Mac Mini M1 - How is it for Orchestral Composing?
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- Опубліковано 6 лип 2024
- The new M1 Macs have been out for a year or so now, and performance across the board has been impressive. But how does this performance translate to the world of orchestral composition? In this first look, I compare a new M1 Mini to an i7 MacBook Pro to see how they stack up. I also discuss plug-in compatibility.
Cinebench R23 Scores (Custom Single Run)
MacBook Pro: 4419
Mac Mini: 7809
Mac Mini Rosetta: 5240
Intro - 0:00
MacBook Pro Test - 2:25
Mac Mini Test - 10:19
My Thoughts - 18:03
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An update to this video is available here: NATIVE UPDATE - Mac Mini M1 For Orchestral Composing
• NATIVE UPDATE - Mac Mi...
An update to this video has been uploaded, you can find it here! NATIVE UPDATE - Mac Mini M1 For Orchestral Composing
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Boy, am I glad I ran into you. I have a Mac Mini running Digital Performer. My module samplers are old. Can Mac Mini run both Performer and generate orchestral samples? If yes what software do you recommend for orchestral sound?
Thanks for the video. Love seeing creative people do what they do!
Thank you for watching!
Been looking at a few comparison tests on YT but this is by far the best.
Glad you liked it! Thank you for watching!
sounds like the ending of a very big film!!!! great work!!!!
Great and helpful video! Thank you man 🙏🏻🎹👍
Glad you found it helpful! Thanks for stopping by.
Oh my god.... I just was looking this up being curious on the Mac Mini m1... but your orchestral composing is mindblowing! Would love to hear that composition in full, and hell yeah... at the end you stated you might plan a series on how to start with orchestral composing... I pressed the subscribe buton so hard that there is ahole in my mouse's surafce :-) Can't wait for it... glad I bumped on this video man.
Thanks for the kind words! The second composition actually released yesterday, it’s here on my channel under the title “Hoist the Sails.” Planning the composition series as we speak so stay tuned!
Good video. First off, let me say that your actual musical compositions are fantastic! Secondly, I appreciate seeing a more real world test where there's actually different libraries playing different parts, vs other folks just loading up 100 tracks of the exact same patch to see how that pushes the cpu, which I am suspicious is not accurately taxing the computer as much.
Thanks for your kind words! Glad you found it helpful. Yes, the synthetic tests I’ve seen run are interesting to see, but like you said nobody runs 100 instances of logics sculpture synth in a normal scenario. Decided just testing a real project was more useful.
Great video and your music is fantastic!
Thank you very much for your kind words!
Really good video. 76 track template is actually typical for most people I think and you’ve showed that even the M1 version has nailed it. I run 100 track templates on MacBook Pro and Intel Mac Minis and I can never get below 1024 with pops and fan going crazy. I could fry eggs on my Mac Minis running 100 tracks. I was astounded that you got down to 32. Even through Rosetta this is an awesome machine. Your compositions are also really good!
Thank you very much!
thank you very much, very useful video!! and great music!!
Glad it was helpful!
Thanks a lot, man. Very useful.
You're welcome! Glad you found it useful
This is what I’ve been looking for! I’m been worried with plug-ins not being native yet but this helped a ton
Thanks for watching and glad it helped! I was worried about it too, which is why I ended up not getting a higher specced machine. Didn't want to shell out a bunch of money for something I couldn't really use. I was pleasantly surprised by how painless the Rosetta compatibility made everything.
Helpful content. Thanks. What is the orchestral software you are using?
Bro.. I don't know what movie you're doing that music for but I can't wait to see it!
Thanks for your kind words!
Wow that's amazing! M1 chips got me to buy a Mac for the first time in over a decade.
They are impressive, I’m looking forward to seeing what they have in store for future generations. Thanks for watching!
Dude, your music is amazing
Thank you!
Extremely helpful video! Thanks for doing this. My iMac is on its last legs too and I've been considering a Mac Mini with the M1 and 16GB RAM for Logic Pro orchestral compositions.
Glad you found it helpful! Thanks for watching.
Hi! Great video, thank you! First, it’s a shame you don’t have a lot more followers. Second, this is great communication, on top of that, you impress with you composition skills. I got more valuable information from your video than many others with loads of followers. Nice woodwinds on the second example 😊. You just saved me from buying the new Mac Studio. The Mac Mini will be great for my needs. Keep up the good work! P.S. Haven’t checked your channel, but you should make some videos showing how to make good sounding orchestral parts (technical).
