This channel shall grow exponentially if it persists with the current quality or improves on it. Very enjoyable and cannot wait for future videos. Cheers
Wow, thanks, I appreciate that. I'm always second guess myself with new videos (especially the next one since it is more experimental), so its comforting to see comments like this!
Huge Soulsborne fan here. I’m glad you mentioned The Surge. Probably my favorite of all the games attempting to ape the Soulsborne formula. Not only did it do a valiant effort at that, but the sci-fi setting was a genius move as it is pretty much as far away from the classic medieval fantasy of Dark Souls. Really helped the game stand out on it’s own as opposed to the many other “copycats” that stuck to the same setting. Great vid, btw. ;)
I dunno how I should feel about saying this. While "Easy mode" would really diminish the appeal of Souls, two things happened to me. I was playing "Infamous Second Son". At the very start, there is a platforming section that you need to do to get to your home. It was pathetically easy if you have played any amount of games, and I thought even a non-gamer could've done that. Then my sister came and I gave her the controller for her to try the game. She was facing a lot of problems, like not able control the camera, and not able to judge the distance between platforms. Also, "press A/X longer to jump higher" is instinctive to us, but she didn't knew about it until I told her about it. I was a little annoyed as to why couldn't she was able to do such a simple thing, but I calmed myself and analysed the "casual gamer/non-gamer" in front of me. Other thing happened to myself. I love character actions. I pulled off an S/A rank in Metal Gear Rising for the most part and almost always A in DMC3/4. I recently bought Bayonetta and was able to get Platinum/Pure Platinum in almost all encounters in the first few missions. I put the game on hold because life and exams. I played Bayonetta just yesterday, and to my shock, I couldn't anything more than a rare Gold in the encounters, with the overall rating always being a Stone Statue. What I'm getting here is that, **people have different states of flow, and it also depends on the level of mastery and general state of being**. And I believe that most games should allow kinds of players to be able to play the game. A difficulty option/slider is a good way for casual gamers, and those who have started to loose their touch to get along with the game. Because in this mode, while the game would still be challenging, at least it would be doable. It was after these two incidents that I think that having a difficult slider, or at least having options for making the game easy (like "white" level perks in Witcher 3, or the tutorial "stages" in DS II), could be beneficial. Core gamers wouldn't touch them anyway, but rather casual gamers would still be able to enjoy the game. This is why I really appreciate Platinum's effort for their Easy modes. Sure the things are automated, but that still makes them feel like a badass.
I randomly stumbled onto a video a week or so ago and now I am going through and starting to watch the other stuff you have made. I am super impressed and everything has been super great quality. Can't wait to see what's to come! Keep up the great stuff, man!
6:35 I have to disagree. There is a certain rule in all DS games (including Bloodborne and Demon's) - you can't hit through walls. You will hit a wall instead, and your blade won't go through, BUUUUT there is a good number of enemies who just don't care and kill you through corners, pillars and thin walls. It happened to me A LOT of times. You also showed Ninja Gaiden in your video, and that game deals with this problem easily - you can hit walls, but your attacks just wont connect. Same goes for your opponents.
Manulel I know what are tou talking about, but still. You can't face walls and hit through them, but your enemies just don't give and won't let you use environment
Let's also not forget that you need to let Seath kill you when you first run into him in The Duke's Archives to access the prison and fight him for real. Oh, and in Demon's Souls, even if you manage to kill the tutorial boss, you still get instantly punched to death by a gargantuan dragon a minute or so later.
The “wall bounce” is indeed the one aspect of the series that stands out as being unfairly biased against the player in my eyes. (That and the two dickbag Silver Knight archers in Anor Londo. You know the ones, I’m sure.)
The more I hear about "Dark Souls tropes" like I-frames while dodging or "punishing" combat, the more I think that people never played any other games. For real.
+i don't even I get that, though those are just the semantic of this sub genre, like talking about grinding in JRPGs and frame data in fighting games, they aren't exclusive to those games but they are what define them, hence why they are used so often
I don't even feel that Dark Souls can be considered punishing, it is hard but punishing would be more unfair like say Skyrim on Legendary or Persona 5 on its most difficult where its a simple the enemy is stronger and you are weaker while providing unfair advantage to opponents. Dark Souls is Brutal in some cases but it doesnt pull a fast one on you. I played Persona 5 for an hour on hardest difficulty but gave up on that because the weakest enemies would wipe 95% of my health bar and I could barely scratch them with their weakness. I would say we should just call the combat Tactical.
