After graduating from BGU (Blood God University) and received my MA in WH40KChaosTactics, I received a job in the Eye of Terror. All thanks to Professor Blog. *holds up flesh diploma with the seal of Chaos.*
DeVry can offer you a similar degree plan online. Between classes there with University of Phoenix and National American University I graduated with my Associates of Assistant Game Design with a minor in history of Thanksgiving. I'm still paying back my $50k student loan but very proud of how far I've come.
The first one has confused me wouldn’t another 3 world eaters be able to attack via being in contact with a base that’s in engagement range? ‘A model can fight if it is in base-to-base contact with another model from its own unit that is itself in base-to-base contact with an enemy unit.’ Also wouldn’t the other models have to move closer to not break unit Cohesion?
Used to use the Heroic Ingress trick myself all the time as a Custodes player. Dropping 6 Allarus Custodes was my favourite thing in the world, did not meet a single opponent who did not give me a " Are you serious? " look afterwards. Favourite instance was versus my best friend, his full squad of eight bound where ready to go slaughter my Witchseekers holding a No-mans objective, in comes the Allarus, and suddenly, he has no more Eightbound, still gives me shit for it to this day.
@@MrTheWarp Most of the local people I play with barely know what " Playing by intent " even is, so no, can't say I do. To be fair, I doubt most of them really think about why it works since they just tend to be annoyed, especially when doing it on a guard squad with a blade champion, since then it only costs 1 CP to rapid ingress them and you get to heroic intervene for free afterwards. And if they just so happen to be standing on an objective, well, you know what that means against Custodes.
@@NoName-PvPngl man, if you aren’t announcing this stuff at the beginning of the game or before a move is made you’re being an arse, “gotcha” moments suck and some tournaments don’t vibe with them at all
On the first tip, you can fight in two ranks as per the core rules so the bezerkers just need to base with their own unit to fight as well!? As per page 33 of the core rules "a model can fight if it is base to base contact with another model from its own unit that itself is in base to base contact with an enemy" therefore that isn't going to reduce the attacks or only by 1 berserker?
One other option with the 'Puncture Wound' is to charge the screening unit with Angron, but use fly to move over them and base them from behind. This can then put you close enough to the second unit to Pile In when the first unit is destroyed.
second trick sounds like bit stupid and not logic in a battleground , should be change in the rules, could kill a unit who can't answer is a bit shameless
As a Blood Angel player, I can’t condone your fanaticism with the ruinous powers… BUT as a fellow melee enthusiast, your tips and tricks for charging + piling in are INVALUABLE. Honestly, some of these tricks can feel “scummy”, specifically against newer players, but melee needs all the help it can get to be able to make a difference in this shooting/tank meta. Maybe the upcoming Pariah Nexus mission expansion will give us new strategies or incentives to get into melee easier
Thanks mate, I appreciate the kind words. A new mission pack brings the potential for a huge shake up, I do think the number one thing that influences combat is terrain however, if you have sufficient terrain you don't mind if your opponent has guns lol.
That second one, that guy who’s chilling in the middle to keep coherency, doesn’t he need to move towards the closest enemy, attempting to get into engagement??
This is pure gold - thanks for sharing these... Melee in 10th hits like a wet noodle (unless you're playing WE/Chaos) so any strategic insights into getting more out of the charge/fight phase in this edition is really appreciated.
In the first example, couldnt the world eaters still have more attacks by being in base contact with a model thats in base contact with an enemy unit? Im a new player so im still learning how this all works, but i thought that was a thing
Rule bending, cheese and poor tricks instead of using common sense. But many 40K and warhammer players always been like that, poor, pathetic community.
Tricks 2 and 3 feel very much allowed becasue of RAW rather than RAI. Which is fine, not arguing with their existence but it feels like they're pushing what the rules say to their absolute limit.
Can I make a pile in move to an enemy unit If i didn't charge that unit? Example, my trygon is set up 3" away from an enemy unit. He cannot charge after doing so. A pile in move would bring him within 1" and thus into engagement range of that enemy unit. So now he would be able to attack. Am I correct?
Referring to the strategy you used with Antron, where specifically does it say that a unit can still make a pile in and attack when it’s charge target is no longer there? I didn’t think this was possible.
In the second lesson (I think) about the the Berserkers into the 2 Guard unit (1 with FF): I thought you could only end in combat range on a pile in on the charged unit. I can understand piling in onto the other unit of Custodes (w/ FF) that were not a target of the charge but it sounds like an interpretation of the WAR over WAI to pile in into the non-charged unit. I can understand consolidating into combat range with the non-charged target after fighting. Then again my interpretation could be wrong. I only have a few games under my belt, so I have my grain of salt and my eat ready to be eaten. Also another reason/excuse is I may have had that taught to me (or just agreed on locally [they have small BCP tournaments too]). Which ever, I will except correction or guidance.
