from frontiers if only more were that strict with the time, currently replaying Generations on PC because of the hype of Sonic X Shadow Generations & no joke it took me 16 minutes to beat Classic Planet Wisp & still somehow got a B.
The most challenging aspect of the entire game so far was the achievement to get through Modern Chemical Plant without ever being submerged in water. It took nearly an hour of attempts, but once I got it, it felt amazing. For replayability & longevity, I hope they add fun achievements in the stages in future games.
In Generations and Forces it was an issue anyway. They just handed out S ranks there. You know there's a problem when you have to try really hard to get a B rank or lower. Great video!
Maybe with the tails save, they could make it to where if you use it, your score lowers, meaning you get a worse rank than what you would if you beat it without using the tails save. I think that would keep some of the challenge with getting S ranks in colors ultimate.
I agree with you. I'm not that hardcore player that always 100% everything and I actually only did this on Riders, Zero Gravity and Adventure DX (from Sonic games), so you might think I'd want to get best ranks just by playing the game, but it honestly feels so bad to get good ranks after being objectively bad. I remember how I sucked at some stage in Forces (I do not remember the details) and almost got offended when I got best rank possible for it, lol
At the same time I'd like to point out that the feeling when I struggled with something in these games as a child just to get the worst rank possible is horrible (I freaking sucked at Heroes 😢)
If they do the ranking to be like SA2 or Unleashed, they better add in the E rank.
And the funny Erank music
I’ve only recently started to care about S ranks recently and it really helps prolong the games playtime. I’ve put over 30 hours on Sonic Colors trying to complete everything
I recently started replaying generations after all this time. I was surprised I was making so much mistakes, taking things slow and safe, and still getting S rank. The only way I'd get a lower rank was if I died trying to get a tricky red ring on my first try. It's really forgiving and easy to get an S rank, while colors (the original, haven't played the new one) I remember it being at least somewhat hard to get S ranks.
I totally agree with you, a ranking system should be hard to master.
I personally am OK with harsh ranking systems, but I prefer it to either be points or time. Not both. I need it to be measurable. I need to be able to understand my progress.
The Sonic Rush trilogy had good ranking systems too, don't forget those. Those really pushed me to my limits and forced me to get good lol. In the case of 1 and Rush Adventure, it was all about doing tons of tricks, blazing through the level, and getting tons of rings, and if you don't do one of those well enough, you get an A Rank instead. In the case of Colors DS, you mainly get S Ranks by clearing the stages fast, but you WILL NOT get an S Rank on your first go. It was all about using the Wisps to your advantage, and using those to go faster. I also thought Episode Shadow had a good ranking system, Virtual Reality is infamous for the VERY strict S Rank requirement
Damn I always thought that I was the only to get mad at the forces and gens super easy S ranks
Sometimes getting the strategies and training the level can be pretty frustrating, but when you se the shining S (or pink/red A) the satisfaction is great, then you see that wasn't that hard to get it, and now you're not just better at the game but you feel that
Oh, and nice video :^)
I just like getting better times on my runs. Like getting the minus times is super satisfying in generations. And getting the A ranks in adventure 1 is also fun then improving that time still bring me back to that game.
Um, adventure 1 doesnt have a ranking system, it debuted in adventure 2
Tbf sonic forces ranking system wasn't that bad. The game was just so easy that u were guaranteed an s rank. If u have 0 rings at the end of the stage you won't get the s rank, it's just that the game is so easy that u won't actually have the challenge of not losing ur rings.
Perfectly said
Basically, the problem is not the rank system, the problem is the game lol
uh no
the video game’s design is structured partly by the ranking system. if it’s the game’s problem,, then it is the fault of the ranking system by default
Really good topic to discuss. I really liked the ranking system of every Sonic game up until Generations. It actually feels like it was going to have a better one but at the last second they toned it down. Even Generations 3DS has a better one.
I would like to see the ranking system from sonic unwiished came back,it is just like crash 4.
Why can't it be like unwiished, sonic is after all, all about speed
The main issue I see with Sonic Adventure 2's ranking system is that you have to know what you've gotta go out of your way to do, and it's a lot more cryptic feeling than how Sonic Colors handled that. If you haven't memorized where certain things are, you're basically stuck no matter how hard you play the level... and Metal Harbor is actually a good example of what looks like bad ranking design, with the short tunnel section with absurd bonuses that could significantly boost your rank if you A) get lucky or B) have somehow memorized the movements you need to make in this incredibly slippery section.
