Controlling Instrument and Stage Sound in Worship presented by Yamaha
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- Опубліковано 17 січ 2017
- Mike Overlin from Yamaha shares some tips on controlling instruments and stage sound for worship. After the video, learn more from Sweetwater Worship Connect here: www.sweetwater.com/worship/
Thank you for lending your expertise. You are very much a blessing to our community! When my dad was leading worship, he could really have used your advice, but we did the best we could back then!
Wooooow! I am a Pastor in Dar Es Salaam Tanzania East Africa. Awesome tutorial.
Bless you sweetwater
good job on the tips! I like this !
Great video, very informative.
“There double Marshal stack in a church of 60” 😂😂😂
Half guilty. I put my single 4x12 pointing straight up at me.
Really good info right here...
Electronic vs acoustic: Old argument but even as a drummer I understand the weighting towards electronics. I'm a pro who can control my volume but as others have said, the percentage of drummers that can do that is getting smaller all the time. The issue that is not brought up almost at all is once you move to electronic kits, even good ones, the need for a mature, skilled sound crew or tech goes up exponentially. The majority of churches I've played in, that person is a volunteer. They're doing the best they can but most the time the only thing they recognize as success is keeping the volume down. One of my main frustrations is that although my time is solid after years of playing with clicks, metronomes and loops, not everybody in the band has time like that (although they certainly should be pursuing excellence that way). To keep chaos to a minimum, I take the 'my way of the highway' approach to time with the exception of moving with the leader (slightly) after getting a clear signal to do so. If the tech or the monitor system can't get the right amount of e-drum volume to all of the players, forget it. With acoustic drums there are ways to sheepdog the errant players, hopefully in a subtle way. Electronics that are under mixed or improperly mixed (or acoustic drums being behind a full enclosure) have no way of providing guidance. Also most in ears or wedge solutions for drums are severely lacking in realistic monitoring for the drummer himself. So bottom line is with most churches you replace the volume problem with a whole new set of problems. These issues should always be discussed together, looking for the best comprehensive solution. Rarely are they though. :(
"Most drummers have a problem with electronic drums"
But nobody cares what the drummer thinks. Most churches just need a body to fill the position and don't want the drummer's opinions. That's why alot of churches LOVE to have young, inexperienced drummers who will do whatever they're told to just for the experience of playing on the platform.
I've never seen any other situation besides church where a Sound Tech or Band Leader will run out and buy new percussion instruments that they know almost nothing about without ever consulting the drummer.
Interesting.. Thank you Yamaha... Team
Two of my mics are interfering please what is the causes
what a great sales man
A lot depends on how the drummer is trained. Drummers should incorporate dynamic range exercises as a routine part of their training. (I mastered the rope tensioned field drum. I developed such soft hands that I needed to have a drum made for me, because I had soft, quiet hands--and I did not sacrifice style in developing great hands.) As an experienced drummer, I much prefer the feel of acoustic drums over e-drums any day. I actually tune my practice pad heads to match the feel of my acoustic drums. You can add more / heavier baffling to the acoustic drums, which can help. Have the drummer try out different stick designs. I prefer a stick with a long taper (a stick that's considered to be a modified Swiss design) that 'sits up'. So, not only should the drummer want to try lighter sticks, but the drummer might want to try different shaped stick heads and tapers. This is important: have the drummer work on brush work. Heavy handed drummers generally don't like to play with brushes. If a heavy handed drummer diligently works on exercises to improve one's dynamic range, the drummer will develop light hands (maybe as light as my hands became). A good way for a heavy handed drummer to see progress is to play with brushes... once you have a light touch, they'll be a sheen to your brush work. If the whole band wants to go acoustic and use quieter instruments, brush work is the way to go...
I had a pastor that HATED electronic drums. The drummer we had was fantastic and once he heard this he quit the worship team and quit attending that service
Well, apparently they didn't need them because he wasn't humble enough to understand his role and priorities at the church
Julián Andrés Murillo Amen brother!
Is he talking about the recording mix or the house mix? Is he saying you will use the house mix for the recording?
The benefit of e-drums is that the main desk controls the house volume,but then you need to have the drums coming back at you thru either your iems or your foldback speaker.My last church went from acoustic to e-drums but we did not like them so went back to acoustic.My own personal opinion is that acoustic drums have a better feel to them etc,also I have never liked e-cymbals,always played my own live cymbals with the e-drums,having a lot more control over the sound from them.One of our drummers brings along 7 cymbals when he plays,not sure if e-drums have imputs for 7 e-cymbals.Maybe they do.!!
please what can make the amp to bridge
I've actually found that hot rods don't make that much of a volume difference on cymbals, which are one of the loudest parts of the kit. Best solution to a loud drummer is getting them to get lighter sticks and play quieter.
The answer to loud cymbals is Heartbeat.
No offense, but tend to think that You are not a Drummer by yourself, right?
Don't forget about the mesh drum heads and perforated cymbals and using drum triggers as mics.
Just get a drummer that can play at reasonable volumes.
“Cutting the distance in half from a sound source makes something 4 times louder.”... this is an incorrect statement. If you cut the distance in half takes things up +6db. This typically is not 4xVolume.. it’s adopted that we typically hear +10db = 2x loudness. In order to perceive 4x loudness you’d need +20db. In order to have +20db increase, that would require cutting the distance in half 3.33 times
Yup!
As a former acoustic theory student, I agree. Bravo!
