10 years ago there was a small youtuber who said 'Gokus strongest form will look like his base form' and I just wonder where they are right now and what they are doing
@@undefinedYT The other forms make him increase or decrease in size slightly, and make his hair spiky, or in some cases (ssj3) make his hair much longer, whereas these forms literally do nothing but change his hair colour
True UI isn’t even a new form. It’s the same Omen state just being used differently (not like an angel, but like a Saiyan). Plus it’s more compatible with his natural base instincts compared to a Super Saiyan form
@@ÉmileMelançonbuddy you can't use MUI's powers properly with an uncalm heart, it's been shown multiple times in the Manga, it can only be used properly with a calm heart which Goku himself told Gas before their fight.
@@raiden8991 Just one problem with that: The "calm heart" version of UI is arguably just Whis' telling of his own version of UI. Among angels, a calm heart is their apex potential. Among saiyans, it's different, and that's gotta be why Whis finally was like "fuck it, find your own version". The avenues and interpretations of sensory and mental inputs that an angel uses for UI aren't the same as what a saiyan would use. I'll bet you Whis was only bitten by Goku in that pre-ToP scene because angelic UI doesn't pick up on that shit, but saiyan UI would've seen it a mile away because that's precisely the kind of barbaric shit it would look for.
@@Erythrium Buddy Goku literally told Gas that he needs to keep his heart calm in order to use the silver haired form to it's full potential, the reason why he was losing to Gas earlier with Vegeta is because he wasn't able to keep his heart calm which restricted the form from evolving, Whis literally told Goku to one use the silver haired form if the situation is dire, when Goku at end used MUI the right way he was easily able to overpower an an even stronger Gas by Grabbing and throwing him into space with his ki avatar. The whole narrative about Goku biting whis was a GAG scene that was only seen in the anime not the Manga lol. Bro just stop using this headcanon about "saiyan UI" cuz UI carries the same concept and emotions only hinder it's growth which is why Goku wasn't even able to hold the black haired form longer than he should have.
I like the idea that Goku learns from his extremely powerful forms and then turns them into something that fits him more. It actually feels like he's a martial artist learning a variety of techniques from others and then fine tuning them in his own special way. I think that's better than him just getting a new form and winning. He passes a limit, learns from it, and makes it a benchmark!
Yeah this is a good evolution for Goku as a character. One thing I wish super focused more on is Goku's usage of forms. And by that I mean his reliance. They did focus on it here and there, but it could've been a bigger deal. SSG gave him a new realm of power he hasn't felt since Vegito and then he's continously evolving on top of that. Making the forms feel natural and he even gets UI sign and MUI and now he feels strong. Beerus and Whis are stronger, but he doesn't see them as an objective yet. Broly could be a good catalyst for Goku to realize his overreliance on all his new forms, studying UI with Whis could bring him to his answer of TUI like it did. All in all I wish they could've written Goku going back to his roots in a way, better.
@@pesky2119 buddy the problem is, TUI is nothing more than UI sign and MUI anyway is Goku's form, provided he needs to be in the right mindset to maintain it.
It's 2024, the silver haired form IS Goku strongest form. DB fans can't read or comprehen even if their lives depend on it and think "TUI" which is a term created by them, is superior to MUI. What they call TUI is just U.I omen/sign but with more liberty of using his emotions without losing power.
fr, bro doesn't ahve 'true' UI yet. He's still in the phase of using UI as a form and not a state. His silver haired form is the current SSJ3. Super strong but taxing on his mortal body.
basically, true ultra instinct is just the technique applied to his base form while mastered ultra instinct is the actual transformation Kinda like ultimate gohan which looks like his base form but beast gohan actually has that power multiplier of ssj2
@@ashonnogordon3285 it does cuz MUI is officially confirmed to the strongest version of UI, and what yall call TUI is nothing but omen itself, all Goku did was put his emotions in that form and it's not something new since Goku has done that against Moro as well while he was in UI sign, so stop calling it a new form lol.
mui is like that strogest character in the game but you dont know how to play whit tui is like your fav or og character in the game it dont have the same hax but you fell good playing whit it
I like the idea of Goku using TUI more often even tho its weaker than MUI. I wanna see the form expanded upon in future arcs. Maybe next DB video could go over the SSJ grades and the multipliers since it’s kinda a point of contention among fans. Most notably the debate of whether or not Grade 4 is stronger than Grade 1.
Yeah. Imagine they actually recreate the hype of SSJ1 again in an intense fight with a new Ultra Instinct infused variant. That would actually be awesome and would look sick
It’s complicated Technically grade 2 doesn’t have a direct drawback, it’s merely an upgrade from grade 1. Grade 3 is a massive increase in strength, but in return it drastically reduces the speed and stamina of the user in a fight, it’s basically the body getting heavier and the body isn’t used to having such a heavy weight on the user. This does require a bit of headcanon to explain it tho. Since it never gets addressed exactly whether grade 4 became the new ssj1 or not. From what I interpret. Super saiyan is a form that when it debut is shown to have an explosive boost in power. but at the time it had a subtle change in the user's personality. the point im trying to make is that the form seems to be alien to the body. and because its not used to this level of power, it cant be used to its fullest due to it being a form that can be exhausting physically and mentally for the user to tap into. Super saiyan grade 2 and 3 seem to be what happens when that sudden shift in power can get taxing on the body. As the muscles increase to likely react to the new power boost. This is again an interpretation but it has some merits with how the grades beef the user up and cause strain on the body. With goku concluding that the only real way to reach a new level is not to upgrade but to master the form, achieving the forms highest power without being taxing to the body. “Wouldn’t that mean grade 4 is stronger?” Yes but for the wrong reason. I’d say the reason grade 4 is strong is because it’s the result of the body merely adapting the to change of ssj grade 1 and preventing a strain on the users energy and stamina. It would explain why both goku and gohan no longer have a subtle change in tone when in the form. They’re completely comfortable. That being said, Id say that’s why goku is stronger even tho imo he’s still at a 50x multiplier, because goku is in perfect control of the form and can fight in it without struggle.