I understand people who feel this is RAW of RAI, I disagree however as GW could have copy pasted 9th rules across, so the removal of that restriction seems intentional to me
Some of the wording used in the piledriver example is confusing. The Objective Custodes squad IS eligible to fight, but only after you pile into it and make your attacks. The effect is to prevent them fighting first, not to prevent them fighting at all.
Question about the Heroic Ingress one. Unless im missing something, couldn’t the enemy choose not to charge after seeing that you Rapid Ingressed a unit in? Or better yet try to shoot them to death before they charge? Theyd be wasting a turn by not charging i know, but I feel like just charging them in knowing they’ll probably die is worse
They absolutely could, however chosing not to charge or choosing to shoot hounds instead of something else is a great deterrent and keeps other units alive which was the point all along
Question about the Piledriver portion of the video. I thought you could only fight targets that were declared targets of the charge, so you could NOT fight targets you piled into unless you declared them? Or is that a 9th edition thing that I never swapped out in my brain?
In the second example, Piledriver, aren't you not actually in coherency there? If a unit is more than seven models it must end its move within 2" of two other models. I'm not sure that the ones on the ends were making that.
You do still require coherency, I may not have articulated that perfectly in the video so thanks for the comment, I'd hate people to get the wrong idea
can someone explain the pile driver , as pile in is the first thing you do before fighting thus when you pile into the custodes this would make them eligible to fight meaning they can pop fight first, no?
Such tricks are pointless in Competitive gameplay. You can charge against rhino with undivided chosen and allocate even 4 wounds but your berzerkerz are dead before the battle begins. You can charge againt accursed cultists but it's both overkill and underkill.
@@BlogForTheBloodGod I am not sure what a WE player can do. Charging rhino with angron or demon prince seems overcosted. You need to destroy rhino in meele and kill battle shocked chosen in one phase or they kill you next turn.
Got into a heated debate over the piledriver and despite referencing the video, got told the video was totally wrong. Opponent claimed that the top squad of guard would still make their attacks first. I tried to explain the three stages of a "fight", as my understanding from the video was that as the pile in move is the first of the three stages, and this happened before the custodes were eligible to fight, that the three stages of the beserkers "fight" could not then be interrupted. He completely disagreed and I couldn't find anything written to contradict him... please help!
You are right. It's a simple matter of "activation" So you check at the start ofbthe fight phase to see who is eligible to fight, as the custodes are not eligible they cannot be activated. So you activate your berzerkers and go through the steps, once finished you then select the next unit
@@BlogForTheBloodGodthank you (this is my other account on my phone). Sent him a screengrab but he still says I’m wrong so will just avoid playing him in future lol
so let me get this straight, is it because Charging gives you Fights First which reads that they are eligible to fight means you can still pile in and attack even if your charge target dies? what about units with native Fights First? does this mean they can just pile in and fight on any target within 4" of them in the fight phase?
@@BlogForTheBloodGod it’s presented as ‘here’s a way to save a unit’ but really seems to play as ‘here’s another unit to feed the meat grinder’ Doesn’t seem all that threatening if you know proper risk/threat allocation
But, the fight first for Custodes gets activated at the start of the fight phase. So you can still use it. So the CSM Player has the choice to still pile into them (on the marker) or just ignore em. Wich will result in a asswhooping in the next turn. Do i get anythin wrong? My thoughts should be right with rules as writen. Start of fight phase is before pile in and Strat of Custodes does not state that they need to be in contact with another unit. Worth the use of 2CP in my point of view. But your advice is gold for many many other scenarios. Thx!
@@BlogForTheBloodGod Okay, sooooo. Because the FF is in the Core Rules stated before the pile in it will loose its "power" after the pile in. And that is possible because you are in contact with the second unit. But, you also get the FF Buff as the charging unit. So do you loose it also after pile in, cause you didn't use in in the FF step? Or are you just able to hit the Guard Squad wich is not on the Marker? Cause the defending Player will choose the First fight in fight normal, wich would make the Charge irrelevant🤔 You see my Problem? Why should the Custodes not be able to fight first, but the Zerkers can though they also didn't use the buff in FF step. If they pile in they loose the FF then.
Yep, looked it up in old Rulebooks and 10th. The big difference is that in 10th nowhere is written "charging units fight first". In 10th the book states that " a charging unit the fight first buff gets" So either both get FF, or Zerker can hit the squad they are in melee with first, or the pile in happens and it is fight normal.
