Your Pickleball Paddle Might be Broken: Here's How to Tell
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- Опубліковано 23 вер 2024
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I think that all thermoformed paddles will become delaminated or "core crushed" over time. The designs are defective. The polypropylene core is tightly wrapped in carbon fiber. Everything that is compressed has to expand. If there is no expansion potential the core will be crushed over time. Even concrete will buckle after it warms up on a summer day. That is why expansion seams are cut into it. The manufacturers initially dealt with "delamination" by adding extra glue to the surface. They need to focus on creating an expanding zone around the polypropylene core so that it can expand after it is compressed. Most manufacturers only cover delamination under warranty for a limited time such as 6 months. This is substandard since "delamination" is due to defective design. I had a Six Zero that became delaminated after about 7 months and the company would not replace it and chose to offer a discount on a new paddle instead. Why would I buy another defectively designed paddle.
ya. My sixzero sounded funny after 2 days. cut it open and crushed core. Important to know the the crush is all the way through the handle. It's crushed from the factory and if we cut open a new one, we would find the same thing. The time to failure, or the time it takes to detect the symptom varies and is probably dependent the amount and location of the crush. It is not uniform. So yours was 7 months and mine was 2 days. Some people are happy and will never see the symptom or are not able to detect (why chris did the psa). Regardless, they are bad from the factory. The problem is not visible, so the brands can just lie and say they fixed it. If the defect was a visible gash across the face of the paddle, it would never leave the factory.
If the owner of a core crushed paddle is a rec player who themselves have no problem playing with a core crushed paddle, and who might have spent around $200 for it, what would really make them to bother changing their paddle?
You lose tons of control. The ball will literally fly off the paddle when you’re trying to hit soft
Good information, except for one thing. The paddle does not 'become' core crushed. It is crushed from the factory. Depending on the amount of crushing, you will observe the symptoms (hard hitting, loud). Since the problem is hidden, the brands have been blaming customers - hitting in the cold, etc. It's just broke to begin with. We know this because the crushed core goes all the way through the handle. We don't hit balls on the handle. If you were to buy a new Vatic Pro V7 today, don't hit any balls, and do a x-section, you will find the crushing. Customers would not do this because it's throwing away money, but you could do it Chris. Then Vatic (Daryl Wang) would be encouraged to fix it. You could show us every brand that currently does or does not have crushed cores from the factory, you know...like your brand tier list. Then we would never need to be annoyed by that clueless person crushing balls that has no idea that his paddle is bad. The PSA is good and useful, but you have the juice to fix this, if you X-section new paddles and put the results on your channel. Maybe Ronbus Nova fixed it. We don't know. They said they did. Cut open a new one and show us. I am happy to fund the first one - Vatic Pro V7. Send me your VENMO. It's currently has the worst field failure rate.
I have never had my V7 paddles give me problems. I weight them with lead and have been playing with one for over 7 months. I have a friend who bodybuilds, he breaks all the paddles he buys no matter what brand. Go figure. I figured to replace a paddle every 6 months at the rate that I play. However, I haven't changed my V7 yet as it still plays very well. I play 6-7 days a week sometimes up to 3-4 hours a day. I been trying to get it to die but it's still going strong. I also believe that all paddle companies will have some issues with the production line. Since majority of the factories are outsourced there is no way every paddle company will have a perfect paddle record.
William is indeed correct. But Chris knows this - and is simplifying the process for his audience.
It is indeed true that many thermoformed paddles have core deformation before they've hit a single ball.
This is deformation is NOTHING to do with balls hitting paddles (see above - they've never hit a single ball)
So what is it - well the root cause is a combination of temperature and THICKNESS of the core. In other words if the core is too thick for the mold it will get oversqueezed and bits of it will bulge out etc
Temperature causes the PP core to soften and in some cases actually disbond (in plane) - I gathered significant evidence of this from CT scans - it's just a bit complicated to understand.
So - why does this happen with some paddles and not others?
No idea exactly - but my best guess is simple - - if your supplier sends you out of spec PP core and you don't check the thickness before assembly - then you could get a LOT of deformation which will result in turn with delamination of the surface sheets
So I unknowingly played with a core crushed Perseus for about 3 months until my buddy said something one day. I pushed on the center of the paddle and yup, crunch, crunch in the sweet spot on one side and near the top of the paddle on the other side.
Reflecting over it, 3 months ago was about the time my drives became a lot more powerful BUT blocks and deep serve returns became A LOT more inconsistent PLUS it was a lot more difficult to reset hard driven balls consistently and pop ups happened a lot more as well.
As soon as my buddy noted it, he had me play with a DBD and I did notice power went down BUT control improved dramatically and both my blocks and deep serve returns became A LOT more consistent.
So those who feel like playing with a core crushed paddle gives them an advantage due to the power, think about the inconsistencies with other shots as well.
Great video! Thanks for addressing this issue. As a follow up I think it would be worth doing a deep dive into core materials. I'm NOT talking about wood vs. aluminum vs. nomex vs. polypropylene, cuz that info is readily available. I'm talking specifically about the differences in the polypropylene honeycomb cores used by different manufacturers. I have a theory that not all of these cores are made the same with regard to cell size, wall thickness (of each cell) and thus durability. I've core crushed 2 Vatic v7 paddles already, each lasting about 4 to 6 months playing 3 to 4 times per week. I'm not certain exactly when the cores broke down. Is that normal lifespan of a thermoformed paddle? Or are there certain brands with stronger cores that can hold up longer? Keep up the great work on these videos!
