The F-35 was created to "quaterback" different weapons platforms. While the F-22 will watch it's back, the F-15EX will complement any strike package with the ability to carry 30,000 pounds of ordinance. (4) F-35s accompanied by (4) F-15EX, (carrying 12+ anti-air missiles/each), and (4) F-22s are an excellent force multiplier. The Eagle IIs can be used in support of the F-35s and they can also defend themselves and dogfight if necessary maintaining the F-35s out of the picture and with the F-22s on "overwatch" just in case. With the new upgrades the Eagles can share all the necessary info with the Raptors, Lighting II and even the latest F-16V Vipers. "Teamwork" is the key for any tipe of conflict, battle or war. Let's hope that WE never have to use this combinations.
And which one of these will replace the A-10 in the Air-to-Ground (aka Air to Mud) Mission that the USAF has detested since day one? And the USAF has been spending years to remove from the inventory. Hot flash for the USAF. Airplanes do not hold ground. Yes they are a very important asset in the overall picture but unless you have boots on the gournd holding ground you do not have anything. So perhaps someday the USAF will realize the grunt on the ground is also a very important asset worth protecting.
in fact the f-35 failed to accomplish its goal, too costly, cant fly during storms cause it can't take lightining, the f-15 is a better plane bang per buck overall, also stealth might be irrelevant with newer detections systems, like using radars with different waves or using heat detection instead, the f-15 is a top of the line airplane, basically the f-35 project i believe was too complex it involved too many people in its development, and unlike previous generations, newer generations are much less keen on education, the lack of overall leaderships/skillsets/education led to its downfall, and the enormous budget employing too many people just made it worse, the f-15 was basically made by people who knew what they were doing to put it short, they didnt build a plane to them later sort it out. by the way one f-15 lost its wing and the pilot didnt even notice it at the moment, he was able to fly back and land it safely, good luck doing that with any other plane.
They don't prefer the F15EX, they just can't afford an all stealth fleet. It's not just the sticker price, the operating costs and availability rates are important too. And you don't need an all stealth fleet, so it is an acceptable compromise. And the EX is not 4th gen, it's 4+ or 4,5 how ever you want to call it. It is a lot more advanced than the legacy F 15s. It's in the same category as the Eurofighter Typhoon or the french Rafale.
No, because stealth is obsolete.. Well, physical stealth anyway.. You have to spend many billions of dollar into an airframe, and then the enemy counters it, and it's useless. It's better to have a decent airframe that can carry weapons etc. And then you add electronic warfare suites, datalinks etc to it.. It's WAAY cheaper to upgrade that, and quicker too. Say you make a stealth plane today.. It's not invisible(!) to radar, just harder to detect.. Problem is technology is really advancing fast today.. So invisible today means in ten years so are a big blob on the latest radars.. But if you use electronics to defeat enemy radars, you can upgrade that bit with a new ew pod every 2 years... WAAY cheaper...
@@MrZnarffy F-35 has BAE's Eurofighter Gen 4.5 era digital jammer, RCS towed drone, and passive stealth (shape and materials). F-35 can target enemy missiles as an Aegis ABM compatible platform. F-15EX's recent wargames have mixed results. F-15EX is based on Saudi's F-15SA and they are targets for SAMs.
JAS 39 Gripen has no stealth, still done extremely well as red force planes in Red Flag, the only match they had was F22s and F35s.. And Gripen is NOT stealth.. But if you have good EW, stealth don't help as you gotta get close and lose your advantage.. And as I said.. Stealth today is not stealth tomorrow.. So WHY on earth spend 100 million ++ on airframes thats gonna get shot down or replaced in 5 years?? US was first with stealth, why do you think they are discontinuing F22s and replacing them with F15s? Wake up dude...
@@MrZnarffy They are not replacing the Raptor with the F-15EX.They Raptor is to be replaced by the NGAD (Next Generation Air Dominance) fighter which has apparently already flown in prototype form. The NGAD will be a stealthy sixth generation fighter that will have its stealth properties based on the F-35 which is said to be much more durable and easier to maintain then the F-22. If Stealth was truely on the way out,why would the US,the country who was first with stealth, be on the verge of rolling out the B-21 with 150 + plane order in the next three years? The EX is set to replace the F-15C (and likely the F-15E down the road) because the F-15C airframes are way passed their projected service life (most are mid to late 80s vintage) and need to be phased out by the end of this decade. The Air Force originally wanted to replace the F-15C with F-16s but the EX provides more capability and that was already paid for by the Saudis and South Koreans ordering more advanced Eagles which kept the assemblylines open and funded 4+ generation upgrades. The EX is not only cheaper to operate and has greater endurance then the F-35. It can be fielded using existing Eagle supply chains and training facilities. Eagle pilots can change over to the EX after a week of training vs months changing over to the F-35. It doesn't hurt that the EX has the Eagles long range performance which will be a big help over the SCS.
In my uneducated opinion, the 🇺🇸 made the right decision, the F-15 has always been a phenomenal machine! How many adversaries would require rediculisously expensive stealth aircraft when the F-15 can already deal with almost everything? Cheeper too!
The operating cost of 5th gen fighters are more as compared to 4th gen fighter. While operating in aircraft carrier 5th generation fighter are good for specialised mission, as my opinion.
Because it's for the wars of tomorrow. It has been almost 100 years since we've fought a near peer adversary. If and when the time comes, we'll be glad we have a stealth fleet.
@@Apophis-en9pi US war doctrine states involves getting air supremacy asap. Thats where the steal fleet comes in. After achieving air supremacy, it is cheaper to use 4th gens than 5th gens. They are not gonna use the 4th gens to fight other air superiority planes. Theyre going to use it as a weapons platform to target tanks and ground targets.
@@apeinto5637 100% Correct. A relatively new development however are extremely mobile and effective SAM's. So Air Superiority Fighter vs Air Superiority Fighter is only part of the consideration. Even with no adversaries in the air, the threat from the ground has never been greater. This is why stealth is still extremely important.
Once the enemy air defense is taken out by F35’s and cruise missiles the F15EX can take out many more targets with it’s large payload of weapons in the same air strike.
The F-15, with its superior overall maneuverability & payload is also better at SEAD & DEAD missions. Being a visible threat that must be neutralized unless whatever it's going for unmolested is worth losing. Which, if it's a major power plant or electrical junction station supporting stationary RADAR assets, supply convoys, &/or armor columns, is a difficult choice to make. Sacrifice your mobile AA now, & maybe save those other assets, or sacrifice those assets to preserve your mobile AA for later.
The F-15 is respected worldwide by friend and foe alike. It is a perfect aircraft for installing upgrade equipment into instead of starting from scratch with a completely new design. The same approach applies to upgrading the A-10 Thunderbolt(Warthog),it is a supreme ground attack,ground support aircraft and would be nearly impossible to replace. Both decisions were wise.
The odds we could become involved in a ground war are growing exponentially, by about 6-7. Now is not the time to play nice. I say we figure out a way for the Russians to stop and retreat from Ukraine, but maybe give their money back as an incentive? Lots of countries have Russian money invested. Germany is the biggest, maybe. Then USA second (I guess) Money is a good motivator, then again, so is pride.
At 225 million per jet and nothing in the air that can even compare to it I think 130 of them is plenty. Just like computers and cell phones military technology is expensive and is outdated quickly. The US alone has around 900 f22s and f35s combined. That's 900 5th gen fighters. China has around 50 5th gen fighters and Russia has 12.
@@DIYAllied Actually, I never understood why advance in computer and cellphone technology made them more affordable, while advance in military technology makes everything more expensive. Will our grandchildren fight with a single fighter jet per country?
it was just a bad timing, the airforce was geared for a war on terror where a hightech stealth fighter was pretty much useless so it got cut short of its true potential numbers
@@albar428 just quoting this here but "The F-15EX costs $87.7 million per aircraft, and can fly for up to 20,000 hours at a cost of $29,000 per hour. So $29,000 per hour x 20,000 hours + $87.7 million for the aircraft comes out to a pretty serious $667.7 million dollars. In order to match that operational lifespan, it would take three F-35As. So the math would look like $44,000 per hour x 20,000 hours + $233.7 million for three F-35s… and it comes out to more than a jaw dropping $1.1 billion. The F-15EX, then, offers a saving of around $446 million per aircraft over the lifespan of the jet (if things were this simple, anyway)."
@@lolzyking656 From 19-F-1098_DOC_33_F-35_SAR_Dec_201 pdf F-35A’s Maintenance and Sustaining Support cost per hour is $14,043 USD. $30,000 value includes system improvements, unit manpower, and unit operations. US has a significant pre-Block 3F F-35 fleet, hence expensive retrofits.
