I'm in my master's right now and I feel like I'm learning the same stuff as undergrad, different schools. I got my undergrad in Architectural Engineering and focused more on the BIM side and my masters is more design and less engineering. Neither of them teach budget courses seriously and that's honestly scary because they only do it once and hopefully you remember. I've been watching your videos since I was a freshman and this video has helped me understand why i feel like I'm missing something. Do you know any books or videos that help with filling that gap?
@astranova232 i unfortunately do not have any resources for budget courses/realistic skill courses for architects/architectural engineers. If I do find one though, I will shoot you a comment/:
everything she said is true. this comes from a architecture student here in Canada. it was only until my internship year where I felt I truly learnt about architecture and its crazy how in 1 year working I learned more about architecture than in 4 years of undergrad. These schools are literally scamming us. They don't teach the softwares , they don't teach various architectural styles and let us pursue them, they don't provide or at least subsize materials/programs and they don't prepare us for the reality of the architecture industry. You're best bet is to master softwares on your own through UA-cam or paid courses which are much cheaper than uni. The problem we have is that the system is setup this way that the only way to be a licensed architecture is to do an undergrad, then masters, then exams and finally you become an architect. My advice, is keep learning on your own outside of school, pursue your interests in the field, read books and network. Great vid nonetheless!
It's been a year since I have been working as a Junior architect in India. Everything that you mentioned in the video seems to be a worldwide problem in the Architecture fraternity. From academia to fieldwork everything is so relatable, and I have been experiencing all this firsthand. People really need to understand that this is a collaborative field and requires a change in the system of undergrad courses to prepare students to take up specializations. The fact that we are turning into the 'jack of all trades and master of none', is impacting the fieldwork and payscale. Division of work based on specializations will help navigate an individual's interest and harness it to its full potential at work without being burdened to know it all. Work-life balance should no longer be a choice but a basic & necessary requirement.
I feel like theres so much that needs to be tackled by the architecture community. It feels like so many graduate and have these waves of emotion and vids like these are so important to watch whilst still studying, its so helpful to have information like this. We always said we feel like members of a sinking ship and no one gets it. We were never personally taught budget and stuff so wow I can imagine how that must have been! Personally my studies were going really well and loved every minute of it. Had to leave my post grad due to personal circumstances and family drama in covid. It killed me and havent been able to get a job in the field since. I hope I do again one day because its a beautiful field but a very complex one.
Architecture school is the worst R.O.I. in the universe, with no digital drafting nor business management skills to offer. I've been an artist all my life, but I accepted the fact that life as a professional artist is unsustainable in the 21st century (even with marketing experience, it's a daunting challenge). So I arrived at the university, thinking that it will provide a creative professional life with a paycheck. How can I be so naive and hopeful for the future of civilization? Everyone I knew there wanted to be the next FLW, Frank Gehry, and Zaha Hadid, but what a painful awakening. All I did in the field was damage restoration, drive -thru, box marts, parking lots, bringing slums and garbage buildings up to code, hazmat lockers, product research, and being a walking/talking reference manual, working for chump change with no health coverage. Architecture is becoming more and more like a 20th century white elephant that deserves to go extinct. An outdated aristocrat's fantasy from the Gilded Age. The A.I. revolution will easily do the tasks that I did in nanoseconds, and is already building that coffin for the profession. Currently, I'm transitioning to software engineering to learn A.I. and lifting myself out of this $%it storm. Goodbye, Architecture, and good riddance.
Going to a school with a technical background helps a lot. Whenever I speak to other architects, they always speak highly about the students and graduates from my school. Going to a technical school definitely helps for preparation in the work force
Omg I cracked up at Birkin Bag. 🤣🤣🤣I wish I had a Birkin Bag. Wait... they didn't teach you Revit in school ??? That's crazy if so (especially when thinking about how much tuition is). Revit seems to be the main software in the U.S.- is that right? I'm using Vectorworks this side of the pond (although all the firms want you to know 9978 different programs lol). For me, the biggest difference between uni and real-life practice, is the client's input. Like of course our lecturers would give constructive criticism, but I wasn't prepared for how much the client's would change the design (is it even my design in the end? or even a good design for that matter👀). Of course it's different in smaller interior projects, direct to client, compared to the large corporate jobs you're doing. We are attaching our name to this project... it turns out ugly, because the client insisted certain things☕ I completely resonate with your designer instincts dying comment- it's a sad truth. In practice we end up focusing on the mundane technical aspects more than the conceptual fun side. Great video as usual Natalie! - Jacqueline 😊
Jacqueline, oh to only have a Birkin Bag ! 😄 Regarding Revit, it's surprising how some schools overlook it, given its industry prevalence. In the U.S., it's widely used, but it's interesting to hear about Vectorworks on your side of the pond. Your insight into the client's influence is spot on. Balancing design integrity with client preferences, especially when they steer towards questionable choices, can be a challenge. And yes, the shift from uni's conceptual focus to real-life technicalities is a universal struggle. The "designer instincts dying" sentiment is sadly relatable/: Thanks for your thoughtful comment, Jacqueline! 😊
When you started talking about budget, that feels so real. I understand budget flexes with the market, but still we should be taught how this works and how we are to go through making/adjusting the budget. Do you think you could make a video one this???