@@BlogForTheBloodGod But, i'm at a tournament on the 11th of February and there will be a big Part of the Austrian National Team (i think a former Grandmaster will be there too) and i will ask them about their Interpretation. Cause shure, if you use the "charging units always fight first" you are 100% right. But thats not the same in 10th anymore, i think. Cause you just get the same buff as others can get.
@@BlogForTheBloodGod Hi! Got a Chance to talk to one of them early in the local hobby store. I admit humbly that i was wrong, my brain was tangled at the last step but it is total clear to me now. Thx for bringing it into my fokus, even if it is very situational with the many many variables (Charge roll, position of both troops, if custodes as enemy he pulls -1dmg on one grp and -1hit karate for ouch fightback, Trajann in 2nd troop?, blablub) Again, sorry for the hustle. I will keep that in Mind for the tourney, even though i dont play the golden Bubs!
@@BlogForTheBloodGod ah okay thanks for the clarification. I think as Ork it‘d hard to do shenanigans against custodes. But i could try to charge in chaff grots. :)
Great vid! In the pile driver, would the custodes player be able to still fight in the "remaining combatants" (non-fights first) step, since they are now within engagement range, provided there are any left?
Thanks bro. Some great tricks here. On my way to a massive apocalypse day and hope i can use these tricks with my world eaters. ( I get to use my whole collection) I'll let you know how many skulls I'll grab for the skull throne.
Are you really allowed to "abuse" the base-to-base contact rules like that? Can you move your models in such a way that the ones that move first, prevent your other models from being able to get into base-to-base contact? I thought the rules meant that if spreading out your models meant more of them could achieve it, then you had to do so, even if it meant completely encircling the enemy.
@10:30 in case you dont kill the top squad of custodes after making your attacks, would the custodes be eligible to fight back since they are now in engagement range? Also if the top squad would heroicaly intervene, they would be in engagement range at the start of the fight phase and could use their fight first and kill your berserker or am i wrong?
If they become eligible to fight after the pile in, what prevents them from triggering their fights first strat at that time? What is the likelihood of 8 Zerkers being able to kill two different 5 man bricks of custode guard? They will save on 3+ and take 1 to 2 damage per wound against their 3 wounds. However, I just pulled this move off against Black Templar Sword Brothern squad of 5 and a Primaris Crusader Squad. With Kharn in my crew, it was skulls for the skull throne all day long!
You know these are essentially gotcha tactics. This is the sort of thing that GW tried to remove in tenth with the changes in the fight faze . Yeah this is all legal but it’s not in the spirit of the game.
10th edition is so Shooting heavy I think combat armies need every trick they can get. And it's not a gotchya if I make videos explaining how the tricks work and how to counter them hahaha
@@BlogForTheBloodGod this is a poor defense. While I wish you all the success in the world, your videos reach a fraction of the WH40K playerbase. This is still "gotcha" tricks and anti-ROI
Essentially you are using it to charge them with a second unit in their charge phase, allowing you to put their models in base contact with a unit that was not the intended target of the charge
A question about the Berserkers at 5:34 , after they pile in, would the half of the unit that wasnt able to get into base contact die due to unit coherency?
Just curious about the Custodes point. FF happens at the start of the fight phase. So in this situation before your unit activates you would have already known if the unit outside of engagement was given FF. if you pile in there to them then you have started your activation but moved into a unit that already has fights first. So wouldnt the unit on Objective just fight first in that case? Thanks in advance for help.
@@johnaxios6335 no the pile driver trick will always work because of how activation works. All charging units get fight first so they fight before non fights first units. By piling into a FF unit you skip their initial FF effect and can fight before them as you must finish the activation. However should the FF unit live in this case the Custodes on objective they must take the next fight phase activation unless the Custodes player has another FF unit
Yeah, its almost like the rules are so shaky that playing optimally almost always feels like cheating XD. Its been that way since like 5e and it hasnt gotten any better.
@BlogForTheBloodGod quick question about the puncture maneuver, doesn't angron have to declare the (in this case) tank as part of his charge in order to fight it? Or can theoretically if the charged unit is destroyed you can just consolidate into the next closest thing and fight anyway as you demonstrated? I only ask because I know that's the first thing my opponent will say when I use it next 😅
After graduating from BGU (Blood God University) and received my MA in WH40KChaosTactics, I received a job in the Eye of Terror. All thanks to Professor Blog. *holds up flesh diploma with the seal of Chaos.*
Bahahaha, I should open up BGU
DeVry can offer you a similar degree plan online. Between classes there with University of Phoenix and National American University I graduated with my Associates of Assistant Game Design with a minor in history of Thanksgiving. I'm still paying back my $50k student loan but very proud of how far I've come.
