Accuracy and chrono testing a wax based pellet lube on Gamo ,JSB and a lead free H&N ftt
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- Опубліковано 21 кві 2023
- Here i test a wax based pellet lube through my sub12 Anschutz 9015
i run them over the combro chronograph in real time to monitor and increase in pellet speed / fps.
i only shot at just under 25 yards in a relatively sheltered area. the results are quite surprising really...
the Gamo 10x pellets are a budget pellet at £6 per tin and the groups are much the same as what i got through my Airmaks katran. they also perform significantly better then the gamo lethal pellets which ive previously tested
the JSB heavies we have used on the channel before. the groups were ok and im sure would be better still given some time to lead them into the barrel. we have used them in previous videos to good effect.
i was hoping to get some better performance from the H&N ftt green pellets. if we are faced with a lead ban i want to be well prepared. their performance was decidedly poor compared to the full lead equivalents such as the H&N 8s.
the scope im using is a prs specific model from discovery, the ed prs 5-25x56 a bit of a monster for short ranges but i like it.... - Спорт
Thank you for another informative video and the time you’ve spent making it.
Another thorough and informative review, thanks 😁 . Personally never bothered with lubes and tbh can’t see I ever will however this was very interesting.
I use silicone lube. Just spray it on and let it dry. I've been doing it that way for years. I see almost no increase in speed and very little accuracy wise. But I stopped getting fowling in the barrel.
What silicone lube do you use? And do you just put a couple of drops in the tin? I might give this a go in my r10 👍
I do exactly the same. any cheap silicon spray stops them oxidizing and doesn't affect accuracy. Keeps the blueing shiny and the plastic black doesn't harm the wood and keeps the 12g semi-automatic going . excellent stuff.
Probably cures COVID as well.
Why u continue to use it when u see no positive results 👀
The positive is no accuracy loss or power loss and no lead fouling inside barrel
Wicked video yet again mate. Very interesting 😊
It often takes a few shots to condition the barrel, between pellet types and lube states, before things settle down. Ignoring that may make it seem like a given pellet or lube state is less stable than it is. That said, your Anschutz seems rather consistent with most everything, so it is a great test bed for this.
Another good one and has answered the ‘to lube or not to lube’ question for me ie: not really worth it! I always use a quality pellet anyway so as you’ve just shown, it doesn’t make enough of a difference. When I’m shooting 10m standing and unsupported a lubed pellet isn’t going to make any noticeable difference. Great vid Tilly, keep up the good work, cheers, Woody.
Some old thing with air rifles mate, some wil see a clear improvement, some won't and being able to conclusively say what will and won't perform is all but impossible 😂
I think he was honest about talking about the wind. The only way to truly determine of these lubricants made any difference would be to use such a setup as some pellet manufacturers use and that is shoot down a very long pipe to do away with the wind factor. and of course have the rifle completely bolted down. There are videos of such setups out there (or at least there used to be LOL). I might add that some ingredients of certain bike lubes may not be compatible with whatever rubber O-rings one is running. I would also suggest that most do not even know what compounds their )-rings are made from unless they have obtained them directly from a proper O-ring supplier. The reason i mention this is because any type of lube put around the barrel/into the barrel will have a good chance to encounter via a type of creep if you like (not creep as in metal creep obviously) rubber seal/s. Just saying. Check the bottle, he probably said it anyway and I didn't hear it.
I don't know if it has to do with PCP rifles, but tat shouldn't matter, but with my Gamo Magnum I reach 200feet more speed, you can even hear the difference! do't know what happens here!
@@tillysgunstocks it could help if yo barrel is loose so the air does not go around the pellet so much and you get 3 more fps :D it could also smooth things out in a bad barrel with a rough surface/ dirt in it..
But im sure accuracy will be worse when lubed as the lube will be uneven around the pellet. moisture on a surface will also create turbulence...
Interesting video, just undertaken a shoot at 100 yard to 300 yard with leadfree 6.5x55SE and whilst the Sako Blade is very accurate at 100 yards, the POI drops significantly at 200 yards (3 to 4 inches), and drastically at 300 yards (6 to 9 inches), which is a bit of a revelation for Copper/Plastic Projectiles. Since the drop is normally 2 inches at 200 yards with Lead Projectiles.