I am starting arch school at 35, I can't imagine going into this right out of high school. I held off for a lot of reasons but I did 1 1/2 years of drafting school that was pretty heavy on the architecture side of thing. My instructor was a licensed architect and we did lots of design and AiA things. I decided to just jump all the way in, it's just so weird being in a school environment after so long though. Most architects are late bloomers anyway. Loui Khan's career didn't really take of tell his late 50's. Anyway I just want to say doing a drafting program with a transfer into a Arch school is a route someone who isn't sure about the field can do. It's also good to have those hard skills because Revit can be safety net. I guess the firms in my area were having a hard time finding grads that know Revit at all, just Rhino. Revit can be pretty clunky to design with unless its moded a bit.
I believe that this feeling is truely universal. I'm Brazilian and I just finished graduate school and I feel the same way. The school didn't teach me the skills I really needed and even though I always tried to learn them by myself, it wasn't enough and now I can't get a good job.
It's disheartening when education falls short in providing practical skills. Your experience resonates with many around the world. Despite the challenges, your proactive approach in self-learning is commendable. Remember, persistence pays off, and exploring additional resources or workshops might further enhance your skills. Keep pushing forward, and I believe opportunities will come your way((: Feel free to share more about your journey, and let's support each other through these shared experiences!!!
All college and Uni's do this with every course. They never prep you for a real job. I'm in IT and they did the same. We were never taught the boring Request For Change process and more.
I’m in agreement with pretty much everything that’s been said here, and most of it was true when I was in school 40+ years ago. I do think I can add a bit of analysis to the discussion. Why does it feel like you’ve been in school for x many years, but still don’t feel like you know what you need to do your job when you get out? 1. There are two phases to the education of an architect: school and the AXP ”Licensure Candidate” program. Both the degree and the apprenticeship/practical experience are required in order to sit for the architectural licensing exam. And passing the licensing exam is required in order to call oneself an “architect.” So in that phase of your career, you’re literally not “done” yet. (Natalie, I know you know this.) 2. A lot of architecture schools are resistant to considering themselves “vocational training.” This is why you get the weird “We don’t train you to use Revit, Rhino, etc.” attitude. The Ivy league and higher end schools are usually the most invested in this. They were the same way about hand drafting skills back when everything was hand drawn on paper. I was lucky. I got 3 years of drafting classes back in high school, and when AutoCAD came out I had an employer that was willing to cover the costs on training people on the job. So how does someone get where they want to go with their career in this “emerging professional”/”licensure candidate”/apprenticeship phase? 1. Find people in your firm that you can pester and ask questions. This might not be the project architect you’re working directly under, it might be a senior detailer or a specifications writer. Try to get to a point where you understand everything that you are drawing or modeling. 2. Find product representatives that will spend time with you and answer your questions. Product reps work for construction materials manufacturer and it’s their job to make sure that you understand how to incorporate their products in your project. 3. Spend time at networking events. Join your professional societies, even when you are still a student. 4. Summer jobs, internships, and co-op jobs.
Thank you for sharing your insights on the challenges architects face in transitioning from education to professional practice. Your experience of over 40 years brings a LOT of valuable perspective to the ongoing issues in the field! You rightly point out the two crucial phases in an architect's education: academic and practical experience through programs like AXP. The emphasis on passing licensing exams adds complexity to the journey, making it a continuous learning curve. Your observation on the resistance of some architecture schools to position themselves as vocational training institutions is noteworthy. Plus, your positive experience with hands-on drafting classes and on-the-job training emphasizes the importance of practical skills. Your wealth of experience adds depth to the conversation, benefiting both seasoned professionals and those starting their architectural careers. Thank you for the comment. It will help many.
Aaaah Nat! Everything you’ve mentioned is not only true, but your feelings about corporate vs starchitect is extremely valid. It can be really frustrating, and I’m sure even moreso being in a designer role who is genuinely passionate about the industry such as yourself, but just know we’re cheering you on over here and want nothing more but for you to continue to be passionate about what you do everyday! We’ll be here for you while you continue to navigate ❤
This is the most authentic and relatable video I think I’ve seen on the topic - maybe because I often feel similarly and am in what sounds like a similar position as you - either way, great video. It is tough that school doesn’t really prepare us for the real-world of the industry. I’ve found the working for a genuinely good firm that values their people is the biggest thing that has helped me deal with the “unpreparedness”. Sure, there can be unfulfilling days like you said, but at the end of it, if you’re valued by your firm and teammates, that really is a blessing. You’re really already ahead of so many. Never stop learning, growing, and seeking to get better!
Thank you for the words Alex! I think you’re 110% right in regard to finding the right firm that you fit well with and who will also support your own development and growth… it’s unfortunate that a lot more teaching responsibility falls more on the firm rather than school. But like you said, it’s a matter of finding the right firm and a good balance. Best of luck to you whether you’re in school or in practice(-:!
This stands for most professions especially technical professions. The best take is the education gets you in the door of the profession. What you do after is what will make your career. Very little from my education was practically applied.
I refer you all to my previous comments. You were all lied to by your Architecture School. You'll get to design something after around a min. of 5-10yrs of working in practice. Up until that point you'll be doing utterly tedious layout, planning and technical drawings. 7 years training for that......I went through it all 20yrs back and ended back at University recently having been through the architecture mill, and this alone saddened me the most for the 20-something's there, who were so full of excitement, wonder and creativity, now knowing what I do. Then add-in the additional reality that our industry is THE lowest paid of every profession when set against the amount of time required to qualify. And this applies world-wide.
