TREELESS SADDLES - Are they good for your horse? A Saddle Fitter's Perspective.
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- Опубліковано 22 кві 2021
- Tree'd saddles vs Treeless saddles, are they good for your horse? Who needs them? Do they have to be fitted? Poppy Webber discusses this controversial topic, from the perspective of a Qualified Saddle Fitter.
Comments? Questions? Ask away... 👇🏽👇🏽👇🏽
#adayinthelifeofasaddlefitter #treelesssaddles - Домашні улюбленці та дикі тварини
Hi poppy, thank you very much for covering this. Jochen schleese answered my question on one of his live streams about treeless. He said big fat no! So another no, makes it a no I guess 😘👍
Thank you for watching!
@@ADayInTheLifeOfASaddleFitter its confirmed what I thought anyway. I need a 17.5ins because I'm 5'7 and he needs a 16ins. I'm having to buy a smaller saddle and to get a shorter rider. I'm beyond gutted. I'll have to think about having one specially made with shorter panels and decent seat, but maybe even that wont work! The comfort of my pony is much more important than my desire to be riding him 😔 xx
Please do not lump "all treeless saddles" together. There are BIG differences in treeless saddles and their designs. Good ones can easily cost $4000+ USD. And, some ARE fitted to the horse based on spinal channel width, saddle distribution area (panels used), various girth rigging, rider weight and more (though they typically are not recommended for overweight riders). You may want to research Tevis Cup Endurance Race in the US... it's a 100-mile race completed in 24 hours.. and there are multiple vet checks along the way with a host of health issues that are evaluated, including back/muscle. Many Tevis Cup riders ride Treeless.. even many winners. How can you explain that? These are very seasoned professional riders... and they're not riding on big pillows. Personally, I have both treed and treeless saddles. It just irks me when people lump subjects into "black" and "white"... "yes" or "no" categories. It's just not that way.
Treeless done correctly is still better than an I’ll fitting saddle. Here in America nobody except the very rich gets a saddle fitter and they use one saddle for many horses. I used a treeless for 6 years and I have to say, my horse and I very happily trail rode for hours in our treeless saddle. Her sweat patterns were always a nice channel off her spine. My mare had a short, wide asymptomatical wither and a wide spine. After going through many treed saddles unsuccessfuly and having a sore backed horse I started researching. I respect your opinions expressed but depending on how you use your horse treeless is a wonderful option. Her sore back issues subsided and her back and wither became wider and stronger as she was able to bend and flex without a rigid tree restraining her movement. My seat also improved and it became more secure and deep. I can no longer sit a treed saddle because I can now feel the tree no matter how padded the saddle is. So a treeless girl here for life and I am happy to share my success story.
Just reading threw comment have to agree with your experience. No saddle fitters or not very good ones. I have studied this problem for years and have ridden with all kinds of saddles . But think a poor fitting treed saddle is worse than a well made treeless. Never have seen a treeless ravage a horses back. I personally have not ravaged a horses back but have witnessed this.
Which saddle pad are you using with your treeless saddle? Do you also use a cotton pad ?
Oh my!! I was afraid of this. I’m watching children ride an old Amish mare with a saddle that is so bad that it sits right on her withers. I’m trying to come up with a solution before the mare gets too hurt and the children get injured when she rebels from the pain. 😢
Personally speaking - as a rider and trainer of problem horses for over 40 years, I don’t generally listen to anything from people who have a vested interest in a subject/product/method who poo poo alternate ideas. I mean…..imagine a saddle fitter disagreeing with the product that makes them a living….
For clarification - I don’t ride a treeless saddle, never have done, (but HAVE ridden bareback extensively), and I don’t give my opinions to people who have experience with things that I don’t.
I know this video is a few months old now, but I’ve only just come across it.
