Giles tells Buffy not to let Angel provoke her and by the climax it's Buffy trying to restrain Giles. What a powerful reversal and continues the theme of teenagers being wiser than adults at times. The ambiguity of adolescence.
Giles _says_ these things because he _knows_ them. Buffy _does_ these things because she _feels_ them. It's like how you can objectively know about your own cosmic insignificance, but it plays no part in your actions because you don't _feel_ that knowledge. Likewise you can act on your own cosmic insignificance because you feel it, but with no exposure to philosophy, why you do what you do may never even cross your mind despite being part of you. It's their characters in a nutshell. Giles is cerebral, Buffy is substance. She has substance but can't reach her full potential without receiving and incorporating his cerebral understanding of her nature, her situation, and her goals. He can give her guidance, but without her substance his knowledge has no action and is arguably worthless. I would say they mutually brought about this outcome through the joining of their opposing perspectives. They have what I imagine to be a rare example of a healthy, peer-to-peer watcher/slayer dynamic. This incident is a perfect example of it, and I like that you pointed it out, even if we interpreted it differently.
We heard Angel was ‘one of the worst vampires’ before he had a soul and in this episode you really see how sadistic he is. Vampires kill to survive, but we don’t see him do anything along those lines here. We just see him revel in cruelty itself. It gives us a new insight into the guilt that was torturing the souled Angel.
Huge props to the writing and David Boreanaz's performance. It would have been so easy to mess up a character like Angelus - it's a lot easier to _describe_ someone as the absolute worst person to ever exist than it is to convincingly show it, but Angelus is so central to this season's plot that they had to do it, and he had to live up to the hype. It was a tough needle to thread and they absolutely nailed it. It's especially impressive given that Angel hadn't exactly been a demanding role up to this point- it wasn't nothing, he had to at least have good chemistry with Sarah Michelle Gellar, but most early episodes didn't require much more from him than brooding, looking guilty and being ridiculously attractive. ...Then suddenly the story completely hinges on him and he has to convincingly play a character who's completely different than Angel, and has to juggle menace, humour, villainous charisma and petty dickery. He needs to be extremely entertaining and completely loathsome at the same time. And Boreanaz hadn't had many roles by this point, this was, I think, only his third credited role. They expected a lot from a mostly untested actor, but he delivered in spades.
@@Marwolaeth01 I feel like that was intentional. To make a point. Trivialize her death. Mock them, essentially. By emphasizing the pointlessness, that he didn't get anything out of it at all but their suffering.
This episode is from '98. I graduated HS in '91, so not exactly the same, but close. Our Computer teacher had a crew of us students that acted as teachers assistants in other classes. If she couldn't make a class the substitute who was assigned would just let us run the show since they knew nothing about computers at all. Qualified Programming teachers are hard to find today, but in the '90s most teachers didn't even have an email account.
Exactly. One of my high school computer teachers was the old typing teacher...who mostly focused on giving us "typing tests" from the old typewriter textbooks...because what else would you use a computer for? 🙄
Class of '00 here, one year younger than Buffy and co. I was a teacher's aide for my Spanish teacher, the librarian, and in the office. Kids definitely did things around school for the experience. So even beyond computers, I would think it's possible to let a kid lead the class if the teacher was out. We still always had a sub lol. But still, I could easily see it in Willow's case
03, here. We had student teachers in many classes over the years. They'd work as TAs most of the time, and would fill in for them for short periods if needed. Was most common in subjects where it was hard to find a knowledgeable substitute. And computer science would absolutely be one of those subjects in the late 90s.
The music playing when Giles find Jenny is from Puccini’s La Boheme, the scene where the lovers meet, I believe, just to make it extra painful. That whole setup, the roses, the candles, the music; it’s agony to watch because you already know what’s coming; the show didn’t leave you thinking maybe Jenny made it out, so you’re forced to watch Giles smile at the romantic gesture when you know, you KNOW, that it’s the opposite… it’s so brilliantly staged, lit and performed so that the death really hits you. Then there is the fall out, the other characters reacting. I can even forgive the very shitty thing Xander said, because he’s dealing with the loss too, and while he’s saying ‘I told you so’, inside I think it’s more like ‘why couldn’t I stop this’. Doesn’t make it less ugly, but grief can bring out that kind of ugliness in people. They are all hurting.
There’s a small character moment in this I dig; when Angelus destroys the computer, he’s only really smashed the monitor because he’s never bothered to learn anything about them. No idea if that was a writing choice or an acting choice (or, let’s be fair: if I’m reading too much into it). Assuming I’m not, full marks to whoever made that happen.
@GeorgiannaMiller5 I figured, but I also know my brain has…shall we say, an excitable pattern recognition system? :) So I like to add disclaimers when it’s not obvious. Thanks for confirming! 👍
@l.s.d.5863 Regarding my brain: thanks, it only took me several decades to suss! And there’s stuff I definitely didn’t pick up until the umpteenth viewing, for various reasons. One of my faves is a blink-and-you-miss-it later this season; will call attention at the appropriate time. ;)
If they planned to make it about Angelus' know-how, there wouldn't have been a floppy disc. It's a cinematography choice, most likely, because glass looks cooler being smashed than a random computer box. Screens are always being smashed in movies all over the place.
This episode always makes me cry. I really liked Miss Calendar. The raw disbelief and pain on Giles' face and Willow's reaction crush me every time. Willow covering the class makes a touch more sense in the time period...when I was in school, most students knew more about computers than any/all of the teachers, save the computer teacher.
Up until now, we've really only heard about the cruel things Angelus was capable of from Giles books, but now with Jenny's brutal murder and the staging of her body, we see our core group experience the cruelty firsthand, he made it real for them. Throughout the episode, we see just how at risk they all were. The stakes are much higher now. Excellent reaction as always 🙂
This is definitely a "point of no return" episode, for Angellus's arc, and for anyone watching. I challenge anyone to reach this episode and choose not to keep watching! It's such a beautiful episode. I love the way Angellus describes "the ecstasy of grief". That's a line that has always stuck with me. Grief and passion go hand in hand. The more passionately you care for someone, the more powerful grief is. Grief is love continuing when a person is gone. It is passion. A passionate longing for someone who is gone.
The moment when Giles ascends the stairs and discovers Jenny, music from the opera La Bohéme is playing in the background. "La Bohéme" translates to "the bohemian", or - "gypsy".
The piece of music that plays at the end at the graveyard, "Remembering Jenny", have vocals (or rather laments) by Anthony Stewart Head. Such a nice touch. And it was later sampled by Ed Sheeran for his "Afire Love".
The music in this really fits the mood to help work up even more tears if you weren't crying enough already. And even the creepy parts had special creepy music. So definitely the music in the show had come a long way since the music in season one.
okay i know you can’t use most of the music in this episode for copywrite reasons but god DAMN is it good. once my dad was watching me bopping my head listening to music in headphones and asked what i was listening to. it was. it was the passion score.
Was so keen for you to get to this episode. The music and the narration really just make it a standout. It's the point of no return for the Angelus arc, yes from a story pov Jenny was somewhat disposable and not really in the core group but the fact that he's killed a character we know and who has intimate connections with our core group, it changes things and cements that Angel is the big bad of the season. He's not getting turned back easily or in a way where his actions don't have serious emotional ramifications not just on Buffy but on the wider group as well.
Absolutely, I think making the consequences of this arc matter more fully is, while more painful, definitely the way to go. It's what makes people sit on the edge of their seat. I think as a character and a big bad he surpasses the Master at this point for me.
@@TylerAlexander that makes sense, there’s so much more emotion tied into angelous as the Big Bad than there was with the master. the master was just a straight up villain that wanted chaos and the end of the world and buffy was standing in front of that but angel… angel wants to hurt her.
As a wheelchair user, your insights about Spike and ableism are spot on. The infantilization people immediately put on you (even if they don't know you) is extreme. People just assume that wheelchair users are intellectually disabled too, and/or that we're so sensitive that they have to treat us like children. It doesn't help that there is definitely some resentment on both ends when someone's health changes quickly, like Spike's did. Spike is resentful at his body's new limitations and the way he's being treated because of it. Dru is resentful that she's having to adapt to Spike's new needs and that she has been robbed of her playmate for the foreseeable future. It's a lot, and it sucks
Buffy HAS to feel every murder that Angelus commits as a personal failure. Between assuming her direct responsibility over him losing his soul, her inability to stake him when he was at her mercy and worst of all, not killing him at her door-before he killed Jenny-plus Theresa and numerous other innocent bystanders, the guilt and horror is just piling up...and she's still in love with him. She knows and accepts her Duty...but she STILL loves him.
One of my favorite episodes. I can't tell you how many times I have cried myself through it and how much it has helped me process some of the trauma I have experienced in my life. Great analysis.
In Innocence, Buffy has the dream where she discovers that Jenny knew about the Curse, Angel: "First you have to know what to look for." switch scene, Jenny Calander wearing all black lifts here black veil to reveal her face. end dream Buffy's dreams are prophetic. Not only did this dream reveal the truth about Jenny Calander, the location of Jenny Calender in the dream was a funeral. Buffy was being shown that Jenny was going to die soon. And since it was Angel who revealed the scene to Buffy in her dream, it was also revealed that Angel was going to kill her. Never forget that Buffy's dreams are prophesy.
Most people are shocked by Willow teaching that class but they forget how hard it would have been to find a computer teacher in 1997, especially one more competent with computers than willow. Let willow get that AP credit
Absolutely. it could have counted as an elective class credit for Willow, or even internship experience to put towards a career in teaching (if she ever wanted to go that route).
As someone with a severe disability that's left me housebound for almost 15 years, I really really appreciated everything you said about disability. I'm lucky that the WFH push during the pandemic finally allowed me to get a good job that gives me the freedom and independence to build a good life, but the years before that were very isolated and vulnerable, and I often felt the need to "perform" as the happiest person in the world just to maintain some kind of social network and not drive away the people I depended on. It's a difficult way to live, and I only survived because this internet/communications age allows me to have a presence and impact outside the home. What Spike needs is a smartphone.
Never clicked so fast! Getting real indeed. Thank you for sharing your thoughts on the disability aspect of Spike's arc! I don't remember seeing this perspective explored before (and I've read my share of BtVS meta back in the days).