I think these points are very important and there are a lot of improvements that need to be made to architecture programs. Would love a walkthrough of your thesis video!! Maybe, and this would be time consuming of course. But maybe you could do little side projects of your own designs, or start doing some interior design on the side. It’s how I keep my creative juices flowing during a corporate job!
that is an awesome suggestion, Alana!!! I am definitely trying to get more into architecture competitions too! but definitely having something going on the side of the 9-5 corporate job will help(:
I am criminal justice major not even related to architecture, prior to Covid-19 however, architecture and engineering was something I was very interested in. My Highschool and middle school offered programs teaching how to use Inventor and variety of design software's. Additionally my father works of the company that provide training tech support for inventor and other software's even help fixed some of the coding bugs. So I had a lot of exposure to those software enough to learn that it was not for me however I still use those skills to fool around with the 3-D printer and help design run in sheds on my families ranch. Kind of shocking you guys don't get to learn enough, for your careers in college. I know my major complete different but criminal justice is really for students looking to become a cop. While my college offers so many resources and educational opportunities. We were given access to the police shooting simulator and all our professors are ex cops or active cops. They frequently gave us real world scenarios and mostly ignored the text book form what it like on the job.
I’ve noticed a general trend with most professions where the big name firms are more soul crushing and keep you in an intellectual box, whereas smaller firms (because of their lack of size) actually need and want you to grow in many ways. The architecture firm in at now is on the smaller size and I feel like I’ve gotten more 1 on 1 mentoring. Yeah my salary isn’t close to what the Gensler people make but it I’m so much more versatile in my role which I feel in the long run will make up for it.
It's interesting to hear about your experience in the architecture profession and your observation regarding the impact of firm size. Your insight suggests that smaller firms offer more personal growth and one-on-one mentoring (which I definitely agree with as I have also worked at a smaller firm for a year), despite potentially lower salaries compared to larger counterparts. Your willingness to prioritize versatility and mentorship over immediate financial gains highlights the importance of holistic career development!!!!! Thanks for sharing, and it's inspiring to hear about your positive experience in a smaller firm that values individual growth and fosters a dynamic professional environment(: I should've mentioned that before
I feel like crap about graduating tbh. I don't think my portfolio is up to industry standards and I know the my skill are likely to not apply to finding an appropriate job. I wish I could start over or move into something that was not design oriented
It's very true. 7 years yet we learn nothing of what you need to know for 99% of the work you're going to do as an architect. Imagine med school operating this way. You can definitely incorporate design and practical courses within those 7 years. I look at college (not university) courses for programs like "construction engineering technology" and feel envious of the things I wish learned to better prepare for the workplace. University education spends so much time teaching useless things it seems. So strange...the people in college know more than university grads but the job ads require a university education instead of college - it's all an illusion
It's soooo disheartening when educational paths don't align with the practical demands of the profession. I was talking to a graduate nursing student last night and she was explaining to me how her last full year of school has just been preparing her for her board exams. It's undeniably true - incorporating more design and practical courses within the curriculum could better equip aspiring architects for the real-world challenges they'll face. It's indeed perplexing when job postings *prioritize* university degrees over the practical knowledge gained... I hope this up and coming generation can shift all of this toward more comprehensive and practical education..
Hi so good to see you back, i am studying at measi academy of architecture, india. I am only in my 2nd year of school right now and thankgod we're getting taught revit but it's very basic. I guess we'll have t learn ourselves the rest. It would be soooo beneficial if the school did teach all the things you mentioned.
Great insight once again and i think you should continue making these kind of videos to shed more light on the realities of this great field that we are involved in.
I am from Lithuania, we have different art academia and universities, where you can study architecture. I studied for 6 years, now I have practiced in different offices for over 12 years😅 Also work with students and I must agree with you about mostly everything. I am sorry that you felt such a gap and from your eyes it looks like you have a lot of pressure at work. With years it will be easier but yeah, universities, academia, collages take accents not in the most important things of architecture and draw it like the art😂 it is a hell business 😢 however, all knowledge is valuable and after new skills you will see the difference, artistic minds and thoughts always be in you, do not let them go.😊
THIS! I am in my 5th year and I feel like don't know the basics of how to be an Architect. Some keep saying you gonna learn this along the way, while others are like YOU DON'T KNOW THIS AND YOU ARE A 5TH-YEAR STUDENT, SERIOUSLY? But, it's just... It's pointless that somebody COULD have told us these things before. That's when I always keep wondering if architecture is really for me, or if should I consider other majors?
I totally get where you're coming from, and it's completely normal to feel this way, especially in the demanding field of architecture. It can be overwhelming, and the conflicting advice doesn't make it any easier. Just remember, the learning curve in this profession is steep, and it's okay not to have all the answers in your 5th year. I'm sure most successful architects have been through similar doubts. Consider seeking guidance from mentors, both within and outside your academic circle. Additionally, I've shared some videos on my channel about overcoming challenges in architecture and finding your path. Maybe they can provide some insights and encouragement during this challenging time. Remember, it's okay to question and reassess. With an architecture degree, you can transition into roles such as urban planning, project management, real estate development, sustainable design consulting, interior design, graphic design, construction management, 3D visualization, BIM specialization, or facilities management. You've come this far for a reason!
