Do you hate the pregnancy trope in books?
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- Опубліковано 15 лют 2024
- Do you hate the pregnancy trope in books?
I do not categorically hate the trope or the topic, but I am really tired of how even seemingly feminist authors objectify women's pregnant bodies as nothing more than a plot device or a playground for trauma p*rn.
A life change does not equate losing all personality, desires, and agency as so many authors seem to think it does.
Our society still regards the male body as normative and anything unique to the female body is weird, scary, and treated like a pathology. The female body is "other" and I am so, so tired of running into this mindset in every area of society, including literature.
And yes, female authors do it, too.
I do not categorically hate the trope or the topic, but I am really tired of how even seemingly feminist authors objectify women's pregnant bodies as nothing more than a plot device or a playground for trauma p*rn.
A life change does not equate losing all personality, desires, and agency as so many authors seem to think it does.
Our society still regards the male body as normative and anything unique to the female body is weird, scary, and treated like a pathology. The female body is "other" and I am so, so tired of running into this mindset in every area of society, including literature.
And yes, female authors do it, too.
in my personal experience (which includes being identified as son of either one of my parents, grandchild of, brother of my sister, rarely myself) I've witnessed a lot of women simply lose all their defining traits of personality besides MOM the moment they gave birth. Less often, but still happens, I've witnessed it with dads.
It’s been some time since I last read it, but I remember personally LOVING how pregnancy was handled in the final book of the Dragon Keeper Chronicles by Donita K Paul. It’s a 5 book series, and you follow the main characters through key milestones in life, pregnancy and giving birth being one of them. It felt like a really natural progression to that point, as by then we’ve watched the main character Kale (who is still one of my favorite female characters in fiction) grow up, become a powerful wizard and extremely competent woman, fall in love and be courted, and get married.
Her becoming pregnant (that I recall) didn’t change or effect how competent or powerful she was, but it was a wonderful way of showing how she still leaned on and trusted her husband to take care of her, even though we’ve seen so many times where she’s more then capable of handling herself. As well as celebrating the beauty of new life, not using it as a trauma excuse.
I don’t know if this would scratch the itch for you, and it HAS been several years since I last read the story (I’m definitely due to read them again lol), but it’s definitely one of my favorite book series in general. And I hope you might enjoy it as much as I have 💜
Maybe the large number of traumatic birth scenes is a response to when I was growing up and birth scenes were waaaaaay unrealistic in the other direction… nothing of the actual birth, maybe just the water breaking and then cut… dad is heating water or cutting a bit of wood and then it’s over and back to mum with a perfect hair, makeup, no sweat, fluids, blood or anything. The birth scenes in recent years are more realistic as to how a birth in a non-hospital environment would have gone over then those earlier portrayals.
It’ll probably balance out in a couple of years.
In my opinion, the Gilded Duology by Marissa Meyer is better about this, but it does have a unique situation involved
GONE WITH THE WIND! She gives birth and not only does she not care about her son she considers the entire experience a blur and it doesn't stop her from doing what she wants with whoever she wants for large stretches of the book you forget she is a mother. It's immoral but it's the exact opposite of what is common. Personally when I encounter such a phenomenon in books I read it makes a character more likeable that they take such pride in their parenthood.
I bet you, you think it's cute when a man is an involved father in a book. The best I can explain it is guys love seeing women hold motherly characteristics it enders us to the character. That's why Scarlet irritates me because she treats her child like baggage where Melanie has such a love of children it's enough for Baux and Wade
Also the concerning “the mother dies but thank god the baby makes it” like I get the message of new life and hope, but does it have to be at the mother’s expense every time? Like everyone’s like “oooh the baby made it happy ending!” Meanwhile mom here basically just got ritualistically sacrificed for the sake of story. Edit: for those saying it’s just historically accurate, I understand, and it’s very important to accurately portray the risk and struggles of women through pregnancy. However think about it- if it truly was about historical accuracy, then movies would also portray the baby dying more often as well. After all, that happened a lot as well. But they largely don’t, because the story doesn’t want to upset the audience too much, again with the baby being a symbol of new life and hope even after tragedy. Therefore, these pregnant women dying is not for the sole purpose of being historically accurate, considering the baby is most always safe for the sake of story.
It's called historical REALITY. If the baby survived, the human race continues into the next generation, which it won't if the mom survives and baby doesn't. She and her entire generation WILL DIE EVENTUALLY. Having babies is LITERALLY the only way the human race can survive. Why shouldn't that immense achievement be celebrated? We celebrate everyone else who gives their life fir s good cause; that should not be taken away from mothers.
@@cmm5542because it treats Mom like a plot device and not an individual who would be missed by her loved ones. Babies don’t make the sadness any less
Boy you do not want to hear about how Japanese women were seen as the evil because they died in the pregnancy and now will have to drown in period blood hell.
Unfortunately, that’s how women were viewed for like… a long time. Women were expected to mourn for no less than a year, sometimes multiple years… men were only expected to grieve their wives for three months. Then to remarry.
Hell, most boomer jokes boil down to “this wife who is a woman has died and my life is better for it, because the only good woman is a dead woman.” Threw me for a loop when I realized that that was why I wasn’t fond of my husband making those “haha wife bad” jokes that I’d never had a problem with before. He stopped immediately.
Basically, women are always seen as expendable. We always have been. It’s no excuse for a fantasy story to not have a man who loves his wife (even some monarchs loved their wives very dearly and fell apart after their deaths), but people sometimes forgo that for “realism.”
And, as far as the mom dying instead of the baby, I think most women who are pregnant with a child they want and love would pick the baby living over them. My mom almost died in childbirth and told the doctors to save my sister (even as her husband and mother begged the doctors to save her instead), I had an emergency C Section and was terrified for my daughter’s life (albeit my husband asked about my safety first and foremost. First thing he said to the doc when they brought our girl out was asking if I was okay.) Maternal instincts are hella strong and usually boil down to “baby must live even if I die.” I’ve thrown hands over my daughter, entirely on instinctive reflex. It’s something you don’t really understand until you have kids because saying “I punched a man and it felt like a sneeze or a twitch” means nothing until you’ve experienced that supernatural weird rewiring, because attacking someone is always a deliberate choice. Until suddenly it was not.
TL;DR: being a woman sucks, mom brains turn us into attack martyrs, and motherhood is fascinatingly strange.
@@cmm5542 If we go by actual historic..the celebration would be if the mother survives..historically babies were always the first to go if it meant saving the pregnant woman...because a mother can still go on to have another baby..and a mother is a whole full individual allready with talents she can contribute to society with and people who love her
My father unintentionally gave me the best advice when my oldest was a toddler. We were hanging out on my parents' back porch and my daughter said "Mama?" for the 3 millionth time that day. I responded with "That's my name. Don't wear it out."
He looked at me and gently said "Mom isn't your name." I almost cried. For a while it felt like it was. At that point I put more effort into being myself again. Now with 2 kids, I think I am more myself than I have ever been. Better boundaries. Better at saying what I need and want. Better at admitting when I need help or a break. There are so many things I would never have discovered about myself if we had never had our girls. Also, I love watching my husband parent. I knew he would be a good father, but he's their Daddy, too. We grow in knowledge and love as life hands us situations to overcome. It's not always easy, but things worth having rarely are.
That's so beautiful...you know, I'm 16 and I really do aspire to be a mom. It's not the central goal of my life but it's something I want. I believe that everyone has their own definition of "success" in their lives. For me, definition of success in life is having the job that I want and am passionate about, being in a secure place in my life and having a loving family of my own. When I tell people I want kids , I'm usually met with comments like "you're too young to think about that" or "you need to be financially stable first", and all of that is reasonable. I realise that I need to be self sufficient before I have people depending on me. If I raise kids, I want them to have the world. I'm aware of the challenges that comes with parenting but I believe in myself, I just wish others did as well.
@plamiguha4263 you sound like a thoughtful young woman. I'm 28 now but I remember being 16 and hearing the same response of being too young to be thinking like that. In reality, thinking like that helped me find someone in my early 20s who also wanted kids and we're going to try for a kid next year. Maybe you will have a similar trajectory. I always knew I wanted kids, including at 16, and think it's great that you know what you want. I think people just overreact because they are so afraid of teen pregnancy that they need to shut down the 1% chance in their minds that that's what you mean by wanting kids so they resort to pointing out finances and such
@@plamiguha4263, instead of saying "I inspire to be a mom," say "I inspire to be a mom by the time I'm 30" (or whatever age you want). By adding a "due date" far into the future, others will realize that this is a long term goal instead of a short term goal. Good luck!
@@melissawalsh8760exactly!
@@plamiguha4263you sound very thoughtful. I wish you the best on that!
Personally, when I was sixteen, I thought the opposite, for me even now, pregnancy isn’t in the cards for me. I completely hate when people say shit like “you are too young to know how you feel.”
I remember being called “ungrateful” and “selfish” for saying I didn’t want kids. Honestly, people need to stop forcing their own beliefs onto others lives. If someone wants to have children, power to them. If someone doesn’t want to have children, power to them.
I think a lot of people need to realize that women have their own agency to feel and want things, and shouldn’t be downplayed because some people view you as “too young to think about such things” if you’ve put a lot of thought into it.
Wish ya the best hun.
"Her defining characteristic becomes Mom." This has even happened when the characters are cats.
Correct me if I'm wrong, are you referring to Ferncloud?
I hate that in Warriors, there are tons of female characters who have kits and suddenly get reduced to doting, loving mothers with not a single shred of their original personality left :’)
@@iamobsessedwithshadowsightand it’s so funny bc we had a cat colony growing up, and one of the cats was both the big mom, but also didn’t hesitate to throw hands
Fr, poor Sandstorm deserved more than being a love interest followed by being shoved in the background, I think she could have had more relating to her desire to be a strong warrior.
