Great demonstration and BEAUTIFUL rifle!!! I built a tac precision 30-06 bolt from a shot out Colt version of the Finnbear Sporter. The Sako 1960-1961 long action L61R was perfect and I got the rifle for $70. I know have a consistent 1/4 MOA platform!
was there any particular reason that you didn't completely lock the bolt when attempting to extract with the factory extractor? With how the bolt face and extractor cam over the round when locked up it will make a difference in the extraction. If you don't try the same technique with both varients you'll never know the real results. It seems like this was a staged vid.
So that's a pretty interesting stock I guess you could say. Looks like a good way to introduce consistency into the design of the rifle. Don't have to worry so much about bedding compound getting damaged and I guess it's a little more forgiving if you don't have the action screwed in exactly the same way every time.
Brass shavings or other junk buildup under the extractor claw will do that. Can't argue that the Sako extractor isn't better but the problem could of been solved by purchasing a new extractor if cleaning the old one didn't fix the problem. Maybe even the ejector plunger and spring were worn too. A new extractor, ejector plunger and spring cost like $10 and 1 minute worth of work to replace them.
Their not custom made to fit, but what they allow is for adjustments to be made to fit your body and the specific shooting position with a hex tool. So the length of pull, stock cant, slide stop, etc can be adjusted as needed for standing, sitting, prone, etc, since the rifle will mount differently for all different positions. This specific rifle cost me about $2300 before sights with an off the shelf R700 action with some action work.
This looks like a hi-power rifle used in (you guessed it) hi-power rifle competition. And the target is stationary and has big numbers on it that match your firing point, so no need to keep an eye on the target while cycling the bolt. The reason s/he is cycling the bolt so slow is because s/he is showing the performance of the extractor, and extractor spring.
Well I never had a extractor ejector fail out of a 700 Remington, I had two Sako's that had extraction problems, easy enough fix, then again, All my 700's and Sako's were and are stock hunting rifles. Been shooting a Sako 75 for years now along with an old and I mean old 7mm RM in a 700 BDL that I have had since 69, that would be 41 years, Not so much as a hick up with that rifle, I would bet you have a broken plunger spring. Nothing in life is perfect. I still will buy either one.
i understand that you wanted to upgrade your gun, but i have the factory bolt in my gun and it throws the rounds totally clear of the gun. could it be that the extractor was broken? Ive seen that happen before. awesome gun BTW
That is a 6mmBR case, but with every case that comes factory from Remington the case ejects fine. Just because you rechambered your rifle to a different caliber and the case wont eject don't mean there is anything wrong with the factory setup.
The sako style compromise the integrity of the bolt face I used to do warranty for Remington and Weatherby the vanguards essentially a 700 bolt head with the sako/ar style extractor and any time there was a catastrophic case failure with the vanguards or even the MKV’s the damage would always start from the corner of the extractor cut but the Remingtons being fully supported by the recessed bolt face surrounded by the barrel would hold and contain the pressure allowing the vents to work might have a stuck bolt but unlike the weatherbys the customers didn’t have to buy a new bolt
@ocabj I've seen more of your videos and read more of what's been said and understand that you do shoot 6mmBR with this gun. Did not realize it is chambered for it. It just seems like a smaller casing would need less torque, I don't know enough about it to really assume.
Jonathan, Are you sure the difference isn't in the strength of the ejector spring? Could be the Sako extractor provides a looser pivot allowing smoother ejection but the ejector spring is the main variable here. I like the sako extractor and install them for myself and my customers. Nice upgrade and a nice rifle. My favorite caliber.--Jerry
I just started watching your video's (enjoying them and learning lots of bits) but as a Sako/Tikka fan, I would suggest the Sako-style ejector inserted in a Sako rifle. Leave out the Remington part and you're GTG. :)
@ocabj Check out this video by TSniper79 : Remington 700 SPS Varmint .308 Shooting He doesn't seem to be pulling back at a faster speed than you, and the cases seem to eject just fine. I don't believe there are any mods done to it other than a bi-pod and a scope, per his previous video that he made stating he just bought it. I'm not downing you or anything, I just believe the 700 action is an excellent tried and true action. If it is worn out just replace what needs replacing.
My factory extractors on my 700 kicks brass like a mule, I can see why people may upgrade in certain situations and uses. Even a slow pull on my VTR .223 kicks it out fine. However when replacing with a Sako extractor, evidence that this actually weakens the three rings of steel design that they built for safety probably not a big issue but not ideal either, just hope a case never fails on you.