@@Skyhawks1979 yeah its 2 years of 24/7 use, 10 years of about 5 and half flights hours average daily, or about 20 years of service at an average of 2 and half hours of flight time average per day. most planes aren't assigned to a single pilot and are assigned to a squadron, so you could possibly see in an active warzone the aircraft being refueled, rearmed, and the pilot swapped out with a fresh pilot for a new mission within hours of the aircraft landing depending on operational needs.... its not that outlandish when you consider how various older fighter have had their service life extended. I personally think the correct decision is to have both f35's and upgraded f15's.
There is something to be said for keeping the production line of an air superiority fighter open. Since the F-22 production line is gone, the F-15 production line is important.
It makes sense to use the F15 EX to make up the bulk of the next generation fighter fleet rather than the super expensive and high maintenance F35. The F35 is a great platform for consideration as a naval strike craft and stealth strikes deep within enemy territory. When you consider that the main roles of a fighter are air superiority and close air support (roles the cheaper and more easily maintained F15 EX and A-10 Warthog are perfectly capable of between them) keeping a smaller dedicated force of F35's for stealth attacks, deep strikes and on carriers is far better than trying to manage the huge cost and maintenance overruns a large fleet of F35's would entail.
a high performance missiles truck with range, speed, etc is perhaps a needed component in an air war with an adversary that has equal or superior numbers and comparable technologies
Another major factor is shown this day. The cost of hyper-modern planes makes it necessary to reduce the numbers. The world is showing us today, that numbers are still VERY important. In a world where military presence is and has been for the last 10-12 years, a major war deterrent. We, as in all major western countries have neglected our duties of protection, to ourselves and our allies. Germany for example has highly motivated and highly trained forces for counter-terrorism and small scale conflict. But lacks any real defence and support power. We Germans simply do not have the numbers needed neither personal nor in equipment. Hopefully, the politics will react and take citizens into defence service in the very short term and in the long term build up a reasonable amount of armed forces. Generally, while I think a small force of 5th gen. fighters is needed for a modern military I do think the major portion of a modern airforce should be modern 4th or 4.5 gen. airframes. The hyper-modern planes are filling a narrow role but the backbone combat should be modern fighters.
Hopefully all our politicians will get their acts together and take a measured approach to defense. After the collapse of the Soviet Union too many western nations including mine, US, had neglected defense and became hyper focused on social programs too the detriment of us all. I hope we truly learn from our mistakes going forward.
In Europe, right now nobody has enough numbers of military human nor equipment resources. This has to change very quickly otherwise we'll be crushed by the russians. More equipment, military service for everyone, more military industry and reasearch, more EU cooperation and less or even 0 gas imports from russia. We need more 4.5 fighters well capable for air-air and air-ground attacks and nuclear capacity.
There are a lot of strategies and tactics this opens up, in addition to having logistics advantages. The F-15ex can fly three times as many miles and is much cheaper to maintain. It is an amazing missle carrier that can manauver in a dog fight, and it also can keep up with the f35 easily. That being said, consider just one of the tactics as an example. The f35 is capable of using electronic warfare and decoy deployment to simulate f15 radar signatures. A single f35 can simulate up to a dozen f15s on enemy radar if they specialize in it and are willing to give up other payload. With just 2 f15exs and 2 f35s, they can appear to be nearly 30 fighter aircraft, make an enemy aircraft group waste most of their missles, and carry enough missles themselves to seriously impact that group. Imagine being in an arial engagement and 2 dozen f15s pop up on radar, you fire on them, they disappear then reappear elsewhere, then missles start coming in at you.
The F-15 aircraft is designed to “keep flying” after taking two hits anywhere in the hydraulic system. This capability was accomplished by using unique features developed by MACAIR such as Return Level Sensing (RLS) that provides 2 hydraulic circuits per system, Switching Valves and Return Press Sensing (RPS). 3 systems are supplied by 4 identical engine driven pumps, 2 on each engine. The F-18 aircraft uses this same technology except it uses 2 identical engine driven pumps, 1 on each engine.
The F-15EX is quite obviously inspired by countries like Singapore and later Saudi and Qatar, with their orders of highly customized F-15SG/SA/QA. Singapore started the ball rolling with an extensive list of customized upgrades including integration with local technologies, that stretched the mission profiles considerably and reimagined their use - in mixed missions with F-35 and F-16.
Any modern air force probably needs a variety of aircraft to best support all of its missions. I've never believed that one plane like the F-35 can "do it all" as well as a proper mix of different platforms can. Still like to see upgraded versions of the A-10 (who really believes that the F-35 will ever be able to do its close ground support job as well as it does?), F-22, F-23, and F-15EX in the air, so we haven't put all our eggs in one basket that could be upset if new enemy weapon systems figure out how to easily take down F-35's. Some reasonable diversity is strength!
Reality is other countries haven't really provided a compelling competition re: legit 5th-gen aircraft. Both Su-57 (FA-50) & J-20 are 10-15 years behind the US in first flights, entering into service, & sheer numbers of aircraft. Or the experience gained having operated them all that time. And under combat conditions. The US has 179 F-22s & 709 F-35s. Russia has 3 Su-57s. China supposedly has 150 J-20s. They had Russian engines. Then Chinese. But the Chinese engines were too unpowered, so back to Russian. 6 months ago, apparently trying the homebrew again. US tech has already had a couple decades to sort these things out. And 6th-gen is already here. Integrating the next big thing w/ UCAVs as "wingmen". VSTOL for Carrier operations. All kinds of new bells & whistles. Doesn't make alot of sense to pour money into extra 5th-gen when we know we want resources freed up to stay ahead.
Combined with the fact that by now the F-35 project is mind-bogglingly over-budget and still lacks several core advertised features. Basically a TON of money for a product that has never lived up to it's own hype when the existing airframes are more than capable with minimal modernization and upgrade at a tiny fraction of the cost.
An F-15E costs $11.7M/year to operate and maintain. EX is probably even more expensive! An F-35 costs $13.4M/year averaged between the variants and I'll bet the B variant is eating up a ton of that! That's really not a meaningful difference. An F-16 costs $5.7M to operate and maintain. That means you could operate 2 F-16s for the price of one F-15E with a third of a million dollars in spare change. Yet the airforce is buying F-15EX. This shows how little operating and maintainance costs matter. Certainly the 15% difference between F-15E and F-35 isn't gonna make them suddenly decide to be reformers when a 105% difference between the F-16 and F-15E is considered a non-issue. You need a better reason why they're picking the F-15EX than a miniscule difference in operating costs.
Perhaps a former Boeing high level executive now working on the government convinced the congress to buy it, without any request from USAF which wants as much F35 as possible.
The F-15 is a proven and capable platform that can easily go toe to toe with any of its Russian or Chinese counterparts. The F-15EX is a logical choice to compliment the F-35.
We need more F-15EXs with longer-range air-to-air missiles in the 200-300 mile range and air-to-ground standoff weapons for striking with 1,000+ mile ranges to keep our aircraft out of the threat zone. Also, Rapid Dragon using cargo planes as floating armories to drop pallets of missiles out of the back and have them launch from the pallet is a beautiful and well-tested program that works very well for striking ground targets.
The US also doesn't want to put all its eggs in one basket. The F-16 is manufactured by General Dynamics which was acquired by Lockheed. The F-22 was and the F-35 is manufactured by Lockheed. The F-15 is the only active fighter jet built by another company (General Dynamics / Boeing).
This video missed the main point, the F-35 production line is at capacity. So it was either open a new line at great expense of money and time. OR give the contract to replace the now retiring f-15 C and D fleets to another facility already set up and ready to go on the F-15EX.
Maybe the reason is the F-15EX, an F-15E Strike Eagle Variant can reach the speed of Mach 2.5+ and has plenty of Hardpoints despite lacks Stealth Characteristics unlike F-35, though F-35 will also have a Hardpoints in "Beast Mode" configuration while sacrificing Stealth for Firepower, from Air or Ground Missions.
The thing is an F-15 top speed can only be achieved in a clean configuration whereas the F-35 can handle more weapons and sensors internally and thus can sustain top speeds with less drag. Besides the whole speed thing is a red herring. It is true on a dedicated interceptor it is useful. But most jet fighters are used as multirole fighters even if they were not intended for that role. The only things that an F-15 does better than the F-35 is that it can carry more bombs and is cheaper.