Amen on the electronic drum kit. If i were a drummer, id play one. So much more controllable and sound options. Its like a guitar player who hates pedals.
He is 100000% correct on electronic kits in a church
In will put this mildly, electric drums is like having an relationship with an inflatable doll...sorry🤭
Everyone likes electronic drums except drummers.
idk, but as a keyboardist I hate it too.
Electric drums suck. there’s no other way of getting around it!
Amen
Jake Walker if they’re so good why do pros use Acoustic kits ?
I don't like the way they sound at all
electronic drums are NEVER to solution EVER!!!!!! The first reason is most church are not gonna have a $7000 e kit they are gonna do what churches do and get the cheapest kit the can and it's gonna suck. I have been playing electronic drums since the 80's and they will never be able to reproduce all those little nuances that make the drummer sound like him. It reduces every drummer to a drum machine.
Though I would agree in Principal; the mesh kits that have come out in the past few years being piped to a VST on laptop to generate better samples will take 90% of the way there. I have an Alesis DM10 for which I have modified to a mesh kit at pretty low cost. I am able to connect to Addictive Drummer via USB and generate some pretty awesome drums sounds. I use it for recording since I don't have access to a location where I can play/record an acoustic kit. Still, the main problem with churches is they don't have a solid advisor giving them options and they let budget dictate a lot of things. Someone saying, 'hey I know you have $XXX of dollars to spend but I advise you to wait a little while' because you could do 60% better with 10% more budget.
Cliff Berry this is one of the most balanced, informed comments on e-drums I’ve heard in a while. Well said.
I actually had a pastor tell me they didn't have the money to drop on a full enclosure, new drum heads, and thinner cymbals. Then he ran out and spent $5000 on an e-kit. 🤦🏻♂️
In ear.... firstpart of video you talk about bringing the drummer back into worship then you wanna get rid of others by walking them off with in ear.....
Try goin on the fly while everyone is plugged in an can’t hear you except thru the board!
Pretty disappointed with this video. I saw it as a promo video for Yamaha gear at Sweetwater, rather than having pro audio engineers talking about stage volume they deal with every day in the field at theaters, smaller venues, and how they solve their specific issues. Like drummers struggling to have good feel so they play harder, when adding a drum sub or butt kicker can add the low end back into their playing so they can back off on their attack into the drums.
Is it me, or does he sometimes sound like Frank Welker?
Just get drummers that can play to the room. When I first started playing in church in the 80's we didn't have enclosures at all and you just had to play at the right levels for the room. The problem is now days drummers do not have the skills to play with dynamics and different volumes. You can't play in church like a rock concert. Modern guys play way to aggressive for church worship. They kill it for the rest of us.
You say that like churches have an abundance of drummers. It's hard enough getting people involved in church outside of the hour a week that they sit in service. There's even fewer who can play drums, and fewer still who can play to a room. With that being said, good luck picking and choosing from your abundance of qualified drummers who can play to a room.
Training is the key!
I disagree
I'm not 100% against e-drums just 99%. I don't want most drummers to determine if real drums work in a particular room. In some old rooms you could make the case but most modern churches there is no excuse. Either the drummers with real instruments can't play the room, or the rooms are acoustic nightmares. Remember 2 things... If you don't have a real acoustical engineer look over your building design and then you treat the room after it is built -you will get half the performance at twice the cost. The other thing to remember is the guy in the above video works for Yamaha.
This. Video.
Sorry modeling amps don't feel the same or sound the same at all. They feel weird and don't respond the same way at all.
Try the Kemper Profiler
Stopped watching when he says: "That's why I prefer electronic kit.."😂
All these folks hating edrums sound like people who thinks only Harley’s are motorcycles. I can guarantee that if you heard a recording of our service, you would’ve never known that it was edrums. I have a full size customized conversion ekit and I use a top of the line vst. I have a full size acoustic kit that I love but when I gig, it’s the conversion kit. I can adapt to any size platform, any size church and I don’t have to be in a box or behind plastic.
What rubbish is he even talking abt cutting the sound and also he stats it incorrectly ..... Im more supriced that someone like sweetwater makes a video with that guy, also abt drummer, lemme tell you, nobody wants to play in the church, bcz theres too much of restrictions, and i bet that guy isnt even a musician , im a musician and experienced of more than 20+ years, and i still play in the church and we dont have any restriction which is teally good but yes I have dynamics, and i know how to play in any situation, but the biggest problem the size of the drum which no one will talk, if you have small church ask the drummer not the sound engineer, you need small sized toms like 8 and 10 inch and 18-22 inch bass drum, floor tom is ur choice , so that the sound will automatically will be reduced bcz it wont allow it to be loud, just an eg. And theres so much more to it . But just to finish this off, just dont make any video which doesnt give clearity but confusion
Ain't No Real Drummer Gonna Use Electronic Drums 😂
Electronic drums suck! I’m gonna stick with pdp! All my fellow drummers who agree like this comment!
So no one agreed
He's basically advertising Yamaha products for each topic he's covering. 👎🏼
Tito V He is a Yamaha employee and Yamaha sent him there so of course he's gonna advertise their products. That's his job.
Exactly what I was thinking, great info but please leave the salesman aspect out Sweetwater...
well hello ...thats his primary job there.
Tito V yeah the video says "presented by Yamaha".....so of course he's gonna advertise Yamaha.
That’s ok. He’s not forcing you to buy anything, he’s just giving you information and it’s free.