It reminds me of when I became physically disabled and my brother continued his "sibling banter". I eventually had to stand up for myself and say that I've never understood the difference between "banter" and bullying and that now I'm disabled I can't take it anymore. I experience shame about being disabled from so many places, externally and internally, I want my family to be kind and supportive. I'm glad I stood up for myself because he has been kind and supportive ever since x
Thanks for the disability discussion. I’m long term disabled and rely on other people for housing. On top of that I need surgery on both knees and currently cannot walk. I do my very best to keep taking care of myself as much as possible. I just found out that for the past five months I have been doing all this with a fractured rib! And I still try not to come off as needy or dramatic.
Thinking back to when I originally first watched this show, this is the episode that hooked me .Before this I was on and off watching as an interested viewer, but Passion was the episode that made this show a can't miss show moving forward. The scene between Giles and Buffy hugging still gets to me, their bond is so strong, one of my favorite relationships in the entire show.
I was so excited for you to get to this episode, it’s the point where I truly fell in love with this series. It may not be perfect but it never holds back.
Computer Lab in the 90's? Yeah we absolutely had on occasion one of the ace students cover or fill in. Not long term susbtitues mind you, but covering it in a pinch sure. Even in my area which had a really well funded school system back then, there just weren't enough people around that knew the first thing about computers let alone could teach a class. Regarding Xander; While its undeniable he has a incredibly questionable motivation for hating Angel, he is nonetheless basically the only character that consistently treats Angel and similar demons like they are actually dangerous horror movie creatures with a body count that the show says they are. He sees Angel as a, in his world, real life Jason Vorheese or Xenomorph that could snap and murder all of them at any time but frequently the other characters tend to lack that sense of apprehension or concern around them.
@@JagoBC She's just a human for the majority of the time. But yes the entire show really never addresses her past the way it should have considering she likely has the biggest body count of any of the recurring demons. The show also generally treats her horrible actions as comedic beats which is definitely a mistep of the writing.
“Poor emotional control” describes Xander perfectly, and definitely toxic moments. 😂 I loved the moment where Spike kept Dru from helping Angel and just wanted to watch him get beat down. My favorite moment of this episode. Overall, I appreciate how dark this goes to truly highlight Angelus’ sadism, and the contrast between him and Spike. If you recall, Spike “stink[s] of humanity” and Angelus has “no humanity in him,” per the Judge who could sense humanity. It’s fascinating how the show is starting to show us more complex vampires with full personalities.
SPOILER . . . . . . . . . . . . . It's implied later on Xander grew up in an abusive household those tendencies rubbed off on him. He breaks off his wedding later because he was worried he would repeat the cycle. There's also a theory I heard that he tends to be attracted to "strong women" because of this, subconsciously thinking they can hold their own if he gets toxic. That would explain why he only becomes attracted to Willow when she starts using magic and getting more confident.
@@XavionofThera Even with the lead and spoiler alert, why do people keep trying to spoil the show for Tyler? He only knows what he's seen so far, Gingerbread, and the finale. There is *zero* need to spoil anything else. Putting a spoiler as a reply to my own comment is rude. I know what Xander's deal is and his character arc; I've seen the series over 15 times. But if there's any chance Tyler could see this comment (hopefully he doesn't), then it should be removed as a courtesy to him.
@@ravenlord7144 ????? The idea of the "SPOILER" tag is so that he doesn't read it. And that anyone who doesn't want spoilers doesn't read it. The spacing means that you have to willingly click "read more..." to read it.
Regarding your talk about disabled people having to "perform" to get by: One, thank you. That was very gratifying to hear, and Two, it has an interesting, probably unintended thematic parallel in the magic shop owner, a man of colour who plays to stereotypes associated with his ethnic identity. He's a genuine authority on magic (and American, as we hear when he drops the act,) but he can only pay the bills by talking like a Magic Mysterious Middle Easterner stock character that you often see in Orientalist depictions of the region, and selling shiny baubles to clueless tourists. And the "baubles" are Orbs of Thesulah: rare and valuable artefacts to people who know what they are and what they're for, but literally just expensive paperweights to those who lack the cultural context to understand them. He has to perform other people's expectations of his ethnic identity to pay the bills, and he does it by selling rare and valuable treasures as trinkets. It's an interesting and textured scene thematically for such a minor one.
It wasn't due to a death or anything, but I did have one student teacher in high school, for choir. Dude had grown up with a folk music group, and ran our choir his senior year. It was the best we sounded in my time there.
This is the last of the 4 episodes which made me understand that this show was going to be so much more than the fun slightly campy drama comedy that it started out as Prophecy girl - particularly the library scene Lie to Me Innocence/Surprise Passion
It is pretty funny how every time I watch one of your videos I’m pacing back and forth in my garage pausing periodically to speak out loud as if im speaking to you directly haha. Anyway great video as usual. The rest of the season is going to be fantastic to cover. I think you will be quite satisfied with how this season wraps up.
This is such a great episode. It really brings up the question is Angleus irredeemable at this point? When Buffy says I cant lose you I can do this alone I lose it every time.
Hi Tyler. Great commentary, love your stuff, just wanted to share some of my views about Xander. I have hated Xander a lot during the first three seasons, for his toxic and incel-like behaviour. But in one of my rewatches I realized a couple of things that made me a ton more sympathetic towards his character, whether its justifiable or not you decide. Xander's whole hate towards Angel, and towards Spike in future seasons, its so easy to assume its all because of his jealousy, and I believe it does play a role in initiating the hate for Angel, but somehow his character is way too complex for me to believe that's it. I truly believe that maintaining the intensity of his hate towards the vampires has a lot more to do with his love for his friends, and protectiveness towards them, however misguided it might be. Xander comes from an abusive household, its reasonable to assume that he has seen many many years of his father abusing his mother, while she keeps forgiving him again and again; how his blood must boil whenever Angel hurts Buffy (even before he became soulless, it wasn't exactly a healthy relationship) and she tries to find ways to keep going. He doesn't have much in the way of family, his friends form the essence of his self. Let's keep in mind that his best friend was killed and turned into a vampire in the very first episode. He already had so little, and then that little was taken from him; the loss combined with the betrayal he might have felt at that can more than reasonably justify his black and white attitude regarding humans vs demons. While its true that Angel did have a soul, and that makes him different from other vampires, it still doesn't make him safe to be around, it still doesn't make him any less dangerous, and he has done a LOT of bad in the past. Angel is a really gray area, true right or wrong will decide whether he deserves redemption or punishment, but as far as humans are concerned, everybody has to draw the line within the confines of which they can function. Xander draws that line between humans and demons; Buffy draws that line between souled and unsouled; someone else will probably draw that line between dangerous and safe, or useful or useless. Point is, this is subjective, and maybe Xander's reasoning isn't refined, but he does have very solid reasons for feeling the way he does, and I just cannot blame him for it. Of course this is just one facet of this situation, there are many other threads that can be pulled, would love to hear your thoughts.
Well put! For all the hate Xander gets, he chooses to surround himself with strong women (strength in Buffy, intelligence in Willow, and popularity in Cordy), and, having zero super "powers" of his own, he always _always_ *always* tries to help. It comes off a little like machismo (sorry, that's the spanish word for it), but i think it's mostly genuine "these are my friends and i WILL try to protect them because they matter to me" trope anime-style, you know? For all his faults, i would probably not have minded being his friend in hs.
I truly think Xander is one of the most tragic characters in Buffy the vampire slayer series. His home situation is definitely worst amongst the trio; while Buffy has a single parent household with a mother who perhaps took too long to understand her, and Willow has negligent parents, Xander's family is downright abusive. He has too many insecurities due to that, and while I know that a lot of his suffering is his own fault, that he could make things better for himself if he would only try, but is it really that surprising that he doesn't? He is a teenage boy at a time when teenagers were treated like delinquents, boys were treated as inhuman insensitive idiots (patriarchy harms everyone), abuse was thought to "toughen up kids", and therapy was the devil's poison for lazy whiners. How many of us can really have the courage, wisdom, distinction and resources to try to be better people than the world around us expects us to be, to follow our true conscience instead of ingrained and trained emotional habits? Our morality is guided by our times and society much more than we would be comfortable knowing. Xander does do some terrible things, I really can't deny that, and he does deserve censure, cannot argue with that either, but when I compare his actions with those around him, especially Willow, and realize how he is treated with so very little grace compared to her, for often doing much less egragious things than her, it just brings my own hypocrisy in front of me. This is proof of Alyson Hanigon's magic. All she has to do is look at the camera with her trembling lips and shiny damp eyes, and all my feelings rush to forgive and comfort her. I have come to feel that though Nicholas Brandon is an excellent comedic actor, if only he had been able to give Xander a better tragic performance, a lot of his grievances must have been felt a lot less.
Passion hits me on every level as an episode, more so than Innocence did. The music, the cinematography (not the bad HD remaster, but the original lighting and 4:3 framing), the performances from everyone, the story beats, the mood, all of it (the narration from Angelus is the cherry on top). This one did things I hadn't seen attempted on a TV show before, really diving into what gives Angelus pleasure, which is the suffering of others.
While Xander did have some jeoulsy issues vis a vis Angel/Buffy, and I don't want to minimize those, the core of his dislike for Angel is that Angel is a vampire. Remember aaaaallll the way back to episode 1 part 2, Xander: "I am going to go out on a limb and say they [vampires] are bad." Xander's best friend, Jesse, was killed by vampires, and he has never gotten over that. I do wish the show had mentioned Jesse a few more times after his death, and the impact that would have had on Xander and Willow, but that is the kind of thing that sticks with a person forever. Having said all this, I completely agree with you that Xander did not have a right to say to the others what he did there. He was completely in the wrong to rub his disdain for Angel in their faces.
Going into season 2, trying to figure out who will be the Big Bad of the season, moat assume it is Drusilla and Spike. But then it's revealed that it's actually Angelus, and that makes it hit SO much harder as his villain arc progresses, and most especially in this episode. This is also the way he drove Drusilla insane before he changed her - by going after everyone she loved first (we saw some of that in the previous episode where she talked about him killing her family). He's not just soulless as Angelus. He's creatively cruel, engaging first in psychological torture before going after his true intended target.
To me it's a really interesting question whether Angel and Angelus are two different people. This is also tied up with the question of whether the demon that makes you a vampire means you are no longer "you," even though you're operating with all of your memories and formative experiences and so on. Did Angel have to have these sadistic, obsessive tendencies as a human and the demon only unshackled him from his conscious/any feeling of guilt/whatever allowed himself to regulate these tendencies as a human (or as a vampire with a soul), or could the demon turn him into a totally different person and invent new aspects of his psyche that never existed before he was a vampire? My thoughts changed the more I saw of Angel and of Spike and of other vampires. I look forward to how you end up exploring this as you see more.