@@mrj1897I think your explanation as to why Grade 4 is strong is sound. After much debating I came to a similar conclusion. The reason Mastered SSJ Goku and Gohan were so much stronger than Vegeta and Trunks despite Grade 4 only being 50x is because the training to get used to SSJ as a secondary base form on top of their usual basic training lead to a huge increase in power for their base forms. Essentially their base forms got massively stronger from the training to master SSJ and combining Mastered SSJ’s lack of stamina issues with the power that Goku and Gohan got from training makes for two incredibly strong warriors. This idea is even supported in the Buu Saga as we find out that Base Goku FAR surpassed Base Vegeta and since neither of them would’ve slowed down on their training that means the gap from the Cell Games would still be the same size.
@@MarioSonicBee yeah. I heavily disagreed with the notion that ssj grade 4 was a multiplier amp. As it contradicts goku being in base form after cell during all that time, since why would you ever be in base form if ssj is at its best when it’s on constantly?. It would make more sense that it was the result of their training to master the form being why they got so powerful. Goku was always a genius when it came down to fighting, training especially made that clear. Plus they specified clearly that the form as a result of their mastery made it feel natural to be in ssj. Whereas vegeta and trunks mentioned their time training was to reach a new level, it was all about power and not about the actual training in of itself. Which is again why I conclude that grade 4 is just the result of training in the form. As for the buu arc. Vegeta likely never caught up to goku because he spent most of his time training solo, and without much of a goal. Remember that vegeta trained not to be stronger than himself but to be stronger than goku, and when goku died, he’s shown to be visibly shaken up by this. Goku always had the upper hand because fighting and getting stronger was his obsession, he kept training his body and mind because he always kept wanting to improve himself. Which is what roshi had taught him during dragon ball by saying “there will always be someone stronger around the corner”
Then there's super saiyan 2. In a way it's the fifth grade of Super saiyan. The fully mastered version as there really wasn't any further to go with it besides making it like base form, like they made mastered SSJ (Grade 4) Every other form had a learning curve with it. SSG needed a ritual and while Goku's body adapted to it, Vegeta showed us that there were hoops to travel through to really get it, tho these hoops are linked to god ki and revolves around utilizing god ki to become SSG. SSB had an entire run of needed to be perfected in the manga. UI is still imperfect. SSJ3 brought back issues from the previous SSJ grades showing it's still very flawed. Besides the drawback of making your saiyan instincts go crazy, SSJ2 is pretty much a perfected SSJ. It has all the good qualities found in the SSJ grades and can be maintained. We haven't seen someone relax in SSJ2, but it could be possible. SSJ grade 4, could basically be what SSJ4 is, a new base state and SSJ2 could be the attack ready version.
@@onekidgamer577 I mean all Whis said was “it would seem so” vague. Unlike during the Tournament of Power where he objectively said “Perfected Ssb is the strongest form Goku has” I mean there’s also the fact that UI doesn’t just refer to the silver haired form but the technique in and of itself. Beerus didn’t specify the form
@@joelsasmad I see what you’re saying but I don’t think it is, but from the information in this vid since saiyan biology is so different I think that all of what is Ultra Instinct is now up for interpretation
I think Goku has gotten rid of the issues he had before with Silver Ultra Instinct, as he is shown to have greater efficiency with the form in the latest chapter of the DBS manga and in chapter 102, Beerus and Whis did confirm that Silver Ultra Instinct is Goku strongest and best form.
The main issue is that goku needs to be calm to activate and that he can’t use his emotions. I doubt those are fixed, but I also know that he didn’t need to use them against gohan since he’s just sparring
@@blazeknight2629 It’s more of that it wouldn’t be a match for Gohan Beast, as after Goku went Silver Ultra Instinct, he said “No point in taking our time. Our best moves, right off the bat! Let’s go!” That conveys that both are using their best power ups against each other, which is supported by Beerus and Whis revealing that the Silver Ultra Instinct is his best form.
@@blazeknight2629 Actually no, Goku at one point did go all out and that was when he was trying to dodge Gohan Beast at full power. The manga panels showed him his face was contorted with strain in his efforts to dodge as he was doing his best not to get hit. And when Gohan does land two big hits against Goku, Vegeta was surprised that Gohan was able to bypass Ultra Instinct reactionary speed and Vegeta’s a reliable source since he’s been training with Goku on Beerus’s planet after the Granola Arc, so he would know Goku’s current limits.
In conclusion: MUI = Overclock Mode TUI = Balanced Mode Soon, UI will likely become his base form, and SSJ might just be a power boost? or he might never use SSJ again. But this is Dragon Ball, so inconsistency is always an issue
I think the final evolution for Goku’s Ultra Instinct will be Goku fighting so freely in his base form (similar to his fight vs Uub) that there will never be a need for him to transform into Super Saiyan for a power boost again. He will be so in touch with his natural instincts that he’ll be able to output the most effective and efficient use of his power that Super Saiyan forms wouldn’t be able to do (since they’re a set multiplier and they drain stamina). Then when the time comes for a last resort Goku can switch into MUI temporarily to seal the deal.