@@wyster14we owned my old cats mom, I forget the specifics of why but she got pregnant (my family had either been told she was spayed, or my parents assumed they were safe because our closest neighbors were literally a mile away) and literally shortly after she gave birth she went outside one day and didn’t show up for weeks. One day my mom was outside and saw her, and tried to offer her food. “Mom cat” hissed at her (something she had apparently never done before) and ran away. That cat literally became a mom and almost immediately decided that not only did she not want to deal with her babies, she didn’t even want to deal with humans. After that day my family never saw her again
What I personally hate is the "unexpected" pregnancy trope. And I say "unsexpected" because it's always extremely well telegraphed.
If a woman throws up and there isn't an immediate 100% clear reason why? Pregnant. Swollen feet? Pregnant. Gotta go pee? Pregnant. A bit more tired than usual? You better believe it, pregnant.
Yeah like sometimes I say I feel sick and someone will immediately go 👀 👁️👄👁️, like no I’ve got the shits from a bad burrito
My sister was incredibly nauseous. She knew immediately early in the pregnancy before she even skipped a period bc she had ONE lemon drop shot and got sicker than she’d ever felt in her life. She immediately told her partner and he accused her of being drunk :/
Not in Star Trek Enterprise, it wasn't ^^
Throw back to when I had a kidney stone a few years ago and was ask 7 times by 5 different medical professionals if there was a chance I was pregnant, the 2 who asked twice also 100% looked towards my mom and the back at me with a “we’re not getting a real answer face” I was in so much pain that by the 5th time I just wanted to yell “grab a pen and add this to my chart, I’m a virgin and dating another female, no I am not fucking pregnant!” 😂 I didn’t because I realize they were just doing their job and covering themselves legally, but come on 7 fucking times? The only people I give a complete pass to are the first and last people who asked me, the first because duh, the last because he ask while bringing me to get an MRI to make sure it was a kidney stone and not like appendicitis or something, and by the way he asked it was very clearly “legally I have to ask you this”. And the 3rd person to ask me gets a half pass, I went to my primary office before being sent to the ER, the 3rd person was the first person I spoke to at the ER. Only reason she doesn’t get a full pass is because my primary office had called ahead and let them know I was coming in, so the information could have been communicated.
Funny enough, a few months ago I got my second ever kidney stone. Now I don’t know if this is common, but for me the pain is so bad that I am fairly constantly throwing up, to the point of dehydration being a risk. I also can’t keep anything down long enough for pain meds to kick in (gross tmi fact, I remember trying to take some for my first kidney stone, and throwing up the full solid pills. That was a weird feeling to do) and since I live in a small town we don’t really have an urgent care our urgent care is the ER. So while yes I know it wasn’t an emergency, I went to the hospital to get an IV for hydration and pain meds. This time I knew what was going on, and the only person to ask me if there was a chance I was pregnant when the dude bringing me to get an MRI. He literally said “I’m sure you’ve already been asked this” and even he was shocked when I said I hadn’t been 😂 and ironically, I at this point was now dating a male and not a virgin, so did actually “have a chance” of being pregnant. that trip ended with me being told I “likely just pulled a muscle”, didn’t realize you could do that while laying in bed and try to sleep but sure doc. But I’m pretty sure it’s not normal to basically be bed bound and unable to eat for the next 2 days from a “pulled muscle”.
Sorry this comment is much longer than I meant it to be, I started ranting cause fuck the health care system for AFAB people.
You're literally complaining about the basic function of storytelling. If a story tells you that a woman has morning sickness, that is the writer telling you, the audience, that is is significant. What kind of talentless hack would write a scene that looks like morning sickness, and then say "lol psyche. She just has a hang over."
Bella Swan won most traumatic pregnancy. And otherwise, I hate the pregnancy trope and I'm not afraid to admit it. I'm here for romance, not reproduction.
I agree with this, I have Tokophobia and cannot stand the thought of myself being pregnant, and I always feel like the pregnancy trope is always "character development" for a woman. I hate it.
Hear me out…Bella actually seemed to gain more personality and autonomy as a character when she was a vampire and a mother. I liked her way more when she wasn’t living blindly for Edward. Scene was still traumatic AF, but vampire Bella POV was definitely better.
@@BrieezySoulwanted to say the same, after the pregnancy and becoming a vampire, Bella is actually more self-actuallized then before, but maybe it was also because Nessi didn't require the same kind of care as normal babies do
@@BrieezySoulprobably the first time she stood her ground instead of throwing a tantrum was to save her daughter. She made an unexpected and well though allegiance too. And that's also a trope, and fits with the myths a theories about motherhood, but I found it cool.
And -a little out of topic, I know- the change she has when she becomes a vampire, almost conviced me that the reason her relationship with Edward was the way it was had more to do with the difference of "species" than with gender or him being controlling.
@@lilithiaabendstern6303well, parenting is quite a demanding job. The sad part is not that women changes their habits and priorities with motherhood, the sad part is when "dad" doesn't do the same.
Not every female character (or person in real life) wants to have kids, but often pregnancy is treated like the happy ending they all want. Not everyone’s happy ending is the same, so female characters shouldn’t be generalised in this way. Also Twilight.
I feel like Twilight deserves its own shame corner 😂
@Elisabeth_Wheatley you should read the immortal guardians by Dianne Duvall. It does the one thing where it tells the romance of different characters but it never leaves the other characters behind it continues to tell their stories while telling new stories and the characters are all amazing and feel like actual people.
I read twilight when I was 19 years old, and I didn't think it was so bad back then. Now I'm 31 and thinking of a "re-reading" to understand if I was too young and didn't know better or I just have bad taste 😂
I only made it thru the 1st Twilight book. It wasn't for me, but I could see why its target audience liked it. What I heard about the sequels made me glad I stopped at the first book.
@@erikas.6790 same girl. I read it when it came out, I was 15, and I loved it.
But, judging by the romance novels I'm still now willing to read and listen too, I'm really afraid I probably have bad taste. 😂
Also, I hate that pregnancy and giving birth are usually the end of that character’s adventures, even if they survive and live a seemingly happily ever after. I’m a mom and there is life and adventure after birth. I study, I work, I volunteer, I travel alone, go to parties - I do all the same things I did before becoming a mom. Now they are just a bit more rare and I need to schedule them properly.
Ok but how many of those thing lead to any thing further beyond that? Unless the story’s focus is about a woman’s pregnancy or their life after, a story’s end with one will likely be the most significant detail to conclude on
Do not travel alone.
It can be a death sentence in half the Planet even today.
Which is also probably much healthier than seeing yourself as only a mom and nothing else.
No matter what you do, everyone needs some days to do something different than usually.
Other jobs have vacations, but parent-vacations are not as accepted in society, I feel.
@arienmartinez5025 This is a really dumb point. Plenty of women did massive achievements after having children. Isabella of France invaded England and overthrew the monarch after having kids. Agrippina the Younger assassinated the Roman emperor as a mother. Women don’t magically stop doing big things after having kids. The same reason men don’t stop doing significant things after becoming fathers. The problem is this trope essentially perpetuates that the actions of women only matter if they are leading up to producing offspring so nothing they do after giving birth matters. You yourself say that stories must end there because nothing a woman could possibly do would ever amount to more impact than when she created one more human. Yet the obvious sexism is somehow lost on you.
@@arienmartinez5025 I made some of my best paintings and art work after my daughter was born. Before that, I could barely find my muse
To add on to this- I hate it when a character gets pregnant for plot reasons, usually to "punish" some guy, and then it gets solved by the pregnant person having a miscarriage. Not only is that just unpleasant, I also would find it much more interesting if for once the child was born and everyone had to deal with the consequences that brings.
It's like real life - the problem isn't that the woman suddenly has to narrow her focus to keeping alive this tiny bundle of weaknesses; it's that no one else steps up to support her in doing the same. Everyone assumes it's her exclusive job and ignores anything else that might also be her job. At least Tonks found a babysitter and rode into battle.
Tonks 😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭
Yeah and then she was killed. Like if you let your child alone you are going to die😢
@@sirusfan8890And we all hate this trope! It’s so dumb.
@@sirusfan8890well that’s a stretch and a half. She died because she was defending Hogwarts from VOLDEMORT. Not because she invested in a babysitter wtf
It's not the main premise, but in Victoria Aveyard's Red Queen series, a side character called Farley gets pregnant and doesn't loose character, like, at all. Girl goes on to lead a successful revolution. She is only a side so its isn't focused on much, but its refreshing
Well also:
Sex doesn't equal pregnancy, pregnancy doesn't equal baby OR having had sex, and a woman not having ANY of those things is not bad or tragic.
People seem to forget we are walking talking chemical reactions with agency and autonomy.
From miscarriages and abortions to prenatal and postpartum care, SO MUCH is ignored or blurred together.
Why can't we normalize sexual health and a rather normal perspective of it??
I keep rereading the suggestion that pregnancy doesn’t necessarily mean sex and I’m curious if you phrased that poorly or never went to health class.
@@tlkfanrwbyfan8716 Or they're *really* into Jesus
@@tlkfanrwbyfan8716 There are ways to get pregnant without having sex, such as in vitro fertilization
@@tlkfanrwbyfan8716Artificial insemination could be what was being referred to, i’d guess.
@@tlkfanrwbyfan8716I mean, there’s a lot of books with fantasy worlds and magic. They don’t have to be talking about stories with real world rules
I personally hate the trope of strong pregnant woman who wants to prove she can still work while pregnant, but does so by putting herself and her baby in so much UNNECESSARY danger. No, that's not strong. That's just stupid.