@@UnravelingArchitecture Yes! I agree. It can’t be all bad. I can’t deny that architecture helped me as a person. That’s for sure! This talk is for sure something that people in this field should be open about more! Thank you for your comment! I really enjoy your videos! I am from Morocco btw 🙏❤️
currently in high school taking drafting classes, I've already been accepted into college for architecture but after seeing this video and others like it... I'm having second thoughts about the degree :( I really like drafting, but the fact that job placement is hard and the actual job is nothing like academics is highly deterring. I really don't know where to turn from here
Great video, but all the feelings you're stating are valid. It's an international issue unfortunately. I also find there needs to be a combination of the BA/BSC format of architecture curriculum in schools. You can tell, well I can tell who's come from a BA/BSC school from their approaches to design. There's a lot to uncover but, I think give the experience a good run. They're always other fields adjacent which you can go into. Remember, you're not supposed to know everything, it comes with practice and time. Again begs the question of universities implementing a fake real-life scenario into their curriculums. So, students can get a better understanding of the field.
OMG THANK GOD THAT EXIST PEOPLE LIKE MEEE I feel the same way even that I am not working yet I am so scared to finde the job and to start my career as an architect because in collage we just lerand how to be creativ and not to be preper for work
It is interesting, I'm doing a double of architecture and construction management. If I wasn't doing construction management, I would have no units about budget, cost estimation or project management.
Although general architectural education always has its challenges, Penn and its faculty's pedagogy have been far removed from real architecture. They fail to teach students to think like architects. Drawing from my experience as a Penn Design student, their obsession with creating funny looking 'avant-garde' forms is superficial and merely for visual entertainment. Instead of considering the context and narrative of built spaces, they churn out countless iterations of formal studies that lack meaning. I can attest that Penn Design boasts one of the most hardworking student bodies, but as an alum and practicing architect who often reviews portfolios for hiring, I feel sorry for the students. I hope the new chair will bring positive change to the school.
Good topic. Architectural education is broken, and has been for a long time. All schools should have a complete curriculum of professional practice. But unfortunately they leave this to architecture firms to teach in the intern phase. Architecture firms then pay interns much less because they need to train them. You should do a video on the path to licensure so students know how long and difficult it is.
I'm currently a 3rd year undergrad, last year our professors sat my class down and went through the steps of architectural licensing in the United States and there was a feeling of "how long will I really have to do this?" that I think everyone felt by the end of the presentation. 5-7 years of school, another 5-10 years for experience, and then another undetermined amount of time for exams. I feel there is a lot of pressure put on new architects and makes it very hard to make a practice for yourself early in life.
I completely agree that architectural education needs a revamp. Including a comprehensive curriculum of professional practice within schools could significantly bridge the gap between academia and the real-world demands of the field. It's unfortunate that much of this crucial training is left to architecture firms during the intern phase, often leading to lower pay for interns due to the training burden. I did also made a video on licensure requirements for both international and domestic students! but always open to suggestions. Thank you Roberts!
It is 100% normal and a natural feeling to be nervous before you jump into anything new! A new school and a new major is a new beginning! I’d just say really lean into it. Don’t play it safe either in school. One of my regrets is I played it far too safe with my projects, and could’ve done more theoretical projects and thrived. Failing is honestly a good thing and it’s better to fail fail fail in school at a project vs fail in professional practice - so lean into it! You’ll be okay!
Are you concerned your employer will see this and perhaps conclude you will be unfulfilled at their firm and that hiring an Ivy League educated person was in error?
hahaha! Nope, not at all!! I have discussed this with both of my bosses months ago, and my performance and reviews remain excellent. I started the channel to stay authentic, a trait often lost by creators over time. Now, as a graduated architecture student (not licensed yet), I aim to document the journey in architecture sincerely. Hoping it resonates with high schoolers/college students/etc, helping them avoid unnecessary challenges and know what they're signing up for. Authenticity is rare online. So, if an employer fires me over this, it signals an incompatible fit.
I had several mentorships while in school. Had no opportunities nor didn’t really think about it when I was a teenager in high school. Regardless, after going through the whole educational system and architecture school, I do believe there are several areas of improvement.
Hearing all of this makes me nervous. I just put my acceptance into my college for architecture, I’m sure I’ll end up being fine but all I hear are negatives 🥲
Absolutely -- but I want to assure you that my passion for architecture remains strong. In fact, I have several videos on my channel highlighting the positive aspects of the major and the field. If you check out some of those videos, you'll see that I'm genuinely excited about the journey, and there are many rewarding aspects to focus on. I believe in showing both the positive and negative side of things.
I do believe that architectural education though should really be challenged and adjusted. And the way to challenge and adjust it is to openly talk about it have have debates on what works and what doesnt
QOTD: did you guys go to architecture school? If so where?
PS sorry for the click-bait-y title hehehe
I'm in my master's right now and I feel like I'm learning the same stuff as undergrad, different schools. I got my undergrad in Architectural Engineering and focused more on the BIM side and my masters is more design and less engineering. Neither of them teach budget courses seriously and that's honestly scary because they only do it once and hopefully you remember. I've been watching your videos since I was a freshman and this video has helped me understand why i feel like I'm missing something. Do you know any books or videos that help with filling that gap?
Rensselaer. I don''t recommend them. The school its in financial trouble and is not supportive to their students.
currently i am studying architecture in Thapathali campus, Nepal(lets say i am in fourth year )
@jngnorwood152 oh no! are you considering transferring?