That's what I'm hoping for. Just give him like a white aura or just have him wear his blue gi to symbolise his mastery. But give him absolutely no physical change.
You forgot to mention that true ui can have its dodge overwritten if the power difference is large enough, as seen when beast Gohan managed to overwrite ui’s dodge in their fight in the newest chapters
The final power up for goku I think will be him being able to use ui the silver haired form with his emotions while tui will be his base form. And with his other transformations his eyes in those forms will be silver.
It is important to note that Ultra Instinct itself is a technique, and the form that Goku takes is something that he himself uses to activate the technique because he does not have enough mastery over it to use it normally. Theoretically, once he fully masters it, he would be able to stack the full technique on top of his blue transformation.
Anyone else see the potential set up for a new saiyan based transformation? MUI goes against his Saiyan nature, so he’s gonna stick to the easier to use one while still keeping his Saiyan tenacity. He’ll eventually try to dabble further and go beyond it leading to a new transformation. Super Saiyan 4 becoming canon. Watch. (This is the biggest stretch I’ve ever made in my life).
5:56 minor correction but Kefla was actually still rivaling UI Omen’s power once she went SSJ2, both were causing the other to increase their power exponentially. Even at the very end of their fight it was made very apparent that either could’ve won the fight but since Goku had the superior form he pulled the victory.
It also ties into what Whis said at the start of the Granola Arc. MUI is the form Whis said Goku should use only when "Pushed to his limits" where as this new TUI is more akin to what Whis was talking about of using the form in base closer to his nature.
I mostly consider this debate as "which form is more narratively interesting" honestly. When the question comes up in debates, this is always how I view it
TUI Passive: Gain +100% speed and strength for as long as form is active MUI Passive: Gain +200% speed, strength and durability for 60 seconds, every next 30 seconds after loose 50% of speed, strength and durability till it's 50%
This is probably the best description. Goku mui accuracy is worse over time that's why granolah beat mui because he discover mui drawback and use that to gain adventage by let goku mui accuracy worse enough for granolah to knock goku out cold
@@user-xs3rc1ut8h The only reason why MUI's accuracy dropped was because Goku couldn't keep his heart calm, the form can only be used and maintained properly if the user is in the right mindset, he clearly explained this to Gas.
The example at the end made it reallllll digestible, because that's so true. The strongest character in a given game may not suit your play style, I know that feeling because of smash.
objectively/generally MUI is the better form (all around a greater multiplier) but for GOKU specifically, TUI is the better form since he's a saiyan, and their power stem from emotions which makes it hard to keep a calm heart and mind. (Although TUI literally contradicts the entire point of UI.)
Exactly. This was also confirmed by the last chapters of the Superhero saga where Goku states he is fighting Gohan with his strongest form, being MUI. TUI is just a better adaptation for saiyans. I just wish TUI was more distinct from UI Omen.
True UI should reach a master state that gives Goku an orange hair color and bonus points if it also has ssj4 design but orange. If would be peak if it requires a 'playful/excited' state of mind. Very Son Wukon, very Son Goku.
@undefinedYT they aren't any more overpowered than the ultra forms or beast, they'd probably open up new possibilities and bring back some gt characters.
@amensbuildingjourney i think ssj4 isn't stronger alone, but it could probably be combined with ssjgod or ssj or both and potentially get stronger that way. And kaioken would work well with ssj4.
Why isn't it ultra instinct sign when in the scan you provided it says sign(true)? also why would the lack of dodging be an enhancement when that's a key feature of UI?
if goku had the stamina to keep shifting forms like in the battle against zamasu, by shifting into MUI for defense and, idk, blue kaioken for example, he would have the perfect defense and attack
I find tui as similar to ssg, where future forms of goku will be stacked on top of it like how we got ssgss. Wouldnt be surprised if we got ssui or something down the line.
I have more details to add since a chapter came up, mui would be the better if goku is fighting someone he doesnt hate, like vegeta or whis or broly for sparing or someone in the tournament of power(that handle mui ofc) , but then tui would be better when goku is fighting a enemy that makes him rage. That's why goku used tui against gas and blackfrieza but used mui later against beast gohan.
Fuck both of these forms. Can't wait for Limit Breaker Goku
2 місяці тому
4:54 I thought of it like this. The xbox series s is an evolution to the one s while the same is true with the series x So tui to ui omen Ans hypothetical tmui to mui so I'd say tui ain't as strong as mui or is at least that strong because gas is stronger than mui
My theory is MUI is more of another SSJ form an idea of what UI truly is because of the Ki showing/leakage. Whis hinted to it as and the manga as well when speaking about Ki leakage, the perfected SSB had the Ki stay in the body, which Goku could not maintain for long. TUI will become the primary form due to it not leaking ki and being stackable. so the odder would be Mortal Ki SSJs God Ki SSG&B UIS MUI TUI no leakage and following SSG forms
Tell me if i kinda get the gist of it. Tui is just anorher version of mui in which he can use if he didn't want to have to suppress his feelings but mui is still stonger(as he stated) so tui is just a different route he can use which his is more efficient and comfortable with but besides that mui is stronger(as he stated after getting knocked out of tui he went mui and was able to surpass his opponent)tho he has to have a calm state of mind the majority of the time.
watching this video does raise a question, when they made the wish, was Freiza in the time chamber. that's the only explanation as to why Frieza was able to kill Gas so quickly. You'd figure if the wish was supposed to make him the strongest he would surpass Frieza even in his Black form.