So unrealistic! 😂
The k-drama/webtoon "love is a bonus book" actually made a good point in this. The main character loses everything in the divorce but she is so relieved because she got her name back. In asian culture its quite common to call mothers as "such and such's mom" even directly to their face. Her husband always used endearments to call her, others called her daughter in law or husbands wife. So for years nobody had ever said her name. So when she started working again people finally used her name again and she got some autonomy and identity back.
I never finished watching or reading it but that part struck a cord with me and always stuck with me over the years.
If you have time, you definitely should finksh watching it! I really loved the kdrama (didn't know it was an adaptation before). Generally, peoples names are used less often in Korean, but for me it's also a bit weird when people who met as adults, who didn't meet via their children will call each other xx mom/xx dad. My parents only called people they knew via kindergarten/school like that, and only if they were not close to them at all. But that is probably mostly because of the difference of German and Korean.
they do that a lot in Japan and Korea. Not sure about china-wasn't paying particular attention to if they were, but they probably do. Jinso-Mama. Like your only importance and value is who you are the wife/daughter/mother of.
Osono in Kiki's Delivery Service is pregnancy done right! In both the movie and the book she's portrayed in a competent and respectful light even at the tail end of her pregnancy when she's about to pop any day. It was so refreshing.
I always did like that woman, she was such a quirky person
Same with Chilli from Bluey.
WAIT THERE'S A BOOK?!
@@StitchHeart The movie is based off the book! Same with Howl's Moving Castle, both were books before becoming movies.
It's been so long that I didn't even remember she was pregnant! They definitely did it right if her pregnancy didn't become the beat over the head part of the story.
Bring a mother, or father, is, if done at all properly, defining. It is time consuming. You often give up hobbies and interests, sometimes seemingly losing yourself in it.
People change when they become the primary carer for the child.
This isnt objectification. Its reality.
Does it HAVE to be? No, but it requires lots of determination and effort not to lose yourself, something most people lack.
The problem is that pregnancy and childbirth and a nuclear family are often seen as the end goal of female characters, even when the female characters HAVE other goals they explicitly state. Their "duties" as wives mothers and girlfriends are thought to be more important than their own wants and needs as people. And if a woman tries to be dominant in their families, they're seen as terrible mothers or partners, and infertle women are pitied or villainized that they can't have biological children, whether or not they even want them.
And this is all just touching on straight relationships...
I've never personally met a woman who claimed she felt empowered by her pregnancy... just tired and sore all the time.
Also pregnancy brain is real.
They do exist. A friend's mom said the best she's ever felt was during her 4 pregnancies. It's rare but some women just sail through it with boundless energy.
Pregnancy is tough!!! But I have never felt so empowered as when I gave birth to my son. 25 hour labor, natural home birth, no pain medication. Not because I wanted to wear that like a trophy but because it was something I felt was best for my body and for my son’s. I was able to birth my way with two amazing midwives and my Superman of a husband there to support me all the way. I feel the most feminine I ever have as a mother, and that feeling of being the only person who can calm your own child is like straight dopamine. They rely on you so fully. Yes, it’s exhausting, especially being pregnant with baby #2. But we manage and we persevere. And there is incredible strength in that. To create and foster new life…what an amazing opportunity.
I never felt so strong, beautful, and creative as I did pregnant. That being said, my husband is a rock and fiercely defended my decision to continue in sports and handling livestock.
Someone I know mentioned that she loved the feeling of being pregnant!
As someone who fears that to an almost irrational degree, I cannot relate.
Elaine in WoT using the prophecy that her babies will be born healthy as a "Well that means I can't die!" Was an interesting take on that...
That is what I thought. The series has a lot of problems but that was handled quite well. And there were a lot of political, magical and war threads depending on her
Yeah, I had feeling that would lead somewhere badly and well... it was alright in the end
@@Happy_blumay i ask what happens?
@@albertofuzzi7200 In what capacity? Because a lot happens...
@@albertofuzzi7200 Someone points out the recklessness and lack of responsibility that view point has and she gets back to being the great leader she learned to be. Before the real chaos started up.
Even WARRIOR CATS births have to be weird 😭 a book series made for children (thought sometimes I doubt it)
It was made for children. I promise you that it was. You are just an extremely childish person if you get your mind blown by anything with themes about death or war.
My childhood best friend got her period before she got The Talk and she thought she was dying like Silverstream
@@Abcdefg-tf7cuYour username literally starts with the English alphabet, do you still need to learn it or smth? 💀💀💀
@@gaygay2264 How have you not *redacted* yourself yet? It's really obvious that no one likes you.
@@Abcdefg-tf7cu Look I believe children should be taught about darker themes like death and other things. But sometimes the books get a little too detailed, for no reason?
Reminds me of that one badass pregnant Spider-Woman in Across the Spiderverse. She definitely handled that trope with such grace and badassery.
See and I also hate the flip side of when a woman can't hold/be nice to a child without the conversation going to "Just because I'm a woman, I have to play mom?" And then readers get upset when the author makes her pregnant or a mother at the end of the story. We can't have the middle ground of "A woman choosing motherhood because that's something she wants" or "the pregnancy is a natural and logical step-in the story"
I mean, most of the time authors *Do* treat pregnancy as a natural and logical step in the story, even if it really, really isn't.
@@tameriz1280 Yeah, it feels more like a "raising the stakes" action instead of the couple making the conscious decision to start a family
I can't hold my new baby nephews and nieces without being asked if I've changed my mind about not having kids. Is it so hard to believe that I can like children, and still not want to have any of my own?
@seaztheday4418 While I 100% believe that the only people who have a say about whether or not a woman has a child is her and her partner - I think childfree women need to change the narrative about having children. You might change your mind about pregnancy later on or you might not, that's totally fine. But that shouldn't stop you (women in general) from being mother figures in other ways. Who knows? In 5 years, you could be a stepmother, a foster mom, or even an adoptive mom. You're still a mother by definition, you just didn't give birth.
@@tameriz1280 I see very little "I wanted a child, for a long time, we tried for a while and now I'm pregnant". But maybe that's the selection of books I read
I've read this book series (out of 6 books somewhere late in the 3rd book) we found a character was pregnant. She was more like a warrior- ish, sword-fighting strong, thieving character, so you'd think having a baby would change that, but nope! Only, slightly- and it lead to some happy and some funny moments throughout the books, along with her fearlessness. They were a happy family. She also had a nice husband(incase u were wondering). =)
Does it happen to be land of stories? Goldilocks and Jack might be who you are talking about
@a-629 awww land of stories! I miss those books! It's what introduced my love of books. Goldilocks and Jack and Red and Charlie were so great
@@applejuice565 oh yeah, it's one of my favourite book serieses right now
@@a-629That’s what I was thinking too! Goldie is the only good example of a pregnancy trope I can think of lol
Drop the name please 😩
i find it cute when it’s in epilogues, but it’s just not my thing if it’s in the main story
Yes!
As someone who was once pregnant, may I say, I was surprised as how my body was in mode "everythng for the baby" as I had lost agency for myself :D
In first trimester I had moments when I was so exhausted that I would conk out, never mind if I was at work or whatnot, I'd lay and fall asleep there and then.
In second semester that seceded and left me with random cramps, no reason other than to impair me.
In third trimester, mister baby decided the whole place was his, stepping on my bladder or my spleen without warning.
So yeah, I think my body followed thoses author's tropes :D
Pregnancy is body horror and no one can convince me otherwise (it’s also incredible and almost magical but still body horror)
The natural functions of human bodies are not body horror try again
Low-key, I actually always saw myself adopting a child over giving birth to one because of this exact reason. Sadly it's a very expensive and long process, but I am not planning to jump into that process on a whim anyway...
@@themindeclectic9821not true body horror is just how weird things are
@@themindeclectic9821What I find horrifying is people who think they are!
That's okay. Horror is subjective. What makes some people horrified makes other people become nostalgic, laugh out loud, or feel horny. There's no reason to convince you that you should feel any certain way about any trope.
I also hate how every female character suddenly becomes a generic “sweet pregnant woman” even if it doesn’t match her personality at all, like mean/ambitious/evil people are still the same when they’re pregnant, and any change should be slowly incorporated not magically introduced.
I’d like a book where their bad traits are heightened. You thought the warlord was bad before. Just wait until the food cravings come in. Time to conquer Paris since they make the best crepes
I feel like "The Rookie" does it quite good with Angela's and Nyla's pregnancy
@francakramer2602 😂 yes!
We need more MPREG REPRESENTATION !! 😻😻
REAAALLL
What my "favorite" part is after she gives birth the baby is forgotten. and she just does her thing and the baby is just somewhere in the background 😅
Heh, reminds me of some of the farming type games I've played- you get married, and the kid somehow appears on cue, and then there's no actual schedule changes just an infant hanging out in the bedroom while you go chase livestock and plant lettuce for 14 hours 😅
@@jwolfe1209 Stardew valley?
@@nayonekha3346 story of seasons, olive town, specifically. Also seen it in the "my time in ____" games (recommend those ones!)
Also, romance stories that tack on a pregnancy right at the end, and despite that never being discussed in the novel, it's treated as a good thing on default, "I found my soulmate, OF COURSE im delighted he knocked me up unplanned!"
I think this overlaps with technological changes around what 'planning' constitutes - it happens in period and historical romance because once they have the big wedding in the final act it's an inevitable consequence of realistically hit-and-miss contraception. But it shouldn't carry over to contemporary romance, where it makes it seem like the vicar stole all their condoms or something.
I like that in "Dragon Bound" by Thea Harris the protagonist was actually mightily pissed that she got pregnant despite using protection. And actually suspected that her lover did something to facilitate it. They spoke about it and he was as shocked as she was and it turned out that it was just a freak magical thingystuff. But it wasn't depicted as a totally normal experience.
