Nicely done. I’ve often thought the mech should’ve been called the Wolf, because it comes together very nicely in packs of 4. Massing PPC fire that it’s hard to ignore them.
The idea of a light trooper is a bit of a weird concept but the Panther does a good enough job at it. Just don't expect it to live long vs calvary mechs or something like the wolfhound
The Panther is a "trap" mech. Looks great on paper, performs well against lighter garrisons and pirate forces up until it's being ran down by Phoenix Hawks and Griffins.
The fact that the Panther works so well in a lance with the Jenner is fantastic. I'm always a fan of bumping it to a 5/8/5 profile, though the 5/8 of the PNT-9ALAG is good enough for 3025 work. My personal upgrade list for a FedCom Civil War and beyond refit uses a Light 175, Endo-Steel, and Double Heat Sinks to fit a Light PPC in the CT, a Light PPC with Capacitor in the RA, and an MML-5 with two tons of ammo and CASE in the LT.
My ideal Panther would pull the jump jets and srm4 tubes and stick in a 210 engine and whatever small pulse lasers that could fit along with a snub ppc for the arm.
I remember a panther I used that I’d reffited with some salvage, XL engine, replaced the SRM with a clan LRM 10, two medium lasers in the arm with the ppc and some ferro-fibrous armour for good measure
The Panther and the Dragon are the DCMS's idea of a medium trooper 'Mech. The former is too slow, the latter is too fast, and both are worse than an actual medium filling the same role. That said, the Panther has an advantage if drop weights are a concern, and it's rarely a bad decision to bring a PPC. A rebuild using advanced tech has a lot of potential, if the designers are judicious in which upgrades they use.
Great video! I almost never field these things though, always drifted toward the the Wolfhounds more. Wanted to add: The Dark Age "Panther" looks awful, I agree.
I think the Wolfhound is the superior trooper light between the two, but the Panther works well when teamed up with fast light cavalry, like the Jenner and Spider.
PNT-10K got single heat sinks because Draconis Combine don’t have enough doubles at the time. Otherwise I imagine Panthers going against Enforcers or Griffins, if with numerical superiority.
they didn't have enough manufacturing capability in 3050, officially. they were last to the party before most of their new manufactored units could be built with freezers...
@@tehpw7574 I fully understand the lore explanation for this stupid design but it is still a stupid design. If you can´t mount double heat sinks, don´t mount ER-PPCs. It is very simple.
@@ProfessorHeyTeeEn Is that because you, yourself don't like it or because you might not like the responses that people may give you? I mean there are enough variants that some of them aren't abysmal. I realize the great houses can get tight fisted when it comes to money to actually make the mech better.
I would say that the Panther is good for a cheap trooper mech, but that is the best I can say about it. I can understand Ghost Bears not wanting it as it is usually too slow even for their steady doctrine and House Kurita only using the most 'common' of Clan tech on it making it better, but saving the best like the Clan ER PPCs for their more specialized or harder hitting units makes sense (troopers are usually the ones that fall the most often). Maybe if House Kurita is still around in 40-50 years, the standard Panthers will have Clan grade ER PPCs as there will be enough to go around at that point.
The Panther is one of the few if only mech were I could actually see running an IS-ERPPC it's its only gun so it will have the heat budget to keep the lighting flowing, and the boost in range makes the slower speed easier to compensate for. MRMs are also the perfect missile solution for the panther rather than MMLs. It give the panther enough umphf to hurt anything bigger than it should it get to close or be closed on, and provides enough volume of fire to hit anything smaller/faster than it. The only real upgrades outside of weapon systems would just be Improved Jumpjets Ferro fiberious armor double heatsinks. The manufacturing price between this new panther and a 9R would be miniscule compared to the boost in combat performance, hell it's simple enough to just refit exisiting 9Rs which could be done on the operator level, Hardest thing outside of cramming in the MRM10 into the CT would be recalibrating the new jumpjets
The panther is one of those mechs that isn't really good in small units but is pretty decent in company and above sized fights. When you have a line company in succession wars era they are pretty handy little fill ins. Its not a star but it can be a good rile player.
While it’s a shame that the Panther never got a huge Clantech glow-up like other DCMS mechs, I suppose this is due to the DCMS continuing to use it as a cheap fire support trooper, and using other chassis to experiment with light mech roles like the Phoenix Hawk L and the Rokurokubi. Still, I do wish that it got a better movement profile than 4/6/4 outside of two variants, as that speed is abysmal for a light mech. Even something like an XL gyro would enable it to mount a larger engine and survive better on the modern battlefield.