MUI is the proper form the Angels use therefor it should be more powerful. However since Goku is a Saiyan who gains major strength buffs with his emotions you can make the case the Ultra Instinct Sign or Incomplete is what I would say because he could then use it his way which would give him access to his regular fighting style. Honestly, I think UI while amazing against Jiren which took the world by storm, it's outclassed by Ultra Ego in any form.
Tui is explained as a refined version of omen with emotions but We mui is still his trump can in the gohan battle as well as once goku is knocked out by gas he chooses to go into mui and use his avatar to overpower him once more showing its power is above mui
MUI is a transformation with everything it entails just like the god forms it has the shell brealing bit showcasing him evolving into something else, True UI is probably closer to the technique that Beerus uses: UI withou "transforming" as such TUI is closer to a Kaioken beeing that its "only" a technique that anyone could pull off in theory, this if I had to guess with all the "better suited for a saiyan" and allowing for emotions is paving the way for Super Saitan UI, just like SSB Kaioken
In the latest chapter, Beerus stated that MUI is Goku's most powerful form and whis didn't argue with that and we all know that Goku kept on training with whis since the granola arc
UI went from being really cool to really lame. The concept of Goku's ultimate method being just peak efficiency was awesome but then they couldn't help tying a transformation to it. I've always wanted the end goal for Goku and Vegeta to be them realizing they're beyond needing transformations.
It’s all about stamina issue and which can perform the longest we’ve seen some notable feats from both firms and its usage of power although mastered ultra instinct is a better true UI derives from goku’s heritage and power.
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you should do mystic/ultimate mode vs sjj 4 form since its stated that gohan is more superior than ssj3 and 2
let me tell you that the normal mui is weaker than tui goku but mui spiritual avatar is stronger than true ui
I just read a chapter in which whis clearly said mui>>>>>tui
Wow❤
So in short:
Mastered Ultra Instinct is performance mode while True Ultra Instinct is the battery saving mode.
nice one lol
MUI drains the battery so much bro got to dim the ki brightness in the settings 😭🙏🏻
Dark mode vs Light mode
@@Staygoofy243 lol
Yet people still seem to undervalue Jiren despite him not only keeping up with MUI but also outlasting his form.
10 years ago there was a small youtuber who said 'Gokus strongest form will look like his base form' and I just wonder where they are right now and what they are doing
White hair and black hair are completely different tho
@@undefinedYT The other forms make him increase or decrease in size slightly, and make his hair spiky, or in some cases (ssj3) make his hair much longer, whereas these forms literally do nothing but change his hair colour
@@kidgaming6529 im not talking about physique rn
@@undefinedYT the point is of all the forms mui easily represents his base the most closely
@@undefinedYTyou clearly can't read😂
True - efficient
Mastered - effective
Tui uses more energy than mui, bro
@@TippyGames-le7fq said who nigga?
@@TippyGames-le7fqits the other way around bro
@@JstFluxxy nahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
@@TippyGames-le7fq It's the other way around it's been said that overtime MUI loses it's effectivity the longer it's used.
So basically, MUI is like a gold pickaxe, and TUI is like an iron pickaxe (Minecraft)
couldnt have said it better
Best explanation 😂
Prolly more like mui being a gold pickaxe, because of how fast it is, but tui is a diamond pick. Not as fast but longer durability
@@sc_eliteiron is also slower with better dura
Yup
True UI isn’t even a new form. It’s the same Omen state just being used differently (not like an angel, but like a Saiyan). Plus it’s more compatible with his natural base instincts compared to a Super Saiyan form
Yeah, this tracks. I think TMUI will then probably use the same silver-haired transformation, just, again, used differently.
@@ErythriumYes, Goku learned to use Mui whitout a calm mind, so he keeps his emotions.
@@ÉmileMelançonbuddy you can't use MUI's powers properly with an uncalm heart, it's been shown multiple times in the Manga, it can only be used properly with a calm heart which Goku himself told Gas before their fight.
@@raiden8991 Just one problem with that: The "calm heart" version of UI is arguably just Whis' telling of his own version of UI. Among angels, a calm heart is their apex potential. Among saiyans, it's different, and that's gotta be why Whis finally was like "fuck it, find your own version". The avenues and interpretations of sensory and mental inputs that an angel uses for UI aren't the same as what a saiyan would use. I'll bet you Whis was only bitten by Goku in that pre-ToP scene because angelic UI doesn't pick up on that shit, but saiyan UI would've seen it a mile away because that's precisely the kind of barbaric shit it would look for.
@@Erythrium Buddy Goku literally told Gas that he needs to keep his heart calm in order to use the silver haired form to it's full potential, the reason why he was losing to Gas earlier with Vegeta is because he wasn't able to keep his heart calm which restricted the form from evolving, Whis literally told Goku to one use the silver haired form if the situation is dire, when Goku at end used MUI the right way he was easily able to overpower an an even stronger Gas by Grabbing and throwing him into space with his ki avatar.
The whole narrative about Goku biting whis was a GAG scene that was only seen in the anime not the Manga lol.
Bro just stop using this headcanon about "saiyan UI" cuz UI carries the same concept and emotions only hinder it's growth which is why Goku wasn't even able to hold the black haired form longer than he should have.
