Just bumped into Efrain from the Terry Bozzio video where he mentions him, then a couple days ago from a Matt Garstka twitch stream. Really fascinating stuff. I love learning new and mind-expansive things and this stuff definitely qualifies. It is exciting to find completely new lenses after playing for almost 20 years. Eff, I’m getting old…
Efrain Is a true master .His knowledge and beyond everything. profound and unique. Each of his video books and concepts are indispensable for anyone who wants to play the drums or any other musical instrument. one of a kind
I am proud to have been (and still be) a student of Efrain Toro. The artists he has recorded with speak for itself. Those who insist his method can not be legitimate or correct without “math” fail to understand his concept of “Harmonics” This year, I have 3 drum students who are college scholarship winners and 2 of them are also 2021 Down Beat Magazine winners. ALL of them took Master Classes with Efrain. I am thankful for each moment Efrain graciously shared his gigantic musical talent with us. Have an open mind and the courage to discover Rhythm beyond your current comprehension. It’s as easy as 123 😊🙏🏽
@@evanpetkau7329 , on our last conversation, he stated he was retired. I will ask him later this week. If he’ll take another student, I’ll contact you directly . 🙏🏽
In August 2019 Mr. Toro gave a clinic on rhythm to me and other students of Al Velasquez. My mind is still blown from all he taught that day. His insights on rhythm are indescribable; you just have to see it to believe it. Thank you for your wisdom, you have inspired me so much. PS, he also makes the best pancakes EVER!
Many years ago I got to see Efrain at the Montreal Drum Fest. He left a lasting impression on me not only with his playing but with his words. A true teacher.
Thank you...yes I had a wonderful time and returned for a masterclass the coming year ... ! I ave a private educational page if it interest you... send your Gmail address and I will send an invitation! Best , et.
Efrain Toro is such an advanced drummer his drumming concepts are amazing! You can literally improve your drumming by learning his ideas and mentally implementing them.
I studied with Mr. Efrain Toro when I attended MI in the early '90s; he's a great music Educator; I'm still working on rhythmic concepts from his first book.
Efrain is a true visionary and rhythmic genius. His perception of rhythm far surpasses most musicians. His concept 3&2 and multi dimensional time has greatly influenced my playing, rhythmic perception and compositions. I would implore anyone who decides to watch Efrain's videos to watch them with an open mind and without a bias of trying to qualify his teachings with knowledge in which you think you already know. If one truly listens to what he has to say then you may just learn something ;) PS. If you don't understand something theres no harm in asking for help :) -Angelo Velasquez, Cal arts Masters degree presidential scholarship winner, CSUN A band drummer, and 2021 Downbeat magazine best composition winner
Hi Silvano... what a great surprise ... hope you are well! would like to invite to my educational page if you like ... please send your email... thanks and saludos!
In Physics they call the fundamental and overtone...! In my point of view in Pulse the fundamental is the fundamental and the first harmonic is 2... a bit confusing but it has to be... we have no standard method to explain RHYTHM.... People like Salmar in the next comment thinks that RHYTHM is a human invention but I will address him properly and respectfully as with you. Please let me know if you have any questions...please , always happy to answer them sincerely!
To add to what Efrain is sharing with us: In Tao, over 4000 years ago, it was said..."from one comes two, from two comes three and from three comes all the numbers". And more....among the Dogon of Mali, an equally ancient culture, Nya is three (odd numbered) and is the male energy (Yang/ Shiva).Tolo is two (even numbered) and is the female energy.(Yin / Shakti) The Dogon this say: e"Every rhythm is a marriage and interplay of female and make eneries".
Hi Adam! Nice to hear from you... all these observations and realizations of individual cultures is RIGHT ON !!! They are what is called MYTH which is the stories we tell ourselves to try to understand the world as we see it while we are alive. We form MYTH every day sometimes... more MYTH happens when we are a a difficult time in our lives ;-) It is the most important device humans have to calm themselves about something they do not really understand in a fundamental way. ALL GOOD STUFF... myth is our internal song that informs us of the happenings on a daily basis. American Indians where are sound 13,000 years and they all come from he same root... First Indians in India appear 72.000 years after the first Africans... What ever AIDs US in our understanding of a subject must be brought forward... but the MYTH of today is different than the one 4000 years ago or 2000 years ago which is still the prevailing one but I am more with the Einstein MYTH called RELATIVITY and the Feynman MYTH called QUANTUM ELECTRODYNAMICS ... with Bohm MECHANICS in between. These are the prevailing myths and therefor my video and explantations. Best to you and thanks for participating, SINCERELY et !