@astranova232
i unfortunately do not have any resources for budget courses/realistic skill courses for architects/architectural engineers. If I do find one though, I will shoot you a comment/:
everything she said is true. this comes from a architecture student here in Canada. it was only until my internship year where I felt I truly learnt about architecture and its crazy how in 1 year working I learned more about architecture than in 4 years of undergrad. These schools are literally scamming us. They don't teach the softwares , they don't teach various architectural styles and let us pursue them, they don't provide or at least subsize materials/programs and they don't prepare us for the reality of the architecture industry.
You're best bet is to master softwares on your own through UA-cam or paid courses which are much cheaper than uni. The problem we have is that the system is setup this way that the only way to be a licensed architecture is to do an undergrad, then masters, then exams and finally you become an architect. My advice, is keep learning on your own outside of school, pursue your interests in the field, read books and network. Great vid nonetheless!
It's been a year since I have been working as a Junior architect in India. Everything that you mentioned in the video seems to be a worldwide problem in the Architecture fraternity.
From academia to fieldwork everything is so relatable, and I have been experiencing all this firsthand.
People really need to understand that this is a collaborative field and requires a change in the system of undergrad courses to prepare students to take up specializations. The fact that we are turning into the 'jack of all trades and master of none', is impacting the fieldwork and payscale.
Division of work based on specializations will help navigate an individual's interest and harness it to its full potential at work without being burdened to know it all.
Work-life balance should no longer be a choice but a basic & necessary requirement.
I feel like theres so much that needs to be tackled by the architecture community. It feels like so many graduate and have these waves of emotion and vids like these are so important to watch whilst still studying, its so helpful to have information like this. We always said we feel like members of a sinking ship and no one gets it. We were never personally taught budget and stuff so wow I can imagine how that must have been!
Personally my studies were going really well and loved every minute of it. Had to leave my post grad due to personal circumstances and family drama in covid. It killed me and havent been able to get a job in the field since. I hope I do again one day because its a beautiful field but a very complex one.
Architecture school is the worst R.O.I. in the universe, with no digital drafting nor business management skills to offer. I've been an artist all my life, but I accepted the fact that life as a professional artist is unsustainable in the 21st century (even with marketing experience, it's a daunting challenge). So I arrived at the university, thinking that it will provide a creative professional life with a paycheck. How can I be so naive and hopeful for the future of civilization? Everyone I knew there wanted to be the next FLW, Frank Gehry, and Zaha Hadid, but what a painful awakening. All I did in the field was damage restoration, drive -thru, box marts, parking lots, bringing slums and garbage buildings up to code, hazmat lockers, product research, and being a walking/talking reference manual, working for chump change with no health coverage. Architecture is becoming more and more like a 20th century white elephant that deserves to go extinct. An outdated aristocrat's fantasy from the Gilded Age. The A.I. revolution will easily do the tasks that I did in nanoseconds, and is already building that coffin for the profession. Currently, I'm transitioning to software engineering to learn A.I. and lifting myself out of this $%it storm. Goodbye, Architecture, and good riddance.
Holy cow!!!.....Thank you for this post!!!😢😢😢
Going to a school with a technical background helps a lot. Whenever I speak to other architects, they always speak highly about the students and graduates from my school. Going to a technical school definitely helps for preparation in the work force
What school is this?
Omg I cracked up at Birkin Bag. 🤣🤣🤣I wish I had a Birkin Bag.
Wait... they didn't teach you Revit in school ??? That's crazy if so (especially when thinking about how much tuition is). Revit seems to be the main software in the U.S.- is that right? I'm using Vectorworks this side of the pond (although all the firms want you to know 9978 different programs lol).
For me, the biggest difference between uni and real-life practice, is the client's input. Like of course our lecturers would give constructive criticism, but I wasn't prepared for how much the client's would change the design (is it even my design in the end? or even a good design for that matter👀). Of course it's different in smaller interior projects, direct to client, compared to the large corporate jobs you're doing. We are attaching our name to this project... it turns out ugly, because the client insisted certain things☕
I completely resonate with your designer instincts dying comment- it's a sad truth. In practice we end up focusing on the mundane technical aspects more than the conceptual fun side.
Great video as usual Natalie!
- Jacqueline 😊
Jacqueline, oh to only have a Birkin Bag ! 😄 Regarding Revit, it's surprising how some schools overlook it, given its industry prevalence. In the U.S., it's widely used, but it's interesting to hear about Vectorworks on your side of the pond.
Your insight into the client's influence is spot on. Balancing design integrity with client preferences, especially when they steer towards questionable choices, can be a challenge. And yes, the shift from uni's conceptual focus to real-life technicalities is a universal struggle. The "designer instincts dying" sentiment is sadly relatable/:
Thanks for your thoughtful comment, Jacqueline! 😊
When you started talking about budget, that feels so real. I understand budget flexes with the market, but still we should be taught how this works and how we are to go through making/adjusting the budget. Do you think you could make a video one this???
I am starting arch school at 35, I can't imagine going into this right out of high school. I held off for a lot of reasons but I did 1 1/2 years of drafting school that was pretty heavy on the architecture side of thing. My instructor was a licensed architect and we did lots of design and AiA things. I decided to just jump all the way in, it's just so weird being in a school environment after so long though. Most architects are late bloomers anyway. Loui Khan's career didn't really take of tell his late 50's.
Anyway I just want to say doing a drafting program with a transfer into a Arch school is a route someone who isn't sure about the field can do. It's also good to have those hard skills because Revit can be safety net. I guess the firms in my area were having a hard time finding grads that know Revit at all, just Rhino. Revit can be pretty clunky to design with unless its moded a bit.