I like the idea that Goku learns from his extremely powerful forms and then turns them into something that fits him more. It actually feels like he's a martial artist learning a variety of techniques from others and then fine tuning them in his own special way. I think that's better than him just getting a new form and winning. He passes a limit, learns from it, and makes it a benchmark!
Yeah this is a good evolution for Goku as a character.
One thing I wish super focused more on is Goku's usage of forms. And by that I mean his reliance. They did focus on it here and there, but it could've been a bigger deal.
SSG gave him a new realm of power he hasn't felt since Vegito and then he's continously evolving on top of that. Making the forms feel natural and he even gets UI sign and MUI and now he feels strong. Beerus and Whis are stronger, but he doesn't see them as an objective yet.
Broly could be a good catalyst for Goku to realize his overreliance on all his new forms, studying UI with Whis could bring him to his answer of TUI like it did. All in all I wish they could've written Goku going back to his roots in a way, better.
Why are people debating between TUI and MUI when it's obvious Goku's obviously gonna reach TMUI eventually
This guy gets it. Clearly these different versions of UI all have their strengths and weaknesses. Goku has to learn to implement them all together.
That's hmdiwzi levels of strength
Honestly I took TUI as a step in him further mastering UI, TUI will become a part of the whole in his mastery of UI.
@@pesky2119 buddy the problem is, TUI is nothing more than UI sign and MUI anyway is Goku's form, provided he needs to be in the right mindset to maintain it.
It's bleach all over again! god damnit all!
It's 2024, the silver haired form IS Goku strongest form. DB fans can't read or comprehen even if their lives depend on it and think "TUI" which is a term created by them, is superior to MUI.
What they call TUI is just U.I omen/sign but with more liberty of using his emotions without losing power.
fr, bro doesn't ahve 'true' UI yet. He's still in the phase of using UI as a form and not a state. His silver haired form is the current SSJ3. Super strong but taxing on his mortal body.
basically, true ultra instinct is just the technique applied to his base form
while mastered ultra instinct is the actual transformation
Kinda like ultimate gohan which looks like his base form
but beast gohan actually has that power multiplier of ssj2
@@sirius_solaris using the word current for ssj3 makes it seem like that form will ever get over its stamina drain.
Bro the hair doesn’t mean it’s better that Tui
@@ashonnogordon3285 it does cuz MUI is officially confirmed to the strongest version of UI, and what yall call TUI is nothing but omen itself, all Goku did was put his emotions in that form and it's not something new since Goku has done that against Moro as well while he was in UI sign, so stop calling it a new form lol.
mui is like that strogest character in the game but you dont know how to play whit
tui is like your fav or og character in the game it dont have the same hax but you fell good playing whit it
Probably best way to describe it
De i use hax over the strongest ie i use sasuke over naruto so…. Hax and skill > power
@@aayewhyy hot take from me sauke is stronger than naruto but the plot
@@factsguy2006 i feel you he’s just better imo aswell but the show called Naruto so… i just said that to appease the fans
@@factsguy2006 Sasuke is more skilled than Naruto but Naruto is more powerful than Sasuke.
I like the idea of Goku using TUI more often even tho its weaker than MUI. I wanna see the form expanded upon in future arcs. Maybe next DB video could go over the SSJ grades and the multipliers since it’s kinda a point of contention among fans. Most notably the debate of whether or not Grade 4 is stronger than Grade 1.
Yeah. Imagine they actually recreate the hype of SSJ1 again in an intense fight with a new Ultra Instinct infused variant. That would actually be awesome and would look sick
It’s complicated
Technically grade 2 doesn’t have a direct drawback, it’s merely an upgrade from grade 1.
Grade 3 is a massive increase in strength, but in return it drastically reduces the speed and stamina of the user in a fight, it’s basically the body getting heavier and the body isn’t used to having such a heavy weight on the user.
This does require a bit of headcanon to explain it tho. Since it never gets addressed exactly whether grade 4 became the new ssj1 or not.
From what I interpret. Super saiyan is a form that when it debut is shown to have an explosive boost in power. but at the time it had a subtle change in the user's personality.
the point im trying to make is that the form seems to be alien to the body. and because its not used to this level of power, it cant be used to its fullest due to it being a form that can be exhausting physically and mentally for the user to tap into.
Super saiyan grade 2 and 3 seem to be what happens when that sudden shift in power can get taxing on the body. As the muscles increase to likely react to the new power boost.
This is again an interpretation but it has some merits with how the grades beef the user up and cause strain on the body. With goku concluding that the only real way to reach a new level is not to upgrade but to master the form, achieving the forms highest power without being taxing to the body.
“Wouldn’t that mean grade 4 is stronger?” Yes but for the wrong reason. I’d say the reason grade 4 is strong is because it’s the result of the body merely adapting the to change of ssj grade 1 and preventing a strain on the users energy and stamina. It would explain why both goku and gohan no longer have a subtle change in tone when in the form. They’re completely comfortable. That being said, Id say that’s why goku is stronger even tho imo he’s still at a 50x multiplier, because goku is in perfect control of the form and can fight in it without struggle.
@@mrj1897I think your explanation as to why Grade 4 is strong is sound. After much debating I came to a similar conclusion. The reason Mastered SSJ Goku and Gohan were so much stronger than Vegeta and Trunks despite Grade 4 only being 50x is because the training to get used to SSJ as a secondary base form on top of their usual basic training lead to a huge increase in power for their base forms. Essentially their base forms got massively stronger from the training to master SSJ and combining Mastered SSJ’s lack of stamina issues with the power that Goku and Gohan got from training makes for two incredibly strong warriors. This idea is even supported in the Buu Saga as we find out that Base Goku FAR surpassed Base Vegeta and since neither of them would’ve slowed down on their training that means the gap from the Cell Games would still be the same size.
