I love how in like the second adventuring party for the season, Brennan offhandedly mentions a potential arc for Raphaniel being that he becomes obsessed with Provolone because he's so unassuming compared to everyone else, so Raphaniel ends up thinking he's some sort of chosen one. And then Provolone ends up being the one to actually kill Deus Pah'Zuul and save the world, meaning that unlike Raphaniel's actual decent into madness, that deranged prediction was actually correct.
I have to hand it to Matt for coming up with something so horrifying in concept as the garbage disposal. In Calorum, everything is food in some way shape or form. Houses aren't made of stone, they're made of rock candy. Swords aren't made of metal, they're made of bacon steel. And all the citizens of Calorum don't really think it strange that they are made of the same stuff, because why would they? What would make them even think twice about the composition of their atoms? What indeed. The Deus-Pa'Zuul is classic eldritch horror because it can't even be conceived of until it is encountered. In a 100% organic world, the inorganic is so alien and terrifying I can't even think of a real-world example to compare it to. Which is exactly the point.
Literally it's "A gingerbread man sits inside of a gingerbread house. Is the house made of flesh, or it the man made of house? He screams for he does not know." but they DON'T know until they encounter the DPZ, they haven't even concieved of it.
Honestly, I like how Matt respected Brennan’s continuity. First, if the players knew they would be murdering Queen Pamelia, Amethar’s mom, they wouldn’t if given the choice not to, especially not Lou. Also, the assassination of Saphhira and other tragedies endured by the House of Rocks are cutscenes, so nobody makes a time paradox. And despite Amethar appearing as an NPC, his close friend Calroy doesn’t, and isn’t even mentioned, as if he was, the party would hunt him down and kill him for his future treachery. Thus, Matt gave the players agency, but not enough to conflict with Crown of Candy’s continuity.
Do not forget the pasta lady senator, that seduced Deli and manipulated him, was also his aunt. She is the younger sister of his dead cerisian mother. I guess it is a GoT parody, so the incest fits the genre..
@@AshAtropos It was even the thing he was being blackmailed with, the fact that he was in this relationship, that if anyone found out he would be condemed by everyone. But it did weirdly seem to fall in the background a little.
i think colin and deli’s relationship is really the catalyst to so much of what i love about trw. colin does everything in the first half of his arc _because_ of deli’s orders, and the second half of his arc is _despite_ deli’s orders. they are diametrically opposed in their morals, to an unreconcilable degree (at least at the beginning, i think deli’s development in the last episode does a lot to allow for some sort of understanding between the two of them), and THAT is the rift that affects the entire campaign more than any other. under their normal circumstances, colin might’ve remained with deli throughout the rest of the war, but at the hands of the fda, their differences are put under a spot light, and the entire story takes a hard left into divisions and conversations of the complex role power and status plays in a dynamic, _especially_ in war time. colin provolone was also my favorite character, he absolutely fascinated me, but i don’t think he would’ve gotten that honor without the absolutely brainrotting way him and deli interacted throughout the season.
I had also noted that the characters that died could be argued as those that likely wouldn't have lived long enough to see the events of Crown of Candy. Raphanelle was extremely elderly with his body fairing as well as his sanity had at that point and Carna essentially had a terminal illness.
what you said about what matt focuses on - the actual people in the centre of the ravening war - reminds me of something i read where someone got quite upset that the ravening war was "focusing on a bunch of characters who were never mentioned in the actual a crown of candy story" instead of focusing on lets say - the house rocks sisters. for me, at least, i believe it was a good decision - after all, most of the rocks sisters died during the war, so what would happen if a dice roll changed that outcome?
