Hi Joel, This is nicely done. I agree that limiting the Gospel to forensic justification only is probably too narrow. I also wonder, though, about the best way of framing this. I am drawn to Gustav Wingren's account of Luther's doctrine of vocation and Luther's belief that good works must be for the neighbor rather than for God. He seemed to be worried that making sanctification focused on shoring up our assurance of salvation would turn good works into transactional and self-interested endeavors rather than being genuinely directed toward the good of those around us. Thus, I do find something resonant about the idea of preaching sanctification as not so much a means of confirming or achieving salvation (not that you are saying this, I am using imprecise language here to make my point) but as coming from a place of abundance and peace in our relationship with God, with no need to gain anything for ourselves. How do you think we can preach God's Law to Christians while also avoiding a transactional relationship with sanctification?
Hey, David! It’s been a while, but thanks for jumping in the comment section here. I’m not very concerned about this problem myself, but I’d like to articulate why. I think there’s a conditionality that is not transactional in a bad way. For instance, knowing that a certain percentage of marriages end in divorce, I could be anxious that there’s a probability that mine will as well. However, I don’t think there’s any way around the fact that my marriage is conditional on my faithfulness. I think we try to draw too sharp a divide between protestant and catholic or orthodox approaches on this matter. Francis Turretin said that good works are the way and path of salvation, and I see this as conditional in a true sense. We will be glorified with him provided we suffer with him. That said, there are a lot of people who are really concerned about assurance of salvation or are scrupulous, and they tend to really appreciate gospel centered preaching. However, I think the church has over emphasized this. I know it’s not my spiritual problem. I want to be exhorted toward the holiness without which no one will see the Lord.
Christ gives us rest, but he also places on us his yoke, but his yoke is easy and his burden light - and we must lay down our lives in order to gain them...these are the paradoxes of the gospel!
The gospel also tends to get narrowly defined as saving us as individuals and neglect the reconciliation of Jew and Gentile as well as the redemption of all creation. Thus the horizontal aspect of reconciliation is ignored and the cosmic aspect of redemption is ignored. This has practical implications of how we relate to each other and understand the future of our planet.
Thanks for using your voice to speak truth. There are wonderful things happening right now in the world. The Spirit of God is moving.
Orthodox Christians know this, and we are accused of "salvation by works" by protestants.
Hi Joel,
This is nicely done. I agree that limiting the Gospel to forensic justification only is probably too narrow. I also wonder, though, about the best way of framing this. I am drawn to Gustav Wingren's account of Luther's doctrine of vocation and Luther's belief that good works must be for the neighbor rather than for God. He seemed to be worried that making sanctification focused on shoring up our assurance of salvation would turn good works into transactional and self-interested endeavors rather than being genuinely directed toward the good of those around us. Thus, I do find something resonant about the idea of preaching sanctification as not so much a means of confirming or achieving salvation (not that you are saying this, I am using imprecise language here to make my point) but as coming from a place of abundance and peace in our relationship with God, with no need to gain anything for ourselves. How do you think we can preach God's Law to Christians while also avoiding a transactional relationship with sanctification?
Hey, David! It’s been a while, but thanks for jumping in the comment section here. I’m not very concerned about this problem myself, but I’d like to articulate why.
I think there’s a conditionality that is not transactional in a bad way. For instance, knowing that a certain percentage of marriages end in divorce, I could be anxious that there’s a probability that mine will as well. However, I don’t think there’s any way around the fact that my marriage is conditional on my faithfulness.
I think we try to draw too sharp a divide between protestant and catholic or orthodox approaches on this matter. Francis Turretin said that good works are the way and path of salvation, and I see this as conditional in a true sense. We will be glorified with him provided we suffer with him.
That said, there are a lot of people who are really concerned about assurance of salvation or are scrupulous, and they tend to really appreciate gospel centered preaching. However, I think the church has over emphasized this. I know it’s not my spiritual problem. I want to be exhorted toward the holiness without which no one will see the Lord.
So encouraging to see someone who appreciates what JP is doing.
“Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.”
Matthew 11:28
Christ gives us rest, but he also places on us his yoke, but his yoke is easy and his burden light - and we must lay down our lives in order to gain them...these are the paradoxes of the gospel!
The gospel also tends to get narrowly defined as saving us as individuals and neglect the reconciliation of Jew and Gentile as well as the redemption of all creation. Thus the horizontal aspect of reconciliation is ignored and the cosmic aspect of redemption is ignored. This has practical implications of how we relate to each other and understand the future of our planet.
Even more dimensions I didn’t get to discuss!
forget about the gospel this man needs a cheeseburger. He makes Kate Moss look like Fat Albert in comparison.
Unnecessary and not even accurate
@@heisenberg3082 food is pretty necessary.
@ your comment is unnecessary
@ you'll find food is necessary but your response isnt.