@@MarioSonicBee yeah. I heavily disagreed with the notion that ssj grade 4 was a multiplier amp. As it contradicts goku being in base form after cell during all that time, since why would you ever be in base form if ssj is at its best when it’s on constantly?. It would make more sense that it was the result of their training to master the form being why they got so powerful. Goku was always a genius when it came down to fighting, training especially made that clear.
Plus they specified clearly that the form as a result of their mastery made it feel natural to be in ssj. Whereas vegeta and trunks mentioned their time training was to reach a new level, it was all about power and not about the actual training in of itself. Which is again why I conclude that grade 4 is just the result of training in the form.
As for the buu arc. Vegeta likely never caught up to goku because he spent most of his time training solo, and without much of a goal. Remember that vegeta trained not to be stronger than himself but to be stronger than goku, and when goku died, he’s shown to be visibly shaken up by this. Goku always had the upper hand because fighting and getting stronger was his obsession, he kept training his body and mind because he always kept wanting to improve himself. Which is what roshi had taught him during dragon ball by saying “there will always be someone stronger around the corner”
Then there's super saiyan 2. In a way it's the fifth grade of Super saiyan. The fully mastered version as there really wasn't any further to go with it besides making it like base form, like they made mastered SSJ (Grade 4)
Every other form had a learning curve with it. SSG needed a ritual and while Goku's body adapted to it, Vegeta showed us that there were hoops to travel through to really get it, tho these hoops are linked to god ki and revolves around utilizing god ki to become SSG.
SSB had an entire run of needed to be perfected in the manga.
UI is still imperfect.
SSJ3 brought back issues from the previous SSJ grades showing it's still very flawed.
Besides the drawback of making your saiyan instincts go crazy, SSJ2 is pretty much a perfected SSJ. It has all the good qualities found in the SSJ grades and can be maintained. We haven't seen someone relax in SSJ2, but it could be possible. SSJ grade 4, could basically be what SSJ4 is, a new base state and SSJ2 could be the attack ready version.
in the latest chapters beerus stated that mui is the strongest form of goku
To be fair, we don’t know if Beerus has even seen TUI yet
@@darknessemblemflame3036whis would of corrected him if he was wrong
Timeskip
CURRENTLY the strongest form
@@onekidgamer577 I mean all Whis said was “it would seem so” vague. Unlike during the Tournament of Power where he objectively said “Perfected Ssb is the strongest form Goku has” I mean there’s also the fact that UI doesn’t just refer to the silver haired form but the technique in and of itself. Beerus didn’t specify the form
For the 2635846 time….. Black hair is called “Ultra Instinct Omen or Ultra Instinct Sign”
White hair is just called “Ultra Instinct”
The issue is that it gets more confusing that way because "Ultra Instinct" is a skill that is separate from the White haired form.
@@joelsasmad I see what you’re saying but I don’t think it is, but from the information in this vid since saiyan biology is so different I think that all of what is Ultra Instinct is now up for interpretation
MUI looks better therefore it is better
Nah
It's just Goku with jizz hair lmao
@@Leo-Lapulga10 yeah
Looking better doesn’t mean it is better
TUI>>>
I think Goku has gotten rid of the issues he had before with Silver Ultra Instinct, as he is shown to have greater efficiency with the form in the latest chapter of the DBS manga and in chapter 102, Beerus and Whis did confirm that Silver Ultra Instinct is Goku strongest and best form.
The main issue is that goku needs to be calm to activate and that he can’t use his emotions. I doubt those are fixed, but I also know that he didn’t need to use them against gohan since he’s just sparring
@@blazeknight2629 It’s more of that it wouldn’t be a match for Gohan Beast, as after Goku went Silver Ultra Instinct, he said “No point in taking our time. Our best moves, right off the bat! Let’s go!” That conveys that both are using their best power ups against each other, which is supported by Beerus and Whis revealing that the Silver Ultra Instinct is his best form.
@@maximillianoorosco-randhaw9336 Same point as goku using ssb against krillen
@@blazeknight2629 Actually no, Goku at one point did go all out and that was when he was trying to dodge Gohan Beast at full power. The manga panels showed him his face was contorted with strain in his efforts to dodge as he was doing his best not to get hit. And when Gohan does land two big hits against Goku, Vegeta was surprised that Gohan was able to bypass Ultra Instinct reactionary speed and Vegeta’s a reliable source since he’s been training with Goku on Beerus’s planet after the Granola Arc, so he would know Goku’s current limits.
@@maximillianoorosco-randhaw9336 Using ultra instinct, however we know that using emotions also amp sayains a lot as well
In conclusion:
MUI = Overclock Mode
TUI = Balanced Mode
Soon, UI will likely become his base form, and SSJ might just be a power boost? or he might never use SSJ again. But this is Dragon Ball, so inconsistency is always an issue
I think the final evolution for Goku’s Ultra Instinct will be Goku fighting so freely in his base form (similar to his fight vs Uub) that there will never be a need for him to transform into Super Saiyan for a power boost again. He will be so in touch with his natural instincts that he’ll be able to output the most effective and efficient use of his power that Super Saiyan forms wouldn’t be able to do (since they’re a set multiplier and they drain stamina). Then when the time comes for a last resort Goku can switch into MUI temporarily to seal the deal.