When doing a prequel in a medium literally left to the dice, you really can't have the important characters hang around too long. It's like how in Calamity, Brennan tried to get Purvan away from the cast as fast as possible
@@Sootielove tbh the person who made that comment was incredibly anti matt, to the point where d20 changing their profile picture to brennan in drag got a "the evil has been defeated" comment lol
Come on Provolone! It was a lovely series. Not my particular favourite because conspiracy stories are really not my jam. But it was truly lovely seeing Matt use his particular novelistic storytelling style (nod to one of your older vids) to Brennan's world building. Also, Lou + intensely dedicated shouting = always funny
Honestly i was impressed with how much this felt like ACOFC. Matt did a really good job capturing the tone and scale of the world. And at points he was even meaner to his players that Brennan was😂
Losing my mind live over The Ravening War and then accidentally discovering through paranoid theory blogging on tumblr that Aabria has a tumblr and reblogs paranoid theories definitely bumped TRW up in experiences for me, but in general it was such a well thought out game. From characters to plot to world to endgame, everything seemed plotted to be both absurd, metaphorical, serious, meaningful and interesting. It was seriously well made, and one of the best Liveplay games I’ve ever seen.
I’m commenting so I can come back to this video later, since I’m only at the beginning of watching CoC, and I feel like I need that context first in order to watch The Ravening War haha
As a D20 fan , yes , Rw may be a prequel for all intents and purposes, but it lacks context without CoC first as it's a love letter to CoC first and Prequel second.
I had to challenge myself to get through the series, just wasn’t for me but I love the people involved, but that last episode really brought home the narrative for me (plus it was a great combat)
This is my favorite video that you’ve done and I would definitely watch if you do a series reviewing/deep diving on individual d20 seasons. I would love to hear more about the world building in the stoat season in particular. Immaculate
To me the biggest point against it is the pacing. Like there are 2 eposides back to back which combine to a 5 hours of nothing but time skips and it hindered my ability to connect to the characters. Like the closest thing to it I remember is the Misfits and Magic campaign, but even there it was 1 time skip per episode. Though at the end, the story picks up so much steam an tension that it mostly makes up for all of it.
This is off topic but around 5:50 there's this background music going on. I recognize it but I don't know from where. I NEED to know where it's from. Please help?
The only thing I was disappointed with in the moment was meeting prince amethar, I wish he would’ve switched narrative control to Lou. Although it could’ve pulled Lou out of his own character space? It’s a choice
Also I think he only became King Amethar when he was Lou, its like in a show where a flashback depicts a known character but younger so they are played by someone else
I'm sorry but I'm I the only one that didn't vibe hard with this season as much as I did with the crown of candy? Like the last 2 ep were really good but that's about it for me
I don’t like all the time skips, especially in a setting like Calorum. It feels kinda presumptuous to me for it to just be assumed that none of the important characters would die in such long periods of time during the Ravening War of all times. I think this campaign suffers from being so short.
Ehhh it started good, but as with most things related to Critical Role it just started to drag. Too many threads left just hanging or rushed in exposition. The players barely got a chance to actually role play. It felt like Matt was completely out of his depth and having no clue how to direct the group whilst also rushing them through a story clearly too big for the time allocated. It really showed me how much better Brennan and Aabria are at DMing
It's true that Matt is at his best in giant epics. But it's funny, because I came away with the opposite opinion. I felt that it was slow at first, and the time jumps a bit disjointed, but the last three episodes really made for a cohesive adventure which justified the conclusion.
@@Call-Me-I it's because so many people's exposure to this is only Critical Role and so they think that's as best as it can be, when in my opinion is rather mediocre. Nearly everything CR has done, someone else can do as good or better, but people have put that crew up on a pedestal and have a hard time realising they're really not all they cracked up to be.
Matt is a great dm, but it doesn't surprise me that he struggled at ton with pacing and keeping plot threads in the air. bringing colin's dad back as secretly alive felt particularly out of left field, as opposed to interacting with the cheddars. karna and raphaniel's backstory were revealed in death because they were never got to in the campaign, and deli and amangeaux's relationships to npcs (including her child!!) never felt meaningfully real in the world. There was just already a lot floating around in terms of plot _before_ the mushroom kingdom plot, which felt out of place in the low-magic Calorum setting and completely took over the last half of the campaign. the time jumps were conceptually cool but rushed the players, like you said. There were just a lot of things that made me feel that Calorum was not the right setting for this collab. ACOC worked so wonderfully because Brennan works incredibly meticulously and at a breakneck pace, and the highly political setting is something I've only seen him manage that well. Matt is suited to epic fantasies that have a lot of course correction time, while Brennan's improv training allowed him to perfect efficient and precise campaigns. Mini campaigns are not Matt's wheelhouse in the slightest, and to then set him up against two of Brennan's sharpest and most complex campaigns (EXU:C and ACOC) just felt a bit out of place. It felt like the idea was that because Matt was the "serious" dm of the two he should do a Calorum setting, but he probably would have had a better time doing an LA version of the Unsleeping City, hanging out in Spyre, etc. Overall, there was a sense of rushing and incompleteness all over the place that makes me wonder what the bts looked like. small stuff like messing up Citrina's accent all the way up to the weird hard left into mushroom-land made this campaign feel like a shadow of what it could have been. Because Matt is talented! And the PCs this campaign were some of my favorites in a while! It just needed a tighter grip and a smaller story from the start.