Thanks for the kind words! The woodwinds are from Albion One by spitfire and I consider it to be one of that libraries biggest strengths. Thanks for the video idea, specifically is there a section you’d be interested in me explaining?
@@thegrizzledmusician Efficient workflow creating strings with natural and alternating articulation, and also create fast runs. Maybe I need other software. I have Logic (stock instruments) and Komplete 11.
Wow! So this video has been viewed a lot more times than I thought it would. Thank you everyone for watching! I’m glad that so many are finding it useful and that it’s helping people with their decisions. I’ve had a few people ask about the tracks and if they are available in their entirety. The first track is still unfinished, I’d like to fix that at some point. However the second one just released to stores! You can find it on my channel or your music store of choice under the title “Hoist the Sails.” (Some stores may be late in releasing it) Again, thanks to everyone who has made it here, watched, and commented!
i know nothing about music production but i really enjoyed this video. glad you did this test with 16gb ram version of the mac mini m1 👍
Glad you enjoyed it!
thanks! Im getting one!
Nice! Thanks for watching!
Wow for the computer and wow again for the cues!
Thank you!
Wow! That composition is virtual? Serious respect my friend!
Thank you!
So where are you getting your beautiful sounding French Horns from? And I have a lot of external midi sound modules, (D50, EMU SERIES, ROLAND V, ROLAND SUPER JUPITER, ROLAND OCTAPAD) and thus my concern in regards to compatibility, and enough ports. Compatibility concern for the MOTU 16U to transfer dozens of 1” 16 track tape to the Mac mini.
I currently use a fully lauded iMac from from 2017. I’ve overloaded the processor a few times between audio tracks and software instruments. 50-60 tracks is where I start to get into trouble on my 2017 iMac
Possibly something to think about for your next video for the new Mac Mini.
Anyway… thanks for your helpful video. I’m waiting for an iMac Pro M1 MAX 27” or possible go with the new Mac mini coming in spring of 2022. Any thoughts on this. Expense is of no concern, and a Mac Pro is over kill for orchestral work.
Your works are intriguing.
🎹🎹🎹🎹🎹🎹🎹🎹
I too am waiting to see what they release in the coming months. My main thought behind getting this generation of Mac Mini was to test compatibility, because I was afraid of having my current setup be incompatible in some way like you described. If I ended up having a bunch of trouble, I wouldn’t be out the however many dollars a top end M1 pro or max retails for and I’d have a machine to test compatibility as developers roll out M1 updates. But Rosetta works extremely well. Rather than getting a half working mess like I was sort of expecting, I ended up having a complete (and faster) working setup. I’m thinking this machine is good enough for me for the next few years and hopefully by then we will have everything we need running natively.
The French Horns are from Cinebrass, which has fast become my favorite brass library. Glad you liked them! Thanks for your comment.
The composition was great!
Nice video. Thank you. I want to get one myself. What are the specs for your Mac mini?
Thanks! It’s a great little machine. This is 256gb model with 16gb of ram.
Great music along with a great video, thanks....
Thanks for watching, glad you found it useful!
Wonderful video, my old 5,1 mac pro is finally dead and there is no use fixing it, I'm planning to get a 2017 macbook pro with i7 and 16gb ram, or an M1 mac mini second hard for film scoring, I use a lot of kontakt libraries, omnisphere, Sample tank, which one would you recommend since you have both
Wow, those older Mac pros were tanks. I’ve seen a few people with those say they are starting to have to migrate now. Honestly I personally wouldn’t buy an intel Mac now, unless it was a really substantial discount vs an m1. As far as Apple is concerned, the intel Macs are legacy hardware and their continued support of them is dubious at best. Hope that helps and you find the machine that’s right for you. Thanks for watching!
I too enjoyed the composition. I would love to see a video of how it was done. Are those real instruments that were sampled and controlled by MIDI? It sounded a little bit like the soundtrack to Pirates of the Caribbean. Better of course! Great job.
Thanks for your kind words! Yes this is done using samples. Several different sample libraries were used from companies like Spitfire Audio, East West, and Cinesamples to name a few
Great! I've been waiting for this exact video for about a year! With only 256Gb HD where are you loading your samples from?
