As aCNC machinist I set spindle position in relation to a hole in a part or, more often, a tooling hole on a part holding fixture (and some other co-ordinate positions as well) when setting up to run different parts. Your videos were well done and facinating and it was easy to relate to the concepts you were presenting. Your company looks like it does well at providing an important service to many industries,while at the same time appreciating the contributions of each employee. I am impressed!
Hey Dimtt2, I am so sorry for this late response. I was reading comments and came across your questions. 1. Yes, the validity rule applies tor face dial values as well. 2. While bar sag will impact the vertical dial result, sag does not affect the validity rule as the dial and the point of contact both turn true circles. Bar sag merely causes the circle to be displaced downwardly.
Thanks for asking. Bar sag can be measured by mounting the dial/s on a piece of rigid pipe. The dial/s are set to zero at 12:00 and turned 180 degrees to 6:00.
Cd, thank you for responding. Perhaps we were not clear enough. Mili is latin for 1/1000th. A milimeter, is 1/1000th of a meter and 20 milimeters would be 0.7873". We could have been clearer, however we were using the term mil to represent 1/1000 of an inch. In this expample, 20 mils=0.020". It is approiate to use mil in this context. If you buy a 3 mil garbage bag in the USA, the thickness would be 0.003". I hope I have cleared up any misunderstanding. Again, thank you for your response.
Mils has been arouund for awhile. I aligned many large Gensets. I prefer to measure in mm. A few of my fellow technicians that started to do alignments were getting it totally confused." mm" is milimeters which is metric,"mil" is one thousands of a inch. Fairly easy concept once you conduct a few alignments.
It must be a regional thing. I've heard mils used in machine shops as a synonym for "thousandths" for fifty years, but us folks in the south don't know anything about machining. This is a very cool video, and extremely useful information. Thank you for posting, and don't mind the nit-picking know-it-alls.
I love this video. I am studying to become a millwright and have done some alignments. I wish I would have found your videos when I was doing my first alignments...it would have been less stressful!
I hear lots of people in various shops say "mils" for "thousandths". It's just common slang, and it can be confusing, especially when you work in both inches and metric. But it's more accurate than saying "move it over just a scosche" or "it's off by a hair"!
Shawn, The holder is not commercially available. But, I have it on good authority that 4 sets are going to be given away on our Realigning America site. The offer will probably start in May.
I've been doing alignments on rotating equipment for quite a while and mils is the term used in that field, especially with laser alignment. I will add everything I do is English measurement based, not Metric. Doing other forms of precision measurement using mics, calipers, indicators, etc., a form of thousandths is used in most cases. Though, they do get interchanged depending on whom you're communicating with. That's been my experience, anyway.
Aldhamin, thank you for asking. We made the brackets for teaching dials. They incorporate our laser kit chain fixtures and are not commercially available. You might try A-Line Manufacturing in Texas as they make a very similar bracket. Thank you.
Edge, I appreciate your response and I also aprreciate your fear. However, I have been aligning machines with true position data for about 15 years. You might give this a try. It is especially useful when getting 6:00 data is difficult or impossible. From a technical point of view, the only way the values do not add up is if the center of rotation moves during rotation (excessive bearing clearances coupled with bent shaft) of the shafts.
El video esta muy bien, hecho en falta que reste la flexa que produce la gravedad sobre la posición 0 y 6. Siempre hay caida del reloj comparador en 0 y 6, siempre.... En Jupiter mucho más y en la luna mucho menos. En la tierra tenemos gravedad.... Señores...
My question is, it necessary to always turn the dial half of its reading @4:27 in the video to set it's True position? Thank you very much for the wonderful information. 👍
Which method you are following? Because you are taking reading of Rim , how about face out? I never see anyone using single dial gauge😊 What is tolerance of Alignment per API686 standard?
Holy tomole explained a lot! Love this video thanks for the help! I hope to be a top rated millwright in the years to come and with information like this I will be well on my way!
Can I ask? I align my equipments and then set the indicator to zero at 12 oclock then rotate it to 6 oclock then it reads -30mils.wat do i do? Lower the motor?