At least for now I feel like they're the same person and the lack of soul ADDS a whole bunch of psychotic, sadistic tendencies onto the psyche that already existed rather than shedding any shackles from what already existed. I have zero evidence to back this up though, it's just how I feel 😂 I'd say they're the 'same person' in that sense, but the manifestation of both aspects are different people, to my mind. It's definitely interesting to propose that the things Angelus does is an Angel completely unshackled. You could take it that way for sure, as morally there's precedent to say a lot of us only 'behave' because of the rules we put in place in society, whether that be law or propriety. I think while there were issues with Angel, he was ultimately an innately good person at heart and it seems to me the lack of soul just saps any trace of that from you while layering it over with the psychotic. This is definitely more of a one dimensional view I think though, I'm just not ready to commit to your deeper conversation without knowing more 😜 This isn't me correcting you or anything either by the way, your theory is super interesting and doesn't come across as wrong to me, this is just how I feel right now with my limited view. I'm also holding back fully as I've only seen 2 seasons ish 😅
@@TylerAlexander oh no worries, I know you don't have enough information or data points yet! There are very specific data points I'm thinking of from later seasons of Buffy and from the Angel spinoff, and I'm really looking forward to you encountering each of these data points. But your response makes me think that maybe an analogy is people with damage to their prefrontal cortexes. Some peoples' behavior and personality seems to completely change, like for example a person who previously wouldn't hurt a fly suddenly becoming violently abusive to his family or becoming a serial rapist. Other people seem to be the same as they were before, except they act or say things more impulsively (but the things aren't completely out of character, just... MORE). Maybe for vampires there is a similar range of results depending on how bad the injury is (i.e. maybe some people get a particularly nasty demon), on who they were before they were turned, on what happens to them their first few weeks or months as a vampire, etc.
Although it's never explicitly mentioned, I've always felt there's much more to the Xander/Angel dynamic. I believe it's not just about Xander's jealousy but his deep-seated animosity towards vampires in general. Xander's hatred likely stems from losing Jesse, a friend he'd known as long as Willow. This loss affected him more profoundly than we realize. Every time he saw a vampire, he probably flashed back to killing Jesse, and it seemed unfair that Angel, who caused far more harm than Jesse ever could, wasn't killed immediately by Buffy and was even loved by her. That would be incredibly anger-inducing for Xander. I have a lot more to say about this and why Xander wouldn't discuss it, but I'll save that for when you're further along in the show to avoid spoilers. I just believe that not everything is shown to us about the characters, and Xander's deepest thoughts and feelings are often sidelined or completely overlooked. Additionally, while we often like to pretend that Angel and Angelus are two separate entities, they are not. They are the same demon, with the only difference being that Angel has a soul. Xander never forgets that Angel was a monster and that the monster still lurks just beneath the surface. We shouldn't fault him for being the only one who consistently remembers that.
She wasn’t? Fridging is a sexiest trope referring to female characters being killed or harmed in order to motivate a male character…with the male character also very often being the protagonist. That’s not what’s happening here…by this logic female characters could never die in fiction…
!!!!!! 99% sure this isn’t direct enough to be a spoiler but i thought i’d put a disclaimer here anyway just in case !!!!!! i always ALWAYS end this episode with tears in my eyes because of alyson hannigan’s acting when she finds out about jennys death. it’s. it’s too close to how she acts something else later in the show that scarred me WAY more.
I think up until S2 episode Innocence, it was the best episode so far. However this is where the show went into overdrive. Passion is a superb episode which had absolutely everything and very much a top ten episode from the whole series. The plot really thickens here with Jenny trying to get the way to restore Angel's soul, but Angelus is too strong and clever and foils her attempt with her brutal and shocking murder of a main character. Superb atmospheric narration from David Boreanaz at the start and end of the episode explaining Passion itself. The bit where Giles see's Jenny in the bed lifeless is so cruel, as is Angelus looking in through the window at Buffy and Willow crying, pure evil. The writing here was excellent as we build up to the Season finale with this incredible arc of Season 2. You can really see here how brilliant the Series has now become heading towards a fantastic Season Finale. The ending where the computer disk falls in between the desk is so well done. Superb writing and brilliant acting. Passion is I think a top ten episode from the whole Series.
Angel/Angelus is a sadist. More specifically he is an emotional sadist. He thrives off of causing emotional pain in others. We saw this in how he taunts Spike with Drew, we see this with how he taunted Buffy over her insecurities of their relationship taking a new level. And then we see this in they way he displayed Jenny's body for Giles, but then he watches the reactions of Buffy and Willow when they hear the news. And you are correct that this is inherent to Angel too. When he has a soul, he can't let this sadism out in the same ways, but it is still there. You can see it in how he talks to Xander for example. The way he needles Xander because he doesn't like him. How he used Xander as bait for Spike, and told Xander that he wouldn't have cared if Spike bit him afterwards. And we see it in Angel's combat banter, and how it differs from Buffy's. Buffy's combat banter is playful, and punny. Angel's combat banter drives home to whatever weakness he sees in whoever he is fighting with.
Something this episode in particular, and the Angelus voice over made me think of ….. the whole phenomenon of buffy reactions is a weird thing. We love watching other people enjoy this show. But bits of it, like this episode, aren’t enjoyable, and looking forward to other people being emotionally devastated by what is coming is a bit sick. We, the youtube audience, are becoming Angelus. Joss made us Angelus. But good grief it’s some masterful story telling and the whole show contains some of the best editing and pacing I’ve ever seen in any show ever. There’s an extended story that spike tells another character much later on that is extensively cut through with flashbacks and voice over….that’s all I’ll say, because spoilers, and addicts know which one I mean I’m sure. I think it’s one of the tightest pieces of editing I’ve ever seen. Utterly beautiful. I’m absolutely loving watching the show again through your eyes, I’ve loved it since it came out but you are teaching this old hag new things. Thank you.
When I was in about 3rd grade, I had to go to my brother's class for my Mom to pick us up one day (he was in 7th). The teacher left the room for a moment, said I was in charge and showed me the "paddle" drawer where she had all sorts of paddles. Of course I wasn't really in charge. And she was only gone a few moments. But it did happen. And yes, this was back in the day when seniors could drive the school bus, and teachers could smoke in school (usually the teacher's lounge) and spank kids. I got spanked twice in kindergarten.
fun fact- oz was actually the one who was supposed to die in this ep. the actor who played jenny wouldn't play the role anymore, so they had angelus kill her instead. oz would've been a tie back to willows "glad i didn't have a puppy" since, yk, werewolf.
@@spikescryptz i saw her her interview from VH1: where are the now? from '99. She didn't tell anything about religious. And told that she was sad that her Jenny was dead in time when show was becoming popular. It was Joss Whedon brutal decision, not her. She left acting in early's '00. After 2002. Religious came later.
You make a great point about how the stakes are real now that Angelus killed Jenny, and the writers successfully got the audience rooting against Angel, which is pretty impressive. IIRC they say on the commentary that they chose to have him snap Jenny’s neck, rather that bite her, because they weren’t sure they could pull off redeeming him if we actually had that tragic shot of him feeding on her.
Love your buffy reactions. Really can’t wait for your take on characters as they grow and change (well most of them). I always look forward to these. Thank you!
A lot of people give Xander a bad wrap because of how quick he is to behave this way, which I get. But so many people make this about his jealousy towards Angel when I don't think he's actually jealous or even pinning for Buffy the way he did in season 1. Xander's been trying to work through those feelings for Buffy with honest effort, I think. When he says he hated Angel long before everyone else, I think that statement is both true and false. When Angel is good, I think Xander has made an honest effort at times to be cordial with him. To be fair Angel isn't always the most respectful of Xander either. But I also think Xander has always been aware of the threat that Angel's existence holds, soul or no soul. He can't really decipher Angel any differently than all the other vampires they kill on a daily basis. In a way Xander is pretty xenophobic, but the writing of the show kinda creates that problem. I believe Giles is pretty similar (after all he pretty much taught Xander to think of every vampire as the same after Jesse died), but Giles is also less vocal and more mature about it. He understands that Buffy has to make up her own mind and live through her own experiences.
Note many people distinguish Angel from Angelus, but I thunk this is more question than fact. Take the barrier for example, Buffy invited Angel not Angelus, yet the invite extends to both.
I was curious as to how emotional Tyler would get in this episode considering how critical he views episodes. Considering he's so analitical, I'm not surprised he saw it coming and he wasn't as worried, so much as he accepted her upcoming death. What not everyone always notices is that the school is a public building, so Angel has a free invitation, therefore he is toying with Jenny's fear over nt understanding that when he says the latin sign invited him in. The same goes for him running directly into the cleaning cart. He is allowing Jenny to feel she has the upper hand while he goes the back way. Don't get me started on the Willow as a teacher storyline. In-universe (not the writing), the school authorities belong in jail. They are clearly wanting to not pay a substitute and somebody is pocketing money (perhaps to use it for other school something or whoever pays the teachers directly just puts it in their own pocket). Lots of laws are being broken along the way, though. I would respect Xander's opinion of Angelus needing to die (even while not agreeing with it) if he didn't say he hated Angel before Angel was Angelus and therefore everyone else should get on board with his opinion of killing Angelus. That tells me Xander is still talking from a place of jealousy and not from a look at all the horrible things Angelus has done place. If he brought up issues like Angelus pulling him through Buffy's window and trying to turn him in the last episode I would get it, but explaining he hated Angelus before he had a reason to and urging the idea of Giles getting killed through revenge doesn't make me see his opinion as clearly as he is trying to push it. And Buffy punching Giles for trying to get himself killed makes me believe Buffy didn't agree with Xander's opinion despite telling him "you're right." She just knew what Xander wasn't thinking; which was that Giles was going to die if he did it the way Xander was hoping for and the way Giles ended up doing it. I love hearing a reaction viewer say, everything I've always said about the moment and cap it off with, "Disrespectfully Xander, F&%?# off!" That made my day for this moment and this opinion Xander has.
I also think Sunnydale has a reputation for not being a safe place for teachers and substitute teachers alike, and heck, their last principal was eaten! The may not even have had a librarian before Giles showed up.. 😉 Still, they are definitely violating labor laws and probably a lot of other statutes as well. On the other hand, we know at least some of the folks in law enforcement have some knowledge of the supernatural, based on what we saw in School Hard: "Snyder tells the police chief to say that the trouble was caused by a gang on PCP. When the chief wonders if people will believe it, Snyder asks if he'd rather tell the truth." With Snyder and the police chief apparently knowing some stuff, it makes sense that others in the city administration know stuff as well - and probably hide stuff from outsiders. So not following the proper procedures for teaching doesn't surprise me at all.