The first one has confused me wouldn’t another 3 world eaters be able to attack via being in contact with a base that’s in engagement range?
‘A model can fight if it is in base-to-base contact with another model from its own unit that is itself in base-to-base contact with an enemy unit.’
Also wouldn’t the other models have to move closer to not break unit Cohesion?
Used to use the Heroic Ingress trick myself all the time as a Custodes player. Dropping 6 Allarus Custodes was my favourite thing in the world, did not meet a single opponent who did not give me a " Are you serious? " look afterwards. Favourite instance was versus my best friend, his full squad of eight bound where ready to go slaughter my Witchseekers holding a No-mans objective, in comes the Allarus, and suddenly, he has no more Eightbound, still gives me shit for it to this day.
Haha nice!
….and Flesh hounds nerf for WE…sad sad sad.
Sounds like you don't play by intent often if people are giving you looks for this strat
@@MrTheWarp Most of the local people I play with barely know what " Playing by intent " even is, so no, can't say I do.
To be fair, I doubt most of them really think about why it works since they just tend to be annoyed, especially when doing it on a guard squad with a blade champion, since then it only costs 1 CP to rapid ingress them and you get to heroic intervene for free afterwards. And if they just so happen to be standing on an objective, well, you know what that means against Custodes.
@@NoName-PvPngl man, if you aren’t announcing this stuff at the beginning of the game or before a move is made you’re being an arse, “gotcha” moments suck and some tournaments don’t vibe with them at all
On the first tip, you can fight in two ranks as per the core rules so the bezerkers just need to base with their own unit to fight as well!? As per page 33 of the core rules "a model can fight if it is base to base contact with another model from its own unit that itself is in base to base contact with an enemy" therefore that isn't going to reduce the attacks or only by 1 berserker?
One other option with the 'Puncture Wound' is to charge the screening unit with Angron, but use fly to move over them and base them from behind. This can then put you close enough to the second unit to Pile In when the first unit is destroyed.
True, depends if they leave enough room for his big arse base! But yeah on smaller units with fly absolutely
second trick sounds like bit stupid and not logic in a battleground , should be change in the rules, could kill a unit who can't answer is a bit shameless
The second one blew my mind, great work!
Haha fantastic
Same, I didn't know this was possible but makes so much sense
I got totally screwed at my last event because of fighrs first, thanks for the tip! Now I have plans
It's a tricky one to work around, hope this helps
As a Blood Angel player, I can’t condone your fanaticism with the ruinous powers… BUT as a fellow melee enthusiast, your tips and tricks for charging + piling in are INVALUABLE.
Honestly, some of these tricks can feel “scummy”, specifically against newer players, but melee needs all the help it can get to be able to make a difference in this shooting/tank meta.
Maybe the upcoming Pariah Nexus mission expansion will give us new strategies or incentives to get into melee easier
Thanks mate, I appreciate the kind words. A new mission pack brings the potential for a huge shake up, I do think the number one thing that influences combat is terrain however, if you have sufficient terrain you don't mind if your opponent has guns lol.
Perfect Tipps for my Next Event!
Keep up the good work!
Would love to see some World Eaters Battlereports
I'll try get one our soon, downside to being a one man show is finding someone to film with
This is really good. Way better content than what I was getting in the Vanguard Tactics /Art of War 40k paywall content. Subscribed!
Thanks mate, I really appreciate it
That second one, that guy who’s chilling in the middle to keep coherency, doesn’t he need to move towards the closest enemy, attempting to get into engagement??
Pile in moves are optional and per model. If they DO pile in, they have to move closer to the enemy unit.
This is pure gold - thanks for sharing these... Melee in 10th hits like a wet noodle (unless you're playing WE/Chaos) so any strategic insights into getting more out of the charge/fight phase in this edition is really appreciated.
You are welcome mate!
In the first example, couldnt the world eaters still have more attacks by being in base contact with a model thats in base contact with an enemy unit? Im a new player so im still learning how this all works, but i thought that was a thing
The idea is to limit your opponents attacks, but yeah trying to get as many in B2B is good to maximise yours
@@BlogForTheBloodGod after thinking about it more I realized I was probably focusing on the wrong part, but thank you for replying!
Rule bending, cheese and poor tricks instead of using common sense. But many 40K and warhammer players always been like that, poor, pathetic community.
Tricks 2 and 3 feel very much allowed becasue of RAW rather than RAI. Which is fine, not arguing with their existence but it feels like they're pushing what the rules say to their absolute limit.