When Dark Souls was released in Japan, I’m sure the combat was instantly compared to that of Monster Hunter. MH is a gigantic phenomenon over there so the similarities in the combat would’ve been obvious to a great many players instantly.
the first souls i tried was 3 and i didn't care for it. the game had a decent flow till you fight the abyss watcher's. i was never able to get into the zone,yet i could in monster hunter world. i felt like often i wasn't learning anything from my deaths except that i got hit with a cheap fast attack with little to no windup. maybe i just lack a twitch reflex because i grew up with games at a time before First Person shooters.
Yeah I see what you mean, Humanoid bosses in these games are normally the hardest the read due to the amount different swipes/swings they could combo into, while in something like MHW, the monsters telegraph their various attacks quite well for the most part so you learn to avoid and maximise damage to them
"No enemy has arbitrary rules or a secret weapon you need to use" Izalith and Yhorm do, but everyone likes to ignore those. I think what you're probably saying here is in the ideal circumstance, that would be the case, even if the prototype for this type of game does in fact break those rules. Pointing that out matters, though, because we can see a clear and obvious drop in fun, quality, and flow when those rules have been broken, ie Izalith and Yhorm being the worst parts of their respective games. well, except for Aldrich, maybe. And as for the easy mode thing, I think you're just lacking nuance in the way you're viewing the concept of flow. People with less patience or experience with games on a whole, or even just this genre, will have much different levels at which flow even becomes possible. I tried to have a friend play DS3 this year and he asked how to sneak, like it was Skyrim or something. The DS3 tutorial is ridiculously easy for anyone who's played 2-4 other FromSoft games, I remember getting through it on my first try, but nothing my friend would do could get him through, and we didn't have hours for him to learn. It's the same with the Guitar Hero example. I've never played a rhythm game, so if I jumped in on expert mode, I'd lose in 5 seconds, before I'd even have a chance to start learning the mechanics and get into that flow state. I'd need the easy mode to learn the game and slowly develop that flow because I'm not used to that type of gameplay, I'm used to action RPGs. It's why Mario starts out with goombas and works its way to Bowser, just with a more modular aspect which opens it up to more people so that the exact level someone's comfortable with is available. Not to mention the addition of an easy mode could mean an addition of a hard mode for players who have already beaten 3 Souls games already and don't want to be yawning for the first third of the newest title, so it works on both sides.
The best games try keep you in the flow state for as long as possible by carefully balancing difficulty with your skills. First they teach you something in a low risk setting, then they challenge you to use that skill is a more difficult scenario. Valve is a master of this, you just cant stop playing their games. It's ironic to me that you mention flow and dark souls in the same sentence. The Souls games don't try to balance skills and difficulty at all. I would argue they are very lazy in this regard. They just throw all difficulty at you at once, so you either "git gud" or stop playing. When the difficulty is high and your skill is low, you are frustrated. When you have to repeat sections of enemies you can already beat easily to get to the boss, you are bored. You are all over the "flow graph", if anything these games makes the flow moments extremely rare.
Good video, Foxcade. Personally, I don't like Souls-like style gameplay even if I do love its lore. I play video games to relax, not to challenge myself so I always prefer easy and relaxing game but I can certainly understand why others would love it.
That's Fair. I feel the same about online multiplayer games. I want to relax and play my way, and not have to worry about constantly talking on the mic and making sure I know what everyone else is doing. I get the appeal but it just isn't for me.
Or otherwise: Why I would spend hours at a time replaying boss battles on intense difficulty in Super Smash Bros. Brawl and you probably did too(if you had that game).
hellkite dragon at the bridge is still really bullshit boss to me and gets worse with each ng+! I mean yeah, dragonslayer arrows and all help, but then the bastard starts healing itself and its hard to learn much by just jumping into battle as most of its moves are like instant fiery death from above. I would much rather battle Kalameet
i love the story and overal feel around the dark souls games, however i never played em just watched my friend play them. I did however get bloodborne. i'am a scrub i know XD i just don't have the time to invest in games like theese.
Souls games are somewhat like fighting games, as they are a time commitment, but are gratifying to succeed in because of it. This is why I usually throw Bloodborne at people, as there is a bit less to worry about and is more fast paced, which I find is more appealing to a lot of folks.
jackstone112 honestly, I picked bloodborne but for me it's not just 'cause I don't have time to play games like Dark Souls but also because Bloodborne looks alot less intimidating than the Dark Souls games. That, and because it was free on ps plus two months ago.