@@ernesthakey3396 SPOILERS FOR SEASON THREE DON'T READ IF YOU HAVEN'T SEEN THROUGH (NOT TO, BUT THROUGH) SEASON THREE I've said as much myself, and if long term fans think about it all that stuff, including Willow's teaching ties back to The Mayor because of him being in charge of such a corrupt system and town and/or because he's so corrupt/evil.
It's a weird thing to note, I suppose, but Angelus killing Jenny by snapping her neck is almost an insult in itself. Usually vampires would drain their victims, probably out of enjoyment, but he didn't even think her worth anything to him but swatting her down like killing a fly. And then he brings her to Giles like a cat bringing its master a dead rat, and arranges her "artfully" to inflict the most emotional damage possible upon Giles. Cold and brutal, that Angelus. This episode is gut wrenching.
Re: Xander, exactly. I like Xander, but this is one of those moments when I agree with the Xander critics. It's good Giles didn't kill Dru, since Drusilla and Jenny are their own characters, that would be kind of like trading a man's girlfriend for another man's girlfriend, kind of icky. 20:18
Buffy theme just starting up... UA-cam interrupts with an ad. Me: How DARE you interrupt Tyler's jamming out to the Buffy theme!?! Shame, UA-cam, shame on you. 😄🤣😉
Always hated this episode, but purely because every time I see it I want her to escape. It really is a fantastic episode though, but a bit too much of a setup for everything becoming right for Jenny and Giles, so in your heart of hearts you know she's not going to make her getaway from Angel. Maybe her and Giles working towards that goal last episode would have helped... but then all that would do is make it hurt more. I'd like to try defend Xander by saying he's upset and angry at Jenny's death so lashing out, but tbh I remember that Xander did annoy me at times with his whole hating Angel thing when I first watched it, so valid.
Angelus loves to break people It doesn't matter the age four gender The demon Angeles enjoys isolating people and taking away everything from them to the point where they only have their own life and then and only then he takes it sometimes he doesn't even silver person we just leaves them to suffer And with drewsila He found a way to make that torture eternal... He doesn't care that the thing that he is torturing isn't the human or the soul anymore He doesn't even care that it is a demon he just enjoys the torture. That being said... It's not that he can't kill Buffy (the only thing stopping him is Buffy herself) it's that he enjoys the torturing of Buffy too much to kill her. From his point of view killing Buffy would be far from the worst he could do to her. And he enjoys doing the worst
You cut a lot of moments it is a little quick but i think it is important to react at more moments this show is really great and needing to focus on lines, everything is intersting and useful even for later episodes
Pretty pretty please don't take too long to watch the rest of this season! I can't wait to hear your thoughts on these final episodes and on season 2 as a whole, you're always so insightful! I agree with you that it's absolute bullshit of Xander to try to pat himself on the back for hating Angel before he lost his soul, but... he is supposed to be a 17 year-old boy (something that often gets lost bc Nick B. sooo doesn't look like a highschooler), and something very traumatic just happened in his friend circle. Much like the theme of this episode, passion is driving him too.
‼️okay this one’s definitely a SPOILER so tyler no peaking‼️ truely all i could do as he was talking about knowing how angel ends up because of the first middle last video but wanting him to die is sing hannah montana best of both worlds. hilariously, knowing the future has made him less likely to entertain possibilities that he can extrapolate from the current text - correct ones.
It would be worse quality if the allegory was on purpose, case in point: all the 'lesson of the week' episodes. In some ways, it would be worse if it really was an allegory, and not just a character going through something.
if you touched on this in the episode and i missed it i'm sorry, but the thing that has always stood out to me about jenny's death is the way angel just snaps her neck. it's like the biggest "add insult to injury" that he, as a vampire, didn't even bother drinking her blood.
@@TylerAlexander My head canon is that Angel/Angelus has sworn off drinking Romani blood ever since that one girl ended up getting him cursed. It leaves a bad taste in his mouth...so to speak.
@@GeorgiannaMiller5 Meh, you could make the case for Angel too. Possessive, definitely encouraging an inappropriate relationship with a minor, literal stalking as seen in the first ep and confirmed later, etc.
Thank you for pointing out that Xander was jealous of Angel the nice human out of sheer sexual/romantic jealousy. He had no idea that there would be Angelus the demon. And with ableism, yeah, I grew up extremely right-wing and capitalist and although I never disparaged or insulted someone for having a disability, ableism was still a huge blind spot for me in regards to public policy/accomodation. One hears about "inclusive" events that people with disabilities have no way to attend and aren't listened to.
Omg u talk too much. We're looking for a reaction but you cut out the best scenes like Willow crying on the phone. I personally want an emotional response.
@@TylerAlexander cuz I'm an emotional person. It's like the most important part of why this episode is such an important part of this show. Showing how dark the storyline gets. You totally overlook it while showing no emotion about some of the scenes you cut out. This season is an art form of what makes Buffy powerful and you completely ignore it with scenes that aren't that important.
@@amillan2004 considering your name 'queerNB' you're surprisingly, and disappointingly narrow-minded. I'll put this at the top of the reply as I don't know if you'll read to the end - if you continue to conduct yourself this way in the comments I'll just block you. Fair warning. And I truly hope you learn something from this reply rather than lashing out for a third time. Not everyone shows emotion the same way but that doesn't mean either way is invalid, and differentiating this the way you do belittles people at a foundational level, and you should be ashamed of this kind of behaviour. It's fine to be an emotional person, but not at the expense of beating someone else with it. I had a pretty productive conversation on my Patreon with someone who actually inquired about why I didn't cry or show overt emotion in a polite/constructive way. I won't rehash that all here but the tldr on that is that I WAS upset by what happens. My energy drops and I talk pretty solemnly by the end which were the tells for that, and while this might not be satisfying in the same way as overt tears to you, it doesnt mean I didnt show any emotion at all. This feeds into my second point and addressing your initial comment. My content is analysis focused. This comes under the reaction umbrella but reactions are not why people come here. I've cried in videos before (Haunting of Hill House), and if the emotion gets too much I feel it, but what happens this episode happens so quick and the focus shifts so fast to Giles, worry for him, and the events that follow that this acts as adequate distraction and as a re-focus for my analysis. Because of this I control what I feel and the raw emotion doesn't hit me as hard, and I provide what people come to my videos for; analysis. Not all people or reactors are going to be the same, that's just the genre of video. I'll round this out by saying this. Coming into a comment section and using the universal 'we' as if you're speaking for the masses (you're the minority here, trust me), is such pretentious privilege. Announcing your own expectations as if the whole world should cater to YOU does not array you in a positive light, and declaring you're an 'emotional' person as if that justifies you coming in and getting personal towards a creator is dismissive and rude. If you don't like the style of content go watch someone else that caters to you. 'I'm an emotional person' isn't a reason to behave this way. I directly comment on Jenny's death, the overarching theme of passion, and the events of the episode as well as the darkness you say I didnt mention. This isn't 'totally overlook'ing the storyline. If you can't sit still for 20-30 minutes unless you see someone react in the 'perfect way' to you, the issue isn't my video it's the expectations you held and your inability to channel your emotions in a positive manner.
@@amillan2004 There are many BtVS reactors out there and they all watch the show in their own way, which is their perogative.Tyler's way is less emotional and more analytical and many of us enjoy that. There are certainly enough other creators out there who can be more emotional. I suggest you find those if you don't like his style and not berate him for not being emotional enough for your taste.
Giles tells Buffy not to let Angel provoke her and by the climax it's Buffy trying to restrain Giles. What a powerful reversal and continues the theme of teenagers being wiser than adults at times. The ambiguity of adolescence.
Giles _says_ these things because he _knows_ them. Buffy _does_ these things because she _feels_ them.
It's like how you can objectively know about your own cosmic insignificance, but it plays no part in your actions because you don't _feel_ that knowledge. Likewise you can act on your own cosmic insignificance because you feel it, but with no exposure to philosophy, why you do what you do may never even cross your mind despite being part of you. It's their characters in a nutshell. Giles is cerebral, Buffy is substance. She has substance but can't reach her full potential without receiving and incorporating his cerebral understanding of her nature, her situation, and her goals. He can give her guidance, but without her substance his knowledge has no action and is arguably worthless.
I would say they mutually brought about this outcome through the joining of their opposing perspectives. They have what I imagine to be a rare example of a healthy, peer-to-peer watcher/slayer dynamic. This incident is a perfect example of it, and I like that you pointed it out, even if we interpreted it differently.
We heard Angel was ‘one of the worst vampires’ before he had a soul and in this episode you really see how sadistic he is. Vampires kill to survive, but we don’t see him do anything along those lines here. We just see him revel in cruelty itself. It gives us a new insight into the guilt that was torturing the souled Angel.
Huge props to the writing and David Boreanaz's performance. It would have been so easy to mess up a character like Angelus - it's a lot easier to _describe_ someone as the absolute worst person to ever exist than it is to convincingly show it, but Angelus is so central to this season's plot that they had to do it, and he had to live up to the hype. It was a tough needle to thread and they absolutely nailed it.
It's especially impressive given that Angel hadn't exactly been a demanding role up to this point- it wasn't nothing, he had to at least have good chemistry with Sarah Michelle Gellar, but most early episodes didn't require much more from him than brooding, looking guilty and being ridiculously attractive. ...Then suddenly the story completely hinges on him and he has to convincingly play a character who's completely different than Angel, and has to juggle menace, humour, villainous charisma and petty dickery. He needs to be extremely entertaining and completely loathsome at the same time. And Boreanaz hadn't had many roles by this point, this was, I think, only his third credited role. They expected a lot from a mostly untested actor, but he delivered in spades.
Yeah, he didn't feed, just snapped her neck.
@@Marwolaeth01 I feel like that was intentional. To make a point. Trivialize her death. Mock them, essentially. By emphasizing the pointlessness, that he didn't get anything out of it at all but their suffering.
@@l.s.d.5863 yup
@@l.s.d.5863yeah that was the point she had nothing he wanted but her suffering and his cruelty for what her people did to him.