@@Dischingo "and is cheaper." In 2020 the Air Force stated that in the FY 2021 budget flyaway cost of an F-15EX was $87.7 million and flyaway cost of a Lot 14 F-35A was $77.9 million. However, for the first lot of 8 F-15EX aircraft purchased in FY 2020 the flyaway cost was $150 million each.
The old F-15 C/D's are wearing out fast and need to be replaced. The development costs for the F-15EX was paid for was paid for by Qatar or one of the gulf countries.
Another thing to consider is that an all-stealth fleet is an expensive venture. The F-35 is a class of its own right and cannot fill in the roles of the aircraft it intends to replace (i.e. F-16, A-10, and F/A-18 E/F).
False narrative. F-35C is designed to replace F/A-18C. F-35B is designed to replace Harrier 2. F-35A is designed to replace F-16C Block 50/52. Not all missions require stealth e.g. low-risk missions. A-10 has its own replacement program.
Something that is not mentioned is interception. You don’t necessarily need stealth to take down bombers. You need to find the bombers and get there fast. The F-15s top speed is more important than stealth in this regard.
If you don't need to ingress to an area without being detected, then you may as well take the most payload possible, and that's why the F-15EX is being procurred. You wouldn't use your supercar to do grocery shopping, you'd use your SUV. But when you want to go fast, you take the Ferrari. Different jobs, different aircraft.
"that's why the F-15EX is being procurred." The F-15EX is being procured to replace aging F-15Cs the majority of which serve in ANG units as homeland defense alert fighters - air to air - not as strike fighters - air to ground.
To answer your question in the title, because the F-35 while cheaper then the 22 is still super expensive. The EX is essentially a cheap AMRAAM bus, to be guards for the stealther Aircraft. Also the 35 is still capable, the main downsides are its costs. In the end JSF, instead of fixing ATFs issues had the same problems instead.
The latest F-15EX variant is a bomb and missile truck with supercomputer and AESA radar onboard. Also, it can fly faster than Mach 2.2, furthermore it is cheaper to produce and maintain than F-35A(But bear in mind, in slow speed turn fight F-35A has the advantage).
Because we have 1000+ F-35’s and upgraded them. Our adversaries can be addressed by the F-15EX. The J-20 and SU-57 are not stealthy as advertised and F-15EX is more than enough to address these threats.
Short answer: The service life of current F-15s is rapidly reaching its end, so since there are Boeing factory lines already open for foriegn customers, we figured we'd buy some of them without having to wait long.
@@JSFGuy Which are illegal and if caught with one the fine is substantially higher than the fine for speeding and may result in being charged with a felony.
This is a misleading title they are buying both. They haven't stopped buying F35 and they continue to buy more. the F 35 right now is the 2nd most numerous combat aircraft in the us air forces inventory.
I dont have much knowledge on the matter but I support this descision. Even though the f15ex is more expensive ($110 million compared to the f35s $78 million) it does have cheaper maintenance cost and loosing it wont be as bad as loosing an f35 because loosing the latter will leak things like radar coating and so-and-so.
As someone who paints eagles for a living, I'm glad they are pursuing the dump truck instead of the 35 with how much potential it has and just how battle ready the thing can truly be. The 35 was made to take the place of the 22, 15, and 16 all at once while being a stealth aircraft which is obviously impossible to do all that with a air craft that small while the 15 literally couldn't give a shit less while being a air to ground priority bomber but a true multirole beast. Always hated 35s too so that also influences my choice😂
The F-15EX is a Balls-out dogfighter. The United States learned the hard way, during Vietnam, to never become too overly dependent on technology. During Vietnam, the Navy and Marine Corps went with F-4 Phantom and removed the canons/guns from these fighters in favor of missile technology. This stupid design proved fatal for Navy and Marine fighter pilots. In later variants of the F-4 Phantom, they included canons/guns!
@@DaveSCameron Both the F-35 and F-22 are superior multi-role air dominance fighters. They're the most advanced fighter aircraft in the world, but the United States will never abandon a pure air-to-air dogfighter like the F-15EX or a gunship like the A-10. That is the lesson from Vietnam.
@@BENKYism I don't know? The only fighters that are being ordered by the Air Force, Marine Corps, and Navy are the F-35, F-22, the F-15EX, and supposedly the next generation of the A-10. The only fighter jet in that lineup, that's a pure dog fighter, is the F-15.
In a full on war (China Strikes Taiwan) the alpha strike will be about 20 minutes. Those 20 minutes will determine who controls the skies. You need brute air superiority. F-15 is a pure muscular air superiority fighter. It is the core of your Airforce. The f-35 and f-22 provide support and overwatch, the f-15 does the heavy lifting
Could it also be that F35 advances to pickup targets and sends them via datalink to F15, which then shoots them down with their 20+ long range missiles?
Love the F-15. Had posters of F-15e on my walls in the 90s. It can break the sound barrier going straight up! Its advanced radar can detect enemy planes fire first. Eagle eyes. F-35 is a different kind of sexy. Stealth is not invisible. to detect one just needs to get closer. much closer. F-35s radar detects enemy radars and flies out of range. Even if F-15 EX gets upgraded equivalent radar. Very different tactics. How many Ninja does it take to ____? One, 10, 100, noone knows F-35 share radar info with each other. If one sees an enemy’s radar, all see. They will never go into battle alone. Furthest one from a target can fire. Close one does not need to give away its position. Finally: NO US military personnel wanted F-15EX. does not fit new ninja tactics. F-35s will always detect an F-15EXs first. (When new F-15 was king of detecting first) Less F-35 are needed. Cost even if double (which it’s not) still more bang for buck. F-15EX purchase forced on military by senators to secure Jobs in their state. Yes, Jobs are good. Hopefully Boeing can deliver like they used to do.
Even though the F-35 uses ninja tactics, the Air Force was concerned how they would perform against the Chinese Air Force in a massive air war over the SCS where Chinese J-20, J-31s,J-10s, and J-11s, and J-16s would have a missile advantage over an all F-35 force. The F-15EX is to be a missile truck that could be assigned targets outside Chinese detection range by the F-35 flying inside denied areas. The F-35 can save its stealth abilities by staying out of air to air missions as much as possible and saving itself for going after air defenses and command and control centers on the Chinese mainland as well as ships at sea. The EX can do the grunt work of protecting AWACs and tankers out over the Pacific while also engaging Chinese missile carrying bombers coming out to attack the US Navy.
saying F-15EX entirely procured just because bunch of senators would be a flawed argument. F-35 procurement was already expensive after the cost overruns during the development, and 5th gen fighters require extensive maintenance and coating which costs more man-hour and money. F-15EX was procured to replace the aging fleet of F-15C, and to replace several ANG fleet too. And ANG has huge amount of fighter squadrons, and replacing entire fighter fleet into F-35 is impossible for the ever-shrinking Air Force FY budget
F15EX is to be a weapons platform. It's all integrated. F35s cant carry much firepower if it wants to remain stealthy. Thats where f15ex comes in. F35 acquires the target because it can go nearer an enemy without getting detected, and the f15ex fires at it from a long range distance.
This is kind of similar to how F4s from the Vietnam era are faster than modern warplanes, sustained high speed was better for combat purposes rather than small bursts of high speed with afterburners, especially when fuel burn and stress on the airframe is factored in as well. The F-15 is also a well proven airframe that has performed very well in combat. That being said, these two aircraft are not really in the same category and should not be compared directly, they have different roles. The US might have filled all of its available slots for the F-35 and money is being spent on the next generation of fighter aircraft taking into consideration data from the F-35 and F-22 aircraft. Similar to the Zumwalt class of destroyers, the entire line was cancelled. All the money that was spent on the F-35 went somewhere and given the past history of the US government, to say that it was all spent on acquiring just a few hundred new jets is laughable. I would theorize that the Skunkworks is very busy these days doing something. What that is I have no idea, but I would not be surprised if we see new airframes and a new program be revealed to the public by 2025.
I think the Air Force also decided to suspend its buy rate for F-35s pending another software upgrade which is supposed to happen in a few years.The reason being its cheaper to just buy the planes with the capability over buying them without it,only to take them back out of service to be updated. The Air Force had money it wasn't using and a pressing need to replace the F-15C which needs to be phased out by the end of the decade. the Air Force can buy the 144 EXs needed to replace the F-15C over the next 3 years (with options to buy up to 250 to replace the F-15E) then shift back to buying F-35s (and the 6th generation replacement for the F-22) when the new software is ready.