I've owned two Remington 700's now and haven't had a problem with extraction/ejection! I've just had a $6,500.00 custom built rifle made, based on a trued Remington action, with a Sako extractor installed, and it won't even extract the cartridge (the gunsmith says it's the fault of the un-'fireformed' Norma brass being too short for the claw to engage it, and that it would sort itself out once fireformed) and it won't 'eject' the cartridge half the time, rather, choosing simply to dump the extracted shell on top of the other round that's sitting in the magazine, such as demonstrated in this video, but, only it's the Sako extractor on mine that's doing it, not the Remington, as in this video! Plus I've got the added bonus of a "compromised" three rings of steel (as you're describing) to boot! Man, I'd give anything to go back to a factory Remington extractor claw, merely for the strength and reliability factors! And mine is chambered in .300 RUM!
I had the Sako extractor mod installed because of the 6mmBR cartridge that this rifle was chambered for. I have a target that was shot during an NRA 3x600 Mid-range match: www.ocabj.net/shot-my-eliseo-r5-rifle-at-600-yards-finally/ I don't have the original test targets when I was working out the load that I settled on with 107 SMKs, but it was shooting 1" groups at 200 yards (tested with optics, not the aperture sights).
no a mauser/controlled feed positivleys controls the round at the the time it strips it from the internal mag,a m-16 or a sako is a push feed ,meaning it only engages the casing at the time the bolt goes into battery
Was this an extractor or ejector issue. I removed my ejectors to control fired case contamination on ejection but my cases still extract from the breach.
It's a short case (6mmBR) issue with slow bolt operation. 15 years ago when I had a 6mmBR barrel put on a commodity 700 action, I wanted to 'guarantee' ejection regardless of bolt speed operation (for High Power Rifle XTC matches).
See link in video description. 6mmBR in a stock Remington 700 short action. Case length isn't like anything you'll find in a factory Remington 700 chambering.
I've been wondering, why does everyone refer to it as a "Sako" extractor? It's not like they invented it or even popularized its use? IIRC, that style of extractor was first invented by Hiram Berdan and was first used on his Berdan II rifle in 1870. And I've got an antique Mosin(ironically, it was rebuilt at the Sako arsenal!) from 1896 with the same setup. Did everyone just decide to start calling it a Sako extractor when Sako rifles started to become available State-side?
Obviously your EJECTOR in the factory remmy bolt is not functioning. Not a very representative video; in fact it is quite misleading. This has nothing to do with the extractor; the extractor is functioning just fine on the remmy bolt.
huh.. that's weird.. I have the remington factory extractor on my 700 and no matter how slowly I pull the bolt back with even an unfired round, once the bullet clears the action wall it still flies out.. maybe your ejector spring is week or something?
Well I went downstairs and tried the same test with a BR case in my 6/250 700 actioned rifle, fully expecting the case to fly out. Guess what - it behaved EXACTLY like your video!!! Serve me a big plate of crow please. As I type this I understand why - the ejector only has so much travel. The angle of the lever, the case, is greater due to the short length of the case. Where the mouth touches the inside of the receiver, it has used up the travel of the ejector.
see thats why the Remington seems to dominate the aftermarket parts, there are just so many parts to release its potencial to achieve ultimate accuracy. so once you buy a remington 700, you could change a stock, change a barrel, change a trigger, bottom metal, action, bolt, base....... to heard a "DING" from 1000yards
Yes it is, actually. I really can't give much opinion on it with regards to how it compares to factory firing pins or anything else aftermarket, nor can I give an expert analysis on the lock time. Considering I pretty much had the action gunsmithed for match use, I figured swapping out the factory firing pin for the Tubb system was logical. It's been dead nuts reliable.
Thats good to hear, I ended up going with a PTG assembly with Tubb springs in it, I think it helps, but I also seem to get the feeling I am just spending my money... your video on the sako extractor was good input for my eliseo match rifle
Yea, my 700 with the factory extractor just dumps the case in the action. It is not a repeater so I actually prefer it to stay in the action personally. This way I am not looking in the grass and dirt for my stupid expensive brass. I thought it was just my gun a ll this time tho, lol.
@MrXl250 The day Sako starts making extractors for toy guns that eject toy cartridges my life will be complete. In case I was too subtle: it's not a toy gun and it's you who should leave the internet AND actually shoot anything before pretending to be an expert.