That was another great video there. The Panther does have its place, that's true. If you ignore it, you will be sorry. On a side note, have you ever worked on a pink Panther before?
The Panther isnt a terrible design, but its out of place for a Light mech. It makes me think of a Tank Destroyer like the Marder. I liked it in the Battletech videogames where it was a good starter mech before you could get better mechs. So you upgrade to a Vindicator or Griffin. I don't like its slow speed for any era. Thats a critical weakness as its pretty easy to counter with a much faster mech, like most Light Mechs. Its main advantage is thats its relatively cheap, but there are much better and more efficient designs.
@@ChaosTicket Eh, I kinda see what you leaning towards and I love me a good assault mech. But that one Awesome can't be in three places at once like the three Panthers, cannot jump in tight situations and get vantage points, and, from a narrative standpoint, cannot be as easily mass produced and ya have to have the facilities to make it.
@@fedupN An Awesome has about 3 times the firepower and double the armor(6 times as powerful) of a Panther for 2.5 times the cost. You really dont want to go into custom mechs because after seeing a post about an Optimized Warhawk being for villains I went into Mech Factory to make Jumping Awesomes. The only real downside to focusing on fewer better mechs is the Mobility Checks for taking 20+ damage in a turn. If anything it leads back to my preference for light mechs to be fast. A Wasp's kick is more deadly than a Panther's PPC.
@@ChaosTicket I wouldn't really count custom mechs as a general rule, since that isn't the mechs as expected to be seen. That also sounds like a video game version with unlimited playing around with things. Almost not point in mech chassis if it can be tooled up to be any mech. It also breaks heavily with establish in universe lore. See: MWO lighting fast urban mechs. That can lead us into very unhelpful territory of "Why don't the houses would totally just make fast urban mechs by hoping into magickal mech lab and give it all double heat sinks and XXXL Magnum Dong Condom Engines!" On the table top, three panthers allow you great mobility in both speed and with jump jets. They allow you to hit multiple objectives at once, flank for rear shots, take advantage of various cover points, always be firing three PPC shots, and then can fire off SRMS to seek holes in armor. Sure, there is the activation advantage too but blech. Additionally, in some cases they can be more "durable" beyond merely the armor. One of them falls downs, the others keep firing. Bit of bad luck on the dice rolls and you slag some left arms and it doesn't slow the incoming fire. In universe, there are alot of reasons to have numbers, from production availability to covering all your territories. All that said, the Awesome is great. It does alot of things better than the Panther which has its own limitations. But having multiple mechs that can mass produced, hit really freaking hard, and can work well at range or urban terrain has advantages.
After playing mech 5… this mech definitly is in my top 10 mechs I wouldn’t want to be caught dead in in Battletech. Miserably slow, a soldjery mech through and through for suicide firing lines. A cheep and efective soldiery mech many a green combine mustard soldier will die in.
@@ProfessorHeyTeeEn If you are not able to install double heat sinks, you should not even think about installing an ER-PPC. The 10K gains a bid of range but loses at least 1/3 of it´s firepower because it needs to cool down all the time. This is a bad trade-off.
In the TRO:3050 there is quite some competion for the title of worst "upgrade", e.g. the Grasshopper 5J, Blackjack BJ-2, Griffin 1-DS, Hunchback 5M or Quickdraw 5K.
Welcome to the Succession Wars, where 6.5 tons on a light mech makes you good enough to be the grunt of a Great House. Thanks for the video.
The beauty of the Succession War era is that this was produced in such a large amount that it became a game changer.
Nicely done.
I’ve often thought the mech should’ve been called the Wolf, because it comes together very nicely in packs of 4. Massing PPC fire that it’s hard to ignore them.
Ever since the Solaris DLC, that PPCX on anything is freakishly destructive, might have to make a 4 pack.
You ignore it and you have a sniper that can then Crit seek with a SRM.
You focus on it, you have a Dragon or a Warhammer bearing down on you.
@@ProfessorHeyTeeEn Me in my Archer: *grins maliciously while sending 40 LRMs at the little shit before I brawl with his bigger brother*
I enjoy all of Professor HeyTeeEn videos
And I enjoy you enjoying them.
It's important for me to make things people like!
The idea of a light trooper is a bit of a weird concept but the Panther does a good enough job at it. Just don't expect it to live long vs calvary mechs or something like the wolfhound
The Panther is a "trap" mech. Looks great on paper, performs well against lighter garrisons and pirate forces up until it's being ran down by Phoenix Hawks and Griffins.
I give it a LXpulse or erppc with gecm making it a JJ sniper.