A lot of people don’t want to spend the money to buy a new paddle and just ignore the symptoms. And some like the additional power from a corrupted paddle. Those who play tourneys probably pay more attention to this. Most rec players will “ride til the wheels fall off”, so to speak. Just my thoughts anyway.
BTW delamination is not necessarily a positive. In my case a large part of the sweet spot was partially crushed and balls hitting there barely deflected off the surface and went in the net. Balls that hit the much smaller area with complete core crushing shot off like a rocket. In no was was this a positive as the high deflection area was very small.
The Quality of paddles need to improve $99 - $300 paddles is a lot for anyone's budget.
This Throwaway society (aka planned obsolescence) is gonna make saving and financial literacy very hard for the 2000’s+ generation.
💯💯
That's why I buy clones on AliExpress
"core crushed" sounds like a good thing
Maybe worth mentioning that core-uption can happen with non thermoform but it just results in the paddle feeling dead. Paddle should probably still be replaced even if it doesn't piss off your opponents.
My B&B Filth had this issue about a week ago at a tournament. It was a bummer as I had to switch to my old paddle mid-game.
these days you almost need a "core crushed" paddle to keep up with guys playing with the gearbox pro power. The difference from a regular paddle is visually apparent. Hopefully soon official exit velocity test will change some things. And the paddles will have the Diadem Vice stigma in rec play...
Get a gearbox
Chris, please let us know what companies are most known for crushed cores. I'm assuming Vatic Pro, Six Zero, and Legacy. Is that correct? Are there others?
Would have been cool to show us what the difference looks like when hitting a ball with core crushed vs non core crushed paddles
I did know this but still helpful. I can also tell before the "crackle" sound by tapping the sweet spot with something hard like your ring or ??? Does Aramid sound the same as PP when pressed? Using a padlle that degrades "slower" is something I take into consideration when buying.
Aramid is not likely to have this issue because it has to reach a significantly higher temperature to become compromised.
Factory core crushing can occur if the core is not perfectly line up before the paddle faces are pressed and heated in the mold
Purchased a Ronbus R1 Pulsar in December. Currently no symptoms of core crush but I'm curious, based on your experience, is it one that is generally good or is it one that you see as still having this issue (they "haven't figured it out")??
I hope it's one of the ones that is generally ok since I'm really enjoying the paddle.
If tennis racquet core crushed that would be obvious and it degrades power, unlike paddle core crashing. This means there has to be more objective formal criteria to determine legality of paddle. The USAPA paddle standard requires no more than 0.005” of displacement of the paddle face under a load of 6.614 lbs. This corresponds to a stiffness of 1323 lb/in. According to the USAPA, paddles that have a stiffness less than 1323 lb/in may exhibit a “trampoline effect”. Does it mea; they just soft or illegal? Formal standard measures average stiffness so paddle could be softer in some spots but stiffer in other part keeping average above the minimum threshold. Is there a rule for minimum stiffness ?
My paddle is getting much louder on hard hits… afraid delam is just around the corner, although it still plays close to the same.
Have had a few instances of gen 1 carbon fiber paddles getting core crushed actually. Have had it with 4 paddles specifically
Interesting. Do you mind sharing which paddles?
@@michaelfargarsonpickleball9707 Vatic Pro v7, Diadem warrior, Ace Club, DBD, and then a few Ace Spades
Thanks for the info. I’m curious now! Btw you missed out on some awesome lasagna!
Core crushed = Joola gen3
When the Selkirk power air delaminates, what are the characteristics.
I play with a guy now and then and his paddle has been broken for months. He just won’t replace it. 😂
Step 1: cut open paddle
Step 2: check to see if the corrugations are kinked or bent in any way. if they are your paddle is broke and throw it away
step 3: throw away your paddle anyways because you cut into
step 4: profit? i dunno i haven't watched the video
Or buy the Olympus Bondmaster 600 and non-destructively test core integrity like the pros. 👍🏽
Sauce:Selkirk tv paddle test video ~3months ago
Also: /s
The process of cutting the corrugated honeycomb core in thick slices from the loaf form can have bent and crooked ends for the heated thermoform process therefore a deformed core causing delamination in the newly manufactured paddle🤣
@@lesterma1608 I guess I could see that, but it would probably be a quality issue from the factory. Hopefully this video posts. In this vid they seem to cut cleanly. ua-cam.com/video/lBMAbg_Wt-M/v-deo.htmlfeature=shared
So you're saying having a crushed core adds (almost unfair) power, does it lose feel/touch? Would your soft game suffer? If not, it sounds like a good thing frankly.
If your paddle sounds like a gun going off, chances are it’s delaminated or core crushed lol
If you had this happen, did you notice the noise prior to the performance change?
33-0 at WORST!
You call it broken.. I call it broken in!
Love your content! Another killer video! Crushed me to my core.
….yea but what’s wrong with that