That's what I'm hoping for. Just give him like a white aura or just have him wear his blue gi to symbolise his mastery. But give him absolutely no physical change.
7:16 back explodes is crazy choice of words
The " your main in a fighting game" comparison is the perfect analogy
You forgot to mention that true ui can have its dodge overwritten if the power difference is large enough, as seen when beast Gohan managed to overwrite ui’s dodge in their fight in the newest chapters
The final power up for goku I think will be him being able to use ui the silver haired form with his emotions while tui will be his base form. And with his other transformations his eyes in those forms will be silver.
Nah it's gonna be gay form
It is important to note that Ultra Instinct itself is a technique, and the form that Goku takes is something that he himself uses to activate the technique because he does not have enough mastery over it to use it normally.
Theoretically, once he fully masters it, he would be able to stack the full technique on top of his blue transformation.
Anyone else see the potential set up for a new saiyan based transformation? MUI goes against his Saiyan nature, so he’s gonna stick to the easier to use one while still keeping his Saiyan tenacity. He’ll eventually try to dabble further and go beyond it leading to a new transformation. Super Saiyan 4 becoming canon. Watch.
(This is the biggest stretch I’ve ever made in my life).
5:56 minor correction but Kefla was actually still rivaling UI Omen’s power once she went SSJ2, both were causing the other to increase their power exponentially. Even at the very end of their fight it was made very apparent that either could’ve won the fight but since Goku had the superior form he pulled the victory.
Well Kefla other half was the legendary super saiyan.
Can u make a video on explaining all forms of UI and their differences?
tf you mean "forms of UI". he just explained everything, TUI, UI omen and MUI those are the forms
@@yomadin difference between MUI and PUI
@@jithamithrank7647 tg is PUI?!
@@yomadin perfected UI
i did this btw, check out the mui vs tui vs uio thanks for the idea
2:01 most of us saw that moment on a television like that…..nice touch bro
I absolutely love how active you are right now with so many uploads! Also, great video
that last analogy was simply OP!!!
I hope he will be able to stack TUI ontop of other forms. I'd love a TUI/SSJ3 combo
Can’t wait to see Kaioken SSGSS3TMUI form
Kaioken x100 Ascended SSGSS4TMUI
Great video!
All I have to say is that the image on the right on this thumbnail is heat.
I just found ur channel and already like ur videos, the way you explain and give valid points just makes it perfect, new sub earned
I think why “T”UI doesn’t have a aura is because Goku sealed of his leaking energy like he did with SSB
The black hair looks so much doper then the white. Reminds me of Mysitc gohan
It also ties into what Whis said at the start of the Granola Arc. MUI is the form Whis said Goku should use only when "Pushed to his limits" where as this new TUI is more akin to what Whis was talking about of using the form in base closer to his nature.
TUI - Efficiency Mode
MUI - Performance Mode
W aVentsir
I mostly consider this debate as "which form is more narratively interesting" honestly. When the question comes up in debates, this is always how I view it
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TUI
Passive: Gain +100% speed and strength for as long as form is active
MUI
Passive: Gain +200% speed, strength and durability for 60 seconds, every next 30 seconds after loose 50% of speed, strength and durability till it's 50%
This is probably the best description. Goku mui accuracy is worse over time that's why granolah beat mui because he discover mui drawback and use that to gain adventage by let goku mui accuracy worse enough for granolah to knock goku out cold
@@user-xs3rc1ut8h The only reason why MUI's accuracy dropped was because Goku couldn't keep his heart calm, the form can only be used and maintained properly if the user is in the right mindset, he clearly explained this to Gas.
@@raiden8991 that's the point, rather then have stamina problems like top he have emotion problems which make mui weaker in granolah arc
The example at the end made it reallllll digestible, because that's so true. The strongest character in a given game may not suit your play style, I know that feeling because of smash.
W aven'tsir
Mastered Ultra Instinct has far better feats while True Ultra Instinct has a better look to the form. Reminiscent of Omen. Perfect Vid!!!
Great match
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Love your content ❤❤❤❤
Amazing analyzation like always avent!
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objectively/generally MUI is the better form (all around a greater multiplier) but for GOKU specifically, TUI is the better form since he's a saiyan, and their power stem from emotions which makes it hard to keep a calm heart and mind.
(Although TUI literally contradicts the entire point of UI.)
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Exactly. This was also confirmed by the last chapters of the Superhero saga where Goku states he is fighting Gohan with his strongest form, being MUI. TUI is just a better adaptation for saiyans. I just wish TUI was more distinct from UI Omen.
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I saw a Reddit Comment and there stood that TUI is more stable but weaker than MUI, MUI is stronger than TUI but less stable
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True UI should reach a master state that gives Goku an orange hair color and bonus points if it also has ssj4 design but orange.
If would be peak if it requires a 'playful/excited' state of mind. Very Son Wukon, very Son Goku.
Wont be long for the SUPER SAIYAN MASTERED UI to come when he fights black freiza. Im calling it now
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Goku MUI looks like an oil up version, bro looks so smooth 😁
We need super saiyan 4 & 5 to become a thing to help with this plot thread I think it will work
No it would be a complete mess, those forms are too overpowered and it corrupts writing
@@undefinedYT facts
@undefinedYT they aren't any more overpowered than the ultra forms or beast, they'd probably open up new possibilities and bring back some gt characters.
