How to pick the right type of indie game to make with Chris Zukowski
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- Опубліковано 28 лис 2021
- Wishlist Night Run on Steam: store.steampowered.com/app/22...
What type of game you make is one of the most critical factors in your success as an indie developer today. Many devs start out trying to make a game from their childhood out of nostalgia, but are people still looking to buy those games years later? In this highlight from the Thousand Ant podcast Matt Mirrorfish talks with Chris Zukowski about choosing the right type of game in order to be successful today in indie game development.
Watch the full episode here:
• Thousand Ant Podcast: ...
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@1:57 "an by good game, i mean, it looks beautiful, it HAS to look good, no program-art".
Sorry but I disagree, am a sucker for good looking games like everyone else but what about: VVVVVV, Super Hexagon, Baba is You, Thomas was alone, LYNE, and the most successful "programmer's art" game of all time: Tetris.
I think the right expression to use here is: "it HAS to look *polished* , no prototype-art", and the background video could've shown some of these examples, because I feel beginners will be super influenced when Chris says "it has to look AMAAAZING" and the background is showing some stylized/semi-realistic 3D scene.
I think it’s a fair point and like with anything there are always exceptions to the rule. That said many of those games might struggle if they came out in the current crowded landscape. Fair point though still.
@@ThousandAntI actually don't think it's useful to point out exceptions to the rule. It's just survivorship bias. Tally up all the games with good art and look at their sales. Now tally up all the 2D platformers like VVVVVVV and tell me how it compares. It HAS to look good. If you are not going in with that mindset, you have already set up yourself for failure. Using a few counter examples among the myriad of unnoticed sub par looking games is not doing you any favors.
This channel is absolutely underrated.
Graphics can help get a game's foot in the door. But then again, Flappy bird wasn't the most "beautiful" game and it's has been one of the recent top selling games. So, I think alongside clever marketing, a game needs to be fun and have the ability to hold people's attention. I think these are the things that could help a game be successful.
I agree for the most part. However, if everyone makes games that are in style, how will the games be made that suprise people and may even be the start of a new style?
Yeah, I don't care. I'm STILL making a 2D Medtroidvania ;-D
Worked for Hollow Knight tbh 🤷♂️
What is the Lego game featured in this video?
Oh snap! Two of my favorite ppl in one place! 🔥🔥🔥
Thanks Graham! Hope all is well :)
thousand ant with another banger ty for this video, it's all about player freedom and experience these days. Unfortunately, it's very hard to find the idea and implement within your limitations.
Thanks! Yes I agree and it’s tough to find the right concept that’s doable. I think broadly these factors will push people into teams and making bigger things, but we’ll see
Nothing wrong with bell-bottoms!
Funnily enough bell bottoms are coming back in style, so it was kind of a poor example lol. But I think the idea is clear, that games are affected by style trends
0:42 I just found out why my schnappsidee is to make a boomer shooter.
interesting topic.
Thanks!
I need to see that everyday
Glad to hear it resonated :)
well the good news is bell bottoms are back in style
I think the real point they are trying to say here is that its okay to make a 2D platformer. Just realize it's going to be harder to "sell". You'll have to really stand out and do something legitimately special.
If you would like this to turn into a career you have to play the market. It's just a fact of life. Otherwise have fun making games! You don't really need to make money making games. Upload them for free so the whole world can see your creation :)
FUN is #1 then ok looks is #2
"No bugs" == something that doesn't happen with anything substantially more complex than Hello World.
Then why did Shovel Knight do so well? Cuphead? Holllow Knight? All non open world survival simulator games.
I think you can always find exceptions to the rule. Shovel Knight I'm honestly not sure, NES nostalgia maybe. Cuphead was obviously the very unique art and animation. Hollow Knight is IMO a bit less clear but the souls-ish Metroidvania with cute insects and good art seems to have really worked. These are just advice about trends which are inherently squishy, they're not axioms or laws.
This makes me laugh and be frustrated at the same time. It contradicts itself.
"Make what's in style" "Don't make a pixel art platformer"
Pixel art platformers ARE in style.
"It has to look amazing! ... it has to have no bugs" "What you make is more important than how well you make it"
See how these contradict?
And this is just in this video. There's tons of advice everywhere that push you in one direction and just as much that tell you the opposite.
I like Thousand Ant, but this is poorly edited/thought out. And why does the thumbnail say "Replayability?" This video is a mess.
Thanks for the feedback. In my mind it all made sense but I guess it didn’t come across lol. Hopefully next one lands better for you.
You need to be able to filter and process advice and construct a worldview from it that works for you. None of these are axioms or laws, and some of them are in tension or opposition to one another. That's the nature of a complex topic, it's not a recipe. If it was, this would be incredibly easy.
Pixel art platformers are IMO not in high demand from players. You may see a lot of devs making them because they are relatively cheap / easy to make and people have nostalgia for them. That doesn't mean they are selling on Steam, which is the goal here.
The point is that making something good looking and well made is the bare minimum and not enough to sell, you have to then ALSO be doing it in a genre that has a waiting audience. They don't contradict, they just create a very narrow window of opportunity. Yes you have to do these things AND they don't guarantee sucesss. Make sense?
"Pixel art platformers ARE in style." Either you're coping or in denial. I can't decide which.
Yikes... focus on looks first and "decent game play kinda" and chase trends... jfc, you're unironically everything wrong with the industry... yikes.
Games are not like fashion, that's false equivalence.
Selling new games is subject to fashion and trends. Saying that some games are classics and people play for years doesn't invalidate the point that if they came out now they wouldn't be as new or interesting and therefore wouldn't achieve a critical mass of sales or players. In the market, everything is affected by trends and styles. That doesn't mean there is ZERO market for things that are off-trend, it's just smaller.