I’d love to see you look into this a bit further. I think this comparison is very basic and makes a few assumptions (no offence here at all! Just something I’ve seen a lot of :) ). For a start, treeless is just all lumped together as one. There are so many different types and styles of treeless saddles. If I was to make a guess at the type you are discussing in this video I would say this refers to a cheap copy of one of the ‘flatter’ styles of saddles. Cheap, no weight bearing surface and just chucked on by the owner with no thought to fitting. There is plenty of that going on with treed saddles too! (Although maybe swap out the weight bearing for broken/too narrow etc). Treeless saddles MUST be correctly fitted and padded. A lot of the older saddles absolutely rely on you having the correct pad. For example the older barefoot saddles are designed to be used with a physio pad which has panels built in. They are also absolutely designed with a weight limit in mind. Barefoot saddles now have the VPS system built in to deal with this. There is plenty of research, development and money going into treeless saddle companies by the big names and I have seen plenty of change in the 15+ years I have been using them. Similar statements could be made about cheap treed saddles, but people don’t make sweeping statements about all treed saddles because of this.
What id love to see is you (or any saddle fitter) maybe visit and discuss with some of the big treeless names - Heather Moffet, Barefoot, Ghost etc and ‘compare notes’. Maybe a panel of people discussing these things. I think treeless and treed can absolutely exist in the same space, it’s all about the owners making sure they are buying a quality product and using it correctly on both sides ❤️
I totally agree with you! We do tend to lump them all together into one 'treeless saddles are crap' bracket - but there definitely ARE some treeless saddles that cause less problems than others - the do tend to be the ones that have *some* sort of tree in them, albeit not a standard 'tree'... maybe visiting a treeless saddle manufacturer would be a good idea, to compare notes, tell them my concerns and do a video there? Good plan, indeed!
@@ADayInTheLifeOfASaddleFitter I absolutely love this reply and would love love love to see this! Thank you for this. Really appreciate your open mindedness :)
i would really love if you took a look at an actual, modern and high end treeless saddle, because reality isnt as severe as you make it out to be (for alot of cheeper treeless saddles it is though). There are many treeless saddles which still have quite a bit of structure and support, but just still allow for a wider range of fit, ajustability and movement. Ideal will always be a regularly fitted treed saddle, but ALOT of ppl barely get theirs fitted every year or even every other year, and so a good treeless saddle could save some 'hobby horses' from some hurt. They arent made for heavier riders though, and you do need a special pad underneath
i just bough a ghost saddle a few days ago and both me and my horse love it so far. an obvious upgrade from my old wintec
i have a barefoot saddle because my horse is very hard to fit with a wide barrel and high withers. he suffered with back pain for years and the saddle dealers answer was to get a bigger pad. now he is happy again and out of retirement.
All saddles need to fit well and indeed distribute pressure. All saddles need to be quality. I am not yet convinced either way as it depends on so many factors and choices. I’ve had custom tree saddles, and fitted treesaddles. At the moment very happy with my ghost. At the moment! For now it works where I am at. The Kevlar tree does it job for the short rides. And is with leather panels very close to a tree saddle. In a few years I’ll have a fitter come by and weer other options.
Not sure if you have looked into the Barefoot treeless saddles with the VPS not pre VPS, they are not cheap and can cost just as much as a good saddle and they have a lot of support for the horse back, and they do not claim that the saddle will fit every horse, they also recommend it to be fitted to the horse with regular checks on fit. There are a lot of treeless saddles I wouldn't even touch, but saying this I have now got a custom made and fitted Black Country saddle for my horse and loving it.
Hello, I have the barefoot cherokee with the vps system etc but I find no matter what I do it slips to one side a little, any tips? 🙏
I'm sorry I missed this, but if you still have it and still have issues, I'd suggest a shorter girth, I have a new barefoot Cheyenne for a spare saddle and it was slipping to side when mounting off a mount block, then remembered that I need a shorter girth then what I'm using with my treed saddle@@cinderella2761
Thankyou very much for this. Most informative.
Excellent video/explanation. Thank you.
I absolutely agree with you, however I also think it should be mentioned that you are NEVER supposed to ride in a treeless saddle without the special pad with inlays. Now this still doesn't bring it to the quality of a good quality tree saddle, but that's where it goes wrong a lot of the time. People buy a cheap treeless saddle and put their cheap cotton pads under it because the special treeless saddle pads are too expensive in their opinion.
