Any conversation in which the traditional and mainstream narratives regarding early Islam as they have been taught by our 'ulama throughout the past 1400 years are challenged is "great conversation" for you.
@@hasakicioguz9312 Why does it matter to you if the mythological Mecca existed or not? Mecca is doctrinal construction, which serves narrative functions. The same thing can be said about Medina for all its potency. How would this affect your belief in a cosmic deity?
Who says it does. Christians project so much on Islam. You have so many dogmas in your religion (e.g. trinity, nature of Christ, sacraments, etc) that most simple everyday believers don’t even comprehend or believe. Islam has only one dogma- There is only one God and Muhammad is his prophet. Don’t project your dogmatic experience of religiosity onto Muslims. Muslims just can’t help but feel somewhat outraged at the arrogance and condescending attitude of the Western academia which has the audacity to say that Muslims have no historical memory and that instead we have to replace our narrative reflect ing our collective historical memory with their almost exclusively hypocritical narrative which relies almost 100% on the supposed lack of evidence to support Muslim narrative as their sole evidence. The absence of evidence is not the evidence itself. It doesn’t mean that if there is no evidence for something now that the evidence for that might be found in the future. That is the fallacy of the Western academia in trying to rewrite the Islam’s narrative.
58:40 No Fred, if you are Christian, you do not believe in one God (according to Judaism and the Quran). The fact that (sometimes) Christian are more or less praised is due to the fact that the public targeted by the Quranic texts are Christians.
What can an eminent professor and historian at the university of chicago who has produced first-rate peer-revied scholarship can learn from an evangelical apologist?
He will be shocked when he find out the real origins of this moon-otheistic sect that was born out of polytheistic arab moon gods pre-islam, then added monotheistic elements and final end product "islam" as we know today. The rabbit hole is literally endless
You kept talking about believers...!! But believing in what though?????? It's believing in God & only God and that prophet Mohamed peace and blessing be upon him is the last messenger.......!!!!!
Thank you for this. I love listening to Dr. Donner.
Great conversation. Thank you.
Any conversation in which the traditional and mainstream narratives regarding early Islam as they have been taught by our 'ulama throughout the past 1400 years are challenged is "great conversation" for you.
@@hasakicioguz9312 Why does it matter to you if the mythological Mecca existed or not? Mecca is doctrinal construction, which serves narrative functions. The same thing can be said about Medina for all its potency. How would this affect your belief in a cosmic deity?
Who says it does. Christians project so much on Islam. You have so many dogmas in your religion (e.g. trinity, nature of Christ, sacraments, etc) that most simple everyday believers don’t even comprehend or believe. Islam has only one dogma- There is only one God and Muhammad is his prophet. Don’t project your dogmatic experience of religiosity onto Muslims. Muslims just can’t help but feel somewhat outraged at the arrogance and condescending attitude of the Western academia which has the audacity to say that Muslims have no historical memory and that instead we have to replace our narrative reflect ing our collective historical memory with their almost exclusively hypocritical narrative which relies almost 100% on the supposed lack of evidence to support Muslim narrative as their sole evidence. The absence of evidence is not the evidence itself. It doesn’t mean that if there is no evidence for something now that the evidence for that might be found in the future. That is the fallacy of the Western academia in trying to rewrite the Islam’s narrative.
Great work, Laith. An interview with John Woods would be an excellent complement to this interview.
I hope they take up this suggestion
@@Corvinuswargaming1444 Coming soon! Stay tuned.
Dr. Donner is a wonderful man. You can learn a lot from him.
Great time of listening (not reading 😊) thanks a lot
Looks great
The effect of the web "the loss of the capacity to read... collective suicide in cultural terms."
Strong agreement with the other commenter, please have John Woods on this channel
Coming soon! Stay tuned.
@@seldoninstitute fantastic!
Thanks God for Islam ❤❤❤
Its me
58:40 No Fred, if you are Christian, you do not believe in one God (according to Judaism and the Quran). The fact that (sometimes) Christian are more or less praised is due to the fact that the public targeted by the Quranic texts are Christians.
This person should attend Dr. Jay Smith lectures on islamic origins where he could learn even more. God bless...
What can an eminent professor and historian at the university of chicago who has produced first-rate peer-revied scholarship can learn from an evangelical apologist?
@@Sam76475 Anything and Everything can be learnt from professor Jay Smith. God bless.....
@@trinitymatrix9719
Give key examples that are important to you that Fred Donner can learn from him?!?
He will be shocked when he find out the real origins of this moon-otheistic sect that was born out of polytheistic arab moon gods pre-islam, then added monotheistic elements and final end product "islam" as we know today. The rabbit hole is literally endless
He is more or less clueless on the real origins. He got his paychecks from arab oil sheykhs
Oh no. He's one of these people whose every sentence trails off into a mumble.
Makes listening a chore.
You kept talking about believers...!!
But believing in what though??????
It's believing in God & only God and that prophet Mohamed peace and blessing be upon him is the last messenger.......!!!!!
wrong,.... it's believing in grace. (love) god is love. mohammed wasn't about love but abouy the opposite of love...namely power!!!!!