I believe that this feeling is truely universal. I'm Brazilian and I just finished graduate school and I feel the same way. The school didn't teach me the skills I really needed and even though I always tried to learn them by myself, it wasn't enough and now I can't get a good job.
It's disheartening when education falls short in providing practical skills. Your experience resonates with many around the world. Despite the challenges, your proactive approach in self-learning is commendable. Remember, persistence pays off, and exploring additional resources or workshops might further enhance your skills. Keep pushing forward, and I believe opportunities will come your way((: Feel free to share more about your journey, and let's support each other through these shared experiences!!!
All college and Uni's do this with every course. They never prep you for a real job. I'm in IT and they did the same. We were never taught the boring Request For Change process and more.
I’m in agreement with pretty much everything that’s been said here, and most of it was true when I was in school 40+ years ago.
I do think I can add a bit of analysis to the discussion.
Why does it feel like you’ve been in school for x many years, but still don’t feel like you know what you need to do your job when you get out?
1. There are two phases to the education of an architect: school and the AXP ”Licensure Candidate” program. Both the degree and the apprenticeship/practical experience are required in order to sit for the architectural licensing exam. And passing the licensing exam is required in order to call oneself an “architect.” So in that phase of your career, you’re literally not “done” yet. (Natalie, I know you know this.)
2. A lot of architecture schools are resistant to considering themselves “vocational training.” This is why you get the weird “We don’t train you to use Revit, Rhino, etc.” attitude. The Ivy league and higher end schools are usually the most invested in this. They were the same way about hand drafting skills back when everything was hand drawn on paper. I was lucky. I got 3 years of drafting classes back in high school, and when AutoCAD came out I had an employer that was willing to cover the costs on training people on the job.
So how does someone get where they want to go with their career in this “emerging professional”/”licensure candidate”/apprenticeship phase?
1. Find people in your firm that you can pester and ask questions. This might not be the project architect you’re working directly under, it might be a senior detailer or a specifications writer. Try to get to a point where you understand everything that you are drawing or modeling.
2. Find product representatives that will spend time with you and answer your questions. Product reps work for construction materials manufacturer and it’s their job to make sure that you understand how to incorporate their products in your project.
3. Spend time at networking events. Join your professional societies, even when you are still a student.
4. Summer jobs, internships, and co-op jobs.
Thank you for sharing your insights on the challenges architects face in transitioning from education to professional practice. Your experience of over 40 years brings a LOT of valuable perspective to the ongoing issues in the field!
You rightly point out the two crucial phases in an architect's education: academic and practical experience through programs like AXP. The emphasis on passing licensing exams adds complexity to the journey, making it a continuous learning curve.
Your observation on the resistance of some architecture schools to position themselves as vocational training institutions is noteworthy. Plus, your positive experience with hands-on drafting classes and on-the-job training emphasizes the importance of practical skills. Your wealth of experience adds depth to the conversation, benefiting both seasoned professionals and those starting their architectural careers. Thank you for the comment. It will help many.
Aaaah Nat! Everything you’ve mentioned is not only true, but your feelings about corporate vs starchitect is extremely valid. It can be really frustrating, and I’m sure even moreso being in a designer role who is genuinely passionate about the industry such as yourself, but just know we’re cheering you on over here and want nothing more but for you to continue to be passionate about what you do everyday! We’ll be here for you while you continue to navigate ❤
thank you Nadia!! I deeply appreciate our supportive friendship over the past few years
This is the most authentic and relatable video I think I’ve seen on the topic - maybe because I often feel similarly and am in what sounds like a similar position as you - either way, great video.
It is tough that school doesn’t really prepare us for the real-world of the industry.
I’ve found the working for a genuinely good firm that values their people is the biggest thing that has helped me deal with the “unpreparedness”.
Sure, there can be unfulfilling days like you said, but at the end of it, if you’re valued by your firm and teammates, that really is a blessing.
You’re really already ahead of so many. Never stop learning, growing, and seeking to get better!
Thank you for the words Alex! I think you’re 110% right in regard to finding the right firm that you fit well with and who will also support your own development and growth… it’s unfortunate that a lot more teaching responsibility falls more on the firm rather than school. But like you said, it’s a matter of finding the right firm and a good balance. Best of luck to you whether you’re in school or in practice(-:!
This stands for most professions especially technical professions. The best take is the education gets you in the door of the profession. What you do after is what will make your career. Very little from my education was practically applied.
I refer you all to my previous comments. You were all lied to by your Architecture School. You'll get to design something after around a min. of 5-10yrs of working in practice. Up until that point you'll be doing utterly tedious layout, planning and technical drawings. 7 years training for that......I went through it all 20yrs back and ended back at University recently having been through the architecture mill, and this alone saddened me the most for the 20-something's there, who were so full of excitement, wonder and creativity, now knowing what I do. Then add-in the additional reality that our industry is THE lowest paid of every profession when set against the amount of time required to qualify. And this applies world-wide.
I think these points are very important and there are a lot of improvements that need to be made to architecture programs. Would love a walkthrough of your thesis video!!
Maybe, and this would be time consuming of course. But maybe you could do little side projects of your own designs, or start doing some interior design on the side. It’s how I keep my creative juices flowing during a corporate job!
that is an awesome suggestion, Alana!!! I am definitely trying to get more into architecture competitions too! but definitely having something going on the side of the 9-5 corporate job will help(:
Thank you SO much for making such this video. You cleared so much stuff for me so many questions that i didn't know who to ask them to...