Very good point!
Yeah I think a quality treeless is key. The best my horse ever went was in an ansur treeless. I understand it's technically not ideal but if it works it works. And my horse gives you her opinion. I ended up with a crappy wintec pro which was her second choice but that I struggle with the stirrup bar placement on
I have used a treeless saddle (Barefoot) for years and even though my horse didn't get pressure points, his back muscles did suffer from it and it's hell to get him to push his back up now. I've switched to a treesaddle some years ago but I still use the barefoot every now and then without stirrups to protect his back when I feel like riding bareback or for the kids that take riding lessons on him. I think it's a good alternative to a saddle or completely bareback as they still train their balance and his back gets cushioned. The good thing about high quality treeless saddles is, that the spine still stays clear and gets no pressure at all.
Hi interresting but, what do you think about natives indians who ride horse bare back for century, did they hates there horses ?, why the Tevis Cup winners ride horses whith tress less saddle ? Why my mare back stil ok after 23000 miles rides with tree less saddle (yearly horse osteophat control since 15 years). Not all tree less saddle are good i agree that. I am 56 years old, and ride horses since 50 years. i start to have a small idea about horse back pain. Tree less saddle are not good good for all horses i agree. But say tree less saddle are wrong and will produce troubles, that's it a lack of knowledge and practice. Regards.
I’ve been through numerous saddle fitters / saddles in I have had no luck what so ever I have a 13hh cob x Welsh A …….. in he is so flat Back you could serve about 5 plates for a family of 5 I’ve been using my saddle for around a year and I love it super comfortable for me and my horse my vet has examined him and he 0 pressures point back it’s perfectly fine 😊. Plus am only 4ft feck all and 8 stone lol
Ok so, I have a quarter horse with large whithers, and almost every treed saddle we put on her hurts her back BADLY. You can just touch the line of her spine and she flinches in pain. The only saddles we have been able to use on her are a very old synthetic saddle, an Australian trail saddle, and a treeless saddle. Also, almost every tack fitter and vet I've talked to has said treeless is better. And my treeless saddle had caused no problem for any of my horses, I also use it on my draft-walking horse cross because he is HUGE and not many saddles fit him.
Very helpful, we have just taken in a new young pony at work (riding school) who has previously only worn a treeless saddle, he's as wide as high so can understand why, but it's now very important we get the right saddle fitted as he will have different riders - this has reassured me we are doing the right thing, thank you!
Yes, it's super important to get the right saddle fitted, I hope he settles in well at the riding school
Interesting video and I agree with the importance of weight distribution. I am wondering…. Some of the treeless saddles have recent weight distribution data (solution SMART saddles). Do you trust this weight distribution data? I’m struggling with the decision for my next saddle. I’ve ridden treeless and treed saddles. I had a few saddle fitters out to my farm, but my mare hated all the saddles that “fit” her.
I would like to hear Poppy’s opinions on the solution saddle! 💚
First time to learn from you! I'm super distracted by that awesome old aqua telephone on your desk!
It's pretty cool, isn't it! I keep meaning to get the phone line put into my shed, so i can actually USE it! 🤣
Nice expanation. Could you make a video about leather tree saddles? It's not that popular tree type but I'm curious how it differes from the standard tree.
Thanks for the comparison. You mention extensive research. Could you point me to the resources and studies, please? Thanks!
Thank you. I have a treeless saddle but agree after seeing this video that what I thought was kinder for my horse is not the case so thank you 🙏🍀💚🇮🇪
This was super helpful! I was considering it, but had my doubts - this helped me feel better about the tree in my saddle 😝
Thank you so much for the comment, i am so glad it was helpful :)
As a wedding dresss designer I love your styling backdrop and thankyou for the video :)
Thank you for a clear explanation. If tree distributes weigh and you're a larger rider should you opt for a larger seat size, ie 18 instead of 17, for horse's comfort?
Would you please do a video comparing the older Keiffer saddles with the new ones?