The fact that the Panther works so well in a lance with the Jenner is fantastic. I'm always a fan of bumping it to a 5/8/5 profile, though the 5/8 of the PNT-9ALAG is good enough for 3025 work. My personal upgrade list for a FedCom Civil War and beyond refit uses a Light 175, Endo-Steel, and Double Heat Sinks to fit a Light PPC in the CT, a Light PPC with Capacitor in the RA, and an MML-5 with two tons of ammo and CASE in the LT.
My ideal Panther would pull the jump jets and srm4 tubes and stick in a 210 engine and whatever small pulse lasers that could fit along with a snub ppc for the arm.
The designer of the 3050 10K should have been 'Invited Onwards' by the DCMS
Ah, the Panther. One of my favorite targets. Partially because if I smash enough of them I get one for free!
I remember a panther I used that I’d reffited with some salvage, XL engine, replaced the SRM with a clan LRM 10, two medium lasers in the arm with the ppc and some ferro-fibrous armour for good measure
You made an expensive Griffin. I like it.
@@WolfHreda oh god you’re right, I didnt even realise it
The Panther and the Dragon are the DCMS's idea of a medium trooper 'Mech. The former is too slow, the latter is too fast, and both are worse than an actual medium filling the same role. That said, the Panther has an advantage if drop weights are a concern, and it's rarely a bad decision to bring a PPC. A rebuild using advanced tech has a lot of potential, if the designers are judicious in which upgrades they use.
With all the weight saving you can gather a C3 master and ER PPC.
Great video! I almost never field these things though, always drifted toward the the Wolfhounds more. Wanted to add: The Dark Age "Panther" looks awful, I agree.
I think the Wolfhound is the superior trooper light between the two, but the Panther works well when teamed up with fast light cavalry, like the Jenner and Spider.
PNT-10K got single heat sinks because Draconis Combine don’t have enough doubles at the time. Otherwise I imagine Panthers going against Enforcers or Griffins, if with numerical superiority.
Lorewise the explanation may be fine but gamewise the 10K has a terrible heat problem. The slight increase in range isn´t worth it.
they didn't have enough manufacturing capability in 3050, officially. they were last to the party before most of their new manufactored units could be built with freezers...
@@tehpw7574 I fully understand the lore explanation for this stupid design but it is still a stupid design.
If you can´t mount double heat sinks, don´t mount ER-PPCs. It is very simple.
I'm really enjoying these. I don't know what your plans are for upcoming mechs, it would be nice to see one of these episodes done on the Urbanmech.
People wouldn't like my opinions on the Urbanmech.
@@ProfessorHeyTeeEn Is that because you, yourself don't like it or because you might not like the responses that people may give you? I mean there are enough variants that some of them aren't abysmal. I realize the great houses can get tight fisted when it comes to money to actually make the mech better.
I would say that the Panther is good for a cheap trooper mech, but that is the best I can say about it. I can understand Ghost Bears not wanting it as it is usually too slow even for their steady doctrine and House Kurita only using the most 'common' of Clan tech on it making it better, but saving the best like the Clan ER PPCs for their more specialized or harder hitting units makes sense (troopers are usually the ones that fall the most often). Maybe if House Kurita is still around in 40-50 years, the standard Panthers will have Clan grade ER PPCs as there will be enough to go around at that point.
The Panther is one of the few if only mech were I could actually see running an IS-ERPPC it's its only gun so it will have the heat budget to keep the lighting flowing, and the boost in range makes the slower speed easier to compensate for. MRMs are also the perfect missile solution for the panther rather than MMLs. It give the panther enough umphf to hurt anything bigger than it should it get to close or be closed on, and provides enough volume of fire to hit anything smaller/faster than it.
The only real upgrades outside of weapon systems would just be Improved Jumpjets Ferro fiberious armor double heatsinks. The manufacturing price between this new panther and a 9R would be miniscule compared to the boost in combat performance, hell it's simple enough to just refit exisiting 9Rs which could be done on the operator level, Hardest thing outside of cramming in the MRM10 into the CT would be recalibrating the new jumpjets
The panther is one of those mechs that isn't really good in small units but is pretty decent in company and above sized fights.
When you have a line company in succession wars era they are pretty handy little fill ins. Its not a star but it can be a good rile player.
While it’s a shame that the Panther never got a huge Clantech glow-up like other DCMS mechs, I suppose this is due to the DCMS continuing to use it as a cheap fire support trooper, and using other chassis to experiment with light mech roles like the Phoenix Hawk L and the Rokurokubi. Still, I do wish that it got a better movement profile than 4/6/4 outside of two variants, as that speed is abysmal for a light mech. Even something like an XL gyro would enable it to mount a larger engine and survive better on the modern battlefield.