THANK YOU! It’s fine if the character has always wanted to be a mom-lots of girls and women dream of the day they have a baby! But it’s almost like they’re worried about the women coming across as less than because of their desire to be a mother. Just FYI, authors: you can write a badass female character who wants to be a mom at the same time, you just need to make sure you don’t write two different characters.
You DO realise that for all other species besides humanity, the overwhelming majority of history, and all poorer countries still today, the OPTION of 'planning' pregnancy didn't exist? Does no one understand basic reproductive biology anymore? Reliable contraception is an extremely recent invention, and it is such an insult to our ancestors to say women were 'forced' to get pregnant. You had sex because it's a normal healthy human instinct you weren't expected to repress, and pregnancy was just the natural outcome like every other creature on the planet.
There is nothing worse than a medieval fantasy where the woman 'chooses' to get pregnant. Talk about anachronistic. And considering the high mortality rate, most RESPONSIBLE human beings would have WANTED to do their part to make sure the human race didn't die out!
Babies are not luxury items you 'choose' to buy. They are PEOPLE.
I hate that soooo much. Kids aren’t like plants that you just get on a whim. They’re huge life changing responsibilities and just because a couple is all lovey dovey flowers, chocolates ‘n’ rainbows doesn’t mean they’ll automatically be 100% ready for kids, let alone want them.
This is an avid description of Padme Amadala. The moment Anakin and her are together she looses all personality and bad@ssery.
To be fair, none of the prequel characters had much personality.
Brother, she didn't have much to begin with.
Well, she's a senator so it's not like you can portray her the same way you portray Ashoka
It’s a shame too because there were several cut scenes showing Padme establishing the groundwork for the Rebel Alliance and doing her best to negotiate with Palpatine.
@@linagreenlyfe6705Ok how long has Ahsoka been a character for people to still misspell her name like this
I’ve always seen pregnancy and childbirth as something strong and powerful, even awe-inspiring. You’re giving a person life, and they cannot exist without you. And the decisions you make can have some of the biggest influence on this person - and you can use this immense power over someone else for good. Also, since childbirth hurts a lot, it takes courage and stoicism to endure.
Looking for a comment like this! 👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏
Stoicism? Love everything else, but complain away. It's good for the soul to let everyone know you need help right now cause otherwise you'll get walked over.
THIS!!! The thing I hate the most is when a strong independent woman suddenly becomes a withering wisp with no personality, smart characters suddenly makimg dumb decisions bc she's in love or pregnant or whatever
Lmfao being pregnancy makes you dumber though or it did with me. Pregnancy brain is real!
I would actually like some good examples on this.
I found myself struggling on portraying small children and mothers in my DnD campaigns, because of how starkly the stakes rise around them (a powerful NPC can shrug off blows from dragons and demigods, but any aoe spell in a wrong place and child is dead)
I have even touched pregnancy only once, as a motivation for an ex pirate captain to hunt down the man who sent assassins after her, because resurrection and healing can't do anything to bring back a child that isn't yet born. Had a ton of fun with her and her husband as NPCs.
My favorite example is the character of Big Mom from One Piece. She's got 85 kids, she's 68, and she is a deplorable character. But she is shown to still be pirating when she starts having kids. She also is very protective of her kids and frequently gives them powerful magical items to prevent them from getting hurt. She also makes powerful political alliances.
Is easy, just still write them as they aren't pregnant. Done. People are still people even if they are carrying a parasite in their womb.
Red Seas Under Red Skies is the second book in the Gentlemen Bastards series by Scott Lynch and it has a pretty good portrayal of a mother who still has a lot of agency. She even shows how starkly the stakes rise with children involved and talks about that with the main character. I don't recall any pregnant people in the book, though.
Just do some work/family balance. I DM'd for a group over the span of a decade. Half of my players are female.
My session got intense when the Baddy came back to town, turned out to have become morally gray, and had a tumultus on and off with his old Sweetheart.
Then the Baddy fell back into his Bad Habits, but for mysterious Good Reasons, and he was sentenced to death by his Old Nemesis.
Baddy insisted on bringing the truth with him to his grave. The truth, why Baddy left town, why Old Nemesis wanted him killed and why Baddy became morally grey and not just bad.
While Baddy was in jail, waiting for his sentence, I let Baddys sweetheart tell the (female) characters in a heart-to-heart, she was pregnant! But that she hadn't told Baddy!
It was up to the players to manouver the Baddy out of the death-sentence and get him setup with Sweetheart and accept to be Daddy instead of Baddy.
And yeah, Sweetheart is an unpolished, uncouth, halforc bouncer. Even after the babies where born. Someones gonna pay for the roof over the babies heads.
@@Mjao519 Heh)))
My mother of the year was a wandering wine trader, who semi-frequently visited her husband in his city. Since he and his allies were constantly opposing people with far more power, and she herself was often in high risk (she worked for Harpers at the time), she didn't tell her husband about pregnancy and just settled elsewhere for a year before continuing on her journey.
And so the party learned of her when her husband's (and their frequent questgiver's) enemy covertly set them up to try taking her hostage, also without knowing she is arriving into the city with a year-old child.
Party turned their gears mid-fight, as they began figuring out the truth, and called for her husband and his friend to help, as now they all were targeted by another enemy operation.
The one who actually emerged out of it all most mentally scarred was her husband, because not only he didn't know for almost two years that he has a child, but was not there to protect either from a danger that he created for them. So now the guy has willingly undergone the ritual to turn into rakshasa and is on a constant murder spree against anyone who tries to harm his family.
It has been three years after that in game, and now that lady is again a traveling merchant, who collects war refugees and orphans and brings them to safety, while her husband and their friends look after the children most of the time.
OMG SAME LIKE DID YOU SEE HOW EVERYONE TREATED KATNISS WHEN SHE WAS “PREGNANT” GOD I HATE THAT
HATE HATE HATE
What? Who? Help i'm stupid!
@@reddy161Katniss Everdeen from Hunger Games, there was that whole thing
To be fair, as a mom of 2, there is a certain level of caution that pregnant women should take, but Catching Fire milked that fake pregnancy for every bit of sympathy they could get! It was a bit much, but there is truth behind it.
i was ok with it because it was a fake pregnancy! katniss knew how to play the game and manipulated tf out of those capitol bastards. she really made citizens of the capitol think about how fucked up the government was being which they'd never thought of before. and she also rallied people from other districts to support the mockingjay's cause. ultimately, i feel it was such a great political move
Okay, but when you first have a kid, your defining characteric kinda *does* become "mom" - a tiny, helpless human needs you 24/7, it tends to take you over for a little while even when you have help. Eventually you get back to a version of yourself, but motherhood is one of those things that tends to change you irrevocably.
I'm new to the romance genre but I think it's weird calling pregnancy a "trope" - it's a natural and necessary part of life, we'd literally die off without it.
For what it's worth, my own pregnancy was wonderful and empowering, maybe I need to write my experience into a book! 😂
Wonderful comment - please do write the book! ❤
I was a little offput by calling it a trope too
solution: pregnant men
I needed that laugh! 😂😂😂
Also, the worst version is the TEENAGE pregnancy trope. I read it in the Splintered sequel, and hated it. It was prophecied throughout the trilogy, but the main girl becomes an old woman, with life experiences and maturity, only to have her youth, naivety, and VIRGINITY returned in her 16-year-old body in order to marry her second husband and have the prophesied baby immediately. W.T. F???
I just reread those and never got that message. Yes, she did have her youth restored (I thought she was 17 by this point but same difference) but I never got the idea that her “virginity” was restored in either read. And the books end when Alyssa and Morpheus enter the sun after their wedding.
I have other issues with the ending but have no recall of “insta-pregnancy”.
@@rivendells_shona There's another book after the trilogy, Untamed, an anthology of 3 mini stories. One of which is the scene when she returns to Morpheus after Jeb's death. It goes into more detail about the crown transforming her back into the state she was last time she wore it - i.e in book 1, at 16, when she was a virgin. It actually highlights that she has her 'innocence' again.
And yeah, it's not an insta-pregnancy thing, but in one of the anthology shorts it's heavily implied that they consummated on their wedding night, and thus got her pregnant. To the degree that she says that she's been married 9 months when she goes into labour.
I don't think Untamed is as common as the other three BECAUSE it's an anthology, but it was an AWFUL message for that target audience nonetheless. I can't read it anymore as an adult because 16, really, Morpheus? Really?
That sounds EXTREMELY gross! What was the author even thinking?
That sounds like some sort of fetish ☹
what. I haven't read that but it sounds so wrong! 😭
And then the child is like either the 'chosen one', the new main character and forget mom, OR just a prop for new conflict
I like that Anne of Green Gables stayed as Anne as ever after she had her children. (See Anne of Ingleside.)
Anna in Wolfenstein: New Collossus is how you write a badass pregnant lady. She's still running around conducting a rebellion, knifing Nazis, and planning guerrilla warfare and at one point duel wielding a pair of machine guns while topless, on fire, and heavily pregnant with twins.
OMFG YES!!!! she was so freaking badass. my boyfriend plays video games for me to watch, and he always picks ones with badass women for me.
not about books but one of my bestie's aunts is a gynecologist and showed her some medical books about what happens to a female body when pregnant. She then told me everything she read, word for word. We were 12 back then and I'm still scarred. Talk about body horror.
and my mom wonders why i dont want kids after hearing about her 20 horrific hours of labor followed by a vacum extraction with me.... every birthday.... LOL (at this point its a joke between us, that she calls me on the hour of my birth to tell me the tale of how i came into the world.) but i still teaze her about "and you wonder why i dont want one..."
