Metal´s Forge #73: Talking about John Wick Chapter 4 with MauLer and MarcTheCyborg!
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- Опубліковано 25 бер 2023
- Welcome back to the Forge!
The Last (?) Chapter of the John Wick Saga came out and we will talk about it!
MauLer: / @mauleryt
Mooler: / @everyframeapause
MarcTheCyborg: / @marcthecyborg
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Normally mauler is the more lively one and mootal is dead inside but this was a nice change of pace for the writer's. A fun and fresh take on the mooler vers
longman got tired from grinding the shooting ranges in RE4 remake. LOL!
For the first time in the history of yt it made you BELIEVE in metal?
@@timothytorigian7932 Maybe.. just MAYBE Mauler didnt want to be a dick an steal the spotlight on his friends show.
@@timothytorigian7932wait no, that wouldn't be consistent with his character.
“Remember when movies were good?”
-Bilbo Baggins
All the John Wick movies are good
@@harrydubois6619 I only liked the first one.
@@harrydubois6619 "nough"
-The frog prince
@@Kernwadi
Common Deus Ex L
@@harrydubois6619 I remember literally nothing from the other movies so I don't know how good they can be.
The reason why no one attacked John after the club fall was because John had to go to the pause menu and use a first aid spray.
John Wick is now Mando x Fast n Furious.. filled with non-characters and pure one-upism
I'd say the movie is just some good simple entertainment, anybody expecting the story to improve probably forgot 2 and 3 come before 4, that being said, its an alright movie.
I wouldnt even say it was that.
Best I can say is you dont feel the run time, but then dont really feel anything from the movie. it's white noise just kind of exists.
Was the characterisation in the first movie an accident? Its been gone in every sequel.
Aside from the action,literally everything is terrible in this series/franchise…The character writing let it be their motivations and the actions they make…The world building and how the high table function…How can you draw suspense or any tension from the audience when your main character at this point is not even a character but a plot device…John Wick is literally immortal…
I don't think, so the same writer did write Nobody according to the credits of the film. And that movie had decent character writing as well. Might just be the mass production they do to churn out, what was it six of them in total, maybe they did switch writers as these went on? Honestly, not even sure. I just saw after watching Nobody that the same writer was credited for that and JW 1.
@@properduction2586
>”John Wick is literally immortal”
>John Wick dies at the end of 4
@@harrydubois6619
You know there’s a spin off and a fifth John Wick movie right ?
@@harrydubois6619 ‘John Wick dies at the end of 4’ - when he should have died about 50 times before in the film, according to the universe rules set up in JW1. But only ‘died’ when the plot demanded it.
John Wick should be like Red Haired Shanks from One Piece, where the entiretx of the Navy collectively shits their pants at the prospect of having to fight him
Yeah but they choose the realistic approach which was the mistake at the very start when they started with the sh!t they do when they become superhuman.
Red Hair Shanks sucks and so does One Piece. The ammount of plot armor OP characters have is leaps and bounds above anything in JW.
Or like Yujiro Hanma who beat the entire US Military. Don't ask questions alright
MauLer sounded so annoyed through the whole stream. I genuinely feel bad for him.
I get why he is annoyed. I don't share his opinion , but I have been in the situation where a lot of people praise what I see as total garbage .
JW1 Russians are literally styled off Hotline Miami
that scene was "homage" to HMs influence on the JW universe
7:55 in DMC5 you can pay for in game currency, alternate colors, or a special taunt. You can also use them for moves, but it doesn’t make any better at the game
They're also extremely insignificant. You barely get anything from them, especially if you're shit at the game.
Yeah, I'm so glad that shit ended up being pointless. It's like capcom forced them to have MTXs and they just slapped them on something pointless to appease the executives.
I'm going to enjoy John Wick 4 and nobody can stop me.
Mauler is cynical
The reason the 2:15:00 original club song plays in the "hotline miami" scene is because the original club scene was based off hotline miami russian mafia ,even the suits are the same.
Ad mortem sic vita fluit, velut ad mare flumen. Vivere nam res est dulcis, amara mori. Restituunt furtum fures, vi rapta, latrones. Omnia mors aufert, restituitque nihil. Latus ad occasum, unquam rediturus ad ortum. Vivo hodie, moriar cras, here natus eram.
When you film from above , you see the maximum impact visually of a spread shotgun
This was my first John Wick film, and the huge Warriors reference just made me want to watch The Warriors. Otherwise I was mostly confused.
Same here, everyone was talking about how good the franchise was so I expected some cool action at least... the scene with the shotgun was cool, I guess...