Why didn't canada buy 42 of these and then buy 42 F35 instead of going all in on the 35's? Sounds to me like the 35 is great on paper but sometimes when you do too many things you don't do a few well enough.
because the F-35 gives them more options. The F-35 was built as a multirole righter. The F-15 is an air superiority fighter. The F-35 also comes with more advantages. It has better sensors, stealth, supercruise without afterburners, can be equipped for many different missions, more future proof. The F-15EX is a good update to the platform but still cant compete with the F-35. Also, as more and more f-35s come into service around the world, the price and maintenance cost for them will continue to go down.
Die f22 ist wie die F15 ein Luftüberlegenheitsjäger! Die f35 ist ein Mehrzweck Kampfflugzeug. In Deutschland haben wir als Luftüberlegenheitsjäger den Eurofighter. Die f35 daher eine sinnvolle Ergänzung. Auch wenn sie im dogfight anderen Modellen unterlegen ist, hat sie einige überragende Eigenschaften. Denke in den USA hat man einfach den Bedarf an Langstrecken Anfangjäger und dafür ist die f22 und f15ex besser geeinigt.
It boils down to cost but not because they are cutting corners. Id imagine they see the stealth advantages offered by an F-35 as not worth the cost. Stealth effectiveness in the future will probably have more to do with other factors and it's probably not prudent to over invest yourself in a technology that might be outdated in 10 years and probably will be in 25. More planes is probably the preference and the updated f-15 is probably considered just as capable by those who know. I'd also bet anything that both the defense contractors and the defense department want to distance themselves from the decade long debacle that has been the roll out of the 35. When things go to shit people have a tendency to gravitate back to when things were going well, as opposed to pushing forward and risk another debacle
The Pentagon already has announced that they have no interest in unmanned aircraft. The only thing they are willing to have unmanned are drones. There are many factors for this.
These are 2 different planes that do different things. The F35 is the quarterback and the F15 ex is a new stud running back running old plays that have been proven to work even today now that the running back has Ben upgraded with the newest technology he can run the ball or go out and catch a pass and takeoff downfield
America Is Purchasing Both Platforms! Their Rolls Are For 2 Completely Different Theaters! F-35 For Highly Defended Theater's And The F-15EX Is For Conventional Theaters! The F-15EX Will Also Be Used In Heavily Defended Theater's To Deliver Long Range Munitions With Standoff Capabilities! ✌️
F15 and f35 serve different roles, F15ex is fully capable of home land air defense and is cabable as a bomb truck, EX has full data link ability which will complement the f35 and f22, we desperately need more f15s for home defense especially in Alaska
Ive always wondered about stealth fighters and the significant additional cost for the stealth capability in development, production and maintenance. If a reliable detection method would be developed or might already exist then with wide spread deployment all the money for the stealth was for nothing.
Stealth isn't a hard black or white though. You're not either 'stealth' or 'not stealth'. There absolutely will be advancements in radar in the future that will make F-35 and F-22 visible on radars, because it's not a matter of being invisible, it's a matter of being hard to detect through all the clutter. Could you see a single needle in a haystack? No, but if you get a very strong metal detector, you'll likely find it. Eventually the RCS of the current stealth jets will become detectable, but then further stealth advancements will be made too, putting them in the same relative position that the F-35 and F-22 are in at the moment.
@@bennperkins4006 also just because you spot the 22 and 35 on more advanced radar doesn't mean you can hit it with current missile technology. its gonna take a lot to integrate that all into a working package.
Stealth is about reducing the distance you can be seen from. An F22 or F35 is going to be able to close to lethal range with most aircraft before it is detectable on radar, and an F35 will be able to use its DAS to detect aircraft from even further away, in all directions. An F15 is going to be a massive, easily located target for advanced aircraft. That doesn’t make it useless, but it’s about matching your enemy - if you have air dominance you could fly whatever bomb truck you like over - and that’s what the F-15EX is good for, and limited air to air against older aircraft.
f15ex costs more than a f35 to buy. and 2 engines vs 1 the f35 will eventually be cheaper to sustain. and the f35 can run external hardpoints doing the job of the f15ex, and keep in mind the f15 ex is based on the f15e- the multi-role ground attack version not the air superiority fighter version. they do the same thing but Boeing has better salespeople, selling the older plane for more money. there are probably lots of bonuses going around at Boeing hq right now as they laugh all the way to the bank. there probably just preparing for the retirement of the a10, b1, and b2 and they need something that can move weight like those in case the b21 doesn't live up to the promises. even though the f35 can already carry more weight than the a10 on the external hardpoints.
Neither russia or china have huge fleets of stealth aircraft, the NATO or the US in general still has a big leap in this field. But, 1 f35 can quite easily loose if there are several less capable 3rd or 4th generation jets opposing him. The F-15EX still can contest against latest russian or chinese developments, but they can also dominate in numbers the backbons of those airforces which is made up by 2+ and 3rd gen fighter aircraft.
Should have outsourced manufacturing to as many countries as possible and made large batch orders. Strongarm the European states into focusing on the f35. Drive the f35 price to as low as possible.
The F-35 was created to "quaterback" different weapons platforms. While the F-22 will watch it's back, the F-15EX will complement any strike package with the ability to carry 30,000 pounds of ordinance. (4) F-35s accompanied by (4) F-15EX, (carrying 12+ anti-air missiles/each), and (4) F-22s are an excellent force multiplier. The Eagle IIs can be used in support of the F-35s and they can also defend themselves and dogfight if necessary maintaining the F-35s out of the picture and with the F-22s on "overwatch" just in case. With the new upgrades the Eagles can share all the necessary info with the Raptors, Lighting II and even the latest F-16V Vipers. "Teamwork" is the key for any tipe of conflict, battle or war. Let's hope that WE never have to use this combinations.
Great annalise of the big picture ,thanks a bunch for all the terrific information, makes better since now.
And which one of these will replace the A-10 in the Air-to-Ground (aka Air to Mud) Mission that the USAF has detested since day one? And the USAF has been spending years to remove from the inventory. Hot flash for the USAF. Airplanes do not hold ground. Yes they are a very important asset in the overall picture but unless you have boots on the gournd holding ground you do not have anything. So perhaps someday the USAF will realize the grunt on the ground is also a very important asset worth protecting.
Also the F-15 is a game
You write like a Colonel not a Seargent.
in fact the f-35 failed to accomplish its goal, too costly, cant fly during storms cause it can't take lightining, the f-15 is a better plane bang per buck overall, also stealth might be irrelevant with newer detections systems, like using radars with different waves or using heat detection instead, the f-15 is a top of the line airplane, basically the f-35 project i believe was too complex it involved too many people in its development, and unlike previous generations, newer generations are much less keen on education, the lack of overall leaderships/skillsets/education led to its downfall, and the enormous budget employing too many people just made it worse, the f-15 was basically made by people who knew what they were doing to put it short, they didnt build a plane to them later sort it out. by the way one f-15 lost its wing and the pilot didnt even notice it at the moment, he was able to fly back and land it safely, good luck doing that with any other plane.
They don't prefer the F15EX, they just can't afford an all stealth fleet. It's not just the sticker price, the operating costs and availability rates are important too. And you don't need an all stealth fleet, so it is an acceptable compromise.
And the EX is not 4th gen, it's 4+ or 4,5 how ever you want to call it. It is a lot more advanced than the legacy F 15s. It's in the same category as the Eurofighter Typhoon or the french Rafale.
Well, people realized, that combat aircraft has to be....welll..... also ARMED.
No, because stealth is obsolete.. Well, physical stealth anyway.. You have to spend many billions of dollar into an airframe, and then the enemy counters it, and it's useless. It's better to have a decent airframe that can carry weapons etc. And then you add electronic warfare suites, datalinks etc to it.. It's WAAY cheaper to upgrade that, and quicker too.
Say you make a stealth plane today.. It's not invisible(!) to radar, just harder to detect.. Problem is technology is really advancing fast today.. So invisible today means in ten years so are a big blob on the latest radars.. But if you use electronics to defeat enemy radars, you can upgrade that bit with a new ew pod every 2 years... WAAY cheaper...
@@MrZnarffy F-35 has BAE's Eurofighter Gen 4.5 era digital jammer, RCS towed drone, and passive stealth (shape and materials). F-35 can target enemy missiles as an Aegis ABM compatible platform.
F-15EX's recent wargames have mixed results. F-15EX is based on Saudi's F-15SA and they are targets for SAMs.
JAS 39 Gripen has no stealth, still done extremely well as red force planes in Red Flag, the only match they had was F22s and F35s.. And Gripen is NOT stealth.. But if you have good EW, stealth don't help as you gotta get close and lose your advantage..