Been loving the recent videos a lot!
I liked sonic rush's ranking system. You had to earn a certain amount of points to get an S. Just being fast isn't enough, you have to do tricks, defeat enemies and be stylish overall kinda like SA2's but a little toned down. I don't consider that a bad thing though
I definitely agree with you, but I also think there should be a slightly better balance. I think Sega is trying to make the S ranks super easy so everyone can enjoy getting them, because other games it was so difficult. But the way it is now makes ranks pointless.
I would prefer things closer to the level of sa2, but maybe just a tad less difficult. I don’t want to take the challenge away from the people who love perfecting and completing the most difficult challenges, but it would be nice if I didn’t have to be a god at the game to get the highest rank also.
The funny thing is despite that, the easy S ranks in Generations is one of the least annoying issues I have with the game. While I do like Generations, there are so many things that make it a frustrating experience. But I’m not gonna get into that.
Unleashed ranking was brutal but it did drive me to play stages more.
I think generations’ ranking system was perfectly fine, but unleashed (HD), SA2, heroes & colours definitely had better ranking systems though.
Also sonic games replay-ability wise are more than just their ranking systems & generations’ is no exception cause it still has great replay value in the form of the hard mode bosses, extra missions, the Red star rings for unlockables etc.
There is one thing Sonic Forces doesn't get enough credits personally. You said that Sonic can do like the relics in Crash Bandicoot, and make you have to complete the stage super fast. Well, while Sonic Forces has pretty easy S ranks, the time trial missions are exactly that. They make you complete the stage as fast as possible, and beat the time. And even as soon as Ghost Town, those missions are very hard in my opinion. You need to perfect your run, and not lose time. Of course not every stages have those missions, while every stages have a S rank, but at least there is some mastery of the stage required in the game, and is in my opinion the best part about Sonic Forces.
7:11 My name is Evan so I jumped out of my skin when Matt aggressively said my name lmao
adventure 2 and unleashed had the best ranking system in my opinion. they really push the players to play better
300th Also I would like to see a video where you beat sonic with your feet. No hands. That would make for interesting content. How would it go. It must be an easy Sonic game but not too easy. A game that is mostly casual.
If you beat it try harder Sonic games.
I can end the Black Knight debate: It's good. there :)
Ngl, there shouldn't be a ranking system anymore. Personally I hate it when a game TELLS me when I'm doing good because the GAME thinks it is. I don't care about that at all. It shouldn't be gone completely but it should definitely have its own mode like Time Attack or something. Sonic Lost World actually got that right
I'm currently grinding for A ranks in Sonic Heroes. You forgot to mention that Heroes also has something special for getting every A rank: Super Hard Mode.
I loved A ranks in Sonic Heroes because It feels like a huge achievement like I just finished a 1000 Piece Lego set or something
Maybe someone else has mentioned it, but the ranking system actually started in SA1, sure they were called "levels" but it was effective the same thing
It's so terrible in forces that I s ranked all stages by just beating them without dying
I think for the ranking system it should be fairly easy to get a B rank, but for A and S you gotta do quite the challenge. If it's too hard it might be discouraging for some players. Imagine playing and feel you did well, but the rank said D or E 😅😅
Sonic colours ranking is actually sick with difficulty to get an S rank
Generations S ranks are definitely more difficult in the extra missions, though. They aren't that easy there, you will struggle for those S ranks
The ranking system in unleashed and colors are the best you need skill and effort to get that juicy S rank
But generations and forces are hot garbage
@ same thing with unleashed and colors
In sonic frontiers cyberspace, all u need is speed
I also think the rush series does these pretty well
This is exactly why I like the fact that Colors is getting remastered. That game had the best ranking system of the boost games in my opinion. We haven't had a good ranking system like that since the Adventure days. (I could be wrong tho.)
I agree that the raking system is kinda bad these days and I would love it if they make it better but i still think that it is one of the last things that Sega had to focus on (because they have a lot to fix in the games)
I'm gunna defend generations because of its large priority of best times I feel like generations instead of striving for the S-Rank wants you to improve upon your time
I just wish Forces have you a REASON to replay levels.