That was another great video there. The Panther does have its place, that's true. If you ignore it, you will be sorry. On a side note, have you ever worked on a pink Panther before?
Surprisingly, pink camo is rather useful in a number of situations, especially when dealing with some light from some stars.
Its all fun and games with honor and glory until you encounter a Griffin
The problem with the Griffin is that all its weapons have a minimum range AND are built on the same side.
The Panther isnt a terrible design, but its out of place for a Light mech. It makes me think of a Tank Destroyer like the Marder.
I liked it in the Battletech videogames where it was a good starter mech before you could get better mechs. So you upgrade to a Vindicator or Griffin.
I don't like its slow speed for any era. Thats a critical weakness as its pretty easy to counter with a much faster mech, like most Light Mechs.
Its main advantage is thats its relatively cheap, but there are much better and more efficient designs.
Cheap fire support with decent mobility and good armor. It's cheap both on BV and Cbills.
@@TheManyVoicesVA I prefer an Awesome if Im going for cheap. Its lower costing than 3 Panthers.
@@ChaosTicket Eh, I kinda see what you leaning towards and I love me a good assault mech. But that one Awesome can't be in three places at once like the three Panthers, cannot jump in tight situations and get vantage points, and, from a narrative standpoint, cannot be as easily mass produced and ya have to have the facilities to make it.
@@fedupN An Awesome has about 3 times the firepower and double the armor(6 times as powerful) of a Panther for 2.5 times the cost.
You really dont want to go into custom mechs because after seeing a post about an Optimized Warhawk being for villains I went into Mech Factory to make Jumping Awesomes.
The only real downside to focusing on fewer better mechs is the Mobility Checks for taking 20+ damage in a turn.
If anything it leads back to my preference for light mechs to be fast. A Wasp's kick is more deadly than a Panther's PPC.
@@ChaosTicket
I wouldn't really count custom mechs as a general rule, since that isn't the mechs as expected to be seen. That also sounds like a video game version with unlimited playing around with things. Almost not point in mech chassis if it can be tooled up to be any mech.
It also breaks heavily with establish in universe lore.
See: MWO lighting fast urban mechs.
That can lead us into very unhelpful territory of "Why don't the houses would totally just make fast urban mechs by hoping into magickal mech lab and give it all double heat sinks and XXXL Magnum Dong Condom Engines!"
On the table top, three panthers allow you great mobility in both speed and with jump jets. They allow you to hit multiple objectives at once, flank for rear shots, take advantage of various cover points, always be firing three PPC shots, and then can fire off SRMS to seek holes in armor.
Sure, there is the activation advantage too but blech.
Additionally, in some cases they can be more "durable" beyond merely the armor. One of them falls downs, the others keep firing. Bit of bad luck on the dice rolls and you slag some left arms and it doesn't slow the incoming fire.
In universe, there are alot of reasons to have numbers, from production availability to covering all your territories.
All that said, the Awesome is great. It does alot of things better than the Panther which has its own limitations.
But having multiple mechs that can mass produced, hit really freaking hard, and can work well at range or urban terrain has advantages.
After playing mech 5… this mech definitly is in my top 10 mechs I wouldn’t want to be caught dead in in Battletech.
Miserably slow, a soldjery mech through and through for suicide firing lines. A cheep and efective soldiery mech many a green combine mustard soldier will die in.
Panthers biggest jobbers in Warrior Trilogy…always thought they needed a medium to heavy version
Medium version is the Vindicator.
@@ProfessorHeyTeeEn Heavy would be the grand dragon. Or a PPC Thunderbolt if you want to keep the speed.
Good enough at the time? The 10k is one of the all time worst upgrades ever!
They made due with the parts they had.
All their double heat sink kits were going straight to Grand Dragons at the time.
@@ProfessorHeyTeeEn If you are not able to install double heat sinks, you should not even think about installing an ER-PPC.
The 10K gains a bid of range but loses at least 1/3 of it´s firepower because it needs to cool down all the time. This is a bad trade-off.
In the TRO:3050 there is quite some competion for the title of worst "upgrade", e.g. the Grasshopper 5J, Blackjack BJ-2, Griffin 1-DS, Hunchback 5M or Quickdraw 5K.
@@hermes7587 Oh gods the 3050 Hunchback is such a terrible machine...
@@hermes7587 Okay that blackjack before the Errata is worse than the 10k. I will admit that. "Hellow, would you like to go up 14 on the heatscale?"