@@efraintoro5073 thanks for interesting thoughts. I hear you and I understand. I imagine that "musiking" existed long before myth.....or any social constructs for that matter....
@@adamtabl agreed! Way before we develop the intellect for sure there was dancing and singing 🤝 though in principle rhythm has nothing to do with music as rhythm is the basis and it exists wether there is music or not …. Music is only one of trillions of ways that rhythm is manifested!
I enjoyed this talk quite a bit. Efrain Toro is probably a much better musician than I will ever be. Nonetheless the video appears to be nothing but an "esoteric" and a little misleading explanation of polyrhythms. At the very basis of rhythm is the abstract concept of simple algebra (calculating with fractions, mainly using the largest common demoninator, ...). That's it 🙃 We subdivide a chunk of time in different numbers of equally sized pieces. I am going to make myself even more unpopular by pointing out that at 25:00 Efrain Toro is not playing the notated 6 quarter note triplets, but: 2 dotted eigth notes + 1 eigth note + 2 dotted eigth note + 1 eigth note Also the statement that all you need to know to play complex rhythms are 2s and 3s is misleading ... well actually plain wrong. Take a 6 over 7 polyrhythm for example. It has completely different note relations than 2 over 3. You cannot express it as any kind of variation of a 2 over 3 or 3 over 2 polyrhythm. You absolutely need to learn the 6/7 relation in order to play it! Wish everyone a nice day! 😊
Nonetheless the video appears to be nothing but an "esoteric" and a little misleading explanation of polyrhythms. (ET)Rhythm is a POLY event …. So the word polyrhythm is a redundancy and actually the idea is a misunderstanding in the western way of thinking though great Physicists like Richard Feynman, Einstein, Maxwell and Bohm understood this idea clearly! At the very basis of rhythm is the abstract concept of simple algebra (calculating with fractions, mainly using the largest common denominator, ...). That's it 🙃 We subdivide a chunk of time in different numbers of equally sized pieces. (ET)This is exactly the misconception ;-) that is a EUCLIDEAN view of the world which does not work in dimensions as the Greeks stayed behind 14 centuries until they copied they Arabs who copied the Indians who figured out pretty much everything and created a LINEAR point of view of RHYTHM which the west inherited. (ET)Time is an element of RHYTHM … time is the space between one frequency and the next… universal concept not well understood. Einstein said there are many times at the same time… which seems to be the case and reality of ALL harmonic structures. I am going to make myself even more unpopular by pointing out that at 25:00 Efrain Toro is not playing the notated 6 quarter note triplets, but: 2 dotted eighth notes + 1 eight note + 2 dotted eight note + 1 eight note (ET)CORRECT I don’t know how to play anything perfectly everything I play is uneven like everything in nature … I explain on L TO M where the dotted note came from … the way that this is interpreted in actual playing is ambiguous as it is the basis of rhythm and nothing is nature is perfect but wobbly at best… but the dotted note does not exist in nature…! QUESTION!? Also the statement that all you need to know to play complex rhythms are 2s and 3s is misleading ... well actually plain wrong. Take a 6 over 7 polyrhythm for example. It has completely different note relations than 2 over 3. You cannot express it as any kind of variation of a 2 over 3 or 3 over 2 polyrhythm. You absolutely need to learn the 6/7 relation in order to play it! (ET) 6 and 7 is not a harmonic of the 1st order but nevertheless I will address the issue… I WILL OFFER YOU A FREE LESSON on Skype of whatever to make sure you understand certain things… I thank you for taking the time to watch , think and relate your thoughts… if you are relating things just to be a contrary then I will sense that and send you to the LIONS so to speak other wise if you are serious about RHYTHM I will give you a clear idea of how things work…. Sincerely! It is quite simple to play 6 and 7 from 2 & 3 and I will also do a video just for you and if you want to share then you can. You are so sure of what you are saying, as to say that I am misleading and wrong… those are strong and insulting words but I will excuse your lack of respect because you are young and obviously not conscious of your language.