This episode is from '98. I graduated HS in '91, so not exactly the same, but close. Our Computer teacher had a crew of us students that acted as teachers assistants in other classes. If she couldn't make a class the substitute who was assigned would just let us run the show since they knew nothing about computers at all. Qualified Programming teachers are hard to find today, but in the '90s most teachers didn't even have an email account.
Exactly. One of my high school computer teachers was the old typing teacher...who mostly focused on giving us "typing tests" from the old typewriter textbooks...because what else would you use a computer for? 🙄
Class of '00 here, one year younger than Buffy and co. I was a teacher's aide for my Spanish teacher, the librarian, and in the office. Kids definitely did things around school for the experience. So even beyond computers, I would think it's possible to let a kid lead the class if the teacher was out. We still always had a sub lol. But still, I could easily see it in Willow's case
I graduated in ‘99, and the computer classes I had were exactly like this!
03, here. We had student teachers in many classes over the years. They'd work as TAs most of the time, and would fill in for them for short periods if needed. Was most common in subjects where it was hard to find a knowledgeable substitute. And computer science would absolutely be one of those subjects in the late 90s.
The music playing when Giles find Jenny is from Puccini’s La Boheme, the scene where the lovers meet, I believe, just to make it extra painful. That whole setup, the roses, the candles, the music; it’s agony to watch because you already know what’s coming; the show didn’t leave you thinking maybe Jenny made it out, so you’re forced to watch Giles smile at the romantic gesture when you know, you KNOW, that it’s the opposite… it’s so brilliantly staged, lit and performed so that the death really hits you. Then there is the fall out, the other characters reacting. I can even forgive the very shitty thing Xander said, because he’s dealing with the loss too, and while he’s saying ‘I told you so’, inside I think it’s more like ‘why couldn’t I stop this’. Doesn’t make it less ugly, but grief can bring out that kind of ugliness in people. They are all hurting.
SPOILER FOR THE SEQUEL SERIES SEASON THREE
That makes this episode a great callback for AtS 3x13 when Angel says Angelus cried during _Giselle._
There’s a small character moment in this I dig; when Angelus destroys the computer, he’s only really smashed the monitor because he’s never bothered to learn anything about them. No idea if that was a writing choice or an acting choice (or, let’s be fair: if I’m reading too much into it). Assuming I’m not, full marks to whoever made that happen.
no, this was absolutely intentional
@GeorgiannaMiller5 I figured, but I also know my brain has…shall we say, an excitable pattern recognition system? :) So I like to add disclaimers when it’s not obvious. Thanks for confirming! 👍
@@noahrobin1941 First off, I love that you know that about yourself.
@l.s.d.5863 Regarding my brain: thanks, it only took me several decades to suss! And there’s stuff I definitely didn’t pick up until the umpteenth viewing, for various reasons. One of my faves is a blink-and-you-miss-it later this season; will call attention at the appropriate time. ;)
If they planned to make it about Angelus' know-how, there wouldn't have been a floppy disc. It's a cinematography choice, most likely, because glass looks cooler being smashed than a random computer box. Screens are always being smashed in movies all over the place.
This episode always makes me cry. I really liked Miss Calendar. The raw disbelief and pain on Giles' face and Willow's reaction crush me every time.
Willow covering the class makes a touch more sense in the time period...when I was in school, most students knew more about computers than any/all of the teachers, save the computer teacher.
I figured that given the mortality rate of teachers in this school that they'd simply run out of substitutes. :)
@@airawynsummers Ha!🤣
@@airawynsummers It was Willow or a praying mantis so I think they made the best choice.
Agree on all counts. Also principal Snyder just loves to ‘volunteer’ students to do things; so a perfect Snyder moment we don’t get to see. 🙃.
Up until now, we've really only heard about the cruel things Angelus was capable of from Giles books, but now with Jenny's brutal murder and the staging of her body, we see our core group experience the cruelty firsthand, he made it real for them. Throughout the episode, we see just how at risk they all were. The stakes are much higher now.
Excellent reaction as always 🙂
This is definitely a "point of no return" episode, for Angellus's arc, and for anyone watching. I challenge anyone to reach this episode and choose not to keep watching!
It's such a beautiful episode. I love the way Angellus describes "the ecstasy of grief". That's a line that has always stuck with me. Grief and passion go hand in hand. The more passionately you care for someone, the more powerful grief is. Grief is love continuing when a person is gone. It is passion. A passionate longing for someone who is gone.
The moment when Giles ascends the stairs and discovers Jenny, music from the opera La Bohéme is playing in the background. "La Bohéme" translates to "the bohemian", or - "gypsy".
I've watched this show a million times, and I still pick up new things every time. lol
Love that Dru names the puppy "Sunshine"- along with stakes and beheading, one of the 3 sure-fire ways to kill a vampire.
And then tells Spike to eat it.
Dru. Drusilla. Wha- Whatcha doin, hun?
The piece of music that plays at the end at the graveyard, "Remembering Jenny", have vocals (or rather laments) by Anthony Stewart Head. Such a nice touch. And it was later sampled by Ed Sheeran for his "Afire Love".
The music in this really fits the mood to help work up even more tears if you weren't crying enough already. And even the creepy parts had special creepy music. So definitely the music in the show had come a long way since the music in season one.
@@gungho1284 yeah Christoph Beck was brought on during S2 and he really increased the quality of the music.
@@Henrik_Holst I will call it "Buffy/Angel Love Theme" here, but that piece of music is still one of my favourites.
okay i know you can’t use most of the music in this episode for copywrite reasons but god DAMN is it good. once my dad was watching me bopping my head listening to music in headphones and asked what i was listening to. it was. it was the passion score.
Was so keen for you to get to this episode. The music and the narration really just make it a standout. It's the point of no return for the Angelus arc, yes from a story pov Jenny was somewhat disposable and not really in the core group but the fact that he's killed a character we know and who has intimate connections with our core group, it changes things and cements that Angel is the big bad of the season. He's not getting turned back easily or in a way where his actions don't have serious emotional ramifications not just on Buffy but on the wider group as well.
Absolutely, I think making the consequences of this arc matter more fully is, while more painful, definitely the way to go. It's what makes people sit on the edge of their seat. I think as a character and a big bad he surpasses the Master at this point for me.
@@TylerAlexander that makes sense, there’s so much more emotion tied into angelous as the Big Bad than there was with the master. the master was just a straight up villain that wanted chaos and the end of the world and buffy was standing in front of that but angel… angel wants to hurt her.
As a wheelchair user, your insights about Spike and ableism are spot on. The infantilization people immediately put on you (even if they don't know you) is extreme. People just assume that wheelchair users are intellectually disabled too, and/or that we're so sensitive that they have to treat us like children. It doesn't help that there is definitely some resentment on both ends when someone's health changes quickly, like Spike's did. Spike is resentful at his body's new limitations and the way he's being treated because of it. Dru is resentful that she's having to adapt to Spike's new needs and that she has been robbed of her playmate for the foreseeable future. It's a lot, and it sucks
Buffy HAS to feel every murder that Angelus commits as a personal failure. Between assuming her direct responsibility over him losing his soul, her inability to stake him when he was at her mercy and worst of all, not killing him at her door-before he killed Jenny-plus Theresa and numerous other innocent bystanders, the guilt and horror is just piling up...and she's still in love with him.
She knows and accepts her Duty...but she STILL loves him.
One of my favorite episodes. I can't tell you how many times I have cried myself through it and how much it has helped me process some of the trauma I have experienced in my life. Great analysis.
In Innocence, Buffy has the dream where she discovers that Jenny knew about the Curse,
Angel: "First you have to know what to look for."
switch scene, Jenny Calander wearing all black lifts here black veil to reveal her face.
end dream
Buffy's dreams are prophetic. Not only did this dream reveal the truth about Jenny Calander, the location of Jenny Calender in the dream was a funeral. Buffy was being shown that Jenny was going to die soon. And since it was Angel who revealed the scene to Buffy in her dream, it was also revealed that Angel was going to kill her. Never forget that Buffy's dreams are prophesy.
Most people are shocked by Willow teaching that class but they forget how hard it would have been to find a computer teacher in 1997, especially one more competent with computers than willow. Let willow get that AP credit
Absolutely. it could have counted as an elective class credit for Willow, or even internship experience to put towards a career in teaching (if she ever wanted to go that route).
As someone with a severe disability that's left me housebound for almost 15 years, I really really appreciated everything you said about disability. I'm lucky that the WFH push during the pandemic finally allowed me to get a good job that gives me the freedom and independence to build a good life, but the years before that were very isolated and vulnerable, and I often felt the need to "perform" as the happiest person in the world just to maintain some kind of social network and not drive away the people I depended on. It's a difficult way to live, and I only survived because this internet/communications age allows me to have a presence and impact outside the home. What Spike needs is a smartphone.
20:10 "Respectfully... Naah, disrespectfully, Xander, f*ck off" - beautifully put 😂
Never clicked so fast! Getting real indeed.
Thank you for sharing your thoughts on the disability aspect of Spike's arc! I don't remember seeing this perspective explored before (and I've read my share of BtVS meta back in the days).
It reminds me of when I became physically disabled and my brother continued his "sibling banter". I eventually had to stand up for myself and say that I've never understood the difference between "banter" and bullying and that now I'm disabled I can't take it anymore. I experience shame about being disabled from so many places, externally and internally, I want my family to be kind and supportive. I'm glad I stood up for myself because he has been kind and supportive ever since x
@@Scarygothgirl Thanks for sharing, I'm glad you found that support in your brother! ❤️
Thanks for the disability discussion. I’m long term disabled and rely on other people for housing. On top of that I need surgery on both knees and currently cannot walk. I do my very best to keep taking care of myself as much as possible. I just found out that for the past five months I have been doing all this with a fractured rib! And I still try not to come off as needy or dramatic.
Thinking back to when I originally first watched this show, this is the episode that hooked me .Before this I was on and off watching as an interested viewer, but Passion was the episode that made this show a can't miss show moving forward. The scene between Giles and Buffy hugging still gets to me, their bond is so strong, one of my favorite relationships in the entire show.
I was so excited for you to get to this episode, it’s the point where I truly fell in love with this series. It may not be perfect but it never holds back.
Computer Lab in the 90's? Yeah we absolutely had on occasion one of the ace students cover or fill in. Not long term susbtitues mind you, but covering it in a pinch sure. Even in my area which had a really well funded school system back then, there just weren't enough people around that knew the first thing about computers let alone could teach a class.