And as I said.. Stealth today is not stealth tomorrow.. So WHY on earth spend 100 million ++ on airframes thats gonna get shot down or replaced in 5 years??
US was first with stealth, why do you think they are discontinuing F22s and replacing them with F15s? Wake up dude...
@@MrZnarffy
They are not replacing the Raptor with the F-15EX.They Raptor is to be replaced by the NGAD (Next Generation Air Dominance) fighter
which has apparently already flown in prototype form. The NGAD will be a stealthy sixth generation fighter that will have its stealth properties based on the F-35 which is said to be much more durable and easier to maintain then the F-22.
If Stealth was truely on the way out,why would the US,the country who was first with stealth, be on the verge of rolling out the B-21
with 150 + plane order in the next three years?
The EX is set to replace the F-15C (and likely the F-15E down the road) because the F-15C airframes are way passed their projected
service life (most are mid to late 80s vintage) and need to be phased out by the end of this decade.
The Air Force originally wanted to replace the F-15C with F-16s but the EX provides more capability and that was already paid for by
the Saudis and South Koreans ordering more advanced Eagles which kept the assemblylines open and funded 4+ generation upgrades.
The EX is not only cheaper to operate and has greater endurance then the F-35. It can be fielded using existing Eagle supply chains and
training facilities. Eagle pilots can change over to the EX after a week of training vs months changing over to the F-35.
It doesn't hurt that the EX has the Eagles long range performance which will be a big help over the SCS.
I love seeing fighters that I grew up being fascinated with still being relivent as well as formidable.
Me too, but up to a point. When people start talking about Super-duper Phantoms or resurrected Arrows I gotta leave the room to avoid laughing.
@@skaldlouiscyphre2453 It would be so cool to see super-duper F-4 Phantoms as I just love how they look but being real, that's just a very bad idea.
In my uneducated opinion, the 🇺🇸 made the right decision, the F-15 has always been a phenomenal machine! How many adversaries would require rediculisously expensive stealth aircraft when the F-15 can already deal with almost everything? Cheeper too!
The operating cost of 5th gen fighters are more as compared to 4th gen fighter. While operating in aircraft carrier 5th generation fighter are good for specialised mission, as my opinion.
@@rryzzzi2026 The U.K. will use the F-35 for deep strike missions. The Typhoon will do everything else.
Because it's for the wars of tomorrow. It has been almost 100 years since we've fought a near peer adversary. If and when the time comes, we'll be glad we have a stealth fleet.
@@Apophis-en9pi US war doctrine states involves getting air supremacy asap. Thats where the steal fleet comes in. After achieving air supremacy, it is cheaper to use 4th gens than 5th gens.
They are not gonna use the 4th gens to fight other air superiority planes. Theyre going to use it as a weapons platform to target tanks and ground targets.
@@apeinto5637 100% Correct. A relatively new development however are extremely mobile and effective SAM's. So Air Superiority Fighter vs Air Superiority Fighter is only part of the consideration. Even with no adversaries in the air, the threat from the ground has never been greater. This is why stealth is still extremely important.
Once the enemy air defense is taken out by F35’s and cruise missiles the F15EX can take out many more targets with it’s large payload of weapons in the same air strike.
The F-15, with its superior overall maneuverability & payload is also better at SEAD & DEAD missions. Being a visible threat that must be neutralized unless whatever it's going for unmolested is worth losing. Which, if it's a major power plant or electrical junction station supporting stationary RADAR assets, supply convoys, &/or armor columns, is a difficult choice to make.
Sacrifice your mobile AA now, & maybe save those other assets, or sacrifice those assets to preserve your mobile AA for later.
The F-15 is respected worldwide by friend and foe alike. It is a perfect aircraft for installing upgrade equipment into instead of starting from scratch with a completely new design. The same approach applies to upgrading the A-10 Thunderbolt(Warthog),it is a supreme ground attack,ground support aircraft and would be nearly impossible to replace. Both decisions were wise.
They are too many compromise in the F 35 the ex is out dated we meed a new jet
The odds we could become involved in a ground war are growing exponentially, by about 6-7. Now is not the time to play nice. I say we figure out a way for the Russians to stop and retreat from Ukraine, but maybe give their money back as an incentive? Lots of countries have Russian money invested. Germany is the biggest, maybe. Then USA second (I guess) Money is a good motivator, then again, so is pride.
The f22 being cancelled halfway through its production run is still being felt, terrible decision.
At 225 million per jet and nothing in the air that can even compare to it I think 130 of them is plenty. Just like computers and cell phones military technology is expensive and is outdated quickly. The US alone has around 900 f22s and f35s combined. That's 900 5th gen fighters. China has around 50 5th gen fighters and Russia has 12.
@@DIYAllied Actually, I never understood why advance in computer and cellphone technology made them more affordable, while advance in military technology makes everything more expensive. Will our grandchildren fight with a single fighter jet per country?
it was just a bad timing, the airforce was geared for a war on terror where a hightech stealth fighter was pretty much useless so it got cut short of its true potential numbers
The F-15ex is making up for the fact the F22 didn't replace the F15. Also the F35 can't be made fast enough and has a high service cost.
The F-15 has a higher service cost than the F-35
@@albar428 just quoting this here but
"The F-15EX costs $87.7 million per aircraft, and can fly for up to 20,000 hours at a cost of $29,000 per hour. So $29,000 per hour x 20,000 hours + $87.7 million for the aircraft comes out to a pretty serious $667.7 million dollars.
In order to match that operational lifespan, it would take three F-35As. So the math would look like $44,000 per hour x 20,000 hours + $233.7 million for three F-35s… and it comes out to more than a jaw dropping $1.1 billion. The F-15EX, then, offers a saving of around $446 million per aircraft over the lifespan of the jet (if things were this simple, anyway)."
@@lolzyking656 20,000 hours. LOL
@@lolzyking656 From 19-F-1098_DOC_33_F-35_SAR_Dec_201 pdf
F-35A’s Maintenance and Sustaining Support cost per hour is $14,043 USD.
$30,000 value includes system improvements, unit manpower, and unit operations. US has a significant pre-Block 3F F-35 fleet, hence expensive retrofits.
@@Skyhawks1979 yeah its 2 years of 24/7 use, 10 years of about 5 and half flights hours average daily, or about 20 years of service at an average of 2 and half hours of flight time average per day. most planes aren't assigned to a single pilot and are assigned to a squadron, so you could possibly see in an active warzone the aircraft being refueled, rearmed, and the pilot swapped out with a fresh pilot for a new mission within hours of the aircraft landing depending on operational needs....
its not that outlandish when you consider how various older fighter have had their service life extended.
I personally think the correct decision is to have both f35's and upgraded f15's.
There is something to be said for keeping the production line of an air superiority fighter open. Since the F-22 production line is gone, the F-15 production line is important.
It makes sense to use the F15 EX to make up the bulk of the next generation fighter fleet rather than the super expensive and high maintenance F35. The F35 is a great platform for consideration as a naval strike craft and stealth strikes deep within enemy territory. When you consider that the main roles of a fighter are air superiority and close air support (roles the cheaper and more easily maintained F15 EX and A-10 Warthog are perfectly capable of between them) keeping a smaller dedicated force of F35's for stealth attacks, deep strikes and on carriers is far better than trying to manage the huge cost and maintenance overruns a large fleet of F35's would entail.
a high performance missiles truck with range, speed, etc is perhaps a needed component in an air war with an adversary that has equal or superior numbers and comparable technologies
Another major factor is shown this day.
The cost of hyper-modern planes makes it necessary to reduce the numbers. The world is showing us today, that numbers are still VERY important. In a world where military presence is and has been for the last 10-12 years, a major war deterrent. We, as in all major western countries have neglected our duties of protection, to ourselves and our allies.
Germany for example has highly motivated and highly trained forces for counter-terrorism and small scale conflict. But lacks any real defence and support power. We Germans simply do not have the numbers needed neither personal nor in equipment.
Hopefully, the politics will react and take citizens into defence service in the very short term and in the long term build up a reasonable amount of armed forces.
Generally, while I think a small force of 5th gen. fighters is needed for a modern military I do think the major portion of a modern airforce should be modern 4th or 4.5 gen. airframes. The hyper-modern planes are filling a narrow role but the backbone combat should be modern fighters.
As WW2 illustrated. The Tiger II was the most formidable tank ever fielded during WW2. But it still lost to a sea of T34s and Shermans.