I’m forced to write a collage paper on Agentiel Realism for my video game design course (don’t ask why we have to deal with Feminist garbage in such a class to begin with) and I picked the Soulsborne “formula” as subject to examine. Consider yourself cited, my good fox.
I'd count the StormRuler bosses and the Bed of Chaos as arbitrary rules considering they are both not fought conventionally. Dark souls has some enemies with arbitrary rules. Should i mention the intended way of beating the white dragon from DS 3 endgame?
"The God-like being descending from the Heavens of Hentai."
NOW I know why I like the Moon Presence's design so much!
Personally, for me it was being a huge Lovecraft fan that did it.
But each to his own. ;)
Ett Gammalt Bergtroll theres a difference?
This channel shall grow exponentially if it persists with the current quality or improves on it. Very enjoyable and cannot wait for future videos. Cheers
Wow, thanks, I appreciate that. I'm always second guess myself with new videos (especially the next one since it is more experimental), so its comforting to see comments like this!
Even me?
That... Caught me off guard
Andrew Marshall same
Me too. I feel uncomfy.
Huge Soulsborne fan here. I’m glad you mentioned The Surge. Probably my favorite of all the games attempting to ape the Soulsborne formula.
Not only did it do a valiant effort at that, but the sci-fi setting was a genius move as it is pretty much as far away from the classic medieval fantasy of Dark Souls. Really helped the game stand out on it’s own as opposed to the many other “copycats” that stuck to the same setting.
Great vid, btw. ;)
"...git gud." I died. again. from laughing this time.
Git Gud at watching ;)
leave a like, Smash that MF subscribe button and hit my bell button to Never miss on of my videos
I dunno how I should feel about saying this. While "Easy mode" would really diminish the appeal of Souls, two things happened to me.
I was playing "Infamous Second Son". At the very start, there is a platforming section that you need to do to get to your home. It was pathetically easy if you have played any amount of games, and I thought even a non-gamer could've done that.
Then my sister came and I gave her the controller for her to try the game. She was facing a lot of problems, like not able control the camera, and not able to judge the distance between platforms. Also, "press A/X longer to jump higher" is instinctive to us, but she didn't knew about it until I told her about it.
I was a little annoyed as to why couldn't she was able to do such a simple thing, but I calmed myself and analysed the "casual gamer/non-gamer" in front of me.
Other thing happened to myself. I love character actions. I pulled off an S/A rank in Metal Gear Rising for the most part and almost always A in DMC3/4. I recently bought Bayonetta and was able to get Platinum/Pure Platinum in almost all encounters in the first few missions. I put the game on hold because life and exams.
I played Bayonetta just yesterday, and to my shock, I couldn't anything more than a rare
Gold in the encounters, with the overall rating always being a Stone Statue.
What I'm getting here is that, **people have different states of flow, and it also depends on the level of mastery and general state of being**. And I believe that most games should allow kinds of players to be able to play the game.
A difficulty option/slider is a good way for casual gamers, and those who have started to loose their touch to get along with the game. Because in this mode, while the game would still be challenging, at least it would be doable.
It was after these two incidents that I think that having a difficult slider, or at least having options for making the game easy (like "white" level perks in Witcher 3, or the tutorial "stages" in DS II), could be beneficial. Core gamers wouldn't touch them anyway, but rather casual gamers would still be able to enjoy the game.
This is why I really appreciate Platinum's effort for their Easy modes. Sure the things are automated, but that still makes them feel like a badass.
Dark Soul's UI is has a pretty muted colors and it mixes well with the environment, which is why I think it feels unobtrusive.
I randomly stumbled onto a video a week or so ago and now I am going through and starting to watch the other stuff you have made. I am super impressed and everything has been super great quality. Can't wait to see what's to come! Keep up the great stuff, man!
lol Wooliam's Daigo match
Oohh, "procedurally generated".
Well I'm out.
6:35
I have to disagree. There is a certain rule in all DS games (including Bloodborne and Demon's) - you can't hit through walls. You will hit a wall instead, and your blade won't go through, BUUUUT there is a good number of enemies who just don't care and kill you through corners, pillars and thin walls. It happened to me A LOT of times. You also showed Ninja Gaiden in your video, and that game deals with this problem easily - you can hit walls, but your attacks just wont connect. Same goes for your opponents.
You can also hit through thin walls if you position yourself correctly. It should work with almost all weapons, easiest being greatswords and lances.