Shells better to take from the bed with fingers and put it in a box/belt/pocket. Clean shiny shells. Not bent, not trampled clean shiny shells. Ready to reload. Than to pick up it from the ground (mud, poops, sand, poops with sand, mud with sand and poops). Than to pick up it from the ground in the dark in the rain from the puddle of pooped sandy mud :) Pick out crumpled shells from the toothy soles of pooped boots :) In the dark in the rain :) IMHO :)
I was quit surprise to see a bi-pod on the rifle the factory instruction say stock is not for bi-pods I failed to believe the and the first shout out of the rifle broke the for arm stock as mine and other that did the same buyer be ware of a factory that dose not stand behind the goods.
I find it hard to believe that you broke the foreend of the Eliseo R5 chassis by using a bipod, and even harder to believe that if it did fail in this manner, that Gary Eliseo wouldn't have taken it back and resolved the issue for you. I would be interested in more details.
Finally, someone with knowledge in firearms!
Have a great day man!
Great demonstration and BEAUTIFUL rifle!!! I built a tac precision 30-06 bolt from a shot out Colt version of the Finnbear Sporter. The Sako 1960-1961 long action L61R was perfect and I got the rifle for $70. I know have a consistent 1/4 MOA platform!
was there any particular reason that you didn't completely lock the bolt when attempting to extract with the factory extractor? With how the bolt face and extractor cam over the round when locked up it will make a difference in the extraction. If you don't try the same technique with both varients you'll never know the real results. It seems like this was a staged vid.
So that's a pretty interesting stock I guess you could say. Looks like a good way to introduce consistency into the design of the rifle. Don't have to worry so much about bedding compound getting damaged and I guess it's a little more forgiving if you don't have the action screwed in exactly the same way every time.
Brass shavings or other junk buildup under the extractor claw will do that. Can't argue that the Sako extractor isn't better but the problem could of been solved by purchasing a new extractor if cleaning the old one didn't fix the problem. Maybe even the ejector plunger and spring were worn too. A new extractor, ejector plunger and spring cost like $10 and 1 minute worth of work to replace them.
Their not custom made to fit, but what they allow is for adjustments to be made to fit your body and the specific shooting position with a hex tool. So the length of pull, stock cant, slide stop, etc can be adjusted as needed for standing, sitting, prone, etc, since the rifle will mount differently for all different positions. This specific rifle cost me about $2300 before sights with an off the shelf R700 action with some action work.
This looks like a hi-power rifle used in (you guessed it) hi-power rifle competition. And the target is stationary and has big numbers on it that match your firing point, so no need to keep an eye on the target while cycling the bolt. The reason s/he is cycling the bolt so slow is because s/he is showing the performance of the extractor, and extractor spring.
@ocabj i saw this gun on the 6mmBR website :) amazing gun
Interesting Video. Thanks for posting.
Well I never had a extractor ejector fail out of a 700 Remington, I had two Sako's that had extraction problems, easy enough fix, then again, All my 700's and Sako's were and are stock hunting rifles. Been shooting a Sako 75 for years now along with an old and I mean old 7mm RM in a 700 BDL that I have had since 69, that would be 41 years, Not so much as a hick up with that rifle, I would bet you have a broken plunger spring. Nothing in life is perfect. I still will buy either one.
i understand that you wanted to upgrade your gun, but i have the factory bolt in my gun and it throws the rounds totally clear of the gun. could it be that the extractor was broken? Ive seen that happen before. awesome gun BTW
That is a 6mmBR case, but with every case that comes factory from Remington the case ejects fine. Just because you rechambered your rifle to a different caliber and the case wont eject don't mean there is anything wrong with the factory setup.
The sako style compromise the integrity of the bolt face I used to do warranty for Remington and Weatherby the vanguards essentially a 700 bolt head with the sako/ar style extractor and any time there was a catastrophic case failure with the vanguards or even the MKV’s the damage would always start from the corner of the extractor cut but the Remingtons being fully supported by the recessed bolt face surrounded by the barrel would hold and contain the pressure allowing the vents to work might have a stuck bolt but unlike the weatherbys the customers didn’t have to buy a new bolt
@ocabj I've seen more of your videos and read more of what's been said and understand that you do shoot 6mmBR with this gun. Did not realize it is chambered for it. It just seems like a smaller casing would need less torque, I don't know enough about it to really assume.
Jonathan,
Are you sure the difference isn't in the strength of the ejector spring? Could be the Sako extractor provides a looser pivot allowing smoother ejection but the ejector spring is the main variable here.
I like the sako extractor and install them for myself and my customers. Nice upgrade and a nice rifle. My favorite caliber.--Jerry
my thoughts exactly. well said.