I think that unless you're shooting in a 100% windfree surrounding, (ie indoors) results will not be measurable. However, here in Germany with a limit of 7.5 joules and a realistic shooting limit of 25 meters, I've been using silicon spray directly into the tin. Is it better? no idea, it's more psychological.
What I can say is, leadfree diabolos in a 7.5 joule airgun are a complete nonstarter (sometimes literally). This is why I'm very well stocked up with traditional lead diabolos just in case the ban is introduced. Although I see the ban directed more to the shotgunners who can easily, and on a regular basis, blast off 100 shots with a 36g load in 1 afternoon, that's 3.6 Kilos of lead or 7000 diabolos in .177 anyway airgunners generally shoot into pellet traps or rat heads so it's no big deal.
I really appreciate your diversity and enthusiasm for the airgunning world and I think we have all learnt a little more from your videos.
Greetings from Germany
That's really bad. It's 20 joules in France and 16 in the UK for non permit over the counter sales.
German limits seem to reflect Bell Target limits.
Me and my mate bought BSA scorpions well over ten years ago as our first PCP's, after a few months the O rings on the mags broke,we started using pellet spray and haven't changed one since,even if performance isn't affected, it certainly preserves O rings on probes and mags,
Over the years it's pretty much only been the BSA and cz barrels that I've seen any sort of noticeable gains in. Some more than others,but definitely worth a try in the hammer forged barrels...
@@tillysgunstocks still use it today on my R10,,I do think it improves performance personally,
@@ratrabbitandpestsniper1826 thing is mate, if it makes you feel more confident in your kit and prep, then it's worth doing. Are you running something like an h&n through the BSA barrels?
@@tillysgunstocks JSB Exact heavy 10.34gr,,,bob on for me,
What pellet spray do you use and how much I've got a r10 se and a scorpion se so I might give it a try👍👍
A+ Vid - Just sorted my FTT Greens (older tin) & they were HORRIBLE. The weights were evenly distributed from 9.50-9.60, to 10.10grains!!! There was a very large number of 10.05-10.10gr pellets. They were hard to load into the mag & accuracy was meh at 50. Still waiting on my head gauge
Excellent test. I have had my Jon Harris 9015 since 2017 and have found consistently that lubing pellets makes groups worse. I use FP10, three drops on an entire tin, I have been using this method since about 2003/4. By comparison my export barrel (LW) Pro-T BR rifle has shown consistent improvement on group sizes with certain batches of pellets when lubed. My method is to shoot them from the tin, then try a few lubed and if necessary sized (unlubed and lubed), if at the end of all that I still can't get acceptable groups, then that batch don't suit. The 9015 is much easier, it either likes a batch or not, my Walther LG300 is an entirely different matter, what a fussy b*gger that is. I'll try some wax chain lube, I think I have some in the garage.
I've only seen any appreciable improvements in a few of the BSA and cz barrels, although the ftt greens went through the 9015 barrel much nicer lubed than dry. As we saw the groups were much the same but that better sight picture might be worth a few points over a season. I mean they aren't that accurate but you know what i mean..
I'll keep trying stuff on the pb free, if there's a workaround that brings them somewhere near lead pellets then atleast if all goes belly up,we've something to fall back on
This 9015 barrel is something else though, I've never seen such an unfussy barrel, ever.
On my Hatsan gladius cal .25 I need to use a couple of drops of silicone lubrication on about 1 in 100 pellets to get better groups. I see a clear pattern how the groups start to spread and after some lubrication shrink back to nice tight group again. Haven't experienced the same with my new Leshiy 2 cal .25. Maybe it can have with the barrel quality to do.
Very interesting video. I have only just come across your channel and subscribed. I have been using aerosol silicone spray straight onto pellets. It would be very interesting to see what you think. Definatly seems to tighten my groups up through my BSA R10 using 177 air arms 4.5 2 to see what you think
Really interesting and informative video thanks
Good day my friend. You must try Vicks vapor rub fil the bullet at the back and test it again and you will see the performance.
Interesting vid , not a great deal of difference in performance between lubed and non - lubed .. nevertheless , it duz keep the pellets from oxidizing ... I found the best way to ensure the pellets get a good even coating is to , put 4 / 5 drops in a food bag or snap top bag , and squish it about lubrication ALL the inside of the bag , THEN tip your pellets in ( after washing and drying preferably ) then gently massage the pellets around in the bag .. this will cover the whole pellet ... some vids show them putting drops into the bag with the pellets already in .. this just means the lube will get stuck mostly into the inside of the pellet skirt on some ... just thought I'd mention it ... gonna lube a tin of QYS Magnums next week , hope it doesn't make them hotter then they already can be ...