Let me know if you have any other questions!! I’ll do my best to answer
I am criminal justice major not even related to architecture, prior to Covid-19 however, architecture and engineering was something I was very interested in. My Highschool and middle school offered programs teaching how to use Inventor and variety of design software's. Additionally my father works of the company that provide training tech support for inventor and other software's even help fixed some of the coding bugs. So I had a lot of exposure to those software enough to learn that it was not for me however I still use those skills to fool around with the 3-D printer and help design run in sheds on my families ranch.
Kind of shocking you guys don't get to learn enough, for your careers in college. I know my major complete different but criminal justice is really for students looking to become a cop. While my college offers so many resources and educational opportunities. We were given access to the police shooting simulator and all our professors are ex cops or active cops. They frequently gave us real world scenarios and mostly ignored the text book form what it like on the job.
I’ve noticed a general trend with most professions where the big name firms are more soul crushing and keep you in an intellectual box, whereas smaller firms (because of their lack of size) actually need and want you to grow in many ways. The architecture firm in at now is on the smaller size and I feel like I’ve gotten more 1 on 1 mentoring. Yeah my salary isn’t close to what the Gensler people make but it I’m so much more versatile in my role which I feel in the long run will make up for it.
It's interesting to hear about your experience in the architecture profession and your observation regarding the impact of firm size. Your insight suggests that smaller firms offer more personal growth and one-on-one mentoring (which I definitely agree with as I have also worked at a smaller firm for a year), despite potentially lower salaries compared to larger counterparts.
Your willingness to prioritize versatility and mentorship over immediate financial gains highlights the importance of holistic career development!!!!! Thanks for sharing, and it's inspiring to hear about your positive experience in a smaller firm that values individual growth and fosters a dynamic professional environment(: I should've mentioned that before
I feel like crap about graduating tbh. I don't think my portfolio is up to industry standards and I know the my skill are likely to not apply to finding an appropriate job. I wish I could start over or move into something that was not design oriented
It's very true. 7 years yet we learn nothing of what you need to know for 99% of the work you're going to do as an architect. Imagine med school operating this way. You can definitely incorporate design and practical courses within those 7 years. I look at college (not university) courses for programs like "construction engineering technology" and feel envious of the things I wish learned to better prepare for the workplace. University education spends so much time teaching useless things it seems. So strange...the people in college know more than university grads but the job ads require a university education instead of college - it's all an illusion
my thoughts exactly 👏👏perfectly put. Its all just so frustrating
It's soooo disheartening when educational paths don't align with the practical demands of the profession. I was talking to a graduate nursing student last night and she was explaining to me how her last full year of school has just been preparing her for her board exams. It's undeniably true - incorporating more design and practical courses within the curriculum could better equip aspiring architects for the real-world challenges they'll face. It's indeed perplexing when job postings *prioritize* university degrees over the practical knowledge gained... I hope this up and coming generation can shift all of this toward more comprehensive and practical education..
Hi so good to see you back, i am studying at measi academy of architecture, india. I am only in my 2nd year of school right now and thankgod we're getting taught revit but it's very basic. I guess we'll have t learn ourselves the rest. It would be soooo beneficial if the school did teach all the things you mentioned.
Great vid! Just wanted to say I’d love to see your thesis walkthrough! Those kind of videos I really enjoy!
yay okay(:
Great insight once again and i think you should continue making these kind of videos to shed more light on the realities of this great field that we are involved in.
hope to do just that! authenticity is hard to find and hard to maintain these days online
Yeah certainly but atleast you keep it real @@UnravelingArchitecture
You don't like what you do, then create your own firm and be the boss, corporate will never care about your designs or your passion.
I am from Lithuania, we have different art academia and universities, where you can study architecture. I studied for 6 years, now I have practiced in different offices for over 12 years😅 Also work with students and I must agree with you about mostly everything. I am sorry that you felt such a gap and from your eyes it looks like you have a lot of pressure at work. With years it will be easier but yeah, universities, academia, collages take accents not in the most important things of architecture and draw it like the art😂 it is a hell business 😢 however, all knowledge is valuable and after new skills you will see the difference, artistic minds and thoughts always be in you, do not let them go.😊
THIS! I am in my 5th year and I feel like don't know the basics of how to be an Architect. Some keep saying you gonna learn this along the way, while others are like YOU DON'T KNOW THIS AND YOU ARE A 5TH-YEAR STUDENT, SERIOUSLY? But, it's just... It's pointless that somebody COULD have told us these things before. That's when I always keep wondering if architecture is really for me, or if should I consider other majors?
I totally get where you're coming from, and it's completely normal to feel this way, especially in the demanding field of architecture. It can be overwhelming, and the conflicting advice doesn't make it any easier. Just remember, the learning curve in this profession is steep, and it's okay not to have all the answers in your 5th year. I'm sure most successful architects have been through similar doubts.
Consider seeking guidance from mentors, both within and outside your academic circle. Additionally, I've shared some videos on my channel about overcoming challenges in architecture and finding your path. Maybe they can provide some insights and encouragement during this challenging time. Remember, it's okay to question and reassess. With an architecture degree, you can transition into roles such as urban planning, project management, real estate development, sustainable design consulting, interior design, graphic design, construction management, 3D visualization, BIM specialization, or facilities management. You've come this far for a reason!