Can I make a pile in move to an enemy unit If i didn't charge that unit? Example, my trygon is set up 3" away from an enemy unit. He cannot charge after doing so. A pile in move would bring him within 1" and thus into engagement range of that enemy unit. So now he would be able to attack. Am I correct?
Amazing video man ; many thanks for those tricky moves that can really help a melee list ! 👌
You are welcome mate! Hope they help in your games
The rapid ingress one is a good idea, but those aggressors would just shoot the hounds
Yeah for this I just used aggressors as it is what I had on hand
Referring to the strategy you used with Antron, where specifically does it say that a unit can still make a pile in and attack when it’s charge target is no longer there? I didn’t think this was possible.
In the second lesson (I think) about the the Berserkers into the 2 Guard unit (1 with FF):
I thought you could only end in combat range on a pile in on the charged unit. I can understand piling in onto the other unit of Custodes (w/ FF) that were not a target of the charge but it sounds like an interpretation of the WAR over WAI to pile in into the non-charged unit. I can understand consolidating into combat range with the non-charged target after fighting. Then again my interpretation could be wrong. I only have a few games under my belt, so I have my grain of salt and my eat ready to be eaten. Also another reason/excuse is I may have had that taught to me (or just agreed on locally [they have small BCP tournaments too]). Which ever, I will except correction or guidance.
This was true in 9th, but that restriction does not exist in 10th. It's a useful trick!
I understand people who feel this is RAW of RAI, I disagree however as GW could have copy pasted 9th rules across, so the removal of that restriction seems intentional to me
I'm with you on this one, this is RAW over RAI. I'd hope this interaction would get patched if it becomes popular
Make sure neither of those Custodes units have a shield captain or blade champion. They will heroic and or interrupt for free
Good point, this trick works on more than just custodes but yeah, well spotted
So did it change this edition so you can pile in and fight a unit you didn’t declare a charge against?
Yeah that's new in 10th, subtle change of wording can be so impactful
If you consolidate move into engagement range with an enemy unit that has not fought yet can it now fight? 9:08 I’m not sure that make sense?
It can, after you fight
@@BlogForTheBloodGod cheers
So piling inro to a fights first unit is not a charge, so a fights first unit can't use that ability? ? !
Great video!
One possible correction though - you mentioned Angron can't charge over the intercessors? He can, he just cant land on them.
Yes that is correct, but if his base won't fit on that side he can't be placed there, perhaps I wasn't clear there
You were clear.@@BlogForTheBloodGod
Some of the wording used in the piledriver example is confusing. The Objective Custodes squad IS eligible to fight, but only after you pile into it and make your attacks. The effect is to prevent them fighting first, not to prevent them fighting at all.
Correct, but they can't fight if they are dead!
Great video around how to counter the Fight first and Interrupt stratagem.
Glad you enjoyed it mate
Tip 1: World Eaters players tells all other melee armies how to defeat our most powerful unit and ability. What is he giving away the secrets?🤷🏼♂️
Sharing is caring :)
The Arena Innovations mats look nice. Do they have any with deployment zones printed on them? Having trouble finding them in Aus.
I don't think they do unfortunately
Question about the Heroic Ingress one. Unless im missing something, couldn’t the enemy choose not to charge after seeing that you Rapid Ingressed a unit in? Or better yet try to shoot them to death before they charge? Theyd be wasting a turn by not charging i know, but I feel like just charging them in knowing they’ll probably die is worse
They absolutely could, however chosing not to charge or choosing to shoot hounds instead of something else is a great deterrent and keeps other units alive which was the point all along
Question about the Piledriver portion of the video. I thought you could only fight targets that were declared targets of the charge, so you could NOT fight targets you piled into unless you declared them? Or is that a 9th edition thing that I never swapped out in my brain?
That's a hangover from 9th my friend
So the Custodes would not be able to activate fights first? That seems kinda cheesy in a way. Or maybe I'm just not understanding.
Correct as they are not engaged. This is how to get around fights first
But you are still attacking them or just being nearby?
I'm a ninth legion Astartes. Don't tell my emperor I'm here.
Thank you sire. As an apprentice of the melee I am very appreciative of this content. Comment for algorithm complete.
Hahahah thanks mate!
In the second example, Piledriver, aren't you not actually in coherency there? If a unit is more than seven models it must end its move within 2" of two other models. I'm not sure that the ones on the ends were making that.
You do still require coherency, I may not have articulated that perfectly in the video so thanks for the comment, I'd hate people to get the wrong idea
can someone explain the pile driver , as pile in is the first thing you do before fighting thus when you pile into the custodes this would make them eligible to fight meaning they can pop fight first, no?