Regarding Xander; While its undeniable he has a incredibly questionable motivation for hating Angel, he is nonetheless basically the only character that consistently treats Angel and similar demons like they are actually dangerous horror movie creatures with a body count that the show says they are. He sees Angel as a, in his world, real life Jason Vorheese or Xenomorph that could snap and murder all of them at any time but frequently the other characters tend to lack that sense of apprehension or concern around them.
"consistently treats...demons like they are actually dangerous horror movie creatures"? Um...
@@JagoBC She's just a human for the majority of the time. But yes the entire show really never addresses her past the way it should have considering she likely has the biggest body count of any of the recurring demons. The show also generally treats her horrible actions as comedic beats which is definitely a mistep of the writing.
I've been looking forward to your reaction and analysis of this episode, and you certainly didn't disappoint!
“Poor emotional control” describes Xander perfectly, and definitely toxic moments. 😂 I loved the moment where Spike kept Dru from helping Angel and just wanted to watch him get beat down. My favorite moment of this episode. Overall, I appreciate how dark this goes to truly highlight Angelus’ sadism, and the contrast between him and Spike. If you recall, Spike “stink[s] of humanity” and Angelus has “no humanity in him,” per the Judge who could sense humanity. It’s fascinating how the show is starting to show us more complex vampires with full personalities.
SPOILER
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
It's implied later on Xander grew up in an abusive household those tendencies rubbed off on him. He breaks off his wedding later because he was worried he would repeat the cycle.
There's also a theory I heard that he tends to be attracted to "strong women" because of this, subconsciously thinking they can hold their own if he gets toxic. That would explain why he only becomes attracted to Willow when she starts using magic and getting more confident.
@@XavionofThera Dang, good points. i never thought of it that way.
@@XavionofThera Even with the lead and spoiler alert, why do people keep trying to spoil the show for Tyler? He only knows what he's seen so far, Gingerbread, and the finale. There is *zero* need to spoil anything else. Putting a spoiler as a reply to my own comment is rude. I know what Xander's deal is and his character arc; I've seen the series over 15 times. But if there's any chance Tyler could see this comment (hopefully he doesn't), then it should be removed as a courtesy to him.
@@ravenlord7144 ????? The idea of the "SPOILER" tag is so that he doesn't read it. And that anyone who doesn't want spoilers doesn't read it. The spacing means that you have to willingly click "read more..." to read it.
Regarding your talk about disabled people having to "perform" to get by:
One, thank you. That was very gratifying to hear, and
Two, it has an interesting, probably unintended thematic parallel in the magic shop owner, a man of colour who plays to stereotypes associated with his ethnic identity. He's a genuine authority on magic (and American, as we hear when he drops the act,) but he can only pay the bills by talking like a Magic Mysterious Middle Easterner stock character that you often see in Orientalist depictions of the region, and selling shiny baubles to clueless tourists. And the "baubles" are Orbs of Thesulah: rare and valuable artefacts to people who know what they are and what they're for, but literally just expensive paperweights to those who lack the cultural context to understand them. He has to perform other people's expectations of his ethnic identity to pay the bills, and he does it by selling rare and valuable treasures as trinkets. It's an interesting and textured scene thematically for such a minor one.
It wasn't due to a death or anything, but I did have one student teacher in high school, for choir. Dude had grown up with a folk music group, and ran our choir his senior year. It was the best we sounded in my time there.
This is the last of the 4 episodes which made me understand that this show was going to be so much more than the fun slightly campy drama comedy that it started out as
Prophecy girl - particularly the library scene
Lie to Me
Innocence/Surprise
Passion
It is pretty funny how every time I watch one of your videos I’m pacing back and forth in my garage pausing periodically to speak out loud as if im speaking to you directly haha. Anyway great video as usual. The rest of the season is going to be fantastic to cover. I think you will be quite satisfied with how this season wraps up.
Haha, I do that as well. 😂
This is such a great episode. It really brings up the question is Angleus irredeemable at this point? When Buffy says I cant lose you I can do this alone I lose it every time.
Hi Tyler. Great commentary, love your stuff, just wanted to share some of my views about Xander. I have hated Xander a lot during the first three seasons, for his toxic and incel-like behaviour. But in one of my rewatches I realized a couple of things that made me a ton more sympathetic towards his character, whether its justifiable or not you decide. Xander's whole hate towards Angel, and towards Spike in future seasons, its so easy to assume its all because of his jealousy, and I believe it does play a role in initiating the hate for Angel, but somehow his character is way too complex for me to believe that's it. I truly believe that maintaining the intensity of his hate towards the vampires has a lot more to do with his love for his friends, and protectiveness towards them, however misguided it might be. Xander comes from an abusive household, its reasonable to assume that he has seen many many years of his father abusing his mother, while she keeps forgiving him again and again; how his blood must boil whenever Angel hurts Buffy (even before he became soulless, it wasn't exactly a healthy relationship) and she tries to find ways to keep going. He doesn't have much in the way of family, his friends form the essence of his self. Let's keep in mind that his best friend was killed and turned into a vampire in the very first episode. He already had so little, and then that little was taken from him; the loss combined with the betrayal he might have felt at that can more than reasonably justify his black and white attitude regarding humans vs demons.
While its true that Angel did have a soul, and that makes him different from other vampires, it still doesn't make him safe to be around, it still doesn't make him any less dangerous, and he has done a LOT of bad in the past. Angel is a really gray area, true right or wrong will decide whether he deserves redemption or punishment, but as far as humans are concerned, everybody has to draw the line within the confines of which they can function. Xander draws that line between humans and demons; Buffy draws that line between souled and unsouled; someone else will probably draw that line between dangerous and safe, or useful or useless. Point is, this is subjective, and maybe Xander's reasoning isn't refined, but he does have very solid reasons for feeling the way he does, and I just cannot blame him for it. Of course this is just one facet of this situation, there are many other threads that can be pulled, would love to hear your thoughts.
Well put! For all the hate Xander gets, he chooses to surround himself with strong women (strength in Buffy, intelligence in Willow, and popularity in Cordy), and, having zero super "powers" of his own, he always _always_ *always* tries to help.
It comes off a little like machismo (sorry, that's the spanish word for it), but i think it's mostly genuine "these are my friends and i WILL try to protect them because they matter to me" trope anime-style, you know?
For all his faults, i would probably not have minded being his friend in hs.
I truly think Xander is one of the most tragic characters in Buffy the vampire slayer series. His home situation is definitely worst amongst the trio; while Buffy has a single parent household with a mother who perhaps took too long to understand her, and Willow has negligent parents, Xander's family is downright abusive. He has too many insecurities due to that, and while I know that a lot of his suffering is his own fault, that he could make things better for himself if he would only try, but is it really that surprising that he doesn't? He is a teenage boy at a time when teenagers were treated like delinquents, boys were treated as inhuman insensitive idiots (patriarchy harms everyone), abuse was thought to "toughen up kids", and therapy was the devil's poison for lazy whiners. How many of us can really have the courage, wisdom, distinction and resources to try to be better people than the world around us expects us to be, to follow our true conscience instead of ingrained and trained emotional habits? Our morality is guided by our times and society much more than we would be comfortable knowing.
Xander does do some terrible things, I really can't deny that, and he does deserve censure, cannot argue with that either, but when I compare his actions with those around him, especially Willow, and realize how he is treated with so very little grace compared to her, for often doing much less egragious things than her, it just brings my own hypocrisy in front of me. This is proof of Alyson Hanigon's magic. All she has to do is look at the camera with her trembling lips and shiny damp eyes, and all my feelings rush to forgive and comfort her. I have come to feel that though Nicholas Brandon is an excellent comedic actor, if only he had been able to give Xander a better tragic performance, a lot of his grievances must have been felt a lot less.
Passion hits me on every level as an episode, more so than Innocence did. The music, the cinematography (not the bad HD remaster, but the original lighting and 4:3 framing), the performances from everyone, the story beats, the mood, all of it (the narration from Angelus is the cherry on top). This one did things I hadn't seen attempted on a TV show before, really diving into what gives Angelus pleasure, which is the suffering of others.
While Xander did have some jeoulsy issues vis a vis Angel/Buffy, and I don't want to minimize those, the core of his dislike for Angel is that Angel is a vampire. Remember aaaaallll the way back to episode 1 part 2, Xander: "I am going to go out on a limb and say they [vampires] are bad." Xander's best friend, Jesse, was killed by vampires, and he has never gotten over that. I do wish the show had mentioned Jesse a few more times after his death, and the impact that would have had on Xander and Willow, but that is the kind of thing that sticks with a person forever. Having said all this, I completely agree with you that Xander did not have a right to say to the others what he did there. He was completely in the wrong to rub his disdain for Angel in their faces.
This is in my top 10 of episodes. Top tier.
Going into season 2, trying to figure out who will be the Big Bad of the season, moat assume it is Drusilla and Spike. But then it's revealed that it's actually Angelus, and that makes it hit SO much harder as his villain arc progresses, and most especially in this episode. This is also the way he drove Drusilla insane before he changed her - by going after everyone she loved first (we saw some of that in the previous episode where she talked about him killing her family). He's not just soulless as Angelus. He's creatively cruel, engaging first in psychological torture before going after his true intended target.
To me it's a really interesting question whether Angel and Angelus are two different people. This is also tied up with the question of whether the demon that makes you a vampire means you are no longer "you," even though you're operating with all of your memories and formative experiences and so on. Did Angel have to have these sadistic, obsessive tendencies as a human and the demon only unshackled him from his conscious/any feeling of guilt/whatever allowed himself to regulate these tendencies as a human (or as a vampire with a soul), or could the demon turn him into a totally different person and invent new aspects of his psyche that never existed before he was a vampire?
My thoughts changed the more I saw of Angel and of Spike and of other vampires. I look forward to how you end up exploring this as you see more.
At least for now I feel like they're the same person and the lack of soul ADDS a whole bunch of psychotic, sadistic tendencies onto the psyche that already existed rather than shedding any shackles from what already existed. I have zero evidence to back this up though, it's just how I feel 😂 I'd say they're the 'same person' in that sense, but the manifestation of both aspects are different people, to my mind. It's definitely interesting to propose that the things Angelus does is an Angel completely unshackled. You could take it that way for sure, as morally there's precedent to say a lot of us only 'behave' because of the rules we put in place in society, whether that be law or propriety.