Not to mention the “well I HAVE to stay with this toxic partner because I’m PREGNANT with his baby!”
And the sad thing is, this also happens in real life. I believe my dad won't leave my mom bc of me nd my brother. I think it comes from many factors, but writing it into romanticizing books definitely doesn't help.
Shoutout to Chi-Chi, Videl, and to a lesser extent 18 for embodying this trope so hard that it makes you kind of not like them.
I mean 18 was still and is still beating peoples asses. She was in the tournament of power. But yeah Chi-Chi always wanted to be the wife and mother sort. Videl was the real shock, she never seemed the type.
I’m reading a book with a really interesting take on the main character’s pregnancy. She already had a bit of a mother dynamic with a group of kids in her village, and it didn’t take away with the addition of her pregnancy. In fact, I feel like this strengthened her character. She’s always loved spending time with kids even before she got pregnant. The interesting part is how everyone around her acts about it, it’s quite complicated and you’d have to read the book to understand but this just reminded me of it. (The book is called Gilded by the way)
I'm okay with characters being pregnant but ive hated every birth scene I've ever come across. I feel like an older gentleman instead of a woman when it comes to birth scenes in fiction. Show me to the lobby and just slap a bow on the kid's head when I need to come back in the room. 😂
I mean, I've given birth two times, and I still would never agree to watch someone else give birth.
This is so true. The few times I stumbled over the pregnancy trope, the soon to be mother had such a change in personality and character that I wasn't even sure I was reading the same story anymore. The coolest characters are just reduced to being moms and I think that that is just sad. As if you are incapable of being anything but a parent as soon as you are with child.
... that's how it works in reality a lot of the time, though. Not for any arbitrarily sexist reason either. Kids are one hell of a time-consuming hobby, and in practice do tend to either become the main focus in their mother's life...or develop attachment issues if that doesn't happen, which I am sure you wouldn't like as a story either
Yes, it IS for a sexist reason, but it is not an exclusive job for the mother to raise the child. There's at least the father too
I actually don't mind childbirth being portrayed as traumatic because childbirth IS traumatic.
It's traumatic in very different ways. And the constant narrative of birth being horrific because of outside influences takes away from the fact that lack of education is causing the traumatisation of people who wouldn't be as traumatised if they knew what was happening to them. That proper support before, during and AFTER means it can be more of a painful necessity instead of the life and death struggle it is depicted as.
This is how I felt about the character Cadence from My Little Pony. She lost all her personality after giving birth. I get that children can be a handful and take up a lot of time, but personality can even shine when people take care of children. Parents may respond differently to different scenarios based on their personality and stuff, but we instead get the same character over and over again.
Aren't we all defined by our relationships in some way? I don't think the fix for this is that women should not be defined by their relationships but that men SHOULD. Why is the role of being a father NOT a defining characteristic of a person's life? I think that would be a much more refreshing update.
absolutely - a male character who suddenly is struggling with going into battle because not he has a child back home he doesn't want to see childless.
Agreed. I think a good portrayal of this was in the movie (and book) The Patriot... "I'm a father, i don't have the luxury of principles." Putting his children BEFORE himself, and then eventually being forced to go to war to protect his children as the capture and impending death of one of his sons that then lead to the death of another of his sons was the catalyst that forced his hand into battle. And I get that it was "based on a true events", however it was STILL a compelling story and very engrossing. Even when I was a teenager and read the book and then saw the movie, to now being a mom myself, it resonated. To be a parent during times of war. And then the aunt that he eventually ends up with at the end. She was a BOSS! Holding down the children and home front, facing countless dangers as well and YET STILL finding balance between the "cause" AND the role of "Mom/caregiver".... Pregnancy and parenthood could be GOOD things that give a character something to fight for and still be dynamic and an individual while also being a parent, husband, father, wife, mother. We have examples of it, they are just few and far between these days.
It's about women being more than their relationships, they shouldn't only be defined by who they're related to in whatever way
I mean unless the man is your father, he shouldn't be defined as a father unless he decides to make it that way. [Mase Hughes comes to mind.]. Women shouldn't either. They should be known as their own person.
my parents are MY parents, that's how they are defined by ME. But if someone else defines them as parents are only parents, I find it odd. Dad's a firefighter and mum's an accountant. Basically, a person's whole personality shouldn't change to being only Parent if it wasn't their goal or want before.
The only time it should matter is when someone isn't doing their job as a parent..When someone isn't taking responsibility of their kids its absolutely annoying. YOU chose to have it, take care of your kids and don't ignore them. I don't care that you're tired after work or you haven't had a break all day. So what? You shouldn't have procreated then. That's on you, mate.
On another note, a relationship to other people shouldn't define a character. It should be their goals. Their lives. Their accomplishments. We call Abraham Lincoln the president of the Untied states [a job title not a relationship]. Not son of Nancy Lincoln, or husband of Mary Lincoln, or father of Robert, Eddie, Willie, and Tad. That's what the video is referring to.
@@toothless3835 and I think that’s a crying shame, for literature anyway. The model that your accomplishments to society are more defining for you as a person than your accomplishments in your family is to me a false narrative. Literature is supposed to reflect human experience and real human experience, your role as a parent is THE most defining role in most people’s lives. I wish that was reflected in male characters. People have many aspects to themselves, and career and hobbies and worldly accomplishments is just one subset of a whole person.
I remember Helene's sister (don't remember her name) was a very well written pregnant woman during the later part of the Ember in the Ashes series.
Ahhhh, it was my first time reading a story where characters can just die, and that series killed me! Can confirm, i was huddled after each book before snapping out of it to grab the next.
I think her name was Livia but I could be wrong
But I totally agree I loved her character
@@Happy_blu yes the stakes in that book are brilliants set
I love being pregnant but the newborn stage is so tough. A lot of people hate being pregnant but like the newborn stage so I guess everyone’s different. This does make
Me think deeper about the pregnancy story I was going to write for my fantasy novel. A happy ending or easy birth was not something I’d ever considered even as a possibility but now that you mention it it has potential.
I'm rewatching charmed, and Piper's pregnancy seems to be working out well enough. She spends the episodes complaining about how her sisters think she's suddenly made of sugar and that she can still kill demons, run her club and live her life. She also threatens to a man's arm off for attempting to touch her belly without consent, which is a very reasonable reaction I reckon.
Pretty sure that was just Holly channeling her own frustrations of people treating her like that into the character. From what I had heard she was always pretty self-reliant and independent and suddenly everyone asked like she was an invalid.
The forced jome birth annoyed me so much. That should have been her decision. (I'm not against home birth, I'm for the right to choose the level of medical intervention).😊
@@carly7522 Yes, it should have been but the reason for it being a home birth was very understandable: Whyat orbed out in the end. They saw this coming. So Piper had to deal with the home birth to avoid exposure.
Were there other options? Yes. There's the mind erasing dust for one thing and the cleaners for another (even though they weren't something that existed at the time in the canon). But why would the elders take that risk for the comfort of a woman? /s (maybe I'm giving the writers too much credit. Maybe they're just hacks who didn't think the implications through)
The first image that popped into my head was a pregnant woman whose nearby people are trying to take care of her and make her rest, but she’s like “This is so stupid, I barely even have a baby bump. I still have a kingdom to run.”
My goodness, would like to read something like that! What I've come across is usually tacked on the end of romance novels like a burr on a cat's tail... Like there is no " happily ever after " without getting knocked up within 3 months...
Considering that the kid in there is very important for the stability and long term safety of the realm, I cant really blame them. If that character was royalty, they absolutely would be bundled up and kept weeeell away from anything even remotely dangerous for the exact same reason as to why the President of the US is constantly surrounded by big scary men in suits.
This is Elayne from Wheel of Time, only she takes it to the extreme... but that has more to do with her interpretation of a prophesy than her pregnancy
A sonic oc set in a alternate universe did this really well I think, still had some things that was debatable, but when her midwife informed her she was suspicious of her pregnancy, she was happy, but immediately coddled, being a fiercely independent woman, she did NOT like that, especially when plot happened, because goddamn it, she is Queen and she needed to be there for her people, but neither her people or her baby were neglected in the aftermath, things turn out well, adoption so emotionally driven I cry like a bitch happens
I don't think she takes it to the extreme except in a couple of scenes. For the most part it's actually a really honest portrayal of pregnancy. Everyone around her is super annoying and policing what she eats and drinks and she is busy being queen . @@sindarinlord
Also, why on earth is the epitomeof a happy romance novel 80% of the time ”and 2months later she surprised her now husband, that she has known a total of 4 months by then with the news that he will become a father and everyone is happy.” At least in ACOTAR they actualky discussed not getting pregnant right away but instead living a cool life and doing things as a couple for a while.
Most people do want kids, and if you're having sex, they happen. 😂
@@nala7829well yes, but the strong independent super cool characters in the books do not seem the type to want kids straight away. Especially as they usually are barely adults themselves. I found the love of my life young, got married at 22 and had my kids 5 and 8 years later. Sam with all my friends, except the ones who got married in their mid-to late 30s, where there perhaps starts to be a bit of time pressure.
And I’m not even a cool adventurer/magician/billionaire with all the world to explore. Seems weird for otherwise modern characters to fall into this pregnancy thing all the time.
@@nala7829Most people aren't educated enough in history to realize that before the 20th century, the only reliable contraception was celibacy. Actually, it's still the only one that's 100% reliable.
Yep, the characters get married, have TONS of graphically written unprotected sex, and then still manage to 'wait' to have kids because they drink a certain type of herbal tea that definitely won't work on everyone? HAVE THEY NEVER READ A BIOLOGY TEXTBOOK! The teenagers reading this series will NOT realise they have to use something more reliable to 'plan' pregnancies!