You should have started with the original it’s better than the rest
John Wick 4 > EFAP
My ranking from best to worst is:
1. John Wick
2. John Wick Chapter 2
3. John Wick Chapter 4
4. John Wick Chapter 3: Parabellum
What a treat
Can't wait for the Payday gang to show up
People are calling this film a "Masterpiece", which is disappointing but not surprising. Almost every film with pretty visuals and nice music is "Masterpiece" nowadays.
Overall, JW4 is better than I expected, but I wasn't expected much. And there is a lot of things about this film that annoy. I hate how John doesn't acknowledge just how much destruction his actions caused. Especially when they're harming his friends. Speaking of which, Hiroyuki Sanada is an awesome actor, with a tremendous screen presence, yet he keeps getting wasted in things. He should of been the main character in Mortal Kombat. He should of been the main villain in The Wolverine. He should of been more prominent in Bullet Train. And he should of been more prominent here.
It would of be a more interesting story if his daughter died in the crossfire, and he went after Marquis. Every time the stupid Mr. Nobody was on screen I kept thing just how much of his screen time could of gone to more interesting characters like Shimazu, and even Charon. Also, it would of made more sense if Caine, the Blind Character, had the Dog. And it could of helped with the silliness in some of his fight scenes.
Shimazu, Caine, even Akira are also far more deserving of spin-offs than another mediocre action flick where Ana De Armas doesn't know how to use a gun.
The world building in this universe is also screwed. Nothing can be taken seriously, cause they keep making up rules.
I've long worried, that if the JW franchise wasn't careful, it would end up being another Fast & Furious. Unfortunately, that has become a reality. Mission: Impossible is still the Modern Action Franchise King. And there isn't a competitor that comes close.
Aside from the action,literally everything is terrible in this series/franchise…The character writing let it be their motivations and action…The world building and how the high table functions…How can you draw suspense or any tension from the audience when your main character at this point is not even a character but a plot device…John Wick is literally immortal…
Yooooooo what up man, didn’t know you also watched Metal’s Forges
No rags? Those are my fav.
Might be a hot take but I rather watch John Wick 4 than the Last of us show xDD
I did watch John Wick 4, and never will watch TLOU show
Hey man I got you one up I haven't seen either
Damn, Moolie was not entertained.
Favorite forge in a little bit though!
Ok. Few problems with this movie.
Unlike the EFAP crew, I accept that the movies are borderline parody. The same way I don’t overanalyze Spaceballs or Blue Harvest for being accurate to Star Wars or even Sci-Fi.
Rather, I’ve appreciated the movies for what they were: action movie porn-basically.
However, IF this movie is meant to be the pivotal FINAL super duper special wrap up conclusion as it was presented… why is the table still around? Why did some nameless Marquis de Crème Brûlée have to pop into the picture, blow up the continental, kill Lance Reddick in real life, and accomplish nothing. I just don’t understand it.
I appreciated the characterization in this film moreso than in the others… but it definitely didn’t feel like a conclusion to anything.
If Keanu Reaves isn’t in this franchise, sorry kiddos… it ain’t gonna float.
Bruh ur talking as if he died or something
It took me 6 hours to watch this movie.
The fat front-desk looking dude was Scott Adkins?! What a waste to put him in a fatsuit...
"12 or 9?"
Is actually "11 or 1".
I liked the part where the bad guys decided to stand around waiting for John to arrive so they could pose on him and die two seconds later.
As an anecdote my dad said, "the protagonist can't die until the end, y'know, that's how it works". Kill me.
Yeah that’s why they can be hit by like what six cars and take a three story fall better than Spider-Man somehow. Nothing about that ending made me feel like his life was going to end.
The JW sequels remind me of Watchmen or League of Extraordinary Gentlemen, comic-book worlds.
This is like cienamsins but without the dings.
And not gay
15:50 John Wick is presumably the same age as Keanu, none and I mean NONE of his falls are believable
In the first alone, he falls 10 ft up and simply walks away limping, presumably all the way to his hotel room (all while bleeding to the point he needs stitches in the next scene).
To which in a later fight that SAME night, when the adrenaline and any sort of actual explanations to due away with the SLING he has on, he faces a grown woman whom hits and exposes his stitches, and still is manhandled by him.