They are all stored on external SSDs. Currently I’m using three Samsung T5s, one 1 TB and two 500GB. I initially thought about getting a larger internal drive, but after having to swap machines several times over the past few years, having all of my large libraries on external drives ended up being more convenient for a stationary studio machine. For a laptop, I’d definitely want a larger one next time. The MacBook Pro in this video is now used for live performance with mainstage and the less you have to carry around and plug in, the better. But 256gb runs out fast so I have to pick and choose carefully. Thanks for watching and glad you found it helpful!
@@thegrizzledmusician Hi man! One more question If you woudn't mind! :) How much RAM did it take in M1 test? You didn't show it. Thank you again!
@@MichelBarbaro Hey! Yeah I realized after I finished I forgot to show that part lol. I just ran the projects again and on the first one logic topped out around 9 GB used and the second one it's at 13.5. On the second project it is starting to use swap space on the ssd. About 1 GB. But I don't notice any issues because of that. I've heard the M1s handle memory really well and I assume the swap is really efficient. Probably why some people are getting by on 8GB versions
@@thegrizzledmusician Oh man! Thanks for the info! I ended up buying a Mac Mini 16Gb - 512 SSD (Can't wait to put my hand on it, it's in transit). Mac Studio would be a dream, but here in Brazil it costs like a brand new car 😅. I've also got a 1TERA Samsung, but T7 instead of T5. I think that will be more than enough for my productions. If just in case I really need a huge orchestral set for a certain project, I'll probably get VEPro and link it to my i7 32GB RAM PC, via ethernet.
Hi Mate, You might like to know that performance on both machines will be improved if you take the thread processing off automatic and put it on the one with maximum cores. I have the 8gb model still boxed and i dont know wether to sell it and get a 16gb or sell and get whatever they come out with in about 2 months time or set it up and keep for 3 to 4 years. I have been using the iconic Trash Can since 2015 and im only upgrading due to TB3 as it hates my LG display and UAD Arrow needs a dock to work and they can not both be in the dock at once. Got any ideas ?
Interesting! I’ll have to try that, thanks for the tip. I haven’t used any UAD hardware, so I don’t really have any comments on that but this is definitely a “stop gap” machine for me. Ive got it set up, hope to get a few years out of it, then upgrade to whatever the latest and greatest is once we are past the M1 conversion period we are in right now. The only reason I really bought this one was because I missed having a desktop. For the money though, I’ve been extremely pleased. I haven’t tried the 8gb version, I’ve seen people say it is enough and then others say you need 16. With 16, the memory pressure gauge will go above the midway point, but with 8 it would just have to swap out to disk more. I’d be interested to see both side by side. But I just went with 16 to be safe. Thanks for your comment!
Excellent video. Have you had any issues with outboard USB2 devices not functioning properly? Almost everything in my studio (audio interfaces, etc) are USB 2 and I had heard some time ago (before the M1 machines) that Apple was having serious issues with USB 2.0 compatibility in their MacBook Pros. I thank you in advance for your response!
Hmm, interesting. No I've not heard that nor have I had any issues. My audio interface is usb 2.0 and it works fine. I have it running off of a usb-c hub even.
@@thegrizzledmusician Thank you very much for the reply, sir!
Love your video. I have a question because I need a new Imac. I am still working on a late 2013 8G 256 Imac making compositions like yourself using Spitfire Recovery and adding vocals to it. working in UAD Luna workstation using a apollo x4. When I hit 30 to 40 tracks incl busses and have the neve summing on it renders at 100 to 130% and get a lot of pops and drops and therefor can't finish my projects. I like the 2021 24inch M1 Imac with 16G and 1 terra, however, I get very confused from the good tips I get from the pros. Some say it will work amazing for me and it is enough power to run my projects, where other pros say, no it will not work you need at least an mac pro or max 32G. With Apple anything that is upgraded a little they charge big time and when I wait for the new 2022 Imac with 10 cores I may not even need that power. I am certain that machine with 27inch and 10 core will be a lot more expensive than the 24 inch 16G. You are working with Spitfire like the albion one and BBC, and you're doing cinematic compositions and all. Do you think the M1 Imac 24 inch 8-8 core would solve my issues? I mean, I see you run the mini at 64 samples. In Luna we can't change the sample rate, it does it automatically which is kinda cool. I have a project of a simple pop song, some drums, bass, guitar, some spitfire strings, woodwinds ect and I run into 90% render and I haven't even recorded the vocal yet - it will get me into trouble and that is bad for the client 🙂- The 24inch I can afford. So, what do you think....Thanks in advance
Since I don’t have any Universal Audio hardware and have never used Luna, I can’t really comment on how it might work on the M1. But I can comment on my previous Macs and maybe you can draw some conclusions from that. I had a late 2015 iMac which I upgraded to 24 GB of RAM. I never personally came close to utilizing that much unless I purposely enabled every track in my template (easily over 100 instrument tracks). I then swapped to my MacBook, which I discuss in the video, then to the M1 mini. Both of those are 256 GB storage versions with 16 GB of RAM. I got the mini as a way to test the waters with M1 compatibility believing eventually I’d get a pro or max version with 32 GB of RAM. I don’t feel the need to do that right now honestly. It’s done everything I’ve asked it to do.