I will say, I wasn’t really trying to use a pellet lube but I did spray some white lithium in my chamber to lube the o-ring and make the pellet feed easier. I did pick up about 20fps on the chrony over 2 mags shot. I’m sure it will die down as the lube dries.
Another very interesting video 👍
I noticed a difference in a 30:06 ss barrel with Slick 50 by 150 FPS more than without but it needed reapplied to the barrel every few shots and in the end found it to be to much bother. I saw no difference in accuracy at all just over the chronograph. I was shooting 100 yards with 150 grain bullets and with and without Lube the gun held 2-5 shot groups around an inch and a half. Hell of a lot cheaper shooting my airguns that’s for sure, less recoil if any, and a damn site quieter.👍
It was stated many years ago in Airgun World or Air Gunner that the best pellet lube was any wax based furniture polish like Mr Sheen etc. far cheaper than these little bottles of pellet lube and goes much further and smells better as well lol. To be fair it does work.
As you've used a bike lube....... I'm into cycling and hot chain waxing, we are moving from ptfe powder in wax to tungsten disulfide, this is a very slippery powder, much more environmently friendly, none toxic and can take very high temperatures, could you test dry lube powder, just sprinkle a bit on pellets rather than in an oil or wax base?
When it comes to surface area, there's not much pellet actually touching the barrel.
I prefer to lube the barrel. In fact, I use a dry wax bicycle lube to clean & lube the barrel in one shot. It is a liquid that dries quickly.
Hiya bud another good video as always is there a rifle that you have that is more relatable to hunting outfits that us average joes may have that you could do so tests with? I appreciate the time and effort you put in making the videos but iv done nothing with target rifles and wonder some times how a multi shot would fair on tests compared to a single shot like you are using, anyway keep up the great work pal and happy shooting
Hi Alex,I'm regularly using the little airmaks katran. That's a multi shot modern ultra carbine rig. There's some vids on the channel directly comparing the single shot loading against the magazine loading 😉
If you watch the last video that was a test on the gamo 10x pellets you'll notice that the results are almost identical through the katran and the 9015 😉
Thanks for sharing.
Subbed 👍
Great video, i dno if its just certain tins but I swear the last tin of jsb heavies i had were prelubed from factory, they felt oily to the touch.
Funny you say that but these new ones feel like they have something of a lube on.maybe it's just from the swaging process🤔
I've got some fresh batches from 2023 on the way.itll be interesting to try some very recent ones out
@@tillysgunstocks another thing i noticed is the 2022 batch has deep narrow indent on the underside and the 2023 batch has shallow wide indent on the underside. Dont know if this would effect drag.
Am I the only one concerned about the proposed lead ban?
No one seems that bothered about this imposition on our freedom.
Interesting vid, thanx. 👍
Appreciated, thanks
Hmmm. I was expecting to see some dieseling, but I guess if you don't have enough of the lube in the skirt it won't really diesel. It would be interesting to see the accuracy difference when dieseling.
PCP’s don’t diesel as the physics are different to springers.
@@andybrown8293 its not impossible ,it depends how much pressure you got in the plenum . and how fast it gets into the barrel a diesel engine diesels under 30 bar compression
Thanks for the interesting video .
I'm in the US and I'm new to pellet rifle shooting. I'm not new to the world (I'm ancient.) Maybe this comment is apples to oranges because I'm shooting a new Gamo Maxim break barrel. Break barrels are not famous for accuracy anyway, but people shooting the same brand of similar rifles are telling me they get 0.5" (13mm) groups at 40 yards.
Because of my accuracy problems with a brand new rifle I hunted everything I could find about accuracy. Even though it sounded nutty I went through the process of washing, drying overnight and lubing 50 pellets just so see what happened. I used spray on chain lube named Blaster. It's not wax based and doesn't dry overnight. I have no interest in any business companies here nor there.. After drying over night and lubing over night and just before loading into the chamber I blotted the lube out of the skirt to avoid dieseling.
My very poor group at 20 yards went from 3" (76mm) to 1.5" (38mm). Still a poor group, but a huge improvement.