We need vid about bareback pads w and wo stirrups
I recently read an article where some archeologists dug up some ancient horse skeletons and surmised the horses had been ridden due to the spinal deformities caused by bareback riding. Ouch. That sold me on using treed saddles.
Oooh this is fascinating! I'm off to find that research, thank you so much!
Not quite as you have stated. Firstly horse vertebrae don’t survive well in the archaeological record whereas long bones do, so the spectrum of analysis isn’t very broad at all. Secondly, the “deformities” were indications of change of use from pulling (wagons etc) to being ridden, and those differences in bone structure were - and are - caused through changes in musculature, similar to human archers, ballet dancers and swimmers etc. Although their skeletal system is, to some degree, deformed through repetitive use, we wouldn’t see that as being a negative thing.
i'm disappointed you have no treeless saddles to base your info on....
Yes I agree. It was a very simplistic view. I actually stopped watching at the pillow scenes. I'd much rather see a treeless saddle dismantled. I have a treeless and a treed saddle for my horse. I wonder why treeless saddles are so popular in endurance riding?. 🤔
Yeah, i didn't have one, as I don't deal with them... and didn't fancy spending £hundreds just to dismantle it ;) But, i'll pop a post on social media to see if anyone has one to donate... and then i can have a look inside one and video it for you?
They're popular in endurance as they're so much lighter as they don't have a tree in them - plus riders find them very comfy... I fit a lot of tree'd saddles to endurance horses now, they're definitely getting more popular in endurance as people learn more, thanks to the amazing advancements in pressure testing. :)
@@ADayInTheLifeOfASaddleFitter definitely would like to see that. 🤞
I do agree. You may have the experience of it. But I feel like you don't have much experience of the full range of treeless saddles.
I totally agree that Treed saddles are designed to distribute pressure but some "treeless" saddles are also quite rigid and have a structure underneath just not the same as a treeless.
I'd have expected to have more "evidence" cos it sounds pretty circumstantial.
I know quite a few people who ride in pads and treeless and get backs checked regularly with no issues. But they're riding round wide ponies who's back distributes the weight. Not tbs.
Note I ride in Treed saddles. But I think you're being pretty presumptuous.
Ah- i ride in a (no stirrups) bareback pad sometimes. I just love the feel of "bareback" and it is a good balance exercise. I do however not view it as a substitute for a saddle.
Thanks for discussing this, completely agree but now somehow own three treeless saddles, I just can't afford a custom made tree'd saddle that I would need. I live in rural Australia and also don't have access to a saddle fitter, so far my treeless saddles have been sooo much better than an ill fitting tree'd saddle but I am conscious of pressure issues and I don't jump in them ( little ones bareback!) and I make sure I get on and off a lot if I ride for longer periods. I guess they have there place, and they have improved a lot over the years. Especially the girthing set ups.
Yes, totally agree!
I understand as inlive in rural Australia where there are saddle fitters but no propersaddle adjusters! So one of mines ended up with a treeless too. I prefer a properly fitted treed saddle
Thanks good information
People should not hate you for what you believe.
You just informed them ,they can believe it or not .
Free thinking 😅
Exactly :) Thank you for your comment :)
You confirmed my suspicion. Thank you.
No problems
I would really like to hear your opinion of the English WOW saddles by the company called First Thought Equine.
I’m struggling with this. Mostly because I’m working with children and an old buggy horse. They can’t afford a proper saddle. They have one that is a horrible fit and hurting the horse. Trying to find a solution for them and the horse. HELP.
I would love to see a video of the Freewest saddle with a closed cell pad. A true comparison that would reflect reality for those of us that do not have a saddle fitter available.
I have ridden thousands of miles in a treeless saddle and I really loved it. It was custom made for me and my horse loved it, but then he broke his pelvis in a pasture accident and I couldn’t ride him with a crupper. I’m now back in a treed saddle and I solved the comfy cushioned feel by adding a sheepskin cover. The treed saddle and pad weighs much less than the treeless saddle and pad.
So would a jockey/exercise saddle with a half tree create a lot of pressure on the points of the tree/stirrup bars?