One of the best portrayals I've seen of a pregnant character has got to be Jessica Drew from Across The Spiderverse. She is absolutely badass, her character was developped around her being a PERSON and not just a vessel, and her being a dynamic, pregnant action hero both in Miles' universe and her own is just so pleasant to see
Yes! This! After becoming a mom - I feel like that’s my ONLY identifier that other people give me. (There is in fact a “mom” club, and if you don’t mom like the other moms you are casted as the “other”). And when I try do things like for myself that’s not “mom” I’m suddenly a bad one. I also feel bad if I do something for myself that is also not “mom” even though no one says anything directly because of years of societal pressure. I love my kids but I don’t want to talk about them when I’m with other women. I want to talk about other things because I need a mental break. There’s like a mom-you and a non-mom-you but they’re both you. Vent complete. Thank you for joining me on my soapbox. ❤
Too many women face terrible pain during birth, struggle too hard being a mom and we as a society are not doing enaugh to adress it than to acknowledge this dire reality in books.
Yes people thought i was lying when i told them 2hrs post birth i was vacuuming my house. All they knew was from tv and books. They were convinced every labor is life and death, come out so weak they cant stand, and all mental capacity diminishes to only baby oriented tasks.
Damn, never knew that was possible
@@jadefoxette8603 our body is amazing we can do more than we think
I mean. The women I know rested for the first couple days after. You must have had a pretty smooth pregnancy. But everyone's is different I guess.
@@catwithquill ive had a couple smooth and a couple rough. Some people do end up having a hard time but most don't. Resting postbirth isn't a bad thing at all.
That sounds very american, where they discharge you out of the hospital so soon you make it home in less 2 hours, did they throw you out in 10 minutes?? As far as I know everywhere else you are kept there for 2-5 days for the child to be monitored and to make sure they are safe. That or you gave birth at home at which case it is still weird to not be occupied with the child and instead do vacuuming...
If you want some good pregnancy representation, I would recommend The Land of Stories! They have a pre-established, badass character who gets pregnant in one of the later books and she still keeps her badassery just now she’s also dealing with the side effects of pregnancy. It’d highly recommend despite it being for a younger audience!
One of my favorite portrayals was in the ‘Soulless’ series by Gail Carriger
Goldilocks, one of the protagonists from The Land of Stories, is actually an example of the author making a character get pregnant, but not ruining her character. She has been on the run since the “three bears incident” and when she eventually gets pregnant in the series, she still insists on joining everyone else in their adventures and escapades and stuff.
I like Anne McCaffery for it. Most women become pregnant, gmhave babies but they all still have jobs and personalities.
I reeeeeally need to read her stuff...
I only really remember the 1 pregnancy scene but I can't remember if it was Dama or Rowan that was pregnant. Still the Tower and Hive series definitely doesn't have the female's lose their personality after having kids. I am still surprised though everytime someone on booktube shows their lack of knowledge about female authors of the past. It's like younger millenials and Gen z completely missed this huge swath of history.
I do love Anne McCaffrey, but there are some other problematic themes in some of her stuff that I only realized when I reread as an adult in my 30s versus a late teen/early 20s. Its not gonna stop me from re-reading them again, but I just don't love them *as much* now as I did back then.
This is both true and false for me. The consent stuff is... Gray at best, but I do actually appreciate how she demonstrated women gaining agency in a fairly partiarchal setting in a realistic way. Like-- not just transplanting 20th c. Feminism on the world, but having characters create +define their own agency. Also really interesting in the origin books how gender roles were more modern due to the background. @@CR_321
Yes! I love her stuff! It’s awesome to see someone’s give her love! I love her dragonriders series
Highly recommend “The Director “ by Renee Rose , it has been my favorite pregnancy trope ever!!❤
I find it is often the opposite. Usually it mentions the pregnancy and maybe a glimpse of the baby playing on the floor or something, but really you never get a picture of what parenthood actually looks like for that character, you also have no clear personality from the kid.
Out on a Limb is amazing book on Pregnancy trope. Apart from disability rep it is a good romance novel without traumatic birth scene.
By who
By Hannah Bonam-Young?
It's a tv show, but i think Charmed does great writing Piper's pregnancies. She is scared at first that fighting demons will hurt the baby, but after that she just continues being a badass lol
To be fair… I lost all personality when I was pregnant. It does have a way of taking over your thoughts.
Currently writing a book where my main character becomes a mother mid way through the book. She still has more growing to do after it, she just happens to be a mom on top of it. She also has a nice birth with her friend/midwife on Christmas Day.
Edit: Throne of Glass and other spoilers in this comment and the following thread. Read at your own risk!
I think Yrene Towers/Westfall from Throne of Glass was an excellent pregnancy portrayal. She became concerned for the wellbeing of her child, yes, but lost none of her spunk and will. She was a force to be reckoned with, with or without child. I loved Yrene
THIS! and beyond this even, Yrene did her most impressive work, KILLED A (basically) GOD, HEALED AN ENTIRE POSSESSED ARMY, AND MAGICALLY REINFORCED HER HUSBANDS ABILITY TO WALK CONSTANTLY, DURING A WAR, all while pregnant! Yrene is one of the best characters in ToG
The more people mention this series, the more I'm convinced I need to read it 😅
@@ironboi7359 I AGREE I AGREE I AGREE
@@Tessa_Ru Oh you absolutely do. I read it with almost no prior info because my boyfriend asked me to. Literally has changed my life.
@@Tessa_Ru Yeah, I'd highly recommend ToG! It's nice to see the writing & characters mature with the author
Since you are a writer I’ll give you some inspiration from my life.
First pregnancy I had all the strength and energy possible. I hiked, rock climbed, or did cardio yoga daily. At 35 weeks my midwife figured out I was in labor but I couldn’t feel it due to my daily practice of hypnobabies. She gave me false unicorn to stop it after I had my one and only sonogram to make sure I wasn’t truly progressing since I still had 2 weeks before I could legally birth at a birthing center. At 37 weeks we finally named our baby (surprise sex) and that’s when I discovered my blood pressure was in the normal range (mine was always low). It was higher by next morning when my midwife checked and sent me to the hospital (this is when I lost body autonomy). Hubby and I both understood I was having tests done but in reality my midwife dropped my case and switched me to the hospital. The hospital did a forced and painful exam and put me on pitocin (an artificial hormone to try to induce me which I could have told them I was allergic to) and magnesium (to control the BP but basically makes it impossible to dilate). I was on high doses for 17 hours with the highest levels on contractions, which did nothing and I couldn’t feel due to hypnosis all because my midwife was controlling the doctor’s every move and everyone ignored me. I had an emergency c-section that the anesthesia didn’t work (thank God for hypnosis) and the pitocin caused me to hemorrhage (2 separate doctors’ conclusions). Despite being the only patient for 4 days I was also given the wrong blood platelet and had an allergic reaction to it. I have no memory of my son for probably the first two days, no feelings for 4 days, and due to the fake oxytocin had no love feeling for an entire month and had immediate postpartum psychosis and rage based anxiety, plus PTSD trauma (all lessened or healed through EMDR therapy, sepia, and CBD oil).
Now my second birth my husband was yet again on my side. Pre-eclampsia with HELLP syndrome is a usually a first time mom thing and I was pregnant before the 4 year limit in case of hubby’s DNA being the cause for HELLP. We chose the student midwife that stayed at the hospital with us and was way more into informed consent. I also had a doctor specializing in monitoring me for pre-eclampsia and HELLP and did all the base blood work the morning before conception. This time I had no energy, but I also had a 3 year old and my husband was gone all but 1 month. At 37 weeks I went into labor. I was in labor for 4 days, pushed at the birthing center for 4 hours (at the start of that they popped my water and my chiropractor had to put my dislocated hip back in, which was the only part that hurt due to hypnosis). My husband and birth doula tried every single position I wanted to push baby out but his head could be seen but kept popping back up, even when they had me squatting in the air with my butt below my feet. Midwife finally asked if I wanted to go to the hospital and explained her concerns with me having not slept in days. So, we drove to a hospital, I immediately chose a hospital away from my doctor due to it being an hour away instead of two hours. The hospital hooked me to an epidural, which was far worse than labor because it felt like my whole body was being poked with needles. The epidural also gave me blackout amnesia and laps of time. I was awake pushing and taking the entire 7 hours at the hospital but I thought it was only 1 when my midwife came and explained the baby’s heart rate was dropping and asked what I wanted to do. I immediately chose another surgery. Well, anesthesia didn’t work again, despite the anesthesiologist and I having a conversation. This time, thank God, I have all memories from surgery and after, don’t know why not in the labor room. The hospital ended up paying our entire bill, like weirdly kept insisting on it we are assuming because they technically weren’t supposed to let me push for so long, the anesthesia not working, and because despite 5 people telling the doctor I’m allergic to pitocin she had them try to start a drip after surgery and my husband immediately threatened to rip everything out of me and sue them. Despite that, hubby and I both 100% agreed we had a way better experience and it was a healing birth.