All I saw in the wash water was very tiny pieces of lead. I didn't think those pieces of lead were big enough to matter, bit that's just my guess.
After changing scopes the best group I got was about 1" (25mm) at 30 feet. And 50 shots later the group was once again horrible. Today I'm hoping to decrease the group size by putting blue thread goo on the scope threads. I already tightened the rifle screws.
Shooting experience for me is 70 years. I can put 5 shots with my Hatsan MOD 25 in a 1.125" (38mm) dot at 20 feet with a shooting table and open sights.
Any advice? Thank you.
Hi, my advice/observations - at your age try a smaller/lighter rifle. The HW30 in .177 is a truly brilliant rifle and super accurate over 40m. Get a decent (but not too expensive - you’re not taking deer at 400m) scope (you may already be using one), and take your time zeroing in - up to 200 shots with ammo from one tin. Accept that different types/brands of pellets will result in different results - barrels can be fussy - and find the one that suits your barrel/gun. Don’t bother with waxes or lubes if using lead. Do consider lubes if going lead-free. Work on your breathing and fire whilst exhaling (gently exhaling). When holding a springer (break barrel or lever action) don’t pull the butt hard into your shoulder. If right handed, hold the rifle in your left hand at the balance point and rest the butt into your shoulder. Don’t get frustrated when you get a “flyer”. Sometimes pellets just do that. Enjoy.
@@joemerican5781 Thank you so much for your reply and advice.
A few days ago i started shooting my granddaughter's Ruger Explorer .177 youth model with 9.3gr wadcutter pellets at 13 yards. I can get a lot closer to the dime diameter dots than with the Gamo, but I can tell the pellets aren't strong enough to take my furry squirrel vandals.
I looked up the HW30 and some reviews say it, too, is not strong enough for hunting.
I'll not do typical hunting activities because io the trajectory of pellets. I'll set up a bait location and hide in a blind so I can be sure to be at the same distance all the time.
So after seeing the Ruger break barrel was close on target at 13 yards I moved a steel backed paper target about double that distance and took a few shots. I could hear the pellets hit the steel, but couldn't find a hole in the paper. So after taking a few more shots I noticed leaves flying up ahead of the target. After close examination I saw that the pellet hit about a meter ahead of the target. After raking leaves I found the pellet trench and inside that trench was pieces of Night Crawlers. lol
I'm watching my breathing and all those other pieces of advice you included.
Thank you for your time and for sharing your knowledge.
😁
Best bike lube - auto trans fluid ATF & hex Boro nitride powder HBN, superb & cheap. Hbn is like moly but clean & much higher temp than teflon
A rifle with lateral chargement with pellet in the barrel, is mostly precise... (springer) your air can does'nt valiue a littele bit see the cost and the big expensive mode to recharge the tank.... w springer foreveer
I'm not being picky here mate, but its not Game-o, its Gam-o.
Same as in Gammon.
I swear, not a wind up, ask someone. I swear!!👍🏻
Anyone else notice the continuity error, re barrels...?
ballistol waxes up like a wax u should do a test on it
The only time lube really makes a difference is when the chamber-O is worked out and is over the hill..
Then it was time to replace the o-ring.
What was the comment about when he said he was still shooting under a certain number and still being "legal"?
In the UK you need to get a firearms certificate for anything over 12 ft/lb muzzle energy...depending on pellet weight thats approx 600fps in 22 and 800fps in 177
Adequate for the size of pests, rats, rabbits, squirrels we have here at up to 40 yards
Spray some balistol oil n dry it off with a towel ...really good for slugs 👍🏻
It’s funny how different rifles perform, my ev2 and Steyr no difference at all, M3 impact becomes phenomenal with lube.
lead free would probably grip the rifling better with beeswax. (As in Black Powder)
His ricochet group is tight
Silicone spray (any) stops oxidizing and does no harm as far as I can tell. Cheap as well.
Try synthetic 2 stroke oil, it works better in my at 44.
wd40 in this test would have been interesting also? great upload ty.
What is the blue box between the Combro and the phone ?
That's a blue shot combro adapter. It allowse to record all the shots via an app on the phone.although currently it's now a bit obsolete as it uses the old phone charger type lead. It works well when the phone will update...