It's another controversial issue... in theory the half tree helps with pressure distribution of the stirrup bars... but there is a lot of evidence to suggest there are serious pressure points in other places.
Hey poppy! What do you think about heather moffet with the leather trees inside?
i was going to ask the same thing! i love HM.
I think that the leather trees can help distribute some of the pressure from the bars and girthing... and rider.
Have you reviewed a flexi tree western saddle? You put me off treeless lol
It would be fun if you talked about Icelandic saddles, from what I know they are usually treeless which is not good to ride in all the time because of the reasons you talked about un the video.
This is a massive wake-up call for me my horse has a beautiful saddle with a tree that was custom-made for her after we won a competition but we also have another saddle with a flexible leather tree which I don’t think can really be particularly useful to her if what you’re saying is accurate and if I understand it correctly and she is usually using the synthetic saddle with the flexible tree in her riding school sessions when she’s not working with me so I think I might need to get rid of it and find another option.....
Hello. I' m searching treeless saddle only because my horses back constantly is changing depending on season. I dont have enaugh money, to buy for him 3 -4 different saddles, and he is difficult to fit. Saddle i have, only fit him when he drops weight, but when there is grass season or even a few days off, he is starting to get more bulkier (he is on fatty side - he very easily picking up weight, but dropping weight is really difficult). That's why I can't fit him with tree saddles, because they most of the time will not fit him, and even half of year going bareback, I think is to much for his back. Maybe You have another option? I want what's best for him, but more saddles is over budget for me 😅
I have a leather tree saddle. I feel it’s the best of both world. Also it have wool flocking, so it have to get fitted for my horse 👍
The leather tree can help distribute the pressure points... would you say a leather tree'd saddle is tree'd or treeless? Sometimes you see them described as 'treeless' but sometimes not... what do you think? xxx
What about barebackpads? Not with stirrups, but just the girth? And those lunging girths?
Without stirrups they're ok for every now and then :)
You can argue a frame ruck sack vs a padded ruck sack. Fitted properly both have their purpose .
What is your opinion on arena saddles? I'm looking for a new saddle but I'm trying not to go over 2k😊
They're made by Bates, and are their mid-budget range, so are perfectly nice little not-too-expensive saddles.
Get a quality used saddle over a wintec or arena. I've owned several wintecs and eventually your body starts fighting them. The bates are okay but the wintecs and arenas are yucky
I would like to ask for a brand suggestion of a treed saddle.
It depends very much on the shape of your horse, what you want to do with the horse, the size of the rider and budget :)
One thing I've always been concerned with treeless saddles is when you stand in the stirrups, all your weight is being confined to the size of the stirrup bar directly behind their withers.
Is sitting in a treeless saddle basically the same as sitting bareback, or is there some weight distribution in a treeless saddle that is better than bareback?
id say thebweight distribution is like in a bareback pad.. but the balance of most treeless saddles is very wobbly because of the layers and it makes it very hard to have a secure seat. i prefer bareback over treeless!
What do tou think about using a tree-less saddle without stirrups?
It would stop the pressure points from the stirrup bars but not from the rider and girth - so, yes, better but not perfect :)
I had toyed with the idea of treeless saddles in the past. After listening to several high level riders and saddle fitters opinions on treeless I decided against them. Outside of a few very high end brands I never found one that seemed to be of any quality. Also I tried a friend's cashel soft saddle on my very high withered TB, it was simply awful (very much like your pillow). Thank you for just confirming what I already suspected. The logic behind having a firm stable foundation to build the saddle around is very convincing in my opinion.
I totally agree! And no one (NO ONE!) wants to ride a high withered TB in a pillow! #frontwedgy ;)
@@ADayInTheLifeOfASaddleFitter amen
What about a flex tree saddle
What about the ghost saddle? There are many types of treless saddle, not just "the pillow saddle".