I wouldn’t do less than 16 GB, but I don’t personally think 32 GB is necessary on these machines (depending on your workload obviously). On a Windows machine or an intel Mac…possibly. But the way the M1s handle memory is supposedly different and more efficient. Just my two cents. Hope it helps in your decision. If you have a specific example using some of the spitfire libraries that cause you trouble I can try them on my system to see how it behaves
@@thegrizzledmusician Good morning, Thank you so much for your reply. I really appreciate it. Your reply has given me more confidence on purchasing the M1 Imac. 100 tracks is a lot 🙂I don't see myself making a project with that many instrument layers. The spitfire library doesn't cause a problem, I believe it is the Imac that has. If I use only UAD plug ins to make a pop song incl midi tracks and vocals I run into the same rendering problems. I made last a simple Elvis kinda song for a client. Simple drums, bass, Guitar, and 2 tracks for solo guitar and the vocal chain. I had to take the neve summing off some of the tracks because the playback was giving pops and clicks and rendering at 110%. Couldn't even add the izotope pro plug in because it would not even play back anymore 🙂. Reading your experience with the M1 computers the 16G with 1 terra Imac would be enough to finish my projects. Having more power in an Imac is great of course, however, the prices Apple charge for upgrades I may not even need are mind blowing 🙂. Thanks for helping me out. I will get the Imac 24inch 16G 1 terra and finish my projects with a happy face
once you get everything on M1 *native* it will be really slow as it adapts, then it’ll turn into a BEAST!
once i swapped everything to M1/Terminal for install it has been crazy. the M1 is perfect, listen to that 😍
omg! 😍😍
What about performance running many audio tracks ? I use a lot of audio stems recorded in a studio and then mixed and mastered in my home studio using Logic Pro X. My laptop struggles (MacBook Pro) and I have a lot of external drives.
I usually only work with a lot of audio tracks at the end of a project when I bounce the MIDI tracks to audio, but on my last project I had no problem playing back when I did that.
Audio is easier on the CPU than virtual instruments so I would not foresee any problems there...
where do you have located the sample libraries? internal 256gb ssd or external usb/tb drive?
External ssds, 2 tb in total right now
which macbook do you prefer for film scoring? i ordered a 512gb with 32 ram but im thinking of returning to get 1tb
Most libraries I have are on external drives because it’s easier to restore if you have to reinstall Mac OS. No need to redownload libraries. So I’ve always gotten by fine with 256gb personally. Next Mac I buy will probably have 1 tb but that’s just as a nice to have, not a requirement.
Great comparison, exactly what I wanted to see. I have a hunch if everything was M1 native, you wouldn't hear the pop at 32.
Now I can go put my order for M1 studio ;)
Very cool, studio looks like a very nice machine. Will probably get one myself at some point in the future. Thanks for your comment and enjoy your new machine!
Running native or Rosetta on the mini? I expect Rosetta, afaik, EastWest has only made Opus M1 Native. As for the others, I don't know. Sorry if I didn't catch how much RAM. 8 or 16? And why don't you have all 8 cores running on the mini?