No a "fight" includes Pile in > make attacks > Consolidate.
The heroic ingress is perfect for my daemon army I’ve got a unit of 10 fleash hounds
Flesh hounds are so good
New sub here, awesome work and content man! Keep working on these masterclass content please!
Thanks mate, will do
Such tricks are pointless in Competitive gameplay. You can charge against rhino with undivided chosen and allocate even 4 wounds but your berzerkerz are dead before the battle begins. You can charge againt accursed cultists but it's both overkill and underkill.
I have some tricks VS CSM Rhinos in an upcoming video, far from pointless
@@BlogForTheBloodGod I am not sure what a WE player can do. Charging rhino with angron or demon prince seems overcosted. You need to destroy rhino in meele and kill battle shocked chosen in one phase or they kill you next turn.
Can a unit fight without being in engagement range just because it charged? I thought they changed that in 10th edition.
They can, yeah in 9th you couldn't but in 10th you can
I thought heroic intervention did not allow charge bonus ie fight first is a charge bonus
It doesn't grant you the charge bonus, however if you can access it from other means you can still gain fights first
That second one is pretty cool, but i think a bit to gotya for my tastes
This is why I share it, so it doesn't feel so gotchya
I always thought as long as 1 model in my unit made contact with a opponent unit, it meant my whole unit get to fight the oppo unit 😅
That would be wild haha
Got into a heated debate over the piledriver and despite referencing the video, got told the video was totally wrong. Opponent claimed that the top squad of guard would still make their attacks first. I tried to explain the three stages of a "fight", as my understanding from the video was that as the pile in move is the first of the three stages, and this happened before the custodes were eligible to fight, that the three stages of the beserkers "fight" could not then be interrupted. He completely disagreed and I couldn't find anything written to contradict him... please help!
You are right.
It's a simple matter of "activation"
So you check at the start ofbthe fight phase to see who is eligible to fight, as the custodes are not eligible they cannot be activated. So you activate your berzerkers and go through the steps, once finished you then select the next unit
@@BlogForTheBloodGodthank you (this is my other account on my phone). Sent him a screengrab but he still says I’m wrong so will just avoid playing him in future lol
I miss the good old days of initiative values. Nice and simples.
I do too, it was much better IMHO
Thanks mate. Exactly the kind of video i need.
Hope it helps mate
@BlogForTheBloodGod would like to see how you synergize LOS with 8 bound.
so let me get this straight, is it because Charging gives you Fights First which reads that they are eligible to fight means you can still pile in and attack even if your charge target dies? what about units with native Fights First? does this mean they can just pile in and fight on any target within 4" of them in the fight phase?
Nope, you have to either be within 1" OR have made a successful charge to be eligible to be selected to fight
@@BlogForTheBloodGod where can I find that in the rules? I went looking but didn’t find it yet
I learned a lot, very clear and informative video, thank you, mister Blood God.
You are welcome my friend, thanks for the feedback
Can't you not pile in to a unit you didn't charge?
That was 9th edition, in 10th edition you can pile into and make attacks against units that were not declared as targets of the charge
Blokes for the bloke god
Shielas for the shiela throne
Hahahah spot on
in 'heroic ingress' nothing is stopping him from just shooting off the hounds with those aggressors and then charging in to the eightbound
Yeah but now he is shooting flesh hounds instead of something else. It either protects something from shooting or something from combat
@@BlogForTheBloodGod it’s presented as ‘here’s a way to save a unit’ but really seems to play as ‘here’s another unit to feed the meat grinder’
Doesn’t seem all that threatening if you know proper risk/threat allocation
But, the fight first for Custodes gets activated at the start of the fight phase. So you can still use it. So the CSM Player has the choice to still pile into them (on the marker) or just ignore em. Wich will result in a asswhooping in the next turn.
Do i get anythin wrong? My thoughts should be right with rules as writen. Start of fight phase is before pile in and Strat of Custodes does not state that they need to be in contact with another unit. Worth the use of 2CP in my point of view. But your advice is gold for many many other scenarios. Thx!
The custodes can fight first, but at the start of the phase they are ineligible to fight as they are not within engagement range
@@BlogForTheBloodGod Okay, sooooo. Because the FF is in the Core Rules stated before the pile in it will loose its "power" after the pile in. And that is possible because you are in contact with the second unit. But, you also get the FF Buff as the charging unit. So do you loose it also after pile in, cause you didn't use in in the FF step? Or are you just able to hit the Guard Squad wich is not on the Marker? Cause the defending Player will choose the First fight in fight normal, wich would make the Charge irrelevant🤔
You see my Problem? Why should the Custodes not be able to fight first, but the Zerkers can though they also didn't use the buff in FF step. If they pile in they loose the FF then.