Statistically speaking 5 shot groups aren't that useful you need more shots to get true data, either 10 shot groups or what I prefer is multiple 5 shot groups so a whole card of 5 shots for each variant would give you really good data.
Yes, with 10 conditioning shots between pellet types and lube states, before starting a group.
If you can find it try LT1 pellet lube. Thank me later 😊
My thoughts exactly it's THE only one worth using that works!!!!
Also, remember FASTEX ,still got some.
Chrono before and after treatment..meaning barrel treatment....amazing!!
Really interesting. I just can't see the point of lubes (beyond oxidisation protection in long-term storage). Surely the lubricating effect is minimal as the lube will come off the bearing surfaces of the pellet pretty quickly (maybe nothing left by the time it reaches the choke). And it will leave residue in the barrel. On the pellet, the lube will be uneven across skirt, neck and head therefore marginally reducing the consistency of weight distribution. Finally, lube on your fingers certainly doesn't help dirt transfer to pellet or gun, nor trigger use.
The endless real time narration on this video reminds me of the movie, "The good, the bad and the ugly". In one scene a ruffian intends to shoot Tuco. But, first he goes into a long explanation why. Before he is done, Tuco turns the tables on him, and utters, "if you need to shoot, shoot; don't talk".
Please: More shooting and less talking. We can see what you are doing. If you need to narrate, add that in editing, over the action video. Narrating and then shooting doubles the length of the video. I appreciate that this is more work for you, but, concentrating the value of your content will double the number of subscribers to your channel.
Or, you could tell me to go to Coventry...
I've got a bottle of Pellet Perfect from HW100tuning and to be honest I don't think washing and lubing actually makes any difference ( I NEVER use cheap pellets -would you buy a Ferrari and run it on E10?)clean my barrels after approx 500 shots on PCP's,& when accuracy falls in a springer.
Who points at things with their 'finger' finger? Everyone I know uses their 'index' finger...
NO ITS NOT A SCAM" ITS SPAM" WHICH IS MUCH NICER AND GOES DOWN GREAT WITH CHIPS AN PEA,S.
Mr Sheen 🤔🤔🤔
If you use a good quality pellet for an established brand you do not need to lube. Lead is self lubing. Wax and oils just gunk up your barrel.
True enough, I'm more concerned right now with potentially having to use tin pellets. Mainly looking at existing work arounds,so I'm prepared for the worst 😉
a barrel gets a lead film , and if thats a problem waxing could help ,but some guns never need a barrel clean
The main benefit of lubing pellets is the barrel stays clean longer; before you start to see flyers. Then, it takes one or two pulled patches to clean the barrel, rather than 25 or more.
The advantage of lubing pellets is more apparent with hard high antimony pellets, such a Crosman. Soft almost pure lead pellets such as JSB have a lesser tendency to produce stubborn lead deposits, that are likely to affect grouping ability.
Too much lube, or inconsistent lube is likely to cause unstable grouping. Too much oily lube on pellets used in a springer is likely to boost velocity via dieseling. It also has the potential the boost velocity differences, and group really poorly.
And for you fellows in the UK, you could bump yourself into FAC territory when using oiled pellets in your springer. However, there is little risk of that with PCPs - assuming that you are not on the limit already.
Dry wax lubed pellets are unlikely to cause dieseling in your springer, while the solvent carrier certainly could, if you shoot such pellets while still wet. Dry lubed pellets don't have the tendency to stick to dust and fluff, so they are popular.
In the USA, model RC car shock absorber oil in "10 weight" is a favorite for lubing pellets. It is non-combustible silicone oil, so you could use it from springers too.
Shhh, shhh.....its OK.....
Wash and dry, thats it, no oil
I get better accuracy with lubed jsb 10.34.
Pellet lube is totally unnessary lead is it,s own lubricant.
Bottom line is - Dead quarry, Lube or Not!!!!
Lol did you just call gamo gay mo 😂
i don't see the point of lubes, they have potential to increase the weight of the pellet, ie: if theres a bit more lube on one pellet than another leading to inconsistent groups
I like information but my God, please breathe because I can't even
They are three different grain, how is that work for accuracy...................... Really............... Click bait.
Commentator is ranting as if he's missing the train. Listening is Unbearable
What ARE you talking about? If you don't like his presentation style go away and don't watch.
Well that's not what your boy friend said !! He said you love lube more the better 😂