@@efraintoro9415 Thank you for taking the time to respond to my comments, despite them being quite harsh 😅 I appreciate that a lot! 😊 Regarding the Skype call, I would be absolutely thrilled, but only if you can really spare the time. I'd be genuinely interested :) Wish you all the best!
Are you a musician!? I am sorry 😞 to hear such a negative comment without explanation. I am actually a real musician … with thousands of performances and recording credits and 18 books to my credit …. But I can just play too … but I can teach too and can do both well …. To just play is enough… but to know is the other 50% … if you just like 50% of everything… is your choice and that we have to respect…
@UCdG-pPtYF9V_gqyFRdSAlCw I'm a serious and schooled drummer for 55yrs straight. My background is extensive with thousands of performances just like you. You're great at promotion, which is commendable but You can't play time at all. Respect is honesty too.
@@efraintoro5073 no need to respond to people like this Efrain. Their eyes are not yet open. They will see it one day when they ready. Hope you well my friend.
“Natural musicians” ahhh! Are they also organic? Where can I get a pair? Perhaps at the colonial department of your favorite white supremacy’s retail store?
Just bumped into Efrain from the Terry Bozzio video where he mentions him, then a couple days ago from a Matt Garstka twitch stream. Really fascinating stuff. I love learning new and mind-expansive things and this stuff definitely qualifies. It is exciting to find completely new lenses after playing for almost 20 years. Eff, I’m getting old…
Efrain Is a true master .His knowledge and beyond everything. profound and unique. Each of his video books and concepts are indispensable for anyone who wants to play the drums or any other musical instrument. one of a kind
I am proud to have been (and still be) a student of Efrain Toro. The artists he has recorded with speak for itself. Those who insist his method can not be legitimate or correct without “math” fail to understand his concept of “Harmonics” This year, I have 3 drum students who are college scholarship winners and 2 of them are also 2021 Down Beat Magazine winners. ALL of them took Master Classes with Efrain. I am thankful for each moment Efrain graciously shared his gigantic musical talent with us. Have an open mind and the courage to discover Rhythm beyond your current comprehension. It’s as easy as 123 😊🙏🏽
To those people I'd say, stop being linear! :D
Do you know if Efrain takes on any new students of his own?
@@evanpetkau7329 , on our last conversation, he stated he was retired. I will ask him later this week. If he’ll take another student, I’ll contact you directly . 🙏🏽
@@AlVelasquezDrums thanks! If not, maybe one day I can take lessons with you!!!!!
In August 2019 Mr. Toro gave a clinic on rhythm to me and other students of Al Velasquez. My mind is still blown from all he taught that day. His insights on rhythm are indescribable; you just have to see it to believe it. Thank you for your wisdom, you have inspired me so much. PS, he also makes the best pancakes EVER!
More pancakes coming ;-)
Many years ago I got to see Efrain at the Montreal Drum Fest. He left a lasting impression on me not only with his playing but with his words. A true teacher.
Thank you...yes I had a wonderful time and returned for a masterclass the coming year ... ! I ave a private educational page if it interest you... send your Gmail address and I will send an invitation! Best , et.
Efrain is a gem. I was so lucky to tour with him. I’m happy to see this!!
Efrain Toro is such an advanced drummer his drumming concepts are amazing! You can literally improve your drumming by learning his ideas and mentally implementing them.
I studied with Mr. Efrain Toro when I attended MI in the early '90s; he's a great music Educator; I'm still working on rhythmic concepts from his first book.
heavy groove dear Charles... good to hear from you!
The more I see of this man the more amazing I find him.
He's such a great musician.
Him and Alex A together ❤️
Wonderful and Deep. Just his words are Eye-opening.
Efrain is a true visionary and rhythmic genius. His perception of rhythm far surpasses most musicians. His concept 3&2 and multi dimensional time has greatly influenced my playing, rhythmic perception and compositions. I would implore anyone who decides to watch Efrain's videos to watch them with an open mind and without a bias of trying to qualify his teachings with knowledge in which you think you already know. If one truly listens to what he has to say then you may just learn something ;)
PS. If you don't understand something theres no harm in asking for help :)
-Angelo Velasquez, Cal arts Masters degree presidential scholarship winner, CSUN A band drummer, and 2021 Downbeat magazine best composition winner
I can't believe this hasn't picked up yet. Comment, get together with Kiko Loureiro. He uses the Harmonic series to explain the pitch world.
thank you so much, you are an excellent teacher
Sempre interessante, grazie Efrain
Hi Silvano... what a great surprise ... hope you are well!
would like to invite to my educational page if you like ... please send your email... thanks and saludos!