SA2 has Green Hill and Generations has cool unlockables. Forces has no collectibles.
metal harbor was so hard to get an s rank but it was so satisfying to pull it off and i am still running one the pure happiness of A ranking it
Yes the 3ds version of generations have a better ranking system
The ranking system is very important but also very underrated of its effects
I'd they ever remake/remaster Unleashed, maybe have getting an S-Rank open up the challenge stages for that level, out give your bonus sun and moon medals, or some new medal altogether, all of which can only be used to purchase stuff like cosmetics or remixed songs, and things of that nature.
I think we should go b ack to A ranks like SA1-SA2. But I do agree with everything in this video. (Getting a S rank in generations is hard in my opinion.)
Getting an S rank in Unleashed is satisfying, getting one in Generations is not.
Have you played Spark the electric jester 2? It has the best Sonic Ranking system by far. Especially if you play on the hardest difficulty.
I agree 99 percent because I think that sonic unleashed had the best ranking system
So that's why I hated Generations. Easy as heck ranking system, coming from an Unleashed veteran.
NO YOU'RE NOT SUPPOSED TO HAVE A DIFFERENT OPINION THAN ME!!!!1111!!!11!!
SA2 did the ranking correctly, you had to grind for the A and it felt damn good to see it!
You make a good point.
I never liked the ranking system. Even in SA2.
I mean yeah, I liked that I got Green Hill Zone when I got all the S Ranks and Emblems but it never really felt like it should be part of the game.
And then as you said, yeah they've kinda dumb them down more and more since SA2 so I think the best is just do away with them in general.
I think simply keep the whole score aspect and just have your best scores showing so whenever you play, you have something to try and beat each time. That or try to beat the level faster than you did before.
The ranking itself never really add anything to the games.
Also yes, I like how you mentioned Metal Harbor... the problem is that's the only level in SA2 I think that you have to master to get an S rank. Every other level in the game is super easy to S rank. Many even on the 1st time playing it.
The only ones that you would have to "Master" are the hard levels of Rouge and Knuckles as you have to memorize where the shards are but... that's less on skill or mastering and just "I remember where this and this is now rush and get them."
Unleashed Ranking on the Wii I like it a lot and uses the emblems for something more optional. There, the higher the rank, the more emblems you get. The more emblems you get, the more side stuff (cinematics, music, concept art, lives, etc.).
How do you get an S rank there?
Day stages: Reach the goal under X minutes
Night stages: Number of enemies killed required, reach the goal under x minutes, and collect X quantity of rings
You'd think it sounds simple, but it is a better way and a simple way to make the rankings, and also hard. Believe me, getting the S ranks in the day stages requires you to know the level perfectly and making almost no mistakes.
yo matt my favorite sonic youtuber, ever u love ur content, and most of ur opinions are true and make sense but some are kinda stupid like, "sonic adventure's level design is perfect, the adventure games should remastered and not remade", but the question im about u is a biggy, can u make a guide for sonic unleashed and how to play the game, for this i need you you actually reply to yes or no because my sister started playing sonic unleashed and her gameplay... is pretty cringe she doesn't boost in that day time stage unless the game tells her too, and on the note time stage she always spams the same XXXX move ( if ur on on ps3, ⬜⬜⬜⬜ ) yet she stills manage to beat me in mortal kombat now i know what ur thinking, " but the game come's with a game manual whats the point of me making a guide" her 3 reasons why, 1 there's no guide of the game on UA-cam for some reason, 2the game manual doesnt even teach u how to play the game it only tell u the plot and basic controls, 3 the game expects u to now how to play the game right. she is one of those gamers that thinks she knows what she is doing even if she does know how to the play game or not, if u r gonna make a guide separate the videos to section in these categories: intro, what is sonic unleashed, why u SHOULD'NT play this game on ps3, hoe to play day time stages, how to play nighttime stages, always have a good eye, leveling up, shops and stores, suvinears, hints, & more, bosses, always take hints even if u do know what to do, dlc levels, when to boost and not to boost, M-speed/d-speed glitch tutorial(u don't have to do this), abilities in the game u probably didn't know ( for ex, u can spin kick by pressing be twice) conclusion, outro. those are the categories i wanna see, yes u have my permission to ad this comment on to ur vid if u want, please help
I still feel the pain from Lost World’s Time Attack Rankings. Those were just cruel.