Hopefully all our politicians will get their acts together and take a measured approach to defense. After the collapse of the Soviet Union too many western nations including mine, US, had neglected defense and became hyper focused on social programs too the detriment of us all. I hope we truly learn from our mistakes going forward.
In Europe, right now nobody has enough numbers of military human nor equipment resources. This has to change very quickly otherwise we'll be crushed by the russians. More equipment, military service for everyone, more military industry and reasearch, more EU cooperation and less or even 0 gas imports from russia.
We need more 4.5 fighters well capable for air-air and air-ground attacks and nuclear capacity.
There are a lot of strategies and tactics this opens up, in addition to having logistics advantages.
The F-15ex can fly three times as many miles and is much cheaper to maintain. It is an amazing missle carrier that can manauver in a dog fight, and it also can keep up with the f35 easily.
That being said, consider just one of the tactics as an example. The f35 is capable of using electronic warfare and decoy deployment to simulate f15 radar signatures. A single f35 can simulate up to a dozen f15s on enemy radar if they specialize in it and are willing to give up other payload. With just 2 f15exs and 2 f35s, they can appear to be nearly 30 fighter aircraft, make an enemy aircraft group waste most of their missles, and carry enough missles themselves to seriously impact that group.
Imagine being in an arial engagement and 2 dozen f15s pop up on radar, you fire on them, they disappear then reappear elsewhere, then missles start coming in at you.
When something is too Advanced and Powerful there's always one thing that holds back
Money$$$$
The F-15 aircraft is designed to “keep flying” after taking two hits anywhere in the hydraulic system. This capability was accomplished by using unique features developed by MACAIR such as Return Level Sensing (RLS) that provides 2 hydraulic circuits per system, Switching Valves and Return Press Sensing (RPS). 3 systems are supplied by 4 identical engine driven pumps, 2 on each engine.
The F-18 aircraft uses this same technology except it uses 2 identical engine driven pumps, 1 on each engine.
The F-15EX is quite obviously inspired by countries like Singapore and later Saudi and Qatar, with their orders of highly customized F-15SG/SA/QA.
Singapore started the ball rolling with an extensive list of customized upgrades including integration with local technologies, that stretched the mission profiles considerably and reimagined their use - in mixed missions with F-35 and F-16.
Nope. SOUTH KOREA STARTED IT WITH THE SLAM EAGLES
Any modern air force probably needs a variety of aircraft to best support all of its missions. I've never believed that one plane like the F-35 can "do it all" as well as a proper mix of different platforms can. Still like to see upgraded versions of the A-10 (who really believes that the F-35 will ever be able to do its close ground support job as well as it does?), F-22, F-23, and F-15EX in the air, so we haven't put all our eggs in one basket that could be upset if new enemy weapon systems figure out how to easily take down F-35's. Some reasonable diversity is strength!
The F-15s are the best fighter jets ever produced
The F-15 C/D are at the end of their life cycle. The F-15EX is to replace those F-15s in service.
Reality is other countries haven't really provided a compelling competition re: legit 5th-gen aircraft. Both Su-57 (FA-50) & J-20 are 10-15 years behind the US in first flights, entering into service, & sheer numbers of aircraft. Or the experience gained having operated them all that time. And under combat conditions. The US has 179 F-22s & 709 F-35s. Russia has 3 Su-57s. China supposedly has 150 J-20s. They had Russian engines. Then Chinese. But the Chinese engines were too unpowered, so back to Russian. 6 months ago, apparently trying the homebrew again.
US tech has already had a couple decades to sort these things out. And 6th-gen is already here. Integrating the next big thing w/ UCAVs as "wingmen". VSTOL for Carrier operations. All kinds of new bells & whistles. Doesn't make alot of sense to pour money into extra 5th-gen when we know we want resources freed up to stay ahead.
Combined with the fact that by now the F-35 project is mind-bogglingly over-budget and still lacks several core advertised features. Basically a TON of money for a product that has never lived up to it's own hype when the existing airframes are more than capable with minimal modernization and upgrade at a tiny fraction of the cost.
An F-15E costs $11.7M/year to operate and maintain. EX is probably even more expensive!
An F-35 costs $13.4M/year averaged between the variants and I'll bet the B variant is eating up a ton of that! That's really not a meaningful difference.
An F-16 costs $5.7M to operate and maintain. That means you could operate 2 F-16s for the price of one F-15E with a third of a million dollars in spare change.
Yet the airforce is buying F-15EX. This shows how little operating and maintainance costs matter. Certainly the 15% difference between F-15E and F-35 isn't gonna make them suddenly decide to be reformers when a 105% difference between the F-16 and F-15E is considered a non-issue.
You need a better reason why they're picking the F-15EX than a miniscule difference in operating costs.
Perhaps a former Boeing high level executive now working on the government convinced the congress to buy it, without any request from USAF which wants as much F35 as possible.
It is not cool to go into combat with a single engine fighter
The F-15EX is frankly better for the homeland defense role than the F-35
@@rowanscott915
How about no
@@rowanscott915 you sound like an experienced military intelligence analyst. Tell us of your qualifications and experience. 🤡
Makes sense.
It's not. It's a really good aircraft, but expensive. F-16s are best for homeland defense.
The F-15 is a proven and capable platform that can easily go toe to toe with any of its Russian or Chinese counterparts. The F-15EX is a logical choice to compliment the F-35.
Talking about past accomplishments of 30 years ago is not particularly relevant in 2022 or 2030. We are buying for the next 40 years here.
We need more F-15EXs with longer-range air-to-air missiles in the 200-300 mile range and air-to-ground standoff weapons for striking with 1,000+ mile ranges to keep our aircraft out of the threat zone. Also, Rapid Dragon using cargo planes as floating armories to drop pallets of missiles out of the back and have them launch from the pallet is a beautiful and well-tested program that works very well for striking ground targets.
The US also doesn't want to put all its eggs in one basket. The F-16 is manufactured by General Dynamics which was acquired by Lockheed. The F-22 was and the F-35 is manufactured by Lockheed. The F-15 is the only active fighter jet built by another company (General Dynamics / Boeing).
This video missed the main point, the F-35 production line is at capacity.
So it was either open a new line at great expense of money and time.
OR give the contract to replace the now retiring f-15 C and D fleets to another facility already set up and ready to go on the F-15EX.
Maybe the reason is the F-15EX, an F-15E Strike Eagle Variant can reach the speed of Mach 2.5+ and has plenty of Hardpoints despite lacks Stealth Characteristics unlike F-35, though F-35 will also have a Hardpoints in "Beast Mode" configuration while sacrificing Stealth for Firepower, from Air or Ground Missions.
If you put more hardpoints on the F-35 = More weight = less acceleration.
The thing is an F-15 top speed can only be achieved in a clean configuration whereas the F-35 can handle more weapons and sensors internally and thus can sustain top speeds with less drag. Besides the whole speed thing is a red herring. It is true on a dedicated interceptor it is useful. But most jet fighters are used as multirole fighters even if they were not intended for that role. The only things that an F-15 does better than the F-35 is that it can carry more bombs and is cheaper.
Also, will the F-15EX, along with other Aircraft like F-16, F-15E and A-10C can carry AGM-179 JAGM since F-35?
@@Dischingo "and is cheaper."
In 2020 the Air Force stated that in the FY 2021 budget flyaway cost of an F-15EX was $87.7 million and flyaway cost of a Lot 14 F-35A was $77.9 million. However, for the first lot of 8 F-15EX aircraft purchased in FY 2020 the flyaway cost was $150 million each.
The old F-15 C/D's are wearing out fast and need to be replaced. The development costs for the F-15EX was paid for was paid for by Qatar or one of the gulf countries.
Both F-15SA and F-15QA are based on F-15 Advance.
they work in tandem. great call.
Another thing to consider is that an all-stealth fleet is an expensive venture. The F-35 is a class of its own right and cannot fill in the roles of the aircraft it intends to replace (i.e. F-16, A-10, and F/A-18 E/F).
False narrative.
F-35C is designed to replace F/A-18C.
F-35B is designed to replace Harrier 2.
F-35A is designed to replace F-16C Block 50/52. Not all missions require stealth e.g. low-risk missions.
A-10 has its own replacement program.
@@valenrn8657 thank you for the info!
Number 1 reason; we don’t like to pay taxes. Cost is almost everything.
F-15: over 40 years old and still king of the skies
Rafale F4 + F-15EX(ID) for Indonesia would be great!
Something that is not mentioned is interception. You don’t necessarily need stealth to take down bombers. You need to find the bombers and get there fast. The F-15s top speed is more important than stealth in this regard.