Thank you!
Thank's!
still love your work!!
Are your books still available, Mr. Toro? I'd like to buy them if they are.
Hola Efraín, me encantaría tener tus libros. ¿Hay algún sitio donde se puedan comprar?
Vengo aqui de parte de Darwin Carvajal, saludos Efrain Toro
Saludos
1st overtone has two pulses (wave peak), 2nd has three pulses?
That earlier pattern would be the 1nd and 2rd overtones?
Edited - read chart wrong
In Physics they call the fundamental and overtone...! In my point of view in Pulse the fundamental is the fundamental and the first harmonic is 2... a bit confusing but it has to be... we have no standard method to explain RHYTHM.... People like Salmar in the next comment thinks that RHYTHM is a human invention but I will address him properly and respectfully as with you. Please let me know if you have any questions...please , always happy to answer them sincerely!
2 has 4 , 3 has 6, 4 Has 8 … get it !? 😊
To add to what Efrain is sharing with us: In Tao, over 4000 years ago, it was said..."from one comes two, from two comes three and from three comes all the numbers". And more....among the Dogon of Mali, an equally ancient culture, Nya is three (odd numbered) and is the male energy (Yang/ Shiva).Tolo is two (even numbered) and is the female energy.(Yin / Shakti) The Dogon this say: e"Every rhythm is a marriage and interplay of female and make eneries".
Hi Adam! Nice to hear from you... all these observations and realizations of individual cultures is RIGHT ON !!! They are what is called MYTH which is the stories we tell ourselves to try to understand the world as we see it while we are alive. We form MYTH every day sometimes... more MYTH happens when we are a a difficult time in our lives ;-)
It is the most important device humans have to calm themselves about something they do not really understand in a fundamental way. ALL GOOD STUFF... myth is our internal song that informs us of the happenings on a daily basis. American Indians where are sound 13,000 years and they all come from he same root... First Indians in India appear 72.000 years after the first Africans... What ever AIDs US in our understanding of a subject must be brought forward... but the MYTH of today is different than the one 4000 years ago or 2000 years ago which is still the prevailing one but I am more with the Einstein MYTH called RELATIVITY and the Feynman MYTH called QUANTUM ELECTRODYNAMICS ... with Bohm MECHANICS in between. These are the prevailing myths and therefor my video and explantations. Best to you and thanks for participating, SINCERELY et !
@@efraintoro5073 thanks for interesting thoughts. I hear you and I understand. I imagine that "musiking" existed long before myth.....or any social constructs for that matter....
@@adamtabl agreed! Way before we develop the intellect for sure there was dancing and singing 🤝 though in principle rhythm has nothing to do with music as rhythm is the basis and it exists wether there is music or not …. Music is only one of trillions of ways that rhythm is manifested!
🌞🙏❤
Go everybody search how an organ works. You can watch and hear how this armonic thing works
You've written half note triplets on the board though.
Questions !?
I enjoyed this talk quite a bit. Efrain Toro is probably a much better musician than I will ever be.
Nonetheless the video appears to be nothing but an "esoteric" and a little misleading explanation of polyrhythms.
At the very basis of rhythm is the abstract concept of simple algebra (calculating with fractions, mainly using the largest common demoninator, ...).
That's it 🙃
We subdivide a chunk of time in different numbers of equally sized pieces.
I am going to make myself even more unpopular by pointing out that at 25:00 Efrain Toro is not playing the notated 6 quarter note triplets, but:
2 dotted eigth notes + 1 eigth note + 2 dotted eigth note + 1 eigth note
Also the statement that all you need to know to play complex rhythms are 2s and 3s is misleading ... well actually plain wrong.
Take a 6 over 7 polyrhythm for example. It has completely different note relations than 2 over 3.