And all of this while there is a sniper on him who never gets a clear shot while clearly having the intention to kill. Snipers do require very precise aim however, wind is not a problem as it is 1) not windy, 2) he's in between large buildings, and 3) He is relatively not all that far for shots to change trajectory based on distance, and aim
If you're telling me it is more believable that a 50 plus year old man:
1) Gets shot through his Kevlar causing him to clearly lose blood to the point he finally loses a fight
2) Falls 10ft onto marble
3) Gets up only limping away (rather than you know fucking dying, or at least being carried away)
4) Travel between one and several blocks to his hotel, all the way up several stories into a building
(though it is possible the club is in the same location as the hotel with jw3 having a scene with the club being inside the hotel for some reason)
5) Get stitched up, and in a sling is being offered pain killers, opting out for his alcoholic beverage instead
6) Proceeds to almost get headshot by a sniper, to then begin a fight with a trained female assassin of believable size whom hits him in the stitched wound
7) Bests her anyways, and then only the next morning is shown recognizing he is injured by finally taking pain killers which he then proceeds to go on another killing spree and not before ending it he gets hit by a car
And all of this is more believable than that same man falling several stories, while having his fall broken by
1) half of the fall onto a roof that is on an incline
2) onto fire escape on to his back
3) onto a dumpster
4) onto the concrete floor
all while wearing a relatively high tech armored suit, and then only getting away because some hobo carries him away
Then you're all full of shit. With great power, comes great responsibility, and I'd say they have done a decent (not perfect) job at presenting live action HYPER REALITY. Because that is the thing when you look at it through the lens of Hyper reality, you realize that all this increasingly bs stakes is just a product of hyper action, no different than a comic book from america or japan. Same difference as an issue of detective comics, or a volume of Berserk.
Also later Mauler points out how John gets hit by several cars, but when one of the henchmen gets hit they are stunned
Well that can easily be explained by John being ready to be hit in most were he simply slides off the hood when the car stops, and in the only other different case is when one screeches to a halt on its side, and John is thrown onto it, but thats just a case of hyper reality with the suit, John's durability, and simply the car stopping nearly before it even hits him
versus well being hit by the car it not stopping and you spinning a couple times in he air before fucking falling on your FACE
Did you guys even watch the same movies as me? At zero points (as a John Wick fan, and as a person who dodges being the fan of anything) did I ever think that John Wick was ever approaching peak fiction nor even decent fiction.
I watched the movie, and understood its core was its action. I watched the behind the scenes, and came away knowing the point was the action. And yet you so called film critics couldn't see that.
Virtually all of your criticisms are addressed by realizing what genre your watching, hyper reality action with Neo noir. That's not a shield against your criticisms of the dialogue and characters, it's an acceptance of them.
The creators are stunt guys/ action guys who wanted to make a movie. Yes, I watch John Wick for its plot, no I am not ashamed of it. The same goes for my enjoyment of DMC and DOOM.
You know the difference between John Wick and all of the Hollywood sludge that is filling the market, it sets out to do one thing and it does it well. It is attempting to please every common denominator, it's just trying to deliver a story, while demonstrating its action prowess, nothing more and definitely nothing less. You can't criticize an artist for not doing enough of what you want, rather they should be asked for more of what they already attempted
And a John Wick with a solid story sounds awesome, we don't need it, and definitely not getting it in this film ecosystem
I was going to respond to every criticism levied against it (and as you see I have a keyboard and I'm not afraid to use it), but I have self control and I'm not going to waste my time (not that I already haven't over a narratively weak ACTION film, and few fellow film lovers
Everyone makes mistakes I guess.
I think Optimus Primes death in Revenge Of The Fallen hits harder than John Wick dying lol
That an opinion. Let's say you're dead right, why is that bad?
@@obiwon1237 what are you asking?
@@bigcoffinhunter5500 why bring up transformers when talking about John Wick? You're just looking for something to use as a rod to hit this film with.
You are trying to hate this film
@@obiwon1237 and you are trying to instigate an argument from someone who doesn't really care. Do us both a favor and stop responding.
John wick 4 is a movie about gun wizards intended for children, grow up and move on
1:37:42
John Wick 5: John and Caine prequel so we get fun friendship murder
I know the sequels are dumb and make no sense, but I honestly cannot imagine getting so insanely miserable and angry about these movies as Mauler is here. The first movie is fine, it doesn't belong on the pedestal they put it on comparing it to the sequels.
I kinda thought this movie was mid, it was better than 2 and 3 but still worse than the 1st movie. I enjoyed a lot of things in it but there was still too much goofy shit in it. Also I hate bulletproof suits it ruins stakes in 3 of the movies but a least in 2 they tried showed that when John got it still hurt. John wick 4 is a 6.5/ 10
Oh my goodness, my comment was read out! In the middle of the stream! Granted, it was entirely due to my stupidity in confusing JonCJG for MarcTheCyborg, an incredibly silly blunder, but I'll take it!
(sorry Marc, I'll never screw that up again.)
I liked it better than 2 and 3, but it has issues. The main problems seem to come from building off of the previous films. For instance, Bulletproof jackets. Dumb. Hate it. But it exists, and they use it as has been established.
Bow and arrows vs guns pissed me off.
Overall, it was probably an objective mess, but I really enjoyed the film.
4 pretty much pretends 3 doesnt exist. you can go from 2 to 4 and miss nothing, in fact you're better off as 3 ends with a Morpheus Neo team up vs Winston and the high table. and 4 is like nah Winston and John cool and Morpheus just shows up to give John a suit then fucks off never to be seen again
Why are bullet proof jackets dumb?