@@Call-Me-I this is an excellent way of articulating it! I don't doubt the cr cast has a ton of fun playing, but a lot of people have fun watching through a parasocial level of watching them have fun playing, rather than the story itself. d20's constantly shifting side cast proves in itself that it relies a good deal less on that
I love how in like the second adventuring party for the season, Brennan offhandedly mentions a potential arc for Raphaniel being that he becomes obsessed with Provolone because he's so unassuming compared to everyone else, so Raphaniel ends up thinking he's some sort of chosen one. And then Provolone ends up being the one to actually kill Deus Pah'Zuul and save the world, meaning that unlike Raphaniel's actual decent into madness, that deranged prediction was actually correct.
He must’ve remembered that joke about Gilear
''YOU LIED. YOU LIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIED''
I love Lou
He sounded legit furious
I have to hand it to Matt for coming up with something so horrifying in concept as the garbage disposal. In Calorum, everything is food in some way shape or form. Houses aren't made of stone, they're made of rock candy. Swords aren't made of metal, they're made of bacon steel. And all the citizens of Calorum don't really think it strange that they are made of the same stuff, because why would they? What would make them even think twice about the composition of their atoms? What indeed. The Deus-Pa'Zuul is classic eldritch horror because it can't even be conceived of until it is encountered. In a 100% organic world, the inorganic is so alien and terrifying I can't even think of a real-world example to compare it to. Which is exactly the point.
Literally it's "A gingerbread man sits inside of a gingerbread house. Is the house made of flesh, or it the man made of house? He screams for he does not know." but they DON'T know until they encounter the DPZ, they haven't even concieved of it.
right! the eldritch horrorterrors running reality probably think its so weird that we're made of carbon and so is all our stuff
Honestly, I like how Matt respected Brennan’s continuity. First, if the players knew they would be murdering Queen Pamelia, Amethar’s mom, they wouldn’t if given the choice not to, especially not Lou. Also, the assassination of Saphhira and other tragedies endured by the House of Rocks are cutscenes, so nobody makes a time paradox. And despite Amethar appearing as an NPC, his close friend Calroy doesn’t, and isn’t even mentioned, as if he was, the party would hunt him down and kill him for his future treachery.
Thus, Matt gave the players agency, but not enough to conflict with Crown of Candy’s continuity.
Do not forget the pasta lady senator, that seduced Deli and manipulated him, was also his aunt. She is the younger sister of his dead cerisian mother. I guess it is a GoT parody, so the incest fits the genre..
YEAH like when he was flirting with het I was like. Isn't she his aunt???? And NOBODY addressed it
@@AshAtropos It was even the thing he was being blackmailed with, the fact that he was in this relationship, that if anyone found out he would be condemed by everyone. But it did weirdly seem to fall in the background a little.
And Karna died a virgin because Deli friendzoned her because of her.
I did love the story of Amangeux's baby, and it is my headcanon that the kid grows up to be Plumbeline Uvano.
i think colin and deli’s relationship is really the catalyst to so much of what i love about trw. colin does everything in the first half of his arc _because_ of deli’s orders, and the second half of his arc is _despite_ deli’s orders. they are diametrically opposed in their morals, to an unreconcilable degree (at least at the beginning, i think deli’s development in the last episode does a lot to allow for some sort of understanding between the two of them), and THAT is the rift that affects the entire campaign more than any other. under their normal circumstances, colin might’ve remained with deli throughout the rest of the war, but at the hands of the fda, their differences are put under a spot light, and the entire story takes a hard left into divisions and conversations of the complex role power and status plays in a dynamic, _especially_ in war time. colin provolone was also my favorite character, he absolutely fascinated me, but i don’t think he would’ve gotten that honor without the absolutely brainrotting way him and deli interacted throughout the season.