Manulel I know what are tou talking about, but still. You can't face walls and hit through them, but your enemies just don't give and won't let you use environment
Let's also not forget that you need to let Seath kill you when you first run into him in The Duke's Archives to access the prison and fight him for real.
Oh, and in Demon's Souls, even if you manage to kill the tutorial boss, you still get instantly punched to death by a gargantuan dragon a minute or so later.
false. I killed Havel without even going into the tower thing he's in. I simply attacked him through the wall/door
The “wall bounce” is indeed the one aspect of the series that stands out as being unfairly biased against the player in my eyes.
(That and the two dickbag Silver Knight archers in Anor Londo. You know the ones, I’m sure.)
HOW!?!?!? How did I not know about this channel? I just subscribed so hard!
5:04
N-no, sir. That's actually just a Berserk reference. The lovecfraft comes after though. And boy does it come.
+Unbound King Damn it, how did I forget about "that" horse
How do you only have arround 2.2k subscribers?
I just found your channel and now I'm stuck in watching all your videos
Hmm, its probably due to the fact I'm terrible at uploading frequently and networking haha but thanks for the support, super appreciate it!
As a fellow Canadian, I understand that reference.
The more I hear about "Dark Souls tropes" like I-frames while dodging or "punishing" combat, the more I think that people never played any other games. For real.
+i don't even I get that, though those are just the semantic of this sub genre, like talking about grinding in JRPGs and frame data in fighting games, they aren't exclusive to those games but they are what define them, hence why they are used so often
I don't even feel that Dark Souls can be considered punishing, it is hard but punishing would be more unfair like say Skyrim on Legendary or Persona 5 on its most difficult where its a simple the enemy is stronger and you are weaker while providing unfair advantage to opponents. Dark Souls is Brutal in some cases but it doesnt pull a fast one on you. I played Persona 5 for an hour on hardest difficulty but gave up on that because the weakest enemies would wipe 95% of my health bar and I could barely scratch them with their weakness. I would say we should just call the combat Tactical.
When Dark Souls was released in Japan, I’m sure the combat was instantly compared to that of Monster Hunter. MH is a gigantic phenomenon over there so the similarities in the combat would’ve been obvious to a great many players instantly.
i really enjoy your analysis
Dark souls easy mode = knight class
I regret I have but one like to give.
What's the name of the game at 0:48? I can't understand what the word is. Itzier? E-Tier? lol
well, yhorm the giant from DS3 must be killed using the stormbreaker
the first souls i tried was 3 and i didn't care for it. the game had a decent flow till you fight the abyss watcher's. i was never able to get into the zone,yet i could in monster hunter world. i felt like often i wasn't learning anything from my deaths except that i got hit with a cheap fast attack with little to no windup. maybe i just lack a twitch reflex because i grew up with games at a time before First Person shooters.
Yeah I see what you mean, Humanoid bosses in these games are normally the hardest the read due to the amount different swipes/swings they could combo into, while in something like MHW, the monsters telegraph their various attacks quite well for the most part so you learn to avoid and maximise damage to them
"No enemy has arbitrary rules or a secret weapon you need to use"
Izalith and Yhorm do, but everyone likes to ignore those. I think what you're probably saying here is in the ideal circumstance, that would be the case, even if the prototype for this type of game does in fact break those rules. Pointing that out matters, though, because we can see a clear and obvious drop in fun, quality, and flow when those rules have been broken, ie Izalith and Yhorm being the worst parts of their respective games.
well, except for Aldrich, maybe.
And as for the easy mode thing, I think you're just lacking nuance in the way you're viewing the concept of flow. People with less patience or experience with games on a whole, or even just this genre, will have much different levels at which flow even becomes possible. I tried to have a friend play DS3 this year and he asked how to sneak, like it was Skyrim or something. The DS3 tutorial is ridiculously easy for anyone who's played 2-4 other FromSoft games, I remember getting through it on my first try, but nothing my friend would do could get him through, and we didn't have hours for him to learn. It's the same with the Guitar Hero example. I've never played a rhythm game, so if I jumped in on expert mode, I'd lose in 5 seconds, before I'd even have a chance to start learning the mechanics and get into that flow state. I'd need the easy mode to learn the game and slowly develop that flow because I'm not used to that type of gameplay, I'm used to action RPGs. It's why Mario starts out with goombas and works its way to Bowser, just with a more modular aspect which opens it up to more people so that the exact level someone's comfortable with is available. Not to mention the addition of an easy mode could mean an addition of a hard mode for players who have already beaten 3 Souls games already and don't want to be yawning for the first third of the newest title, so it works on both sides.
the best example for combat being like dancing is sekiro
But does it have Berserk refferences?