Cheers,
PoA
Rosetta, you are correct about east west. I actually wasn’t even aware if opus was native yet or not but feel pretty sure they won’t backport compatibility to the play engine. It’s a 16gb model. The CPU question is an interesting one. At the time of this video I didn’t change the processing threads in logic’s settings. Another commenter told me to try changing it to 8 so I did, showed all 8 cores. Figured it would only offer better performance. After using it for a while I started noticing issues with audio pops and CPU spikes while working on a project, and considering how well it ran in this video something seemed off. So I remembered that was the only thing I changed and I swapped it back to automatic on a whim. Immediately my problems disappeared. The only thing I can think of is that some CPU intensive plugins were being offloaded to the 4 efficiency cores in 8 core mode and they couldn’t handle the load, whereas in automatic mode only the performance cores are being used. It could be a mixture of that and the overhead of running in Rosetta, native might not have an issue in 8 core mode and run better. I honestly just haven’t had a chance to run any tests to get to the bottom of it. So I’d recommend everybody try setting the processing cores to 8 and using it if you don’t have any issues, but set to automatic if you notice problems like me
@@thegrizzledmusician thanks for your reply! I am, for the most part, using Logic in Native mode, as more than half my plugs are now native. I have a project, recorded on my late 2015 i7 4ghz, 32gb ram iMac that choked everytime it hit addictive drums. Overload! I bought a base model mini for my wife, and it breezed through it. I bought a 1tb/16gb bto for myself. I'm pleased. Again, thanks!
@@thegrizzledmusician You should try setting it to 6 cores to test as that is how the m1 pro chip is set. It would be awesome if it ran smoothly like that. Efficiency core are set to make sure that nothing interrupts the performance cores. Having two still dedicated to efficiency SHOULD still run smoothly, but it depends on how the other tasks are managed by the mac OS
Do the native instruments VSTs work with M1 chips ?
I believe Kontakt is compatible now, don’t know about their others
is this done with 8 or 16 of RAM, i have the 8 and wondering if it can do similar things performance wise
This is a 16GB model. I'd like to try an 8GB model as I've heard people get by just fine with them but I don't have any personal experience with one.
@@thegrizzledmusician great thanks!
Why do you think since it has 4 performance cores that only 3 of those cores where working most of the time?
Hey, thanks for your comment!
Very hard to say, processor task scheduling is extremely nuanced. On intel chips, if all cores aren’t being utilized the clock speed can be increased on the ones that are. So it’s better to utilize a single core almost fully before putting things on other cores. M1 might do something similar seeing as cores 1 and 2 are loaded more than 3 and 4 almost all of the time. But that’s just a theory.
I use GarageBand for orchestral composition. My software of choice is GarageBand. I do occasionally use logic but GarageBand is my daily driver because of its ease of use. My m1 MacBook Pro has 16gb of ram and my biggest project is 473.9 MB. It has 104 midi tracks and my Mac handles it perfectly. My project has 104 midi tracks. I am also planning to het a 2tb M1 MacBook Pro later this year for college.
I also use garageband but I only have 8gb ram I do have cheaper libaries so I'm assuming not a lot of ram is used or the max is used no sure there are the odd freeze here and there but its not the end of the world cus i just close it and open it again takes like 15 seconds the most midi tracks I've currently used is 36
Hi. What are the specs of the M1 mini ?
This one is a 16GB version with 256 GB of storage
can native instruments plugins be downloaded on the external?
They can, just have to change the install location in native access
@@thegrizzledmusician oh okay so i can do this when i first get my macbook great thank you
Am I the only one who got this track stuck in the head for the rest of the day? 😅😀
Ha! Hope it didn’t distract you too much!
Dude...
I wanna listen to the whole song...Where can i get it?
Coming soon :)
@@thegrizzledmusician Thanks a Ton...😇
Love from India💙
Was this the base model 8gb?
It is the 16gb model
Many plugins have started adapting for the m1 chip seeing the potential, and now with the two chips functioning as one joined together for 20 cores and 32 GPU cores they know they will take off. Plugin alliance sent out emails about plugins already adapted for the M1, and they are working on the rest too. But it's still overpriced, open it and you will see for yourself!
Don't keep important data on the internal drive. These can fail at any time and have to be...revived.
Very true, all of my libraries are external and I use an external backup service in addition to time machine to guard against that.
Not good.I will wait
About a third of the plugins I use still haven't gone full native yet so I have to wait anyway. I don't want to run anything via Rosetta and I'm in the position now that I can afford to wait. A more robust Mac mini is rumored to be announced either June or November this year, and there's another rumor saying that the newer Mac mini will only be announced next year. Either way I'll have to wait