So, round three. I found out I was already pregnant when I decided to relinquish my fertility to God. Literally got pregnant on April Fools during a time I should not have been ovulating for another 2 weeks based on my decade of tracking my cycle. So, I was a little freaked out because I now knew that no type of anesthesia works on me, like the dentist even has issues. We weren’t sure if baby could actually fit to come out. So, I prayed and got led to experts. Turns out my second baby got stuck due to scar tissue blocking his shoulder and a twisted tailbone all caused so many hours of pushing just for his head to be at the exit point. I was led to a womb doula who specializes in scar tissue. I saw her at least once a month for her to break apart the scars in my uterus and all the organs they had attached to (also turns out the left side couldn’t expand and that’s why even my amazing chiropractor couldn’t get second baby to move away from my right side). It was like having a bone broken with every scar she broke apart. I also worked with a pelvic floor therapist and had a doctor who 100% agreed I needed a vaginal birth due to my anesthesia and scaring issues. I was in prodromal labor, which felt like end stage labor with my second for 1 month. Contractions were every 2-3 minutes for 4-6 hours a day.I would be alone driving two hours from my doctor many times. I was halfway dilated during that entire time. The day before 40 weeks I woke in transition with contractions every minute at 12:30 am. I was stuck on the toilet for an hour yelling to try to wake anyone up. Finally finished with the toilet and woke my husband. He called everyone and we got ready to go. When he lifted me in the backseat of the truck my water burst, like a comedic show, and I was launched into the seat headfirst, causing whiplash that would be discovered 12 hours later when the adrenaline wore off. We made it 5 minutes down the road when I yelled to stop. 911 just answered when a bubble came through me and his head was out, followed right behind with his body. I had no pain after the water broke and didn’t consciously push. It was the most amazing thing. He was born at 2:39 AM. My water breaking at home was actually the sign I prayed for if I was being blessed with a vaginal birth but in the moment I forgot.
Since my doctor was out of town on vacation my doula called her and the doctor did everything over the phone with the hospital and basically told them to leave me alone and I call the shots. She denied all pay and the hospital gave us a huge discount and dropped most charges, except for the NICU (he has a genetic breathing issue that our homeopathic actually figured out and was able to treat when doctors became clueless on healing). We brought our third baby home on Christmas Day and hubby and I have true healing from the past. Hubby takes my lead when it comes to pregnancy, birth, and most parenting because he trusts my research and knows I’m hyper aware of my own body.
I'm not a writer.
But I can tell you that a huge block of homogeneous text is hard to read.
Helps to add some spacing.
I am kind of relieved to hear you say this because every time somebody shades the pregnancy trope I feel a little bit of author shame for having it in my book's outline. Thankfully, the plan for my darling Rosanna is that her becoming pregnant with the heir to the throne by accident is not her defining quality, but rather how she rises to the challenge of being thrust into court with tenuous standing, so... hopefully you're never mad at me.
THANK YOU! I’m so glad other people are talking about this. I don’t think I’ve ever read or watched a show where this hasn’t happened to the point where I decided I hat to write a book where a character got pregnant and had kids and was still a badass and a good mom. I am also sick of mother characters being portrayed as a bad mom if they are cool, you don’t have to pick one.
My mom told me that I should cut my hair shorter. I asked why and she said, and this isntge quote, "You're a mom now"
I want more stories about women being in healthy relationships and being warriors throughout pregnancy. I want stories about women fighting to make a better place for their child. I want stories showing the true fire that burns in a woman's soul for her children, showing the unending desire to protect them, as well as nurture them.
Yeah! A lot of people act like women who complain about pregnancy just “have the wrong perspective” or “you just hate children” when rather it’s just that they aren’t being represented properly.
I have a series recommendation. Its called the 'Red Queen' by Victoria Aveyard. A pretty important character, sort of the leader of the rebellion becomes pregnant and remains a fighter and is literally exactly like what you described.
SPOILER: Her partner dies though so that's a little depressing. He was one of mine fav side characters.
The whole series I think is like 4 books, and her becoming pregnant is in the 3rd book (probably). I wasn't able to complete the series so I don't know how it ends but it also has LGBTQ representation and is set in a dystopian future.
my one character in the text based RP i'm writing is exactly this. (its an X men type story) she's a superhero named Mainstay, an empath who can affect other people's emotions around her, and can use magical sheilds. she's absolutely not going to stop fighting, expecially because her step daughter, and her two daughters all have their own abilities and that puts them in danger. she becomes MORE active after becoming a parent, if anything else. because now her kids are at stake. (she's an activist for powered people to be seen as human with the same rights as everyone else, on top of being a UN sanctioned superhero)
Check out The Rookie - there are a couple mothers and pregnant ladies in the whole series that make you want to hide 😂
Idk my wife is pregnant right now, and she is everything but empowered right now. Puking once or twice per day, breathing heavy walking up the stairs, losing energy from standing in the shower... but maybe someone could make it work?
I think Handmaids take and junes second pregnancy really does the opposite of this. Her being pregnant was NOT her choice and she straight up was smuggling herself out of Gilead and would have succeeded if she didn’t fall into labor she was perfectly capable of escaping on her own. She took her pregnancy into her own hands even though it was thrust upon her unwillingly and made choices for herself and her daughter that could’ve gotten her killed
I really want to have a post-pregnancy scene the day after where the mother and father are outside wrangling horses when someone drives by (car or carriage depending on timeline) and have them yell at the husband, “YOU GET HER BACK IN BED!” ….for like. All the reasons you just mentioned 😂😂😂
Well depending on the birth that is totally and understandable position to take. My wife tore her vaginal stitches because she wouldnt take it easy those first seven days and had to go back in for to be cut and re stitched and then actually take it easy.
@@robertblume2951 okay?
Finally someone who gets it!!
I believe the preg trope is great for peeling back underlying character flaws/ arcs that maybe the MC was avoiding. I get so tired of the arc just being “mom” or “will I be a good parent?”
Like any life event it should dramatically make your MC question parts of themselves. A way for them to possibly reexamine there past trauma’s. Not just magically wisk away the problems as you become a paragon of “motherhood” and loose all personhood.
By all means if anyone had a good example of the preg trope please please PLEASE! Tell me about it? I need good book recommendations
sadly my only good examples are from the Text based writing server i'm an admin on... but they are out there! i just can't think of any off the top of my head.
I read a Worm fanfic where the couple Assault and Battery.
Long story, yes they know their names are stupid together, Assault did it just to piss off Battery who already had her name.
Anyway, she gets pregnant and after a bit, disappears from the story.
Then comes back like nothing changed. Just had a few less appearances. And they became less of a duo as Assault and Battery were seen together less.
They were taking care of their kids.
NOTHING CHANGED ABOUT BATTERY'S CHARACTER. Aside from her schedule and I loved it!
Oooh I got something for that actually, its not a book but a movie. But the character Ronal, from Avatar Way of The Water. Dispite being pregnant she plays an active role in the movie, even when her husband gets worried for her safter during a time of war she pushes through and takes up arms to fight.
as a kid with severe mommy issues, the pregnancy epilogue and fan fic is the only thing keeping me alive rn.
I wish you knew how perfect of the time it is that I got this video recommended. I am writing exactly that a pregnant woman with a personality but now you have motivated me. Thank you
AGH FINALLY I CAN TALK ABOUT THIS!!! I know of a positive pregnancy story!!! It's a short story in Song Of The Mango and Other New Myths titled Chosen Mother, it's centered around a girl that gets pregnant with the chosen one, but she has kickass adventures and subverts the "dies while giving birth" thing by just straight up saying "nah im not dying for this!!"
she doesnt stay with her kid (she has to send him off to fantasy school) but she goes on EVEN MORE adventures after it. it was such a good read, an all of the stories ive seen in the collection are really good !!!
Childbirth is extremely traumatic though. Even with no complications it's a wild ride.
My wife had minor complications and there was blood everywhere.
It's probably the most painful and physically taxing thing most women will ever do, no need to sugar coat it
Also "happy feminist" makes me laugh every time.
Difficult is not the same as life threatening/life and death. So much of fiction is full of stories where the mom has to choose to live or save her child, she nearly dies, and so on, when it’s incredibly rare IRL. Obviously, with fiction, especially fantasy, if the tech is bad, yeah, pregnancy and labor were far more dangerous. But even modern or futuristic settings do this all the time
As a mom myself this tracks. Some people thought my pregnancy made me public property and those same people found out that they were delusional the effective way. When I say effective please look at it through the lens of I'm active duty and a maintainer. Also most authors have no actual experience with pregnancy not looking like a woman loosing all agency or personality because a lot of pregnant women do due to how hard pregnancy is and how vulnerable it makes you. A woman is most likely to be murdered or physically abused while pregnant and the 3 months immediately after. This threat comes from everyone, her family, his family, her friends more than his friends, her exes and his exes equally, and perfect strangers. Baby rabies is a fucking real thing and it's terrifying to be on the receiving end of it when you are weaker, less coordinated, and much more easily over powered due to the biological changes caused by pregnancy. Hormones cause a personality change in most women towards nurturing, self sacrifice, and priorization of the baby. Your body is shared with someone else during and after the pregnancy. Babies are needy and always right for the first 6 months. Also minimum 30% of birth scenes should be traumatic or kill the mother/child in first world countries because that's the real world statistic. Historical fiction should be between 50% to 60% percent death rate for mothers or children under 3-5 depending on how far back it's set. While fantasy or paranormal fiction should fluctuate based on the established magical prowess of those immediately available but never get below 15% trauma and death for mom/child because we don't want to compromise the suspension of disbelief required to immerse yourself in a story. Pregnancy and childbirth is for modern women the most dangerous thing they will ever do unless they seek out extreme danger and even then they have control over their preparations. No matter how well you prepare for pregnancy and childbirth you really have no control over how it turns out and that's terrifying the first time around.
See, as a reenactor and someone who studies history, yes, pregnancy is dangerous! She has a point with the statement that the characters personality changes I have never been pregnant so I can't speak to what it's like. But I can't fault writers for having violent heroes take a back seat the minute they are pregnant.