I just started watching your video's (enjoying them and learning lots of bits) but as a Sako/Tikka fan, I would suggest the Sako-style ejector inserted in a Sako rifle. Leave out the Remington part and you're GTG. :)
@ocabj Check out this video by TSniper79 : Remington 700 SPS Varmint .308 Shooting
He doesn't seem to be pulling back at a faster speed than you, and the cases seem to eject just fine. I don't believe there are any mods done to it other than a bi-pod and a scope, per his previous video that he made stating he just bought it.
I'm not downing you or anything, I just believe the 700 action is an excellent tried and true action. If it is worn out just replace what needs replacing.
Also, this whole topic was covered on 6mmbr dot com, who referenced this video in articles.
My 700 Varmint does that when I cycle slowly. If i rack it back with a little authority it cycles nice
My factory extractors on my 700 kicks brass like a mule, I can see why people may upgrade in certain situations and uses. Even a slow pull on my VTR .223 kicks it out fine. However when replacing with a Sako extractor, evidence that this actually weakens the three rings of steel design that they built for safety probably not a big issue but not ideal either, just hope a case never fails on you.
I've owned two Remington 700's now and haven't had a problem with extraction/ejection! I've just had a $6,500.00 custom built rifle made, based on a trued Remington action, with a Sako extractor installed, and it won't even extract the cartridge (the gunsmith says it's the fault of the un-'fireformed' Norma brass being too short for the claw to engage it, and that it would sort itself out once fireformed) and it won't 'eject' the cartridge half the time, rather, choosing simply to dump the extracted shell on top of the other round that's sitting in the magazine, such as demonstrated in this video, but, only it's the Sako extractor on mine that's doing it, not the Remington, as in this video! Plus I've got the added bonus of a "compromised" three rings of steel (as you're describing) to boot! Man, I'd give anything to go back to a factory Remington extractor claw, merely for the strength and reliability factors! And mine is chambered in .300 RUM!
So, the gun was purpose built for the Sako Extractor ?
Nice looking gun and curious to how she shoots?
I had the Sako extractor mod installed because of the 6mmBR cartridge that this rifle was chambered for. I have a target that was shot during an NRA 3x600 Mid-range match: www.ocabj.net/shot-my-eliseo-r5-rifle-at-600-yards-finally/
I don't have the original test targets when I was working out the load that I settled on with 107 SMKs, but it was shooting 1" groups at 200 yards (tested with optics, not the aperture sights).
@MrAsundstrom factory bolt works fine as long as you pull fast the bold back
no a mauser/controlled feed positivleys controls the round at the the time it strips it from the internal mag,a m-16 or a sako is a push feed ,meaning it only engages the casing at the time the bolt goes into battery
Was this an extractor or ejector issue. I removed my ejectors to control fired case contamination on ejection but my cases still extract from the breach.
It's a short case (6mmBR) issue with slow bolt operation. 15 years ago when I had a 6mmBR barrel put on a commodity 700 action, I wanted to 'guarantee' ejection regardless of bolt speed operation (for High Power Rifle XTC matches).
See link in video description. 6mmBR in a stock Remington 700 short action. Case length isn't like anything you'll find in a factory Remington 700 chambering.
I have the same stock extractor problem in my Remington 700 rifle.
I've been wondering, why does everyone refer to it as a "Sako" extractor? It's not like they invented it or even popularized its use?
IIRC, that style of extractor was first invented by Hiram Berdan and was first used on his Berdan II rifle in 1870. And I've got an antique Mosin(ironically, it was rebuilt at the Sako arsenal!) from 1896 with the same setup.
Did everyone just decide to start calling it a Sako extractor when Sako rifles started to become available State-side?
@CRFbadass
He's demonstrating that the Sako extractor ejects with more vigor in 6mmBR than the factory extractor.
Obviously your EJECTOR in the factory remmy bolt is not functioning. Not a very representative video; in fact it is quite misleading.
This has nothing to do with the extractor; the extractor is functioning just fine on the remmy bolt.
huh.. that's weird.. I have the remington factory extractor on my 700 and no matter how slowly I pull the bolt back with even an unfired round, once the bullet clears the action wall it still flies out.. maybe your ejector spring is week or something?
Well I went downstairs and tried the same test with a BR case in my 6/250 700 actioned rifle, fully expecting the case to fly out. Guess what - it behaved EXACTLY like your video!!! Serve me a big plate of crow please. As I type this I understand why - the ejector only has so much travel. The angle of the lever, the case, is greater due to the short length of the case. Where the mouth touches the inside of the receiver, it has used up the travel of the ejector.