Yep, looked it up in old Rulebooks and 10th. The big difference is that in 10th nowhere is written "charging units fight first". In 10th the book states that " a charging unit the fight first buff gets" So either both get FF, or Zerker can hit the squad they are in melee with first, or the pile in happens and it is fight normal.
@@BlogForTheBloodGod But, i'm at a tournament on the 11th of February and there will be a big Part of the Austrian National Team (i think a former Grandmaster will be there too) and i will ask them about their Interpretation. Cause shure, if you use the "charging units always fight first" you are 100% right. But thats not the same in 10th anymore, i think. Cause you just get the same buff as others can get.
@@BlogForTheBloodGod Hi! Got a Chance to talk to one of them early in the local hobby store. I admit humbly that i was wrong, my brain was tangled at the last step but it is total clear to me now. Thx for bringing it into my fokus, even if it is very situational with the many many variables (Charge roll, position of both troops, if custodes as enemy he pulls -1dmg on one grp and -1hit karate for ouch fightback, Trajann in 2nd troop?, blablub) Again, sorry for the hustle. I will keep that in Mind for the tourney, even though i dont play the golden Bubs!
Does #2 work on the basis that a charging unit is no longer required to allocate all of its attacks to its charge target?
That's no longer a rule
@@BlogForTheBloodGod brilliant, really keen to try this
#3 could be pretty lethal with Lucius
Lucius in legionaries is pretty spicy ATM
Did i understand it right, when the opponent uses counter offensive, they dont get to pile in?
They do
@@BlogForTheBloodGod ah okay thanks for the clarification. I think as Ork it‘d hard to do shenanigans against custodes. But i could try to charge in chaff grots. :)
how do the khorne berzerkers get fight first ????
Adding a Master of Executions
Bro this was so useful! Thanks
You are welcome mate
Pure gold, or brass
Haha nice
Great vid! In the pile driver, would the custodes player be able to still fight in the "remaining combatants" (non-fights first) step, since they are now within engagement range, provided there are any left?
If there are any left absolutely
As a new player who joined on the tail end of 9th, this video is stellar. The first tip alone is super valuable. Thank you! Subbed!!
Haha you are welcome mate
Khorne berserkers or votann berserkers :p
They stole our name
berserkers have fight first/can get fight first? am i just this bad at world eaters that i didn't know this?
It's like their main thing lol
@@BlogForTheBloodGod I must be missing it on datasheet :( is it an ability with blessings of khorne? Appreciate your reply.
@heyheykoolaid it is on the Master of Executions datasheet, it is an ability he grants the unit
@@BlogForTheBloodGod now I understand. I appreciate you and your content. Thanks fam.
Thanks bro. Some great tricks here. On my way to a massive apocalypse day and hope i can use these tricks with my world eaters. ( I get to use my whole collection) I'll let you know how many skulls I'll grab for the skull throne.
Hell yeah, apocalypse is so much fun! Let me know how it goes
I was 100% sure you could only pile into units you charged I guess that changed or i have always been mistaken on that. good to know.
That changed from 9th to 10th. Subtle but actually impacted change
Awesome
This was brilliant! Some nice tricks, and the splitscreen worked really well 👍
Thanks mate
For the heroic ingress, can't the agressors just shoot the incoming unit prior to the charge phase?
Of course, this is just an example of the technique, we are assuming they shoot elsewhere or you use this trick against an enemy that does not shoot
Well this video was incredible, got me excited to use some tricks next game.
Hahaha thanks mate! I appreciate the feedback
Custodes bad example
I tried to use a different faction for each example and didn't want to do WE vs WE but was limited in the minis I had on hand
This is a really interesting insight into the nuances of the Fight Phase! Really well done, mate! Greetings from a Pommie C**t!!
Haha fantastic, cheers C**t
Are you really allowed to "abuse" the base-to-base contact rules like that? Can you move your models in such a way that the ones that move first, prevent your other models from being able to get into base-to-base contact? I thought the rules meant that if spreading out your models meant more of them could achieve it, then you had to do so, even if it meant completely encircling the enemy.
It specifically instructs you to move models one at a time, so yes, as long as each individual move is legal then you can somewhat block yourself
For the piledriver move fly units can still charge over units
Correct, I believe I miss spoke
melee for the melee god!
Combat for the Combat Throne
Intresting! :O
Thanks mate, hope ya can make em work for ya
This is amazing!