Ghost saddles have a weight limit on them (a not very generous weight limit on them, about 12 stone I believe?). And recommend padding them out. This is to help minimise the pressure. So it is something they are taking into consideration. Yes there are lots of different types of treeless saddles, as I mention in the video - some 'treeless' saddles actually have trees too... There is a wide range, but on the whole, a tree is what distributes the weight/pressure, and this has been shown in pressure testing/ extensive research on the matter. So the wide range of treeless/sort of treeless/flexible tree saddles will all have varying results when it comes to pressure testing.
I ride barefoot and bitless and there seems to be an almost culty mentality among the ‘metal free’ community to aim for the ‘holy trinity’; barefoot bitless treeless - and a lot of ill-informed, ignorant argument on the topic. I’ve seen the studies on treeless v tree saddles and the concentration of pressure under the rider’s seat bones and the heavier the rider, the worse this concentration of pressure is. It makes absolutely logical sense that a tree will distribute the rider’s weight - as a snow shoe distributes the weight of a human.
Absolutely agree with you!
This is not intended with any offense, but this is a very and clearly biased opinion 😅
All the things you said about treeless saddle didn't add up to your conclusion for me.
Your options are not, you only ride in treeless or you never ride in treeless.
As a riding instructor to those without the budget to keep a saddle well fitted, semi regular use of a "bareback" saddle is entirely appropriate.
It is worth noting that the impacts of the saddle, much like a bit are dependent on the manner of its use.
I teach riding in treeless saddle differently to treed, to combat the impacts of all the things you mentioned.
These saddles need good breast plates, and are not suitable for balancing using stirrups.
The stirrup design is only suitable as a foot rest, not for weight bearing.
Because of this the saddle is not particularly suitable for jumping. Neither are the most commonly found treeless shapes.
I would also add they are not overly suitable for spooky horses or long rides.
They are however a fabulous and inexpensive tool to have in the tool box, they can help build a confident relaxed seat in riders, assist is rehabilitating injuries and improve overall riding.
As a show jumper rider with significant handicaps, I am unable to ride in a treed saddle often, well.
I have spent a huge amount of time riding bareback. Galloping, jumping and schooling.
Treed saddles are not the only way.
Development of skills and practical understanding is possible ❤
Which is better, an ill fitting treed saddle or a treeless one?
I think it depends on how badly fitting the treed saddle is. I think a very badly fitting tree one would be worse than a fairly well made treeless one.
But a less badly fitting treed saddle would be better than a super collapsing treeless one.
@@ADayInTheLifeOfASaddleFitter the one thing i took away was the super collapsible part. I work with several horses. 3 or 4 on a given day. I have been using a wintec hart style... i guess they call it 'treeless'. Anyway im not riding for extended periods and good saddlers are few and far between where i live (Ecuador) saludos and thanks for the help
Can I have a word with you about tree saddles, not hate, just want to ask your opinion
Yes of course
My horse rides nothing but treeless or bareback. If I put any type of rigid treed saddle on him he'll bronc. Your knowledge on treeless is a little lacking in my opinion. I've switched three of my training horses to my treeless and the difference was night and day. They went 10 times better in it. After 25 years of riding traditional saddles, I won't ride in them anymore
I always see treeless saddles being such a "humane" option. But it really isn't, especially long term. Trees were invented for a reason after all.
Also I've heard about this "saddle" called the Total Contact Saddle and it would be so interesting to see what you think of it. I don't think it's good from what it looks like, but I've seen many people in facebook groups love it and say that if you haven't tried it you cannot critique it.
Ah yes the 'if you haven't tried it you can't critique it' reply... I see that a lot. I haven't tried kicking my horse in the face, yet I know he wouldn't like it. 🤣 I think it's the same as a lot of the treeless saddle malarky - some people are VERY set on an idea, because they like it - and often the horse will initially feel more free... but... they have stirrups so they WILL have a pressure point. There is no getting around that! It's science. The only way to help that is to have several layers of substantial padding - and then, what's the point in having a 'total contact' saddle if you're 17ft away from the horse?