From Software's next title should just be Berserk Souls
Daigo Vs Woolie/Fetus of God References? Sounds like someone watches TBFP :)
The best games try keep you in the flow state for as long as possible by carefully balancing difficulty with your skills. First they teach you something in a low risk setting, then they challenge you to use that skill is a more difficult scenario. Valve is a master of this, you just cant stop playing their games. It's ironic to me that you mention flow and dark souls in the same sentence. The Souls games don't try to balance skills and difficulty at all. I would argue they are very lazy in this regard. They just throw all difficulty at you at once, so you either "git gud" or stop playing. When the difficulty is high and your skill is low, you are frustrated. When you have to repeat sections of enemies you can already beat easily to get to the boss, you are bored. You are all over the "flow graph", if anything these games makes the flow moments extremely rare.
9:26 or just know when to parry (i don't)
Good video, Foxcade.
Personally, I don't like Souls-like style gameplay even if I do love its lore. I play video games to relax, not to challenge myself so I always prefer easy and relaxing game but I can certainly understand why others would love it.
That's Fair. I feel the same about online multiplayer games. I want to relax and play my way, and not have to worry about constantly talking on the mic and making sure I know what everyone else is doing. I get the appeal but it just isn't for me.
Yhorm.
What's the name of the game at 6:50 ?
Let It Die. Should be free to play on PS4
Nice channel especialy about dmc and souls :)
Thank you! :)
Or otherwise: Why I would spend hours at a time replaying boss battles on intense difficulty in Super Smash Bros. Brawl and you probably did too(if you had that game).
hellkite dragon at the bridge is still really bullshit boss to me and gets worse with each ng+! I mean yeah, dragonslayer arrows and all help, but then the bastard starts healing itself and its hard to learn much by just jumping into battle as most of its moves are like instant fiery death from above. I would much rather battle Kalameet
i love the story and overal feel around the dark souls games, however i never played em just watched my friend play them. I did however get bloodborne. i'am a scrub i know XD i just don't have the time to invest in games like theese.
Souls games are somewhat like fighting games, as they are a time commitment, but are gratifying to succeed in because of it. This is why I usually throw Bloodborne at people, as there is a bit less to worry about and is more fast paced, which I find is more appealing to a lot of folks.
jackstone112 honestly, I picked bloodborne but for me it's not just 'cause I don't have time to play games like Dark Souls but also because Bloodborne looks alot less intimidating than the Dark Souls games. That, and because it was free on ps plus two months ago.
...How did you know my name?
Flow state?
Argh!!! I feel like I'm being judged for how I play in other games....
"Get good"
N-noooo :'(
I’m forced to write a collage paper on Agentiel Realism for my video game design course (don’t ask why we have to deal with Feminist garbage in such a class to begin with) and I picked the Soulsborne “formula” as subject to examine.
Consider yourself cited, my good fox.
first
I keep meaning to get into the Souls games as a lot of your points are the same reasons I love the Monster Hunter series. Also hell yes PJ Phil.
I've always considered trying Monster Hunter too, but the sheer amount of grinding turns me off a bit. And ya, Canadians represent!
If you want to get into Dark Souls better to buy the remastered version now while the servers are full of jolly cooperation, and PVP.
Nioh is a great game. Not just a souls like. It's a great game by its self
Dead cells isn't souls-like tho...
Fuuuurrryyyy
Enjoyed the analysis and commentary. You my friend, have yourself a new subscriber. Look forward to future videos.
Loving all the chiptune souls music ;-;
This video finally made me understand the "don't add easy mode to Dark Souls" stance.
90's canadian reference, more like canadian reference from 90's-2000's.
I am a simple man. I see anything involving Dark Souls I click.
Any relation to that funny cartoon owl that also talks about games?
Shammy? Only in that we follow each other on Twitter and have chatted a couple of times.
He reminds me more of Mandalore than Shammy
His name is pronounced Me-hi cheek-sent-me-he
I'd count the StormRuler bosses and the Bed of Chaos as arbitrary rules considering they are both not fought conventionally. Dark souls has some enemies with arbitrary rules.
Should i mention the intended way of beating the white dragon from DS 3 endgame?
True but isn't that why most fans hate those bosses? Because they break/change the standard rules set by the game?
The Zone lmao
i get in the zone in racing games
Still waiting on the Switch port to play this series...
So far only 1