I think while there were issues with Angel, he was ultimately an innately good person at heart and it seems to me the lack of soul just saps any trace of that from you while layering it over with the psychotic. This is definitely more of a one dimensional view I think though, I'm just not ready to commit to your deeper conversation without knowing more 😜
This isn't me correcting you or anything either by the way, your theory is super interesting and doesn't come across as wrong to me, this is just how I feel right now with my limited view. I'm also holding back fully as I've only seen 2 seasons ish 😅
@@TylerAlexander oh no worries, I know you don't have enough information or data points yet! There are very specific data points I'm thinking of from later seasons of Buffy and from the Angel spinoff, and I'm really looking forward to you encountering each of these data points.
But your response makes me think that maybe an analogy is people with damage to their prefrontal cortexes. Some peoples' behavior and personality seems to completely change, like for example a person who previously wouldn't hurt a fly suddenly becoming violently abusive to his family or becoming a serial rapist. Other people seem to be the same as they were before, except they act or say things more impulsively (but the things aren't completely out of character, just... MORE). Maybe for vampires there is a similar range of results depending on how bad the injury is (i.e. maybe some people get a particularly nasty demon), on who they were before they were turned, on what happens to them their first few weeks or months as a vampire, etc.
One of my favorite episodes...its a stand out for sure
Episode broke my heart. I crushed on Jenny SO much.
Although it's never explicitly mentioned, I've always felt there's much more to the Xander/Angel dynamic. I believe it's not just about Xander's jealousy but his deep-seated animosity towards vampires in general. Xander's hatred likely stems from losing Jesse, a friend he'd known as long as Willow. This loss affected him more profoundly than we realize. Every time he saw a vampire, he probably flashed back to killing Jesse, and it seemed unfair that Angel, who caused far more harm than Jesse ever could, wasn't killed immediately by Buffy and was even loved by her. That would be incredibly anger-inducing for Xander.
I have a lot more to say about this and why Xander wouldn't discuss it, but I'll save that for when you're further along in the show to avoid spoilers. I just believe that not everything is shown to us about the characters, and Xander's deepest thoughts and feelings are often sidelined or completely overlooked.
Additionally, while we often like to pretend that Angel and Angelus are two separate entities, they are not. They are the same demon, with the only difference being that Angel has a soul. Xander never forgets that Angel was a monster and that the monster still lurks just beneath the surface. We shouldn't fault him for being the only one who consistently remembers that.
I'm still not over Jenny Calendar being fridged.
She wasn’t? Fridging is a sexiest trope referring to female characters being killed or harmed in order to motivate a male character…with the male character also very often being the protagonist. That’s not what’s happening here…by this logic female characters could never die in fiction…
@@nagelhautentferner "logic" 😂. Bless your heart.
!!!!!! 99% sure this isn’t direct enough to be a spoiler but i thought i’d put a disclaimer here anyway just in case !!!!!!
i always ALWAYS end this episode with tears in my eyes because of alyson hannigan’s acting when she finds out about jennys death. it’s. it’s too close to how she acts something else later in the show that scarred me WAY more.
*Spoiler quote*
.
.
.
"Your shirt..."
@@JhadeSagrav evil.
@@chelsjones believe me, it hurt just to type it. 😭😭😭 Was that the scene you meant?
@@JhadeSagrav yes 😭😭
Thanks for another amazingly well-thought out reaction. And I love seeing glimpses of your black cat!I have a mini-hour panther, too.
I've been waiting for this episode since you started the show 🤭
Same! This is definitely one of my favorites.
I think up until S2 episode Innocence, it was the best episode so far. However this is where the show went into overdrive. Passion is a superb episode which had absolutely everything and very much a top ten episode from the whole series. The plot really thickens here with Jenny trying to get the way to restore Angel's soul, but Angelus is too strong and clever and foils her attempt with her brutal and shocking murder of a main character. Superb atmospheric narration from David Boreanaz at the start and end of the episode explaining Passion itself. The bit where Giles see's Jenny in the bed lifeless is so cruel, as is Angelus looking in through the window at Buffy and Willow crying, pure evil. The writing here was excellent as we build up to the Season finale with this incredible arc of Season 2. You can really see here how brilliant the Series has now become heading towards a fantastic Season Finale. The ending where the computer disk falls in between the desk is so well done. Superb writing and brilliant acting. Passion is I think a top ten episode from the whole Series.
Angel/Angelus is a sadist. More specifically he is an emotional sadist. He thrives off of causing emotional pain in others. We saw this in how he taunts Spike with Drew, we see this with how he taunted Buffy over her insecurities of their relationship taking a new level. And then we see this in they way he displayed Jenny's body for Giles, but then he watches the reactions of Buffy and Willow when they hear the news. And you are correct that this is inherent to Angel too. When he has a soul, he can't let this sadism out in the same ways, but it is still there. You can see it in how he talks to Xander for example. The way he needles Xander because he doesn't like him. How he used Xander as bait for Spike, and told Xander that he wouldn't have cared if Spike bit him afterwards. And we see it in Angel's combat banter, and how it differs from Buffy's. Buffy's combat banter is playful, and punny. Angel's combat banter drives home to whatever weakness he sees in whoever he is fighting with.
Something this episode in particular, and the Angelus voice over made me think of …..
the whole phenomenon of buffy reactions is a weird thing. We love watching other people enjoy this show. But bits of it, like this episode, aren’t enjoyable, and looking forward to other people being emotionally devastated by what is coming is a bit sick. We, the youtube audience, are becoming Angelus. Joss made us Angelus.
But good grief it’s some masterful story telling and the whole show contains some of the best editing and pacing I’ve ever seen in any show ever. There’s an extended story that spike tells another character much later on that is extensively cut through with flashbacks and voice over….that’s all I’ll say, because spoilers, and addicts know which one I mean I’m sure. I think it’s one of the tightest pieces of editing I’ve ever seen. Utterly beautiful.
I’m absolutely loving watching the show again through your eyes, I’ve loved it since it came out but you are teaching this old hag new things. Thank you.
When I was in about 3rd grade, I had to go to my brother's class for my Mom to pick us up one day (he was in 7th). The teacher left the room for a moment, said I was in charge and showed me the "paddle" drawer where she had all sorts of paddles. Of course I wasn't really in charge. And she was only gone a few moments. But it did happen. And yes, this was back in the day when seniors could drive the school bus, and teachers could smoke in school (usually the teacher's lounge) and spank kids. I got spanked twice in kindergarten.
fun fact- oz was actually the one who was supposed to die in this ep. the actor who played jenny wouldn't play the role anymore, so they had angelus kill her instead. oz would've been a tie back to willows "glad i didn't have a puppy" since, yk, werewolf.
Actress who played Jenny didn't want quit the show on this time...
@@pawerutkowski8791 she did. her religious views changed and it made her uncomfortable playing the role.
@@spikescryptz i saw her her interview from VH1: where are the now? from '99. She didn't tell anything about religious. And told that she was sad that her Jenny was dead in time when show was becoming popular. It was Joss Whedon brutal decision, not her. She left acting in early's '00. After 2002. Religious came later.
You make a great point about how the stakes are real now that Angelus killed Jenny, and the writers successfully got the audience rooting against Angel, which is pretty impressive. IIRC they say on the commentary that they chose to have him snap Jenny’s neck, rather that bite her, because they weren’t sure they could pull off redeeming him if we actually had that tragic shot of him feeding on her.
My head canon is that he's sworn off Romani blood ever since that one time it got him a soul...
@@ernesthakey3396 Nice. Stealing this head canon for my own head now. Your contribution is appreciated. 😁
@@JhadeSagrav you're welcome!
@@ernesthakey3396he killed Jenny snapping her neck quick cause he got off on the cruelty she wasn’t worth feeding on.
@@Mcherri yes, that's the actual reason. But that why I said "my head canon." I like my idea better so that's how I see it.
Love your buffy reactions. Really can’t wait for your take on characters as they grow and change (well most of them). I always look forward to these. Thank you!
A lot of people give Xander a bad wrap because of how quick he is to behave this way, which I get.
But so many people make this about his jealousy towards Angel when I don't think he's actually jealous or even pinning for Buffy the way he did in season 1.
Xander's been trying to work through those feelings for Buffy with honest effort, I think.
When he says he hated Angel long before everyone else, I think that statement is both true and false. When Angel is good, I think Xander has made an honest effort at times to be cordial with him. To be fair Angel isn't always the most respectful of Xander either. But I also think Xander has always been aware of the threat that Angel's existence holds, soul or no soul. He can't really decipher Angel any differently than all the other vampires they kill on a daily basis. In a way Xander is pretty xenophobic, but the writing of the show kinda creates that problem.
I believe Giles is pretty similar (after all he pretty much taught Xander to think of every vampire as the same after Jesse died), but Giles is also less vocal and more mature about it. He understands that Buffy has to make up her own mind and live through her own experiences.
Note many people distinguish Angel from Angelus, but I thunk this is more question than fact. Take the barrier for example, Buffy invited Angel not Angelus, yet the invite extends to both.
Enjoyed your analysis to this powerful Buffy episode. Looking forward to you thoughts on the rest of season two.
I was curious as to how emotional Tyler would get in this episode considering how critical he views episodes. Considering he's so analitical, I'm not surprised he saw it coming and he wasn't as worried, so much as he accepted her upcoming death.
What not everyone always notices is that the school is a public building, so Angel has a free invitation, therefore he is toying with Jenny's fear over nt understanding that when he says the latin sign invited him in. The same goes for him running directly into the cleaning cart. He is allowing Jenny to feel she has the upper hand while he goes the back way.
Don't get me started on the Willow as a teacher storyline. In-universe (not the writing), the school authorities belong in jail. They are clearly wanting to not pay a substitute and somebody is pocketing money (perhaps to use it for other school something or whoever pays the teachers directly just puts it in their own pocket). Lots of laws are being broken along the way, though.
I would respect Xander's opinion of Angelus needing to die (even while not agreeing with it) if he didn't say he hated Angel before Angel was Angelus and therefore everyone else should get on board with his opinion of killing Angelus. That tells me Xander is still talking from a place of jealousy and not from a look at all the horrible things Angelus has done place. If he brought up issues like Angelus pulling him through Buffy's window and trying to turn him in the last episode I would get it, but explaining he hated Angelus before he had a reason to and urging the idea of Giles getting killed through revenge doesn't make me see his opinion as clearly as he is trying to push it. And Buffy punching Giles for trying to get himself killed makes me believe Buffy didn't agree with Xander's opinion despite telling him "you're right." She just knew what Xander wasn't thinking; which was that Giles was going to die if he did it the way Xander was hoping for and the way Giles ended up doing it. I love hearing a reaction viewer say, everything I've always said about the moment and cap it off with, "Disrespectfully Xander, F&%?# off!" That made my day for this moment and this opinion Xander has.
that money is for sure going to the swim team. 🤣🤣🤣
I also think Sunnydale has a reputation for not being a safe place for teachers and substitute teachers alike, and heck, their last principal was eaten! The may not even have had a librarian before Giles showed up.. 😉
Still, they are definitely violating labor laws and probably a lot of other statutes as well. On the other hand, we know at least some of the folks in law enforcement have some knowledge of the supernatural, based on what we saw in School Hard: "Snyder tells the police chief to say that the trouble was caused by a gang on PCP. When the chief wonders if people will believe it, Snyder asks if he'd rather tell the truth."