@ocabj So, are you shooting a 6mmBR with this rifle?
Sir, are these rifles custom made to fit you or not? if so how much do they range in price if you don't mind me asking.
@ocabj Thanks for the reply but i have on;y one more question, how much does 6mmBR ammo cost?
Thank you.
What do you call a handful of this gun durring battle? PURPLE RAIN!
@ocabj Thanks for the reply:)
see thats why the Remington seems to dominate the aftermarket parts, there are just so many parts to release its potencial to achieve ultimate accuracy. so once you buy a remington 700, you could change a stock, change a barrel, change a trigger, bottom metal, action, bolt, base....... to heard a "DING" from 1000yards
Wonder if that case had been sized properly before they did their test
That's what it looked like when the bolt was hard to close
Who's bolt handle is it on the Sako style bolt?
I'm guessing the Sako extractor turns it into a a controlled feed like a Mauser
?
No, not at all.
the funny thing is the reason it was changed on modern guns is to lower the cost of manufacture. Sure lets us know where their priority is.
the reason you would work a bolt rifle like this is for long range shooting as not to lose your target
you should try a m16 extractor
Mine works fine and it throws out long bullets not the short ones in your video . You may have just gotten a bad one that's all .
How much do a rifle like that cost?
what ammo does it use?
@MrAsundstrom Likewise in my 30-06
I just played this 5 times...to listen >.
Is that a Tubb speedlock firing pin assembly? Thoughts on it?
Yes it is, actually. I really can't give much opinion on it with regards to how it compares to factory firing pins or anything else aftermarket, nor can I give an expert analysis on the lock time. Considering I pretty much had the action gunsmithed for match use, I figured swapping out the factory firing pin for the Tubb system was logical. It's been dead nuts reliable.
Thats good to hear, I ended up going with a PTG assembly with Tubb springs in it, I think it helps, but I also seem to get the feeling I am just spending my money... your video on the sako extractor was good input for my eliseo match rifle
Yea, my 700 with the factory extractor just dumps the case in the action. It is not a repeater so I actually prefer it to stay in the action personally. This way I am not looking in the grass and dirt for my stupid expensive brass. I thought it was just my gun a ll this time tho, lol.
Nice but that's kaynda looks like BFG 50
Ohhh, this it's really just a chassis system with a few head space changes and what not
"You're"
Fake! You were not closing the bolt all the way on the factory bolt.
Closing the bolt or not doesn matter for this test. He's showing the difference about ejection not lockup...
im likin the paint job.
WHAT DOES THIS ALL MEAN?!?!
Target shooters, varmint hunters, people how aren't trying to be tacticool super snipers.
@MrXl250 The day Sako starts making extractors for toy guns that eject toy cartridges my life will be complete.
In case I was too subtle: it's not a toy gun and it's you who should leave the internet AND actually shoot anything before pretending to be an expert.
my 700 in 223 doesnt do that...
you dont pull the bolt back fast enough lol
longar909 on a springloaded ejector? lol
you need to bump them shoulders back as welll
@ocabj OH... i see... im shooting .308; that makes more sense
Shells better to take from the bed with fingers and put it in a box/belt/pocket.
Clean shiny shells. Not bent, not trampled clean shiny shells. Ready to reload.
Than to pick up it from the ground (mud, poops, sand, poops with sand, mud with sand and poops). Than to pick up it from the ground in the dark in the rain from the puddle of pooped sandy mud :) Pick out crumpled shells from the toothy soles of pooped boots :) In the dark in the rain :)
IMHO :)
That's why I like fixed blade ejectors
i specially liked more the colour your gun, i bet she's the blonde chick of the ranges! ;D
I was quit surprise to see a bi-pod on the rifle the factory instruction say stock is not for bi-pods I failed to believe the and the first shout out of the rifle broke the for arm stock as mine and other that did the same buyer be ware of a factory that dose not stand behind the goods.
I find it hard to believe that you broke the foreend of the Eliseo R5 chassis by using a bipod, and even harder to believe that if it did fail in this manner, that Gary Eliseo wouldn't have taken it back and resolved the issue for you. I would be interested in more details.
Same thing the other one does when ya close the bolt all the way derp
that does not affect ejection derp
My target is on the ground bleeding out waiting for me to come gut it.
Maybe you should close the bolt all the way on the factory bolt? Lol!
Your gun... it very... purple.
Bullshit.
gotta say, i think thats the ugliest 700 ive ever seen
bad comparison