If you don't need to ingress to an area without being detected, then you may as well take the most payload possible, and that's why the F-15EX is being procurred. You wouldn't use your supercar to do grocery shopping, you'd use your SUV. But when you want to go fast, you take the Ferrari. Different jobs, different aircraft.
"that's why the F-15EX is being procurred."
The F-15EX is being procured to replace aging F-15Cs the majority of which serve in ANG units as homeland defense alert fighters - air to air - not as strike fighters - air to ground.
To answer your question in the title, because the F-35 while cheaper then the 22 is still super expensive. The EX is essentially a cheap AMRAAM bus, to be guards for the stealther Aircraft.
Also the 35 is still capable, the main downsides are its costs. In the end JSF, instead of fixing ATFs issues had the same problems instead.
that guy on 1:42 got me laughing I must admit
The latest F-15EX variant is a bomb and missile truck with supercomputer and AESA radar onboard. Also, it can fly faster than Mach 2.2, furthermore it is cheaper to produce and maintain than F-35A(But bear in mind, in slow speed turn fight F-35A has the advantage).
Because we have 1000+ F-35’s and upgraded them. Our adversaries can be addressed by the F-15EX. The J-20 and SU-57 are not stealthy as advertised and F-15EX is more than enough to address these threats.
Short answer: The service life of current F-15s is rapidly reaching its end, so since there are Boeing factory lines already open for foriegn customers, we figured we'd buy some of them without having to wait long.
I need to get some of the stealth wax those guys are applying to the F35. I like to speed on the highway and that should defeat the Trooper's radar.
You may know this, they do have decoy jammers that you can install that immediately mimic and send back legal speed limit signals to law enforcement.
@@JSFGuy no, I did not know that. Thanks.
@@JSFGuy Which are illegal and if caught with one the fine is substantially higher than the fine for speeding and may result in being charged with a felony.
I love F-15. Such an awesome and iconic aircraft. Most of me pilot kills in Battlefield 2 were from F-15 :D - thousands!
Respect for bf2
The 144 F-15EXs are slated to replace long in the tooth, mostly ANG, F-15Cs.
The F-15EX is a weapons truck it's meant to go in after the route is cleared by the F-22 and F-35.
This is a misleading title they are buying both. They haven't stopped buying F35 and they continue to buy more. the F 35 right now is the 2nd most numerous combat aircraft in the us air forces inventory.
I dont have much knowledge on the matter but I support this descision. Even though the f15ex is more expensive ($110 million compared to the f35s $78 million) it does have cheaper maintenance cost and loosing it wont be as bad as loosing an f35 because loosing the latter will leak things like radar coating and so-and-so.
Should've spent that money on f22s instead of f15
SAVING MONEY IS THE MAIN REASON!!! The US is decreasing in power! It's not the 90's anymore, folks!
As someone who paints eagles for a living, I'm glad they are pursuing the dump truck instead of the 35 with how much potential it has and just how battle ready the thing can truly be. The 35 was made to take the place of the 22, 15, and 16 all at once while being a stealth aircraft which is obviously impossible to do all that with a air craft that small while the 15 literally couldn't give a shit less while being a air to ground priority bomber but a true multirole beast. Always hated 35s too so that also influences my choice😂
Curious, is the simple answer: having more aircraft in the skies is better?
Each have their own abilities that combined can take out opponents.
F15 is more than enough to eliminate Russia & CCP !! Greatest USAF ❤️🗽🗽🗽❤️
God bless Ukraine 🇺🇦 🙏🙏🙏
AARGM-ER is a game changing missile, what’s the point in stealth if you can destroy the enemies radar effectively.
Stealth aircraft can be used to safely destroy those radars with little risk of detection
>it can be said..
By whom, specifically?
It doesn't matter if an aircraft is any good or not,
It's the Gen Number that counts.
The F-15EX is a Balls-out dogfighter. The United States learned the hard way, during Vietnam, to never become too overly dependent on technology. During Vietnam, the Navy and Marine Corps went with F-4 Phantom and removed the canons/guns from these fighters in favor of missile technology. This stupid design proved fatal for Navy and Marine fighter pilots. In later variants of the F-4 Phantom, they included canons/guns!
Not worth a carrott alongside a Hawker Harrier Jump Jet. ☢️🚫🇳🇿🇰🇾🇭🇲🇨🇦🇦🇺
@@DaveSCameron Both the F-35 and F-22 are superior multi-role air dominance fighters. They're the most advanced fighter aircraft in the world, but the United States will never abandon a pure air-to-air dogfighter like the F-15EX or a gunship like the A-10. That is the lesson from Vietnam.
For F-15 &A-10
The original F-15 was a dogfighter but the EX isn't. The EX will mainly serve as a BVR missile boat with 5th gen sensors.
@@BENKYism I don't know? The only fighters that are being ordered by the Air Force, Marine Corps, and Navy are the F-35, F-22, the F-15EX, and supposedly the next generation of the A-10.
The only fighter jet in that lineup, that's a pure dog fighter, is the F-15.
In a full on war (China Strikes Taiwan) the alpha strike will be about 20 minutes.
Those 20 minutes will determine who controls the skies. You need brute air superiority. F-15 is a pure muscular air superiority fighter. It is the core of your Airforce. The f-35 and f-22 provide support and overwatch, the f-15 does the heavy lifting
Different tech for different missions, the f35 can strike radar and Sam systems while the F15EX will target the main targets
Could it also be that F35 advances to pickup targets and sends them via datalink to F15, which then shoots them down with their 20+ long range missiles?
F-15 Eagle 104 kills 0 losses in air to air combat! That's why it's called the greatest air superiority fighter in the world! End of story!
Seriously.. they had funds to get 100 new F-15’s and not cutting the F-35 ..
Whoever writes your scripts needs to let the VA speak fluidly and use words that make better sense!
Love the F-15. Had posters of F-15e on my walls in the 90s.
It can break the sound barrier going straight up! Its advanced radar can detect enemy planes fire first.
Eagle eyes.
F-35 is a different kind of sexy.
Stealth is not invisible.
to detect one just needs to get closer. much closer.
F-35s radar detects enemy radars and flies out of range.
Even if F-15 EX gets upgraded equivalent radar.
Very different tactics.
How many Ninja does it take to ____?
One, 10, 100, noone knows
F-35 share radar info with each other. If one sees an enemy’s radar, all see. They will never go into battle alone.
Furthest one from a target can fire.
Close one does not need to give away its position.
Finally:
NO US military personnel wanted F-15EX. does not fit new ninja tactics.
F-35s will always detect an F-15EXs first.
(When new F-15 was king of detecting first)
Less F-35 are needed.
Cost even if double (which it’s not) still more bang for buck.
F-15EX purchase forced on military by senators to secure Jobs in their state.
Yes, Jobs are good.
Hopefully Boeing can deliver like they used to do.
Even though the F-35 uses ninja tactics, the Air Force was concerned how they would perform against the Chinese Air Force in a massive air war
over the SCS where Chinese J-20, J-31s,J-10s, and J-11s, and J-16s would have a missile advantage over an all F-35 force. The F-15EX is to be
a missile truck that could be assigned targets outside Chinese detection range by the F-35 flying inside denied areas.
The F-35 can save its stealth abilities by staying out of air to air missions as much as possible and saving itself for going after air defenses
and command and control centers on the Chinese mainland as well as ships at sea. The EX can do the grunt work of protecting AWACs and tankers out over the Pacific while also engaging Chinese missile carrying bombers coming out to attack the US Navy.
saying F-15EX entirely procured just because bunch of senators would be a flawed argument. F-35 procurement was already expensive after the cost overruns during the development, and 5th gen fighters require extensive maintenance and coating which costs more man-hour and money.
F-15EX was procured to replace the aging fleet of F-15C, and to replace several ANG fleet too. And ANG has huge amount of fighter squadrons, and replacing entire fighter fleet into F-35 is impossible for the ever-shrinking Air Force FY budget
F15EX is to be a weapons platform. It's all integrated. F35s cant carry much firepower if it wants to remain stealthy. Thats where f15ex comes in. F35 acquires the target because it can go nearer an enemy without getting detected, and the f15ex fires at it from a long range distance.