Thanks mate! Glad you enjoyed it
Working on my W.E right now hope i can finish them before they get nerded to bad
Yeah I'm concerned about angron and Eightbound
magnificent!
Cheers mate
I love you
1st tactic: similar to “crossing the T” in military lingo. Great stuff
Going to have to google that
@10:30 in case you dont kill the top squad of custodes after making your attacks, would the custodes be eligible to fight back since they are now in engagement range?
Also if the top squad would heroicaly intervene, they would be in engagement range at the start of the fight phase and could use their fight first and kill your berserker or am i wrong?
Correct on both accounts
@@BlogForTheBloodGod thabks for the clarification mate, great video learned a lot ❤️
@peternubaum4514 glad to hear mate :)
If they become eligible to fight after the pile in, what prevents them from triggering their fights first strat at that time?
What is the likelihood of 8 Zerkers being able to kill two different 5 man bricks of custode guard?
They will save on 3+ and take 1 to 2 damage per wound against their 3 wounds.
However, I just pulled this move off against Black Templar Sword Brothern squad of 5 and a Primaris Crusader Squad. With Kharn in my crew, it was skulls for the skull throne all day long!
These are excellent tips and tricks! Thank you!!
You are welcome sir
You know these are essentially gotcha tactics. This is the sort of thing that GW tried to remove in tenth with the changes in the fight faze . Yeah this is all legal but it’s not in the spirit of the game.
10th edition is so Shooting heavy I think combat armies need every trick they can get. And it's not a gotchya if I make videos explaining how the tricks work and how to counter them hahaha
@@BlogForTheBloodGod this is a poor defense. While I wish you all the success in the world, your videos reach a fraction of the WH40K playerbase. This is still "gotcha" tricks and anti-ROI
I didn't understood the heroic ingress thing
Essentially you are using it to charge them with a second unit in their charge phase, allowing you to put their models in base contact with a unit that was not the intended target of the charge
A question about the Berserkers at 5:34 , after they pile in, would the half of the unit that wasnt able to get into base contact die due to unit coherency?
They still pile on and move closer just not into base contact or base of a base
Yeah you still get pile in and consolidate moves to regain coherency
Just curious about the Custodes point. FF happens at the start of the fight phase. So in this situation before your unit activates you would have already known if the unit outside of engagement was given FF. if you pile in there to them then you have started your activation but moved into a unit that already has fights first. So wouldnt the unit on Objective just fight first in that case? Thanks in advance for help.
If you are the non controlling player your FF unit fights before the controlling FF unit. If there are multiple FF you pick the first fight.
@@kocashima So this trick only works if the WE has Fight First?
@@johnaxios6335 no the pile driver trick will always work because of how activation works. All charging units get fight first so they fight before non fights first units. By piling into a FF unit you skip their initial FF effect and can fight before them as you must finish the activation. However should the FF unit live in this case the Custodes on objective they must take the next fight phase activation unless the Custodes player has another FF unit
Looks like others fielded this one for me but yeah, you will know if they FF, but they have to be in engagement range to be eligible
Cheers Dean, saved that one straight to the Favourites!!
Awesome! Glad you enjoyed it
That was super helpfull
Glad you enjoyed it mate
Fantastic work my dude!
Cheers mate
Excellent content! Good job!
Thanks mate, glad you enjoyed it
Such a good video!
Thanks mate! Glad you enjoyed it
Not gonna lie, that pile driver move is something that would never fly at one of the tables I play on. Kinda wish it did, I play orks vs stodes often.
Rules are rules.
@@ColmarrPlays yeah seems dodgy but the top level players are using it. Now it's up to GW to fix their shiz!
Yeah, its almost like the rules are so shaky that playing optimally almost always feels like cheating XD. Its been that way since like 5e and it hasnt gotten any better.
Seems gamey and "that guy" type shit
Same, can't wait to fail trying to explain what I just did and have it knocked back cos the don't understand and the core rules is flimsy AF
Great stuff as usual mate. Cheers!
Thank you kind sir
Excellent video!
Thanks mate, glad you enjoyed it
Awesome stuff Dean!
Thanks mate
amazing thanks
Thanks mate, glad you enjoyed it
Excellent video 👍
Thanks mate! Appreciate the kind words
@BlogForTheBloodGod quick question about the puncture maneuver, doesn't angron have to declare the (in this case) tank as part of his charge in order to fight it? Or can theoretically if the charged unit is destroyed you can just consolidate into the next closest thing and fight anyway as you demonstrated? I only ask because I know that's the first thing my opponent will say when I use it next 😅
You make my day with videos like these 👏🏻🔥💯🫂 Big Thanks
Haha thank you! Glad you enjoyed it!