Dear friend Please answer In the graph plotted using reverse peripheral alignment method, if f1 (reading at front foot) and f2 (reading at back foot ) are +ve readings :? 1.shims are to be added for both driver and driven equipment 2.shims are to be removed from both driver and driven equipment 3.shims are to be added to both the feet of equipment being aligned. 4.shims are to be removed from both the feet of equipment being aligned Please answer which one is right answer 1 to 4
Mil is a specific measurement refering to units of angle. Using mil as a substitute for thousandths of an inch is something I've never seen or heard in twenty years of machining. Doing so would be disastrous in shops like mine where we have both SAE and metric blueprints. And now that I've griped a little, it was a good explanation of TIR. But another gripe. Total indicate RUNOUT.
IN THIS VIDEO, PATRICK PROMISED TO SHOW THE USAGE OF THIS METHOD "TRUE POSITION SENSING", BUT EVERYWHERE I SEARCHED I COULDNOT FIND THE LINK, CAN U PLEASE GIVE ME THE LINKES OF THE VIDEOS WHICH HE TAUGHT THOSE THINGS???
True position allow you to use live readings when making the horizontal correction. To see this in action view the following video: ua-cam.com/video/CLyG-8wq268/v-deo.html
This is great! What I wonder is could you not put the indicator on a magnet stand and just rotate the shaft? You could read at 6 that way -- nothing would be in the way. Why have the indicator mounted on the shaft so it rotates for the reading... I don't get that... Note: I'm dealing with round stock sticking out of a lathe. Thanks!
The point of taking readings with the dial attached to one shaft is that you're trying to align them, i.e you are trying to get a relative position reading between the two shafts. If you were to measure with your indicator attached to the base and reading one of the shafts, you would only be reading the runout of the shaft, and not its position relative to the other shaft
ya..my opinion to say, Radial(Rim) is not much difficult to adjust.i would like to know more about Axial(Face) adjustment .if you can show more about Axial adjustment with Formula( +,- how much remove or how much add to front or back...)any way thanks for this video too.
I don't get the total validity rule, surely it is stated wrong. What if the motor is misaligned 100 in the horizontal and 20 in the vertical? Surely its supposed to be left + bottom = right + top. Can you clarify?
For anyone interested in shaft or pump alignment this video is a must. Thank you so much Patrick
What great, simplistic video explaining the use of a dial indicator.
As aCNC machinist I set spindle position in relation to a hole in a part or, more often, a tooling hole on a part holding fixture (and some other co-ordinate positions as well) when setting up to run different parts. Your videos were well done and facinating and it was easy to relate to the concepts you were presenting. Your company looks like it does well at providing an important service to many industries,while at the same time appreciating the contributions of each employee. I am impressed!
Hey Dimtt2,
I am so sorry for this late response. I was reading comments and came across your questions. 1. Yes, the validity rule applies tor face dial values as well. 2. While bar sag will impact the vertical dial result, sag does not affect the validity rule as the dial and the point of contact both turn true circles. Bar sag merely causes the circle to be displaced downwardly.
Our instructor had us watch this video as part of our HVAC training. It certainly helps explain concepts for someone green like me.
Thanks for asking. Bar sag can be measured by mounting the dial/s on a piece of rigid pipe. The dial/s are set to zero at 12:00 and turned 180 degrees to 6:00.
Cd, thank you for responding. Perhaps we were not clear enough. Mili is latin for 1/1000th. A milimeter, is 1/1000th of a meter and 20 milimeters would be 0.7873". We could have been clearer, however we were using the term mil to represent 1/1000 of an inch. In this expample, 20 mils=0.020". It is approiate to use mil in this context. If you buy a 3 mil garbage bag in the USA, the thickness would be 0.003". I hope I have cleared up any misunderstanding. Again, thank you for your response.
Mils has been arouund for awhile. I aligned many large Gensets. I prefer to measure in mm. A few of my fellow technicians that started to do alignments were getting it totally confused." mm" is milimeters which is metric,"mil" is one thousands of a inch. Fairly easy concept once you conduct a few alignments.
It must be a regional thing. I've heard mils used in machine shops as a synonym for "thousandths" for fifty years, but us folks in the south don't know anything about machining. This is a very cool video, and extremely useful information. Thank you for posting, and don't mind the nit-picking know-it-alls.
I love this video. I am studying to become a millwright and have done some alignments. I wish I would have found your videos when I was doing my first alignments...it would have been less stressful!
Same same
Thank you very much! Sir I am student of mechanical it's very simple and helpful video.Love from Pakistan.
I hear lots of people in various shops say "mils" for "thousandths". It's just common slang, and it can be confusing, especially when you work in both inches and metric. But it's more accurate than saying "move it over just a scosche" or "it's off by a hair"!