Absolutely! Never thought if it this way but that makes complete sense
I had also noted that the characters that died could be argued as those that likely wouldn't have lived long enough to see the events of Crown of Candy. Raphanelle was extremely elderly with his body fairing as well as his sanity had at that point and Carna essentially had a terminal illness.
Exactly the sort of food that would end up in the disposal.
what you said about what matt focuses on - the actual people in the centre of the ravening war - reminds me of something i read where someone got quite upset that the ravening war was "focusing on a bunch of characters who were never mentioned in the actual a crown of candy story" instead of focusing on lets say - the house rocks sisters. for me, at least, i believe it was a good decision - after all, most of the rocks sisters died during the war, so what would happen if a dice roll changed that outcome?
When doing a prequel in a medium literally left to the dice, you really can't have the important characters hang around too long. It's like how in Calamity, Brennan tried to get Purvan away from the cast as fast as possible
@@Sootielove tbh the person who made that comment was incredibly anti matt, to the point where d20 changing their profile picture to brennan in drag got a "the evil has been defeated" comment lol
@siobhannicolson5566 That's such a weird thing to be. Brennan and Matt are friends and aren't in competition with each other.
Come on Provolone! It was a lovely series. Not my particular favourite because conspiracy stories are really not my jam. But it was truly lovely seeing Matt use his particular novelistic storytelling style (nod to one of your older vids) to Brennan's world building. Also, Lou + intensely dedicated shouting = always funny
Honestly i was impressed with how much this felt like ACOFC. Matt did a really good job capturing the tone and scale of the world. And at points he was even meaner to his players that Brennan was😂
What's acofc?
@@TheDanishGuyReviews it stands for A Crown of Candy
@@herebyaccident5174 Oh, you included the F in Of? Okay, I've never seen it like that before.
@@TheDanishGuyReviews lol yeah my dyslexic ass thought that looked right. Lol
It took me… maybe an entire episode to realize the FDA joke
it's okay, it took me as much time as brennan did to get the disposal joke
God damnit I just got it too
Losing my mind live over The Ravening War and then accidentally discovering through paranoid theory blogging on tumblr that Aabria has a tumblr and reblogs paranoid theories definitely bumped TRW up in experiences for me, but in general it was such a well thought out game.
From characters to plot to world to endgame, everything seemed plotted to be both absurd, metaphorical, serious, meaningful and interesting. It was seriously well made, and one of the best Liveplay games I’ve ever seen.
I’m commenting so I can come back to this video later, since I’m only at the beginning of watching CoC, and I feel like I need that context first in order to watch The Ravening War haha
As a D20 fan , yes , Rw may be a prequel for all intents and purposes, but it lacks context without CoC first as it's a love letter to CoC first and Prequel second.
The ravening war had some of the most complex and varied pc I’ve seen in a campaign.
You talking about the Algorithm as an Eldritch God…
I can imagine a campaign taking place on the Internet, like some Wreck-It Ralph base
Yup. I need to rewatch Crown of Candy and the Ravening War again..
Hearing Aabria silently screaming triggered all those emotions again. Christ the heart wrench.
I had to challenge myself to get through the series, just wasn’t for me but I love the people involved, but that last episode really brought home the narrative for me (plus it was a great combat)
HAHAHA I didn’t realize he only murked the other 2 GMs at the table that’s HILARIOUS 😂
Matt was like, “There can only be one!”
Brennan made a deal with Matt. That they would swap groups, and boy, did they both cook.
This is my favorite video that you’ve done and I would definitely watch if you do a series reviewing/deep diving on individual d20 seasons. I would love to hear more about the world building in the stoat season in particular. Immaculate
To me the biggest point against it is the pacing. Like there are 2 eposides back to back which combine to a 5 hours of nothing but time skips and it hindered my ability to connect to the characters. Like the closest thing to it I remember is the Misfits and Magic campaign, but even there it was 1 time skip per episode.