As they say, if it ain't broke, don't fix it... 😎
This is kind of similar to how F4s from the Vietnam era are faster than modern warplanes, sustained high speed was better for combat purposes rather than small bursts of high speed with afterburners, especially when fuel burn and stress on the airframe is factored in as well. The F-15 is also a well proven airframe that has performed very well in combat. That being said, these two aircraft are not really in the same category and should not be compared directly, they have different roles. The US might have filled all of its available slots for the F-35 and money is being spent on the next generation of fighter aircraft taking into consideration data from the F-35 and F-22 aircraft. Similar to the Zumwalt class of destroyers, the entire line was cancelled. All the money that was spent on the F-35 went somewhere and given the past history of the US government, to say that it was all spent on acquiring just a few hundred new jets is laughable. I would theorize that the Skunkworks is very busy these days doing something. What that is I have no idea, but I would not be surprised if we see new airframes and a new program be revealed to the public by 2025.
I think the Air Force also decided to suspend its buy rate for F-35s pending another software upgrade which is supposed to happen in a few
years.The reason being its cheaper to just buy the planes with the capability over buying them without it,only to take them back out of service
to be updated. The Air Force had money it wasn't using and a pressing need to replace the F-15C which needs to be phased out by the end of the decade. the Air Force can buy the 144 EXs needed to replace the F-15C over the next 3 years (with options to buy up to 250 to replace the F-15E)
then shift back to buying F-35s (and the 6th generation replacement for the F-22) when the new software is ready.
Stop worrying about how much WE spend on our defense .
Why didn't canada buy 42 of these and then buy 42 F35 instead of going all in on the 35's? Sounds to me like the 35 is great on paper but sometimes when you do too many things you don't do a few well enough.
because the F-35 gives them more options. The F-35 was built as a multirole righter. The F-15 is an air superiority fighter. The F-35 also comes with more advantages. It has better sensors, stealth, supercruise without afterburners, can be equipped for many different missions, more future proof. The F-15EX is a good update to the platform but still cant compete with the F-35. Also, as more and more f-35s come into service around the world, the price and maintenance cost for them will continue to go down.
Die f22 ist wie die F15 ein Luftüberlegenheitsjäger! Die f35 ist ein Mehrzweck Kampfflugzeug.
In Deutschland haben wir als Luftüberlegenheitsjäger den Eurofighter. Die f35 daher eine sinnvolle Ergänzung. Auch wenn sie im dogfight anderen Modellen unterlegen ist, hat sie einige überragende Eigenschaften.
Denke in den USA hat man einfach den Bedarf an Langstrecken Anfangjäger und dafür ist die f22 und f15ex besser geeinigt.
It boils down to cost but not because they are cutting corners. Id imagine they see the stealth advantages offered by an F-35 as not worth the cost. Stealth effectiveness in the future will probably have more to do with other factors and it's probably not prudent to over invest yourself in a technology that might be outdated in 10 years and probably will be in 25. More planes is probably the preference and the updated f-15 is probably considered just as capable by those who know. I'd also bet anything that both the defense contractors and the defense department want to distance themselves from the decade long debacle that has been the roll out of the 35. When things go to shit people have a tendency to gravitate back to when things were going well, as opposed to pushing forward and risk another debacle
Israel can retro normal aircraft into drones. Perhaps we can do that as well with the F 15 EX. Kind
They proved that very well on 9/11
@@da_cat lol
That's so great way to use them.
The Pentagon already has announced that they have no interest in unmanned aircraft. The only thing they are willing to have unmanned are drones. There are many factors for this.
$ Trillions on f-15ex??? Lost me there. Details matter and you’re not paying enough attention to them
They buy F-15EX because IT FUNCTIONS ! And it's quite cheap to operate...
From memory it was Robin Olds that fronted Congress and got the gun put back into the F4 phantom
the reason F15 chosen is to keep Boeing in production.
without their line working airforce is vulnerable
Now they understand which is the best of both world , F15 EX!
If it was good enough for pixy, it's good enough for everybody
Air National Guard and Air Force Reserve will love these new F-15s.
Because the F-15 has a fully combat proven pedigree and the F-35 doesn't
These are 2 different planes that do different things. The F35 is the quarterback and the F15 ex is a new stud running back running old plays that have been proven to work even today now that the running back has Ben upgraded with the newest technology he can run the ball or go out and catch a pass and takeoff downfield
1st reason its expensive 2nd reason still expensive 3rd reason its super expensive
America Is Purchasing Both Platforms! Their Rolls Are For 2 Completely Different Theaters!
F-35 For Highly Defended Theater's And The F-15EX Is For Conventional Theaters!
The F-15EX Will Also Be Used In Heavily Defended Theater's To Deliver Long Range Munitions With Standoff Capabilities! ✌️
Big Boeing needs contracts, duh. It's a job program and keep Boeing armed manufacturing sharp
I know the F15 is an Air Force fighter and legend but I wished they could have replaced the legendary F14 Tomcat.
F15 and f35 serve different roles, F15ex is fully capable of home land air defense and is cabable as a bomb truck, EX has full data link ability which will complement the f35 and f22, we desperately need more f15s for home defense especially in Alaska
Agreed!.
I reckon the UK ought to buy the F-15 to compliment the F-35 for the UK airforce.
Ive always wondered about stealth fighters and the significant additional cost for the stealth capability in development, production and maintenance. If a reliable detection method would be developed or might already exist then with wide spread deployment all the money for the stealth was for nothing.
Stealth isn't a hard black or white though. You're not either 'stealth' or 'not stealth'. There absolutely will be advancements in radar in the future that will make F-35 and F-22 visible on radars, because it's not a matter of being invisible, it's a matter of being hard to detect through all the clutter. Could you see a single needle in a haystack? No, but if you get a very strong metal detector, you'll likely find it. Eventually the RCS of the current stealth jets will become detectable, but then further stealth advancements will be made too, putting them in the same relative position that the F-35 and F-22 are in at the moment.
The eurofighter with German avionics has the ability to target the f22 and f35
@@RandyMarshSP All fighters do, the wuestion is range, and of you can ping the F-35 as a fighter, it can definitely ping you.
@@bennperkins4006 also just because you spot the 22 and 35 on more advanced radar doesn't mean you can hit it with current missile technology. its gonna take a lot to integrate that all into a working package.
Stealth is about reducing the distance you can be seen from. An F22 or F35 is going to be able to close to lethal range with most aircraft before it is detectable on radar, and an F35 will be able to use its DAS to detect aircraft from even further away, in all directions.
An F15 is going to be a massive, easily located target for advanced aircraft. That doesn’t make it useless, but it’s about matching your enemy - if you have air dominance you could fly whatever bomb truck you like over - and that’s what the F-15EX is good for, and limited air to air against older aircraft.
f15ex costs more than a f35 to buy. and 2 engines vs 1 the f35 will eventually be cheaper to sustain. and the f35 can run external hardpoints doing the job of the f15ex, and keep in mind the f15 ex is based on the f15e- the multi-role ground attack version not the air superiority fighter version. they do the same thing but Boeing has better salespeople, selling the older plane for more money. there are probably lots of bonuses going around at Boeing hq right now as they laugh all the way to the bank.
there probably just preparing for the retirement of the a10, b1, and b2 and they need something that can move weight like those in case the b21 doesn't live up to the promises. even though the f35 can already carry more weight than the a10 on the external hardpoints.
Most F-15 shown at video are not EX version
All I can think is they want some bomb/missile trucks for the F-35 to use. But better than the f-15 to do that is some uavs.
F35 and the ex can certain missions together cus f35 isn't a dogfighter foreal the ex come in with air to air attack when f35 gotta go full stealth
For the same reason you would prefer to buy a 1998 Chevy Lumina with a back up camera and a GPS instead of buying a 2022 Chevy model....
Yes to the F15EX,yes to the F16,no to the F35, I'd fly wooded Sopwith
Someone gave the generals fat checks to buy dated mess. Just like we keep buying unusable things for more than 50 years. SMH 🤦♂️
Simple. Old school still beats the new gen shit.
F-15EX is a more suitable aircraft for Canadian air force than the F-35.
Neither russia or china have huge fleets of stealth aircraft, the NATO or the US in general still has a big leap in this field. But, 1 f35 can quite easily loose if there are several less capable 3rd or 4th generation jets opposing him. The F-15EX still can contest against latest russian or chinese developments, but they can also dominate in numbers the backbons of those airforces which is made up by 2+ and 3rd gen fighter aircraft.
plural form of aircraft is aircraft
Why even make the f-35. it cost so much but I feel a Upgraded jet would do better.
You forgot the most important reason: F15 is just so much prettier than F35!
Should have outsourced manufacturing to as many countries as possible and made large batch orders. Strongarm the European states into focusing on the f35. Drive the f35 price to as low as possible.