@@SilverbackJellybottomssj4 is still stronger than ui tbh in my opinion or at least a ssj4 with current logic
@amensbuildingjourney i think ssj4 isn't stronger alone, but it could probably be combined with ssjgod or ssj or both and potentially get stronger that way. And kaioken would work well with ssj4.
Where do i find the right thumbnail picture
Hey where do you find anime clips because they're very good quality
W aVEntsi
Why isn't it ultra instinct sign when in the scan you provided it says sign(true)? also why would the lack of dodging be an enhancement when that's a key feature of UI?
The black hair looks good
My favourite form is when he is fully black and glowing white temporarily. I know it's no form in itself technically but for me it is.
IN the manga ToP, Goku tells Jiren how he's keepingh is heart/mind calm when he's in UI Sign. So did it get retconned in the Granola Arc?
Zenkai boost is when sayians have a near-death experience as stated by vegeta after returning to namek after his fight with goku
if goku had the stamina to keep shifting forms like in the battle against zamasu, by shifting into MUI for defense and, idk, blue kaioken for example, he would have the perfect defense and attack
what song did you use from 8:13 to 8:45?
Song in the background at 6:05?
There is no song
@@Tgoat00 a bit before. It's piccolo theme thanks.
@@deni484deni sorry bro was having a bad morning
I find tui as similar to ssg, where future forms of goku will be stacked on top of it like how we got ssgss. Wouldnt be surprised if we got ssui or something down the line.
I have more details to add since a chapter came up, mui would be the better if goku is fighting someone he doesnt hate, like vegeta or whis or broly for sparing or someone in the tournament of power(that handle mui ofc) , but then tui would be better when goku is fighting a enemy that makes him rage. That's why goku used tui against gas and blackfrieza but used mui later against beast gohan.
Fuck both of these forms. Can't wait for Limit Breaker Goku
4:54 I thought of it like this. The xbox series s is an evolution to the one s while the same is true with the series x
So tui to ui omen
Ans hypothetical tmui to mui so I'd say tui ain't as strong as mui or is at least that strong because gas is stronger than mui
My theory is MUI is more of another SSJ form an idea of what UI truly is because of the Ki showing/leakage. Whis hinted to it as and the manga as well when speaking about Ki leakage, the perfected SSB had the Ki stay in the body, which Goku could not maintain for long.
TUI will become the primary form due to it not leaking ki and being stackable. so the odder would be
Mortal Ki
SSJs
God Ki
SSG&B
UIS
MUI
TUI no leakage
and following SSG forms
Tell me if i kinda get the gist of it.
Tui is just anorher version of mui in which he can use if he didn't want to have to suppress his feelings but mui is still stonger(as he stated) so tui is just a different route he can use which his is more efficient and comfortable with but besides that mui is stronger(as he stated after getting knocked out of tui he went mui and was able to surpass his opponent)tho he has to have a calm state of mind the majority of the time.
watching this video does raise a question, when they made the wish, was Freiza in the time chamber. that's the only explanation as to why Frieza was able to kill Gas so quickly. You'd figure if the wish was supposed to make him the strongest he would surpass Frieza even in his Black form.
who was the artist who drew Goku on the right in the thumbnail?
MUI is the proper form the Angels use therefor it should be more powerful. However since Goku is a Saiyan who gains major strength buffs with his emotions you can make the case the Ultra Instinct Sign or Incomplete is what I would say because he could then use it his way which would give him access to his regular fighting style.
Honestly, I think UI while amazing against Jiren which took the world by storm, it's outclassed by Ultra Ego in any form.
MUI is like trying to breathe while an entire room is telling u to manually breathe and if u do u crap out. TUI doesn’t care bout it
Why doe sit seem to me, Goku's first trigger for ultra instinct(Omen) was more powerful than the silver-haired one.
take a shot everytime he says ultra instinct in this video
5:49 Actually a weaker Goku because of his fight with Jiren, Kefla had the same energy as the U7 Spirit Bomb tho.
if you started off with the " using your main " comparison from the start i would have understood immediately
8:56 what game is that
tekken
take a shot every time he says Ultra Instinct
Tui is explained as a refined version of omen with emotions but We mui is still his trump can in the gohan battle as well as once goku is knocked out by gas he chooses to go into mui and use his avatar to overpower him once more showing its power is above mui
MUI is a transformation with everything it entails just like the god forms it has the shell brealing bit showcasing him evolving into something else, True UI is probably closer to the technique that Beerus uses: UI withou "transforming" as such TUI is closer to a Kaioken beeing that its "only" a technique that anyone could pull off in theory, this if I had to guess with all the "better suited for a saiyan" and allowing for emotions is paving the way for Super Saitan UI, just like SSB Kaioken
In the latest chapter, Beerus stated that MUI is Goku's most powerful form and whis didn't argue with that and we all know that Goku kept on training with whis since the granola arc
Why do you smoothiebrains kept calling UI, MUI? The hell is wrong with your brains?
Can’t tui also be used with other forms like ssj?
UI went from being really cool to really lame. The concept of Goku's ultimate method being just peak efficiency was awesome but then they couldn't help tying a transformation to it. I've always wanted the end goal for Goku and Vegeta to be them realizing they're beyond needing transformations.
What about PUI/perfected ultra instant vs tui/ True ultra instinct which is stronger
W aVENTSI
It’s all about stamina issue and which can perform the longest we’ve seen some notable feats from both firms and its usage of power although mastered ultra instinct is a better true UI derives from goku’s heritage and power.