Though at the end, the story picks up so much steam an tension that it mostly makes up for all of it.
Literally just finished the Ravening War after renewing my membership and actively seeking out post fiction content :')
loved the video! would be awesome to see you finish out talking about the pcs
Thanks! I had a section where I talked about each of them when i was first writing this video, but it was already way longer than i wanted haha
@@castlecaster i just enjoy seeing people discuss my fav actual play shows, it’s rare to get this level of in-depth conversation about them
It was a good season I can't blame you.
This is off topic but around 5:50 there's this background music going on. I recognize it but I don't know from where. I NEED to know where it's from. Please help?
great review ^^
All I’ve read is the vid title, and I’ll say “same”
The only thing I was disappointed with in the moment was meeting prince amethar, I wish he would’ve switched narrative control to Lou. Although it could’ve pulled Lou out of his own character space? It’s a choice
Also I think he only became King Amethar when he was Lou, its like in a show where a flashback depicts a known character but younger so they are played by someone else
I'm sorry but I'm I the only one that didn't vibe hard with this season as much as I did with the crown of candy? Like the last 2 ep were really good but that's about it for me
engagement
I don’t like all the time skips, especially in a setting like Calorum. It feels kinda presumptuous to me for it to just be assumed that none of the important characters would die in such long periods of time during the Ravening War of all times. I think this campaign suffers from being so short.
Ehhh it started good, but as with most things related to Critical Role it just started to drag. Too many threads left just hanging or rushed in exposition. The players barely got a chance to actually role play. It felt like Matt was completely out of his depth and having no clue how to direct the group whilst also rushing them through a story clearly too big for the time allocated. It really showed me how much better Brennan and Aabria are at DMing
It's true that Matt is at his best in giant epics. But it's funny, because I came away with the opposite opinion. I felt that it was slow at first, and the time jumps a bit disjointed, but the last three episodes really made for a cohesive adventure which justified the conclusion.
@jamespryor5967 is it weird that I think both of you are right at the same time?
@@Call-Me-I it's because so many people's exposure to this is only Critical Role and so they think that's as best as it can be, when in my opinion is rather mediocre. Nearly everything CR has done, someone else can do as good or better, but people have put that crew up on a pedestal and have a hard time realising they're really not all they cracked up to be.
Matt is a great dm, but it doesn't surprise me that he struggled at ton with pacing and keeping plot threads in the air. bringing colin's dad back as secretly alive felt particularly out of left field, as opposed to interacting with the cheddars. karna and raphaniel's backstory were revealed in death because they were never got to in the campaign, and deli and amangeaux's relationships to npcs (including her child!!) never felt meaningfully real in the world. There was just already a lot floating around in terms of plot _before_ the mushroom kingdom plot, which felt out of place in the low-magic Calorum setting and completely took over the last half of the campaign. the time jumps were conceptually cool but rushed the players, like you said.
There were just a lot of things that made me feel that Calorum was not the right setting for this collab. ACOC worked so wonderfully because Brennan works incredibly meticulously and at a breakneck pace, and the highly political setting is something I've only seen him manage that well. Matt is suited to epic fantasies that have a lot of course correction time, while Brennan's improv training allowed him to perfect efficient and precise campaigns. Mini campaigns are not Matt's wheelhouse in the slightest, and to then set him up against two of Brennan's sharpest and most complex campaigns (EXU:C and ACOC) just felt a bit out of place. It felt like the idea was that because Matt was the "serious" dm of the two he should do a Calorum setting, but he probably would have had a better time doing an LA version of the Unsleeping City, hanging out in Spyre, etc.
Overall, there was a sense of rushing and incompleteness all over the place that makes me wonder what the bts looked like. small stuff like messing up Citrina's accent all the way up to the weird hard left into mushroom-land made this campaign feel like a shadow of what it could have been. Because Matt is talented! And the PCs this campaign were some of my favorites in a while! It just needed a tighter grip and a smaller story from the start.
@@Call-Me-I this is an excellent way of articulating it! I don't doubt the cr cast has a ton of fun playing, but a lot of people have fun watching through a parasocial level of watching them have fun playing, rather than the story itself. d20's constantly shifting side cast proves in itself that it relies a good deal less on that