And I guess to give Forces SOME credit, getting S Ranks did reward you with more Avatar items. But then again, it’s easy as pie lol.
“Mmm yes this will age well.”
Should be pointed out that Sonic Generations is a much shorter game than Sonic Colors. It is very possible to get S ranks your first time in some of the stages in Sonic Colors and Unleashed, especially the early stages. But Sonic Generations doesn’t have very far to push the difficult level because it’s so short
Wait, wasn’t the ranking system present in Sonic Adventure 1?
Shouldn’t that be considered as the first Sonic game to introduce the ranking system instead of Sonic Adventure 2?
No, there was no ranking system in Sa1. There was a challenge mode though.
When the sonic is blue:
matt where is the bubsy 3d video essay you promised me
The problem with a hard ranking system is that it will make casuals feel like they suck
Also it's funny because generations gives easy S ranks when the 3ds version of sonic generations gives S ranks if master the lvls I found it funny
Lives + Old ranking system as a hardmode would give older fans what they want and still appeal to the younger fans or casuals who aren't as good at the game.
What pisses me off with unleashed's ranking system is that the game doesn't reward you for getting all S ranks while getting them is extremely hard. If there was a reward then there wouldn't be any complaints imo.
Sonic Adventure 2 is the only Sonic game I was able to 100% only once. I did it on GameCube a very long time ago but when I got it for PC and Xbox 360, I didn't have what it takes to do it all over again. Every other Sonic game I can 100% on a new platform, but SA2? Forget about it.
This video is so right.
my friend played sonic unleashed and he was sad because he got a D rank(He has never played sonic before) I said to him that I know an easier game(sonic generations) HE PLAYED MODERN GREEN HILL ZONE AND GOT AN S RANK..... LIKE WTF plz I really want a better ranking system
They made the ranking systems easier in future Sonic titles. SA2 ranking system had a perfect balance when it comes to increasing points same applies to Sonic Heroes. The last Sonic game with good ranking System is Sonic Colors.
I agree with everything you said, except for Colors. The game itself is fine and all, but the ranking system is one of my least favorites. The reason for that is simply because of the wisps. Even if the ranking system in Colors is based on skill, I wouldn’t know that because I’ve perfected many of the levels and I would still get an A or B. The reason for that is because I’d always ignore the wisps, which, for me anyway, were huge pace breakers. However, they were crucial for getting S ranks because of the amount of points they gave. So essentially, they wanted you to speed through the stages with minimal error while also stopping your progress by forcing you to screw around as a wisp to get a lot more points. And that killed it for me.
Frankly, I believe ranking systems shouldn't exist because it forces the player to play the game in only one way, the way the devs decided is the "right way" to play it instead of letting players do things their own way. You could add score and clear time leaderbords to the game to incentivise players challenging each other, making the player feel like they failed for not replicating a series of actions the devellopers decided is the correct way to play the game takes away the player's agency completely.
not really, gameplay grading scoring system was a great addition to video game where it added replay value to the game, sometimes it can reward player with unlockable stuff. Metal Gear games have a lot of this. Gran Turismo also rewarded player with rank.
"If everyone's S Rank, no one will be"
-Tsun Zu
What are your thoughts on the Sonic Lost World (3DS) ranking system?
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Generations Ranking don’t even bother me anymore cause there’s a mission in a every zine of the game which is about chasing a ghost opponent of Sonic and the S ranks for those missions are actually somewhat of challenging.
i don't like the ranking system. it does not feel like a congratulation for skilful play, the ranking system is almost always more like active discouragement for not playing the game in a certain way.
The amount of easy in forces is insane
TBH Rankings should only be used for Time Attack mode mostly for leader boards
Unleashed was hard generations and colors gave me a S rank after 20 minutes 🤨
well, also in SA2, you can guarantee an A Rank if you get all the rings in that stage. But Idk if that means you fully mastered that stage
I feel they should make it where tails save can only be collected if your on the best path when your good so one death don't mean no s
I A ranked heroes recently and it was actually quite challenging I hope it goes back to that