Like all these things, maybe they're good for the odd bit of fun... but for everyday riding? 😳
@@ADayInTheLifeOfASaddleFitter I have a total contact saddle, as I had an awful job finding a tree's saddle that was creating a pressure point and swelling along my horse's spine, and always feeling wonky (monarchs, wintecs, fitted and kept up by saddler). Saddles and vet advised swelling is 'harmless'. I would like to try a Solution Saddle but it's out my price range (would love to see the inside of one of those, and how they reinforce the support to keep it off the spine and disperse pressure). The total contact has enabled us to continue riding in the meantime without the associated problems, but it does need a proper padding situation and additions to limit pressure points, also a fairly wide back horse and a fairly lightweight rider. He's checked and back is fine, muscles are fine. The longest I've rode in it is about 1hr 30mins (including trot, canter and jumping), no evidence of soreness afterwards but I'm mindful he might just hide it well. In the tree'd he always developed a lump after about 20mins. It would be good to see a video showing the different types of tree and what best for what type of horse, job, for example, flexi that are single piece moulded, vs wooden tree vs half tree racing saddle etc. My horse is a pacer and typically moves with a lateral rather than diagonal gait.
Okay now I have a question because there are so many opinions 😫😫😫. I have treed saddles but I also have a haflinger that's built like a mini draft horse. He hates the treed saddles, I hate them so typically I ride bareback. I started looking at treeless but honestly most of them look cheap and might last a yr. So if bareback okay? Cause now I'm hearing bareback is bad now to 😩. I just want both of us to be comfortable and safe. He's more slow than go. So we don't ride hard.
Bareback is, in my opinion, better than a treeless saddle - because there is no girth or stirrup bars causing pressure. And, in reality, no one *really* rides as hard bareback as in a saddle. :D
@@ADayInTheLifeOfASaddleFitter thank you! Exactly what I was thinking to.
My horse rides better in a bareback pad than he does in his saddle with a tree 😬😬😬 his body weight fluctuates when he is boarded because he is a really easy keeper and nobody has time to manage that like I do.
What the heck can I use if he does not like saddles with trees and I can’t seem to have a saddle that fits any longer than 2 months at a time, if that???? I’m killing myself refitting these saddles damnit
sometimes in this situation, we'd use something like a Prolite pad with removable shims in it, and fit the saddle to the horse at their widest and shim when they need it. x
won't feel bad for my horse that I didn't get her one. She would not have thanked me.
Wow i am sorry but you are wrong. I love my treeless saddle. I have issues with my lower back and a tree saddle leaves me cripple after about an hour. And i am totally not balanced on a treed saddle. The sweat marks attest to that as well. Also you can tell by how my horse rides. Now my treeless while there is a flexibility to the from to back seat estate...it isn't as soft as your example of a pillow. And treeless saddle saddles have come a long way. I have also seen a horse have so much scar tissue from a treed saddle. It took her over 1 year of adjustments to be able to move feely again. Not saying all treed saddles are bad ..with the same token not all treeless are bad either. From experience I can ride 3 hours on a treeless saddle and still have energy to go. While on a treed saddle one hour and i cant even put the horse away because i can't walk. Also watching a horses back after using a treeless..their sweat mark are even front to back and side to side. On a tree..i have never trully seen a regular pwrson have even sweat marks. Professional yes..regular riders no....just saying you may dislike treeless but look at all the brands i personally own a hilason..and i wouldn't change it at all. It may be my back that makes it so, but it is how i feel.
Instinctively, just from what I know about biomechanics and physics, I'd say probably not.
My favorite thing? Bareback pads with stirrups...! Where has common sense gone? It's no longer common. No professional rider in their right mind would ride in a treeless saddle or a bareback pad with stirrups. SCIENCE, PEOPLE!
Why is it wrong? Feels fhe same, does better, and will fit just about any horse.
@@Trippy000 Because there's huge amounts of pressure on just 1 or 2 vertebrae where the strap crosses the horse's spine. It's about the worst thing you could use.
@Adam Sewell Ah ok, I've always used treeless because any treed saddle makes my quarter horse soar.
My physio highly suggests a particular Brand of treeless saddles. I was so tempted because I’ve had nothing but issues with my boy.