You cannot express it as any kind of variation of a 2 over 3 or 3 over 2 polyrhythm. You absolutely need to learn the 6/7 relation in order to play it!
Wish everyone a nice day! 😊
Sorry, but you didn't understand that it exists only ONE Rhythm, and so Polythyms are not possible!
Trying to reply to all your points but but it does not let me... ;-/
I suggest you read some of Efrains books or reach out to contact him. This will help clear up your confusion :)
Nonetheless the video appears to be nothing but an "esoteric" and a little misleading explanation of polyrhythms.
(ET)Rhythm is a POLY event …. So the word polyrhythm is a redundancy and actually the idea is a misunderstanding in the western way of thinking though great Physicists like Richard Feynman, Einstein, Maxwell and Bohm understood this idea clearly!
At the very basis of rhythm is the abstract concept of simple algebra (calculating with fractions, mainly using the largest common denominator, ...).
That's it 🙃
We subdivide a chunk of time in different numbers of equally sized pieces.
(ET)This is exactly the misconception ;-) that is a EUCLIDEAN view of the world which does not work in dimensions as the Greeks stayed behind 14 centuries until they copied they Arabs who copied the Indians who figured out pretty much everything and created a LINEAR point of view of RHYTHM which the west inherited.
(ET)Time is an element of RHYTHM … time is the space between one frequency and the next… universal concept not well understood. Einstein said there are many times at the same time… which seems to be the case and reality of ALL harmonic structures.
I am going to make myself even more unpopular by pointing out that at 25:00 Efrain Toro is not playing the notated 6 quarter note triplets, but:
2 dotted eighth notes + 1 eight note + 2 dotted eight note + 1 eight note
(ET)CORRECT I don’t know how to play anything perfectly everything I play is uneven like everything in nature … I explain on L TO M where the dotted note came from … the way that this is interpreted in actual playing is ambiguous as it is the basis of rhythm and nothing is nature is perfect but wobbly at best… but the dotted note does not exist in nature…! QUESTION!?
Also the statement that all you need to know to play complex rhythms are 2s and 3s is misleading ... well actually plain wrong.
Take a 6 over 7 polyrhythm for example. It has completely different note relations than 2 over 3.
You cannot express it as any kind of variation of a 2 over 3 or 3 over 2 polyrhythm. You absolutely need to learn the 6/7 relation in order to play it!
(ET) 6 and 7 is not a harmonic of the 1st order but nevertheless I will address the issue… I WILL OFFER YOU A FREE LESSON on Skype of whatever to make sure you understand certain things… I thank you for taking the time to watch , think and relate your thoughts… if you are relating things just to be a contrary then I will sense that and send you to the LIONS so to speak other wise if you are serious about RHYTHM I will give you a clear idea of how things work…. Sincerely!
It is quite simple to play 6 and 7 from 2 & 3 and I will also do a video just for you and if you want to share then you can.
You are so sure of what you are saying, as to say that I am misleading and wrong… those are strong and insulting words but I will excuse your lack of respect because you are young and obviously not conscious of your language.
@@efraintoro9415 Thank you for taking the time to respond to my comments, despite them being quite harsh 😅
I appreciate that a lot! 😊
Regarding the Skype call, I would be absolutely thrilled, but only if you can really spare the time. I'd be genuinely interested :)
Wish you all the best!
Efrain you need a minute of 70 seconds... that's the only way you can play 5eq7...LOL
It kills me to just listen to this guy. Run away from this.
Are you a musician!? I am sorry 😞 to hear such a negative comment without explanation. I am actually a real musician … with thousands of performances and recording credits and 18 books to my credit …. But I can just play too … but I can teach too and can do both well …. To just play is enough… but to know is the other 50% … if you just like 50% of everything… is your choice and that we have to respect…
@UCdG-pPtYF9V_gqyFRdSAlCw I'm a serious and schooled drummer for 55yrs straight. My background is extensive with thousands of performances just like you. You're great at promotion, which is commendable but You can't play time at all. Respect is honesty too.
@@efraintoro5073 no need to respond to people like this Efrain. Their eyes are not yet open. They will see it one day when they ready.
Hope you well my friend.
“Natural musicians” ahhh! Are they also organic? Where can I get a pair? Perhaps at the colonial department of your favorite white supremacy’s retail store?