With Snyder and the police chief apparently knowing some stuff, it makes sense that others in the city administration know stuff as well - and probably hide stuff from outsiders. So not following the proper procedures for teaching doesn't surprise me at all.
@@ernesthakey3396 SPOILERS FOR SEASON THREE DON'T READ IF YOU HAVEN'T SEEN THROUGH (NOT TO, BUT THROUGH) SEASON THREE
I've said as much myself, and if long term fans think about it all that stuff, including Willow's teaching ties back to The Mayor because of him being in charge of such a corrupt system and town and/or because he's so corrupt/evil.
@@Buffy8Fan exactly!
It's a weird thing to note, I suppose, but Angelus killing Jenny by snapping her neck is almost an insult in itself. Usually vampires would drain their victims, probably out of enjoyment, but he didn't even think her worth anything to him but swatting her down like killing a fly. And then he brings her to Giles like a cat bringing its master a dead rat, and arranges her "artfully" to inflict the most emotional damage possible upon Giles. Cold and brutal, that Angelus. This episode is gut wrenching.
oh, was that Chekhov's gun that fell between the desk and the drawers
Exactly my thoughts!
10 points to Gryffindor for "Chekhov's Gun"!
@@JhadeSagrav 😁! Not wrong...
Angel was a nasty awful guy before turning vampire. It just brought out his true self.
I been waiting for you to get to this episode 😈
Re: Xander, exactly. I like Xander, but this is one of those moments when I agree with the Xander critics.
It's good Giles didn't kill Dru, since Drusilla and Jenny are their own characters, that would be kind of like trading a man's girlfriend for another man's girlfriend, kind of icky. 20:18
Buffy theme just starting up...
UA-cam interrupts with an ad.
Me: How DARE you interrupt Tyler's jamming out to the Buffy theme!?! Shame, UA-cam, shame on you.
😄🤣😉
Love the episode, love your reaction and thoughts as always- glad you enjoyed it (if thats the right word for such a sad episode)
You consistently have unique and interesting takes on the show! Looking forward to the future reacts.
Always hated this episode, but purely because every time I see it I want her to escape. It really is a fantastic episode though, but a bit too much of a setup for everything becoming right for Jenny and Giles, so in your heart of hearts you know she's not going to make her getaway from Angel. Maybe her and Giles working towards that goal last episode would have helped... but then all that would do is make it hurt more. I'd like to try defend Xander by saying he's upset and angry at Jenny's death so lashing out, but tbh I remember that Xander did annoy me at times with his whole hating Angel thing when I first watched it, so valid.
Angelus loves to break people It doesn't matter the age four gender
The demon Angeles enjoys isolating people and taking away everything from them to the point where they only have their own life and then and only then he takes it sometimes he doesn't even silver person we just leaves them to suffer And with drewsila He found a way to make that torture eternal... He doesn't care that the thing that he is torturing isn't the human or the soul anymore He doesn't even care that it is a demon he just enjoys the torture. That being said... It's not that he can't kill Buffy (the only thing stopping him is Buffy herself) it's that he enjoys the torturing of Buffy too much to kill her. From his point of view killing Buffy would be far from the worst he could do to her. And he enjoys doing the worst
You cut a lot of moments it is a little quick but i think it is important to react at more moments this show is really great and needing to focus on lines, everything is intersting and useful even for later episodes
6:30 i think it's very much on purpose. The writer's on Buffy use a lot of allegory.
Welcome to Joss Whedon heartbreak.
Mainly I like Xander, but there are times like in this episode where he shows definite 'Nice Guy' energy.
Nice air drum solo 😂😂😂 🤘
Pretty pretty please don't take too long to watch the rest of this season! I can't wait to hear your thoughts on these final episodes and on season 2 as a whole, you're always so insightful!
I agree with you that it's absolute bullshit of Xander to try to pat himself on the back for hating Angel before he lost his soul, but... he is supposed to be a 17 year-old boy (something that often gets lost bc Nick B. sooo doesn't look like a highschooler), and something very traumatic just happened in his friend circle. Much like the theme of this episode, passion is driving him too.
‼️okay this one’s definitely a SPOILER so tyler no peaking‼️
truely all i could do as he was talking about knowing how angel ends up because of the first middle last video but wanting him to die is sing hannah montana best of both worlds. hilariously, knowing the future has made him less likely to entertain possibilities that he can extrapolate from the current text - correct ones.
It would be worse quality if the allegory was on purpose, case in point: all the 'lesson of the week' episodes. In some ways, it would be worse if it really was an allegory, and not just a character going through something.
This episode is more tragic than Innocence imo.
Biting my lip SO HARD to not spoil the end of the season for you!
chelsea don’t live comment your reaction to a new tyler video challenge - ❌FAILED❌
I support this.
Ascended. Foreshadowing?
omg let's gooooo
if you touched on this in the episode and i missed it i'm sorry, but the thing that has always stood out to me about jenny's death is the way angel just snaps her neck. it's like the biggest "add insult to injury" that he, as a vampire, didn't even bother drinking her blood.
@@bashby97 I didn't! But I think you're right, there's disrespect in that.
@@TylerAlexander My head canon is that Angel/Angelus has sworn off drinking Romani blood ever since that one girl ended up getting him cursed. It leaves a bad taste in his mouth...so to speak.
I think it's implied Xander is somewhat prejudiced against vampires (including good-Angel) due to his friend Jesse getting killed by one.
Thank you for shutting down Xander's nonsense! I'm going to pretend he could hear you.
@Moooooogieit definitely counts as part of the overall Xander hostility towards vampires. But yeah. He has issues, he needs help.
Upon seeing this come up I suddenly hear the Flight of the Conchords 'Fashion' in my head...but, you know, Passion...P P P P P Passion. 😅
Dammit, thanks for the Bowie earworm... 🤣
It's the David Bowie for me, not Flight of the Conchords.
@@ernesthakey3396 haha I can hear that now as well!, also the Concords Bowie ep rules too
it's an interesting question, is Xander any more or less toxic than angel?
Angelus
@@GeorgiannaMiller5 Meh, you could make the case for Angel too. Possessive, definitely encouraging an inappropriate relationship with a minor, literal stalking as seen in the first ep and confirmed later, etc.
Thank you for pointing out that Xander was jealous of Angel the nice human out of sheer sexual/romantic jealousy. He had no idea that there would be Angelus the demon.
And with ableism, yeah, I grew up extremely right-wing and capitalist and although I never disparaged or insulted someone for having a disability, ableism was still a huge blind spot for me in regards to public policy/accomodation. One hears about "inclusive" events that people with disabilities have no way to attend and aren't listened to.
It sounds like your world view has expanded a bit since your early years. Kudos for that!
@@ernesthakey3396 thank God for the internet. I grew up extremely sheltered.
How can you watch this and not cry!?!
Omg u talk too much. We're looking for a reaction but you cut out the best scenes like Willow crying on the phone. I personally want an emotional response.
You're crying enough about my video to satisfy anyone that wants tears tbh.
@@TylerAlexander cuz I'm an emotional person. It's like the most important part of why this episode is such an important part of this show. Showing how dark the storyline gets. You totally overlook it while showing no emotion about some of the scenes you cut out. This season is an art form of what makes Buffy powerful and you completely ignore it with scenes that aren't that important.
@@amillan2004 considering your name 'queerNB' you're surprisingly, and disappointingly narrow-minded. I'll put this at the top of the reply as I don't know if you'll read to the end - if you continue to conduct yourself this way in the comments I'll just block you. Fair warning. And I truly hope you learn something from this reply rather than lashing out for a third time.
Not everyone shows emotion the same way but that doesn't mean either way is invalid, and differentiating this the way you do belittles people at a foundational level, and you should be ashamed of this kind of behaviour. It's fine to be an emotional person, but not at the expense of beating someone else with it.
I had a pretty productive conversation on my Patreon with someone who actually inquired about why I didn't cry or show overt emotion in a polite/constructive way. I won't rehash that all here but the tldr on that is that I WAS upset by what happens. My energy drops and I talk pretty solemnly by the end which were the tells for that, and while this might not be satisfying in the same way as overt tears to you, it doesnt mean I didnt show any emotion at all.
This feeds into my second point and addressing your initial comment. My content is analysis focused. This comes under the reaction umbrella but reactions are not why people come here. I've cried in videos before (Haunting of Hill House), and if the emotion gets too much I feel it, but what happens this episode happens so quick and the focus shifts so fast to Giles, worry for him, and the events that follow that this acts as adequate distraction and as a re-focus for my analysis. Because of this I control what I feel and the raw emotion doesn't hit me as hard, and I provide what people come to my videos for; analysis. Not all people or reactors are going to be the same, that's just the genre of video.
I'll round this out by saying this. Coming into a comment section and using the universal 'we' as if you're speaking for the masses (you're the minority here, trust me), is such pretentious privilege. Announcing your own expectations as if the whole world should cater to YOU does not array you in a positive light, and declaring you're an 'emotional' person as if that justifies you coming in and getting personal towards a creator is dismissive and rude. If you don't like the style of content go watch someone else that caters to you. 'I'm an emotional person' isn't a reason to behave this way.
I directly comment on Jenny's death, the overarching theme of passion, and the events of the episode as well as the darkness you say I didnt mention. This isn't 'totally overlook'ing the storyline. If you can't sit still for 20-30 minutes unless you see someone react in the 'perfect way' to you, the issue isn't my video it's the expectations you held and your inability to channel your emotions in a positive manner.
@@amillan2004 There are many BtVS reactors out there and they all watch the show in their own way, which is their perogative.Tyler's way is less emotional and more analytical and many of us enjoy that. There are certainly enough other creators out there who can be more emotional. I suggest you find those if you don't like his style and not berate him for not being emotional enough for your taste.
@@TylerAlexander you're right. I'm sorry.