Lighten up. You're too cynical
Pretty much my thoughts on JW4 summed up beautifully
MauLer feels about John Wick 4 the way I felt about the Last of Us show.
Turnabout is a botch.
Mauler has slowly red pilled me on the John Wick Franchise
What do you mean?
@@aaron827 Bad movies
John Wick is like Fast and Furious, you just enjoy the ride ridiculous as it may be. Seeing metal and mauler getting upset about these films is hilarious.
Here's the thing, even if ou atch it with that mentality the fights are boring and bland. I was sick of seeing John punching a guy then shooting him at point blank by the third fight scene.
jw is a great action movie with mediocre story, also most of critiques (regarding suits for instance) don't hold up if you agree that movie can follow it's own logic if there is consistency.
I watched John Wick 2 and three and was quite dissappointed. I was hopping for something I could at least enjoy. But the action sequences actually left me board. Many of them started to feel tedious as I realized no one actually wanted to kill John Wick. Which, I dont recall that from the first movie, which I really liked. Maybe Ill have to go back and watch the first one. But in the sequels it feels as though no one is trying to kill him. What bothered me the most was how often they would hit him with a car and he'd just get up and walk again or even fight just fine. Btw I think what makes action scenes like this. Good in the first place. Are how grounded they are in reality(think daredevil hallway) Basically how good of a job can they do to convince you these people actually want to fight and hurt eachother or kill one another. I think when you just throw flashy action on the screen and pointless gratuity. You start to get the feeling of what is the point of this? Im just watching a guy gun people down who are basically just letting him do it.
Bulletproof suits actually exist btw. They are even more flexible than standard suits and they can stop handguns and machine guns.
They exist, but like kevlar vests, they would not negate the impact force of all of those shots. Wick would have very, very many bones broken.
Closest available is "hyperline" by "SafeLifeDefense" and can stop up to a .44 magnum.
However, **Armor stops the projectile**, not the force the projectile transfers to one's body upon impact.
One 124gr 9mm bullet produces 465 lbf ft.
As a unit of energy, one foot-pound is the energy it takes to push with one pound-force one pound for a distance of one foot. 1 foot-pound is equivalent to: 1.3558179483314004 joules.
Getting shot in any armor can be incapacitating. Broken bones, internal ruptures/bleeding, etc
They are very cynical
It's like they wanted to hate it and use bulletproof suits as the main crux of their arguement
@@obiwon1237 it's a valid criticism when it's the reason the protagonist survives situations he absolutely shouldn't. It trivializes and removes all stakes, especially when other characters don't get the same treatment.
I went to go see the movie with my friend and family, they all left liking the movie however I left somewhat disapointed, it wasn't John Wick, there was moments of the first one in the movie, but they lost the style of the first movie
Try and judge the movies on an individual basis
Lol cyborgman tries to be positive about bad film but The Long will have none
“Isn’t it at least a little bit good in some way…?” Asketh the cyborgman
“NAY!” Cryeth The Long…
FIN
Common L take from Mauler on the John Wick series. I can see why he wasn’t on FNT when they reviewed it.
@@harrydubois6619 FNT?
How can you get so pissed and cry about a stupid Action parody??
Why is a stupid action parody immune to criticism?
@@CapinGegvithe3rd i have nothing against mauler etc criticising the movie. I just dont get how he can be so pissed/joyless with such an obvious dumb action movie
@@elektrometro when people have no lives they usually resort to this. The only mauler take i even remotely give attention is when they ripped synthetic man a new asshole. Everything else he does are boring snoozefests that i usually ignore because i actuaklly have a life.
Just watch RRR instead
Yeah RRR had A FUCKING LOT of suspension of disbelief. They are the same.
@@brandonlucas4173 RRR Is supposed to be over the top, jw is not
@@TrajGreekFire Maybe not the first JW, but it’s been getting crazier with every installment. I was thoroughly prepared for the cartoonish insanity of 4.
@@brandonlucas4173 The fuck they are RRR is super fun with lots of charisma and while the action was cartoonish it embraced it. JW was a snore fest that took itself too seriously and wanted the audience to do the same.
all of the stupid cartoon shit is the reason we love John Wick. its clear what the series is now and I'm sorry to the people who were mislead by the first one before chad went full comic book. I get picking these things apart is your job but I think that most of the people who expected John Wick to be like the first one shouldve seen this coming. look at the last movie.
There is only one John Wick movie. The rest is just bollocks anime masturbation machines strung together wearing the nominal structure of a "movie" but without a single character. The original one was brilliant, but it should have stayed one movie.
Movies make money, and the John Wick movies are some of the most popular action movies