@@UnravelingArchitecture Yes! I agree. It can’t be all bad. I can’t deny that architecture helped me as a person. That’s for sure!
This talk is for sure something that people in this field should be open about more!
Thank you for your comment! I really enjoy your videos!
I am from Morocco btw 🙏❤️
I really appreciate your insight. This was very helpful.
currently in high school taking drafting classes, I've already been accepted into college for architecture but after seeing this video and others like it... I'm having second thoughts about the degree :( I really like drafting, but the fact that job placement is hard and the actual job is nothing like academics is highly deterring. I really don't know where to turn from here
Great video, but all the feelings you're stating are valid. It's an international issue unfortunately. I also find there needs to be a combination of the BA/BSC format of architecture curriculum in schools. You can tell, well I can tell who's come from a BA/BSC school from their approaches to design. There's a lot to uncover but, I think give the experience a good run. They're always other fields adjacent which you can go into. Remember, you're not supposed to know everything, it comes with practice and time. Again begs the question of universities implementing a fake real-life scenario into their curriculums. So, students can get a better understanding of the field.
I agree with everything 100% went through the same 7 years of education
OMG THANK GOD THAT EXIST PEOPLE LIKE MEEE
I feel the same way even that I am not working yet I am so scared to finde the job and to start my career as an architect because in collage we just lerand how to be creativ and not to be preper for work
It is interesting, I'm doing a double of architecture and construction management. If I wasn't doing construction management, I would have no units about budget, cost estimation or project management.
You’re smart for the double major! Bravo! That will help you tremendously!!!
Although general architectural education always has its challenges, Penn and its faculty's pedagogy have been far removed from real architecture. They fail to teach students to think like architects. Drawing from my experience as a Penn Design student, their obsession with creating funny looking 'avant-garde' forms is superficial and merely for visual entertainment. Instead of considering the context and narrative of built spaces, they churn out countless iterations of formal studies that lack meaning. I can attest that Penn Design boasts one of the most hardworking student bodies, but as an alum and practicing architect who often reviews portfolios for hiring, I feel sorry for the students. I hope the new chair will bring positive change to the school.
I bet they don't teach you Revit because the Uni's cheap out and don't want to pay the license costs.
Good topic. Architectural education is broken, and has been for a long time. All schools should have a complete curriculum of professional practice. But unfortunately they leave this to architecture firms to teach in the intern phase. Architecture firms then pay interns much less because they need to train them. You should do a video on the path to licensure so students know how long and difficult it is.
I'm currently a 3rd year undergrad, last year our professors sat my class down and went through the steps of architectural licensing in the United States and there was a feeling of "how long will I really have to do this?" that I think everyone felt by the end of the presentation. 5-7 years of school, another 5-10 years for experience, and then another undetermined amount of time for exams. I feel there is a lot of pressure put on new architects and makes it very hard to make a practice for yourself early in life.
I completely agree that architectural education needs a revamp. Including a comprehensive curriculum of professional practice within schools could significantly bridge the gap between academia and the real-world demands of the field. It's unfortunate that much of this crucial training is left to architecture firms during the intern phase, often leading to lower pay for interns due to the training burden. I did also made a video on licensure requirements for both international and domestic students! but always open to suggestions. Thank you Roberts!
starting architecture school in a few weeks nervous about not wanting to fail and all that, how do you calm these nerves...
and I've already watched the how to thrive video😅😅😅
It is 100% normal and a natural feeling to be nervous before you jump into anything new! A new school and a new major is a new beginning! I’d just say really lean into it. Don’t play it safe either in school. One of my regrets is I played it far too safe with my projects, and could’ve done more theoretical projects and thrived. Failing is honestly a good thing and it’s better to fail fail fail in school at a project vs fail in professional practice - so lean into it! You’ll be okay!
@UnravelingArchitecture hope so thank you 🙏hope the channel grows and you can help more people
Are you concerned your employer will see this and perhaps conclude you will be unfulfilled at their firm and that hiring an Ivy League educated person was in error?
hahaha! Nope, not at all!! I have discussed this with both of my bosses months ago, and my performance and reviews remain excellent. I started the channel to stay authentic, a trait often lost by creators over time. Now, as a graduated architecture student (not licensed yet), I aim to document the journey in architecture sincerely. Hoping it resonates with high schoolers/college students/etc, helping them avoid unnecessary challenges and know what they're signing up for. Authenticity is rare online. So, if an employer fires me over this, it signals an incompatible fit.
OMG! I love this lady. Hehehe...
Thank you, ma'am
Did you not participate in a mentorship or internship in high school? You would have learned a lot of that in those formative years.
I had several mentorships while in school. Had no opportunities nor didn’t really think about it when I was a teenager in high school.
Regardless, after going through the whole educational system and architecture school, I do believe there are several areas of improvement.
Hearing all of this makes me nervous. I just put my acceptance into my college for architecture, I’m sure I’ll end up being fine but all I hear are negatives 🥲
Absolutely -- but I want to assure you that my passion for architecture remains strong. In fact, I have several videos on my channel highlighting the positive aspects of the major and the field. If you check out some of those videos, you'll see that I'm genuinely excited about the journey, and there are many rewarding aspects to focus on. I believe in showing both the positive and negative side of things.
I do believe that architectural education though should really be challenged and adjusted. And the way to challenge and adjust it is to openly talk about it have have debates on what works and what doesnt