Shawn,
The holder is not commercially available. But, I have it on good authority that 4 sets are going to be given away on our Realigning America site. The offer will probably start in May.
I've been doing alignments on rotating equipment for quite a while and mils is the term used in that field, especially with laser alignment. I will add everything I do is English measurement based, not Metric. Doing other forms of precision measurement using mics, calipers, indicators, etc., a form of thousandths is used in most cases. Though, they do get interchanged depending on whom you're communicating with. That's been my experience, anyway.
Your videos are very informative and the method of teaching is so beautiful.thank you .
Excellent very insightful video. A must for anyone learning how to align shafts using dial indicators!
Thank you for the kind words.
What a nice lesson on shaft alignment effort.
Thank you, Lance & Patrick.
Aldhamin, thank you for asking. We made the brackets for teaching dials. They incorporate our laser kit chain fixtures and are not commercially available. You might try A-Line Manufacturing in Texas as they make a very similar bracket. Thank you.
Edge, I appreciate your response and I also aprreciate your fear. However, I have been aligning machines with true position data for about 15 years. You might give this a try. It is especially useful when getting 6:00 data is difficult or impossible. From a technical point of view, the only way the values do not add up is if the center of rotation moves during rotation (excessive bearing clearances coupled with bent shaft) of the shafts.
El video esta muy bien, hecho en falta que reste la flexa que produce la gravedad sobre la posición 0 y 6. Siempre hay caida del reloj comparador en 0 y 6, siempre.... En Jupiter mucho más y en la luna mucho menos. En la tierra tenemos gravedad.... Señores...
Thanks for this video. It gives a brief & basic information about shaft alignment.
very good explanation Mr Patrick . you are have great teaching skill. thank you.
My question is, it necessary to always turn the dial half of its reading @4:27 in the video to set it's True position?
Thank you very much for the wonderful information. 👍
Comming soon, Richard. Thank you for asking.
Thank you so much for your illustration. Now I clearly understand.
thank you patrick for your detailed explanation , about the validity rule, is it valid regardless the -ve or +ve signal of the readings?
Which method you are following? Because you are taking reading of Rim , how about face out?
I never see anyone using single dial gauge😊
What is tolerance of Alignment per API686 standard?
Holy tomole explained a lot! Love this video thanks for the help! I hope to be a top rated millwright in the years to come and with information like this I will be well on my way!
Aldhamin,
Keep checking in. I know that a new basics video is a few weeks away.
can you let me know how do we read the dial indicator and calculate when using 3 dial indicator, 2 nos for axial and one for horizontal
Thanks we can check the value by true position .
Can I ask? I align my equipments and then set the indicator to zero at 12 oclock then rotate it to 6 oclock then it reads -30mils.wat do i do? Lower the motor?
Thank you very much for sharing your knowledge ♥️🇵🇭
GREAT VIDEO tutorial 👍♥️
Well done video. Excellent lessons learned.
great video tutorial, very informative, thank you for sharing your knowledge.
Thanks for the very informative video. Can you indicate what type of Dial Indicator and Assembly used for performing the measurements? Thanks
Rishi, the dials are made by Starrett. Don't recall which bracket set we used.
Excellent explanation thank you sir.
Dear friend
Please answer
In the graph plotted using reverse peripheral alignment method, if f1 (reading at front foot) and f2 (reading at back foot ) are +ve readings :?
1.shims are to be added for both driver and driven equipment
2.shims are to be removed from both driver and driven equipment
3.shims are to be added to both the feet of equipment being aligned.
4.shims are to be removed from both the feet of equipment being aligned
Please answer which one is right answer 1 to 4
Mil is a specific measurement refering to units of angle. Using mil as a substitute for thousandths of an inch is something I've never seen or heard in twenty years of machining. Doing so would be disastrous in shops like mine where we have both SAE and metric blueprints. And now that I've griped a little, it was a good explanation of TIR. But another gripe. Total indicate RUNOUT.
very useful ,do you have videos for True Position Sensing method?
Thanks, James. This was a great experience.
thanks for the tips. your video made my job easy, well less difficult. thanks for sharing.
very well done video, easy to understand....thank you
How many clearance between bearing's ball and races of c1.
You might also enjoy checking out thealignmentblog which is a mostly non-comercial forum for those interested in shaft alignment.
What kind of dial indicator are you using? Where can I buy a chain set that won't cost $1000!?
Thank you, Patelanand.