As a transgender gay man being pregnant is my worst nightmare. Not because I wouldn't be willing to bring life into this world but because flat out the way it happens? I will be treated horribly if I am at any point medically transitioned. I mean fuck in Germany for instance, if you have a child more than 6 months after your legal transition you lose your rights to be seen as a man. They will legally de-transition you. And they're not the only countries to do it trans men lose their reproductive rights.
Tldr: the book writers have a reason for why they do this. While there needs to be more representation of how most women have healthy happy babies with ease, we can't ignore the truth.
We also have to look at population differences. In Europe, the upper class bred themselves into an unhealthy physical form, incapable of giving healthy birth. They were/are full of birth defects and genetic diseases due to massive inbreeding. This was contemporaneously verified by that same class defining a "peasant" characteristic as being able to give birth easily, will minimal pain or complications, and continue to work after.
Lower-class women were often described, negatively, as having "child-bearing hips". If a high class woman displayed those tendancies there would be rude, under-the-breath comments about her coming from peasant stock, even suggested infidelity on the part of a mother or grandmother in order to secure that strong peasant seed.
So the overall, recorded medical statistics of birth records in European history is skewed towards recording the circumstances of the rich and unhealthy over the poor or extremely healthy.
Queen Charlotte had 15 children, and also came from country "farmer" nobles. In fact she was specifically chosen for that reason, in the hopes she could actually birth an heir.
Almost forgot where I was going with that there. So anyway, a lot of the health issues that affect modern women comes from their personal genetic history, a couple hundred years of convincing women to give birth wrong because Male Science says it's Better Actually, and modern hospitals being way too lax on their use of drugs and medical procedures without a proper medical history, informed consent, or actually properly considering the diagnosis before just waving a hand and ordering a nurse to do whatever.
Birth trauma rates are different everywhere, but wildly differ based on things like European heritage and cultural influence, or class level, even more than access to medical facilities.
@@pvp6077You make amazing points I had not thought about. It's logical to think European upper class women had a lot of this problems due to inbreeding and not because of normal risks of pregnancy.
I used to think if nobles had genetic knowledge in those time they'd make different choices but it seems they deduced inbreeding led to genetic problems all right and did it anyway. It is testament to the stupidity of human race to do these kind of thing and flex about how sickly looking you can be because you have a team of servants and doctors to tend to all your needs.
Notably US has far worse maternal mortality than peer countries so it depends on where you are pregoranting for your trauma stat.
@@specialnewb9821it’s because we are fatter and out of shape and can’t afford preventative health care so might have a lot of unknown conditions. 😢
I think writing pregnancy would be similar to the canonical mechanic of DDLC. Hear me out!!!
In DDLC, Monika is altering the game to amplify the negative emotions of her clubmates. Sayori's depression and Yuri's obsession specifically.
Pregnancy amplifies hormones. So they'd still be the same person (preferably, they have a personality before this), but with enhanced emotions and hunger. So just kick it up by 5×, and give them unique to them weird cravings. (I have pica, I can handle writing the weird cravings)
Let me know if this would be a good way to write them.
I have an idea for a pregnancy in relation to fantasy- Basically, a queen regnant gets pregnant. Everyone is happy. She has a healthy birth and everything is going smoothly and everything is looking up and up for the kingdom. But then she contracts childbed fever. And everyone is worrying because the heir is a newborn and her surviving is the one thing that decides if they go to war or not (her half brother (illegitimate), father in law, cousin, and husband were squabbling with each other over the regency as he father in law and cousin in law wanted it but her husband wanted to put the kid first, and the half brother wanted power). And then she dies and a civil war begins over the regency.
What do ya think?
IVE GOT YOU!!! WRITING A BOOK RN AND SHOULD BE COMING OUT IN ABT 3-6 ISH YEARS DEPENDING ON HOW LONG IT TAKES
I glance at the loads of "Harlequin Romance" books at Goodwill and the library, and I think, "just how many of these are written with the idea of either meeting up with a deadbeat/absent father, only to resolve sort-of neatly...or have that "One night with a powerful someone" only to have it just be that one-night stand where the protection fails (if there's any), etc.?"
Mind you, they're a way to pass a couple hours or so, and for many these plots are relatable, so they still sell like the latest popular thing. But yeaaah, even for me, it's a tired trope. 😅
Man that seems just like an accurate portrayal of becoming a mom in the us. Like you could have saved the world from small pox created a cure and then get pregnant and boom now all you are is mom
Because having a good mother is more important than simply not getting smallpox. Other things can still kill you, and you will ultimately die. The love of a mother is eternal.
This is super interesting and very true. You made my realize that I’ve been really hesitant to have my female characters have children because I don’t want them to lose their personality/who they are, like it’s been societally ingrained.
I think that you just inspired me to write a good portrayal of pregnancy. I've known a _lot_ of pregnant people in my life, and it's a shame they get reduced to just a womb in so many stories.
I’ll write it for you:
1)Character who is financially stable and planned their pregnancy
2)Character is the lucky percent who don’t have 9 months of pregnancy symptoms like carpal tunnel, hyperemesis, insomnia etc.
These two keep her from becoming “JUST MOM” because she isn’t FORCED to feel different
3) Character is the low percentage of moms who give birth quickly and naturally on their first baby, even though first baby is typically the longest and most traumatic delivery
4) Character lives in a world with affordable childcare or supportive family so she doesn’t need to alter her career or just worry all the time that someone will take advantage of her baby.
This woman does exist, she’s just not the majority. Most of us are a variety of the above experience, but rarely all. We’re happy for her, but idk if that story is “empowering”. I think authors change up the pregnant character’s personality because it’s what’s realistic. However all motherhood experiences are valid (even mom who barely has to change when it happens), every mom is giving their all raising people in the end. But if you think books need to start focusing on that lucky mom, write away!
Character live in EU 😂
So much this! Getting pregnant may not change your personality, but it sure changes a whole lot of other things. And if you're feeling sick and riding the emotional and hormonal waves, it can look like your personality has changed. Throw in new fears and priorities, physical impairments, difficult birth, and you may have a completely different character.
I personally ADORED Princess Carolyn’s storyline in Bojack Horseman. Before her daughter she is a career-oriented, cutthroat and shrewd businesswoman. AFTER her daughter…she is a career-oriented, cutthroat and shrewd businesswoman, who has a daughter at home. Her character doesn’t undergo a massive shift after she adopts her baby, and if her focus had shifted from her career after she became a mom, she wouldn’t have been Princess Carolyn anymore.
this is a good point, but i don’t think it’s what the creator was getting at… there’s a difference between writing a pregnancy story with problems because pregnancy is hard and challenging in the real world, and writing a pregnancy story with problems because the author wants the audience to be upset or thinks that pregnancy is the only conflict the main character is allowed to have because she’s Mom™️ now. pregnancy should be written with problems, but the problems shouldn’t be _all_ the mom is, does that make sense? it’s a difficult line to walk, but i think it’s an important thing to think about
Ok, I'm all of these. Also I like in the EU, so no medical expenses, and took a year off work with both kids. Super easy pregnancies and births.
My experience of pregnancy can be summed up as "will you all leave me alone? I'm absolutely fine" and since husband was also on paternity leave + vacation for 6 months both times everything was pretty relaxed. Like we're not going to have more kids, but I sometimes fantasize about a third baby just to relive that intensely peaceful time of the first few months with a newborn
Hey, I actually have a good example of this!
In Chris Colfer’s “The Land Of Stories” series, Goldilocks is a bandit who’s been on the run ever since the Three bears incident. Eventually in the series she gets pregnant, and she refused to quit adventuring even though she is indeed pregnant. People are still terrified of her lmao
Yes! That’s what I was thinking!
There's this manhwa named "Positively Yours" that I read, which is a romance with pregnancy trope. I really loved it because both characters have sm development and fall deeply in love w each other. They started with a night stand and met again one day when the girl went to a gynaecologist for her pregnancy. And I love how they portrayed the story of side characters, and how the fmc worked on herself towards her goals even after being a mom, all her family and friends supporting her.
Btw it's one of my most fav romance manhwas, and I love both the fmc & mmc. Fmc is an INFP & mmc is an ISTJ and I really love a romantic & wholesome INFP x ISTJ ship
Shout out to that time I wrote a story where a woman started out as a princess, was sold to Barbarians as payment for them protecting the kingdom's lands, became the pleasure slave to the Barbarian king, then married him and became his queen, learned the art of warfare behind his back, killed him and took his throne, gave birth to a son, and then a few months later raided her father's kingdom with the Barbarian hoarde, killing her father and brothers who sold her into slavery and built a throne out of their (and her husband's) bones that her son would one day sit upon and rule over the land.
TLDR: Woman becomes stronger and more badass after becoming pregnant and realizing that she wants her baby to have a mother that represents the strength of women instead of having them grow up looking at women as weak.
God, I love powerful and vengeful women.
There is a series of books, which do open with a quite traumatic birth experience (it's really in them in context of the story and not just for the lols).
And then across the series, several women get pregnant and the depictions are lovely. The women have agency and one of them even go into battle while pregnant.
It's the Wayfarer Redemption series (it might be called the Axis Trilogy, the author renamed them after I originally read it) by Sara Douglass. It's my favorite series. (The first 3 books anyways).
Thank you!!! When I was newly postpartum I really liked romance books that had some pregnancy plot - but I hated how most of the time the character who was pregnant became just an incubator and then ONLY a mother no personality.
I love the red queen for making a fearless character pregnant, but she then gets more power and a higher military rank (not spoiling the book with character identity)
If there is translation, read series by Oksana Pankiejewa, rough translation of the title is Fate of the King.
There is a lot of characters, but two of the female characters get pregnant and give birth. Before and after they are more than just mothers. One is a warrior queen and the other is ... well, someone important (need to read to understand that).
But I honestly like how many there are character that are different, with different views and different personalities