Very awesome techniques sir, thanks a lot
Is it applicable for axial alignment with two dial indicators
IN THIS VIDEO, PATRICK PROMISED TO SHOW THE USAGE OF THIS METHOD "TRUE POSITION SENSING", BUT EVERYWHERE I SEARCHED I COULDNOT FIND THE LINK, CAN U PLEASE GIVE ME THE LINKES OF THE VIDEOS WHICH HE TAUGHT THOSE THINGS???
can you share the link of the video where you will explain the importance of true positioning. great video. many thanks
True position allow you to use live readings when making the horizontal correction. To see this in action view the following video:
ua-cam.com/video/CLyG-8wq268/v-deo.html
pamp
Where that +10 comes from plz tell me plz..😟
Information are very good
Thanks you sir
Great. Very helpful video. Thank you.
This is great! What I wonder is could you not put the indicator on a magnet stand and just rotate the shaft? You could read at 6 that way -- nothing would be in the way. Why have the indicator mounted on the shaft so it rotates for the reading... I don't get that... Note: I'm dealing with round stock sticking out of a lathe. Thanks!
The point of taking readings with the dial attached to one shaft is that you're trying to align them, i.e you are trying to get a relative position reading between the two shafts. If you were to measure with your indicator attached to the base and reading one of the shafts, you would only be reading the runout of the shaft, and not its position relative to the other shaft
Your effort is appreciate..... thank you very much
When are you going to split the coupling and take your readings?
u explained about true position for offset misalignment..is the same concept applicable for angular misalignment?..please clarify?
Great and Thanks.
But how these deviations should be modified without the app?
Thank you, James.
great video guys! thanks for sharing. Keep doing more videos!
ya..my opinion to say, Radial(Rim) is not much difficult to adjust.i would like to know more about Axial(Face) adjustment .if you can show more about Axial adjustment with Formula( +,- how much remove or how much add to front or back...)any way thanks for this video too.
Can you give example TIR of unacceptable alignment that exceeds 15%
I have a borewell of 200ft what configuration motor pump I can buy. please help me out.
I don't get the total validity rule, surely it is stated wrong. What if the motor is misaligned 100 in the horizontal and 20 in the vertical? Surely its supposed to be left + bottom = right + top. Can you clarify?
Nope he got it right, if the dial reads zero at the top, left + right = bottom
Please explains the electronically dialing.
Thank You So mUch, Pattrick
Great to learn the real precision alignment and I buy the idea. Wonderfullllllllllll
What about Positive and negative values?
Thank you Sir..your video very helpfull
John,
Thank you so much for your kind words....
David Zdrojewski
Hi Patrick, I notice that you do not make any mention of first checking for bar/clock sag as this will affect your actual alignment result.
Thankyou patrick
How can i rotate a high load shaft with low number of rpm
Well done sir
Understanding is learning
Saludos, nadamas estan alineando los ejes radialmente pero tambien es importante alinearlos angularmente
Which standards you referred to. API 686 doesn’t mention that
Nice information
what is the name for these brackets?
My former boss. Hi Patrick!
Why do you use the word mill, when I can see you have a indicator that measures thousands at .001 per grad. doesn't mills mean milimeter?
Hi, this's Rim and face method, can you make a video please with reverse methode.
Thank you very much.
ua-cam.com/video/FtKOCJg1H-g/v-deo.html
I don't understand the 6 and 9 o'clock .005" and .025" to .010" and .010". Can you clarify how that happened for me?
Hi Cryofire. Send us your email and we will get you in touch with one of our trainers who will be able to answer your question.
im a little confused with the language....what about bar sag did you add that to your true value?
Great work
thanks.谢谢。nice lesson！
Well. Thank you. Great video
Excelente video muchas gracias
Tps reading fallow validity
But validity reading not fallow TPS.
Reply soon
Hi admin
You can for me ... data or manual alignment ... thank you
Thanks so much
I love your video. Can i borrow yourvideo and tranlate my language for my men. Thanks you so much
Excellent
What about angular misaligned?
You only measured offset in same way
What about angular misalignment
You did already or not taken that measurements??
In validity 25 & 5
In TPS -10 & +10
Why sir please tell me urgently
Reply soon
25-15 =10 ; 5-15= -10.. that is how i understand..
Nice video but you MUST account for gravity drop in your indicator fixture to be truly aligned
Thank you, artgoat!
Very beautiful 1
Thank you so much
You're wecome.